# COVID Stupid



## Huntn

I said something like this recently, but after a report that every non-vaccinated person is going to catch the D or D+ variant of COVID-19, here is my policy:  When you arrive at the hospital if you have been inoculated, show your card, you will be admitted. If you have not been inoculated, you will receive a COVID test and if positive, you will be sent home.  









						What doctors wish patients knew about the dangerous Delta variant
					

The COVID-19 Delta variant, a more transmissible form of SARS-CoV-2, is rapidly spreading and poses a threat to unvaccinated and partially vaccinated people.




					www.ama-assn.org
				












						How dangerous is the new Delta Plus variant? Here’s what we know.
					

The latest coronavirus variant has spread to about a dozen countries—including India, the U.S., and the U.K.—while scientists scramble to figure out if the strain is more deadly or transmissible.




					www.nationalgeographic.com
				












						The Delta variant infected almost everyone at a 'superspreader' party in Australia — but not the 6 vaccinated people
					

After a birthday party near Sydney, 24 guests tested positive for COVID-19. The six fully vaccinated guests remained healthy, a health official said.




					www.businessinsider.com
				









						Why The Delta Variant Matters If You’re Vaccinated Or Unvaccinated - Gothamist
					

Gothamist is a non-profit local newsroom, powered by WNYC.




					gothamist.com
				












						How Immunity Generated from COVID-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection
					

A key issue as we move closer to ending the pandemic is determining more precisely how long people exposed to SARS-CoV-2, the COVID-19 virus, will make neutralizing antibodies against this dangerou…




					directorsblog.nih.gov


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> I said something like this recently, but after a report that every non-vaccinated person is going to catch the D or D+ variant of COVID-19, here is my policy:  When you arrive at the hospital if you have been inoculated, show your card, you will be admitted. If you have not been inoculated, you will receive a COVID test and if positive, you will be sent home.




Am I reading what you wrote correctly, that EVERY NON-VACCINATED PERSON is going to catch D or D+?  That is what, 40+% of the country?


----------



## Hrafn

Herdfan said:


> Am I reading what you wrote correctly, that EVERY NON-VACCINATED PERSON is going to catch D or D+?  That is what, 40+% of the country?



Your counts of the stupid in America might be high, but not unexpected.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> Am I reading what you wrote correctly, that EVERY NON-VACCINATED PERSON is going to catch D or D+?  That is what, 40+% of the country?



It is reported as so contagious that  if an individual exposes themselves to an infected person they will get it much easier than the original strain.


----------



## Herdfan

Hrafn said:


> Your counts of the stupid in America might be high, but not unexpected.




This source shows just under 60% have had at least 1 jab.  That leaves 40% with none.  Not sure if that counts U12's or not.

But doing some quick math, 40% of 330M is 132M.  That is 4 times the number who have had it so far.  

If that is accurate, get ready for masks and lockdowns all over again.


----------



## Hrafn

Herdfan said:


> This source shows just under 60% have had at least 1 jab.  That leaves 40% with none.  Not sure if that counts U12's or not.
> 
> But doing some quick math, 40% of 330M is 132M.  That is 4 times the number who have had it so far.
> 
> If that is accurate, get ready for masks and lockdowns all over again.



I don't see how our _Patriot_ brethren will tolerate that.


----------



## Eric

Now there's talk of the Lambda variant 









						The Lambda Variant: What You Should Know And Why Experts Say Not To Panic
					

Cases of the variant have popped up in several states. But neither the WHO nor the CDC considers it a variant of concern, and the fast-spreading delta variant continues to dominate U.S. cases.




					www.npr.org
				




(To which I suspect will be followed by the Omega-Mu variant)


----------



## DT

Eric said:


> Now there's talk of the Lambda variant
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Lambda Variant: What You Should Know And Why Experts Say Not To Panic
> 
> 
> Cases of the variant have popped up in several states. But neither the WHO nor the CDC considers it a variant of concern, and the fast-spreading delta variant continues to dominate U.S. cases.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (To which I suspect will be followed by the Omega-Mu variant)




And soon, the Delta Tau Chi variant ...


----------



## Yoused

covidiocy story link​


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> here is my policy: When you arrive at the hospital if you have been inoculated, show your card, you will be admitted. If you have not been inoculated, you will receive a COVID test and if positive, you will be sent home.



... So, unvaccinated, infected people are sent home? Surely this is only for asymptotic/'mild' symptom cases? If they come in struggling to breath, surely they're not being told to go quarantine at home?


----------



## Alli

Stephen.R said:


> ... So, unvaccinated, infected people are sent home? Surely this is only for asymptotic/'mild' symptom cases? If they come in struggling to breath, surely they're not being told to go quarantine at home?



It will depend on whether there are any rooms/ventilators available. And the vaccinated will have priority.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> This source shows just under 60% have had at least 1 jab.  That leaves 40% with none.  Not sure if that counts U12's or not.
> 
> But doing some quick math, 40% of 330M is 132M.  That is 4 times the number who have had it so far.
> 
> If that is accurate, get ready for masks and lockdowns all over again.



Here is my point, the vaccine has been shown to control this contagion. If it ever reaches a point when we are effectively back to square one, the unvaccinated can plan on being blamed for this, and personally I believe punitive policies need to be instituted. With this new virulent variant,  kids not vaccinated can stay home, maybe working adults too. The effectiveness of the vaccine is nothing less than stunning. This is a case where we need to be team players or go find a private island to live.


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> Now there's talk of the Lambda variant
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Lambda Variant: What You Should Know And Why Experts Say Not To Panic
> 
> 
> Cases of the variant have popped up in several states. But neither the WHO nor the CDC considers it a variant of concern, and the fast-spreading delta variant continues to dominate U.S. cases.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (To which I suspect will be followed by the Omega-Mu variant)



Besides reading that the flu has kind of gone into remission, I think it was DR Fauci who said that they are working on a hybrid flu-COVID vaccine for annual application.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> ... So, unvaccinated, infected people are sent home? Surely this is only for asymptotic/'mild' symptom cases? If they come in struggling to breath, surely they're not being told to go quarantine at home?



Yep, this is my philosophical position in light of hard facts. I have no sympathy left for stupid, this is like winning a Darwin award, a chance to clear out the dead weight of humanity, possibly a chance to increase the collective IQ of the human species. In light of COVID outbreaks among those who have been vaccinated, they definitely get priority. Of note at this point you who are vaccinated can still get sick with COVID, but virtually all those who are dying are the unvaccinated.

No need for our hospitals and medical system to be overwhelmed by a contagion that has an effective counter. If you don’t believe in vaccines, then don’t bother us, go home and take your chances.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Edit: quoted wrong post.



Huntn said:


> Yep, this is my philosophical position in light of hard facts. I have no sympathy left for stupid, this is like winning a Darwin award, a chance to clear out the dead weight of humanity, possiblyba chance to increase the collective IQ of the human species.
> 
> No need for our hospitals and medical system to be overwhelmed by a contagion that has an effective counter. If you don’t believe in vaccines, then don’t bother us, go home and take your chances.




... So, context be damned, no vaccine, no entry, fuck you very much?

I don't want you to think that I'm agreeing with the anti-vaxxers - they are indeed _choosing_ to do stupid things. 

But to be fair, if you plan to ban anyone who does something stupid from a hospital, you might as well close 70% of hospitals.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Huntn said:


> …If it ever reaches a point when we are effectively back to square one, the unvaccinated can plan on being blamed for this, and personally I believe punitive policies need to be instituted.



Medical ethics demands that patients be triaged and the worst cases given priority. But I would love to see the AMA give blanket permission for doctors and hospitals to do what you’re talking about.

For the last six months or so, if you’ve been avoiding the vaccine you are essentially walking blindly into traffic every day, knowing damn well sooner or later you are going to be hit. I have no sympathy for such stupidity.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Thomas Veil said:


> Medical ethics demands that patients be triaged and the worst cases given priority. But I would love to see the AMA give blanket permission for doctors and hospitals to do what you’re talking about.
> 
> For the last six months or so, if you’ve been avoiding the vaccine you are essentially walking blindly into traffic every day, knowing damn well sooner or later you are going to be hit. I have no sympathy for such stupidity.




Am I really the only one who can imagine where that would inevitably lead, given the ridiculous politics in America?



For those who can't imagine, you don't need to. It's already happening here. The *director of a hospital* here made these statements recently:



> Covid-19 patients that went out to protest are not on the prioritized list at <hospital name>






> The prioritization will be for people who are loyal to the King first and if there are any hospital beds left, we will only consider receiving protesters on a case by case basis after we screen them for their behaviour


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> Edit: quoted wrong post.
> 
> 
> 
> ... So, context be damned, no vaccine, no entry, fuck you very much?
> 
> I don't want you to think that I'm agreeing with the anti-vaxxers - they are indeed _choosing_ to do stupid things.
> 
> But to be fair, if you plan to ban anyone who does something stupid from a hospital, you might as well close 70% of hospitals.



The COVID variant is spreading like wildfire through the population of unvaccinated.

I sympathize with what you are saying. As far as our medical system being overwhelmed, it’s like triage, but in this case help the vaccinated sick ones who need help first. Send  the unvaccinated home.  I realize there are a lot of stupid people who do things unrelated to COVID. My stance was on this issue, is limited to the “bright“ folk who feel they don’t need to take COVID-19 vaccination.

Also I have to acknowledge from a previous post that I made exceptions for low income people who had no readily apparent means of getting vaccinated.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yup, I stopped by Facebook earlier and picked up a few things


----------



## Herdfan

Eric said:


> Now there's talk of the Lambda variant




What happened to Epsilon through Kappa?


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> it’s like triage, but in this case help the vaccinated sick ones who need help first. Send the unvaccinated home.



I'm not a doctor but I'm pretty sure triage is about prioritising help for those who need it most *and can be helped*, and not about refusing to help people because they're partly to blame for needing help.

Also, it's a little disingenuous to say "help the vaccinated *first*" if your next sentence is "send the unvaccinated home".

The first part implies you're going to help the unvaccinated after, but you've said quite clearly you don't want to help them.


----------



## Eric

Stephen.R said:


> I'm not a doctor but I'm pretty sure triage is about prioritising help for those who need it most *and can be helped*, and not about refusing to help people because they're partly to blame for needing help.
> 
> Also, it's a little disingenuous to say "help the vaccinated *first*" if your next sentence is "send the unvaccinated home".
> 
> The first part implies you're going to help the unvaccinated after, but you've said quite clearly you don't want to help them.



Sounds like opinion and conjecture but the reality is no hospitals are favoring one over the other, at least nothing on the news is being reported that way. In fact, the unvaccinated are overwhelming hospitals and obviously have priority right now. 

Are they selfish assholes who treat hospital staff like shit with a sense of entitlement and no shame? Yes. Are they being sent home when sick? No.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Eric said:


> Sounds like opinion and conjecture but the reality is no hospitals are favoring one over the other, at least nothing on the news is being reported that way. In fact, the unvaccinated are overwhelming hospitals and obviously have priority right now.
> 
> Are they selfish assholes who treat hospital staff like shit with a sense of entitlement and no shame? Yes. Are they being sent home when sick? No.



I'm not suggesting that is happening somewhere there, I'm directly responding to @Huntn and @Thomas Veil clearly saying they think hospitals *should* do that.


----------



## Eric

Stephen.R said:


> I'm not suggesting that is happening somewhere there, I'm directly responding to @Huntn and @Thomas Veil clearly saying they think hospitals *should* do that.



I would never really send someone home but I definitely get their thinking here. These people have been irresponsible, outspoken against the vaccine and politically motivated this entire time and now we have to put them in the front of the line while they're kicking and screaming about it. It's easy to say F them right in their COVID hole.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Eric said:


> I definitely get their thinking here



I understand the frustration with anti-vaxxers who then continue to take up beds.

But like I said, I can also see where it's gonna lead.

You choose not to be Catholic? No service at my Catholic hospital (I still find it beyond bizarre that a religion runs hospitals but whatever).

You choose to be an unwed mother? No service at my conservative-run hospital.

I know, I know - those things are not related to the cause of the need for hospitalisation, so it's 'different'. Pretty sure that's not gonna stop someone doing what they see as "the other side of the coin". If conservatives can pretend that science is a political issue, you better believe they're gonna pretend health care is a political issue.




Eric said:


> It's easy to say F them right in their COVID hole.



Sure. Right after we say 'fuck drink drivers, speeders and those driving unlicensed, no hospital care after they crash', not to mention 'fuck smokers, no hospital care when they get cancer' oh and of course 'fuck protesters, no hospital care when the police/other protesters beat them to a pulp'.

If you think health care in America is fucked now, wait till you have doctors/hospitals deciding they're going to admit people based on their specific moral compass.


----------



## Eric

Stephen.R said:


> I understand the frustration with anti-vaxxers who then continue to take up beds.
> 
> But like I said, I can also see where it's gonna lead.
> 
> You choose not to be Catholic? No service at my Catholic hospital (I still find it beyond bizarre that a religion runs hospitals but whatever).
> 
> You choose to be an unwed mother? No service at my conservative-run hospital.
> 
> I know, I know - those things are not related to the cause of the need for hospitalisation, so it's 'different'. Pretty sure that's not gonna stop someone doing what they see as "the other side of the coin". If conservatives can pretend that science is a political issue, you better believe they're gonna pretend health care is a political issue.
> 
> 
> 
> Sure. Right after we say 'fuck drink drivers, speeders and those driving unlicensed, no hospital care after they crash', not to mention 'fuck smokers, no hospital care when they get cancer' oh and of course 'fuck protesters, no hospital care when the police/other protesters beat them to a pulp'.
> 
> If you think health care in America is fucked now, wait till you have doctors/hospitals deciding they're going to admit people based on their specific moral compass.



You're trying to elicit sympathy for these dicks, I think you're going to have a hard time pushing that here. They will get the best care possible even though they certainly do NOT deserve it so I don't get all the hypotheticals.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Eric said:


> You're trying to elicit sympathy for these dicks, I think you're going to have a hard time pushing that here. They will get the best care possible even though they certainly do NOT deserve it so I don't get all the hypotheticals.



Not at all. My reasons are 100% not because of 'sympathy' for anti-vaxxers.

I'm trying to make people realise that a change like that, does not happen in a vacuum.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> I'm not a doctor but I'm pretty sure triage is about prioritising help for those who need it most *and can be helped*, and not about refusing to help people because they're partly to blame for needing help.
> 
> Also, it's a little disingenuous to say "help the vaccinated *first*" if your next sentence is "send the unvaccinated home".
> 
> The first part implies you're going to help the unvaccinated after, but you've said quite clearly you don't want to help them.



First of all I want emphasize I don’t consider this a fight between you and me.   This is simply a logical philosophical exercise. That said…

Triage is not helping people that most need it. Triage is prioritizing, giving help to those that can benefit most  from that help. So it means cutting loose those who are too far gone. If you are overwhelmed or understaffed, you apply the limited help you can give were it is most beneficial, not lost causes.

I have added into that a responsibility clause if we have a full hospital with limited beds, say 10 beds available and 40 people need beds, of those people who need to be in hospital those who have COVID and refused the vaccine, they would go to the end of the line and sent home. From the patient perspective, I consider it adult responsibility.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> I'm not suggesting that is happening somewhere there, I'm directly responding to @Huntn and @Thomas Veil clearly saying they think hospitals *should* do that.



I just answered you, and yes this is how I feel.   Did you know that both Chicken Pox and TB is on the rise because not so smart parents are not having their kids vaccinated? I believe this is part of the Fermi Paradox/Great Filter argument as to why we maybe doomed...  









						Chickenpox on the rise
					

Minnesota's Department of Health says there's an uptick in the number of chickenpox cases this year.




					www.kimt.com
				






			https://www.usnews.com/news/healthiest-communities/articles/2018-08-21/is-tuberculosis-making-a-comeback


----------



## Yoused

Herdfan said:


> What happened to Epsilon through Kappa?



You see, one side started to fall a little but stabilized when the other side drooped over. However, as it was falling, it slid a little bit sideways, causing the bottom to come loose and just fall away. Thus, the Δ variant was directly transformed into the λ variant.


----------



## Yoused

Lincoln Project ad


Spoiler: banned from Comcast



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1418194125807964169/


----------



## Yoused

Anti-maskers and Anti-vaxxers were protesting outside a clinic when they got into an argument with a woman who had showed up at Cedars-Sinai Breast Health Services for a round of chemo.

Protesting COVID restrictions outside a cancer clinic. This level of stupid seriously needs to stop.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> First of all I want emphasize I don’t consider this a fight between you and me.



Agreed. I have RL friends with whom I have bigger philosophical differences.



Huntn said:


> Triage is not helping people that most need it. Triage is prioritizing, giving help to those that can benefit most from that help.



The good people at Oxford English Dictionary don't seem to agree with you (emphasis mine):


> the preliminary assessment of patients or casualties in order to *determine the urgency of their need* for treatment and the nature of treatment required


----------



## Thomas Veil

Huntn said:


> First of all I want emphasize I don’t consider this a fight between you and me.   This is simply a logical philosophical exercise. That said…
> 
> Triage is not helping people that most need it. Triage is prioritizing, giving help to those that can benefit most  from that help. So it means cutting loose those who are too far gone. If you are overwhelmed or understaffed, you apply the limited help you can give were it is most beneficial, not lost causes.
> 
> I have added into that a responsibility clause if we have a full hospital with limited beds, say 10 beds available and 40 people need beds, of those people who need to be in hospital those who have COVID and refused the vaccine, they would go to the end of the line and sent home. From the patient perspective, I consider it adult responsibility.



I can buy that. 


Yoused said:


> You see, one side started to fall a little but stabilized when the other side drooped over. However, as it was falling, it slid a little bit sideways, causing the bottom to come loose and just fall away. Thus, the Δ variant was directly transformed into the λ variant.



That has to be the nerdiest joke I’ve ever read.


----------



## Roller

A few facts and comments relevant to this thread:

1. In the United States, hospitals are bound by the Emergency Medical Treatment and Labor Act (EMTALA) to screen patients for emergency medical conditions. If one exists, they must be stabilized or treated until the condition is resolved. If the facility lacks specialized capabilities for treatment, they must transfer the patient to a hospital that does. The latter are required to accept transfer. Of course, there are many nuances that come into play, particularly in patients with COVID-19 and in scenarios where the specialty hospital is at capacity.

2. Refusing to treat patients because they chose risky behavior runs counter to the ethical principles that are supposed to govern medical care. In situations where triage is required because of limited resources, hospitals typically will base decisions on considerations such as likelihood of recovery, age, and so on.

3. The science regarding COVID-19 in general and the delta variant in particular is fluid because new evidence, some of it contradictory, comes out every day. But most people who quote studies online, especially on social media, lack the wherewithal to assess the validity of published medical research. Evan in the medical / scientific community, there is considerable (and, IMO, appropriate) debate.

4. The CDC recognizes three levels of variants, which are constellations of mutations that establish a distinct viral line due to natural selection: variants of interest, variants of concern, and variants of high consequence. Delta's competitive advantage appears to be the higher viral loads in infected patients, which increases transmission. So far, the leading vaccines are fairly competent at preventing serious illness, but that could change. (Delta is considered a VOC.)

5. Fully vaccinated individuals who contract COVID-19 (so-called breakthrough infection) will usually have mild symptoms if any, though some will be sicker. A small minority will require hospitalization and may die, particularly if they have co-morbidities like diabetes. It's still unclear how many people who are mildly symptomatic will suffer long-term consequences, so precautions are in order.

6. I believe vaccinated people in areas with low vaccination rates (I am in one of those) should continue to wear masks in public indoor spaces. Fortunately, hospitals can still require this of staff, patients, and visitors.


----------



## Huntn

Yoused said:


> Lincoln Project ad
> 
> 
> Spoiler: banned from Comcast
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1418194125807964169/



Freaking simo awful and awesome.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Yoused said:


> Lincoln Project ad
> 
> 
> Spoiler: banned from Comcast
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1418194125807964169/




I’m not sure why the ad is in spoiler tags, but 

There is about a 0% chance cable systems will drop Fox News as the ad asks—more’s the pity.
They’re right: Fox is responsible for deaths. A lot of them.
Tucker Carlson: “How many people have died after taking the Covid vaccine?” _*What??*_ Are you out of your fucking mind? How many have died from _not_ taking the vaccine?


----------



## Huntn

Thomas Veil said:


> I’m not sure why the ad is in spoiler tags, but
> 
> There is about a 0% chance cable systems will drop Fox News as the ad asks—more’s the pity.
> They’re right: Fox is responsible for deaths. A lot of them.
> Tucker Carlson: “How many people have died after taking the Covid vaccine?” _*What??*_ Are you out of your fucking mind? How many have died from _not_ taking the vaccine?



Tucker Carlson wants to run as Trump V2 in 2024.


----------



## mac_in_tosh

In perusing this thread, there appears to be blanket scorn directed at all the non-vaccinated, but they fall into at least four categories. 

First, due to pre-existing conditions related to potential side effects of the vaccines, some people face increased risk with vaccination. They are not necessarily against the vaccines in principle.

Second, some people have concerns about the development of the vaccines and are in the difficult position of having to weigh the risk of Covid vs. the risk of potential issues down the road from these new technologies.

Third, some people have an inherent distrust of big pharma based on the industry's history and/or previous adverse reactions to their products. They also could be facing personal struggle trying to decide what to do.

Fourth, there are the conspiracy theory, rigged-election anti-vaxxers who probably also scoff at wearing masks and social distancing. They deserve scorn and those careless behavior choices no doubt account for some percentage of the rising cases among the unvaccinated.

*None of this is meant to dissuade anyone from taking the vaccine.* I simply want to point out that getting the vaccine is not a simple thing to do for some people and the non-vaccinated are not one homogenous group of horrible people. Many in the first three groups are behaving responsibly - they may not have much contact with other people (retired, working remotely, etc.) and wear masks and social distance even when guidelines relax these practices.


----------



## JayMysteri0

mac_in_tosh said:


> In perusing this thread, there appears to be blanket scorn directed at all the non-vaccinated, but they fall into at least four categories.
> 
> First, due to pre-existing conditions related to potential side effects of the vaccines, some people face increased risk with vaccination. They are not necessarily against the vaccines in principle.
> 
> Second, some people have concerns about the development of the vaccines and are in the difficult position of having to weigh the risk of Covid vs. the risk of potential issues down the road from these new technologies.
> 
> Third, some people have an inherent distrust of big pharma based on the industry's history and/or previous adverse reactions to their products. They also could be facing personal struggle trying to decide what to do.
> 
> Fourth, there are the conspiracy theory, rigged-election anti-vaxxers who probably also scoff at wearing masks and social distancing. They deserve scorn and those careless behavior choices no doubt account for some percentage of the rising cases among the unvaccinated.
> 
> *None of this is meant to dissuade anyone from taking the vaccine.* I simply want to point out that getting the vaccine is not a simple thing to do for some people and the non-vaccinated are not one homogenous group of horrible people. Many in the first three groups are behaving responsibly - they may not have much contact with other people (retired, working remotely, etc.) and wear masks and social distance even when guidelines relax these practices.



It's pretty often mentioned that any ire towards the unvaccinated is specifically at that base of a party that's been fed the vaccine has some kind of agenda behind it.  That Biden's door to door outreach is the test run for going door to door to take people's guns & Bibles.  It's why you see repeatedly the connection of red state administrations & low vaccination rates.  There's a clear focus on WHO is being referred to.


----------



## Huntn

mac_in_tosh said:


> In perusing this thread, there appears to be blanket scorn directed at all the non-vaccinated, but they fall into at least four categories.
> 
> First, due to pre-existing conditions related to potential side effects of the vaccines, some people face increased risk with vaccination. They are not necessarily against the vaccines in principle.
> 
> Second, some people have concerns about the development of the vaccines and are in the difficult position of having to weigh the risk of Covid vs. the risk of potential issues down the road from these new technologies.
> 
> Third, some people have an inherent distrust of big pharma based on the industry's history and/or previous adverse reactions to their products. They also could be facing personal struggle trying to decide what to do.
> 
> Fourth, there are the conspiracy theory, rigged-election anti-vaxxers who probably also scoff at wearing masks and social distancing. They deserve scorn and those careless behavior choices no doubt account for some percentage of the rising cases among the unvaccinated.
> 
> *None of this is meant to dissuade anyone from taking the vaccine.* I simply want to point out that getting the vaccine is not a simple thing to do for some people and the non-vaccinated are not one homogenous group of horrible people. Many in the first three groups are behaving responsibly - they may not have much contact with other people (retired, working remotely, etc.) and wear masks and social distance even when guidelines relax these practices.



If there is a medical reason not to do so, then no scorn. That scorn is reserved for conspiracy theorists, anti-vaxxers, _I don’t wanna_ or _I believe the Head Liar_, in other words stupid. The human race just can’t afford stupid these days and we may just be doomed because of them.


----------



## Runs For Fun

mac_in_tosh said:


> In perusing this thread, there appears to be blanket scorn directed at all the non-vaccinated, but they fall into at least four categories.
> 
> First, due to pre-existing conditions related to potential side effects of the vaccines, some people face increased risk with vaccination. They are not necessarily against the vaccines in principle.
> 
> Second, some people have concerns about the development of the vaccines and are in the difficult position of having to weigh the risk of Covid vs. the risk of potential issues down the road from these new technologies.
> 
> Third, some people have an inherent distrust of big pharma based on the industry's history and/or previous adverse reactions to their products. They also could be facing personal struggle trying to decide what to do.
> 
> Fourth, there are the conspiracy theory, rigged-election anti-vaxxers who probably also scoff at wearing masks and social distancing. They deserve scorn and those careless behavior choices no doubt account for some percentage of the rising cases among the unvaccinated.
> 
> *None of this is meant to dissuade anyone from taking the vaccine.* I simply want to point out that getting the vaccine is not a simple thing to do for some people and the non-vaccinated are not one homogenous group of horrible people. Many in the first three groups are behaving responsibly - they may not have much contact with other people (retired, working remotely, etc.) and wear masks and social distance even when guidelines relax these practices.



I have no issue with people that fall into the first group. They can't get the vaccine because of a legitimate medical condition or they're too young. That's fine. Those people seem to be pretty responsible and cautious.

My patience with the wait and see crowd is rapidly approaching 0 at this point. They've had plenty of time to wait and see. If literally millions of people are getting the vaccine with extremely few adverse reactions isn't enough to satisfy them, nothing is going to. Add to that that mRNA isn't a new technology. It has been around for years. Wait and see is very poor excuse right now.

As for the last two groups, fuck these idiots. They are the reason we are seeing increased cases and the rampant spread of misinformation and whacko conspiracy theories.


----------



## Huntn

Runs For Fun said:


> I have no issue with people that fall into the first group. They can't get the vaccine because of a legitimate medical condition or they're too young. That's fine. Those people seem to be pretty responsible and cautious.
> 
> My patience with the wait and see crowd is rapidly approaching 0 at this point. They've had plenty of time to wait and see. If literally millions of people are getting the vaccine with extremely few adverse reactions isn't enough to satisfy them, nothing is going to. Add to that that mRNA isn't a new technology. It has been around for years. Wait and see is very poor excuse right now.
> 
> As for the last two groups, fuck these idiots. They are the reason we are seeing increased cases and the rampant spread of misinformation and whacko conspiracy theories.



Because of the way they make it, they say you are better protected from all strains than the immunity built by just getting sick from it.


----------



## mac_in_tosh

Runs For Fun said:


> Add to that that mRNA isn't a new technology. It has been around for years.



Can you expand on that - when and how has it been used?


----------



## Huntn

mac_in_tosh said:


> Can you expand on that - when and how has it been used?



Look up: mRNA technology has been around for a decade. 









						COVID-19 vaccines built on proven technology
					

COVID-19 vaccines built on proven technology-         The vaccines now used to stop the spread of COVID-19 were the quickest developed in recent history, causing some people to hesitate before getting vaccinated.But the mRNA vaccine technology used in the Pfizer-BioNTech and the Moderna vaccines...




					www.myrecordjournal.com


----------



## Eric

mac_in_tosh said:


> Can you expand on that - when and how has it been used?



Maybe below is better way to phrase this, from the CDC. We've know it's an effective delivery system for decades.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.htmlhttps://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html

mRNA Vaccines Are New, But Not Unknown​Researchers have been studying and working with mRNA vaccines for decades. Interest has grown in these vaccines because they can be developed in a laboratory using readily available materials. This means the process can be standardized and scaled up, making vaccine development faster than traditional methods of making vaccines.

mRNA vaccines have been studied before for flu, Zika, rabies, and cytomegalovirus (CMV). As soon as the necessary information about the virus that causes COVID-19 was available, scientists began designing the mRNA instructions for cells to build the unique spike protein into an mRNA vaccine.

Future mRNA vaccine technology may allow for one vaccine to provide protection for multiple diseases, thus decreasing the number of shots needed for protection against common vaccine-preventable diseases.

Beyond vaccines, cancer research has used mRNA to trigger the immune system to target specific cancer cells.


----------



## SuperMatt

According to this interview done by The Atlantic, the anti-vaxxers are very vocal, but do not represent the majority of those who aren’t vaccinated yet.


> Anti-vaxxers are incredibly vocal, and because of that, they’ve been a disproportionate focus of our vaccine outreach. But I think that they represent a small part of people in this country, and especially in our communities of color, an irrelevant part. In our work, we haven’t given much credence to their bluster. But the rampant disinformation that’s put out by this minority has shaped our public discourse, and has led to this collective vitriol toward the “unvaccinated” as if they are predominantly a group of anti-vaxxers. The people we’re really trying to move are not.












						America Is Getting Unvaccinated People All Wrong
					

They’re not all anti-vaxxers, and treating them as such is making things worse.




					www.theatlantic.com


----------



## Eric

Rob Schneider has finally been flagged on Twitter, it's a shame they're continuing to allow this to go on though. It would be nice to see them purge these lunatics.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1413884214726971394/


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> Rob Schneider has finally been flagged on Twitter, it's a shame they're continuing to allow this to go on though. It would be nice to see them purge these lunatics.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1413884214726971394/



If people are taking health advice from a guy whose career peaked when he said “You can do it” in Adam Sandler movies...


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> If people are taking health advice from a guy whose career peaked when he said “You can do it” in Adam Sandler movies...



Same people who get their advice from Chachi or Ted Nugent I suspect.


----------



## mac_in_tosh

Eric said:


> Maybe below is better way to phrase this, from the CDC. We've know it's an effective delivery system for decades.
> 
> https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.htmlhttps://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html



And yet the very first sentence in the referenced article from the CDC is:

mRNA vaccines are a new type of vaccine to protect against infectious diseases.


----------



## SuperMatt

mac_in_tosh said:


> And yet the very first sentence in the referenced article from the CDC is:
> 
> mRNA vaccines are a new type of vaccine to protect against infectious diseases.



Maybe that is part of the challenge. People seldom read beyond the first sentence, or the first sentence scares them so they don’t read further (or is it farther?). But I also think people associate “new” with bad, especially when it comes to tech (new Windows or Mac OS for example) - oh noez it broked! But a “new” vaccine isn’t new in that sense - it’s been in development for decades.

Let’s look at this from the opposite perspective: People are perfectly happy taking vaccines invented many decades ago, despite the fact that we know far more about medicine now than we did then.

At this point, the facts speak for themselves. Over 100 million people vaccinated... they are not dying in the streets. And over 99% of people dying of COVID now are un-vaccinated. That should be all people need to know. But we know it’s not that simple. I pray that people can accept the vaccine despite the lies from the right, and maybe those liars now changing their tunes might help... to some extent.


----------



## Eric

mac_in_tosh said:


> And yet the very first sentence in the referenced article from the CDC is:
> 
> mRNA vaccines are a new type of vaccine to protect against infectious diseases.



Whose been in the making for decades. Additionally, there have been 3.85 billion (yes that's a b) given to date, so if the angle is "gee, we just don't know enough about it yet" that would be pretty naive.



			Bloomberg - Are you a robot?


----------



## Deleted member 199

Eric said:


> Whose been in the making for decades. Additionally, there have been 3.85 billion (yes that's a b) given to date, so if the angle is "gee, we just don't know enough about it yet" that would be pretty naive.
> 
> 
> 
> Bloomberg - Are you a robot?



I'm not trying to suggest that mRNA vaccines aren't safe, but 1.5B of those 3.85B shots, are in mainland China... which is *not* using mRNA vaccines.

A good chunk of the developing world is also using vaccines from China or Russia (also not mRNA) and another (not necessarily distinct) chunk is using AstraZeneca - *also* not mRNA.

Have a lot of mRNA vaccines been given? Yep.
Would I personally take one? Yep - I've even paid to get one.
Does that mean everyone is getting mRNA vaccines? Nope.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> I'm not trying to suggest that mRNA vaccines aren't safe, but 1.5B of those 3.85B shots, are in mainland China... which is *not* using mRNA vaccines.
> 
> A good chunk of the developing world is also using vaccines from China or Russia (also not mRNA) and another (not necessarily distinct) chunk is using AstraZeneca - *also* not mRNA.
> 
> Have a lot of mRNA vaccines been given? Yep.
> Would I personally take one? Yep - I've even paid to get one.
> Does that mean everyone is getting mRNA vaccines? Nope.



So what‘s the critique?


----------



## Eric

Huntn said:


> So what‘s the critique?



It seems to me the crux of their argument from some is that it's too new, therefore sowing distrust. This is a dangerous ideology that can push those on the fence in the wrong direction while hospitals are filling up again and it's something we'll absolutely not allow here at TA in any way. So to those wanting to question it, let's be careful here.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> So what‘s the critique?



I'm simply saying that quoting *total* COVID vaccination numbers when referring specifically to mRNA vaccinations is, wrong.


I don't agree with the claims that mRNA is unsafe, I'm just saying it's wrong to say 3.85B people have received mRNA shot(s).


----------



## SuperMatt

The “COVID Stupid” thread seems to be the best place for a story on Marjorie Taylor-Greene talking about COVID.









						Marjorie Taylor Greene now calling vax requirements "segregation" | Boing Boing
					

Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (Q-GA) has moved on from comparing Covid protection requirements to the Holocaust. Now she is comparing it to segregation. In a Sunday night tweet, the conspiracy enthus…




					boingboing.net
				




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1419489724985643008/


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> The “COVID Stupid” thread seems to be the best place for a story on Marjorie Taylor-Greene talking about COVID.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Marjorie Taylor Greene now calling vax requirements "segregation" | Boing Boing
> 
> 
> Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (Q-GA) has moved on from comparing Covid protection requirements to the Holocaust. Now she is comparing it to segregation. In a Sunday night tweet, the conspiracy enthus…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> boingboing.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1419489724985643008/



These guys love the free market, until they actually exercise their freedom.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> I'm simply saying that quoting *total* COVID vaccination numbers when referring specifically to mRNA vaccinations is, wrong.
> 
> 
> I don't agree with the claims that mRNA is unsafe, I'm just saying it's wrong to say 3.85B people have received mRNA shot(s).



I’m good with that. And my impression is that you support the idea of everyone being vaccinated?


----------



## Huntn

*Direct to you from Stupid Land*
Starring  Holier Than Thow Blessed Sara


…in a former life, cream of the <cough> crop  ​
*Circa 2019:*








						Sarah Sanders says 'God wanted Trump to be President'
					

'I think God calls all of us to fill different roles at different times and I think that He wanted Donald Trump to become president,' Sanders told the Christian Broadcasting Network on Wednesday.




					www.dailymail.co.uk
				




*Now in 2021:* From the Book of We’ve just _got to help the dumbstruck Trump  Koolaid drinkers on board with getting vaccinated:_

https://www.faithwire.com/2021/07/2...ders-encourages-people-to-take-trump-vaccine/

_Sarah Huckabee Sanders, a Republican gubernatorial candidate in Arkansas, revealed Sunday she received a “Trump vaccine” months ago.

Sanders, who served as former President Donald Trump’s press secretary from 2017 to 2019, lauded her erstwhile boss for his work to make vaccinations widely available at breakneck speeds in an editorial published in the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette.

In the piece, the 38-year-old politician condemned the “misinformation thrown at me by politicians and the media,” all of which made it more difficult, she said, to make a decision on whether to get vaccinated._


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> I’m good with that. And my impression is that you support the idea of everyone being vaccinated?



Sure so long as it’s effective and not a significant risk/massive unknown.


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> … scares them so they don’t read further (or is it farther?)



<pedantry>
From your local grammar nawtzee:
"Farther" means more distance (some ways yonder).
"Further" means more time (some while later).
In this case, either one works (words mark out distance over their lines, but it takes time to read through them).
</pedantry>


----------



## Deleted member 199

Yoused said:


> <pedantry>
> From your local grammar nawtzee:
> "Farther" means more distance (some ways yonder).
> "Further" means more time (some while later).
> In this case, either one works (words mark out distance over their lines, but it takes time to read through them).
> </pedantry>




Neither Oxford nor Merriam Webster agree quite with that.

either are applicable for distance, with farther more common in American English and further more common in real English.

further is applicable to the extent or degree of something and can also mean “more” or “additional”.


----------



## Renzatic

Eric said:


> These guys love the free market, until they actually exercise their freedom.




It's all about freedom for me, at the expense of thee if need be.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> Sure so long as it’s effective and not a significant risk/massive unknown.



As usual, we rely on medical experts for this info and based on the technology and the results as far as we ever know, we are good to go. If you look at the established history of vaccines, it’s  an absolute slam dunk.

And as I said before this is a team player situation. Sure if someone doesn’t  want to get vaccinated, then please remove themselves from the herd.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> As usual



As usual you’re looking at it from your perspective.

Not every vaccine offered is equivalent, and the data available for each is not equal.

Just a reminder: Americans are only about 5% of the earths population.


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> As usual you’re looking at it from your perspective.
> 
> Not every vaccine offered is equivalent, and the data available for each is not equal.
> 
> Just a reminder: Americans are only about 5% of the earths population.



I’m looking at it through the sources I have available to evaluate any information. I don’t know if I can say Pfizer is the best, but at this point with 3 of us vaccinated with it, I have high confidence based mostly on news and govt reporting. What else is there? (The conspiracy theory grapevine, no thanks. )


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> I’m looking at it through the sources I have available to evaluate any information. I don’t know if I can say Pfizer is the best, but at this point with 3 of us vaccinated with it, I have high confidence based mostly on news and govt reporting. What else is there? (The conspiracy theory grapevine, no thanks. )



So as I said, from your point of view.

