# MacRumors allowing unsubstantiated posts about the death of another user



## Eric

This flies right into the face of their "verification" rule and they refuse to address.

RelentlessPower made the unsubstantiated claim that Zenithal has died








						Coronavirus (Covid-19) informational thread
					

I suspect a lot of Health professionals who were involved in studying the pandemic from the beginning, merely were mud slinging and undermining the potential damage this disease could havoc.  We needed studies and more backed science, which nobody had in the very beginning stages of the...




					forums.macrumors.com
				






There have been several subsequent posts asking for more information, none was provided. It was then reported and the response was "no action". 

If you can't apply the verification rule here, where can you?


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## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> This flies right into the face of their "verification" rule and they refuse to address.
> 
> RelentlessPower made the unsubstantiated claim that Zenithal has died
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> Coronavirus (Covid-19) informational thread
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> I suspect a lot of Health professionals who were involved in studying the pandemic from the beginning, merely were mud slinging and undermining the potential damage this disease could havoc.  We needed studies and more backed science, which nobody had in the very beginning stages of the...
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> forums.macrumors.com
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> View attachment 8567
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> There have been several subsequent posts asking for more information, none was provided. It was then reported and the response was "no action".
> 
> If you can't apply the verification rule here, where can you?



I remember all these feelings. If I just point out to the mods that they aren’t enforcing their rules, they will notice, care, and do something about it.

News flash: They don’t give a . The rules are a pretense for suspending or banning people they dislike. People they like can do whatever they want. If you don’t believe me, just read through the thread on the “hoax rule” again. Then tell me that their rules mean anything.


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## bunnspecial

Pretty sick of an individual to post something like this in the first place unless they have absolute rock-solid proof. It takes a really disgusting person to do that, especially when it's phrased as a "Look at me, I know more than you"...

It's also equally disgusting of Macrumors to allow it to stand, but the spineless moderators are at it again with their favorite poster. 

I really, really hope this isn't true.


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## User.45

Eric said:


> This flies right into the face of their "verification" rule and they refuse to address.
> 
> RelentlessPower made the unsubstantiated claim that Zenithal has died
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> 
> Coronavirus (Covid-19) informational thread
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> I suspect a lot of Health professionals who were involved in studying the pandemic from the beginning, merely were mud slinging and undermining the potential damage this disease could havoc.  We needed studies and more backed science, which nobody had in the very beginning stages of the...
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> forums.macrumors.com
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> View attachment 8567
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> There have been several subsequent posts asking for more information, none was provided. It was then reported and the response was "no action".
> 
> If you can't apply the verification rule here, where can you?



What do you guys expect? I don't recall a single reputable person stating the "virus will disappear", most of us were talking about control. Even the stance is made up, LOL.

I'll add that SARS-CoV-2 almost exactly did what we expected it would and we are lucky AF that it's a lot less dangerous to children. We are also lucky that to date it couldn't vastly outmutate vaccines. Considering we've never had a coronavirus shot before, this is pretty impressive.


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## Eric

A friendly reminder that I once had a post removed because I "was asked to show proof" that most doctors agree that masks would help prevent the spread of COVID.

Yet this guy can make this claim publicly and anyone who questions it is shut down. Worthless hypocrites, it's no wonder so many have left their shitty site.

Additionally, even if this were true, why in the world would they allow it to be shared in such a way by such an untrusted user.


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## bunnspecial

Eric said:


> Additionally, even if this were true, why in the world would they allow it to be shared in such a way by such an untrusted user.




I have a lot of hobbies that...well...tend to attract an older group of folks. 

On most sites, the death announcement is handled let's say in a much less casual manner. I've made such announcements myself when I learned of one that likely wouldn't have made it to a source otherwise, but often it comes from family logging into an account an posting or from a friend posting.

Let's just say that death announcements typically aren't mentioned off-handedly as in "Oh, BTW, I'm going to say something about this person and by the way they died." 

Something just feels strange about this whole thing too because if he's "not at liberty" to give details, whoever the source is probably wouldn't appreciate such a casual drop of the information either...


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## Joe

I no longer visit that site. Not gonna give them my traffic. Good riddance.


