Old Powerbooks/Macbooks vs New

shadow puppet

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If this has already been discussed, please accept my apologies. I did a search but didn't find anything.

I came across a pic on X/Twitter today saying "look at what we've lost".

old ports progression_sm.png


While I realize some of these ports are ancient by today's models, I do not like having to use dongles and such on newer models.

I started with a Classic II and then moved into portable territory:

  1. Powerbook 540C (I think - it's been eons but know it was higher end w/color and cost enough to buy a small used car, lol)
  2. Powerbook Lombard (not sure which model but not with bronze keys)
  3. 17" Macbook Pro
  4. 2016 Refurbished MBP (my current computer which is on it's last legs).

I'm currently trying to figure out if my next Macbook will be an Air or Pro. I've only had Pros but the Airs seem to have come a long way, are lighter and less expensive. I also like the 15" option in lieu of MBP's 16". I think the 14" would be too small. I prefer a bit more real estate.

Will the Air handle Photoshop and Cyan's upcoming release of their revamped Riven? I'm currently not a gamer but do love the Myst series. I'm happy to see Cyan returning to their roots & offering a Mac option again.

Any thoughts from the techno wizards here would be much appreciated.
 
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I still have my power book 540C, my silver 17 MBP & the Lombard is buried somewhere in my garage. None of them working though. I guess I’ll take them to an Apple store to see if they can erase & recycle them.
 
In terms of ports, I think picture above the final MacBook Pro is actually pre-Apple Silicon certainly pre-M3 (the old 14” touchbar MBP hung around for M1/M2), the modern MacBook Pros even with the base M chip (and MacBook Airs) have more ports on either side than pictured.

Truthfully I really wouldn’t say we lost much. In fact, I was starting to have to buy USB adapters for my older 2013 Mac before I upgraded as newer accessories expect USB-C. It’s true that some of my older stuff is still USB-A but honestly the adapters between the two are pretty nice, nicer than the old dongles. I also don’t really have to use them because I got a monitor with mixed ports and kept my old USB-A hub. You can also buy hubs with multiple kinds of ports that are pretty cheap. But as I said, as you gradually replace your older accessories everything will increasingly be USB-C anyway. The reason we had to have all those ports back in the day was because each one was unique and there were so many even then if you didn't have the one you needed you still had to have a dongle. Basically since I upgrade my old machine dongles haven’t been a problem - at least no more than they were back in “the good old days”. That said, if you need an SD card reader, only the Macbook Pro models have one built in. The Airs don’t. Also note that 14" M3 Pro MBP models come with more ports than the base M3 14" MBP.

As for system requirements and photoshop, I don't use it myself but I saw that @Clix Pix and @Citysnaps were discussing Adobe products and may be able to answer that more concretely. However, I get the impression that the base M-chip in the 13”/15” Air and 14” Pro would be able to handle running most common photoshop tasks but I've heard that depending on your Photoshop utilization you might need 16GB of RAM. How much RAM you use in Photoshop is probably something you can check now with Activity Monitor. For Riven, given that its Steam page just says "Apple Silicon" for its system requirements I suspect it'll run on the base M3 just fine as well, probably fine on the 8GB of RAM. Overall I don't think you need the Max chip or even full M3 Pro on the 14"MBP - the base M3 on the Air/14" should be good enough and the cutdown M3 Pro on the 14" definitely good enough. However, the 16" comes with the full M3 Pro as its base model. So if that's the screen size you want you'll definitely get the performance you're after and then some.

I know in terms of size, the 14" Pro is smaller, but the screen quality is nicer. That said, the 15" Air is still lighter (marginally so compared to the base M3 14" and little more for the Pro/Max M3 14") and much lighter than the 16" MBP which has the biggest, nicest screen. Speaker quality is better on the MBPs. If you haven't already you should go to the store to pick them up and look at them to determine which you prefer. The Pro models, especially the 16", will also likely handle any heavy duty task with fans but if you aren't doing that very often the fanless, lighter 15" is probably better. It should be noted that the 16” MBP comes with the full M3 Pro and 18GB of a RAM as its base model which as I said would probably be more than enough for your needs but it is also the heaviest and most expensive ($2500) option listed here. The 15" Airs don't have the Pro chips at all but can upgrade their RAM from 8 ($1300) to 16 ($1500) to 24GB ($1700) - though the MBPs come with twice the hard drive space as base spec (256 vs 512). The 14" MBP can have the base M3 ($1600) and M3 Pro ($2000) chips. For my money I wouldn't get a base M3 14" MBP with 24GB ($2000), as for most people I would recommend going with the cutdown M3 Pro with 18GB for the same price. But the M3 14" MBP with 16GB ($1800) could save you some money relative to the Pro chip if you don't need the horsepower but do need the RAM. Also look to see which models have standard specs (e.g. a 15" Air with 16GB Ram and 512GB hard drive for $1700) rather than BTO because whenever Best Buy or Amazon has a sale those are the models they carry and will likely give you a discount. While I bought new this time around, my previous experience with Apple refurbished was excellent and I've heard that's generally the case. Another way to save some money and maybe getting the specs you want for a better price.