If you don’t want to educate yourself about what the situation is like for the other 95% of humanity that’s your choice but don’t expect people to just go along with your little fantasy that getting vaccinated or not is a choice right now.


----------



## Yoused

Stephen.R said:


> ... don’t expect people to just go along with your little fantasy that getting vaccinated or not is a choice …




You know very well that Americans are clearly the most important people in the world. Universe. Those other folks, their sole purpose is to make the lives of Americans better. I mean, look how many Iraqis died in the cause of entertainment. If they cannot get the vaccine, you know, oh well. They _chose_ to not live in the good old US and speak God's proper English.


----------



## fooferdoggie

thank you trump.
Got your COVID vaccine? Stay out, says California restaurateur decrying ‘stupidity’​








						Got your COVID vaccine? Stay out, says California restaurateur decrying ‘stupidity’
					

“We have zero tolerance for treasonous, anti-American stupidity.”




					amp.sacbee.com


----------



## Huntn

Stephen.R said:


> So as I said, from your point of view.
> 
> *If you don’t want to educate yourself *about what the situation is like for the other 95% of humanity that’s your choice but don’t expect people to just go along with your little fantasy that getting vaccinated or not is a choice right now.



What  is going on here? You are making assumptions. What fantasies do I have? What did I say to make you feel justified to make these claims?

You are making sound like it’s a sin to express one’s perspective. And btw that does not preclude accepting other people’s perspectives or understanding the world. You really sound like your number one goal here  is to have a fight and I don’t feel the need to oblige you.


----------



## Deleted member 199

Huntn said:


> What  is going on here? You are making assumptions. What fantasies do I have? What did I say to make you feel justified to make these claims?
> 
> You are making sound like it’s a sin to express one’s perspective. And btw that does not preclude accepting other people’s perspectives or understanding the world. You really sound like your number one goal here  is to have a fight and I don’t feel the need to oblige you.



No, not at all. I welcome other view points.


What I don't welcome is someone making blanket statements about "we know vaccines are effective, we're good to go", ignoring that the COVID19 vaccines available to the *vast, vast* majority of humanity are *no where near* as effective, nor as well studied, as those that a few shit head Americans are shitting in their own beds about.


What I don't welcome is someone making claims to suggest that anyone who isn't vaccinated at this point, is in that situation by choice, and they should instead choose to "leave the heard".


You want to talk about fucking assumptions, try reading your own posts through the eyes of anyone outside the US, UK or EU.



Huntn said:


> I’m looking at it through the sources I have available to evaluate any information




You're literally using the most expansive technology in the history of mankind for information sharing, and you want to talk about "the sources I have available".

I'm not looking for a fight, I was hoping that somewhere along the way you'd realise the world outside America exists, and it's not all sunshine and lollipops. 

Americans, and to a lesser extent brits and europeans, have a choice of multiple, high efficacy vaccines, with a broad body of trial data, overseen by organisations you can trust. I've repeatedly said that someone *in that environment* who continues to refuse a vaccine is a fucking idiot.


But you're somehow not able to see or acknowledge the reality affecting much of the rest of the world: A lot of the rest of us are stuck between a really shitty vaccine that was being administered before any trials had even *started*, with the bonus that we have zero *actual clue* now about the side effects due to the source of said vaccine, and that's *on top of* incompetent and corrupt government responses in general to the pandemic.

Oh sorry, technically I guess I do have an 'option' for a more trustworthy/effective vaccine with less risks: at this stage I could be waiting as long as NEXT MARCH before I'm able to get my *first* shot of Moderna.


Am I looking for a fight? No, not at all. I'm looking for just the slightest little acknowledgement for fucking once that the world does not in fact revolve around America. Ignorance of the outside world is not an excuse to make blanket statements about people's intent.


I'm done with this thread. You can discuss how doctors should be punishing stupid people on your own.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Unvaccinated SoCal resident still not convinced about vaccine safety, nearly dies from COVID-19​At Providence Saint Joseph in Orange, one unvaccinated COVID patient says he's still not convinced that the vaccines are safe.









						Unvaccinated SoCal resident still not convinced about vaccine safety, nearly dies from COVID-19
					

At Providence Saint Joseph Hospital in Orange, at least one unvaccinated COVID patient says he's still not convinced that the vaccines are safe.




					abc7.com


----------



## Yoused

Arkansas seems to be having a public health *Emergency*, but not enough of one to convince the governor to put out a mask mandate.


----------



## Clix Pix

fooferdoggie said:


> Unvaccinated SoCal resident still not convinced about vaccine safety, nearly dies from COVID-19​At Providence Saint Joseph in Orange, one unvaccinated COVID patient says he's still not convinced that the vaccines are safe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unvaccinated SoCal resident still not convinced about vaccine safety, nearly dies from COVID-19
> 
> 
> At Providence Saint Joseph Hospital in Orange, at least one unvaccinated COVID patient says he's still not convinced that the vaccines are safe.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> abc7.com




Well, fine......let him die of it, then, and his family can mourn and whine about the whole situation.


----------



## Eric

Wait what?


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1420964918933614595/

Amen


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1420849819996786696/

I realize these hypocrites probably got the vaccine before any of us, but if they didn't & go sick...

You better believe I will "thoughts & prayers" these MFers like they do everyone else that has ever suffered & they don't give a shit about.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1420879600708726789/


----------



## Yoused

I thought a karen was just a stack of rocks.


----------



## Roller

I hear many people complain that guidance about COVID-19 changes often and is frequently contradictory. That's true, but it reflects the data on which the CDC and other public health authorities base their recommendations. In essence, there are two buckets:

• Historical data
• Predictions based on modeling

Both are subject to inaccuracy for a large number of reasons — it's inevitable. As well, a given dataset may be interpreted in several ways, so we sometimes end up with profound disagreements between knowledgable experts. With that said, here are a few key points about delta:

Transmissibility appears to be significantly greater than the wild type virus and its other variants. How much higher is still being measured and debated.
At least some of this is due to larger amounts of virus in the nasopharynx, which means people shed more when they exhale, sneeze, or cough.
Delta may cause more severe infection, but the degree is unclear.
Vaccinated individuals who contract delta may transmit the virus even if they're asymptomatic or minimally symptomatic. Again, the magnitude is uncertain, but if this holds up, it's a valid reason to recommend universal masking.
The mRNA vaccines seem to protect against severe illness / hospitalization, but again, how much is unknown. Many of the vaccinated people who contract delta COVID-19 have underlying conditions.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> I hear many people complain that guidance about COVID-19 changes often and is frequently contradictory. That's true, but it reflects the data on which the CDC and other public health authorities base their recommendations. In essence, there are two buckets:
> 
> • Historical data
> • Predictions based on modeling
> 
> Both are subject to inaccuracy for a large number of reasons — it's inevitable. As well, a given dataset may be interpreted in several ways, so we sometimes end up with profound disagreements between knowledgable experts. With that said, here are a few key points about delta:
> 
> Transmissibility appears to be significantly greater than the wild type virus and its other variants. How much higher is still being measured and debated.
> At least some of this is due to larger amounts of virus in the nasopharynx, which means people shed more when they exhale, sneeze, or cough.
> Delta may cause more severe infection, but the degree is unclear.
> Vaccinated individuals who contract delta may transmit the virus even if they're asymptomatic or minimally symptomatic. Again, the magnitude is uncertain, but if this holds up, it's a valid reason to recommend universal masking.
> The mRNA vaccines seem to protect against severe illness / hospitalization, but again, how much is unknown. Many of the vaccinated people who contract delta COVID-19 have underlying conditions.



They just reinstated universal masking in my hospital's non-patient care areas*. Our mask "holiday" lasted about 3 weeks

 *meaning we didn't require a mask in areas away from visitors, like in offices. Of course vaccination is mandatory institution-wise, because we can't afford to tolerate stupid.


----------



## Huntn

Deleted member 199 said:


> No, not at all. I welcome other view points.
> 
> 
> What I don't welcome is someone making blanket statements about "we know vaccines are effective, we're good to go", ignoring that the COVID19 vaccines available to the *vast, vast* majority of humanity are *no where near* as effective, nor as well studied, as those that a few shit head Americans are shitting in their own beds about.
> 
> 
> What I don't welcome is someone making claims to suggest that anyone who isn't vaccinated at this point, is in that situation by choice, and they should instead choose to "leave the heard".
> 
> 
> You want to talk about fucking assumptions, try reading your own posts through the eyes of anyone outside the US, UK or EU.
> 
> 
> 
> You're literally using the most expansive technology in the history of mankind for information sharing, and you want to talk about "the sources I have available".
> 
> I'm not looking for a fight, I was hoping that somewhere along the way you'd realise the world outside America exists, and it's not all sunshine and lollipops.
> 
> Americans, and to a lesser extent brits and europeans, have a choice of multiple, high efficacy vaccines, with a broad body of trial data, overseen by organisations you can trust. I've repeatedly said that someone *in that environment* who continues to refuse a vaccine is a fucking idiot.
> 
> 
> But you're somehow not able to see or acknowledge the reality affecting much of the rest of the world: A lot of the rest of us are stuck between a really shitty vaccine that was being administered before any trials had even *started*, with the bonus that we have zero *actual clue* now about the side effects due to the source of said vaccine, and that's *on top of* incompetent and corrupt government responses in general to the pandemic.
> 
> Oh sorry, technically I guess I do have an 'option' for a more trustworthy/effective vaccine with less risks: at this stage I could be waiting as long as NEXT MARCH before I'm able to get my *first* shot of Moderna.
> 
> 
> Am I looking for a fight? No, not at all. I'm looking for just the slightest little acknowledgement for fucking once that the world does not in fact revolve around America. Ignorance of the outside world is not an excuse to make blanket statements about people's intent.
> 
> 
> I'm done with this thread. You can discuss how doctors should be punishing stupid people on your own.




_I'm not looking for a fight, I was hoping that somewhere along the way you'd realise the world outside America exists, and it's not all sunshine and lollipops. _

Lol, more assumptions and BS, your made up bullshit, not going to entertain you with engagement. Get back to me when you want a sincere discussion.


----------



## Pumbaa

Huntn said:


> _I'm not looking for a fight, I was hoping that somewhere along the way you'd realise the world outside America exists, and it's not all sunshine and lollipops. _
> 
> Lol, more assumptions and BS, your made up bullshit, not going to entertain you with engagement. Get back to me when you want a sincere discussion.



Somehow I don’t think Deleted Member 199 will get back to you. Call it a hunch.


----------



## Hrafn

Pumbaa said:


> Somehow I don’t think Deleted Member 199 will get back to you. Call it a hunch.



I'm gonna hold my breath until he does, though.  Anyone else with me?


----------



## Huntn

Hrafn said:


> I'm gonna hold my breath until he does, though.  Anyone else with me?



Word has it he bailed. I was thinking a better title than “guest” would be appropriate.


----------



## Pumbaa

Huntn said:


> Word has it he bailed. I was thinking a better title than “guest” would be appropriate.



A guest is invited and then leaves after a while. Sounds spot on to me.


----------



## Hrafn

Huntn said:


> Word has it he bailed. I was thinking a better title than “guest” would be appropriate.



Oh dear.  Yes, the implosion was this morning, knowing that, my reply seems oddly funny.  Otherwise, not so much.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Texas is stupid 


			https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/07/29/texas-gov-abbott-issues-executive-order-prohibiting-cities-requiring-masks-vaccines/
		


Facebook is a dumpster fire worse than Fox News








						Facebook News Consumers Are More Anti-Vaccine Than Fox News Viewers, Study Finds
					

Researchers found that vaccine resistance among people who get their info from Facebook was second only to Newsmax viewers.




					gizmodo.com


----------



## Huntn

Runs For Fun said:


> Texas is stupid
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/07/29/texas-gov-abbott-issues-executive-order-prohibiting-cities-requiring-masks-vaccines/
> 
> 
> 
> Facebook is a dumpster fire worse than Fox News
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Facebook News Consumers Are More Anti-Vaccine Than Fox News Viewers, Study Finds
> 
> 
> Researchers found that vaccine resistance among people who get their info from Facebook was second only to Newsmax viewers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com



…right up to State elected officials of who have the stupid quotient needed for approval from the Koolaid drinkers.


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> Texas is stupid
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/07/29/texas-gov-abbott-issues-executive-order-prohibiting-cities-requiring-masks-vaccines/



I thought they thought that locals know their local needs better?! Can someone resolve this question in a way that is different than: local government is sacred, until it's run by Democrats, then it isn't. It's also well-described that local governments' hands-on approach works better for pubic health efforts.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Like a finger on the _beating for now_ pulse of parts of our society


----------



## Eric

Runs For Fun said:


> Texas is stupid
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/07/29/texas-gov-abbott-issues-executive-order-prohibiting-cities-requiring-masks-vaccines/
> 
> 
> 
> Facebook is a dumpster fire worse than Fox News
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Facebook News Consumers Are More Anti-Vaccine Than Fox News Viewers, Study Finds
> 
> 
> Researchers found that vaccine resistance among people who get their info from Facebook was second only to Newsmax viewers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com



I wonder if that translates to business not being able to mandate it, right now there's a groundswell of them requiring masks at the local level. I couldn't imaging being an owner and being told I couldn't mandate them in my own store.


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> Texas is stupid
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/07/29/texas-gov-abbott-issues-executive-order-prohibiting-cities-requiring-masks-vaccines/
> 
> 
> 
> Facebook is a dumpster fire worse than Fox News
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Facebook News Consumers Are More Anti-Vaccine Than Fox News Viewers, Study Finds
> 
> 
> Researchers found that vaccine resistance among people who get their info from Facebook was second only to Newsmax viewers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com



This doesn’t surprise me in the slightest. And yet the mouth-breathers in the GOP still complain they are being censored by FB? They are completely unhinged from reality.


----------



## Huntn

P_X said:


> I thought they thought that locals know their local needs better?! Can someone resolve this question in a way that is different than: local government is sacred, until it's run by Democrats, then it isn't. It's also well-described that local governments' hands-on approach works better for pubic health efforts.



Republicans are two faced hypocrites always seeking what they think benefits their hold on power and pleasing their stupid, selfish, _have difficulty handling the truth_ base. Not helping, the norm for a lot of this base is being Trump/Faux News Koolaid drinkers who thrive on self serving fantasies.


----------



## Roller

During much of 2020, we had few tools to treat COVID-19. The sickest patients went on ventilatory support and either lived or died. Over time, we learned the value of dexamethasone and other therapeutic intervention, but we had no proven measures to prevent infection other than physically limiting transmission. In retrospect, some of them, such as repeatedly wiping down surfaces at home and cleaning groceries before putting them away, were probably excessive. We knew vaccines were under development, but their timeline and efficacy were unknown.

What galls most HCWs now is that we have vaccines that can save lives, reduce community spread, and limit viral replication and mutation. They're widely available at no cost throughout the United States, but in some places a large percentage of the population refuses them because they've been fed lies by people who care only about their own profit and / or political power.  That doesn't mean there aren't people with legitimate hesitancy that can be overcome — I've convinced a few people to get vaccinated by listening to addressing their concerns. I also think governments should require paid time off for those who suffer post-vaccination side effects like fever.

I've long thought that case numbers aren't as effective as hospitalization statistics to convince folks that the current crisis is real. That's already happening in some hard-hit areas as hospitals limit elective procedures and visits because of reduced capacity. But we shouldn't have to do that.

I was heartened to read that businesses are taking action regarding masking (which is essential to protect others) and vaccination. I also think healthcare facilities should require universal masking, as well as vaccination.


----------



## SuperMatt

Article from NYT discusses people “on the fence” vs those adamant against getting vaccinated. (Paywall removed)









						Who Are the Unvaccinated in America? There’s No One Answer.
					

One segment of people who have avoided shots is vehemently opposed to the idea. But there is a second group, surveys suggest, that is still deciding.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1420580337965486084/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1420762490296705033/


----------



## JayMysteri0

WTF?!
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1421894387664044035/


----------



## Herdfan

It's not just people in the USA that are rebelling against more stringent measures:









						Berlin protesters decry coronavirus measures; 600 detained
					

BERLIN (AP) — Thousands turned out in Berlin on Sunday to protest the German government’s anti-coronavirus measures despite a ban on the gatherings, leading to clashes with police and the detention of some 600 protesters.




					apnews.com


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> It's not just people in the USA that are rebelling against more stringent measures:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Berlin protesters decry coronavirus measures; 600 detained
> 
> 
> BERLIN (AP) — Thousands turned out in Berlin on Sunday to protest the German government’s anti-coronavirus measures despite a ban on the gatherings, leading to clashes with police and the detention of some 600 protesters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apnews.com



We are our own worst enemy. When humans cease to exist it's entirely possible it will be from something we could've completely prevented.


----------



## Yoused

Saw this posted on the Moronville thing. Note how the big headline says the opposite of the callout quote below it (outdoors vs indoors). Faux always tryna put a "D" after misbehaving Republicans, and the shit like that.


----------



## Yoused

Michael "fuckwit" Flynn's brother Joseph got yelled at by twitter for perpetuating the bullshit about using ivermectin for preventing/treating COVID-19 infections.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1421829783374254082/


----------



## SuperMatt

Yoused said:


> Saw this posted on the Moronville thing. Note how the big headline says the opposite of the callout quote below it (outdoors vs indoors). Faux always tryna put a "D" after misbehaving Republicans, and the shit like that.
> 
> View attachment 7648



Wow. They literally lie in the headline and don’t even try to hide the contradiction in the quote below.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> It's not just people in the USA that are rebelling against more stringent measures:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Berlin protesters decry coronavirus measures; 600 detained
> 
> 
> BERLIN (AP) — Thousands turned out in Berlin on Sunday to protest the German government’s anti-coronavirus measures despite a ban on the gatherings, leading to clashes with police and the detention of some 600 protesters.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apnews.com



Some people are in denial, they just want things to go back to normal despite the solution being right under there noses.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Holy cow! A tale of herd immunity and COVID-19​When *Sen. Gary Stubblefield*, the Republican dairy farmer, touted a cattle dewormer as a guard against COVID-19, it raised some eyebrows. Then it was raised again at the crazy Siloam Springs town hall Friday along with another dubious “therapeutic” treatment for COVID-19 in what seemed to be an anti-vaccination argument.









						Holy cow! A tale of herd immunity and COVID-19
					

Only in Darkansas. Farm store warns customers off vet aisle for COVID-19.




					arktimes.com


----------



## Alli

I now find myself getting angry that despite getting vaccinated I now have to continue masking to protect the unvaccinated. Bullshit. They can and should protect themselves.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Alli said:


> I now find myself getting angry that despite getting vaccinated I now have to continue masking to protect the unvaccinated. Bullshit. They can and should protect themselves.



So much this!


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> I now find myself getting angry that despite getting vaccinated I now have to continue masking to protect the unvaccinated. Bullshit. They can and should protect themselves.




Exactly.  And I think everyone knows how much I hate masks.


----------



## Renzatic

I'd almost agree, but you also have to consider the people who can't get vaccinated, though with the anti-maskers also being anti-vaxers, I doubt it'll make much of a difference for them whether we wear our masks or not.


----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> Michael "fuckwit" Flynn's brother Joseph got yelled at by twitter for perpetuating the bullshit about using ivermectin for preventing/treating COVID-19 infections.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1421829783374254082/



My FIL pointed out a FB group covering ivermectin, and I got into an argument with the source, who called himself "Dr" and gave medical advice to people but turned out to be a PhD biologist without any clinical research under his belt. There are now """real-time""" meta-analyses on HCQ and Ivermectin online and it just blows my mind how shitty they are. Ivermectin _may_ have some severity reducing effect, however, the current data is skewed by a few very low quality studies whereas the better few showed no significant benefit. Most of the ivermectin studies used HCQ as standard of care and one of these showed advantage in a group where ivermectin was used instead of HCQ...It really pissed them off when I pointed out that I could also conclude that maybe the difference is due to not using HCQ and not ivermectin, LOL. The effect size is at best 2 orders of magnitude lower than that of the vaccine.

I honestly like the idea of drug repurposing but when politicians are trying to skew evidence and perpetuate disinformation and people want to draw conclusions based on shitty trials, or they try to use it as an excuse not to get vaccinated, I sharply draw the line.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Renzatic said:


> I'd almost agree, but you also have to consider the people who can't get vaccinated, though with the anti-maskers also being anti-vaxers, I doubt it'll make much of a difference for them whether we wear our masks or not.



We do.

We all agree & have said so many times in the past that we consider those who can't wear masks or get the vaccinations.  We also agree that they are NOT the subject of anyone's anger or frustration.

The only time it matters to the group that we are considering care about whether or not you wear a mask or get a vaccine, is in a hoped for "AHA" gotcha moment to justify their NOT getting the vaccine or wearing a mask.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> Holy cow! A tale of herd immunity and COVID-19​When *Sen. Gary Stubblefield*, the Republican dairy farmer, touted a cattle dewormer as a guard against COVID-19, it raised some eyebrows. Then it was raised again at the crazy Siloam Springs town hall Friday along with another dubious “therapeutic” treatment for COVID-19 in what seemed to be an anti-vaccination argument.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Holy cow! A tale of herd immunity and COVID-19
> 
> 
> Only in Darkansas. Farm store warns customers off vet aisle for COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> arktimes.com



I’m rooting for some Darwin Awards.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Indoor mask mandate back in effect in my area starting tonight. Luckily we don’t have a lot of knuckle draggers in the Bay Area so it should be no big deal.  From what I’ve seen many people never stopped wearing masks indoors.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422230220640243715/

And then this had to happen...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422283447347859460/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422305117949337605/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422304965343670296/

Masks people.  I know some didn't like 'em before, but a portion of the country has decided feeling take precedence over all else.

So masks are going to make a come back, after we just put them away.


----------



## Eric

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Indoor mask mandate back in effect in my area starting tonight. Luckily we don’t have a lot of knuckle draggers in the Bay Area so it should be no big deal.  From what I’ve seen many people never stopped wearing masks indoors.



Every time I come down there from the central valley where many refuse to wear them it's like day and night, they are so good about it in the bay area that I even see them wearing one in their cars when driving alone. I'm the most paranoid person around this thing and even I'm like damn dude, take a breather in your own car lol. Anyway, I always feel really safe down there.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> Every time I come down there from the central valley where many refuse to wear them it's like day and night, they are so good about it in the bay area that I even see them wearing one in their cars when driving alone. I'm the most paranoid person around this thing and even I'm like damn dude, take a breather in your own car lol. Anyway, I always feel really safe down there.




Honestly I almost feel like the mandate is a relief so I no longer have to wonder "ok, what are people doing here." whenever I went into a place.  Even just putting a mask on to be on the safe side and when I went in I was the only one wearing a mask.  This was more common in small stores.  It will be nice for things to be consistent again.


----------



## Alli

Renzatic said:


> I'd almost agree, but you also have to consider the people who can't get vaccinated, though with the anti-maskers also being anti-vaxers, I doubt it'll make much of a difference for them whether we wear our masks or not.



See below. Jay gave my response for me.


JayMysteri0 said:


> We do.
> 
> We all agree & have said so many times in the past that we consider those who can't wear masks or get the vaccinations.  We also agree that they are NOT the subject of anyone's anger or frustration.
> 
> The only time it matters to the group that we are considering care about whether or not you wear a mask or get a vaccine, is in a hoped for "AHA" gotcha moment to justify their NOT getting the vaccine or wearing a mask.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I don't know if I'll get in trouble for this but I've had it with the anti-vaxxers at my work.  Up to this point I've mostly remained silent and respected their decision, but starting today our area reinstituted the indoor mask mandate.   One of our anti-vaxxer employees walks in this morning and snarkily says "Guess we have to wear these again" with the other anti-vaxxer saying "And I wonder how long this time?"  I somewhat snapped and said "Until everybody gets vaccinated.  Just go get vaccinated."

The first anti-vaxxer thinks it's all about freedom.  He also said it's all the vaccinated people who are still getting the virus.  BULLSHIT.  The second anti-vaxxer is a nice guy but really simple, easily roped into conspiracies.  He thinks we just don't know enough about the vaccines.  Honestly, I can't debate him because I would probably be overbearing and unable to win him over as a result.  

I just cut things off with both of them by saying I don't have time for this and said "no more conspiracy theories" and ended it there.  My main point is if you aren't going to get vaccinated then don't you fucking dare complain about mandates to help reduce transmission or wondering how long until we return to somewhat normal.  You are the problem.  Keep your mouth shut.


----------



## Huntn

YES, WE HAVE A STUPID  PROBLEM.

May:
Marjorie Taylor Greene compares House mask mandates to the Holocaust​








						Marjorie Taylor Greene compares House mask mandates to the Holocaust
					

Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene, during an interview on a conservative podcast this week, compared House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's decision to continue to require members of the House to wear masks on the chamber floor to steps the Nazis took to control the Jewish population during the...




					www.cnn.com
				





The face of stupid 1 who thinks they are clever
and would like to shoot someone​
August:
Oklahoma GOP leader was rebuked for doubling down on his comparison of vaccine mandates to gold stars worn by Jewish people during the Holocaust​


			Oklahoma GOP leader was rebuked for doubling down on his comparison of vaccine mandates to gold stars worn by Jewish people during the Holocaust
		



The face of stupid 2 who makes idiotic comparisons
and probably would like to shoot someone too.​Bennett’s Facebook post: _"Those who don't KNOW history, are DOOMED to repeat it," the photo read, which was posted to the official Facebook account of the Oklahoma Republican Party on Friday.
The post called on Oklahoma Lt. Gov. Matt Pinnell to call a special session to prohibit private employers from imposing vaccine mandates for employees._

Of note Conniving Texas Gov Abbott has already mandated no mask mandates via Executive Order although I have no idea if that can be enforced if businesses require masks for entry.









						Texas Gov. Abbott Exec Order: No Face Mask Mandates, Covid-19 Vaccine Requirements By Local Authorities
					

On Wednesday, the number of new confirmed COvid-19 coronavirus cases in Texas exceeded 10,000 for the first time since February 9.




					www.forbes.com
				




In this latest case, the Oklahoma Republican party chairman John Bennett was rebuked by other  Oklahoma Republican politicians.  The irony is they spoke of “Trump’s vaccine”, but note the HEAD STUPID spent  months denying there was a looming crisis, downplaying it,  blaming Democrats,  refused to wear a mask, pushed inconsistent messaging and badgered a reporter to remove his mask.









						Trump Dragged For Trying To Shame A Reporter Into Taking Off His Mask
					

Even after the reporter found another way to ask his question, the president was still annoyed.




					uproxx.com
				




It’s not that hard to be cognizant of the caliber of who the people elect in “conservative” areas of the US when they strut their STUPID and  are either unaware of how self revealing they are or just think their audience is even stupider and will swallow their Koolaid.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I don't know if I'll get in trouble for this but I've had it with the anti-vaxxers at my work.  Up to this point I've mostly remained silent and respected their decision, but starting today our area reinstituted the indoor mask mandate.   One of our anti-vaxxer employees walks in this morning and snarkily says "Guess we have to wear these again" with the other anti-vaxxer saying "And I wonder how long this time?"  I somewhat snapped and said "Until everybody gets vaccinated.  Just go get vaccinated."
> 
> The first anti-vaxxer thinks it's all about freedom.  He also said it's all the vaccinated people who are still getting the virus.  BULLSHIT.  The second anti-vaxxer is a nice guy but really simple, easily roped into conspiracies.  He thinks we just don't know enough about the vaccines.  Honestly, I can't debate him because I would probably be overbearing and unable to win him over as a result.
> 
> I just cut things off with both of them by saying I don't have time for this and said "no more conspiracy theories" and ended it there.  My main point is if you aren't going to get vaccinated then don't you fucking dare complain about mandates to help reduce transmission or wondering how long until we return to somewhat normal.  You are the problem.  Keep your mouth shut.



Hopefully you won’t get in trouble for supporting a mask mandate your company/local government mandated.

I’ve said this before several times, that although this virus is deadly enough  to kill millions and put hundreds of thousands in the hospital, it’s just not deadly enough to register with the dimwits which  makes me wish it was more deadly. Then maybe humanity might stand a chance of getting their heads out of their collective asses.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I can’t help but think of how this has seriously devalued human life. Last week the news was running a story of how a husband and father in his 30’s died from covid who wasn’t vaccinated and said he regretted that decision before he died. As much as I tried, I couldn’t feel sympathy or even see it as a tragedy. The kids will grow up without their father. Guess what, millions of people for generations, including myself, grew up without their father and it wasn’t over losing a game of bad odds Russian roulette with their health.

And I know these widows didn’t ask to step up to the plate and be a hero as a result of their loss, but these stories from strangers, no matter how many, most likely aren’t going to be changing any minds. What they should be doing is going on any media source that will take them and say “I’m a Republican. I voted for Trump twice, but it’s because of my side’s politicians and media that my husband is now dead. I also don’t trust politicians or the news. So why would we now trust them on something that is leading to our deaths? The vaccines were largely created under Trump. This is not a Democrat conspiracy.” These people seem to be pissed off about everything else so why is it so hard for them to spend some of that anger on leading to deaths? At best they just seem to feel stupid.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Well, it took a good strong team effort, ...but we did it!

The mask signs are back up in the front of ALL stores where I'm at.  Watched a group of irate guys got turned away at Sam's Club for not having masks, and I guess they weren't feeling the free handouts.  At least Sam's has learned from all of this, and had a group of people at the front in case anyone wanted to make a scene.  Still it was just last week we had a few weeks of NO signs in the front doors saying to wear masks, and now we are RIGHT BACK to where some people were bitching about...


----------



## MEJHarrison

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Honestly, I can't debate him because I would probably be overbearing and unable to win him over as a result.




I recently came across a YouTube video where they explained why you can't ague with stupid people.  Logic, reason and facts are completely useless tools in that situation.  There's almost nothing that can be said or done to change their minds.  Look at Flat-Earthers.  No amount of science, math, physics, logic, etc. can get through their heads.  Dumb people are going to believe what they want and there's pretty much nothing that can be done about it.

At least we have a vaccine now.  That means that we're no longer on equal footing.  We're in a situation now where the more intelligent people are getting vaccinated and are more or less safe and it's just the dummies that are getting hit hard.  That's a sad situation.  But if they can't be talked out of making bad decisions, they're just going to have to suffer bad consequences.  Perhaps this is natures way of clearing out the gene pool a little.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

MEJHarrison said:


> I recently came across a YouTube video where they explained why you can't ague with stupid people.  Logic, reason and facts are completely useless tools in that situation.  There's almost nothing that can be said or done to change their minds.  Look at Flat-Earthers.  No amount of science, math, physics, logic, etc. can get through their heads.  Dumb people are going to believe what they want and there's pretty much nothing that can be done about it.
> 
> At least we have a vaccine now.  That means that we're no longer on equal footing.  We're in a situation now where the more intelligent people are getting vaccinated and are more or less safe and it's just the dummies that are getting hit hard.  That's a sad situation.  But if they can't be talked out of making bad decisions, they're just going to have to suffer bad consequences.  Perhaps this is natures way of clearing out the gene pool a little.




In this case I think it more comes down to he is simple and unfortunately hitched his wagon to the wrong knowledge tree. Even if he tried to be more proactive with his research he’s most likely to just be met with more fringe information that backs up his hesitancy. I think they’ve tracked down all the misinformation to just a handful of bad actors but then that same information has been regurgitated up the chain by seemingly more reputable sources because they simply don’t give a fuck. To make things worse the courts have backed up their not giving a fuck reporting.

Word is Biden is pretty pissed off about how major news outlets are reporting outlying cases. Since network news is Hollywood agent they are proving they equally have their heads up their asses with their reactionary overcorrections. They took “Hm, maybe we shouldn’t have given Trump’s empty podium so much air time” and turned it into “Let’s give all Covid related news, no matter how insane or rare, equal exposure.”


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> In this case I think it more comes down to he is simple and unfortunately hitched his wagon to the wrong knowledge tree. Even if he tried to be more proactive with his research he’s most likely to just be met with more fringe information that backs up his hesitancy. I think they’ve tracked down all the misinformation to just a handful of bad actors but then that same information has been regurgitated up the chain by seemingly more reputable sources because they simply don’t give a fuck. To make things worse the courts have backed up their not giving a fuck reporting.
> 
> Word is Biden is pretty pissed off about how major news outlets are reporting outlying cases. Since network news is Hollywood agent they are proving they equally have their heads up their asses with their reactionary overcorrections. They took “Hm, maybe we shouldn’t have given Trump’s empty podium so much air time” and turned it into “Let’s give all Covid related news, no matter how insane or rare, equal exposure.”



I do fault the media for the way they’re treating this. The stories make it seem like vaccinated people are in danger! But then I listened to an interview with an expert physician. They did explain that 99% of people with the vaccine will not have a problem. The interviewer pressed her “doesn’t that mean *1.5 million *are in danger?!?!?” and her response was that even of those 1.5 million, almost none of them would have serious symptoms. It was obvious the interviewer was drooling at the idea that there might be a danger to vaccinated people so they would get a *sensational* story. So the dreaded “breakthrough infections” are of little consequence to the vaccinated, and are much more of a danger to the unvaccinated because it just means there is a larger pool of people they could be infected by.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> I do fault the media for the way they’re treating this. The stories make it seem like vaccinated people are in danger! But then I listened to an interview with an expert physician. They did explain that 99% of people with the vaccine will not have a problem. The interviewer pressed her “doesn’t that mean *1.5 million *are in danger?!?!?” and her response was that even of those 1.5 million, almost none of them would have serious symptoms. It was obvious the interviewer was drooling at the idea that there might be a danger to vaccinated people so they would get a *sensational* story. So the dreaded “breakthrough infections” are of little consequence to the vaccinated, and are much more of a danger to the unvaccinated because it just means there is a larger pool of people they could be infected by.




It’s very calculated clickbait. Instead of titling an article “%0.035 of vaccinated people still contract covid” they’ll roll with “vaccinated people still contracting covid”. The average anti-vaxxer isn’t going to bother to read the article. Then they’ll go spew their headline based knowledge like they did some deep research.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> I do fault the media for the way they’re treating this. The stories make it seem like vaccinated people are in danger!





Chew Toy McCoy said:


> It’s very calculated clickbait. Instead of titling an article “%0.035 of vaccinated people still contract covid” they’ll roll with “vaccinated people still contracting covid”. The average anti-vaxxer isn’t going to bother to read the article. Then they’ll go spew their headline based knowledge like they did some deep research.




It's panic porn and all about getting clicks and viewers.


----------



## SuperMatt

The unvaccinated don’t believe they are the problem: they blame immigrants.

These xenophobic hordes are the geniuses who got us Brexit, Trump, etc.



			https://www.ipsos.com/en-us/news-polls/axios-ipsos-coronavirus-index


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> It's panic porn and all about getting clicks and viewers.



I do get that there's hyperbole but there's a lot of denial about what is actually happening. Hospitals filling up in the south, Texas and Florida doing everything in their political power to ensure the spread, these things are real. Choosing to put fingers in one's ears does not change it.


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> I do get that there's hyperbole but there's a lot of denial about what is actually happening. Hospitals filling up in the south, Texas and Florida doing everything in their political power to ensure the spread, these things are real. Choosing to put fingers in one's ears does not change it.



The threat to the *unvaccinated* is very real. Posting clickbait about threat to the *vaccinated* is dangerous and further discourages the *unvaccinated* from getting a vaccine… (Why get the shot if vaccinated people are dying too?)


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> The threat to the *unvaccinated* is very real. Posting clickbait about threat to the *vaccinated* is dangerous and further discourages the *unvaccinated* from getting a vaccine… (Why get the shot if vaccinated people are dying too?)



They're also very clear that 99.9% of those vaccinated are not having issues, great incentivisation but most who aren't getting it won't get it either way. I think the biggest driver is the going to be businesses and the market who have had enough of their bullshit.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> The threat to the *unvaccinated* is very real. Posting clickbait about threat to the *vaccinated* is dangerous and further discourages the *unvaccinated* from getting a vaccine… (Why get the shot if vaccinated people are dying too?)




I've asked this before, and I don't know if opinions have changed, but which is worse...reports of outlying cases getting buried and then some people miss that information and get sick or die, or millions of people not getting vaccinated because outlying stories are given top front page coverage?  IMO "it's important to get the information out there" becomes a lot less important when it's creating a substantially bigger problem.

But it's also important to note that in some cases (Fox News et el), it's not about giving equal or balanced coverage.  It's about driving a divide, period.  So even if the CNN's of the world cleaned up their act on how to report responsibly based on probable outcome, it still wouldn't do anything about the bad actors.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> *They're also very clear that 99.9% of those vaccinated are not having issues*, great incentivisation but most who aren't getting it won't get it either way. I think the biggest driver is the going to be businesses and the market who have had enough of their bullshit.




Being very clear would be putting that in the headline.  They're not doing that in most cases.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I've asked this before, and I don't know if opinions have changed, but which is worse...reports of outlying cases getting buried and then some people miss that information and get sick or die, or millions of people not getting vaccinated because outlying stories are given top front page coverage?  IMO "it's important to get the information out there" becomes a lot less important when it's creating a substantially bigger problem.
> 
> But it's also important to note that in some cases (Fox News et el), it's not about giving equal or balanced coverage.  It's about driving a divide, period.  So even if the CNN's of the world cleaned up their act on how to report responsibly based on probable outcome, it still wouldn't do anything about the bad actors.



In response to your first paragraph, the latter is a much larger problem.

If there’s a story about a lettuce recall, chances are the lettuce is already being taken off the store shelves, and those stories almost always end up being quite localized. And people tend to overreact to those stories. BUT if people decide not to buy any lettuce for a few weeks… what‘s the problem? 

When the media sensationalizes a story about a one-in-a-million side effect from a vaccine, if that causes people not to get the vaccine, you’ve got a big problem.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I've asked this before, and I don't know if opinions have changed, but which is worse...reports of outlying cases getting buried and then some people miss that information and get sick or die, or millions of people not getting vaccinated because outlying stories are given top front page coverage?




Ideally people would get both sides of the story.  But too many people can't be bothered to read past a headline.

Years ago we brought someone in to give feedback on our website.  The one thing that stood out to me was that it was too wordy.  He said the average person didn't read more than 3 sentences.  If we've not conveyed the important information in the first or second sentence, the average person never saw it.  Keep in mind that's 3 sentences on a medical related site where we were serving up personalized health information.  The average is worse on less important sites.