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## Clix Pix

To me, this is all about respect.  Where is it here, in Relentless Power's ever-so casual throwing out a comment on MR that a member has died -- a remark suddenly tossed into the middle of a thread on another subject?  IMHO this disrespects the member who is mentioned and his family, doesn't it?  It also disrespects those members of the forum who may actually have had a connection with the member mentioned and who then are abruptly slammed with this casual comment that, oh, yeah, [member name] has passed away, too bad.....    Something is very, very wrong here.

Aside from the casual announcement,  the fact that there is no supporting evidence whatsoever (no link to an obituary, no comments along the lines of the information having come from reliable sources and that the family requests privacy, etc.).....only leads to confusion and it is natural for members to then question the verity of this remark in the first place.   So this leaves a group of members who may have had interactions with the supposedly deceased member wondering what is going on, even as they are already beginning to grieve the loss of a friend.

If the news of the death is true, that's one thing;  if it is NOT true, that is quite another isn't it?     There is the (hopeful) possibility that the member who was so off-handedly and casually dismissed as having passed away is in fact very much alive.   I am sure that the casual announcement of his death on a forum in which he has been pretty active over the years would come as a surprise to him!   Again, the issue of respect comes into play.  doesn't it?   Why was this "news" of his supposed death allowed to happen in the first place and to remain written in a couple of posts on the thread when there has been no supporting evidence one way or the other?  Isn't this disrespectful to a member, whether actually the person in question is actually deceased or still alive?

In this situation it's a matter of considering the source, and if in this instance, the source, another member of the site, has not produced evidence that what he stated is in fact true, then isn't this behavior, especially the cavalier way in which he casually made the announcement in the first place, breaking more than a few of MR's guidelines/policies/rules/laws when it comes to treating other members (deceased or alive and still participating)  with respect?


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## bunnspecial

Clix Pix said:


> I am sure that the casual announcement of his death on a forum in which he has been pretty active over the years would come as a surprise to him!




If in fact he is still alive, which I hope is the case(and am optimistic considering Sceptical Scribe's recent contact), I wonder what the reaction/response would be if he himself were to report the post. 

It seems like saying "Hey, this guy said I'm dead but I'm not" would be a god reason to at least take the post down, but then this is MR we are talking about.


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## Herdfan

bunnspecial said:


> I have a lot of hobbies that...well...tend to attract an older group of folks.
> 
> On most sites, the death announcement is handled let's say in a much less casual manner. I've made such announcements myself when I learned of one that likely wouldn't have made it to a source otherwise, but often it comes from family logging into an account an posting or from a friend posting.




The one I remember was at DBSTalk and it was announced by a Mod.


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## Eric

Herdfan said:


> The one I remember was at DBSTalk and it was announced by a Mod.



Right or announced properly by a well known and trusted member of the site. Not in the middle of a thread blurted out of nowhere in passing by a narcissistic blowhard, it's not just RP (we expect that from him), the bigger issue is that staff has allowed it when they've penalized so many of us for not providing citations for so much less.


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## bunnspecial

Here's such a death announcement on another forum a frequent. These have unfortunately become all too numerous in the past few years, but this is a common way it's handled at least in my circles 





__





						Jeffery RIP.
					

It is with great sadness that I report the passing of dear friend Jeffery Ollswang of Milwaukee Wi. on April 7 th. I have known Jeff for over 30 years. We have attended countless local, Chapter, Regional, and National events with Jeffery and his wife Lynn. Our group at the Regional, and National...




					mb.nawcc.org
				




The member posting that is a good friend of mine(a really good friend-as in he and his wife were on the guest list at my wedding even though COVID kept them from attending, I talk to him 2-3/month, and have stayed at their house...not an RP "Maybe I've exchanged a few PMs with you" friend), and he had called me with the news a day or two prior to posting that. It often "circulates" before an official announcement is made.


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## Eric

Turns out Zenithal is alive and Relentless Power did lie after all. Not sure what sort of pull he has with moderators over there but he gets away with everything. They covered for him, removed the posts, including this one, and swept it under the rug.


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## Thomas Veil

Sorry if this has been covered, but I haven't been over there in a long time.

Does Zenithal know everything that went down? If not, shouldn't he be notified? After all, we do have the screen grab that Eric wisely took (see first post in this thread).