Depending on your timeline, M4 Macs are likely to be out by November. That said, it's not like we have an exact timeline, nor which models to expect - i.e. Apple could even choose the upgrade the desktops since they didn't get an M3 update. Further if you do decide that you want an Air, the Airs were just updated in the Spring and are unlikely to get updated to M4 until next year.

I hope this helps!

I still have my power book 540C, my silver 17 MBP & the Lombard is buried somewhere in my garage. None of them working though. I guess I’ll take them to an Apple store to see if they can erase & recycle them.
That's what I did.

CORRECTION: I initially miswrote that the 16" comes with the cutdown M3 Pro as its base, it comes with the full M3 Pro as its base.
 
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Thanks HUGE @dada_dave for taking the time to write out all of your information. I agree I need to go to a store & physically see the models in person. Like you, I’ve gone the refurbished route with my current 2016 MBP & It’s served me well. It can’t play Riven since it requires a later OS than Monterey, the highest my 2016 could go.

You made a good point to consider: the fans. I usually have 2 browsers open (sometimes 3 for various reasons), + messages, calendar & mail and often Photoshop so my 2016 often gets pretty hot. Because of this, I have a feeling I’m going to need a MBP.

I’ll bookmark your post & try not to stalk you, but as I get closer to making my purchase, I’ll return if I have further questions.

Again, I really appreciate your time, advice & expertise. 🙂
 
Thanks HUGE @dada_dave for taking the time to write out all of your information. I agree I need to go to a store & physically see the models in person. Like you, I’ve gone the refurbished route with my current 2016 MBP & It’s served me well. It can’t play Riven since it requires a later OS than Monterey, the highest my 2016 could go.

You made a good point to consider: the fans. I usually have 2 browsers open (sometimes 3 for various reasons), + messages, calendar & mail and often Photoshop so my 2016 often gets pretty hot. Because of this, I have a feeling I’m going to need a MBP.

I’ll bookmark your post & try not to stalk you, but as I get closer to making my purchase, I’ll return if I have further questions.

Again, I really appreciate your time, advice & expertise. 🙂
My pleasure, I have made some corrections and addendums to it. Again, someone who does photoshop should probably chime in on that though as that simply isn't something I do. But in general the Apple Silicon chips, fans or not should be much, much cooler (and quieter) than your 2016 model. I came from an iMac and well this thing* is basically silent and cold unless I really, really want to push it. The real difference between the fanless Airs and the MBP with fans is if you need sustained performance, like working in photoshop with lots of stuff open for long periods of time, the Airs will eventually get hot and throttle and you might notice the performance dip. The Pros, especially the 16", will likely not. It does sound like to me even if you get the base M3 in either the Air or 14" you'll want more RAM than 8GB though.

*I sniped myself into buying a cutdown M3 Max 14", I'll admit an unnecessary amount of performance at the moment, but I'm hoping I'll get to a place where I can really put it through its paces.
 
As for system requirements and photoshop, I don't use it myself but I saw that @Clix Pix and @Citysnaps were discussing Adobe products and may be able to answer that more concretely. However, I get the impression that the base M-chip in the 13”/15” Air and 14” Pro would be able to handle running most common photoshop tasks but I've heard that depending on your Photoshop utilization you might need 16GB of RAM.

I can't speak to Photoshop running on laptops anymore as I switched switched over to Adobe Lightroom for processing my image files back in 2007 when LR was released. Imo it's a *much* better environment for processing photos as it has a built-in DAM (digital asset management) that lets me easily import and keep track of all of my image files (many thousands). Also (IMO), Lightroom's design is more photo-processing centric, and far easier to use with outstanding tools over Photoshop.