I see it constantly MacRumors.  People reply to an article and start asking questions answered in the article.  Or drawing conclusions not supported by the article.  People only have time for headlines.  Worse yet, they feel reading the headlines give them enough knowledge to speak with authority on whatever the subject might be.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422524741827526659/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Simply put
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422944342025572356/


----------



## Renzatic

It's funny how antivaxers usually tend to be the same people who believe Bill Gates is attempting to commit mass genocide in the name of population control.

If I intended to kill a large percentage of people, the first thing I'd do...


----------



## Pumbaa

JayMysteri0 said:


> Simply put
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422944342025572356/



Survivorship bias is helluva drug.


----------



## JayMysteri0

The Governor of NJ demonstrating that patience is NOT infinite

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422970876262326280/


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Simply put
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422944342025572356/



And their life expectancy was like 20-25 years shorter
Some people are really dumb


----------



## thekev

Huntn said:


> *Direct to you from Stupid Land*
> Starring  Holier Than Thow Blessed Sara
> 
> View attachment 7472
> …in a former life, cream of the <cough> crop  ​
> *Circa 2019:*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sarah Sanders says 'God wanted Trump to be President'
> 
> 
> 'I think God calls all of us to fill different roles at different times and I think that He wanted Donald Trump to become president,' Sanders told the Christian Broadcasting Network on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.dailymail.co.uk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Now in 2021:* From the Book of We’ve just _got to help the dumbstruck Trump  Koolaid drinkers on board with getting vaccinated:_
> 
> https://www.faithwire.com/2021/07/2...ders-encourages-people-to-take-trump-vaccine/
> 
> _Sarah Huckabee Sanders, a Republican gubernatorial candidate in Arkansas, revealed Sunday she received a “Trump vaccine” months ago.
> 
> Sanders, who served as former President Donald Trump’s press secretary from 2017 to 2019, lauded her erstwhile boss for his work to make vaccinations widely available at breakneck speeds in an editorial published in the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette.
> 
> In the piece, the 38-year-old politician condemned the “misinformation thrown at me by politicians and the media,” all of which made it more difficult, she said, to make a decision on whether to get vaccinated._




You know, I actually don't mind this one. If she goes against Trump, she loses the support of his supporters, who don't care about here any more than I do. With this line, she might actually encourage a few people to get vaccinated.


----------



## Huntn

thekev said:


> You know, I actually don't mind this one. If she goes against Trump, she loses the support of his supporters, who don't care about here any more than I do. With this line, she might actually encourage a few people to get vaccinated.



I admit the stupid need all  the help they can get even if it is from a manipulative, back pedaler, attempting to cling to power with  a mostly corrupt message regarding politics in general.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wait.  What the BLOODY FUCK?!    

Does ARKANSAS imagine this is THEIR target audience for the vaccine resistant in their state?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423027044212830209/

Really?



> Arkansas governor blames 'myths' for 'hardened' vaccine resistance
> 
> 
> "I go into these town hall meetings, someone said: Don't call it a vaccine. Call it a bioweapon. And they talk about mind control," Gov. Asa Hutchinson said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.politico.com


----------



## Eric

SMH









						Texas GOP Official Mocked COVID Five Days Before He Died of Virus
					

H. Scott Apley’s Facebook page was filled with anti-mask, anti-vaccine content until he was suddenly hospitalized on Sunday.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## thekev

Eric said:


> SMH
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Texas GOP Official Mocked COVID Five Days Before He Died of Virus
> 
> 
> H. Scott Apley’s Facebook page was filled with anti-mask, anti-vaccine content until he was suddenly hospitalized on Sunday.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com




There are tons of these stories. Not all of them are guaranteed to die from it. A lot of these guys also don't understand statistics. When talking about the chance of contracting or dying from COVID in the US, this is referring to the total population. It does not condition on the risk of ignoring safety recommendations or living in a community with a high number of infections. I don't have those numbers myself, but it's possible that some of them greatly under-estimate their risk of infection or permanent health conditions (including death) coinciding with the infection.


----------



## Thomas Veil

And this morning Dr. Death, aka Ron DeSantis, remains defiant in defending every Floridian’s right to be a spreader, and no one’s right to be safe.









						Analysis: DeSantis turns his ire on Biden instead of Covid-19 as it rages in Florida
					

Florida's Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis has a message for President Joe Biden: He's not getting out of the way even as his rejection of masking and public health guidance risks fueling his state's raging Covid-19 cases.




					www.cnn.com
				




Is he, like, getting _paid_ by the coronavirus somehow? Maybe he’s getting a cut from the funeral industry. Heck, I’m waiting for him to announce a pro-Delta-variant superPAC.

People are dying around him due to his policies, and they’re talking about impeaching _Cuomo_ for getting too handsy. Not minimizing what Cuomo did, but that’s wildly inconsistent. DeSantis should be impeached and tried.


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> SMH
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Texas GOP Official Mocked COVID Five Days Before He Died of Virus
> 
> 
> H. Scott Apley’s Facebook page was filled with anti-mask, anti-vaccine content until he was suddenly hospitalized on Sunday.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com



Bye, Felicia…


----------



## Huntn

In the face of a deadly pandemic that has strangled the ability of our economies to function around the world for over a year, this  business of Republican led anti-mask mandates is freaking mind boggling, unbelievable, and in the US the failure, the kind of horrendous judgement based on  either denial, or seeking political advantage by manipulating stupid. So the question must be at least in the US do we have too much stupid to succeed?  

For those of you living in Europe is there any of this anti-mask hysteria happening where you live? I’ve not heard about it if it is happening.


----------



## Pumbaa

Huntn said:


> For those of you living in Europe is there any of this anti-mask hysteria happening where you live? I’ve not heard about it if it is happening.



Not so much in Sweden, but we have mostly been without mask requirements.

Like the Finns, we’re eagerly waiting for the pandemic to be over so that we can resume proper social distancing, rather than being recommended to stand as close to each other as 2 meters.

The Public Health Agency (supposedly professionals, not politicians) early on focused on the lack of evidence for benefits of general mask requirements in combination with the risk of people getting a false sense of being protected, thus disregarding social distancing mandates and other measures.

Tried to find some articles in english to link but oh man so much bullshit. Seems like everyone writing about it is framing it like a defense for their respective countries’ ways of handling things. It’s pretty much like asking Fox & Friends about the Biden administration.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Thomas Veil said:


> Texas GOP Official Mocked COVID Five Days Before He Died of Virus
> 
> 
> H. Scott Apley’s Facebook page was filled with anti-mask, anti-vaccine content until he was suddenly hospitalized on Sunday.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com




My time for caring about the stupid is over.  I'm done feeling bad for these people.  If his death causes a minimum of 2 others to change their mind about a vaccine, then Yay!  , he went out as a public servant.  If not, that's one less idiot using social media to spread lies to others.  Either way, I really don't give a damn.  If you're not going to get vaccinated, at least hurry up and catch this thing so the rest of us can move on.  You're holding back the entire world.

I'm not normally a cold, hard, calloused person, but I also have little patience for stupidity.  Especially when their stupidity effects those around them.  This behavior is beyond stupid.  Earn your Darwin Award already and let us be done with you.

FYI, I originally quoted the wrong story.  I fixed that, but it was posted by Eric, not Thomas.  I can't seem to fix that, so in case anyone notices that, that's what happened.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

This may be ignorant to think, but I feel like I really need to question the behavior of vaccinated people who are still getting covid. I was never 100% with the precautions before the vaccine came out, especially around people I know. I realize “knowing people” doesn’t equate to safety in this situation. But even if I wasn’t 100%, I was still keenly aware of the environment around me. I feel like vaccinated people who still get covid are completely throwing caution to the wind…rarely if ever wearing a mask, gathering in large numbers in cramped conditions, making close physical contact with people they know regardless of if those people have been vaccinated or not, etc.

So I think simply saying “vaccinated people are still getting covid” is painting an incomplete picture. But on the other hand, people who were vaccine hesitant but then decide to get it would most likely engage in this zero precautions lifestyle. So it probably wouldn’t matter what you tell them or they would go “So then what’s the point of getting vaccinated?”


----------



## JayMysteri0

Uh wha?



> Congress Is Slashing a $30 Billion Plan to Fight the Next Pandemic
> 
> 
> The proposal would overhaul America’s approach to tackling outbreaks, allowing scientists to develop vaccines in advance. But for now, Democrats are cutting it down.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theatlantic.com





> But it could happen. Biden proposed $30 billion to address the issue, which advocates say could permanently mitigate the risks of future outbreaks. The investment would replenish medical stockpiles, proactively develop vaccines for major types of viruses, and ensure that the United States has a permanent production base of face masks and respirators. In effect, it would amount to an Apollo program–like push to guarantee that a global pandemic could never shut down the country again.
> 
> Yet those funds have been slashed in the current negotiations over the $3.5 trillion reconciliation package as part of a push to slim it down, according to a source familiar with the situation. (I agreed not to name this person because they were not authorized to speak publicly about the negotiations.) While the exact amount is still in flux, it is significantly less than requested.
> 
> In the past week, public-health advocates and nonprofits have mobilized against the reduction, which Tom Frieden, a former CDC director who now runs the nonprofit Resolve to Save Lives, first revealed earlier this month. But as the White House and Democrats in Congress discuss the package’s details, they may be locking in an outdated approach to tackling pandemics, quietly and out of public view.
> 
> “Public health has been chronically underfunded. But prevention is always better than treatment, and the fact that, after an event as significant as COVID, we have to fight for this $30 billion defies belief,” Gabriel Bankman-Fried, the executive director of the nonprofit Guarding Against Pandemics, told me. (The White House and Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer did not respond to requests for comment.)




STOP WAFFLING!


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

MEJHarrison said:


> My time for caring about the stupid is over.  I'm done feeling bad for these people.  If his death causes a minimum of 2 others to change their mind about a vaccine, then Yay!  , he went out as a public servant.  If not, that's one less idiot using social media to spread lies to others.  Either way, I really don't give a damn.  If you're not going to get vaccinated, at least hurry up and catch this thing so the rest of us can move on.  You're holding back the entire world.
> 
> I'm not normally a cold, hard, calloused person, but I also have little patience for stupidity.  Especially when their stupidity effects those around them.  This behavior is beyond stupid.  Earn your Darwin Award already and let us be done with you.
> 
> FYI, I originally quoted the wrong story.  I fixed that, but it was posted by Eric, not Thomas.  I can't seem to fix that, so in case anyone notices that, that's what happened.




The behavior isn’t just stupid. It’s obstructing the goal they want to achieve. They should be punching themselves in the face for prolonging this thing.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

From a Salon article about people mistakenly thinking Fox has finally seen the light.

As I and reporters who cover right wing media for Media Matters and Vox pointed out at the time, Hannity's show that night was not only bookmarked by two other shows — Laura Ingraham's and Tucker Carlson's — that openly discouraged vaccination, but his supposedly "pro-vaccine" comments came in the middle of a segment that overall portrayed vaccines as dangerous and a threat to freedom. Even in the edited clip, Hannity instructed his viewers to "research like crazy," which is a common anti-vaxx rhetorical trick. As with creationists claiming they want to "teach the controversy," it's a way to seem reasonable while slyly directing people to engage conspiracy theories and suggesting those conspiracy theories are on equal footing, credibility-wise, as scientific fact. As Michael Hiltzik of the Los Angeles Times wrote, Hannity was basically "encouraging listeners to expose themselves to the wide variety of anti-vax conspiracy mongering accessible on social media via 'research.'"


----------



## lizkat

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> This may be ignorant to think, but I feel like I really need to question the behavior of vaccinated people who are still getting covid. I was never 100% with the precautions before the vaccine came out, especially around people I know. I realize “knowing people” doesn’t equate to safety in this situation. But even if I wasn’t 100%, I was still keenly aware of the environment around me. I feel like vaccinated people who still get covid are completely throwing caution to the wind…rarely if ever wearing a mask, gathering in large numbers in cramped conditions, making close physical contact with people they know regardless of if those people have been vaccinated or not, etc.
> 
> So I think simply saying “vaccinated people are still getting covid” is painting an incomplete picture. But on the other hand, people who were vaccine hesitant but then decide to get it would most likely engage in this zero precautions lifestyle. So it probably wouldn’t matter what you tell them or they would go “So then what’s the point of getting vaccinated?”




Re the last bit there, you're probably right.  It all has to do with how everything gets crunched down to a sound bite any more.   There's no room for nuance, which is unfortunate since very few things in life are as simple as a tweet or some congresscritter's scripted remark to a press gaggle.

Anyway in the case of the ongoing evolution of this coronavirus and the scientific research and guidelines related to that evolution, way too many people finally settle on "ok the vaccine, now i'm good" and that's the soundbite.  Or "people are still getting sick so forget it" and that's their soundbite. No one hears "however"  or "more recently..."   or "as experience has shown"...  and so forth. 

People have heard what they've decided sounds good to them and they went with it and it's history already and they're moving on. 

But so is the virus "moving on"  --because it naturally mutates and must find fortuitous adaptations as vaccines take hold.  Also moving along is research on the mutating virus, efficacy of vaccines, gathering and analysis of experiential data on health of post-vaccinated people in a milieu where so many still remain unvaccinated, etc. 

Still Americans at least tend to look for a quick answer to any question so they can move on, like glancing at the weather forecast...  who cares what it's going to be like at 10:30am if you figure to be in an office all day, what matters is this:  is it gonna rain during the morning rush?  You're only gonna care about the weather again at lunchtime or maybe not until going home. 

The thing with taking that tack on covid issues is that not caring until you or your family or friends get sick is rolling the dice on not having (or providing to someone else) a serious or fatal encounter with the virus.  It really behooves everyone to try to stay up to speed on official guidance and local mandates, even though it's frustrating to be reminded of the occasional confusion over all the back and forth on masking v not masking etc. 

 Bottom line with the "forecast" for this particular coronavirus these days is "yeah, assume it's going to be raining"...


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423303745165692929/


----------



## fooferdoggie

Leslie Lawrenson died at his home in Bournemouth, South England, on July 2 after insisting that he does not need to take the vaccination to protect himself against the virus.

Lawrenson had posted videos on social media claiming that he would rather get infected with COVID in order to build "natural immunity" rather than take the shot.

His partner Amanda Mitchell, 56, who also became seriously ill with COVID at the same time, told BBC Radio 5 Live on Thursday that Lawrenson considered the vaccines too "experimental," meaning he died "unnecessarily."



			Man Dies From COVID After Being 'Brainwashed' Over Vaccines, Family Says


----------



## fooferdoggie

Florida making covid kids popular.









						135 children hospitalized for COVID in Florida as state sets new overall hospitalization record
					

Florida just set a new record for COVID hospitalizations, with 135 of those being children, the highest ever. Governor DeSantis is now blaming immigration for the spread of COVID. CBS News correspondent Manuel Bojorquez spoke to locals and medical experts about what's truly driving the spike in...



					www.cbsnews.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Just found out my unvaccinated Trump supporting cousin just tested positive for covid.

I don’t know if this is going to contradict something I previously said, but I will just speak of this case. My cousin is a nice guy, kind of simple. We have never had any political discussions or have I sensed any telltale signs of his political leanings. The only reason I know he is a Trump supporter is because other family members have told me. Living in the Bay Area it would be easy to assume he is a Democrat. In conversations with my mom he has talked about feeling attacked or alienated by his wife’s family who are all Democrats. I don’t know if these are direct attacks or just anti-Trump discussions and comments being made in his presence. I don’t really know his circle of friends well. So I don’t know if he goes full Trump supporter in their presence.

In this case I’m more sad disappointed than “you idiot!”. I hope it’s not too severe and he pulls through.


----------



## Hrafn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Just found out my unvaccinated Trump supporting cousin just tested positive for covid.
> 
> I don’t know if this is going to contradict something I previously said, but I will just speak of this case. My cousin is a nice guy, kind of simple. We have never had any political discussions or have I sensed any telltale signs of his political leanings. The only reason I know he is a Trump supporter is because other family members have told me. Living in the Bay Area it would be easy to assume he is a Democrat. In conversations with my mom he has talked about feeling attacked or alienated by his wife’s family who are all Democrats. I don’t know if these are direct attacks or just anti-Trump discussions and comments being made in his presence. I don’t really know his circle of friends well. So I don’t know if he goes full Trump supporter in their presence.
> 
> In this case I’m more sad disappointed than “you idiot!”. I hope it’s not too severe and he pulls through.



Yeah, and at this point, it's probably the delta variant.  Some of my co-workers had the earlier strains, some of whom had a really rough time.  That's a tough position to be in.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423736387124305924/


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423736387124305924/



man covid is proving Forrest gump accurate.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I wonder what the mood and atmosphere is like at a funeral for an anti-vaxxer who died from covid, especially if they were quite vocal about their stance. Honestly depending on who it is I don’t know if I would be able to show up. Just the lingering denial in the air has to be overwhelming.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Loved this:


----------



## JayMysteri0

This is literally the fear stupid brings to us all.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423743918957637640/

The people charged with helping people are some of the people getting others sick?


----------



## DT




----------



## Huntn

The pandemic is now being prolonged by the non-vaccinated. How would you like to help shut down this pandemic that might take your job and end up with your eviction? _Yes!_

Wear a mask… _HEELL NO, THAT’s TOO MUCH OF AN INCONVIENENCE! I don’t want to look like a communist, socialist mother fugg’n liberal!!! Rather die of COVID._

 If your wish could only be my command, in some cases it is.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423303745165692929/



Guys like this fare quite poorly on a vent...


----------



## Alli

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1423736387124305924/



As some of our favorites from TOP used to say “play stupid games, win stupid prizes.”


----------



## Eric

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Just found out my unvaccinated Trump supporting cousin just tested positive for covid.
> 
> I don’t know if this is going to contradict something I previously said, but I will just speak of this case. My cousin is a nice guy, kind of simple. We have never had any political discussions or have I sensed any telltale signs of his political leanings. The only reason I know he is a Trump supporter is because other family members have told me. Living in the Bay Area it would be easy to assume he is a Democrat. In conversations with my mom he has talked about feeling attacked or alienated by his wife’s family who are all Democrats. I don’t know if these are direct attacks or just anti-Trump discussions and comments being made in his presence. I don’t really know his circle of friends well. So I don’t know if he goes full Trump supporter in their presence.
> 
> In this case I’m more sad disappointed than “you idiot!”. I hope it’s not too severe and he pulls through.



One of the people on my team in the bay area said his best friend refused to get the vaccine and has been hospitalized, he said he took a turn for the worse doesn't think he'll survive it. Healthy male in his 30s with no underlying conditions. It is sad for anyone and I don't want to hate on the sick, at the same time it's now fully avoidable. Completely agree, more frustrating than anything.


----------



## DT

In Florida schools in this area, masks are "required", but you can opt out.

That word, I don't think it means what they think it means ...


----------



## fooferdoggie

freedumb at its best.

Charlie Bullington owns Yo Transportation services, a business he started 16 years ago. Recently, he has made it a requirement that he will only transport passengers who aren’t wearing masks and have not gotten the vaccine.

“We don’t allow any type of masks in our vehicles, the second one is we are very against the vaccine and don’t allow people in our vehicle that did get the vaccine,” Bullington said.


Bullington said he verifies his passengers have not been vaccinated and won’t be wearing a mask before he even picks them up. One man took to Facebook saying he was denied a ride because of his vaccination status.
“I understand Missouri is one of the top three states with the lowest vaccination rate, so I am proud of all the Missouri people for standing against this,” Bullington said









						St. Louis taxi company rejecting vaccinated and masked passengers
					

A new policy required by a St. Louis-area transportation company is garnering strong opinions both within the community and online.




					www.kmov.com


----------



## Herdfan

fooferdoggie said:


> freedom at its best.
> 
> Charlie Bullington owns Yo Transportation services, a business he started 16 years ago. Recently, he has made it a requirement that he will only transport passengers who aren’t wearing masks and have not gotten the vaccine.
> 
> “We don’t allow any type of masks in our vehicles, the second one is we are very against the vaccine and don’t allow people in our vehicle that did get the vaccine,” Bullington said.
> 
> 
> Bullington said he verifies his passengers have not been vaccinated




Ummmm.......

If there was an honesty issue about people claiming their were vaccinated so they could ditch the masks, then how in the hell does he think he can trust them to be honest about NOT being vaccinated?


----------



## Huntn

P_X said:


> Guys like this fare quite poorly on a vent...



The level of stupidity is astonishing, until you become numb to it and decide most likely the human race is doomed, does not deserve to succeed. Unfortunately we’ll take many of the species of Earth down with us, 

Secondly, I’ll apologize for my steady stream of doomsday messaging. It just seems appropriate.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> freedom at its best.
> 
> Charlie Bullington owns Yo Transportation services, a business he started 16 years ago. Recently, he has made it a requirement that he will only transport passengers who aren’t wearing masks and have not gotten the vaccine.
> 
> “We don’t allow any type of masks in our vehicles, the second one is we are very against the vaccine and don’t allow people in our vehicle that did get the vaccine,” Bullington said.
> 
> 
> Bullington said he verifies his passengers have not been vaccinated and won’t be wearing a mask before he even picks them up. One man took to Facebook saying he was denied a ride because of his vaccination status.
> “I understand Missouri is one of the top three states with the lowest vaccination rate, so I am proud of all the Missouri people for standing against this,” Bullington said
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> St. Louis taxi company rejecting vaccinated and masked passengers
> 
> 
> A new policy required by a St. Louis-area transportation company is garnering strong opinions both within the community and online.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kmov.com



As I said the species maybe doomed, and I hope he goes out of business, but I suspect as fares drop off, he’ll quietly change policy.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> Ummmm.......
> 
> If there was an honesty issue about people claiming their were vaccinated so they could ditch the masks, then how in the hell does he think he can trust them to be honest about NOT being vaccinated?



There is enough competition, I‘d tell him to get lost, I’ll find a sane transportation company.


----------



## Roller

Speaking of stupid, the Sturgis Motorcycle Rally and Superspreader Event is underway in South Dakota, home of Kristi "I don't care how many of my constituents die" Noem. Maybe some of the bodies can be delivered to her front lawn for burial.


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> freedom at its best.
> 
> Charlie Bullington owns Yo Transportation services, a business he started 16 years ago. Recently, he has made it a requirement that he will only transport passengers who aren’t wearing masks and have not gotten the vaccine.
> 
> “We don’t allow any type of masks in our vehicles, the second one is we are very against the vaccine and don’t allow people in our vehicle that did get the vaccine,” Bullington said.
> 
> 
> Bullington said he verifies his passengers have not been vaccinated and won’t be wearing a mask before he even picks them up. One man took to Facebook saying he was denied a ride because of his vaccination status.
> “I understand Missouri is one of the top three states with the lowest vaccination rate, so I am proud of all the Missouri people for standing against this,” Bullington said
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> St. Louis taxi company rejecting vaccinated and masked passengers
> 
> 
> A new policy required by a St. Louis-area transportation company is garnering strong opinions both within the community and online.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kmov.com




The truth is out there for anyone to see.  The evidence is walking the streets every day.  Those who refuse the vaccine are just being willfully stupid.  Those who wish to wallow in their ignorance are giving this thing more opportunity to mutate into something worse.  Again.  I'm tired of hearing how it's *their *_*right*_ to put my life in danger.

I wish everyone would get vaccinated, but that's not going to happen.  As I said the other day, get the vaccine or hurry up and claim your Darwin Award.  Then along comes Mr. Bullington and his death cab offering rides to the ceremonies!

My hat is off to you Mr. Bullington, you're my hero.  Knock yourself out.  Keep the windows up.  Shake hands.  Hug everyone.  Exercise your freedom right up to the very end.  You have my complete support. If you refuse to do one damn thing to protect me, don't look for sympathy from me.  Good riddance.  Take as many down with you as possible.  I wouldn't be sad to hear this led to 1,500 new infections.  I hope every passenger dies.  Maybe *that* will convince a dipshit or two to get the vaccine.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Ummmm.......
> 
> If there was an honesty issue about people claiming their were vaccinated so they could ditch the masks, then how in the hell does he think he can trust them to be honest about NOT being vaccinated?




How do you even prove to someone you haven't been vaccinated?

I mean, I haven't ever gotten ovarian cancer, but if someone asked me to provide verifiable evidence of such from a trustworthy source, I wouldn't be able to do so. Sure, I could say that I don't have ovaries, ergo, but is that statement alone proof enough? I could be lying. Should I have to present my testicles as evidence? Are my testicles, by themselves, proof enough? Is there such a thing as low ovaries? How do you prove, beyond any reasonable doubt, that you know what you know because you know it?


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Ummmm.......
> 
> If there was an honesty issue about people claiming their were vaccinated so they could ditch the masks, then how in the hell does he think he can trust them to be honest about NOT being vaccinated?




My guess is it's a moot point.  Who is going to lie about their vaccination status to catch a ride with Dr. Death?


----------



## Thomas Veil

Found this online. Kudos to whoever created it.


----------



## Eric

It's almost as if COVID doesn't give a shit about one's politics.


----------



## Thomas Veil

So while Floridians are descending into Covid hell, there’s this trend we’re seeing now that is a new adventure in whataboutism. “What about our borders? Biden is doing nothing to stop millions of infected immigrants from coming into the US!”

It started with DeathSantis and is spreading to the comments sections of sites.

There’s a word to describe something like this. Like when _you’re_ the cause of death and are ignoring it and instead trying to bring in relative irrelevancies like Biden and immigration. What’s the word I’m looking for here…?

Oh yeah. Obscene.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I'm all for this...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424179814290894854/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424160740928376838/

_Note:  I'm not a big Twitter user, but I saw / got a notice for the first time just now, that Twitter is over capacity.  Is that really a thing?_


----------



## SuperMatt

Thomas Veil said:


> So while Floridians are descending into Covid hell, there’s this trend we’re seeing now that is a new adventure in whataboutism. “What about our borders? Biden is doing nothing to stop millions of infected immigrants from coming into the US!”
> 
> It started with DeathSantis and is spreading to the comments sections of sites.
> 
> There’s a word to describe something like this. Like when _you’re_ the cause of death and are ignoring it and instead trying to bring in relative irrelevancies like Biden and immigration. What’s the word I’m looking for here…?
> 
> Oh yeah. Obscene.



My favorite example of this was a post somebody made here about the governor of Iowa blaming increased COVID cases on immigrants crossing the border….  …. into Iowa? Somebody failed geography…


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> I'm all for this...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424179814290894854/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424160740928376838/
> 
> _Note:  I'm not a big Twitter user, but I saw / got a notice for the first time just now, that Twitter is over capacity.  Is that really a thing?_



I don’t have a Twitter account. Lately I’ve noticed that if I open an embedded tweet, it works fine. But if I try to click on other things in Twitter at that point, it pops up a message telling me to make an account.

Likewise, some organizations have basically no website and their only “web presence” is Facebook. I am running into similar problems there, trying to access “public” Facebook pages and instead seeing a FB “signup” message. And Instagram has been highly aggressive ever since the FB acquisition in preventing any usage if you’re not a registered user. Even trying to setup a website that has the latest Instagram posts embedded in it is a pain in the neck. You need to get a special token and *manually* renew that token every 30 days?

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE let these walled gardens go the way of AOL very soon…


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

My wife was showing me a guy from our town on Facebook last night who died a few days ago of Covid. He was a vocal anti-vaxer and his entire feed is memes and quotes spreading misinformation about Covid. His daughter who my wife knows posted that he said a couple of days before he died that he regretted his choice not to have the vaccine. 

Hearing so many of these types of stories too and people can be so bloody stupid. Now the restrictions have been lifted here, it’s like we are going to be forgetting the virus even exists too unless we know someone who dies from it.


----------



## Thomas Veil

SuperMatt said:


> My favorite example of this was a post somebody made here about the governor of Iowa blaming increased COVID cases on immigrants crossing the border….  …. into Iowa? Somebody failed geography…



Well, maybe the Mexicans are all coming up to attend the Sturgis Motorcycle Rally in adjacent South Dakota.


----------



## Alli

JayMysteri0 said:


> _Note: I'm not a big Twitter user, but I saw / got a notice for the first time just now, that Twitter is over capacity. Is that really a thing?_



I’m not seeing anything like that, although I’ve been using Twitter less these days. I’m sure if it were actually a thing my mother would have complained about it. She is a total Twitter addict.


----------



## SuperMatt

Thomas Veil said:


> Well, maybe the Mexicans are all coming up to attend the Sturgis Mororcycle Rally in adjacent South Dakota.



Good point. They are probably using their motorcycles and a ramp to jump the Trump wall and drive to SD!


----------



## Thomas Veil

Viva Knieval!


----------



## Thomas Veil

Local education leaders respond to state’s pressure against face mask mandates
					

To support Gov. Ron DeSantis’ July 30th executive order, the State Board of Education announced members adopted emergency measures on Friday to “protect” the children whose parents believe would be “harmed” by face mask mandates or stay-home directives.




					www.local10.com
				






> To support Gov. Ron DeSantis’ July 30th executive order, the State Board of Education announced members adopted emergency measures on Friday to “protect” the children whose parents believe would be “harmed” by face mask mandates or stay-home directives.
> 
> During the 18 months of the coronavirus pandemic, infectious disease experts have consistently recommended the two public health measures. *The State Board of Education approved an emergency rule to allow private school vouchers for parents who feel their children are being harassed by a school district’s safety rules....*





> The Florida Department of Education also threatened to withhold “state funds, discretionary grant funds, discretionary lottery funds, or any other funds” from school districts with face mask mandates designed to protect the health of teachers and students during the new surge of COVID cases.
> 
> *The priority during the state board’s meeting wasn’t to find ways to implement the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recommendations. It was to protect “parents’ freedom to choose” through the state’s Hope Scholarship program, which offers victims of bullying in public schools access to private education.*




My bold.

This is the purest snowflaky insanity. Being told to wear a mask is bullying now? And Florida's going to give money to people so these snowflake parents can avoid (gasp!) having to send their kids to such schools?

Is anybody here from Florida? 'Cause what's going on there now is definitely grounds for impeaching DeathSantis, and the only reason I'm guessing that isn't happening is because Florida's such a red state. Hospitals are so full they're turning auditoriums into extra ward space and DeathSantis is acting like he's on a mission to spread the disease far and wide. I'm just flabbergasted. Even if the state is _red_, somebody please explain to me how impeachment is not even being _talked_ about?


----------



## SuperMatt

Thomas Veil said:


> Local education leaders respond to state’s pressure against face mask mandates
> 
> 
> To support Gov. Ron DeSantis’ July 30th executive order, the State Board of Education announced members adopted emergency measures on Friday to “protect” the children whose parents believe would be “harmed” by face mask mandates or stay-home directives.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.local10.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My bold.
> 
> This is the purest snowflaky insanity. Being told to wear a mask is bullying now? And Florida's going to give money to people so these snowflake parents can avoid (gasp!) having to send their kids to such schools?
> 
> Is anybody here from Florida? 'Cause what's going on there now is definitely grounds for impeaching DeathSantis, and the only reason I'm guessing that isn't happening is because Florida's such a red state. Hospitals are so full they're turning auditoriums into extra ward space and DeathSantis is acting like he's on a mission to spread the disease far and wide. I'm just flabbergasted. Even if the state is _red_, somebody please explain to me how impeachment is not even being _talked_ about?



The huge bloc of retirees in the state don’t have kids in school there. They go full red no matter what. The cubans are anti-Democrat because they associate them with communism. Average people who want to raise kids in a safe environment are the “odd man out” in that state.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424443346383212550/


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> The huge bloc of retirees in the state don’t have kids in school there. They go full red no matter what. The cubans are anti-Democrat because they associate them with communism. Average people who want to raise kids in a safe environment are the “odd man out” in that state.



I find the population dynamics of FL morbidly hilarious. To me they seem to have a near-infinite supply of conservative retirees that consistently replace the conservative retirees who, switching parties or not, aren't too likely to last more than a few election cycles.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424443346383212550/



Reminds me of Isaac's story from the Old Testament.


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Local education leaders respond to state’s pressure against face mask mandates
> 
> 
> To support Gov. Ron DeSantis’ July 30th executive order, the State Board of Education announced members adopted emergency measures on Friday to “protect” the children whose parents believe would be “harmed” by face mask mandates or stay-home directives.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.local10.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My bold.
> 
> This is the purest snowflaky insanity. Being told to wear a mask is bullying now? And Florida's going to give money to people so these snowflake parents can avoid (gasp!) having to send their kids to such schools?
> 
> Is anybody here from Florida? 'Cause what's going on there now is definitely grounds for impeaching DeathSantis, and the only reason I'm guessing that isn't happening is because Florida's such a red state. Hospitals are so full they're turning auditoriums into extra ward space and DeathSantis is acting like he's on a mission to spread the disease far and wide. I'm just flabbergasted. Even if the state is _red_, somebody please explain to me how impeachment is not even being _talked_ about?




His antimasker BS isn't popular:


> by a 2-to-1 margin – 62% to 31.9% – Floridians believe schoolchildren should be required to wear masks when they return to the classroom in two weeks, a strong rebuke to DeSantis and his recent executive order banning school districts from imposing mask mandates.





			https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2021-08-04/ron-desantis-plays-disaster-politics-as-florida-again-reels-from-coronavirus
		


I'm personally sick of this nazi shit of advocating for the wrong thing and then blame the adverse effects of ill advocacy on a scapegoat group.


----------



## Clix Pix

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424443346383212550/




Well, when her husband dies a totally unnecessary death this woman can just decide that, oh, God wanted to Take Him Home......or whatever.  She'll have to deal with the reality of being a widow and raising however many children they may have on her own now, and isn't that too bad, when simply accepting the vaccination could've made all the difference?


----------



## Thomas Veil

FB is the worst place to get your news. Prayer is the worst way to get your advice.


----------



## Hrafn

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424443346383212550/



You caint cure stupid.  Unfortunately, many of my folks call it home.


----------



## thekev

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424443346383212550/




Where in their religious texts does it even indicate that they should expect a direct response to such questions? Also, the man probably could have gone against him there if he had any brains/balls. Unfortunately, divorce courts tend to favor women.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Clix Pix said:


> Well, when her husband dies a totally unnecessary death this woman can just decide that, oh, God wanted to Take Him Home...



I talked with somebody like that when this whole Covid thing started. He told me that he was right with the Lord, so if it was God's will that he die, he was ready.

There's really nothing you can say to that kind of denseness.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Oh FFS, THIS guy can't help himself from being THIS FUCKING GUY any chance he gets

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424562495532974084/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424509834380992513/


----------



## Yoused

This does not exactly belong here, but it kinda does, and man, is that headline breath-taking or what.



Spoiler: pick up your jaw












						Deep dive into stupid: Meet the growing group that rejects germ theory
					

Germ theory denialist Facebook group went from 147 members in April 2020 to 18.4K now.




					arstechnica.com


----------



## User.45

thekev said:


> Where in their religious texts does it even indicate that they should expect a direct response to such questions?



Isaac, Old Testament.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Oh FFS, THIS guy can't help himself from being THIS FUCKING GUY any chance he gets
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424562495532974084/



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424399282447298563/
@Roller, check this shit out

The full video deserves the extra 1.5 minutes.

"I went to Duke University". I'mma tease my Duke Med buddies for life with this.
"I worked in ERs". I'm probably half his age, but guarantee that I spent more time in ERs than he did.
"I studied immunology and virology". Yeah, for like 1 semester and like 45 years ago (when it comes to immunology, this is the medical equivalent of bragging about your competence that came from a coding course you did 50 years ago)


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> Isaac, Old Testament.




I am actually surprised. I figured it was a modern invention.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424399282447298563/
> @Roller, check this shit out
> 
> The full video deserves the extra 1.5 minutes.
> 
> "I went to Duke University". I'mma tease my Duke Med buddies for life with this.
> "I worked in ERs". I'm probably half his age, but guarantee that I spent more time in ERs than he did.
> "I studied immunology and virology". Yeah, for like 1 semester and like 45 years ago (when it comes to immunology, this is the medical equivalent of bragging about your competence that came from a coding course you did 50 years ago)



“Do they still use COBOL?” - an actual quote from a senior citizen asking me about coding a website last week. Similar knowledge level to Rand Paul and immunology I am guessing.


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424399282447298563/
> @Roller, check this shit out
> 
> The full video deserves the extra 1.5 minutes.
> 
> "I went to Duke University". I'mma tease my Duke Med buddies for life with this.
> "I worked in ERs". I'm probably half his age, but guarantee that I spent more time in ERs than he did.
> "I studied immunology and virology". Yeah, for like 1 semester and like 45 years ago (when it comes to immunology, this is the medical equivalent of bragging about your competence that came from a coding course you did 50 years ago)



Paul's calling attention to his bona fides as a doctor are as valid as Paul Gosar's proclamation that he is qualified to read body language because he's a dentist. If Rand Paul ever was a competent, knowledgeable, caring physician, he abandoned that long ago. Although he insists he's not a career politician, that's exactly what he is. As of last week, 11 Kentucky hospital systems had announced a vaccination requirement for their employees. Is Paul going to try to withhold funding or other resources from them?

Only Paul's constituents have the power to do anything about him, perhaps when they've seen too many of their family and friends die.


----------



## Renzatic

thekev said:


> Where in their religious texts does it even indicate that they should expect a direct response to such questions? Also, the man probably could have gone against him there if he had any brains/balls. Unfortunately, divorce courts tend to favor women.




The sad fact is this woman's story won't do a thing to sway others of similar mind away from their current opinions. They'll just write her off as a deep state operative trying to sway the sheeple into taking the government's poison until it's their turn to pay penance for their bad decisions.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> Paul's calling attention to his bona fides as a doctor are as valid as Paul Gosar's proclamation that he is qualified to read body language because he's a dentist. If Rand Paul ever was a competent, knowledgeable, caring physician, he abandoned that long ago. Although he insists he's not a career politician, that's exactly what he is. As of last week, 11 Kentucky hospital systems had announced a vaccination requirement for their employees. Is Paul going to try to withhold funding or other resources from them?
> 
> Only Paul's constituents have the power to do anything about him, perhaps when they've seen too many of their family and friends die.



All I can say, I've been using Rand to demonstrate my Euro Conservative buddy, how crazy the GOP had gotten.


----------



## Roller

SuperMatt said:


> “Do they still use COBOL?” - an actual quote from a senior citizen asking me about coding a website last week. Similar knowledge level to Rand Paul and immunology I am guessing.