From what I do know, this sounds like pretty convincing (albeit circumstantial) evidence that hieveryone ↔︎ Multi Millionaire ↔︎ Relentless Power. A large dollop of that belief is how neatly this lines up with that post in which MM tried to claim he was taking over control of this site.

As for MR and its so-called moderators...fuck them.


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## Thomas Veil

Hmm. I just noticed (per Scepticalscribe) that Zenithal has his contacts limited. Guess there's no way to tell him.


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## SuperMatt

People should make posts that Arn is dead and that Weaselboy is actually a bot and was never a real person to begin with. It’s allowed, right?


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## Thomas Veil

Not a bad idea, although I'm sure those would magically vanish too.

But if you're gonna purposely get yourself banned from MR and want to do it with flare, that's the way to go about it.


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## bunnspecial

Thomas Veil said:


> hieveryone ↔︎ Multi Millionaire ↔︎ Relentless Power




I'm not sure about the hieveryone<->Relentless Power connection, as the posting styles are very different although they also have very made-up personas. 

I think we can feel confident that Multi Millionaire is Relentless Power, though. The posting styles, the stupidity paired with extreme confidence, and the repetitive use of a single given "big word" in a post totally out of context all seem to add up.


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## Scepticalscribe

Thomas Veil said:


> Sorry if this has been covered, but I haven't been over there in a long time.
> 
> Does Zenithal know everything that went down? If not, shouldn't he be notified? After all, we do have the screen grab that Eric wisely took (see first post in this thread).
> 
> From what I do know, this sounds like pretty convincing (albeit circumstantial) evidence that hieveryone ↔︎ Multi Millionaire ↔︎ Relentless Power. A large dollop of that belief is how neatly this lines up with that post in which MM tried to claim he was taking over control of this site.
> 
> As for MR and its so-called moderators...fuck them.




Given that he (Zenithal) wrote three PMs to me today (mostly about Ukraine), I thought it best to notify him; that is, assuming that he returns to his account to read my reply, so yes, I have informed him of what transpired, and advised him to contact Arn if this whole sorry saga concerned him.

Today was clearly a day set aside for catching up with MR related communications, as both @DT and I received DMs from Zenithal, who rarely visits MR these days.

Zenithal had written to me (by DM) as recently as mid August of this year, which is why I was sceptical about accounts of his death - however, he hadn't posted publicly on MR since the previous August; RP's egregious post was posted on September 4.


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## Scepticalscribe

Eric said:


> Right or announced properly by a well known and trusted member of the site. Not in the middle of a thread blurted out of nowhere in passing by a narcissistic blowhard, it's not just RP (we expect that from him), the bigger issue is that staff has allowed it when they've penalized so many of us for not providing citations for so much less.






bunnspecial said:


> Here's such a death announcement on another forum a frequent. These have unfortunately become all too numerous in the past few years, but this is a common way it's handled at least in my circles
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jeffery RIP.
> 
> 
> It is with great sadness that I report the passing of dear friend Jeffery Ollswang of Milwaukee Wi. on April 7 th. I have known Jeff for over 30 years. We have attended countless local, Chapter, Regional, and National events with Jeffery and his wife Lynn. Our group at the Regional, and National...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mb.nawcc.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The member posting that is a good friend of mine(a really good friend-as in he and his wife were on the guest list at my wedding even though COVID kept them from attending, I talk to him 2-3/month, and have stayed at their house...not an RP "Maybe I've exchanged a few PMs with you" friend), and he had called me with the news a day or two prior to posting that. It often "circulates" before an official announcement is made.



Of course it is possible to announce the death of a member of a site, as long as it is done with knowledge (that you know that this person has actually passed away), and the right to do so (a close friend, family, kin, someone who has appropriate authority) and is done with respect.

On MR itself, I recall a few occasions where a death (a legitimate death, a real death) was announced; one that I remember was when CalWizard's son posted to let us know that his father (whom some of us knew was ill) had passed away.

But, to post such an announcement, in a casual aside, is deeply disrespectful and grotesquely irresponsible.  It is also downright weird - what a extraordinary thing to do, and to want to do.

Well done, @Eric on reviving this thread.


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## Clix Pix

We've seen countless examples of members being chastised and given suspensions for situations far less significant and disrespectful to another member, and yet RP got away with this scot-free, unblemished.  Why?    Now that Zenithal has made his presence known as a very much alive but busy person, this situation of RP casually tossing out word of his death should now be addressed and dealt with properly, the way it should have been in the first place.