With the above as a pretext... I have Lightroom currently running on two laptops...a 2020 M1 13" MBA with 16 GB RAM and 1 TB SSD, and a 2023 M2 Max 16" MBP with 32 GB RAM and 2 TB SSD.

For sitting on the couch and casually processing image files, I honesty don't see much (any?) difference in processing times. They're both quick for any Lightroom editing operations. I suspect importing a folder of 100 or so image files into LR might be a little faster on the MBP - a couple seconds, perhaps? But that's a trivial and one-time hit, that doesn't bother me in the slightest. It's the repetitive editing operations that count, and they feel just as fast when processing photos on my desktop Mac Studio.

As I mentioned in another thread..my wife, a graphic artist, recently purchased an M3 2024 15" MBA. That's a sweet laptop. Reasonably priced, very light weight, thin, nice screen, fast, etc. If I could have a do-over, that would be my laptop choice instead of my current 2023 16" MBP.

Hope this ramble helps...
 
Your ramble @Citysnaps helps a great deal. I’ve had Lightroom for years but never gave it a chance. I’d open it, be confused as heck and run.

I have several plugins and filters I use in PS so would need to learn how to create the effects they provide in LR. But for what I do with photos, LR sounds like it would be the better choice.

So it’s possible for an Air to fit my needs. I’m not ready to pull the purchase plug just yet but still feel a trip to see the models in person is needed. Or if my 2016 can hold out until November, wait to check out the M4s.

Thanks so much for stopping by to add your input!
 
Your ramble @Citysnaps helps a great deal. I’ve had Lightroom for years but never gave it a chance. I’d open it, be confused as heck and run.

I have several plugins and filters I use in PS so would need to learn how to create the effects they provide in LR. But for what I do with photos, LR sounds like it would be the better choice.

So it’s possible for an Air to fit my needs. I’m not ready to pull the purchase plug just yet but still feel a trip to see the models in person is needed. Or if my 2016 can hold out until November, wait to check out the M4s.

Thanks so much for stopping by to add your input!

I think you'll like LR's flexibility. What's huge is any editing you do on an image file is non-destructive. Meaning the original file is never modified. Rather, edits that you make (say, straightening, cropping, exposure, sharpening, masking, etc, etc) are saved as a set of instructions (you never see the actual instructions, just the results) that stay along side with your original. So the next time you view a particular image in LR (say, ten years from now), those edit instructions are automatically applied within a blink of your eye. And you're able to undo or modify them, if you want to try a different crop, exposure, sharpening, or whatever.

There's also smart auto masking; if you want to mask a person or multiple people(or just their eyes), or a background if you want to change the exposure, or whatever. That saves a lot of time if you were doing that by hand.

MBAs... Apple last updated the MBA with an M3 processor around 3 months ago. I would *guess* the next update with a newer M chip will be around a year from now. Just speculation.
 
I still have my power book 540C, my silver 17 MBP & the Lombard is buried somewhere in my garage. None of them working though. I guess I’ll take them to an Apple store to see if they can erase & recycle them.

Let me know about the Lombard and the 540C... I could use some parts. :)
 
While I realize some of these ports are ancient by today's models, I do not like having to use dongles and such on newer models.

Thing is - think about when you need the ports. 99.999% of the time, it is when sitting at a desk. At which point I am plugged into a thunderbolt dock or a monitor (which if it is modern is usb-c and has a built in usb hub, ethernet, etc.).

I'd much rather have 2 or more high speed thunderbolt ports that can be used for anything including 10 gig networking, breaking out to other ports at full speed, etc. than a bunch of single purpose ports that are rarely if ever used.

The majority of the time when I am not at a desk and using the machine as a portable, I'm not using ports at all - I'm using things like airdrop, mail, teams, wifi network, bluetooth, etc.
 
While I realize some of these ports are ancient by today's models, I do not like having to use dongles and such on newer models.
To me, the experience has been the opposite. There used to be so many different connectors to do the same thing carrying a dongle wasn't even enough, I had to ask in advance what port was required (or carry several dongles). For example: while there's mini-DVI and mini-Display Port in the pictured laptops, there were many other competing connections at the time: full size DVI (with dozens of variants), full size Display Port, VGA, Apple Display Connector, S-video, composite... I'm finding that I own way less dongles now, as there's less competing connectors on the market.
 
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