Actually, COBOL is still in fairly wide use, especially for legacy financial systems. I learned a little in 1972, but never took it very far because I was already using FORTRAN and IBM 360/370 Assembly language.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Coming Soon For The Unvaccinated: A $50 Monthly Paycheck Deduction From Your Employer​








						Coming Soon For The Unvaccinated: A $50 Monthly Paycheck Deduction From Your Employer
					

Employers are beginning to tack on a special surcharge of up to $50 a month for unvaccinated workers, according to the health benefits consultancy Mercer.




					www.forbes.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> My favorite example of this was a post somebody made here about the governor of Iowa blaming increased COVID cases on immigrants crossing the border….  …. into Iowa? Somebody failed geography…




Perhaps THIS, brought to you by a regular TFG, explains the 'immigrants bringing Covid' theories.






DEMOCRATS!!!  I tells YA!  DEMS!!!


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## DT

Kind of an "oldy", bit still so accurate ...


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


>




Yeah i think i knew that guy's cousin.   He must be down there too by now.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Follow along
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424800934522195976/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424801027585413130/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424543699850055682/


----------



## Herdfan

So how come no one here thinks Obama's 60th birthday party was stupid?

I mean 400 people maskless inside a tent.  But what could go wrong there?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> So how come no one here thinks Obama's 60th birthday party was stupid?
> 
> I mean 400 people maskless inside a tent.  But what could go wrong there?




Can only speak for myself here, but I wasn’t even aware of Obama’s 60th party.

But knowing now, yeah it was reckless and hypocritical.  But I also don’t worship Obama.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> So how come no one here thinks Obama's 60th birthday party was stupid?




It was stupid.  It just isn't the same level of stupid, in my opinion.  I suspect most/all were vaccinated.  Just a wild guess, but I suspect it's close to the truth.  The post previous to yours was about a gathering where many are likely unvaccinated.  Totally different, in my opinion of course.

Also, I noticed that the Obama story was the top story on Fox over the weekend.  Made me chuckle that they couldn't find anything more newsworthy than an ex-president acting in a slightly irresponsible way.  Maddening when their viewers need to be reading "get the vaccine", not "let's all laugh at Obama some more".  As usual, they're taking a virus that effects us all and are making it us vs. them.  I think they'd serve their readers better if they had more truth about the situation, but they choose to pick on Obama instead because that's what put smiles on their audience's faces and keeps them coming back.  If the name had been "Bush" and not "Obama", I don't think we'd have seen a story at all.

That's my take on it.  All my opinion of course.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> So how come no one here thinks Obama's 60th birthday party was stupid?
> 
> I mean 400 people maskless inside a tent.  But what could go wrong there?



400  200 people that were vaccinated and tested for COVID before attending....VS 700,000 people, many of whom openly state they are not vaccinated and did not get tested. Whataboutism at its finest.

Correction: According to People magazine, the pared-down affair was reduced to 200 people.


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> It was stupid.  It just isn't the same level of stupid, in my opinion.  I suspect most/all were vaccinated.  Just a wild guess, but I suspect it's close to the truth.  The post previous to yours was about a gathering where many are likely unvaccinated.  Totally different, in my opinion of course.




Yes, most were vaccinated.  But this isn't about what specifically happens at that party.  It is how it looks.  More rules for thee, but not for me.

Even MSNBC agrees with me: https://news.yahoo.com/msnbc-host-obamas-huge-60th-181136190.html


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Yes, most were vaccinated.  But this isn't about what specifically happens at that party.  It is how it looks.  More rules for thee, but not for me.



Everybody at my work was vaccinated, and we all were going to work maskless. It’s because people are refusing to get vaccinated that we have to wear masks again. The fact is, in most places you cannot tell who is or isn’t vaccinated, and people will scream and cry if you have vaccine mandates... so everybody is masking up again to try and protect the covidiots from themselves... and thereby hopefully protecting the world from an even more dangerous mutation. Every case increases the chance of a mutation.

If you’ve got 200 people, all of whom are vaccinated, why SHOULDN’T they be able to get together and do whatever they want? The mask and vaccine whiners over at Fox should move to Hungary if they love that version of “freedom” so much. This BS of “why do you get to gather without masks just because you got vaccinated?” Is utter BS, and I don’t care how much they cry about it. Be a good citizen and get the shot.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> If you’ve got 200 people, all of whom are vaccinated, why SHOULDN’T they be able to get together and do whatever they want?




Because breakthrough infections can happen, especially with the Delta Variant.  And these are not people who live in the same general area, but are from all over the country.  So one breakthrough infection could infect others who will travel back home and possibly take it back with them.

You don't have to hammer me about the vaccine.  I am fully vaccinated.  And I am just as pissed as you are about those who won't get it.  Maybe more so given how much I hate masks.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Because breakthrough infections can happen, especially with the Delta Variant.  And these are not people who live in the same general area, but are from all over the country.  So one breakthrough infection could infect others who will travel back home and possibly take it back with them.
> 
> You don't have to hammer me about the vaccine.  I am fully vaccinated.  And I am just as pissed as you are about those who won't get it.  Maybe more so given how much I hate masks.



The risk is infinitesimal if they are all vaccinated. I believe they were wearing masks at the outdoor party too, but I cannot confirm that. The Sturgis thing is pure stupidity. Much of that event is outside, which will help, but they are all going to bars and tattoo parlors and not masking up in there (heard a story with interviews from multiple attendees and a tattoo parlor owner confirming that this morning).


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> More rules for thee, but not for me.




In case you hadn't heard, Obama is out of the rule making game.  He's an average citizen.  If all the guests had been vaccinated AND tested, that's certainly more responsible than the average citizen is acting (in my part of the country).  Was it a bad idea?  Perhaps.  Should it be an important story?  Not in my opinion.  It's barely more interesting than "vaccinated stranger went to the KFC for a bucket without a mask".

I dislike this story because instead of focusing on getting important information out to their viewers about vaccines and proper protocols, they're instead saying "well, if that dude isn't being safe, ..."  Most people resistant to the vaccine aren't going to be encouraged to get one due to this story.  It will push them the other way.  That's my only problem with the story.  They're ignoring real dangers to our public health to focus on someone doing most of the things right.  It makes me question their motivations in reporting this "news" in the first place.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> 400  200 people that were vaccinated and tested for COVID before attending....VS 700,000 people, many of whom openly state they are not vaccinated and did not get tested. Whataboutism at its finest.
> 
> Correction: According to People magazine, the pared-down affair was reduced to 200 people.



This was the joke @The Daily Show had for this when conservatives first started clutching their pearls about Obama's birthday and it was responded to.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1422943962579484680/

The same crowd wasn't making noises about a less former president rallies or attempted whatevers with Bill O' Reilly.

But hey, THAT guy is having a BIG birthday party, what the   ?!!








SuperMatt said:


> Everybody at my work was vaccinated, and we all were going to work maskless. It’s because people are refusing to get vaccinated that we have to wear masks again. The fact is, in most places you cannot tell who is or isn’t vaccinated, and people will scream and cry if you have vaccine mandates... so everybody is masking up again to try and protect the covidiots from themselves... and thereby hopefully protecting the world from an even more dangerous mutation. Every case increases the chance of a mutation.
> 
> If you’ve got 200 people, all of whom are vaccinated, why SHOULDN’T they be able to get together and do whatever they want? The mask and vaccine whiners over at Fox should move to Hungary if they love that version of “freedom” so much. This BS of “why do you get to gather without masks just because you got vaccinated?” Is utter BS, and I don’t care how much they cry about it. Be a good citizen and get the shot.




That's my favorite thing about 'whatabouts' when it comes to all of this.  Such a things are basically incentives.  If you want to have large gatherings get over your feelings about sticking it to anyone but yourself with an injection, and get the vaccine.  It's simple.  You want things to get back to normal you get the vaccine, help everyone out, and you too can have parties, go to restaurants, concerts or whatever.


----------



## SuperMatt

MEJHarrison said:


> In case you hadn't heard, Obama is out of the rule making game.  He's an average citizen.  If all the guests had been vaccinated AND tested, that's certainly more responsible than the average citizen is acting (in my part of the country).  Was it a bad idea?  Perhaps.  Should it be an important story?  Not in my opinion.  It's barely more interesting than "vaccinated stranger to went to the KFC for a bucket without a mask".
> 
> I dislike this story because instead of focusing on getting important information out to their viewers about vaccines and proper protocols, they're instead saying "well, if that dude isn't being safe, ..."  Most people resistant to the vaccine aren't going to be encouraged to get one due to this story.  It will push them the other way.  That's my only problem with the story.  They're ignoring real dangers to our public health to focus on someone doing most of the things right.  It makes me question their motivations in reporting this "news" in the first place.



They hate Obama because he’s black. Let’s just be honest. There’s a reason we got an openly racist president immediately after Obama - white backlash.


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> I dislike this story because instead of focusing on getting important information out to their viewers about vaccines and proper protocols, they're instead saying "*well, if that dude isn't being safe,* ..."  Most people resistant to the vaccine aren't going to be encouraged to get one due to this story.  It will push them the other way.  That's my only problem with the story.  They're ignoring real dangers to our public health to focus on someone doing most of the things right.  It makes me question their motivations in reporting this "news" in the first place.




Problem is "that dude" is a former President who still holds quite a bit of sway.  So in this case the danger isn't so much from the virus, but people getting the idea that everything is safe and they can throw their own party.


----------



## DT

Herdfan said:


> Yes, most were vaccinated.  But this isn't about what specifically happens at that party.  It is how it looks.  More rules for thee, but not for me.




No, it's about the actual substantive nature of the event, and it's not comparable, and the whole " Rules for thee ..." is an attempt at reverse engineering ... because Obama.  It shouldn't even be in the discussion, it's absurd, if the orange fuckwit threw the same event, I'd just shrug (well, and laugh, because he doesn't have 20 people who like him enough to show up ...)


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Problem is "that dude" is a former President who still holds quite a bit of sway.  So in this case the danger isn't so much from the virus, but people getting the idea that everything is safe and they can throw their own party.




Let's be real here.  Of the people who still find him relevant and are going to be influenced by what he says and does, what percentage do you think are unvaccinated or on the fence?  I'll be honest, I don't know those numbers.  But I'm guessing it's a very small percentage.

The people who just need to get the damn shot are a completely different group than the people who would be influenced by his actions.  It's just the haters out there who are going to use this information to validate their choice to be stupid against their own best interests.


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> Let's be real here.  Of the people who still find him relevant and are going to be influenced by what he says and does, what percentage do you think are unvaccinated or on the fence?  I'll be honest, I don't know those numbers.  But I'm guessing it's a very small percentage.




Given that vaccination rates lag in the Black Community, I would say what he does has a lot of influence on them.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Here's a montage of stupid 

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/p014zy


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Uh oh, sounds like the military is about the slap down a vaccine mandate for service members.  I've heard the military is a lot more politically diverse than you'd think but I'm willing to bet it's still more right wing heavy.  

Tell you what, heroes.  You're a lot more likely to directly save American lives by getting vaccinated than you are firing off munitions in a foreign country.  That is what you signed up for, to put your life on the line to protect America and Americans, right?  It's not like you go to a foreign country and get to backout of certain missions because you don't approve  of the potential way that mission could harm or kill you.  "I'm fine with getting blown up but protest being shot".  This is your current mission.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Uh oh, sounds like the military is about the slap down a vaccine mandate for service members.  I've heard the military is a lot more politically diverse than you'd think but I'm willing to bet it's still more right wing heavy.
> 
> Tell you what, heroes.  You're a lot more likely to directly save American lives by getting vaccinated than you are firing off munitions in a foreign country.  That is what you signed up for, to put your life on the line to protect America and Americans, right?  It's not like you go to a foreign country and get to backout of certain missions because you don't approve  of the potential way that mission could harm or kill you.  "I'm fine with getting blown up but protest being shot".  This is your current mission.



If you went through basic training and the line of countless shots they give you (into various body parts, not just your arm...), you would be truly befuddled that the same soldiers are NOW opposed to vaccines. I really don’t get it...


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> If you went through basic training and the line of countless shots they give you (into various body parts, not just your arm...), you would be truly befuddled that the same soldiers are NOW opposed to vaccines. I really don’t get it...



Yep, this is weird. There's people that are not anti-vaxxers but they're anti-COVID vaccine. Makes no sense other than they're using it as some kind of political statement which itself is just stupid.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Just found out my Trump supporting cousin who I posted tested positive for covid last week was just taken to the hospital in an ambulance. I don’t have any info beyond that.

Over the weekend I also found out his wife got vaccinated but also tested positive shortly after him. Her symptoms have mostly just been being exhausted. She made several appointments for him to get vaccinated in the past but he didn’t go. He has a long history of being medical attention adverse but he has also said the vaccine messes with your DNA. So it’s a real mixed bag on his reasoning and even if Trump said everybody should get vaccinated there’s a chance he still wouldn’t do it.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> Yep, this is weird. There's people that are not anti-vaxxers but they're anti-COVID vaccine. Makes no sense other than they're using it as some kind of political statement which itself is just stupid.



well the its not approved argument dies in a month. it was so fast it is full of 5g and on and on.


----------



## JayMysteri0

For your latest, but inevitable bit of Covid stupidity

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424823808561668100/



> I Am Legend (film) - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org





> _*I Am Legend*_ is a 2007 American post-apocalyptic action thriller film[4][5] loosely based on the 1954 novel of the same name by Richard Matheson. Directed by Francis Lawrence from a screenplay by Akiva Goldsman and Mark Protosevich, the film stars Will Smith as US Army virologist Robert Neville. It is set in New York City after *a virus*, which was originally created to cure cancer, has wiped out most of mankind, leaving Neville as the last human in New York, other than nocturnal mutants. Neville is immune to the virus, and he works to develop a cure while defending himself against the hostile mutants. It is the third feature-film adaptation of Matheson's novel following 1964's _The Last Man on Earth_ and 1971's _The Omega Man_.








> Fact check: A vaccine did not turn characters in the movie ‘I Am Legend’ into zombies
> 
> 
> Social media users have been sharing content online that claims characters in the movie “I Am Legend” starring actor Will Smith turned into zombies because of a vaccine. This claim is false.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com


----------



## Thomas Veil

Jesus. Is DeSantis on a power trip or what???



> Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis's office said Monday that the state board of education could move to withhold the salaries of superintendents and school board members who disregard the governor's executive order prohibiting mask mandates for school districts.



You know what? Fuck that guy, fuck his ego, and fuck his sun-drenched dictatorship.









						Florida governor's office says state could withhold salaries of officials who enact school mask mandates | CNN
					

In a move that escalated Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis' fight over mask mandates, the governor's office said Monday that the state board of education could move to withhold the salaries of superintendents and school board members who disregard the governor's executive order that effectively...




					www.cnn.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Thomas Veil said:


> Jesus. Is DeSantis on a power trip or what???
> 
> 
> You know what? Fuck that guy, fuck his ego, and fuck his sun-drenched dictatorship.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Florida governor's office says state could withhold salaries of officials who enact school mask mandates | CNN
> 
> 
> In a move that escalated Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis' fight over mask mandates, the governor's office said Monday that the state board of education could move to withhold the salaries of superintendents and school board members who disregard the governor's executive order that effectively...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com



So much for freedom. Can we send everybody in the GOP on the next Hungary trip instead of just Tucker Carlson? Then put in a travel ban for Hungary…?


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> So much for freedom. Can we send everybody in the GOP on the next Hungary trip instead of just Tucker Carlson? Then put in a travel ban for Hungary…?



I think you're misunderstanding how SOME view freedom.

You have the freedom to follow orders THEY like.

They have the freedom to ignore orders they DON'T like.

They will rage if the gov't is used, they will happily use the gov't.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424730511658950659/


----------



## thekev

SuperMatt said:


> Everybody at my work was vaccinated, and we all were going to work maskless.* It’s because people are refusing to get vaccinated that we have to wear masks again. *The fact is, in most places you cannot tell who is or isn’t vaccinated, and people will scream and cry if you have vaccine mandates... so everybody is masking up again to try and protect the covidiots from themselves... and thereby hopefully protecting the world from an even more dangerous mutation. Every case increases the chance of a mutation.




That doesn't follow. Vaccination does not reduce the rate of infection to zero. CDC recommendations are likely to include masks if they think wearing masks will measurably lower the number of cases, regardless of vaccination status. 



SuperMatt said:


> If you’ve got 200 people, all of whom are vaccinated, why SHOULDN’T they be able to get together and do whatever they want? The mask and vaccine whiners over at Fox should move to Hungary if they love that version of “freedom” so much. This BS of “why do you get to gather without masks just because you got vaccinated?” Is utter BS, and I don’t care how much they cry about it. Be a good citizen and get the shot.




When this all started, virtually (hehe) all academic conferences went online. Some of them actually estimated the expected number of deaths or infections based on best available data that could be incurred if they proceeded as normal. It would be informative to see how many infections are reported following similar events. You can't say with certainty whether an infection occurred there, but you can observe outcomes.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424730511658950659/




This reminds of a joke I've even heard in church as a lesson.  A man is trapped on a roof in a flood.  Multiple people show up in boats and a helicopter to rescue him but each time he tells them he doesn't need their help because he has Jesus.  Eventually he dies from exposure and when he gets to heaven he asks Jesus why he abandoned him and let him die.  Jesus says "I didn't.  I sent those people in the boats and helicopter".  Now they are going to be told he sent the vaccine.

I'd like to see a reporter shove a microphone in the face of a Jesus based anti-vaxxer on their deathbed and ask "Since God has a plan for everyone, how are you feeling about your plan right now?"


----------



## SuperMatt

thekev said:


> That doesn't follow. Vaccination does not reduce the rate of infection to zero. CDC recommendations are likely to include masks if they think wearing masks will measurably lower the number of cases, regardless of vaccination status.



Risk is never zero. That is not the standard. Fact is, if people had gotten their free shots when they were supposed to, we‘d be at or near herd immunity already. It is their fault masks are back.


----------



## thekev

SuperMatt said:


> Risk is never zero. That is not the standard. Fact is, if people had gotten their free shots when they were supposed to, *we‘d be at or near herd immunity already.* It is their fault masks are back.




That's still way too speculative and not in line with past CDC comments. They tend to observe and make recommendations based on their observations. If we had 100% vaccination and the CDC's internal modeling suggested that the use of masks would significantly reduce the number of cases, they would recommend them. What you're referring to here is a confounding variable. It's a factor we know to be present, which has to be accounted for. 

That aside, the masks themselves are not that big of a deal. They're at worst a minor inconvenience.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Ohio hold my beer.
House Bill 248, also named the Vaccine Choice and Anti-Discrimination Act, prohibits virtually everybody from requiring a vaccine, even employers such as hospitals, and forbids "discriminatory treatment" based on vaccination status. It also requires schools to notify parents that children can be exempted from vaccines.

The legislation applies to all vaccines, not just COVID-19 shots.

Sponsored by Rep. Jennifer Gross, R-West Chester Township, the bill attracted national headlines after Dr. Sherri Tenpenny falsely claimed in a June hearing that COVID-19 vaccines cause magnetism.

Videos of her speaking went viral, and the widespread attention "wounded" the bill's chances, Lipps had said. But that didn't mean the bill was dead.

"We will still put it through its paces. We want to hear opponent testimony and we want to see what amendments the bill sponsor presents," Lipps said in a June interview.




__





						As more require COVID-19 vaccine, Ohio lawmakers move up debate on 'vaccine choice' bill
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## SuperMatt

thekev said:


> That's still way too speculative and not in line with past CDC comments. They tend to observe and make recommendations based on their observations. If we had 100% vaccination and the CDC's internal modeling suggested that the use of masks would significantly reduce the number of cases, they would recommend them. What you're referring to here is a confounding variable. It's a factor we know to be present, which has to be accounted for.
> 
> That aside, the masks themselves are not that big of a deal. They're at worst a minor inconvenience.



True enough, but we were in no-mask world for a short while and it was nice…


----------



## User.45

fooferdoggie said:


> Ohio hold my beer.
> House Bill 248, also named the Vaccine Choice and Anti-Discrimination Act, prohibits virtually everybody from requiring a vaccine, even employers such as hospitals, and forbids "discriminatory treatment" based on vaccination status. It also requires schools to notify parents that children can be exempted from vaccines.
> 
> The legislation applies to all vaccines, not just COVID-19 shots.
> 
> Sponsored by Rep. Jennifer Gross, R-West Chester Township, the bill attracted national headlines after Dr. Sherri Tenpenny falsely claimed in a June hearing that COVID-19 vaccines cause magnetism.
> 
> Videos of her speaking went viral, and the widespread attention "wounded" the bill's chances, Lipps had said. But that didn't mean the bill was dead.
> 
> "We will still put it through its paces. We want to hear opponent testimony and we want to see what amendments the bill sponsor presents," Lipps said in a June interview.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As more require COVID-19 vaccine, Ohio lawmakers move up debate on 'vaccine choice' bill
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com



Even for a US travel visa you have to have certain shots, so no this sort of antivaxx bullshit is the privilege of those born in (and never leaving) the USA, as other countries also have vaccination requirements. 



SuperMatt said:


> Risk is never zero. That is not the standard. Fact is, if people had gotten their free shots when they were supposed to, we‘d be at or near herd immunity already. It is their fault masks are back.



We are past the dream of herd immunity. We'd need global herd immunity achieved before the next COVID season to eliminate the infection. Unlikely. It will become a flu-like seasonal disease. Having the vaccine will reduce the risk to that of the influenza, but the really fucked up thing with COVID is that unlike the Flu it spreads quite effectively off-season. 



thekev said:


> That's still way too speculative and not in line with past CDC comments. They tend to observe and make recommendations based on their observations. If we had 100% vaccination and the CDC's internal modeling suggested that the use of masks would significantly reduce the number of cases, they would recommend them. What you're referring to here is a confounding variable. It's a factor we know to be present, which has to be accounted for.
> 
> That aside, the masks themselves are not that big of a deal. They're at worst a minor inconvenience.



The otherwise terribly designed DANMASK study was indicative of one thing. The effect size of universal masking is low enough for it to not make much of a difference if there is a low case count. I think CDC also takes into account demoralization and tries to keep mask mandates to when it will have the biggest impact. 


FL doesn't look good. They managed to beat their own case count AND hospitalization stats after the vaccine became available.


----------



## Runs For Fun

fooferdoggie said:


> Ohio hold my beer.
> House Bill 248, also named the Vaccine Choice and Anti-Discrimination Act, prohibits virtually everybody from requiring a vaccine, even employers such as hospitals, and forbids "discriminatory treatment" based on vaccination status. It also requires schools to notify parents that children can be exempted from vaccines.
> 
> The legislation applies to all vaccines, not just COVID-19 shots.
> 
> Sponsored by Rep. Jennifer Gross, R-West Chester Township, the bill attracted national headlines after Dr. Sherri Tenpenny falsely claimed in a June hearing that COVID-19 vaccines cause magnetism.
> 
> Videos of her speaking went viral, and the widespread attention "wounded" the bill's chances, Lipps had said. But that didn't mean the bill was dead.
> 
> "We will still put it through its paces. We want to hear opponent testimony and we want to see what amendments the bill sponsor presents," Lipps said in a June interview.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As more require COVID-19 vaccine, Ohio lawmakers move up debate on 'vaccine choice' bill
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com



FFS I hate this state sometimes.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

I am amazed by my cousins stance on Covid and that of her husband. They’ve always come across as such educated people but since the pandemic they have promoted anti mask and anti vax messages all over their social media. It’s like they have taken it on as some kind of mission to convert everybody to believe Covid is not as harmful as the worlds governments are trying to portray. My cousin is severely asthmatic, yet has declined the vaccine and is prepared to have a shouting match every time she enters a shop if anybody dares to ask her to wear a mask. Non of our family have liked any of her posts and my aunts have been polite by saying they don’t agree with her views and don’t wish to discuss it from fear of falling out with her.

She’s made it clear she won’t be attending any future family events as the family are betraying her by not sharing her views. My wife shared one of her school friends posts regarding her father who died of Covid a few weeks back and he was anti vax. He admitted on his death bed he regretted not having the vaccine. However my cousin commented on this shared post suggesting it was ‘fake news’ and ‘this is what the government want us to believe’. My wife had to remove the post before her friend saw it!! Awkward and embarrassing as hell! 

Anybody else had a family member go completely mad during the pandemic and be a complete bellend about it??


----------



## fooferdoggie

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I am amazed by my cousins stance on Covid and that of her husband. They’ve always come across as such educated people but since the pandemic they have promoted anti mask and anti vax messages all over their social media. It’s like they have taken it on as some kind of mission to convert everybody to believe Covid is not as harmful as the worlds governments are trying to portray. My cousin is severely asthmatic, yet has declined the vaccine and is prepared to have a shouting match every time she enters a shop if anybody dares to ask her to wear a mask. Non of our family have liked any of her posts and my aunts have been polite by saying they don’t agree with her views and don’t wish to discuss it from fear of falling out with her.
> 
> 
> Anybody else had a family member go completely mad during the pandemic and be a complete bellend about it??



I have a couple not really nutjobs but still. I aam going to start asking such people if they are going to use their sources for info for all of their medical advice and needs now. I mean your using them for vaccination medical advice so why would you not use them for all of your medical advice?


----------



## MEJHarrison

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I am amazed by my cousins stance on Covid and that of her husband.




My mom, who is in her '70s and diabetic, claims her doctor told her she had it in 2019 and if she didn't want a vaccine, she shouldn't get one.  Then she got Covid the day before Mother's Day from my unvaccinated brother-in-law.  My sister was only vaccinated because she works for the school and probably wouldn't have been vaccinated otherwise.  And it didn't hit her, her husband or my brother-in-law hard.  "Like a cold" she says.  Can't argue with firsthand experience.  You can't convince someone who went through it that it could have been worse.  Her own brother died of Covid days before Christmas, but it seems the Covid she had was no big deal.  They were all fine.

We had visited her the day after she caught it and I didn't know till 10 days later when my brother told me.  Thankfully I was vaccinated.  Otherwise I probably wouldn't have known until I got sick and wouldn't have even known from where.

She's visiting people in Vermont right now.  She was telling me how good the Covid numbers are there.  I pointed out Vermont is the most vaccinated state.  I can't tell if I'm getting through or if she's just dropping it because she doesn't want to argue about it.  I give her my thoughts and let it go.  

I don't even try with my sister.  She was fighting to get the kids back into the schools from day 1.  The distance between our two points of view is so large that there are no effective means of communication.  We'd just be standing on different mountains shouting back and forth and not really hearing the other person.  Needless to say, we also had differing opinions on who the president should be.

Family can be especially frustrating.


----------



## JayMysteri0

_Courtesy of the Twitterati _


----------



## JayMysteri0

MURICA!  F- YEAH!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1425177666072858634/


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> _Courtesy of the Twitterati _





Heh, that definitely reminds me of the joke about the farmer who charged $50 to haul yuppies' cars out of trouble in the form of a pretty deep hole in the dirt road, a thing that just looked like a big puddle.  So one day some guy shelled out for the service but then cracked wise about how the farmer must be way rich if he's doing that all day and night... . and the farmer said, nah, at night, see that's when I have to fill the hole back up with water.


----------



## Thomas Veil

fooferdoggie said:


> Ohio hold my beer.
> House Bill 248, also named the Vaccine Choice and Anti-Discrimination Act, prohibits virtually everybody from requiring a vaccine, even employers such as hospitals, and forbids "discriminatory treatment" based on vaccination status. It also requires schools to notify parents that children can be exempted from vaccines.
> 
> The legislation applies to all vaccines, not just COVID-19 shots.
> 
> Sponsored by Rep. Jennifer Gross, R-West Chester Township, the bill attracted national headlines after Dr. Sherri Tenpenny falsely claimed in a June hearing that COVID-19 vaccines cause magnetism.
> 
> Videos of her speaking went viral, and the widespread attention "wounded" the bill's chances, Lipps had said. But that didn't mean the bill was dead.
> 
> "We will still put it through its paces. We want to hear opponent testimony and we want to see what amendments the bill sponsor presents," Lipps said in a June interview.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As more require COVID-19 vaccine, Ohio lawmakers move up debate on 'vaccine choice' bill
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com




I saw that and was relieved to see that Gov. DeWine has threatened to veto it.

DeWine ain't the brightest bulb, but there's been a few occasions like this one where he's kept us from turning into Ohiostan.


----------



## User.191

I Am Legend screenwriter dismisses anti-vax claims based on film's plot
					

A sci-fi writer hits back at unfounded rumours that Covid jabs turn people into zombies.



					www.bbc.com
				




What in the actual fuck? These people are so fucking insane, they're now using fictional plot devices as facts.

Not sure if there's a treatment for this level of stupid. How do these people even get up in the morning?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Remember these people also think Trump is a respected successful businessman.  No logical leap is too far from that baseline.


----------



## User.191

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Remember these people also think Trump is a respected successful businessman.  No logical leap is too far from that baseline.



I know, but still... I mean...I...Er...

This is beyond stupid. This surely qualifies as "removal of the vote" stupid. If your tiny insignificant brain can't handle the basic difference between a Hollywood blockbuster and real life, then you are in dire need of severe psychological help.


----------



## Yoused

umm,
*During an interview with Fox News’ host Dan Bongino … the former president claimed that he’d be dragged by critics if the COVID-19 “attack,” like the one happening now, happened on his watch.

Umm, da fuq?

Is the hair dye leaking into his brain? Does untreated syphilis cause delusion? Is the president losing what little bit of brain he has left?*​
Yeah, I am going to go with the syphilis theory. With, maybe, a bit of Alzheimer's thrown into the already crowded mix.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yeah, I mentioned this in the covid stupid thread, because it was trending all afternoon yesterday.

It's one thing to get shit wrong, but to get shit wrong involving a film, the movie geeks were all over clowning the people spreading this.


----------



## User.191

JayMysteri0 said:


> Yeah, I mentioned this in the covid stupid thread, because it was trending all afternoon yesterday.
> 
> It's one thing to get shit wrong, but to get shit wrong involving a film, the movie geeks were all over clowning the people spreading this.



Sorry, didn't notice! I've asked Eric to (try and please don't nuke) merge this to the other thread...


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

MissNomer said:


> I know, but still... I mean...I...Er...
> 
> This is beyond stupid. This surely qualifies as "removal of the vote" stupid. If your tiny insignificant brain can't handle the basic difference between a Hollywood blockbuster and real life, then you are in dire need of severe psychological help.




We used to toss mentally ill people in prison.  Now we just assign them a leader who they vote into office.


----------



## JayMysteri0

MissNomer said:


> Sorry, didn't notice! I've asked Eric to (try and please don't nuke) merge this to the other thread...



I don't think it needs to be merged.

I personally am too lazy to start new threads, so I've just tossed any stupidity Covid related into that thread.

That thread stood out, since friends were easily aware of the stupidity behind it.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## Thomas Veil

There’s no way to say this nicely.

Abbott and DeSantis are killing people.


----------



## GermanSuplex

This whole thing is madness. Desantis especially, how does this nimrod sleep at night? This death cult is just that. The right dig their heels in on a position on a subject early - usually the opposite of what Democrats do, even if it’s forehead-slapping simple and obvious - and refuse to relent, ever, no matter how obvious it is they’re wrong.

Without facts, they just tailor their argument around anything they can think up. Desantis not enforcing mask mandates is one thing, but punishing schools and employees who do is an entirely different issue. Then again, these are the same people who want to outlaw handing a bottle of water to a voter waiting in line.

You just can’t win with these folks. If every  unvaccinated person in Florida dropped dead, Desantis would just say it’s proof masks don’t work and the “democrat shutdowns of 2020” didn’t work. If the deaths went down through no help of himself, he’d claim success.

The same people who think humping a flag makes you patriotic don’t think protecting each other during a pandemic is patriotic. The same people who shovel McDonald’s and Coke down are worried about a vaccine. I couldn’t wear a hat in school. Not even a plain one with a Nike logo. Girls couldn’t wear daisy dukes or show too much cleavage. Many of the same people whining about masks probably would throw a fit if their schools allowed kids to wear that stuff.

I 100% agree that someone whining about their freedom who isn’t vaccinated shouldn’t get a hospital bed over someone who ends up in the hospital for more traditional reasons.

Anyways…


----------



## JayMysteri0

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaa?  You mean this kind of thing has been done before?  Well....

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1425277645760221184/

What do those 'elites' in the medical field know about immigrants?  They don't even know about science.




Also throw in a "this is why we can't have nice things" as well...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1425273932643459083/


----------



## Runs For Fun

This person is literally the devil 








						German nurse swaps vaccine for saline, 9,000 people need new shots
					

A German nurse dropped a vial of COVID-19 vaccine in April and replaced the doses with saline. Now, nearly 9,000 people have to get the shot again.



					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> The otherwise terribly designed DANMASK study was indicative of one thing. The effect size of universal masking is low enough for it to not make much of a difference if there is a low case count.* I think CDC also takes into account demoralization and tries to keep mask mandates to when it will have the biggest impact.*
> 
> 
> FL doesn't look good. They managed to beat their own case count AND hospitalization stats after the vaccine became available.
> View attachment 7817




I seem to recall one of their spokesperson's stating something to that effect. Note that my objection to the other post centers on trying to predict the present in alternate realities. Even if everyone strictly adhered to CDC guidelines in every situation, their recommendations would still be conditioned on the latest available data. Regarding Florida, it has a combination of old people and people hostile to vaccines and any curtailing of social interaction. If covid infections remain a problem for them long enough to make people want to live there even less, it is going to really hurt their economy. They have a lot of old people, who could start to avoid it as a cost effective retirement destination, and younger people may look for prospects elsewhere, given perceived risks.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

MissNomer said:


> I Am Legend screenwriter dismisses anti-vax claims based on film's plot
> 
> 
> A sci-fi writer hits back at unfounded rumours that Covid jabs turn people into zombies.
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbc.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What in the actual fuck? These people are so fucking insane, they're now using fictional plot devices as facts.
> 
> Not sure if there's a treatment for this level of stupid. How do these people even get up in the morning?




I saw this article shared elsewhere and found it hilarious lol. 





My personal favourite response to this article 





The good old British sense of humour lol.


----------



## Thomas Veil

There are actually two alien races among us that you have to watch out for: the bichons and the goldendoodles. They’re in cahoots.


----------



## Roller

The anti-vaxxers can rant all they want. They can quote scientific studies they have no ability to evaluate or understand. They can parrot lies from despicable politicians like Rand Paul or clergy who tell them God will take care of them. But what will they say or do when they or a family member can't get an ICU bed for COVID or an unrelated condition or can't even be seen  in the ER because their preferred hospital is on diversion? That's already happening in many southern states, and it will only get worse. You can say it's their choice, but they're harming the rest of us, including their own children in many cases.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Roller said:


> The anti-vaxxers can rant all they want. They can quote scientific studies they have no ability to evaluate or understand. They can parrot lies from despicable politicians like Rand Paul or clergy who tell them God will take care of them. But what will they say or do when they or a family member can't get an ICU bed for COVID or an unrelated condition or can't even be seen  in the ER because their preferred hospital is on diversion? That's already happening in many southern states, and it will only get worse. You can say it's their choice, but they're harming the rest of us, including their own children in many cases.



I don’t think they care. It’s God’s will, you know.

(Thereby proving Mark Twain’s statement that God is a malign thug.)

Found this today, too. *Sigh.* ‘Twas ever thus.



> One anti-vaccination pamphlet read “Stop!! People Driven Like Dumb Animals To The Shambles.” Some religious groups called the smallpox shot the biblical “mark of the beast” — the same claim being made by conspiracy theorists about the coronavirus vaccines on the social networks of some Christian groups.



This was in _1885_.



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/history/2021/08/10/montreal-vaccine-riot-smallpox/


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> The anti-vaxxers can rant all they want. They can quote scientific studies they have no ability to evaluate or understand. They can parrot lies from despicable politicians like Rand Paul or clergy who tell them God will take care of them. But what will they say or do when they or a family member can't get an ICU bed for COVID or an unrelated condition or can't even be seen  in the ER because their preferred hospital is on diversion? That's already happening in many southern states, and it will only get worse. You can say it's their choice, but they're harming the rest of us, including their own children in many cases.



Here is a doctor’s response to that behavior… This doctor notes that these people reject medical science… until they become ill and then want doctors to use it to save their lives.









						Vaccine Refusers Risk Compassion Fatigue
					

After the horrors that health-care workers have endured during the pandemic, many are struggling to sympathize with people who won’t protect themselves.




					www.theatlantic.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

BERLIN (Reuters) - Authorities in northern Germany appealed to thousands of people on Tuesday to get another shot of COVID-19 vaccine after a police investigation found that a Red Cross nurse may have injected them with a saline solution.

The nurse is suspected of injecting salt solution into people's arms instead of genuine doses at a vaccination centre in Friesland - a rural district near the North Sea coast - in the early spring.

"I am totally shocked by this episode," Sven Ambrosy, a local councillor, said on Facebook as local authorities issued the call to around 8,600 residents who may have been affected.








						Suspected saline switch sparks vaccine stir in Germany
					

Authorities in northern Germany appealed to thousands of people on Tuesday to get another shot of COVID-19 vaccine after a police investigation found that a Red Cross nurse may have injected them with a saline solution.  The nurse is suspected of injecting salt solution into people's arms...




					www.yahoo.com


----------



## Thomas Veil

SuperMatt said:


> This doctor notes that these people reject medical science… until they become ill and then want doctors to use it to save their lives.



It would be so easy to agree with this guy.


----------



## thekev

Thomas Veil said:


> It would be so easy to agree with this guy.
> 
> View attachment 7853​




I'm kind of surprised Netflix hasn't rebooted that one.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Many have already made the comparison about all the sacrifices that citizens had to make during WWII and these pussies can’t even put on a mask or get a shot, but on Trae Crowder’s recent YouTube rant he said imagine going up to an earlier settler with their wagons full of disease dead and telling them a couple hundred years in the future we figured out how to prevent something like that by wearing a mask and getting a shot but half the country refused to do it.


----------



## Thomas Veil

I checked my notifications and for a moment my brain read this as if it were a movie title: “Covid, Stupid, Love”.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Thomas Veil said:


> There’s no way to say this nicely.
> 
> Abbott and DeSantis are killing people.




If Mel Brooks made the Abbott and DeSantis movie, during their press conferences there’d be an endless parade of sheet-covered bodies swarming with flies being wheeled across on gurneys in the background.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Tom Hanks must be embarrassed to have an idiot for a son.