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## Scepticalscribe

Clix Pix said:


> We've seen countless examples of members being chastised and given suspensions for situations far less significant and disrespectful to another member, and yet RP got away with this scot-free, unblemished.  Why?    Now that Zenithal has made his presence known as a very much alive but busy person, this situation of RP casually tossing out word of his death should now be addressed and dealt with properly, the way it should have been in the first place.




Couldn't agree more.


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## quagmire

That is a new low for RP..... Wow.....


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## The-Real-Deal82

I guess something has been said behind closed doors as the post Relentless Power made about Zenithal passing away appears to have gone. Seems an odd claim to make and even more so now he’s actually alive and well. I suppose his reluctance to corroborate the claim publicly and the promises to PM details to users which he never did now sort of make sense. I think the claim was made and he didn’t expect people to care enough to ask for more information. I’m glad the chap isn’t dead though and I hope he sees the funny side and invests in a few cans of creep spray.

All very bizarre lol.


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## Scepticalscribe

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I guess something has been said behind closed doors as the post Relentless Power made about Zenithal passing away appears to have gone.




*All* of the posts which attempted to discuss this - and challenge RP, or call RP to account, insist that he clarify or withdraw that post, - were culled on November 9 - with the marked exception of the one by RP dated September 4 (you can identify it by the fact that it says that it was edited by a mod), which is the edited remains of the post by RP where he made that statement. 

The thread blew up when a number of us returned to the issue in November, and - yet again, again requested RP to clarify, or withdraw his original post, and argued that it was disrespctful in the extreme to announce the death of a member in such a manner.



The-Real-Deal82 said:


> .... Seems an odd claim to make and even more so now he’s actually alive and well. I suppose his reluctance to corroborate the claim publicly and the promises to PM details to users which he never did now sort of make sense. I think the claim was made and he didn’t expect people to care enough to ask for more information. I’m glad the chap isn’t dead though and I hope he sees the funny side and invests in a few cans of creep spray.
> 
> All very bizarre lol.



Extraordinarily bizarre, and - to be candid - downright weird; very odd - in fact, deeply disturbing - behaviour on the part of RP.


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## Eric

Scepticalscribe said:


> *All* of the posts which attempted to discuss this - and challenge RP, or call RP to account, insist that he clarify or withdraw that post, - were culled on November 9 - with the marked exception of the one by RP dated September 4 (you can identify it by the fact that it says that it was edited by a mod), which is the edited remains of the post by RP where he made that statement.
> 
> The thread blew up when a number of us returned to the issue in November, and - yet again, again requested RP to clarify, or withdraw his original post, and argued that it was disrespctful in the extreme to announce the death of a member in such a manner.
> 
> 
> Extraordinarily bizarre, and - to be candid - downright weird; very odd - in fact, deeply disturbing - behaviour on the part of RP.



I think what's more telling is the hold RP has over moderators there, enough to question why he is always given a free pass when so many are penalized for far less. He either knows one of them on a personal level or donates enough to the site that they are willing to overlook it. In either case their bias is on full display.


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## bunnspecial

I think it's also telling how many infractions/warnings were handed out in that instance. I received one for "off topic bickering"


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## Scepticalscribe

bunnspecial said:


> I think it's also telling how many infractions/warnings were handed out in that instance. I received one for "off topic bickering"




As did I.

However, I very much doubt that RP received any reminder, reprimand, or warning, for writing such an egregious post.

Nevertheless, - while he craves attantion and thrives on notice - I suspect that he may have been rather taken aback by the vehement reaction to that appalling post.



Eric said:


> I think what's more telling is the hold RP has over moderators there, enough to question why he is always given a free pass when so many are penalized for far less. He either knows one of them on a personal level or donates enough to the site that they are willing to overlook it. In either case their bias is on full display.



I remain absolutely flabbergasted by the fact that he appears to have been given a free pass over such an outrageous post.


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## Scepticalscribe

I have now added an update in that original Covid Information thread on MR which lets anyone who is interested in the matter know that Zenithal is still among us, and still can be counted in the land of the living.

It will be interesting to see whether my post is left in place, or is reported and obliterated.