						Chet Hanks rants against vaccines despite parents' Covid-19 battles
					

Chet Hanks has posted a rant against coronavirus vaccines and told sufferers of the virus to "get over it," a year after his parents, Tom Hanks and Rita Wilson, were hospitalized with severe cases of Covid-19.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

'We will find you': Tennessee parents protest school mask mandate; people in masks heckled
					

A man was recorded on video following a person to a car, saying, "You'll never be allowed in public again."




					www.nbcnews.com
				




This over wearing a mask.   Words. Fail.


----------



## Thomas Veil

That is fucking insane. These people care less about their kids’ health than they do about…

…what exactly was their point again?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Thomas Veil said:


> That is fucking insane. These people care less about their kids’ health than they do about…
> 
> …what exactly was their point again?




No clue.  They might have had one during economic shutdowns, but now they have nothing other than being stuck on tilt.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Massive walkout at University of Missouri Health after COVID vaccine is declared mandatory. All six of them










						Six MU Health Care workers walk out to protest vaccine mandate
					

The handful of employees walked off their jobs Wednesday as part of a national protest called #WalkOutWednesday.




					www.columbiamissourian.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I’ve had it with Republican politicians running cover with their personal responsibility over government mandates bullshit. Point me to any right-wing protest where they’re all masked up while chanting “choosing to wear a mask!”. These people are mentally deranged. You don’t further fuel their delusions creating a public safety hazard and then tell everybody else not to worry about it.

To put it in terms they can understand, this isn’t everybody having a gun pointed to their own head with the personal responsibility to not pull the trigger. This is everybody wildly waving their gun in all directions with no control of when the trigger goes off. If this was an active school shooting these people would be blocking the police from entering the scene while saying it’s the students’ personal responsibility to stay out of the line of fire.


----------



## Eric

Meanwhile, in Science Hill, KY... (yes, you can't make this sort of irony up)


----------



## Thomas Veil

Yes, that’s funny, but it’s also so pathetic. These geniuses can’t even spell. Their kids are probably smarter than they are.


----------



## Pumbaa

Thomas Veil said:


> Yes, that’s funny, but it’s also so pathetic. These geniuses can’t even spell. Their kids are probably smarter than they are.



Yes, they kids are way smarter. That’s probably why the geniuses are trying to kill them.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> Meanwhile, in Science Hill, KY... (yes, you can't make this sort of irony up)
> 
> View attachment 7890




My mom told me she read something on the internet posted by somebody in Germany that said “It’s really sad that so many intelligent Americans are surrounded by so many idiots.”


----------



## Huntn

Here is good reason why this thread was created, when El Stupido can’t even keep the plot line of a movie straight as an excuse not to get vaccinated:   

Fact check: A vaccine did not turn characters in the movie ‘I Am Legend’ into zombies​








						Fact check: A vaccine did not turn characters in the movie ‘I Am Legend’ into zombies
					

Social media users have been sharing content online that claims characters in the movie “I Am Legend” starring actor Will Smith turned into zombies because of a vaccine. This claim is false.




					www.reuters.com


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> Meanwhile, in Science Hill, KY... (yes, you can't make this sort of irony up)
> 
> View attachment 7890



Is that the new Southern English lingo? (_are choice)_ I might know about that.


----------



## SuperMatt

This data is visualized in a way that shows how linked Trump voters are to vaccine refusal.





__





						U.S. #COVID19 vaccination levels by county OVER TIME
					

As regular readers know, I've become a bit obsessive over tracking COVID-19 vaccination rates at both the state and county levels over the past month or so. I post the daily rate levels daily on Twitter, and once a week I've been updating the county-level vaxx rates here at ACA Signups. I've...




					acasignups.net
				




It’s pretty astonishing. People care about politics more than their own health? WTF?


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> This data is visualized in a way that shows how linked Trump voters are to vaccine refusal.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. #COVID19 vaccination levels by county OVER TIME
> 
> 
> As regular readers know, I've become a bit obsessive over tracking COVID-19 vaccination rates at both the state and county levels over the past month or so. I post the daily rate levels daily on Twitter, and once a week I've been updating the county-level vaxx rates here at ACA Signups. I've...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> acasignups.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It’s pretty astonishing. People care about politics more than their own health? WTF?





​
POLITICALLY… STUPID = COVID… STUPID
Cheerleading for failure based on the Koolaid of SUPREME CORRUPT AND MENTALLY ILL STUPID.

​Is it possible this movement lives on it’s own stupidity and Trump and the corrupt hangers-on just got them to think it normal to reveal their true state?
​


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

It seems like DeSantis is doing his best to torpedo his chances of a presidential win. I think a lot of people, regardless of political leanings, are looking at Florida in horror as DeSantis completely ignores the reality around him while actively blocking efforts to improve conditions and punishing those who attempt to. A real leader adjusts as conditions change. They don’t paint themselves into a corner and refuse to right the ship. Honestly, what he is doing is a complete dereliction of duty.  "Just let shit happen" is pretty much the exact opposite of what government is there for.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> It seems like DeSantis is doing his best to torpedo his chances of a presidential win. I think a lot of people, regardless of political leanings, are looking at Florida in horror as DeSantis completely ignores the reality around him while actively blocking efforts to improve conditions and punishing those who attempt to. A real leader adjusts as conditions change. They don’t paint themselves into a corner and refuse to right the ship. Honestly, what he is doing is a complete dereliction of duty.  "Just let shit happen" is pretty much the exact opposite of what government is there for.



hey he is just channeling trump give the guy a break.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

fooferdoggie said:


> hey he is just channeling trump give the guy a break.




And Trump's Covid response wasn't exactly the crown jewel of his accomplishments.

It's like DeSantis went "What lost Trump the presidency?  Let's do that."


----------



## Renzatic

Thomas Veil said:


> That is fucking insane. These people care less about their kids’ health than they do about…
> 
> …what exactly was their point again?




...freedom!


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Taken from a Salon article about how anti-vaxxers are taking away everybody else's freedom


In Texas, Republican leadership and right-wing ideology has led to low vaccination rates and subsequently to hospitals overflowing with COVID-19 patients. Gov. Greg Abbott, being a Republican, refuses to do anything to mitigate the spread of the disease. So instead, he's leaning on hospitals to deprive other people of necessary medical care, such as delaying surgeries, to keep hospital resources free to tend to the waves of unvaccinated COVID-19 patients. However angry I am at losing my gym class (also important for physical health, I'll point out), it likely pales in comparison to the rage of someone who has to put off surgery to fix a debilitating but not fatal condition, all because some Fox News junkie thought a quick jab in the arm takes away his "freedom". Not being able to walk because your knee surgery keeps getting delayed is the far greater loss of freedom.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Taken from a Salon article about how anti-vaxxers are taking away everybody else's freedom
> 
> 
> In Texas, Republican leadership and right-wing ideology has led to low vaccination rates and subsequently to hospitals overflowing with COVID-19 patients. Gov. Greg Abbott, being a Republican, refuses to do anything to mitigate the spread of the disease. So instead, he's leaning on hospitals to deprive other people of necessary medical care, such as delaying surgeries, to keep hospital resources free to tend to the waves of unvaccinated COVID-19 patients. However angry I am at losing my gym class (also important for physical health, I'll point out), it likely pales in comparison to the rage of someone who has to put off surgery to fix a debilitating but not fatal condition, all because some Fox News junkie thought a quick jab in the arm takes away his "freedom". Not being able to walk because your knee surgery keeps getting delayed is the far greater loss of freedom.



And now he is asking medical professionals to come in from out-of-state to help.…

”Hello, fire department? I intentionally set my house on fire. Could you please come and put it out?”


----------



## Thomas Veil

And DeSantis wants to treat victims with monoclonal antibodies.

I can’t think of a more classic example of locking the barn door after the horse is gone.

The man is an absolute imbecile.


----------



## Yoused

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> It's like DeSantis went "What lost Trump the presidency? Let's do that."



Human cost notwithstanding, something that might cause that guy to stop being governor, there is that for an upside.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Well this is somewhat shocking.  









						Hugely Popular Anti-Vaxx Misinformation Website Is Just Some Lady in Piedmont
					

Vaccine misinformation hotbed OpenVAERS is one of the leading sources of bad info about COVID vaccines on the internet, and an investigation finds that it’s run by some woman in the Oakland-surrounded suburb of Piedmont with too much time on her hands.




					sfist.com
				




Not a big fan of doxing, but in this case….


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> 'We will find you': Tennessee parents protest school mask mandate; people in masks heckled
> 
> 
> A man was recorded on video following a person to a car, saying, "You'll never be allowed in public again."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This over wearing a mask.   Words. Fail.


----------



## Alli

Couldn’t decide whether it went here or in the Florida thread:









						3 Broward County, Florida, educators died within about 24 hours from Covid-19 complications — CNN
					

The week before classes begin, three educators in Broward County, Florida, have died within about 24 hours of each other from Covid-19 related complications, local education officials said.




					apple.news


----------



## fooferdoggie

for once not stupid.


How two women helped 94% of an Alabama town get COVID vaccines​








						How two women helped 94% of an Alabama town get COVID vaccines
					

The two women went door to door to encourage their neighbors to get vaccinated.




					www.al.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Parent attacks teacher after mask dispute on first day of school in California district, official says
					

The teacher suffered "lacerations on his face, some bruising on his a face and a pretty good knot on the back of his head," the Amador County Unified School District superintendent said.




					www.nbcnews.com
				




These people are seriously mentally ill and a public safety danger.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

fooferdoggie said:


> hey he is just channeling trump give the guy a break.




This is a Trump move.  









						Florida's DeSantis concedes he can't actually cut the salaries of school officials who issue mask requirements
					





					theweek.com
				




Threaten to do something you don’t have the power to do.  Worry/whine about it later.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Parent attacks teacher after mask dispute on first day of school in California district, official says
> 
> 
> The teacher suffered "lacerations on his face, some bruising on his a face and a pretty good knot on the back of his head," the Amador County Unified School District superintendent said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These people are seriously mentally ill and a public safety danger.



Prosecute that person for felony assault. Throw the book at them.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> Prosecute that person for felony assault. Throw the book at them.



Should throwing the book at them fail, try throwing a heavy book at them. If schools still got any of those.


----------



## SuperMatt

Pumbaa said:


> Should throwing the book at them fail, try throwing a heavy book at them. If schools still got any of those.



Maybe an iPad or Chromebook...


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> Maybe an iPad or Chromebook...



That could work. If Apple keeps making their products thinner and thinner, the iPad could soon make a passable guillotine. Replace Oddjob’s hat with an iPad Air.


----------



## Pumbaa

Sigh. Local news. So far 106 confirmed cases of covid-19 after a fucking tantra festival (around 500 participants) about two weeks ago. More cases expected to follow.

The stupid. It hurts.

Edit: Norway apparently closing the border to that region. Can’t blame them.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426052914255106049/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426052914255106049/



“We will not comply"
“I can’t breate” (spelled as they spell it)

Aren’t these the same folks who told every black person who was injured or killed by police they should have complied and stop complaining? Now that they are the ones who (supposedly) can’t breathe, they don’t need to comply though.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426052914255106049/




I think, she thinks, she totally won that round.  That and "plandemic" were the two highlights for me.

For her presentation skills, I'm going to give her a B+.  She held it together very well.  Didn't scream.  Came prepared.  Fairly light on the word salad in comparison to some I've seen.  I would have gone A-, but the reading off the phone could have been a bit more subtle and less awkward.

For her content, well... I don't think Smurfs on LSD could come up with a more entertaining speech.  That's just whack-a-doodle-do right there.

Imagine the irony if the state has to come in and take the kids after she dies from a non-existent virus.


----------



## Renzatic

I don't know whether I should laugh or cry here...


----------



## Renzatic

Keep in mind that I'm the one making the exaggerated comparison here. I'm just surprised people actually agree with it.


----------



## SuperMatt

Somebody makes the obvious financial argument for getting the vaccine:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1424046360798580742/


----------



## Runs For Fun

Just when you think she has said the craziest thing you’ve ever heard, something even crazier comes out of her mouth 

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/p3u8z3


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> Just when you think she has said the craziest thing you’ve ever heard, something even crazier comes out of her mouth
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/p3u8z3



if she has children she is experimenting on them.


----------



## Yoused

The Houthi rebels who control much of Yemen have it under control, using a tool more powerful than any vaccine: "_there is no virus._"


----------



## Thomas Veil

'This is starting to look really ominous in the South,' expert says, as US is among nations with highest rate of new Covid-19 cases
					

The US remains among nations with the highest rate of new Covid-19 cases, driven mostly by a surge in the South, where many states are lagging in getting people vaccinated against the coronavirus.




					www.cnn.com
				






> "This is starting to look really ominous in the South. ... If you look at rates of transmission in Florida and Louisiana, *they're actually probably the highest in the world*," Dr. Peter Hotez, the dean of the National School of Tropical Medicine at Baylor College of Medicine, told CNN's Anderson Cooper on Friday.




USA! USA!


----------



## Alli

Last night on Maddow they did a lengthy segment on Mississippi. Keep in mind that we’re so close my husband worked in MS for 44 years and commuting daily. I already have one friend (in MS), who despite being vaccinated was diagnosed two weeks ago with Covid and immediately given monoclonal antibody therapy. She’s been fine, thank goodness.

They have just completed building a new parking lot wing of the main hospital in Jackson that they will use partly to house patients, but more importantly to treat the diagnosed with monoclonal antibody therapy. Smart.

There are almost no hospital beds left anywhere from Florida to Texas.


----------



## fooferdoggie

GOP Aide Admits To Journalist Why They're Letting People Die​








						GOP Aide Admits To Journalist Why They're Letting People Die
					

Yes, it really is a strategy.




					crooksandliars.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

A parent sent their child to school after a positive Covid-19 test. More than 80 students may have been exposed, officials say​








						A parent sent their child to school after a positive Covid-19 test. More than 80 students may have been exposed, officials say | CNN
					

More than 80 students were potentially exposed to Covid-19 on the first day of class in Reno, Nevada, on Monday after a parent sent their child to Marce Herz Middle School, despite both the parent and child receiving a positive Covid-19 test just two days earlier, Washoe County Health District...




					www.cnn.com


----------



## Alli

fooferdoggie said:


> GOP Aide Admits To Journalist Why They're Letting People Die​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GOP Aide Admits To Journalist Why They're Letting People Die
> 
> 
> Yes, it really is a strategy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> crooksandliars.com



They always say the quiet part out loud.


----------



## SuperMatt

How many deaths will it take to wake people up?


----------



## Thomas Veil

fooferdoggie said:


> GOP Aide Admits To Journalist Why They're Letting People Die​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GOP Aide Admits To Journalist Why They're Letting People Die
> 
> 
> Yes, it really is a strategy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> crooksandliars.com



At first I was inclined to regard that as partisan BS, but the more I read it the more it rang true.

If that’s the case, however, it’s not working. From what I understand, DeSantis’s approval rating is going down in Florida.

That’s not to say it’s hurting him nationally, however. I’ve given up thinking there’s any sort of thought behind Republican politics beyond “let’s own the libs.”


----------



## fooferdoggie

Parent attacks teacher after mask dispute on first day of school in California district, official says​








						Parent attacks teacher after mask dispute on first day of school in California district, official says
					

The teacher suffered "lacerations on his face, some bruising on his a face and a pretty good knot on the back of his head," the Amador County Unified School District superintendent said.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Get vaccinated or lose your job. These people choose unemployment over getting 2 life-saving shots.



> Her girlfriend, Katie Hart, a certified family nurse practitioner at Valley Health’s urgent care facility in Martinsburg, W.Va, said they might be more willing to consider the shot if they didn’t feel coerced.
> Now, though, they were willing to lose their livelihoods if that’s what refusing the vaccine would mean. Hart said they would not budge. “This is the hill to die on,” she said.






			https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/vaccine-mandate-nurses-virginia-covid/2021/08/13/493c906a-fad3-11eb-9c0e-97e29906a970_story.html?%20va._1
		


Feeling “coerced” is more important than your life. These idiots may literally die on this hill. Some of the signs say “my body my choice” - I bet you they oppose abortion though. If the virus mutated into a variant that killed 90% of the unvaccinated, would 90% of the Republican voters in America die?


----------



## Thomas Veil

With pride.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> Get vaccinated or lose your job. These people choose unemployment over getting 2 life-saving shots.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/vaccine-mandate-nurses-virginia-covid/2021/08/13/493c906a-fad3-11eb-9c0e-97e29906a970_story.html?%20va._1
> 
> 
> 
> Feeling “coerced” is more important than your life. These idiots may literally die on this hill. Some of the signs say “my body my choice” - I bet you they oppose abortion though. If the virus mutated into a variant that killed 90% of the unvaccinated, would 90% of the Republican voters in America die?



The point I think is missed by many of these individuals who are in the health / care field is the optics.

How are the people who they are entrusted with to care for, supposed to trust THEM?



> An unvaccinated worker set off an outbreak at a U.S. nursing home where most residents were immunized. (Published 2021)
> 
> 
> New infections of inoculated residents are occurring, signaling the need to maintain safety measures, C.D.C. studies show.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com






> Unvaccinated staff eyed in rising nursing home cases, deaths
> 
> 
> WASHINGTON (AP) — Lagging vaccination rates among nursing home staff are being linked to a national increase in COVID-19 infections and deaths at senior facilities, and are at the center of a federal investigation in a hard-hit Colorado location where disease detectives found many workers were...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apnews.com





> WASHINGTON (AP) — Lagging vaccination rates among nursing home staff are being linked to a national increase in COVID-19 infections and deaths at senior facilities, and are at the center of a federal investigation in a hard-hit Colorado location where disease detectives found many workers were not inoculated.
> 
> The investigation by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention of facilities in the Grand Junction, Colorado, area raises concerns among public health doctors that successes in protecting vulnerable elders with vaccines could be in peril as the more aggressive delta variant spreads across the country.
> 
> Nationally about 59% of nursing home staff have gotten their shots, about the same as the overall percentage of fully vaccinated adults — but significantly lower than the roughly 80% of residents who are vaccinated, according to Medicare. And some states have much lower vaccination rates of around 40%.
> 
> Some policy experts are urging the government to close the gap by requiring nursing home staffers get shots, a mandate the Biden administration has been reluctant to issue. Nursing home operators fear such a move could backfire, prompting many staffers with vaccine qualms to simply quit their jobs.
> 
> To be sure, the vast majority of fully vaccinated people who become infected with the delta variant suffer only mild symptoms.
> 
> But “older adults may not respond fully to the vaccine and there’s enormous risk of someone coming in with the virus,” said Dr. Joshua Sharfstein, vice dean for public health practice at Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health.




Forgetting the very appalling concept that health care workers are infecting people who DID get the vaccine & make them sick.  From a complete selfish standpoint of the facilities, they CANNOT afford to lose anymore workers.  The workers they have, have been working under stressful conditions, and there isn't some long line to replace them should they go down to Covid.  Does a health care facility want to be known as the source of an outbreak?  There are just some professions where some things should be considered a given.  IF these same workers have said previously they don't get flu, measles, polio, or whatever vaccines to their employers, do we think they'd still be employed?

Or is this resistance a specifically NEW thing they've decided to adopt?

It's so bizarre that some think getting a vaccine that hopefully protect them & THOSE they care for, is a 'hill to die for'.


----------



## JayMysteri0

And...







> Four Broward County educators die from COVID-19 within 24 hours, as Florida's battle over masks in schools continues
> 
> 
> This week Broward County school officials pushed back against Governor DeSantis' ban on mask mandates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com





> Four educators in Broward County, Florida, died from COVID-19 in a span of 24 hours, as school officials continue to push back against Governor Ron DeSantis' ban on mask mandates in schools. At least three of the teachers who died were unvaccinated, CBS Miami reports.
> 
> "Within a 24-hour span, we had an assistant teacher pass away, a teacher at her school pass away, an elementary teacher pass away and another teacher at a high school," Broward Teachers Union president Anna Fusco told CBS Miami.
> 
> The news comes just days after Broward County's school board pushed back against DeSantis' order, voting 8 to 1 to require students to wear masks in school, arguing that the decision would keep students and teachers safe. Under the new rules, students and staff with legitimate concerns or health issues can opt out.
> 
> DeSantis' order, signed into effect on July 30, was framed as a way to "protect parents' freedom to choose," and threatened school officials who enforced mask mandates with a loss of funding and withheld pay.
> 
> The American Academy of Pediatrics and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recommend that K-12 students and staff returning for in-person learning should wear masks as part of a "layered prevention strategy," especially since children under 12 do not yet qualify for vaccination.
> 
> Fusco said the news of the teachers' deaths was "extremely frightening," but sadly too common. "I hear this every day. Whether in Broward or elsewhere," she said.
> 
> As schools around the country prepare for students to fill the halls again, Fusco said she's grateful for the county school board's decision.
> 
> "We got a little bit of relief, keeping mask protocols, hand sanitizer, extra sanitizing," she told CBS Miami.
> 
> With the Delta variant surging through the U.S., especially in the South, Florida has been breaking records for new COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Lastly, some of the more horrifying we are dealing with...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426543777947267075/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426571369567989769/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426581484173922304/


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> Feeling “coerced” is more important than your life. These idiots may literally die on this hill. Some of the signs say “my body my choice” - I bet you they oppose abortion though. If the virus mutated into a variant that killed 90% of the unvaccinated, would 90% of the Republican voters in America die?



she had plenty of time to do it before she was forced. but hey being homeless is so much better.


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> If the virus mutated into a variant that killed 90% of the unvaccinated, would 90% of the Republican voters in America die?



Seems likely. They would die martyrs to the cause (ignorance and stupidity), which grows ever strongerweaker with each act of suicide.


----------



## JayMysteri0

This kind of falls under not just covid stupidity, but lingering stupidity we've long had



> Brawls break out at Los Angeles protest against COVID vaccination "tyranny"
> 
> 
> One male was treated by the Los Angeles Fire Department after being stabbed amid the violence, according to police.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com





> iolent brawls broke out at a planned protest against COVID-19 vaccine mandates and passports in downtown Los Angeles on Saturday, with one person stabbed, according to police.
> 
> Hundreds of protesters reportedly gathered outside Los Angeles City Hall from 2 p.m. for the "choose freedom march" to demand an end to "medical tyranny, mandatory vaccinations and vaccine passports," according to Fox 11.
> 
> They were met by dozens of counterprotesters gathered at the same location for a demonstration that organizers called "no safe space for fascists," according to fliers advertising the counterprotest.
> 
> The Los Angeles Police Department arrived at the scene in the afternoon after several fights broke out between the protesters and counterprotesters. No arrests have been made but officials are still investigating the incident.




Once again, it's amazing for who & when police will heavily & quickly mobilize.  If the letters B, L, or M had been involved there would have been a heavily armored presence lined up 2 days before.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426664945362423813/

What a perfect storm anti vaxxers & racists free to roam.  What could possibly go wrong?



> One male was treated by the Los Angeles Fire Department after being stabbed amid the violence, according to police.
> 
> "We are on scene to maintain order after a fight broke out between antifa and people gathered for the permitted event. We are aware of one male that was stabbed and is being treated by Fire Department personnel," said Captain Stacy Spell, an LAPD spokesperson.
> 
> Videos were shared to social media showing dozens of men punching, kicking and throwing each other to the ground. Counterprotesters were dressed in all black, with face coverings, while some anti-vaccine protesters wore apparel referencing former President Donald Trump and the American flag.
> 
> "F*** antifa, f*** antifa," one man can be heard yelling in a video shared by television producer Andrew Kimmel.




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426668517227565057/



> Anti-vaccine mandate protesters also gathered in several other states for planned protests this weekend. Hundreds of protesters gathered at the Oklahoma state Capitol on Saturday for a "Freedom Rally" against vaccine mandates. "I do not want to see us be mandated for masks or vaccines because that is our right to choose what's best for us," one attendee told ABC-5. "So, that's why I'm here. To support freedom to choose."
> 
> There are currently no mandates in any state requiring vaccinations for the general population, but some cities and counties require proof of vaccination from citizens to enter some shops and businesses.
> 
> The Los Angeles City Council voted Wednesday to instruct the city attorney to draft a rule requiring people to show proof for at least one dose of the vaccine to enter indoor public businesses—including bars, restaurants, retail stores, fitness centers and movie theatres.




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426674664298799104/

"We are the enemy"


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> This kind of falls under not just covid stupidity, but lingering stupidity we've long had
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Once again, it's amazing for who & when police will heavily & quickly mobilize.  If the letters B, L, or M had been involved there would have been a heavily armored presence lined up 2 days before.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426664945362423813/
> 
> What a perfect storm anti vaxxers & racists free to roam.  What could possibly go wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426668517227565057/
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426674664298799104/
> 
> "We are the enemy"



Black people marching peacefully - deploy riot gear, tear-gas them without provocation, beat them, arrest as many as possible.

White people forming a mob that is literally beating people up on public streets: Proud boys will be boys!  

If these folks had enough brain cells to plan properly, they could have probably held the Capitol for weeks. After all, nobody would dare use the tactics against them that were used against BLM protestors.


----------



## fooferdoggie

​I don't doubt it at all.​DONALD TRUMP, REMORSELESS ASSHOLE, APPARENTLY WON’T ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO GET VACCINATED BECAUSE IT WOULD BE DOING BIDEN A “FAVOR”​








						Donald Trump, Remorseless Asshole, Apparently Won’t Encourage People to Get Vaccinated Because It Would Be Doing Biden a “Favor”
					

Can’t let that happen.




					www.vanityfair.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Fired Tennessee vaccinations director planning to leave state with her family​
The husband of Tennessee’s former vaccinations director said he and his wife are planning to move out of the state this fall amid growing tension over efforts to combat the Covid-19 pandemic.

Brad Fiscus told NBC News on Saturday that the couple's decision to move to northern Virginia sometime between mid-September and October was initially "precipitated by the actions of the Tennessee Department of Health" to fire his wife, Dr. Michelle Fiscus, this summer amid Republican outrage over her push to inoculate teenagers against Covid-19








						Fired Tennessee vaccinations director planning to leave state with her family
					

Brad Fiscus said he and his wife, Dr. Michelle Fiscus, feel they have to move because public health has become more political in Tennessee during the pandemic.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## Herdfan

When you lose Maureen Dowd............









						Opinion | Behold Barack Antoinette
					

He hated politics. But he loves post-politics.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Yoused

Herdfan said:


> When you lose Maureen Dowd............
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Opinion | Behold Barack Antoinette
> 
> 
> He hated politics. But he loves post-politics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com



That kind of has a paywall – can you summarize/quote the relevant part?


----------



## Herdfan

Yoused said:


> That kind of has a paywall – can you summarize/quote the relevant part?




Sure.

She was saying the Obama's have become elites looking down on the little people.  She referred to him as Obama Antionette because his party was more important than COVID, climate change and voting rights.



> “I think the nouveaux riches Obamas are seriously tone-deaf,” said the authority on opulence, André Leon Talley. “We all love Beyoncé. But people have so many things to worry about with Covid, voting rights, climate warming. People are afraid of being evicted from their homes. And the Obamas are in Marie-Antoinette, tacky, let-them-eat-cake mode. They need to remember their humble roots.”




Some was also about him wanting to be around celebs vs the people who helped him get there.  Kind of a screw you, but we got ours.



> Whether the party was 500 or 300 or 30, Obama should have made sure to have the people there who made the moment possible, the ones who worked so hard to get him elected and cement his legacy.






> David Axelrod, Pygmalion to Obama’s Galatea, was a disinvitado, which he handled with his usual grace. Rahm Emanuel, the former Obama chief of staff who helped him navigate the first two successful years of his presidency, was also disinvited and quipped in the Times story by Annie Karni that getting voted off the island was character-building.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Sure.




"They need to remember their humble roots.” - Makes it sound like some black folks are getting a little uppity and forgetting their place.  I've spent my life getting praised for climbing above the situation I was born into.  I've never once been told that I need to remember where I came from.  In my experience, that's something we praise people for.  Overcoming adversity and all that stuff.  Except black people.  They can pull themselves up by their bootstraps, _*as long as they never forget*_, that at one time they had no boots.  It's the "if we're going to let you sit at the white table, you could at least show a little appreciation" attitude.

"Obama should have made sure to have the people there who made the moment possible, the ones who worked so hard to get him elected and cement his legacy." - So he owes people from 13-15 years ago? How dare he invite the guests he wants for _*his*_ birthday party.  He owes the American public the birthday party _*they*_ want him to have.

I can't read the article.  But from what your quoted, it sounds like some butt-hurt white people are _*still*_ upset that we had a black president. Is this a journalist or a historian writing this article because they seem pretty stuck in the past.

I said it a page or two back and I'll say it again.  If the party was for George W, Bush, there wouldn't have been a story.  Because this isn't a story about an ex-president, but a story about a black man in Washington who dared to reach too far.  Some don't want him to have his rightful place in history.  They'd like to see his legacy toppled like a confederate statue.  So they write scathing articles about guest lists to birthday parties for private citizens.

That's my take on the very tiny amount I know about the full article.


----------



## JayMysteri0

MEJHarrison said:


> "They need to remember their humble roots.” - Makes it sound like some black folks are getting a little uppity and forgetting their place.  I've spent my life getting praised for climbing above the situation I was born into.  I've never once been told that I need to remember where I came from.  In my experience, that's something we praise people for.  Overcoming adversity and all that stuff.  Except black people.  They can pull themselves up by their bootstraps, _*as long as they never forget*_, that at one time they had no boots.  It's the "if we're going to let you sit at the white table, you could at least show a little appreciation" attitude.
> 
> "Obama should have made sure to have the people there who made the moment possible, the ones who worked so hard to get him elected and cement his legacy." - So he owes people from 13-15 years ago? How dare he invite the guests he wants for _*his*_ birthday party.  He owes the American public the birthday party _*they*_ want him to have.
> 
> I can't read the article.  But from what your quoted, it sounds like some butt-hurt white people are _*still*_ upset that we had a black president. Is this a journalist or a historian writing this article because they seem pretty stuck in the past.
> 
> I said it a page or two back and I'll say it again.  If the party was for George W, Bush, there wouldn't have been a story.  Because this isn't a story about an ex-president, but a story about a black man in Washington who dared to reach too far.  Some don't want him to have his rightful place in history.  They'd like to see his legacy toppled like a confederate statue.  So they write scathing articles about guest lists to birthday parties for private citizens.
> 
> That's my take on the very tiny amount I know about the full article.



I too am missing context.

Not because of a paywall, but what it has to do with 'Covid Stupidity'.

I do get if it's about someone who doesn't care for the former president.  I thought we established that tying his birthday to anything Covid related was a sour grapes reach if one didn't have the palpitations about other former presidents still having rallies.  Or as pointed out lately, not having the decency to chip in or weigh in on the whole vaccine hesitancy they helped foment, because they think it may help a current president.



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1426900952032940032/



> Sundown town - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org






> The Latest: Alabama gov issues state of emergency amid surge
> 
> 
> MONTGOMERY, Ala. — Alabama Gov. Kay Ivey on Friday issued a state of emergency as state hospitals face a surge in COVID-19 cases, an order that came the same day the state tied a record low for available intensive care unit beds.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apnews.com


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> I can't read the article.  But from what your quoted, it sounds like some butt-hurt white people are _*still*_ upset that we had a black president. Is this a journalist or a historian writing this article because they seem pretty stuck in the past.




First, I have no idea why some article have paywalls when I just read them without one.  I try not to use them, but if they are letting me in, not sure why others have issues.

Second, I think her point is more about Obama and in general the Democrat party becoming what they used to loathe, that is a party of rich elites who don't remember, or care, how they got there.

As for the COVID part, she did include something about it not being the best idea due to COVID.  And it was written by Maureen Dowd.  Very well respected columnist for the NYT.  (On a side note, she is the one who ate a full 100mg edible when Colorado legalized and spent a very uncomfortable night laying in the closet of her hotel room.)

And while too soon to blame the party. Martha's Vineyard had a 72% increase in positive cases this week.  But could be from the support staff erecting the tents and getting the place ready for the party.


----------



## SuperMatt

DeSantis refuses to institute a mask mandate in a state experiencing a massive deadly outbreak: silence. 

Obama has a birthday party: OMG COVID OUTBREAK WORLD IS ENDING!


----------



## Eric

And every one of their parents probably voted for Trump.


----------



## Runs For Fun

What the hell?








						Hugely Popular Anti-Vaxx Misinformation Website Is Just Some Lady in Piedmont
					

Vaccine misinformation hotbed OpenVAERS is one of the leading sources of bad info about COVID vaccines on the internet, and an investigation finds that it’s run by some woman in the Oakland-surrounded suburb of Piedmont with too much time on her hands.




					sfist.com
				












						This Woman Secretly Runs One of the World's Biggest Anti-Vax Websites From Her House
					

By presenting unverified data as fact, OpenVAERS has become one of the most powerful tools in the anti-vaxxer community.




					www.vice.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

What the?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427031848178290693/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> What the?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427031848178290693/



The combined population of those 8 states is about 80 million (source: 2020 census). That is less than 1/4th of the U.S. population. Their governors should go on trial for crimes against humanity.


----------



## Hrafn

SuperMatt said:


> The combined population of those 8 states is about 80 million (source: 2020 census). That is less than 1/4th of the U.S. population. Their governors should go on trial for crimes against humanity.



I'm sure they are good people??!?


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> The combined population of those 8 states is about 80 million (source: 2020 census). That is less than 1/4th of the U.S. population. Their governors should go on trial for crimes against humanity.



trump would have to be the first one.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> What the?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427031848178290693/



It seems like Texas and Florida are having a "hold my beer" contest with the number of cases.


----------



## Yoused

Herdfan said:


> She was saying the Obama's have become elites looking down on the little people.




I mean, I understand the "gotcha" of having a *L*iberal like Ms Dowd being highly critical of Barack Obama. His supporters were all supposed to be "_Oh, he's the Messiah!_" and I suppose some of them were. But she is an actual Left-wing type, and the actual Left was often critical of Obama.

When you do the measurements, it works out that Obama was about one cholla-needle's width to the left of Reagan, and the actual Left reviles Reagan as a reckless criminal whose policies have gotten us to this dark place.

In other words, if you see a Liberal criticize Obama, it would be because the Left supported him solely because the Republican Party gives us unthinkably horrible politicians who strive to play the final hand of Reagan's trajectory of stupidity, callousness and destruction.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Why it's called "covid stupid".

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427268063091642368/

We're sending Sheriffs to schools because of school shooting and...  MASKS?!


----------



## SuperMatt

COVID-denying priest that tried to convince others not to get vaccinated... is on a ventilator in the hospital.









						The Pope’s No. 1 American Nemesis—a COVID Skeptic—Is Now Fighting for His Life
					

Cardinal Raymond Burke, the arch-conservative who has spearheaded a drive to cast doubt on Pope Francis’ legitimacy and fanned vaccine conspiracy theories, is now on a ventilator.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> COVID-denying priest that tried to convince others not to get vaccinated... is on a ventilator in the hospital.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pope’s No. 1 American Nemesis—a COVID Skeptic—Is Now Fighting for His Life
> 
> 
> Cardinal Raymond Burke, the arch-conservative who has spearheaded a drive to cast doubt on Pope Francis’ legitimacy and fanned vaccine conspiracy theories, is now on a ventilator.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com



people keep thinking covid wont get them if they dont belive in it. Covid Just laughs and thanks them for the stupidity.


----------



## JayMysteri0

What was that loud smacking sound you heard emitting from Florida?






You have to just shake your head at those types who hate 'big gov't overreach', as they try to overreach.


----------



## JayMysteri0

In other perhaps unexpected news....

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427269646693060612/



> U.S. Supreme Court Justice Amy Coney Barrett’s recent ruling suggests that athletes and other students who challenge vaccine requirements would likely fail.
> 
> Eight students from Indiana University insist a vaccine requirement violates their 14th Amendment due process rights and infringes on their ability to make medical decisions. Justice Barrett's denial of college students' challenge to mandatory COVID vaccination will impact college athletes.




Just get out of your f'n feelings people!  If you weren't bitching about vaccines before, it makes you look questionable now.  Let's get past this, save as many of us as we can, and you can back to whining about who gets to use what bathroom & if people have the right to inspect an athlete's genitals before they hit the field.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Lastly, 

Remember kids, sometimes there is consequences for feelings & stupidity, when you can't keep it to yourself

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427329903222009863/

Asshole context
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427243607791177728/


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> Lastly,
> 
> Remember kids, sometimes there is consequences for feelings & stupidity, when you can't keep it to yourself
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427329903222009863/
> 
> Asshole context
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427243607791177728/



the result when your mother and father had the same mother and father.


----------



## Eric

Funny that...


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/p5mnhw


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> Lastly,
> 
> Remember kids, sometimes there is consequences for feelings & stupidity, when you can't keep it to yourself
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427329903222009863/
> 
> Asshole context
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427243607791177728/



What an absolute piece of shit.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Eric said:


> Funny that...
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/p5mnhw



One of my favorite posts on Twitter was something along the lines of...

"You'll eat a hot dog, but won't take a vaccine because you don't know what's in it?"

If you've ever read any stories in New York about the hot dogs sold in by sidewalk vendors, the idea about the uncertainty of what's in a vaccine is laughable.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> "You'll eat a hot dog, but won't take a vaccine because you don't know what's in it?"




Many years back, I ate the hot dogs.  From the street vendors.  In Tijuana.  Clearly, I survived.  But yeah, that's considerably riskier than a vaccine.


----------



## Yoused

Somewhat in contrast to the ceaseless stupid,

_(Pastor George) Davis shared that when people questioned why the church was holding another clinic, he responded via a tweet, noting that he was "tired of crying about and burying people I love.

"So take the political & religious games somewhere else!! We're having people we care about we're having to bury, and I really think this vaccine would've helped them not pass away. Despite whatever controversy is attached to it or the concern people may have, I felt it was important to give another opportunity, make it as easy as possible [to get vaccinated]."_​
Which is good, but it seems like it took a little longer that it should have.


----------



## lizkat

MEJHarrison said:


> Many years back, I ate the hot dogs.  From the street vendors.  In Tijuana.  Clearly, I survived.  But yeah, that's considerably riskier than a vaccine.



Yeah I ate street food in NYC for more than 30 years.  Tempted to say covid would run if it saw me walking down the street in an unvaccinated state.   Still I'm looking forward to my vaccination appointment towards the end of this month.   I don't expect perfect immunity but I do believe from data that a vaccination does head off a response to infection that's so severe it requires hospitalization or results in death.   I'd much rather die from too many Sunday morning breakfasts that include home fries...  now that I've stopped tempting fate with NYC dirty water hot dogs and assorted other street fare,  which I do still miss from time to time.


----------



## Edd

MEJHarrison said:


> Many years back, I ate the hot dogs.  From the street vendors.  In Tijuana.  Clearly, I survived.  But yeah, that's considerably riskier than a vaccine.



Live in San Diego 91-93 and had many of those TJ dogs myself. Very nutritious, I assume.


----------



## fooferdoggie

COVID Skeptics Are Refusing Life-Saving Blood Transfusions from Vaccinated Donors​








						COVID Skeptics Are Refusing Life-Saving Blood Transfusions from Vaccinated Donors
					

Blood centers say they’re hearing from transfusion patients demanding blood from unvaccinated donors. Experts say the option is neither practical nor medically justifiable.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

*Americans With PhDs Are The Most Anti-Vaccine Among All Educational Groups*​*








						TaxProf Blog: Americans With PhDs Are The Most Anti-Vaccine Among All Educational Groups
					

Daily Mail, Americans With PhDs Are the Most Reluctant To Get Vaccinated Against COVID, Study Finds: People with a PhD are the most hesitant when it comes to getting the Covid-19 vaccine, according to a paper by researchers from Carnegie Mellon University and the University of Pittsburgh [Wendy...




					taxprof.typepad.com
				



*


----------



## fooferdoggie

Hillsborough Schools calls emergency meeting as 5,915 students, staff affected by COVID​








						Hillsborough Schools calls emergency meeting as 5,915 students, staff affected by COVID
					

An emergency meeting will take place on Aug. 18. One hour of public comment will be allotted for those who wish to speak.




					www.wtsp.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> *Americans With PhDs Are The Most Anti-Vaccine Among All Educational Groups*​*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TaxProf Blog: Americans With PhDs Are The Most Anti-Vaccine Among All Educational Groups
> 
> 
> Daily Mail, Americans With PhDs Are the Most Reluctant To Get Vaccinated Against COVID, Study Finds: People with a PhD are the most hesitant when it comes to getting the Covid-19 vaccine, according to a paper by researchers from Carnegie Mellon University and the University of Pittsburgh [Wendy...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> taxprof.typepad.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *



I would take this with a huge mountain (not a grain) of salt:



> Researchers surveyed just over five million US adults in an *online survey*, with 10,000 *reporting* that they were educated to PhD level.


----------



## Alli

SuperMatt said:


> I would take this with a huge mountain (not a grain) of salt:



The vast majority of my friends hold Ph.D.s (go figure), and they were all first in line for vaccinations. Even here in the south.


----------



## SuperMatt

Alli said:


> The vast majority of my friends hold Ph.D.s (go figure), and they were all first in line for vaccinations. Even here in the south.



It doesn’t pass the smell test, and then reading that it’s an online survey, relying on people to self-report their education status kind of sealed it for me...


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> I would take this with a huge mountain (not a grain) of salt:



we do know there are a lot of educated antivaxxers in the us. but that has changed now.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> we do know there are a lot of educated antivaxxers in the us. but that has changed now.



True enough - but even if the findings agreed 100% with my ideas, I’d question the methodology.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> It doesn’t pass the smell test, and then reading that it’s an online survey, relying on people to self-report their education status kind of sealed it for me...



Well, maybe it would have passed the smell test if you had sampled covid-19 yourself?

Have to agree that relying on people to self-report their level of education is … potentially problematic.


----------



## Herdfan

fooferdoggie said:


> *Americans With PhDs Are The Most Anti-Vaccine Among All Educational Groups*​*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TaxProf Blog: Americans With PhDs Are The Most Anti-Vaccine Among All Educational Groups
> 
> 
> Daily Mail, Americans With PhDs Are the Most Reluctant To Get Vaccinated Against COVID, Study Finds: People with a PhD are the most hesitant when it comes to getting the Covid-19 vaccine, according to a paper by researchers from Carnegie Mellon University and the University of Pittsburgh [Wendy...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> taxprof.typepad.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *




Well there goes completely blaming Republicans.  Most of the .edu crowd are Dems.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Well there goes completely blaming Republicans.  Most of the .edu crowd are Dems.



Why would only 8% of people with a Master’s be hesitant but then 25% of PhD be? People self-reported their degrees, and only 10K reported to have PhDs... so it would take less than 0.1% of survey respondents to lie and say they have a PhD to massively skew the results.









						Time trends and factors related to COVID-19 vaccine hesitancy from January-May 2021 among US adults: Findings from a large-scale national survey
					

Objective To understand COVID-19 vaccine hesitancy.  Methods January 6 through May 31, 2021, 5,121,436 US adults completed an online COVID-19 survey. Weighted data was used to evaluate change in vaccine intent and correlates of May vaccine hesitancy.  Results COVID-19 vaccine hesitancy decreased...




					www.medrxiv.org
				




Also notable: the researchers didn’t mention anything about that 25% PhD in the paper’s text... they were more interested in the decline in hesitancy over time in the overall survey group.


----------



## shadow puppet

Think he was vaccinated?   

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427736240087048198/


----------



## shadow puppet

I wonder how all his buddies from last night are feeling right now.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427739423517589504/


----------



## fooferdoggie

shadow puppet said:


> I wonder how all his buddies from last night are feeling right now.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427739423517589504/



a covidiot party.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

shadow puppet said:


> Think he was vaccinated?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427736240087048198/




He'll be fine because he'll receive deep state care and he's not black.


----------



## Eric

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427758089634189324/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427758908915912716/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427786738550722565/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427758908915912716/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427786738550722565/



How do you know monoclonal antibodies don’t have microchips in them? I could wish for him to die to give an example to the non-believers, but the Lt. Gov of Texas is even worse than Abbott… so hang in there…


----------



## Runs For Fun

More stupid 








						Chicago Pharmacist Arrested After Selling CDC COVID-19 Vaccination Cards On eBay
					

A Chicago pharmacist has been charged with stealing and selling authentic COVID-19 vaccination cards online, federal investigators announced Tuesday.




					www.nbcchicago.com


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## Roller

One Texas school district has found a way to circumvent Abbott's executive order. Of course, Abbott himself will probably do will since he's vaccinated, has had a third shot, and reportedly has received monoclonal antibodies. In the tradition of Trump, DeSantis, and other so-called leaders, he cares only about his electoral well-being, not about the health of his constituents. 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1427800469351636998/


----------



## fooferdoggie

even after it killed his dad. 
“A shot would have saved him,” Family grieves after father who called vaccine a government conspiracy dies of COVID-19​








						“A shot would have saved him,” Family grieves after father who called vaccine a government conspiracy dies of COVID-19
					

Many Americans are still choosing to not get the COVID-19 Vaccine. It’s a decision that one former Oklahoman says recently cost her ex-husband and father of her three kids his life.




					kfor.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

not stupid but stupid people caused it.
Alabama doctor says he won’t treat unvaccinated people: ‘COVID is miserable way to die’​An Alabama doctor is taking a bold stance in the efforts to get more people vaccinated against COVID-19.

Dr. Jason Valentine, a physician at Mobile’s Diagnostic and Medical Clinic Infirmary Health, posted a photo on his Facebook page showing him posed next to a sign that says “effective Oct. 1, 2021, Dr. Valentine will no longer see patients that are not vaccinated against COVID-19.”

Since posting the sign, Valentine wrote that three unvaccinated patients asked where they could get a vaccine.

“No conspiracy theories, no excuses. Just where do they go,” he added.

Valentine had a blunt answer for those who asked him about his decision.

“If they asked why, I told them COVID is a miserable way to die and I can’t watch them die like that,” he wrote.




__





						outline.com
					





					outline.com


----------



## Alli

fooferdoggie said:


> Dr. Jason Valentine, a physician at Mobile’s Diagnostic and Medical Clinic Infirmary Health, posted a photo on his Facebook page showing him posed next to a sign that says “effective Oct. 1, 2021, Dr. Valentine will no longer see patients that are not vaccinated against COVID-19.”



Good for him. Although I’m sure it goes against the Hyppocratic oath somehow. Then again, that’s where I go for 50% of my medical needs. I’m tempted to change primary care doctors.

Back to Governor Douchebag Abbot, a few points.
1. How can he be given monoclonal treatment before showing any symptoms?
2. Who gave him the 3rd jab?
3. Do the people who are now opting to avoid the vaccinations because they can get the monoclonal antibody infusions realize that it is not FDA approved?


----------



## JayMysteri0

I'm sure this is something that would go over big with the group that they cater to

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428061532047413250/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Alli said:


> Good for him. Although I’m sure it goes against the Hyppocratic oath somehow. Then again, that’s where I go for 50% of my medical needs. I’m tempted to change primary care doctors.
> 
> Back to Governor Douchebag Abbot, a few points.
> 1. How can he be given monoclonal treatment before showing any symptoms?
> 2. Who gave him the 3rd jab?
> 3. Do the people who are now opting to avoid the vaccinations because they can get the monoclonal antibody infusions realize that it is not FDA approved?




I think another concern is when the right sees their political heroes getting covid but appearing like it’s no big deal, they’ll just see this as another reason they don’t need to take things seriously. They won’t care if these high profile leaders are possibly getting special treatment.  Their thought process really isn't that deep.


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> I'm sure this is something that would go over big with the group that they cater to
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428061532047413250/



This is epic. Wonder if their viewers know because if they don't disclose it they'll never know as they watch nothing else.


----------



## shadow puppet

Alli said:


> 3. Do the people who are now opting to avoid the vaccinations because they can get the monoclonal antibody infusions realize that it is not FDA approved?



Not arguing about anything related to douchebag Abbott, but the FDA did approve emergency monoclonal infusions.  I myself was given one earlier this year through UCLA.


----------



## SuperMatt

shadow puppet said:


> Not arguing about anything related to douchebag Abbott, but the FDA did approve emergency monoclonal infusions.  I myself was given one earlier this year through UCLA.



Monoclonal antibodies are still under emergency use authorization… right? So the same status as the vaccines?


----------



## shadow puppet

SuperMatt said:


> Monoclonal antibodies are still under emergency use authorization… right?



Yes, that's why I stated above that the FDA approved _emergency_ infusions.









						Coronavirus (COVID-19) Update: FDA Authorizes Additional Monoclonal Antibody for Treatment of COVID-19
					

The FDA issued an EUA for an investigational monoclonal antibody therapy for treatment of mild-to-moderate COVID-19 in adult and pediatric patients.




					www.fda.gov


----------



## JayMysteri0

If this is true, this is some truly sick shit, that should be beyond any bits about Florida



> AP: Top Donor Of Gov. Ron DeSantis Is Regeneron Investor
> 
> 
> As Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis criss-crosses the state opening monoclonal antibody treatment centers using Regeneron as a post-exposure prevention for COVID-19, he is also being criticized because one of his top donors is a Regeneron investor.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> miami.cbslocal.com





> MIAMI (CBSMiami/AP) — As Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis criss-crosses the state opening monoclonal antibody treatment centers using Regeneron as a post-exposure prevention for COVID-19, he is also being criticized because one of his top donors is a major Regeneron investor.
> 
> According to the Associated Press, filings with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission show Citadel, a Chicago-based hedge fund, has $15.9 million in shares of Regeneron Pharmaceuticals as well as options to buy its stock.
> 
> Citadel CEO Ken Griffin has donated $10.75 million to a political committee that supports DeSantis. He also donated $5.75 million in 2018 and $5 million last April.
> 
> Citadel’s investment in Regeneron is a tiny fraction of its overall $39 billion in investments, but if the stock price were to go up, Citadel would benefit. DeSantis spokeswoman Christina Pushaw points out that Citadel has far greater investments in Moderna and Pfizer, which manufacture COVID-19 vaccines.
> 
> But the relationship has generated a buzz on social media, as Democrats question the relationship.
> 
> “Claiming that there is somehow ‘corruption’ by promoting the baseless political narrative that Governor DeSantis supports Regeneron over COVID vaccines (completely false, but that is another topic) is not even logically consistent when you examine the SEC filing,” Pushaw said in an email. “Citadel holds far more shares of Pfizer and Moderna than Regeneron.”
> 
> DeSantis announced on Wednesday the opening of the state’s newest monoclonal antibody treatment center at C.B. Smith Park in Pembroke Pines. Others are already open in Jacksonville, Orlando, and Merritt Island. Sites will open soon in Miami-Dade and Palm Beach Counties.
> 
> Experts say the drug is an effective treatment for COVID-19 if people receive treatment soon after testing positive.






> Florida Gov. DeSantis promotes Regeneron, a COVID-19 treatment connected to one of his largest donors
> 
> 
> DeSantis has been focused on monoclonal antibody treatments to fight COVID-19, specifically the one developed by Regeneron.
> 
> 
> 
> www.heraldtribune.com





> Gov. Ron DeSantis has zeroed in on monoclonal antibody therapy as a lifeline for COVID-19 patients, holding press conferences around the state where he name-checks a specific drugmaker — Regeneron — which is a major investment for one of his largest campaign contributors.
> 
> “The Regeneron, just so everybody knows, is free,” DeSantis said during an appearance at a monoclonal antibody therapy center the state opened at Camping World Stadium in Orlando.
> 
> As DeSantis ramps up his reelection bid, the largest donation to his political committee this cycle is a $5 million contribution from Kenneth Griffin, the CEO of hedge fund Citadel, which owns $15.9 million shares in Regeneron, according to a regulatory report filed with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission this week.
> 
> The billionaire Griffin also gave DeSantis $5.75 million in 2018, during his run for governor.
> 
> The connection has emerged as the latest battleground in the nation's politicized war against COVID-19, with Democrats accusing DeSantis of doing more to promote Regeneron and his biggest donor's financial interests and less to advance vaccines in Florida, where just under half the population lacks immunization.




The accusations revolve around the reasons that desantis wouldn't want to advocate covid prevention with masks & vaccines, is that would cut into the demand for Regeneron.

What the bloody F-?!!


----------



## SuperMatt

shadow puppet said:


> Yes, that's why I stated above that the FDA approved _emergency_ infusions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Coronavirus (COVID-19) Update: FDA Authorizes Additional Monoclonal Antibody for Treatment of COVID-19
> 
> 
> The FDA issued an EUA for an investigational monoclonal antibody therapy for treatment of mild-to-moderate COVID-19 in adult and pediatric patients.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.fda.gov



So the anti-vaxers claiming they don’t want vaccines because they are under emergency authorization are full of it. They have no problem taking monoclonal antibodies if they get sick, which are also under emergency authorization.


----------



## lizkat

Some of these parents have got way too carried away.  A Washington Post piece:

After Texas parent rips mask off teacher’s face, school official warns: ‘Do not fight mask wars in our schools’



> Some parents physically and verbally assaulted teachers because of masks. One parent ripped a teacher’s mask off her face, Leonard said. Others yelled at another teacher to remove her mask because they claimed it made it difficult to understand what she was saying.
> 
> “This type of behavior will not be tolerated in Eanes ISD,” Leonard wrote Tuesday. “Our staff are on the front lines of this pandemic; let’s give them some space and grace. Please, I am asking everyone to be kind … do not fight mask wars in our schools.”




And it's not just in Texas, of course.  There are other states where schools have been forbidden to issue mask mandates.    However, some schools in areas experiencing a surge of the covid delta variant have defiantly gone ahead and made masks mandatory anyway.    The federal Department of Education appears to be on their side, per another WaPo article.  Their approach is pulling out all the stops available including legislation regarding special needs students and court rulings on discrimination and equal access to education.

Biden orders Education Department to take action against governors who ban school mask mandates



> [Education Department Secretary Miguel] Cardona, in a Wednesday post on the department’s Homeroom Blog, said the department can investigate any state educational agency whose policies or actions “may infringe on the rights of every student to access public education equally.”
> 
> “The department will also receive and respond as appropriate to complaints from the public, including parents, guardians, and others about students who may experience discrimination as a result of states not allowing local school districts to reduce virus transmission risk through masking requirements and other mitigation measures,” he wrote. “As always, the Department’s Office for Civil Rights evaluates allegations of discrimination on a case-by-case basis, looking at the specific facts of each case.
> 
> “In addition, the Department’s Office of Special Education Programs monitors states’ implementation of the federal special education law that requires that students with disabilities receive a free, appropriate public education,” Cardona said.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428190231233191945/


----------



## JayMysteri0

In case you're wondering about the random spectacles at various school board meetings

Maybe wonder if they are really random

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428164499580858377/


----------



## Alli

shadow puppet said:


> Not arguing about anything related to douchebag Abbott, but the FDA did approve emergency monoclonal infusions.  I myself was given one earlier this year through UCLA.






SuperMatt said:


> So the anti-vaxers claiming they don’t want vaccines because they are under emergency authorization are full of it. They have no problem taking monoclonal antibodies if they get sick, which are also under emergency authorization.



My point exactly.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Monoclonal antibodies are still under emergency use authorization… right? So the same status as the vaccines?





shadow puppet said:


> Not arguing about anything related to douchebag Abbott, but the FDA did approve emergency monoclonal infusions.  I myself was given one earlier this year through UCLA.




Stop me if I am incorrect here, but the FDA's EUA simply approved an off-label use of something that has been FDA approved for 35 years.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Stop me if I am incorrect here, but the FDA's EUA simply approved an off-label use of something that has been FDA approved for 35 years.



But it has not been approved for this use. Same argument when hydroxychloriquine was all the rage. Yes it was approved, but not for Covid.


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> But it has not been approved for this use. Same argument when hydroxychloriquine was all the rage. Yes it was approved, but not for Covid.




Correct.  But it does have full FDA approval.  The vaccine does not. See the difference?


----------



## shadow puppet

All I know is when I tested positive for covid early January, my Cardiologist gave my name / case to an independent panel of doctors and nurses at UCLA who decide who get the monoclonal antibodies infusion.  They were afraid I would go full blown covid due to my heart condition.  I had the transfusion, my covid remained very mild and I've been forever grateful.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yes
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428185358676729864/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428340090519105536/


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428340090519105536/



covid is good about sticking it to the deniers.


----------



## JayMysteri0

fooferdoggie said:


> covid is good about sticking it to the deniers.



The deniers just don't seem to consider others may suffer as well, and that effect on them

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428386787794243585/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428393683263631365/


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Correct.  But it does have full FDA approval.  The vaccine does not. See the difference?



No. Some drugs are approved for certain uses but could be deadly if used for the wrong condition or disease.


----------



## shadow puppet

I'm sorry I stepped into this thread.  All I'm saying is I'm grateful for any help the monoclonal antibodies gave me.  Stay safe everyone.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

fooferdoggie said:


> covid is good about sticking it to the deniers.




Unfortunately unless it ends up with a lot of them taking a dirt nap it's not going to have much sway on their voters.  I could be wrong, but I don't think I've seen any infected Republican come back with "I was wrong.  We need to take this more seriously."  after experiencing it first hand.


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> The deniers just don't seem to consider others may suffer as well, and that effect on them
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428386787794243585/



yep covid does not care what you believe. but by the time they learn this it is often too late.


----------



## Huntn

Texas Governor Abbott has it. He was vaccinated, but what is astounding is the silence from the head of the State government as hospital ICUs once again fill up. This is all politics and keeping the stupid voting for you, while they die...because... they're stupid, giving leadership great latitude to seal their death warrants with impunity.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> The deniers just don't seem to consider others may suffer as well, and that effect on them
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428386787794243585/



Was he vaccinated? If not, I might spare a tear for them, while knowing the less of this type of human being around, the better chance for the species. Yes, that's harsh, but looking at our specie's survival challenges with open eyes. _Yeah, I'll buy a gun to protect myself, but don't ask me to inconvenience myself with a shot and a mask_. it's fucking tragic and... stupid.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Huntn said:


> Was he vaccinated? If not, I might spare a tear for them, while knowing the less of this type of human being around, the better chance for the species. Yes, that's harsh, but looking at our specie's survival challenges with open eyes. _Yeah, I'll buy a gun to protect myself, but don't ask me to inconvenience myself with a shot and a mask_. it's fucking tragic and... stupid.



From the article linked to:


> Sara Walsh told KRCG at the time that she and her husband had not been vaccinated against the coronavirus.




In another article I read while researching I believe they stated they hadn't gotten it for a reason



> State Rep. Sara Walsh and husband contract COVID-19
> 
> 
> Missouri state Rep. Sara Walsh says she and her husband have contracted COVID-19, and her husband is hospitalized on a ventilator.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kbia.org





> Neither of the Walshes were vaccinated against COVID-19. Sara Walsh said she chose not to get vaccinated because the vaccine has not been fully approved by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration and she was worried about the risk factors.




For those who've been using the lack of FDA approval as reason to NOT get the vaccine, if it does get FDA approval it may lead to something they dislike more.



> Full FDA approval could lead to COVID-19 vaccine mandates | Here's why
> 
> 
> New York City is already requiring vaccines for indoor dining and other activities.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.11alive.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> From the article linked to:
> 
> 
> In another article I read while researching I believe they stated they hadn't gotten it for a reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For those who've been using the lack of FDA approval as reason to NOT get the vaccine, if it does get FDA approval it may lead to something they dislike more.





"It saddens my heart to share that this morning my best friend and beloved husband Steve Walsh was welcomed to Heaven’s glory into the arms of Jesus Christ his Lord and Savior," she wrote.

Her statement stopped just short of thanking Jesus for making her husband’s death possible.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> From the article linked to:
> 
> 
> In another article I read while researching I believe they stated they hadn't gotten it for a reason
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For those who've been using the lack of FDA approval as reason to NOT get the vaccine, if it does get FDA approval it may lead to something they dislike more.



And the risk factor of not getting the vaccine, maybe this has finally registered with some people After they lose someone. This is after a billion (great many) people have been vaccinated and protected.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> "It saddens my heart to share that this morning my best friend and beloved husband Steve Walsh was welcomed to Heaven’s glory into the arms of Jesus Christ his Lord and Savior," she wrote.
> 
> Her statement stopped just short of thanking Jesus for making her husband’s death possible.



We all have the joy of looking forward to the rapture, or is it the epiphany, of being a dumb shit, burning in Hell,  or maybe oblivion and not being able to realize what a sucker you were? But they had this good hit of Jesus Joy while it lasted.


----------



## Eric

Nailed it.


Fox News: Do as I say, not as I do. (OC) from
      PoliticalHumor


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Huntn said:


> We all have the joy of looking forward to the rapture, or is it the epiphany, of being a dumb shit, burning in Hell,  or maybe oblivion and not being able to realize what a sucker you were? But they had this good hit of Jesus Joy while it lasted.




We have yet to know what the afterlife reward is for worshiping Trump, although many are finding out.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I know some people object to the use of the word stupid, but...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428456196948828160/

God did give us the intelligence to make masks, if it's to help keep ourselves alive.



Or rob a bank, scare others, fight crime...


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

GOP Sen. Wicker of Mississippi tests positive for COVID-19
					

Republican U.S. Sen. Roger Wicker has tested positive for COVID-19 and is in isolation. His communications director, Phillip Waller, says Wicker tested positive Thursday morning.




					www.pbs.org


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> God did give us the intelligence to make masks, if it's to help keep ourselves alive.




You know, I was talking about this the other day, same type of fanatic as you posted, and in this case the person was an EMT.   Their take was vaccinations are "against god's will", etc., they picked up a woman with extreme Covid symptoms, so even in face of what it does, won't get vaccinated.

Here's the thing, I'm sure that EMT has saved people, shown up at car wrecks, all sorts of accidents - why even bother if it's all up to god?  Don't they recognize they're actually intervening, that if god is involved in the equation, he's given people the desire to help and pursue education and skills to be the mechanism, here on earth, that saves lives?

Isn't resuscitating someone after a heart attack, doing the same?  Changing the outcome?

It doesn't even make sense in the context of their own faith.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> I know some people object to the use of the word stupid, but...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428456196948828160/
> 
> God did give us the intelligence to make masks, if it's to help keep ourselves alive.
> 
> 
> 
> Or rob a bank, scare others, fight crime...



Are they nudists? Pretty sure we were all born without clothes on.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

DT said:


> Their take was vaccinations are "against god's will",




I'd like to follow these morons around for a day so I can knock shit out of their hand while going "Nope, manmade, not God" all day long.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

3 U.S. senators test positive in "breakthrough" COVID-19 cases
					

U.S. Senators John Hickenlooper, Angus King and Roger Wicker have become the latest high-profile lawmakers to test positive for the coronavirus.




					www.cbsnews.com
				




Thrice!

We should rally against testing!!  That’s the real danger to life and freedom!


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> I know some people object to the use of the word stupid, but...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428456196948828160/
> 
> God did give us the intelligence to make masks, if it's to help keep ourselves alive.
> 
> 
> 
> Or rob a bank, scare others, fight crime...



well god had us borne naked if he wanted us covered up he would have kept us covered in fur. The dumb is strong in this one.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> I know some people object to the use of the word stupid, but...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428456196948828160/
> 
> God did give us the intelligence to make masks, if it's to help keep ourselves alive.
> 
> 
> 
> Or rob a bank, scare others, fight crime...



My god, so to speak, she thinks she is being profound, but the audience I project had a look in their eyes.  To her point, we were not born with clothes, why is she not naked?


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> 3 U.S. senators test positive in "breakthrough" COVID-19 cases
> 
> 
> U.S. Senators John Hickenlooper, Angus King and Roger Wicker have become the latest high-profile lawmakers to test positive for the coronavirus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thrice!
> 
> We should rally against testing!!  That’s the real danger to life and freedom!



I did not read the link, but I though breakthrough was not  getting it after vaccinated, but ending up in the hospital with it after being vaccinated?


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> I know some people object to the use of the word stupid, but...




Who is objecting to the word "stupid"?  That's really dumb.

I like how these two stand in front of an audience speaking into a microphone (if God wanted us to have LOUD voices...) reading off their cell phones (if God wanted us to be super smart...) with her glasses on (if God wanted us to have perfect vision...) all while standing in a building (if God wanted us to be protected from the elements...)

While there's no evidence to support this, I highly suspect afterwards they hopped in a car (if God wanted you to go that fast...) and drove to their air conditioned house (if God meant for you to be cool...) and hopped into a bed (if God wanted you to sleep on something soft...)

Their whole lives, from sunup to sundown, they're using things man invented to improve their lives without even thinking twice.  But a piece of cloth across the mouth to protect against getting sick?  Now you've gone too far.  If God wanted them to have a piece of fabric across their face while they're having their nails painted green (because the default color God gave us sucks), then we'd come with built-in masks.  That's just simple logic.  Simple as in, it's totally true if you don't really think about it too hard.

These women are really fortunate that God invented the hair-brush so we wouldn't have messy hair, or they would have looked even crazier than they sounded.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Oh this gonna be good 








						Fox News Requires Employees to Report Vaccination Status, Mandates Masks for Workers in ‘Confined Spaces’
					

Fox News Channel requires employees to self-report their vaccination status, as part of guidelines to keep its workforce safe — even as some of the network’s most popular on-air talent …




					variety.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Although not directly related, I just found some educational material from the Jesus for COVID people






I like the bit where Jesus hated certain things so much that he didn’t even mention them, not once.


----------



## fooferdoggie

"I will fight mask mandates to the death," says Sheriff who now relies on supplemental oxygen to live due to COVID

"Bottom line is: I beat it. And I did it without taking vaccinations, without getting my shot, without none of that nonsense," he said. "And that’s my decision. I make that decision. Not the government."








						Klickitat County Sheriff contracts COVID-19, still plans to fight mandates
					

A Southwest Washington state sheriff who has been especially vocal in his opposition to pandemic restrictions recently contracted COVID-19, was hospitalized and is relying on oxygen.




					www.q13fox.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Wheelchairs added to Duval monoclonal site after photo shows sick woman lying on floor​








						Wheelchairs added to Duval monoclonal site after photo shows sick woman lying on floor
					

A photo spreading on social media shows people sick with COVID-19 lying on the floor of the downtown Jacksonville library while waiting for antibody treatment.




					www.news4jax.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

No matter how good your counterfeit vaccination cards are, if they're for your kids who are 4 and 5 years old, you're gonna get caught
Florida couple arrested in Hawaii for using fake vaccination cards​








						Florida couple arrested in Hawaii for using fake vaccination cards
					

The couple was arrested on the north shore of Honolulu after attempting to use the cards for their kids who were born in 2016 and 2017. The kids are too young to be vaccinated and gave the couple a…




					www.wfla.com


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Correct.  But it does have full FDA approval.  The vaccine does not. See the difference?






SuperMatt said:


> No. Some drugs are approved for certain uses but could be deadly if used for the wrong condition or disease.




Exactly. For instance, you really don’t want to take Digitalis for a headache, even though it’s FDA approved and one of its side-effects is relieving headaches.


----------



## Eric

Wait, what?

Irrefutable logic from
      MurderedByWords


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> Correct.  But it does have full FDA approval.  The vaccine does not. See the difference?



Lots of misunderstanding (or misinformation) about how this works, so let me try to clear things up:

Pharmaceutical companies and others who develop new drugs typically submit an IND (Investigational New Drug) to the FDA. These incorporate clinical protocols that test safety and efficacy, with strict requirements for Institutional Review Board review, informed consent, and other controls. The desired endpoint is FDA approval for a given medical indication or set of indications.

Under emergency situations such as the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic, the FDA may grant Emergency Use Authorization for a drug or other therapy. This requires safety and efficacy data as well, though possibly less than needed for full approval, depending on the nature of the emergency. EUAs expire when the emergency conditions are over. In the case of SARS-CoV-2 vaccines that have been granted EUA, the volume and rigor of supporting information was quite high. While it's possible that further study may produce different results, the volume of data gathered worldwide since EUA has been massive, and this hasn't happened.

Occasionally, the FDA may allow use of an investigational drug for expanded (also sometimes called compassionate) use. This can be done for an individual or group in life-threatening circumstances when there are no alternatives. I suspect this is what allowed Trump to receive monoclonal antibody therapy last year.

Finally, any approved drug may be used off-label — that is, to treat conditions for which it was not approved. This can be done at the discretion of the treating physician or other authorized healthcare provider. 

I often hear claims that the vaccines are investigational or experimental and therefore not safe, while drugs like HCQ are because they're approved. But the quality and quantity of supporting data are what matter. Unfortunately, most people who take one position or another have no ability to assess the validity of scientific studies, so they parrot what they've heard or read in social and other media.


----------



## Herdfan

Roller said:


> Under emergency situations such as the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic, the FDA may grant Emergency Use Authorization for a drug or other therapy. This requires safety and efficacy data as well,* though possibly less than needed for full approval,* depending on the nature of the emergency. EUAs expire when the emergency conditions are over. In the case of SARS-CoV-2 vaccines that have been granted EUA, the volume and rigor of supporting information was quite high. While it's possible that further study may produce different results, the volume of data gathered worldwide since EUA has been massive, and this hasn't happened.
> 
> Occasionally, the FDA may allow use of an investigational drug for expanded (also sometimes called compassionate) use. This can be done for an individual or group in life-threatening circumstances when there are no alternatives. I suspect this is what allowed Trump to receive monoclonal antibody therapy last year.
> 
> *Finally, any approved drug may be used off-label — that is, to treat conditions for which it was not approved. This can be done at the discretion of the treating physician or other authorized healthcare provider.*
> 
> I often hear claims that the vaccines are investigational or experimental and therefore not safe, while drugs like HCQ are because they're approved. But the quality and quantity of supporting data are what matter. Unfortunately, most people who take one position or another have no ability to assess the validity of scientific studies, so they parrot what they've heard or read in social and other media.




Thank you!


----------



## JayMysteri0

I beginning to realize that thanks to a considerable portion of Florida & Texas attending meetings, this is the new version of 'mask shaming' lunacy.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428784100463333380/

My question is if you are against vaccines so vehemently, how do you know a spoon will stick to one's vaccination spot?    

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428788908087721994/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428792954982912008/

I'd go to some of these meetings if I could, but I realize it's to see a group of mouth breathers & no masks.  No thanks.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Oh wait, I'm sorry.

It isn't just some folks attending school board meetings where the stupid happens.



> As Cullman prepares for Trump rally, city declares COVID state of emergency
> 
> 
> Cullman Regional Chief Operating Officer Nesha Donaldson sent a letter to the city requesting additional support at the rally, and cited the hospital’s overcrowding, bed shortages, labor shortages and an increased strain on Cullman EMS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.al.com





> With Cullman Regional experiencing overcrowding due to the COVID-19 pandemic, the city of Cullman will be providing more first responders to this weekend’s Alabama GOP rally.
> 
> The Cullman City Council passed a resolution during a special called meeting Thursday morning to declare a State of Emergency due to threat that COVID-19 continues to pose to the city’s residents.
> 
> The declaration of the State of Emergency allowed the city to provide the additional personnel and equipment for this weekend’s political rally after it was requested by Cullman Regional.
> 
> The Alabama Republican Party is hosting former President Donald Trump and other Republican speakers at the York Farms property on Saturday.




Uh...



> Cullman Regional Chief Operating Officer Nesha Donaldson sent a letter to the city Wednesday requesting additional support at the rally, and cited the hospital’s overcrowding, bed shortages, labor shortages and an increased strain on Cullman EMS.
> 
> In the letter, Donaldson said the hospital will be providing medical support at the rally, but needs help from the city to be able to maintain better response times for COVID-19 issues and allow for better staffing at the hospital.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Outside of the U.S.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428740707343294473/

"Chief HEALTH Officer"?


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> Thank you!



I see you bolded a couple of phrases from my post. So to clarify further:

1. As I noted, the data submitted to the FDA for EUA for the vaccines was already quite high at the time. I and many of my colleagues reviewed those data in detail last year and had no hesitancy in getting vaccinated as soon as we were eligible. I understand why people unversed in assessing randomized clinical trials might have been and still remain reluctant. However, by now the amount of data gathered worldwide since EUA is far greater than any pharmaceutical company could ever produce for full approval in the normal course of affairs, and it shows that the vaccines are very safe. Therefore, any argument that the vaccines haven't been tested sufficiently doesn't hold water. All that's left is for the FDA to apply their stamp of approval, which they'll do in a few weeks.

2. Just because off-label use of a drug is permitted doesn't mean that it's as safe or effective as when the same drug is used for one of its approved indications. This doesn't mean that indications can't or shouldn't change over time. Take the use of minoxidil for hair loss, for example. It was originally approved by the FDA to treat hypertension, but it proved to be effective to stimulate hair growth. So physicians started using it off-label for that purpose. Eventually, this was added to the list of approved indications. (For the record, this isn't founded on personal experience!)

My point is that it can be very risky to widely use a drug off-label without good supporting studies. The downside (apart from the drug not working) is low if there aren't any significant side effects, but the risk goes up if there are such effects or if the off-label use causes people to avoid other effective therapies.


----------



## SuperMatt

There are so many COVID patients needing oxygen in Orlando that they don’t have enough for the water treatment plant. So, people are being asked to curtail their water use.

And still De(ath)Santis refuses to issue mask mandates or require vaccines to take part in popular activities.









						Orlando mayor urges residents to limit water use because hospitals need oxygen for Covid patients | Boing Boing
					

Orlando Mayor Buddy Dyer told residents to refrain from watering lawns or washing cars for at least a week because hospitals need so much oxygen to treat all the Covid-19 patients who arrived …




					boingboing.net
				




Once a vaccine became available, we all thought we saw the light at the end of the tunnel. 70-80% of people will get vaccinated, and we will reach herd immunity and we can return to life as normal. Instead, millions of morons saw places that got to 70% drop their mask mandates and they decided that although only 30-40% of their state got vaccines, they would also drop all mask mandates and act as if the pandemic is over. This country is chock-full of idiots and they are hurting us all. I wish Congress would pass a vaccine mandate immediately, but let’s face it… the members of Congress are not always the “best and brightest” of America.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> I beginning to realize that thanks to a considerable portion of Florida & Texas attending meetings, this is the new version of 'mask shaming' lunacy.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428784100463333380/
> 
> My question is if you are against vaccines so vehemently, how do you know a spoon will stick to one's vaccination spot?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428788908087721994/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428792954982912008/
> 
> I'd go to some of these meetings if I could, but I realize it's to see a group of mouth breathers & no masks.  No thanks.



That was literally painful to watch. I don’t think I could listen to the full thing. These people are fucking insane.


----------



## Roller

I my have been wrong in saying vaccines will be approved in a few weeks. I just read that Pfizer - BioNTech may be as soon as Monday. It’s not being widely reported yet, though. But even if not, I don’t think it’ll be long.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Roller said:


> I my have been wrong in saying vaccines will be approved in a few weeks. I just read that Pfizer - BioNTech may be as soon as Monday. It’s not being widely reported yet, though. But even if not, I don’t think it’ll be long.



I’m just waiting for the “wait and see” crowd to move the goalposts when this happens.


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> I my have been wrong in saying vaccines will be approved in a few weeks. I just read that Pfizer - BioNTech may be as soon as Monday. It’s not being widely reported yet, though. But even if not, I don’t think it’ll be long.



Once it‘s promoted from the emergency list to “full” approval, I’m sure the millions of people using that as an excuse for not getting it will be rushing out to get the vaccine! /s


----------



## Runs For Fun

Looks like that might be right








						The F.D.A. is aiming to give full approval to Pfizer’s Covid vaccine on Monday. (Published 2021)
					

Federal regulators are winding down the process of licensing Pfizer’s two-dose coronavirus vaccine, setting up an approval possibly by Monday and potentially kicking off a wave of new mandates.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Paul Krugman has a very good piece about the anger at people who won’t get vaccinated or wear masks. I posted it in the “freedom queens” thread, but here is a snippet:



> To say what should be obvious, getting vaccinated and wearing a mask in public spaces aren’t “personal choices.” When you reject your shots or refuse to mask up, you’re increasing my risk of catching a potentially deadly or disabling disease, and also helping to perpetuate the social and economic costs of the pandemic. In a very real sense, the irresponsible minority is depriving the rest of us of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
> 
> Furthermore, to say something that should also be obvious, those claiming that their opposition to public health measures is about protecting “freedom” aren’t being honest.


----------



## Thomas Veil

So get this. According to Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick, it’s African-Americans and Democrats who are not pulling their vaccine load.









						Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick blames Covid surge on 'African Americans who have not been vaccinated'
					

Patrick, who previously blamed the spike on undocumented immigrants crossing the border, denied that state policies contributed to the surge.




					www.nbcnews.com
				






> "The Covid is spreading, particularly most of the numbers are with the unvaccinated, and the Democrats like to blame Republicans on that," Patrick told Fox News host Laura Ingraham in an interview Thursday night. "Well, the biggest group in most states are African Americans who have not been vaccinated. Last time I checked, over 90 percent of them vote for Democrats in their major cities and major counties, so it's up to the Democrats to get ... as many people vaccinated."