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## lizkat

Scepticalscribe said:


> I have now added an update in that original Covid Information thread on MR which lets anyone who is interested in the matter that Zenithal is still among us, in the land of the living.
> 
> It will be interesting to see whether my post is left in place, or is reported and obliterated.




Yah for being "off topic [again] and [still] bickering", eh?   The mods in that place have gone off the deep end.


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## Scepticalscribe

lizkat said:


> Yah for being "off topic [again] and [still] bickering", eh?   The mods in that place have gone off the deep end.



My money is on "off topic".......but, I shall await with bated breath and an absorbed interest to see what transpires.


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## lizkat

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I guess something has been said behind closed doors as the post Relentless Power made about Zenithal passing away appears to have gone. Seems an odd claim to make and even more so now he’s actually alive and well. I suppose his reluctance to corroborate the claim publicly and the promises to PM details to users which he never did now sort of make sense. I think the claim was made and he didn’t expect people to care enough to ask for more information. I’m glad the chap isn’t dead though and I hope he sees the funny side and invests in a few cans of creep spray.
> 
> All very bizarre lol.




What I simply don't get is why the hell one would say in a forum that another member is deceased while knowing that he's not.

It wasn't a random assertion, and so it seems now a very odd way of saying something else, and NOT at random,  although what exactly was implied, who knows.


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## Scepticalscribe

lizkat said:


> What I simply don't get is why the hell one would say in a forum that another member is deceased while knowing that he's not.
> 
> It wasn't a random assertion, and so it seems now a very odd way of saying something else, and NOT at random,  although what exactly was implied, who knows.




To be quite candid, I am equally at a loss for an explanation for such an (appalling) action.

Some have suggested ego, a need for notice, a craving for attention; if so, it still strikes me as a deeply disturbing and downright weird way in which to behave and demand attention.


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## MarkusL

quagmire said:


> That is a new low for RP..... Wow.....



Also a new low for the MR mods, and that’s saying something.


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## Scepticalscribe

MarkusL said:


> Also a new low for the MR mods, and that’s saying something.




Unfortunately, it does seem to be a new low for MR mods, - that is a bar that seems to move ever downwards.

However, while @quagmire suggests that it is a "new low" for PR, I am now firmly of the opinion that no low is too low for that gentleman.


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## Scepticalscribe

@Eric; @Alli: @Cmaier; @DT and other staff:

I just wanted to revive this particular thread, - as a timely reminder of an especially egregious action - and to ensure that appropriate action, or steps, will be taken by the staff here on TA if something of the sort ever happens, or occurs, or takes place, on TA.

While MacRumors allowed this to occur without taking any action (or none that we are aware of), I should sincerely hope that such outrageous conduct would meet with a reprimand, or response, on TA.


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## Clix Pix

When the incident occurred on MR back then,  the member who posted, rather casually, not to mention callously and without any supporting evidence whatsoever, that another member had died should have been suspended until he could provide proof of what he had stated, which was not provided even though at the time he was asked for that by other members.     Nor was he permanently banned when it became clear that what he had posted was actually indeed a falsehood, wholly untrue and that the other member of MR is very much alive.  

Most forums with which I have been involved over the years would at the time this all transpired have taken immediate temporary action (suspension) and once the truth had come out, permanent action (banning) regarding a member who behaved in this extraordinary and distinctly untrustworthy way.  If they are aware or have been made aware of the history of this individual elsewhere, I daresay they certainly wouldn't welcome as a new or active member someone whose behavior has already been demonstrated to be quite questionable.


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## BigMcGuire

I'm surprised to see RP cancel their account. Never thought I'd see that day. Apologies if this post doesn't belong here or isn't allowed (feel free to delete), couldn't find that other thread.


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## Hrafn

BigMcGuire said:


> I'm surprised to see RP cancel their account. Never thought I'd see that day. Apologies if this post doesn't belong here or isn't allowed (feel free to delete), couldn't find that other thread.



They could do a fair amount of cleaning of other trolls.  He was apparently angry about the way Mike was treated, of which, I have no knowledge.


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## BigMcGuire

Hrafn said:


> They could do a fair amount of cleaning of other trolls.  He was apparently angry about the way Mike was treated, of which, I have no knowledge.