> Patrick told Ingraham that Democrats are "doing nothing for the African American community," while Republicans are "encouraging people" who want the vaccine to take it. But he added, "we respect the fact if they don't want the vaccination, we're not going to force it on them. That's their individual right."




Patrick is suffering from the same kind of mental sickness that Trump exhibits, namely that no matter how many people are sick and dying around him, it’s not about that, it’s about trashing the libs.
It’s about cherry-picking facts to try to paint your opponents as the villains and ignoring your own culpability in it.  

It really is sick.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I saw this on Maddow just now, and thought there is NO FUCKING WAY...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428842090541223940/

But...

Thanks to Faux News and the logic of "It's approved by the FDA, unlike vaccine"...



> 2 hospitalized in Mississippi after taking livestock medicine to combat COVID-19, MSDH says
> 
> 
> Mississippi health officials are warning residents against taking animal drugs to protect them from getting COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wapt.com





> *JACKSON, Miss. —*
> 
> Mississippi health officials are warning people not to take animal drugs to protect them from getting COVID-19.
> 
> "The Mississippi Poison Control Center has received increased calls due to livestock or animal formulations of ivermectin taken to prevent or treat COVID-19 infection. Animal drugs are highly concentrated for large animals and can be highly toxic in humans. Do NOT take drugs made for animals in any form," the Mississippi State Department of Health said on social media Friday.
> 
> State Health Officer Dr. Thomas Dobbs was asked during a Wednesday briefing about reports of people becoming ill after ingesting the drugs, which are available at area feed stores.
> 
> "Ivermectin at high doses can be toxic and even deadly in really high concentrations in animal models," Dobbs said.
> 
> Ivermectin can be prescribed to combat intestinal parasites or scabies and are taken in one-dose, Dobbs said.
> 
> "I think some people are trying to use this a preventative, which I think is really kind of crazy, so please don’t do that," Dobbs said.





> At least one person has been hospitalized because of ivermectin-related toxicity, Dobbs said.
> 
> "Please work with your doctor. This is medical treatment," Dobbs said. "You wouldn’t get your chemotherapy at a feed store. I mean, you wouldn’t get your pneumonia with your animal’s medication. It can be dangerous to get the wrong doses of medication, especially for something that’s meant for a horse or a cow."
> 
> State epidemiologist Dr. Paul Byers is appalled by the high numbers of consumptions.
> 
> "Why in the world would an individual would want to take a medication for livestock that number one has no oversite, no FDA approval, there are no FDA studies on almost. Those are animal medications, and they are very high concentrations that could lead to human toxicity. And ivermectin has not shown any benefit," Byers said.
> 
> According to the Mississippi health professionals, most cases have only been minor symptoms. There are currently no reported hospitalizations in the state.




For FUCK sakes!  This is no longer Covid STUPID, it's Covid LUNACY!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428851746328166403/


----------



## Herdfan

Thomas Veil said:


> So get this. According to Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick, it’s African-Americans and Democrats who are not pulling their vaccine load.
> 
> 
> 
> It really is sick.




Citywide, just 28% of Black New Yorkers between the ages of 18 and 44 are fully vaccinated.  









						Black New Yorkers may have the lowest vaccination rates, but community groups refuse to give up | CNN
					

Months after the rollout of the Covid-19 vaccine, Miriam Vega is still in a battle to persuade some people to get the shot.




					www.cnn.com
				




Just because you don't like who said it, doesn't make it not true.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Citywide, just 28% of Black New Yorkers between the ages of 18 and 44 are fully vaccinated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Black New Yorkers may have the lowest vaccination rates, but community groups refuse to give up | CNN
> 
> 
> Months after the rollout of the Covid-19 vaccine, Miriam Vega is still in a battle to persuade some people to get the shot.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just because you don't like who said it, doesn't make it not true.



WTF does that have to do with Texas? Patrick was blaming black people there for being the top spreaders of the disease… which was shown to be completely false by the data in Texas.

Let’s go back to your “Why does everybody think I’m a racist?” thread. This post you just made should answer your own question.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> For FUCK sakes!  This is no longer Covid STUPID, it's Covid LUNACY!




Yes, it's complete lunacy.  They won't trust a vaccine that millions around the world have taken.  But if some yahoo on Facebook says to take a cow dewormer, you go to the feed store.  That's just covid sense (which is pretty much the opposite of common sense).


----------



## Alli

JayMysteri0 said:


> I saw this on Maddow just now, and thought there is NO FUCKING WAY...



I’ve encountered a few locals on Facebook who are convinced Ivermectin is the answer. 


Herdfan said:


> Citywide, just 28% of Black New Yorkers between the ages of 18 and 44 are fully vaccinated.



Other than the fact that that statement has nothing to do with Texas…. Whether NY or TX, do Blacks make up the majority of the population that it would fall to them? No. That statement is ridiculous.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Citywide, just 28% of Black New Yorkers between the ages of 18 and 44 are fully vaccinated.




I'll admit I found that a surprising statistic.  Hopefully something is being done to change it.

Beyond that, it's about as useful as what the dude from Texas said (Lieutenant Governor?).  This is a virus attacking humanity.  Trying to find somewhere to point the finger is a waste of time.  It doesn't matter if you're democrat, republican or something else.  It doesn't matter if you're white, black, or something else.  Religion doesn't matter.  Being here legally vs. illegally doesn't matter.  Being Christian vs not being a Christian doesn't matter.  None of the typical bullshit we use to abuse each other matters.  It's an unthinking virus that affects all of us roughly equally.  A solution exists, but some have been tricked into not trusting it by assholes with questionable intelligence and/or motives.  Prior to that, ideas to help slow things down were attacked by those same assholes.  Those statistics should be used to know where to concentrate efforts to get people vaccinated for the benefit of _*everyone*_, not for scoring political points.


----------



## SuperMatt

MEJHarrison said:


> I'll admit I found that a surprising statistic.  Hopefully something is being done to change it.
> 
> Beyond that, it's about as useful as what the dude from Texas said (Lieutenant Governor?).  This is a virus attacking humanity.  Trying to find somewhere to point the finger is a waste of time.  It doesn't matter if you're democrat, republican or something else.  It doesn't matter if you're white, black, or something else.  Religion doesn't matter.  Being here legally vs. illegally doesn't matter.  Being Christian vs not being a Christian doesn't matter.  None of the typical bullshit we use to abuse each other matters.  It's an unthinking virus that affects all of us roughly equally.  A solution exists, but some have been tricked into not trusting it by assholes with questionable intelligence and/or motives.  Prior to that, ideas to help slow things down were attacked by those same assholes.  Those statistics should be used to know where to concentrate efforts to get people vaccinated for the benefit of _*everyone*_, not for scoring political points.



Dan Patrick and his supporters put their fingers in their ears: “Nope, it’s all the blacks’ fault!” Which is an interesting pivot from “It’s all the illegals’ fault!” they were spouting earlier.

Convincing people to do what’s good for them has always been a challenge (don’t smoke, don’t overeat, eat more veggies, etc.). Sadly, folks like Donald Trump, who are great at convincing their followers of things, are refusing to use that influence to encourage people to get vaccinated… and are instead working against it.

In reading the article about NYC, many people are concerned about missing work if the vaccine gives them a few days of symptoms. For many, missing a couple days of work means deciding which bill they won’t pay this month.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Roller said:


> I my have been wrong in saying vaccines will be approved in a few weeks. I just read that Pfizer - BioNTech may be as soon as Monday. It’s not being widely reported yet, though. But even if not, I don’t think it’ll be long.




It will be interesting to see if this has a positive affect or if the vaccine hesitant will just move the goal posts or unceremoniously remove this from their list of excuses.  Regardless, the news media will most likely give all the airtime to the latter.  “Go out and find some remaining idiots and only interview them. Make sure to use ‘half the country’ a lot in your report. Yes, we’re allowed to do that. It’s totally fine.”


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> Dan Patrick and his supporters put their fingers in their ears: “Nope, it’s all the blacks’ fault!” Which is an interesting pivot from “It’s all the illegals’ fault!” they were spouting earlier.
> 
> Convincing people to do what’s good for them has always been a challenge (don’t smoke, don’t overeat, eat more veggies, etc.). Sadly, folks like Donald Trump, who are great at convincing their followers of things, are refusing to use that influence to encourage people to get vaccinated… and are instead working against it.
> 
> In reading the article about NYC, many people are concerned about missing work if the vaccine gives them a few days of symptoms. For many, missing a couple days of work means deciding which bill they won’t pay this month.




I’m fairly confident you’ll miss more days of work if you get covid or you’re dead.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I’m fairly confident you’ll miss more days of work if you get covid or you’re dead.



I agree with that, but deciding between the risk of maybe getting COVID vs knowing you’ll miss your rent payment and possibly lose your job... is not a decision people should have to make.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> I agree with that, but deciding between the risk of maybe getting COVID vs knowing you’ll miss your rent payment and possibly lose your job... is not a decision people should have to make.



But the decision of getting the vaccine or keeping your job is a decision some people are going to have to make.


----------



## SuperMatt

People are wondering what will happen when the vaccine becomes mandatory for military members:



			https://wapo.st/2XKtpWC
		


IMHO, the troops will fall in line and get the shot. It surprises me to this day that military members are hesitant to get this vaccine. I vividly remember vaccination day at basic training. Shot after shot in an assembly line. Nobody told you what shot you were getting. You just moved down the line. How anybody could submit themselves to that and suddenly be worried about THIS vaccine is beyond me.

I can understand waiting until they got full FDA approval to make it mandatory though, based on the military’s history with the Anthrax vaccine.









						The shadow of anthrax: The voluntary COVID-19 vaccination effort owes much to past failures
					

The voluntary COVID-19 vaccine effort stands in stark contrast to the Pentagon’s mandatory Anthrax Vaccine Immunization Program, which began in 1998. Those who refused often faced harsh penalties.




					www.militarytimes.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> But the decision of getting the vaccine or keeping your job is a decision some people are going to have to make.



I think something should be done about that. 

NYC, of all places, seems like it would have the political will to issue an order mandating 3 days of paid time off if and only if it’s used for the person to get the vaccine.


----------



## fooferdoggie

I don't know what's in that vaccine and don't want to put it in my body, and that's why we should just shoot ourselves up with cow deworming meds to fight Covid-19​Mississippi officials warn against using livestock ivermectin to prevent COVID-19 after rise in poison control calls​








						Mississippi officials warn against using livestock ivermectin to prevent COVID-19 after rise in poison control calls
					

Mississippi's poison control center has seen a rise in calls of people taking livestock ivermectin to treat or prevent COVID-19.




					abcnews.go.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> I agree with that, but deciding between the risk of maybe getting COVID vs knowing you’ll miss your rent payment and possibly lose your job... is not a decision people should have to make.




Rent payments are of zero concern until the end of September.  I have yet to hear of somebody getting fired because they missed a couple days of work due to getting vaccinated.  That might even be illegal.


----------



## fooferdoggie

I am waiting till some American idiot uses the india idea of cow urine and poop to cure covid.


----------



## JayMysteri0

JayMysteri0 said:


> I saw this on Maddow just now, and thought there is NO FUCKING WAY...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428842090541223940/
> 
> But...
> 
> Thanks to Faux News and the logic of "It's approved by the FDA, unlike vaccine"...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For FUCK sakes!  This is no longer Covid STUPID, it's Covid LUNACY!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428851746328166403/



So what does Faux News do with the criticisms?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428914121618120709/


----------



## Runs For Fun

"I don't trust the vaccine, I don't know what's in it!"
"I'll poison myself and take cow deworming meds instead!"

FFS I can't take these people's stupidity anymore! 

Fuck these people so hard. They are literally the reason this pandemic is still going and why we can't have nice things.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy




----------



## Thomas Veil

…aaaand Darwin wins again.









						Conservative talk show host Phil Valentine dies after battle with Covid-19, his employer says
					

Phil Valentine, a Nashville-based conservative radio talk show host who had questioned whether it was necessary for all people to get Covid-19 vaccines, died on Saturday, his employer, WWTN Radio, announced on Twitter. Valentine was 61 years old.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## lizkat

Herdfan said:


> But the decision of getting the vaccine or keeping your job is a decision some people are going to have to make.




Yeah and some of those people will blame Democrats for their having to make that decision, even though it was Trump and Trump's hijacked piece of the GOP that made the pandemic and vaccines and lockdowns and masking into a thoroughly politicized bundle of misinformation that has stuck the USA with the developed world's biggest, loudest, most stubborn and irrational anti-public-health contingent.

Why are Republican leaders at the national level not standing up and yelling about not taking de-woming medication as an anti-covid measure?!   They are who allowed this misinformation bandwagon to get rolling and keep on rolling, it's up to them to call a halt to it.   The well of public discourse is too poisoned by now for right leaning anti-science Americans to take suggestions from the Biden administration on these issues..   

 Some of the really vocal anti-science Americans, past not listening,  are also just trolls who should be shut down by peer pressure from responsible people on the right, not the left.  The left may as well save its breath on covid-related idiocy-level misinformation at this point.


----------



## Clix Pix

Thomas Veil said:


> …aaaand Darwin wins again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Conservative talk show host Phil Valentine dies after battle with Covid-19, his employer says
> 
> 
> Phil Valentine, a Nashville-based conservative radio talk show host who had questioned whether it was necessary for all people to get Covid-19 vaccines, died on Saturday, his employer, WWTN Radio, announced on Twitter. Valentine was 61 years old.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com



Big surprise, eh?


----------



## lizkat

Clix Pix said:


> Big surprise, eh?




tbh at this point it's just mind boggling to me.   I feel like I'm struggling to get a lucid dream under control...  one of those deals where you half-wake and think nah, not like that, let's go again...


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yes,

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428946935155765248/

some of us have learned this.  Not enough to make a change though.

We are losing a fair bit of those people who don't want to learn this.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Bonus:  

Cheerier thoughts

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429092007159422979/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Yes,
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428946935155765248/
> 
> some of us have learned this.  Not enough to make a change though.
> 
> We are losing a fair bit of those people who don't want to learn this.



Thanks for this. I have a couple thoughts along these lines too.

Greenhouse gases were greatly reduced during the pandemic… if more people work from home, that can help reduce pollution.

Eviction moratoriums have been in place for over a year and landlords are not bankrupt.

Government assistance to the needy went straight into boosting economic output.

We can create a vaccine for a novel virus in less than a year, but we cannot do much about human stupidity and mob mentality.


----------



## JayMysteri0

The party that quotes "We the People" while pursuing voter suppression, is the first to accuse others of tyranny...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429281122253512707/

and catch irony.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Quick reminder

Stupid doesn't happen in vacuum.  It often has help



> Facebook's Most Viewed Article In Early 2021 Raised Doubt About COVID Vaccine
> 
> 
> The social network acknowledged it had held back a report about the most viewed content on its platform in the first three months of 2021.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org





> A news story suggesting the COVID-19 vaccine may have been involved in a doctor's death was the most viewed link on Facebook in the U.S. in the first three months of the year.
> 
> But Facebook held back from publishing a report with that information, the company acknowledged on Saturday.
> 
> The social media giant prepared the report about the most widely viewed posts on its platform from January through March of 2021, but decided not to publish it "because there were key fixes to the system we wanted to make," spokesperson Andy Stone tweeted on Saturday.
> 
> The _New York Times_ first reported the existence of the shelved report on Friday, two days after Facebook published a similar report about top posts from the second quarter. Facebook executives debated about publishing the earlier report but decided to withhold it over concerns it would make the company look bad, the _Times_ reported.
> 
> Facebook has come under pressure from the Biden administration and other critics who argue it hasn't done enough to curb the spread of misinformation about the pandemic and vaccines.
> 
> "We're guilty of cleaning up our house a bit before we invited company. We've been criticized for that; and again, that's not unfair," Stone wrote on Saturday. He said the company had decided to release the previously unpublished first-quarter report because of the interest it had sparked.
> 
> But Stone also emphasized that the article raising questions about possible connections between the vaccine and death illustrated "just how difficult it is to define misinformation."





> But Stone also emphasized that the article raising questions about possible connections between the vaccine and death illustrated "just how difficult it is to define misinformation."
> 
> While Facebook bars posts that contain false information about COVID and vaccines or that discourage people from getting vaccinated, it takes the position that it's more effective to allow people to discuss potential risks and questions about health, rather than banning such content.
> 
> The article, written by the _South Florida Sun Sentinel_ and republished by the _Chicago Tribune_, was headlined "A 'healthy' doctor died two weeks after getting a COVID-19 vaccine; CDC is investigating why." The article was factual. When it was originally published in January, it noted that no link had been found between the shot and the Miami doctor's death. (The page now carries an update from April saying the medical examiner said there wasn't enough evidence to conclude whether the vaccine played a role in the doctor's death.)
> 
> Many news outlets covered the story, but the _Tribune_ link gained the most traction on Facebook: it was viewed by nearly 54 million U.S. users between January and March, according to the company's report.
> 
> Experts who study online platforms say these kinds of stories present challenges for social media companies, because while they do not break the platforms' rules against posting false information about COVID and vaccines, they are often used by anti-vaccination advocates to advance misleading narratives and fuel doubt in vaccines.
> 
> The _Tribune_ link was shared on the social network by several accounts that regularly raise doubts about vaccination, according to Crowdtangle, a research tool owned by Facebook.
> 
> In March, NPR found that on almost half of all the days so far in 2021, a story about someone dying after receiving a vaccine shot was among the most popular vaccine-related articles on social media, according to data from the media intelligence company NewsWhip. The _Tribune_ link about the Florida doctor topped that list.




"_Hmmm, our own research shows we don't publish much misinformation.  Oh that?  We left that bit of misinformation off our research._"


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> So what does Faux News do with the criticisms?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1428914121618120709/




in there defense, when a majority of smart or well informed people are either on the other team or left your team, when you have to produce an alternative you’re pretty much going to be pulling from the fishbowl of stupid.


----------



## Eric

So this happened in Alabama, where hospitals are filled to capacity and they're turning sick people away now.









						Donald Trump booed at Alabama rally after encouraging crowd to get COVID-19 vaccine
					

As Delta explodes, a growing number of Republican leaders are urging people to get vaccinated but polls show that many GOP voters are still hesitant.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> So this happened in Alabama, where hospitals are filled to capacity and they're turning sick people away now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Donald Trump booed at Alabama rally after encouraging crowd to get COVID-19 vaccine
> 
> 
> As Delta explodes, a growing number of Republican leaders are urging people to get vaccinated but polls show that many GOP voters are still hesitant.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com



He can‘t deliver the message, because he cares more about applause than anything else. Once the crowd booed him, he immediately backtracked and went with the free-dumb stuff:



> "I believe totally in your freedoms, I do, you gotta do what you gotta do, but I recommend take the vaccines. I did it. It's good," he said, drawing boos from the crowd of supporters.
> 
> "That's okay, that's alright," Trump continued, brushing off the disapproval. "But I happen to take the vaccine. If it doesn't work, you'll be the first to know. But it is working. You do have your freedoms, you have to maintain that."



He could have told them they are endangering others, the doctors, the hospital workers, first responders… nope. Just pander to the morons in the crowd. What a piece of shit he is.


----------



## Huntn

Thomas Veil said:


> …aaaand Darwin wins again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Conservative talk show host Phil Valentine dies after battle with Covid-19, his employer says
> 
> 
> Phil Valentine, a Nashville-based conservative radio talk show host who had questioned whether it was necessary for all people to get Covid-19 vaccines, died on Saturday, his employer, WWTN Radio, announced on Twitter. Valentine was 61 years old.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com



The more Darwin Awards the better. It’s the only way for the “_this bug is dangerous” _message to make an impression on the dim witted, politically blinded, although the extra stupid may just be out of luck. You know in some Southern States we have idiots unwilling to take a tested and proven vaccine, but instead opt to swallow worm medication for horses and cows because some profit told them it was safer? Drink up idiots! 









						Do Not Use Ivermectin for Animals as Treatment for COVID-19 in Humans
					

FDA recently became aware of increased public visibility of ivermectin after a research article that described the effect of the drug on SARS-CoV-2 in the lab.




					www.fda.gov


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Maybe the voter suppression efforts will be a wash countered by those who died from COVID/those who survived that first hand loss, and those who woke the fuck up their party’s Jim Jones style messaging "They will always be coming for us and our free society. We’d be better off dead."


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> The more Darwin Awards the better.




Are you all really rooting for people to die?


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> Are you all really rooting for people to die?



I always struggle with this personally, I would never advocate for anyone's death just because I have a different political belief. A good example is Rush Limbaugh, did he deserve to die because I have a different political view? Absolutely not and I have never supported that sort of language.

On the other hand I hear my wife say "If they refuse the vaccine and die as a result then so be it", which I also really disagree with. However, unlike cancer or some other heinous disease, dying from COVID is now nearly 100% avoidable for those who choose to vaccinate. It's REALLY hard to understand why people would take such risks.


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> I always struggle with this personally, I would never advocate for anyone's death just because I have a different political belief. A good example is Rush Limbaugh, did he deserve to die because I have a different political view? Absolutely not and I have never supported that sort of language.
> 
> On the other hand I hear my wife say "If they refuse the vaccine and die as a result then so be it", which I also really disagree with. However, unlike cancer or some other heinous disease, dying from COVID is now nearly 100% avoidable for those who choose to vaccinate. It's REALLY hard to understand why people would take such risks.



They are putting others’ lives at risk as well. The school fight in Texas and Florida especially. Kids under 12 cannot get vaccinated yet, and some governors are making it illegal to protect these children. In many areas, it appears school boards care more about the kids than about an edict from their governor, and are breaking the law. An excellent example of civil disobedience. Of course, in Texas we also cannot teach kids about current events and how such civil disobedience is an important part of our nation’s history… due to recent “anti-CRT” laws.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Eric said:


> I always struggle with this personally, I would never advocate for anyone's death just because I have a different political belief. A good example is Rush Limbaugh, did he deserve to die because I have a different political view? Absolutely not and I have never supported that sort of language.
> 
> On the other hand I hear my wife say "If they refuse the vaccine and die as a result then so be it", which I also really disagree with. However, unlike cancer or some other heinous disease, dying from COVID is now nearly 100% avoidable for those who choose to vaccinate. It's REALLY hard to understand why people would take such risks.



No one wants to see anyone die, or at least I would like to think.  A jaded reality tells me differently though.  That for some there is an indifference for the loss of life of OTHERS, rationalizing it away that it was somehow the 'others' fault.  Which brings us to the difficult situation many of us find ourselves with.  Other people are actually at fault for their dying, by making a spectacle of not doing something that may save their lives.  The irony isn't lost on me, but instead constantly wears until it begins to exhaust & make one apathetic.

The other irony of course is that this is perfectly in keeping with how things were before, but with a fatal twist.  One side is always expecting the other 'to be the bigger person' in any situation, after telling you "f- your feelings, man up, and be PERSONALLY responsible".



Do I wish anyone to die?  No.  Nor do many others like myself.  At the same time, those leading to charge to fill ICU beds didn't have an issue with others dying early.  "It's just like flu."  "If it's your time."  Remember it was a certain Lt Gov who just got done blaming his states's issues on less than 15% of his state's population, which makes NO FUCKING mathematical sense.  Before that it was people from another country bringing in a virus that was already in his state.  Many forget also that it was the year before the same guy was positing that the most vulnerable older people should accept dying, for the good of the economy & country.  That's some sympathy.



When we talked more often about the total number lost at the other place, of who died from Covid, we talked about the total.  We had a nationwide memorial of sorts when Biden got into office for those who passed.  We talked about how frightening the number lost was in comparison to natural disasters & wars.  What's one reason for doing that?  Because it's easier.

Because when you add ( wait for it ) CONTEXT, it isn't so easy.

We remember the bus driver who stayed on the job during the height of Covid, while passengers came on the bus unmasked, and HE was the one who died.  That's truly heartbreaking.  Meanwhile we've got politicians playing games for points, who catch Covid & THEN an epiphany.  PERHAPS if that politician didn't play games masks may have been more acceptable earlier and the bus driver would still be driving despite the risks like a true hero.  Perhaps vaccines would be some political litmus test.

Instead we will find others who will want to point out we should feel sympathy for EVERYONE no matter what, or WE are the bad guys.

No.

I'm NOT having it.

IF one wants to trot out speeches about "personal responsibility" when it applies to others, or "it's their body" is only relevant when it pertains to THEM...

Spare me.  You lost me and my concern.  There are so MANY trying soooo hard to keep EVERYONE alive, and a few want to shit all over that.  Because of their feelings...

The FUCKING vaccine is free.  Many of these so called 'hesitant' have already had other vaccines BEFORE this.  This getting so deep in one's feelings is one thing if it ONLY harmed them.  It doesn't, it harms EVERYONE.  It's only when on death's door they suddenly give a fuck about ANYBODY else.  It's too late.  Who knows how many they infected along the way, that infected others. that infected others...

Leading us to be in a worse position when we did NOT have a vaccine that we all hoped would end this, but some decided....  

I have some slight dwindling sympathy for those passing of their own devices.  Many a times perhaps more sympathy they had for their fellow man before they got Covid.

But there's no shame to be had, because those same individuals are making me more & more apathetic.

Get the FUCKING vaccine!  The gov't they supposedly hate so much is supplying it for free.  You may not give a shit about others unless it's to blame them for their fuck ups, but they say they care about their families.  THEY are the ones risking their families and the families of others in the neighborhoods.  Not a minority.  Not people from another country.  Not old people.

THEY ARE.

I maybe exhausted with this shit, but I'm still rooting for people to live.

While some of those same people tell me to "fuck off"...

YOU should NOT have to struggle with this.  Yet, that's what others would have you do, when they couldn't be bothered if the shoe were on the other foot.


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> So this happened in Alabama, where hospitals are filled to capacity and they're turning sick people away now.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trump Booed at Alabama Rally After Encouraging Crowd to Get Vaccinated
> 
> 
> As Delta explodes, a growing number of Republican leaders are urging people to get vaccinated but polls show that many GOP voters are still hesitant.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com



_DON’T FUCK WITH OUR SELF SERVING FANTASIES, EVEN THOUGH THEY DON’T SERVE US …we’re a little slow.  _


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> The party that quotes "We the People" while pursuing voter suppression, is the first to accuse others of tyranny...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429281122253512707/
> 
> and catch irony.




Not only that but *threatening to remove school officials and even cut off state aid* to schools whose boards have mandated mask wearing despite state level instructions to contrary. Talk about tyrannical.









						Florida threatens to remove school officials who disobey DeSantis
					

The DeSantis administration remains locked in a standoff with local education leaders over mask mandates in Florida schools.




					www.politico.com
				












						Some Florida School Districts Will Require Masks. The Governor May Cut Their Funding
					

Several districts are keeping their mask mandates in place despite an executive order by Gov. Ron DeSantis that leaves it up to parents to decide whether their children wear face coverings in school.




					www.npr.org
				




The problem is we shouldn't even be talking about tyranny, which is a political construct.   The management of the covid_19 pandemic is a public health matter.   Guidelines are evolving as the course of the disease and its immunity and mutation situations also evolve. 

One might normally have thought that the public would accept guidelines flexing as a matter of necessity,  but then that would assume an acceptance of how science applied to an evolving situation works.

 "The public" doesn't really accept anything lately.    We tend to be divided now along partisan lines and of course mainstream and other media are picking up on that and amplifying it.

Not sure how we dig ourselves out of this except by taking morons to court over individual idiocies, taking new voter suppression laws to court in advance of the midterm primaries,  and then trying to have a regular ol' midterm election in 2022...  maybe in some red districts there'll be an effort to flush some of the worst and most vocal social media trolls out of Congress and elect more middle of road Republicans.

I was going to say the red districts might "elect more Republican women" but then I remembered MTG and Boebert.  There are more like those two out there and for sure some of them will be running in 2022 unless the RNC or state chairs start signaling maybe the charm has worn off their approach.   Bet there's a lot of internal polling going on all the while about whether we're all gettin' tired of the drama and the bullshit.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> Are you all really rooting for people to die?



I’m rooting for our species. I’m rooting for people to be smart and worthy of the being the custodians of the Earth, but by most standards today, we are collectively self destructive failures.

You can get all weepy about personal losses, but if you look at the big picture, look at the changes in our environment brought about by humans, and then wonder about the odds of the human species surviving at all, think in terms of we>me, and realize that stupid hurts us, is a roadblock to our species survival.

I have sympathy for those loses, but I have more concern for our self destructive ways and trashing this jewel of a planet, especially in the face of wide eyed, willful stupidity.  For this basic challenge, COVID, look at the brilliance of vaccines created in a year. Then compare that to the level of willfull disregard for science, logic, reality, and truth: that these vaccines are effective.

Consequently, I believe we as a species would be better off if this was a more deadly disease because then, a lot more people would sooner take this crisis seriously, and just maybe we’d be hindered less by stupid in the process, roadblocks to our survival.

Keeping in mind that THE ANSWER is staring us in the face, readily available, yet we struggle, why?


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Are you all really rooting for people to die?




I've expressed a similar sentiment.  So I have no problem taking this.

No, I don't want people to die.

At the same time, I know there's a core group out there that will resist ALL attempts to get them to do the right thing.  I wish they would open their eyes, but they won't.  And they're the ones that are going to keep spreading it and raising the odds of a worse variant appearing.  While I don't want this bottom group to die, if they're never going to be convinced, and they're going to continue to pose a risk to the rest of society, I won't be sad when they get what's coming to them.

So yeah, I hope those who can be saved are saved.  For the rest?  If each death causes a single person to reconsider their position, then that death was a net gain for humanity.

It's a harsh attitude.  But the virus doesn't really give a damn about my feelings.  It's going to keep on going till it's done.  So I stand by "Hurry up and collect your Darwin Award."  The rest of the world needs to move on, not get drug down with them.


----------



## SuperMatt

Huntn said:


> I’m rooting for our species. I’m rooting for people to be smart and worthy of the being the custodians of the Earth, but by most standards today, we are collectively self destructive failures.
> 
> You can get all weepy about personal losses, but if you look at the big picture, look at the changes in our environment brought about by humans, and then wonder about the odds of the human species surviving at all, think in terms of we>me, and realize that stupid hurts us, is a roadblock to our species survival.
> 
> I have sympathy for those loses, but I have more concern for our self destructive ways and trashing this jewel of a planet, especially in the face of wide eyed, willful stupidity.  For this basic challenge, COVID, look at brilliance of vaccines created in a year. Then compare that to the level of willfull disregard for science, logic, reality, and truth: that these vaccines are effective.
> 
> Consequently, I believe we as a species would be better off if this was a more deadly disease because then, a lot more people would sooner take this crisis seriously, and just maybe we’d be hindered less by stupid in the process, roadblocks to our survival.
> 
> Keeping in mind that THE ANSWER is staring us in the face, readily available, yet we struggle, why?



If the human race gets wiped out by climate change, other species will survive and the earth will heal because there will be no more human pollution. We are fighting for our species‘ survival more than the planet’s survival.


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> If the human race gets wiped out by climate change, other species will survive and the earth will heal because there will be no more human pollution. We are fighting for our species‘ survival more than the planet’s survival.



There is a real question about how much damage we’ll do before we bite it. The worse would be a large scale nuclear exchange.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## Herdfan

Eric said:


> I always struggle with this personally, I would never advocate for anyone's death just because I have a different political belief. A good example is Rush Limbaugh, did he deserve to die because I have a different political view? Absolutely not and I have never supported that sort of language.
> 
> On the other hand I hear my wife say "*If they refuse the vaccine and die as a result then so be it"*, which I also really disagree with. However, unlike cancer or some other heinous disease, dying from COVID is now nearly 100% avoidable for those who choose to vaccinate. It's REALLY hard to understand why people would take such risks.



That is being ambivalent about it, which is completely different than rooting for people to die or being happy they died.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Went to Hollister this weekend to visit my parents.  It's about an hour south of the Bay Area.  It's surrounded by agriculture land and at some point probably leaned more right, but over the last couple decades it has become a hot spot for people to move from the Bay Area because the houses are cheaper.  My parents moved there about a decade ago and in that time they've continually been building new houses.  Entirely new neighborhoods pop up at about a rate of 1 per year.  So politically it's probably more spit than right leaning.

Having said that, it seems masks aren't really a thing there.  We went out to each twice.  The first place was a middle of the road burger/bar place.  The staff were wearing masks but nobody else was, even coming in or leaving the building.  More to my surprise at the most high end restaurant nobody was wearing a mask, not even the staff.  It's a a county outside the Bay Area so maybe their mandates are different.  

The experience made me feel grateful that I live in a county where the people are mostly on the same page and lean towards health and safety.  I can't imagine living in an area ruled by ignorance or where you might come under attack for going either direction.


----------



## Herdfan

JayMysteri0 said:


> The party that quotes "We the People" while pursuing voter suppression, is the first to accuse others of tyranny...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429281122253512707/
> 
> and catch irony.




The issue I have with Pelosi's edict was that at the time she issued it, it only applied to the House floor.  Masks were not required anywhere in the offices or corridors.  Just where there were TV cameras.  That tells me it was for show.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> The issue I have with Pelosi's edict was that at the time she issued it, it only applied to the House floor.  Masks were not required anywhere in the offices or corridors.  Just where there were TV cameras.  That tells me it was for show.



You dislike mask wearing, and you dislike Pelosi. That’s the actual “problem“ you have with the “edict.”

As for the actual facts about the mask order in question:









						VERIFY: The Attending Physician of the Capitol issued House mask mandate, not Speaker Nancy Pelosi
					

All over social media and on the floors of Congress, GOP lawmakers are criticizing House Speaker Pelosi for a masking rule she didn't institute.




					www.wusa9.com
				




Gotta wonder where you’re getting your info from….


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> You dislike mask wearing, and you dislike Pelosi. That’s the actual “problem“ you have with the “edict.”
> 
> As for the actual facts about the mask order in question:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> VERIFY: The Attending Physician of the Capitol issued House mask mandate, not Speaker Nancy Pelosi
> 
> 
> All over social media and on the floors of Congress, GOP lawmakers are criticizing House Speaker Pelosi for a masking rule she didn't institute.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wusa9.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gotta wonder where you’re getting your info from….




Actually, here are the facts.

Pelosi issued a mask mandate for the House floor in May AFTER the CDC Guidance removed it for vaxxed individuals:



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/05/14/pelosi-mask-mandate-house-scalise/
		









						Pelosi says masks to stay on House floor despite CDC guidance
					

The CDC announcement prompted some House Republicans to call on Pelosi and the Office of the Attending Physician to lift the mask rule.




					www.latimes.com
				




This is the one that only applied to the House floor, but not any of the offices or corridors.  (I posted two links so hopefully one won't be paywalled)

Pelosi, not the House doctor, then removed that mandate in June (Ok, technically the article said Democratic Leaders but that is Pelosi)









						Vaccinated lawmakers no longer required to wear masks on House floor
					

Lawmakers who are fully vaccinated against COVID-19 will no longer be required to wear masks in the House chamber, Democratic leaders announced Friday.The change reflects updated guidance from the …




					thehill.com
				




And this is the new one issued, as you noted, by the House doctor:









						Masks Will Return To The U.S. House And White House After The CDC Changes Guidance
					

Congress' attending physician announced vaccinated and unvaccinated House members will again have to mask up while in the U.S. Capitol or risk a fine.




					www.npr.org
				




So if you can find where I am incorrect, please let me know.  So I stand by what I posted that the inital mandate was for show.  My sources are the WaPo, LA Times, NPR and The Hill.  Sorry there is no Fox, OAN, NewsMax or Breitbart to attack.  The Hill is kind of in the middle, but their article isn't that important to my point.

Perhaps if you weren't so eager to jump on what I posted you could have done a little research first.  Like I did.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Actually, here are the facts.
> 
> Pelosi issued a mask mandate for the House floor in May AFTER the CDC Guidance removed it for vaxxed individuals:
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/05/14/pelosi-mask-mandate-house-scalise/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pelosi says masks to stay on House floor despite CDC guidance
> 
> 
> The CDC announcement prompted some House Republicans to call on Pelosi and the Office of the Attending Physician to lift the mask rule.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is the one that only applied to the House floor, but not any of the offices or corridors.  (I posted two links so hopefully one won't be paywalled)
> 
> Pelosi, not the House doctor, then removed that mandate in June (Ok, technically the article said Democratic Leaders but that is Pelosi)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vaccinated lawmakers no longer required to wear masks on House floor
> 
> 
> Lawmakers who are fully vaccinated against COVID-19 will no longer be required to wear masks in the House chamber, Democratic leaders announced Friday.The change reflects updated guidance from the …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And this is the new one issued, as you noted, by the House doctor:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Masks Will Return To The U.S. House And White House After The CDC Changes Guidance
> 
> 
> Congress' attending physician announced vaccinated and unvaccinated House members will again have to mask up while in the U.S. Capitol or risk a fine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So if you can find where I am incorrect, please let me know.  So I stand by what I posted that the inital mandate was for show.  My sources are the WaPo, LA Times, NPR and The Hill.  Sorry there is no Fox, OAN, NewsMax or Breitbart to attack.  The Hill is kind of in the middle, but their article isn't that important to my point.
> 
> Perhaps if you weren't so eager to jump on what I posted you could have done a little research first.  Like I did.



You completely changed the topic. The tweet you replied to was about the July 27 mask mandate. YOU made it about some past mandate that long since expired.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> You completely changed the topic. The tweet you replied to was about the July 27 mask mandate. YOU made it about some past mandate that long since expired.




You are correct.  I did not notice the date on that tweet.  My bad.

But it does not change my assertion that the first one was for show.


----------



## dukebound85

Deleted member 199 said:


> ... So, unvaccinated, infected people are sent home? Surely this is only for asymptotic/'mild' symptom cases? If they come in struggling to breath, surely they're not being told to go quarantine at home?



they should be.

Their "beliefs" should have consequences and not absorb the limited resources we have to treat those who have taken the precautions

No sympathy from me. They are what are keeping the outbreak going and infecting others. Should be criminal


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> You are correct.  I did not notice the date on that tweet.  My bad.
> 
> But it does not change my assertion that the first one was for show.




Your assertion is wrong. From the link you posted:



> She isn’t easing the requirement because it’s not known how many House members and their staffs are vaccinated, said her spokesman, Drew Hammill.