Is Maflynn Mike? I also noticed he quit or retired or ... something. Quite a bit of change over there.... And agreed about troll comment - it's one of many reasons I've taken a huge step back from forums lately (personal life reasons mostly - nothing bad) - work getting heavy these days.

Never thought I'd ever see the day Maflynn and RP leave that place.


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## Clix Pix

Actually, I would not in the least be surprised if RP is still on MR -- under a new, different user name, either with or without the admins/mods team's knowledge....  Just a sneaking suspicion....


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## Cmaier

BigMcGuire said:


> Is Maflynn Mike? I also noticed he quit or retired or ... something. Quite a bit of change over there.... And agreed about troll comment - it's one of many reasons I've taken a huge step back from forums lately (personal life reasons mostly - nothing bad) - work getting heavy these days.
> 
> Never thought I'd ever see the day Maflynn and RP leave that place.




RP claims Maflynn was forced out, or that MR mistreated him somehow, and that’s why RP quit.  I don’t think we know anything more than that.


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## BigMcGuire

Cmaier said:


> RP claims Maflynn was forced out, or that MR mistreated him somehow, and that’s why RP quit.  I don’t think we know anything more than that.



Thank you for the info.


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## lizkat

Kind of surprised about Maflynn departing,  but don't know anything about the circumstances.

As for that other guy, I remain surprised he wasn't actually booted a long time ago.


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## AG_PhamD

lizkat said:


> Kind of surprised about Maflynn departing,  but don't know anything about the circumstances.
> 
> As for that other guy, I remain surprised he wasn't actually booted a long time ago.




I’m not sure what’s more shocking. The fact he was never booted or the fact he (apparently) voluntarily left.


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## The-Real-Deal82

lizkat said:


> Kind of surprised about Maflynn departing,  but don't know anything about the circumstances.
> 
> As for that other guy, I remain surprised he wasn't actually booted a long time ago.



For him to leave because of his mod friend, I’d say the reason he wasn’t booted was because his friend was protecting him during the post review process. I didn’t cross swords too many times with RP but I did get PM’s on a few occasions warning me not to argue with him or I’d be banned from other posters. I hadn’t realised he was a friend of a mod at that point though.

He was very opinionated and patronising to people if they disagreed with him. I also didn’t get the impression he wasn’t as wealthy as he liked to brag but I can overlook that sort of thing as it’s inoffensive. The tone is a lot nicer on the car threads as I think people are sharing their experiences without a resident expert smacking them down.

The whole announcing the death of a member he didn’t even know was beyond weird though. Not sure how he thought that was appropriate and how he thought it would pan out, especially if this supposed demised poster turned up as he evidently did!!


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## Scepticalscribe

lizkat said:


> Kind of surprised about Maflynn departing,  but don't know anything about the circumstances.
> 
> As for that other guy, I remain surprised he wasn't actually booted a long time ago.



Agree.

However, if maflynn was indeed encouraged to depart, I suspect that it may have been because it came to be perceived that he may have been harming, or hurting, the business.


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## lizkat

Scepticalscribe said:


> Agree.
> 
> However, if maflynn was indeed encouraged to depart, I suspect that it may have been because it came to be perceived that he may have been harming, or hurting, the business.




It's too bad if Maflynn ended up departing over behavior related to moderation or politicking,  since if I recall properly,  his input to technical discussions over there had often been considered valuable by other members. 

There's an old saying that no one gets lost on a straight road, but I dunno about that.  Sometimes the rest stops and exits aren't clearly marked,  and as far as social media forums are concerned, no road ends up without its curves and dips and detours now and then.


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## Cmaier

lizkat said:


> It's too bad if Maflynn ended up departing over behavior related to moderation or politicking,  since if I recall properly,  his input to technical discussions over there had often been considered valuable by other members.
> 
> There's an old saying that no one gets lost on a straight road, but I dunno about that.  Sometimes the rest stops and exits aren't clearly marked,  and as far as social media forums are concerned, no road ends up without its curves and dips and detours now and then.



My recollection of maflynn is he seemed to hate apple products and didn’t really know much about the technology, but I could be confusing him with another mod.


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## Clix Pix

For a long time Maflynn was an enthusiastic Apple products user but somewhere along the line it became noticeable that he had begun to sour on things Apple  and as time went on he very clearly shifted his loyalty to Windows.   At least that's my memory of how things went, anyway.


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