The new CDC rule was that *vaccinated* people didn’t need masks. Because a bunch of dipshit Congress-critters like Boebert and their ilk are so anti-vaccine, there was no way to know whether people coming onto the house floor were vaccinated or not. She COULD have required proof of vaccination for people coming onto the House floor, but there would have been backlash against that too. At least the “everybody wears a mask” wasn’t singling out the anti-vaxxers…

There’s no winning with the anti-mask, anti-vaccine crowd. No matter what you do, they will whine and cry. That’s because it’s all about their *feelings*, not about public health and safety.

Well, we’re all back to masks all the time again because of the anti-vax assholes. And you have the temerity to blame Pelosi? Get a clue, wake up and smell the bullshit.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429268020577320962/

It is interesting what motivates a particular crowd of people to give a shit about children in their schools.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Nobody "rooted" for this man to die, he seemed to be fine doing it himself

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429624449729368064/


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## hulugu

Runs For Fun said:


>




Hahaha. 

This is exactly right. People are being incoherent about the vaccines and about treatments.


----------



## lizkat

Huntn said:


> There is a real question about how much damage we’ll do before we bite it. The worse would be a large scale nuclear exchange.




 Nuclear warfare --nuclear winter!-- might be the worst for Earth as a habitat for organic life, but a virus is more likely to kill off the human species.

Example: a virus more clever than covid at hopping to new hosts and not killing a host too soon to make that hop, always presenting with a relatively long asymptomatic period,  but then leaving irremediable damage behind for the host to die from in a matter of a few weeks.   We ain't seen nothin' yet.

On the other hand we're dong a good job of ignoring climate change as a player with a great hand.  The rate of desertification of Africa is still rising,  and so much of the rainforests there and in Latin America are gone that the trees that are left are starting to work _against _climate change mitigation, becoming a source rather than a sink of carbon as they die off or grow more slowly in drought.









						Global warming fast shrinking rainforest role as climate protector
					

The amount of planet-warming carbon dioxide that can be sucked up from the atmosphere and stored by tropical forests is falling as the global climate heats up, researchers said on Wednesday.




					www.reuters.com
				






> Researchers, who tracked the growth and death of 300,000 trees in Africa and the Amazon, found that undisturbed tropical forests had started the process of switching from a carbon sink to a source, largely due to carbon losses from trees dying.
> 
> “Extra carbon dioxide boosts tree growth, but every year this effect is being increasingly countered by the negative impacts of higher temperatures and droughts which slow growth and can kill trees,” said study lead author Wannes Hubau of the Royal Museum for Central Africa in Belgium.
> 
> “Our modeling of these factors shows a long-term future decline in the African sink and that the Amazonian sink will continue to rapidly weaken, which we predict to become a carbon source in the mid-2030s,” he added in a statement.


----------



## Huntn

hulugu said:


> Hahaha.
> 
> This is exactly right. People are being incoherent about the vaccines and about treatments.



If you want something to be really sad about, in many cases it’s the stupid being driven by Right Wing Politics.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429809289632395265/


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> That is being ambivalent about it, which is completely different than rooting for people to die or being happy they died.



I think regardless of what we say/write, we are all ambivalent about it at this point. I don’t want anyone to die, but dayum!


Herdfan said:


> The issue I have with Pelosi's edict was that at the time she issued it, it only applied to the House floor.  Masks were not required anywhere in the offices or corridors.  Just where there were TV cameras.  That tells me it was for show.



Does she have power over the entire building? From the posts past this, I’d say not. She controls what she controls.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Here it is!








						FDA Approves First COVID-19 Vaccine
					

FDA approved the first COVID-19 vaccine, now marketed as Comirnaty, for the prevention of COVID-19 disease in individuals 16 years of age and older.




					www.fda.gov
				




Bring on the mandates!

"Wait and see" crowd:


----------



## JayMysteri0

Um...?



> COVID-19 patients must isolate or face fines, jail time under new MSDH order
> 
> 
> Violators could face misdemeanor or felony charges.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wlbt.com





> JACKSON, Miss. (WLBT) - As COVID-19 cases across the state continue to surge, state health leaders are hoping a new order will encourage people infected with the virus to self-isolate.
> 
> Friday, State Health Officer Dr. Thomas Dobbs handed down a mandate that all individuals, vaccinated or not, who test positive for COVID-19 must stay home upon learning they are infected.
> 
> Individuals who fail to do so could be charged with a misdemeanor, punishable by a fine of $500, six months’ imprisonment, or both, upon conviction. If a life-threatening disease is involved, failure to follow the order could result in a felony charge, carrying a fine of up to $5,000, five years in prison, or both.
> 
> The news comes as Mississippi continues to report thousands of new infections daily, and as it leads the nation in new cases per 100,000 inhabitants.
> 
> “Louisiana... They’ve had 36,000 cases in the last seven days with the rate of 791 cases per 100,000. When you look at Alabama... 21,000 cases in the last seven days. Their rate is 439 per 100,000 in the last seven days. Arkansas ... 528 per 100,000 in the last seven days. Mississippi... 25,000 cases in the last seven days, but our rate is 843 cases per 100,000 in the last seven days,” said State Epidemiologist Dr. Paul Byers.
> 
> Byers was speaking at the weekly COVID-19 update hosted by the Mississippi State Medical Association. “These numbers are staggering guys. They’re real and they’re staggering.”
> 
> According to the order, individuals must remain at home or in an “appropriate residential location” for 10 days from the onset of the illness or 10 days from the date of the positive test for those who are asymptomatic.
> 
> Negative tests results are not required to end the isolation at the end of the 10 days, but individuals must be fever-free for at least 24 hours and have an improvement in regard to other symptoms.
> 
> Meanwhile, Mississippi schools are required to exclude all students and faculty diagnosed with the virus from school settings during the isolation period.
> 
> A copy of the order is shown below.
> 
> In other news, Byers said he expects new guidelines from the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services to mandate vaccinations for all long-term care staffers.
> 
> “It may well be that pretty soon, CMS makes it mandatory for the facilities they oversee - that receive Medicare and Medicaid payments - those long-term care facilities will be required to have their staff vaccinated,” he said during the MSMA meeting. “I think that will be coming down the pipe too. That won’t be coming from the Department of Health. That will be coming from CMS.”




I'm not suuuurree about this...

I get the sentiment, but considering WHERE we are talking about, I'm concerned WHO would tend to get caught up in this.  Especially if they have employment that does NOT allow sick days, with the possibility of being fired, and are just worried about trying to survive.  Meanwhile those who cry the loudest that mask mandates are somehow like slavery, spread falsehoods about the vaccine, will be given warnings after the 3rd time they are caught outside with the virus.

This is a little worrying even for me.

Remember.  This is the place that has it's poison control begging SOME people not to take horse dewormer...


----------



## Huntn

lizkat said:


> Nuclear warfare --nuclear winter!-- might be the worst for Earth as a habitat for organic life, but a virus is more likely to kill off the human species.
> 
> Example: a virus more clever than covid at hopping to new hosts and not killing a host too soon to make that hop, always presenting with a relatively long asymptomatic period,  but then leaving irremediable damage behind for the host to die from in a matter of a few weeks.   We ain't seen nothin' yet.
> 
> On the other hand we're dong a good job of ignoring climate change as a player with a great hand.  The rate of desertification of Africa is still rising,  and so much of the rainforests there and in Latin America are gone that the trees that are left are starting to work _against _climate change mitigation, becoming a source rather than a sink of carbon as they die off or grow more slowly in drought.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Global warming fast shrinking rainforest role as climate protector
> 
> 
> The amount of planet-warming carbon dioxide that can be sucked up from the atmosphere and stored by tropical forests is falling as the global climate heats up, researchers said on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com



Not to beat a dead horse, but I think we are witnessing *Great Filter* action. I'm closer to the end than the beginning, so it's not going to make that much difference to me, but I feel depressed about the future of our species on planet Earth. An exaggeration? As a disinterested party (not referencing myself), it would interesting to witness this occurrence, like an episode of Star Trek.


----------



## JayMysteri0

As I said, stupid doesn't always happen in a vacuum.  It often gets help.  In this case...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429827930759258113/

Reminder:  You MUST be vaccinated to work in the Faux Newsroom, AND give them your vaccination status.

That is all.


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> As I said, stupid doesn't always happen in a vacuum.  It often gets help.  In this case...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429827930759258113/




So the post by @Runs For Fun a bit earlier was right on the money....  mind the moving goalposts!  

Some private equity print-media vulture with really deep pockets should expand into TV news, scoop up Fox --goalposts and all--, and then promptly move it to the far sidelines, doing what hedge funds do: cut costs, strip assets, load the thing up with debt and starve it to death.

Whatever happened to "buy and bury" as an acquisition strategy?  Tech behemoths do it all the time with potential competitors...


----------



## fooferdoggie

'It's impossible': Lack of Covid safeguards overwhelm school nurses​Florida's Hillsborough County Public Schools have had students in classrooms for only two weeks, and yet Katherine Burdge, a school nurse for the district, said she's more stressed out than at any other point during the coronavirus pandemic.

The district, the eighth largest in the U.S., has had to isolate or quarantine more than 13,485 students and employees since the start of August, and more than 2,650 of them have tested positive for Covid-19. In response, the Hillsborough County school board ordered a more restrictive mask mandate Wednesday after hours of debate, defying Gov. Ron DeSantis' order that masking decisions be made by parents.








						'It's impossible': Lack of Covid safeguards overwhelm school nurses
					

"School nurses here are facing a moral dilemma, because the protocols that are in place and coming from the state don't align with their values," one expert said.




					www.nbcnews.com
				



`


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Man Drives Car Into COVID-19 Vaccine Clinic Workers in California
					

Authorities are looking for the man alleged to have attacked two workers at a COVID-19 vaccine clinic in the Santa Clarita County area over the weekend.




					www.complex.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> As I said, stupid doesn't always happen in a vacuum.  It often gets help.  In this case...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429827930759258113/
> 
> Reminder:  You MUST be vaccinated to work in the Faux Newsroom, AND give them your vaccination status.
> 
> That is all.



Oh FFS. I called it that they would say "the approval was rushed".


----------



## JayMysteri0

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Man Drives Car Into COVID-19 Vaccine Clinic Workers in California
> 
> 
> Authorities are looking for the man alleged to have attacked two workers at a COVID-19 vaccine clinic in the Santa Clarita County area over the weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.complex.com



You guys decide Florida was getting too much attention?


----------



## lizkat

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Man Drives Car Into COVID-19 Vaccine Clinic Workers in California
> 
> 
> Authorities are looking for the man alleged to have attacked two workers at a COVID-19 vaccine clinic in the Santa Clarita County area over the weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.complex.com




Assault with a car used as deadly weapon...  road rage, covid rage... 

... and anger management 101 won't fix it.   It's all about me me me,  and also all about right damn now.

How does a country fix an epidemic of this stuff?   It's gone beyond toddler-style tantrums now.

I have scoffed at those who say we're headed to a civil war.  But an upswing in mental illness is part of the landscape of any war.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## JayMysteri0

I'm not sure to post this here or in the Florida thread, so maybe someone will post this again

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429787917782769671/



> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Group of South Florida doctors stage demonstration amid surge of unvaccinated COVID patients
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> theweek.com




THIS Twitter response sums up what the doctors are dealing with.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429819573193351168/


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> I'm not sure to post this here or in the Florida thread, so maybe someone will post this again
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429787917782769671/
> 
> 
> 
> THIS Twitter response sums up what the doctors are dealing with.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1429819573193351168/



People in healthcare are battling on multiple fronts:

Sheer physical and mental exhaustion from caring for COVID patients day after day, night after night, with no relief in sight in some places. It's especially hard for ED and ICU nurses, physicians, APPs, and other staff, because nothing can be done in most cases. Seeing relatively young people die in such numbers takes a toll that will last long beyond this pandemic.
Knowing that most of the pain and suffering could have been prevented by vaccination and NPIs like masking.
Anger at the politicians and other officials who care much more about being re-elected than helping their constituents. 
Rage at the people on Fox News and other media who purvey lies about mitigation measures even though they're required to follow them by company policy.
Knowing that they and their families may not be able to receive ICU or other advanced care, even for non-COVID conditions. Patients are being transferred hundreds of miles because no care is available locally.
Facing the prospect of yet another wave / surge this winter.
I keep hearing media reports about the healthcare system being at the breaking point. I disagree — in many locations, especially in the South, we're already well beyond that.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

FDA approval will not change anti-vaxxers' minds — but it does make vaccine mandates possible
					

Trumpers were using the FDA as an excuse, not a reason. Only personal consequences will persuade them to vaccinate




					www.salon.com
				





Last week, Dr. Anita Sircar, an infectious-disease physician in Los Angeles, wrote a moving piece for the Los Angeles Times about how doctors are losing compassion for COVID-19 patients, almost all of whom are willfully unvaccinated. She opens the article with a story of a 40-something father of two she had as a patient. His excuse for not vaccinating? "I was just waiting for the FDA to approve the vaccine first. I didn't want to take anything experimental."

As Dr. Sircar notes, this is the same man who "started taking some hydroxychloroquine he had found on the internet," only to find it didn't work. In the hospital, she offered to treat him with Remdesivir, which had been under the same emergency use authorization as the vaccines "for most of last year and had not been studied or administered as widely as COVID-19 vaccines." While he accepted this much more experimental treatment, just as he experimented on himself at home, it was too late. He died.

To be clear, the man's actual objection was not, as he said, that he "didn't want to take anything experimental." No, the likely reason was a right-wing propaganda blitz that has convinced Republican voters that refusing the shot is the best way to stick it to President Joe Biden and the hated Democrats. These are folks who booed Donald Trump himself for promoting the vaccination. The "FDA approval" excuse was only rolled out because even Trumpers know that saying "I'm risking COVID-19 to own the liberals" out loud sounds dumb. But remember, these are the same folks who reject the FDA's advice against eating horse paste.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Just heard Alex Jones called Trump a dumbass for telling people they should get vaccinated at his last rally.

This is starting to sound Iike the student becoming the master.  He gave them their wings. They learned to fly.  They don’t need him anymore.  The only question is will he realize that he is now their puppet and will that matter to him.  I think his playbook has gotten old. Can he come up with new material that will widely appeal to morons?


----------



## fooferdoggie

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Just heard Alex Jones called Trump a dumbass for telling people they should get vaccinated at his last rally.
> 
> This is starting to sound Iike the student becoming the master.  He gave them their wings. They learned to fly.  They don’t need him anymore.  The only question is will he realize that he is now their puppet and will that matter to him.  I think his playbook has gotten old. Can he come up with new material that will widely appeal to morons?



they learned to fly they flew over him and took a dump on his head.


----------



## Eric

The vaccine mandate is a slippery slope that leads to... hyperbole from
      PoliticalHumor


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430274161331613706/



> Parents get coached on how to escape mask and vaccine rules
> 
> 
> ALSEA, Ore. (AP) — An Oregon school superintendent is telling parents they can get their children out of wearing masks by citing federal disability law. A pastor at a California megachurch is offering religious exemptions for anyone morally conflicted over vaccine requirements. And Louisiana’s...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> weartv.com





> ALSEA, Ore. (AP) — An Oregon school superintendent is telling parents they can get their children out of wearing masks *by citing federal disability law*. A pastor at a California megachurch is offering religious exemptions for anyone morally conflicted over vaccine requirements.
> 
> And Louisiana’s attorney general has posted sample letters on his office’s Facebook page for those seeking to get around the governor’s mask rules.
> 
> Across the U.S., religious figures, doctors, public officials and other community leaders are trying to help people circumvent COVID-19 precautions.
> 
> While proponents of these workarounds say they are looking out for children’s health and parents’ rights, others say such stratagems are dishonest and irresponsible and could undermine efforts to beat back the highly contagious delta variant.
> 
> Mask and vaccine requirements vary from state to state but often allow exemptions for certain medical conditions or religious or philosophical objections.



Stressing the shitty part of all of this


> by citing federal disability law.



from individuals who aren't disabled.


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


>




I'm sure that bag hanging around her neck is actually a GOOCHI ...


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430491301154156548/

I understand it comes with less masks & vaccines for some customers, for new & improved speedier results.

Best thing it's free and you don't have to do anything.  Bring friends, family, & people you don't even know down with you. 






Oh, 



> There's no such thing as Covid-22, but it went viral anyway - here's what actually happened
> 
> 
> 'I would like to take the opportunity to clarify here. It is not accurate to call it Covid-22'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> inews.co.uk





> As we continue to emerge from the pandemic, the last thing people want to hear is the term Covid-22.
> 
> It went viral on social media after some took the term to mean another variant was on the horizon next year.
> 
> In reality, it was a poorly-worded phrase to refer to the state of the coronavirus outbreak in 2022, according to one professor.





> What is Covid-22?​Covid-22 is a phrase used by Professor Sai Reddy, an associate professor of Systems and Synthetic Immunology at the university ETH Zurich, during an interview about the pandemic with _Blick_, a Swiss German-language newspaper.
> 
> Commenting on the vaccination programme and the emergence of the contagious Delta variant, Prof Reddy, according to a translation, said: “This is no longer Covid-19. I would call it Covid-21.”
> 
> Later, he commented on the next phase of the pandemic which could see the Beta or Gamma variants become more infectious, or the Delta strain could develop mutations.
> 
> “That will be the big problem for the coming year. Covid-22 could get worse than what we are witnessing now,” he said.
> 
> His comments led to alarming headlines. According to a translation, the _Blick_ interview was titled: “Covid-22 could get worse.”






> 'COVID-22' Isn't a Real Thing—Even Though It's All Over Social Media Right Now. Here's What You Need to Know
> 
> 
> 'COVID-22' isn't a real illness, but people are posting about it on social media. Find out what experts say.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.health.com




In case you saw Covid 22 trending yesterday or see it today.


----------



## fooferdoggie

this is not stupid but in that it she needed to do it. 
Watch Now: Tulsa ER nurse wants world to see her 3-year-old's battle against COVID-19​








						Tulsa ER nurse wants world to see her 3-year-old's battle against COVID-19
					

“If you choose not to be vaccinated, you’ve made a choice for my daughter, too. Your choice led to my innocent child being hospitalized."




					tulsaworld.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Missouri mayor asks permission to treat friend’s COVID with unproven ivermectin​








						Missouri mayor asks permission to treat friend’s COVID with unproven ivermectin
					

The mayor of a central Missouri resort town sparked outrage and debate this week after going on social media to ask for prayers and support in his effort to treat a longtime friend suffering from C…




					www.ozarksfirst.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Missouri mayor asks permission to treat friend’s COVID with unproven ivermectin​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Missouri mayor asks permission to treat friend’s COVID with unproven ivermectin
> 
> 
> The mayor of a central Missouri resort town sparked outrage and debate this week after going on social media to ask for prayers and support in his effort to treat a longtime friend suffering from C…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ozarksfirst.com



I will pray for that mayor - that God gives him a brain.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> FDA approval will not change anti-vaxxers' minds — but it does make vaccine mandates possible
> 
> 
> Trumpers were using the FDA as an excuse, not a reason. Only personal consequences will persuade them to vaccinate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.salon.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Last week, Dr. Anita Sircar, an infectious-disease physician in Los Angeles, wrote a moving piece for the Los Angeles Times about how doctors are losing compassion for COVID-19 patients, almost all of whom are willfully unvaccinated. She opens the article with a story of a 40-something father of two she had as a patient. His excuse for not vaccinating? "I was just waiting for the FDA to approve the vaccine first. I didn't want to take anything experimental."
> 
> As Dr. Sircar notes, this is the same man who "started taking some hydroxychloroquine he had found on the internet," only to find it didn't work. In the hospital, she offered to treat him with Remdesivir, which had been under the same emergency use authorization as the vaccines "for most of last year and had not been studied or administered as widely as COVID-19 vaccines." While he accepted this much more experimental treatment, just as he experimented on himself at home, it was too late. He died.
> 
> To be clear, the man's actual objection was not, as he said, that he "didn't want to take anything experimental." No, the likely reason was a right-wing propaganda blitz that has convinced Republican voters that refusing the shot is the best way to stick it to President Joe Biden and the hated Democrats. These are folks who booed Donald Trump himself for promoting the vaccination. The "FDA approval" excuse was only rolled out because even Trumpers know that saying "I'm risking COVID-19 to own the liberals" out loud sounds dumb. But remember, these are the same folks who reject the FDA's advice against eating horse paste.



_Oh no, I won’t take an experimental vaccine!!!, but I will take animal medication labeled not for human consumption, not designed to fight a virus because  I’m really smart like Donny.  _

Irresponsible, dangerous, self destructive because they are just too self absorbed, blinded by being too political in addition to maybe being too… STUPID and Donny’s sucker to boot.*

*Qualifier: it’s not just Donny acolytes/Republicans who are the problem, it appears to be a class problem although those are not supposed to exist In the US.

When you look at the situation these people are putting the nation in, it could be argued, they  deserve what they get. Unfortunately it’s not just themselves deciding to climb into the lion cage at the zoo to pet them, it’s the equivalent of opening the gate so the lions can wander and eat people at their leisure.

There should be no free ride for this kind of stupid and it appears this is the only way these type of people learn, whether you love them or not. Karma demands some serious consequences or health ramifications that results  from such terrible choices, that hurt not just themselves, but EVERYONE around them. It might even have a bigger impact on their psyche if an exposed parent or child dies in their place. 

I’m not hoping for this, instead I wish people could be smart. In terms of health of the species, Darwin Awards help the species, by clearing out the hinderance to our success as a species. The bottom line, we still have a pandemic going on because of these ignoramuses. It’s enough to make you question if there should be intelligence qualifications to be allowed to vote.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Huntn said:


> _Oh no, I won’t take an experimental vaccine!!!, but I will take animal medication labeled not for human consumption, not designed to fight a virus because  I’m really smart like Donny.  _
> 
> Irresponsible, dangerous, self destructive because they are just too self absorbed, blinded by being too political in addition to maybe being too… STUPID and Donny’s sucker to boot.*
> 
> *Qualifier: it’s not just Donny acolytes/Republicans who are the problem, it appears to be a class problem although those are not supposed to exist In the US.
> 
> When you look at the situation these people are putting the nation in, it could be argued, they  deserve what they get. Unfortunately it’s not just themselves deciding to climb into the lion cage at the zoo to pet them, it’s the equivalent of opening the gate so the lions can wander and eat people at their leisure.
> 
> There should be no free ride for this kind of stupid and it appears this is the only way these type of people learn, whether you love them or not. Karma demands some serious consequences or health ramifications that results  from such terrible choices, that hurt not just themselves, but EVERYONE around them. It might even have a bigger impact on their psyche if an exposed parent or child dies in their place.
> 
> I’m not hoping for this, instead I wish people could be smart. In terms of health of the species, Darwin Awards help the species, by clearing out the hinderance to our success as a species. The bottom line, we still have a pandemic going on because of these ignoramuses. It’s enough to make you question if there should be intelligence qualifications to be allowed to vote.




I have no idea what the average process of dying is in this case. You have to wonder what is going through their head as they directly contributed to their own death over politics. You could imagine some Hollywood scenario where somebody is holding a gun to their head while they’re pleading “Please don’t kill me! I have kids!”, but in this case I can’t imagine anything other than “Well, that was dumb” as they have effectively reduced the value of human life to zero. It’s just embarrassingly disgraceful and probably won’t be a topic frequently discussed by those who knew them.  Dying in a drunk driving accident would probably get more sympathy.


----------



## Eric

And the pushback continues, I was wondering how long it would take before insurance coverage would be impacted.



> Delta Air Lines is raising health insurance premiums for unvaccinated employees by $200 a month to cover higher Covid costs












						Delta Air Lines is raising health insurance premiums for unvaccinated employees by $200 a month to cover higher Covid costs
					

Delta is the latest company to issue new rules for employee vaccinations, but stopped short of an outright mandate.




					www.cnbc.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Maybe we can throw the south a bone and return to their glory days of segregation divided by the vaccinated and unvaccinated.  “Hey! The unvaccinated drinking fountain is in the back by the dumpster! Git!”  It should give them the nostalgia feels.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Maybe we can throw the south a bone and return to their glory days of segregation divided by the vaccinated and unvaccinated.  “Hey! The unvaccinated drinking fountain is in the back by the dumpster! Git!”  It should give them the nostalgia feels.



THEN they can finally say this...





And happily take comfort in believing this while they are sick...


----------



## Eric

What a shame, time to start putting the antivaxxers in tents in the parking lot. Those of us doing the right thing should get priority going forward.


This is infuriating, heartbreaking and was totally preventable from
      WhitePeopleTwitter


----------



## SuperMatt

Some ideas:

Require the vaccine for all firearm purchases.
Surreptitiously tape syringes to the seats at all NASCAR events.
Sneak into houses and vaccinate people in their sleep.
Facebook blocks everybody who doesn’t get the vaccine. Can’t spread anti-vax BS on Facebook if you aren’t on Facebook.


----------



## SuperMatt

SHOCKING NEWS!

People who refused the vaccine “because it wasn’t FDA approved“ have instantly generated new reasons not to get the shot.



			https://wapo.st/3krbqvP
		




> Jennifer Bridges, a nurse in Houston, had told The Post in May that she didn’t trust the vaccines because they lacked full approval. But now that the Pfizer-BioNTech shot has checked that box, Bridges said she and her allies don’t believe regulators did their due diligence.





> “Everybody who didn’t want the shot is literally appalled by the fact that it got FDA approved,” Bridges said Tuesday, arguing that the FDA had rushed to approve the shots despite evidence of their waning efficacy.





> Bridges, who was fired from Houston Methodist in June for refusing to complywith its vaccination mandate, said she’s now helping organize other workers — including flight attendants, health-care workers and more — who don’t want to get vaccinated “so they can help fight mandates” as a team.


----------



## MEJHarrison

SuperMatt said:


> Some ideas:
> 
> Require the vaccine for all firearm purchases.
> Surreptitiously tape syringes to the seats at all NASCAR events.
> Sneak into houses and vaccinate people in their sleep.
> Facebook blocks everybody who doesn’t get the vaccine. Can’t spread anti-vax BS on Facebook if you aren’t on Facebook.




Don't tell them it's a vaccine, tell them it's just Freedom Formula to protect them from the China Virus.
Don't tell them it's a shot, tell them it's checking for 5G probes.
Wear a MAGA hat.

Figuring out how to trick a dumb person takes about the same brain power as blinking one's eyes.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Sadly I could see this working


----------



## JayMysteri0

And for your daily dose of rage, inspired by masks

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430669370640928769/

Hell is coming... because of masks?

One may find themselves on the way to hell because of a lack of masks, but...

Also, it's interesting that these type of individuals who want to spout the Nuremberg code...



> Fact check: Mandatory mask wearing is not a ‘war crime’ that violates the Nuremberg Code
> 
> 
> Social media users have been sharing posts which claim that the mask mandates are a direct violation of the Nuremberg Code, a set of research ethics principles for human experimentation designed after the Second World War. This claim is false: the Nuremberg Code relates...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com





> Social media users have been sharing posts which claim that the mask mandates are a direct violation of the Nuremberg Code, a set of research ethics principles for human experimentation designed after the Second World War. This claim is false: the Nuremberg Code relates specifically to medical experiments on humans and does not apply to mask-wearing, which is a public health intervention.





> “Your Governments are in direct violation of the Nuremberg Code!” and “Mandatory masks are a direct violation of The Nuremberg Code,” say the posts (here  ,  here).
> 
> The screenshots claim to contain Article 6, Sections 1 and 3 of the Nuremberg code, and highlight the following sentence: “Leaders should be aware that mandating masks on the citizens of a nation and preventing their access to food, healthcare, transport or education if they don’t comply, is a war crime.”
> 
> However, they are not from the Nuremberg Code.





> The 1947 Nuremberg Code refers to the ten principles listed in the “Permissible Medical Experiments” section of volume II of the Trials of War Criminals Before the Nuremberg Military Tribunals seen here here and here here . The sixth of these principles, the closest thing to a possible Article 6, reads: “The degree of risk to be taken should never exceed that determined by the humanitarian importance of the problem to be solved by the experiment.” There are no subsections and no references to masks.
> 
> The Nuremberg Code requires that human participants in experiments give informed consent and was adopted as part of the 1949 Geneva Conventions (here), so breaking the code would constitute a war crime (here).
> 
> However, this code is about the rights of subjects in medical research and experiments. Experts told Reuters that mask-wearing falls under public health interventions, not medical research or medical interventions.




It's amazing how much work these individuals ( and take time off ) to work themselves based on falsehoods & feelings.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Also Florida...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430515300001255424/


> Somebody pays the cost of monoclonal antibody treatments | Letters
> 
> 
> Here’s what readers are saying in Tuesday’s letters to the editor.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.tampabay.com





> The treatment isn’t really free​*Gov. DeSantis announces local antibody treatment sites | Aug. 20*
> 
> Monoclonal antibody treatments are not free. They are bought and paid for by the federal government, with our tax dollars. The facilities that are used are paid for by someone, most likely our insurance or tax dollars. The staff in those facilities do not work for free. Someone has to pay them, in the end, probably taxpayers. None of those things are “free.” When Gov. Ron DeSantis repeatedly says they are “free,” someone should ask him who is bearing the costs for the staff and the facilities? He should be held accountable. We deserve to know the price — and who is paying it.




How about that vaccine, eh?


----------



## JayMysteri0

WHAT  THE  FUCK?!!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430623887763648519/



> Anti-Mask Father Accused of Shoving Student While Protesting Broward's Mask Policy
> 
> 
> A man who has been attempting to bring his maskless daughter to school was arrested Wednesday for shoving a student while protesting Broward County Public Schools’ mandatory mask policy. His attorney is now asking why the student who started the incident isn’t also facing charges. Over the past...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcmiami.com





> A man who has been attempting to bring his maskless daughter to school was arrested Wednesday for shoving a student while protesting Broward County Public Schools' mandatory mask policy.
> 
> Over the past few days, Dan Bauman, 50, has been recording his attempts to get his daughter into Fort Lauderdale High School without a mask. In one video, he's heard telling a school official that his daughter "has a right to go in" and that "this is illegal what you’re doing."
> 
> “I don’t care, the school board policy is illegal, and she’s not gonna put on a mask, no matter what, it’s not gonna happen,” Bauman said in a previous interview with NBC 6.
> 
> Bauman was outside Fort Lauderdale High School once again on Wednesday morning, accompanying his daughter as she tried to enter the gate without a mask.
> 
> "Bauman was videotaping other students with his phone and causing a disturbance at the gate," a Fort Lauderdale Police spokesperson said. In an arrest report, Bauman was also described as "known to cause disruption due to protesting the school board's mask policy."
> 
> According to the report, a student was heard saying, "I've had enough for four days," and walked up to Bauman. She attempted to grab his cellphone while he was recording.
> 
> Bauman then pushed the student by the shoulder and grabbed her hand, twisting her arm, Fort Lauderdale police said in the report. An officer and security guard had to pull Bauman away from the student.
> 
> Bauman was arrested and charged with aggravated child abuse, according to online jail records. If convicted, he faces a maximum 30-year sentence and a $10,000 fine.
> 
> Bauman remains in Broward County's main jail pending a bond hearing. His lawyer, Corey Strolla, says Bauman was a victim of a robbery by sudden snatching and that he "used absolutely no unnecessary physical force to legally obtain his property back in his rightful possession."


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> WHAT  THE  FUCK?!!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430623887763648519/



Throw the book at him. Attack a child, enjoy your 30 years in prison.


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> What a shame, time to start putting the antivaxxers in tents in the parking lot. Those of us doing the right thing should get priority going forward.
> 
> 
> This is infuriating, heartbreaking and was totally preventable from
> WhitePeopleTwitter



Yep, agreed 100%, definitely do not penalize those who are team players, hence my previous comment, send the uncaccinated home to take their chances because they knew best not to get vaccinated. It’s called adult responsibility. Wait, would they claim not to be adults If it would get them admitted?


----------



## Yoused

In a way, I understand the anti-mask attitude. We have seen numerous images of cities in China where half the people, or more, wear masks walking down the street (primarily, AAUI, to deal with air quality problems). And China is, after all, one of them backward 3rd-world-type countries run by an oppressive commie dictatorship.

Therefore, if Chinese Commies are frequent mask wearers, that is a wrong way to be, and we do not want to be like that. And anyway, freedom is what *I say* it is, and if you are not doing freedom the way I tell you to, you are a godless socialist oppressor.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> And for your daily dose of rage, inspired by masks
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430669370640928769/
> 
> Hell is coming... because of masks?
> 
> One may find themselves on the way to hell because of a lack of masks, but...
> 
> Also, it's interesting that these type of individuals who want to spout the Nuremberg code...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's amazing how much work these individuals ( and take time off ) to work themselves based on falsehoods & feelings.



Why do these school board meetings seem to bring all of the batshit insane people out of the woodwork?


----------



## lizkat

Yoused said:


> In a way, I understand the anti-mask attitude. We have seen numerous images of cities in China where half the people, or more, wear masks walking down the street (primarily, AAUI, to deal with air quality problems). And China is, after all, one of them backward 3rd-world-type countries run by an oppressive commie dictatorship.
> 
> Therefore, if Chinese Commies are frequent mask wearers, that is a wrong way to be, and we do not want to be like that. And anyway, freedom is what *I say* it is, and if you are not doing freedom the way I tell you to, you are a godless socialist oppressor.




Might be giving them too much credit.   A lot are just authoritarian followers of that former guy...  and doing their thing of being hyper-contrarian now because their Authoritarian in Chief got the boot back in November.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> Also Florida...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430515300001255424/
> 
> 
> 
> How about that vaccine, eh?



These people are crazy. They will try literally anything even with little to no evidence it's effective against COVID (how about that "I did research" phrase they like to throw around? I'm sure they did that beyond listening to whatever conservative is shilling something like dewormers) except the one damn thing that is proven to be extremely effective. The vaccine. It's like they're so caught up with "owning the libs".


----------



## JayMysteri0

If true, Kentucky reminding the country who they elect

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430727522963046401/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> If true, Kentucky reminding the country who they elect
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430727522963046401/



You need to carry a credit card to pay at the restaurant, and an ID if you want to drink at the bar. But sure, let’s lose our mind over a vaccine card. Grow up, people.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Going against FDA warnings, Arkansas physician gives anti-parasite drug to jail inmates with COVID-19









						Arkansas doctor who prescribed ivermectin to jail detainees for COVID now under investigation by medical board
					

The doctor said he would stop prescribing it to inmates if the sheriff asked him to, but added, "he's told me he's not going to do that."




					www.cbsnews.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Capital Regional doctor removed for offering $50 mask opt-out letters​








						Capital Regional doctor removed for offering $50 mask opt-out letters
					

Multiple WCTV viewers sent tips to our newsroom about Brian Warden’s Facebook posts promoting the “medical opt-out interview” screenings.




					www.wctv.tv


----------



## JayMysteri0

One thing Covid stupidity has shown us is the hypocrisy of old talking points from those who always sided with business over the individual.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430722982691975169/

The example as pointed out.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430741838281990145/

When times were different it was, "you don't like the pay? get a new job", "you don't like the boss? get a new job", don't like the working conditions?  get a new job", "don't like the owner's beliefs or politics? get a new job", etc.

NOW of course for these same people SUDDENLY the individual is more important OVER the business.  "You can't tell me what I need to do, to work for you, and collect a paycheck from you!"

Mind you this also the group of people who had no issue with vaccines a year ago.  Especially if it meant the end of wearing masks & getting back to normal.  ESPECIALLY if it was ANOTHER president who believed the FDA would take to long & he's a no nonsense get things kind of guy his believers said.  NOW all this warping & speeding to a FDA approval finally is too fast for them under a DIFFERENT president.

It's just mind blowing what hypocrisy & inconsistency a pandemic has brought out in some people.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> Going against FDA warnings, Arkansas physician gives anti-parasite drug to jail inmates with COVID-19
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Arkansas doctor who prescribed ivermectin to jail detainees for COVID now under investigation by medical board
> 
> 
> The doctor said he would stop prescribing it to inmates if the sheriff asked him to, but added, "he's told me he's not going to do that."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com




Makes sense.  I mean, take your average doctor.  Half their peers are _dumber_ than they are.  Of that bottom group, _someone_ needs to take the job at the prison.  I suspect they're not the best of the best looking for ways to pay back society.  I suspect it's more a choice of "the job at the prison" vs. "working a fast food drive-thru".  On the flip side, the prison is probably thrilled to find someone who knows which end of the shot goes in the arm.  I'd guess most prison doctors are two steps up from homeless financial planners.

Just to be completely transparent, I've never been to prison or a prison doctor.  This is all just speculation.  If I actually did have access to a prison doctor, I doubt I'd have access to be posting here.


----------



## Pumbaa

MEJHarrison said:


> Makes sense.  I mean, take your average doctor.  Half their peers are _dumber_ than they are.  Of that bottom group, _someone_ needs to take the job at the prison.  I suspect they're not the best of the best looking for ways to pay back society.  I suspect it's more a choice of "the job at the prison" vs. "working a fast food drive-thru".  On the flip side, the prison is probably thrilled to find someone who knows which end of the shot goes in the arm.  I'd guess most prison doctors are two steps up from homeless financial planners.
> 
> Just to be completely transparent, I've never been to prison or a prison doctor.  This is all just speculation.  If I actually did have access to a prison doctor, I doubt I'd have access to be posting here.



If you did have access to that particular prison doctor, you probably wouldn’t live to tell about it anyway.


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


>



If God wanted us to SCUBA dive we would've been born with a mask and an air tank!


----------



## Eric

Thoughts and prayers from
      LeopardsAteMyFace


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Covid data disappearing in some states even as delta surges
					

As Covid case numbers rise nationwide, Georgia and some other states have restricted the case count data they share publicly.




					www.nbcnews.com
				




“We’ve found the biggest cause of concern, sharing data.  Problem solved.”


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> If true, Kentucky reminding the country who they elect
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430727522963046401/




Just wait until all the 21 and below kids find out Kentucky doesn't require an ID to get into a bar or to drink.


----------



## JayMysteri0

JayMysteri0 said:


> If true, Kentucky reminding the country who they elect
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430727522963046401/



It seems it was true

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430978018349039617/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430978022044282889/

The fact that this group of people can't see the irony of once being the ones to say others have TDS. Are now the ones who everyday show further decline mentally & into their feelings to the point of total derangement.  Yelling there will be hell to pay, BUT they are NOT threatening anyone.  They are just saying.  To even considering making any comparisons to things like the Holocaust & American slavery that actually affected, changed, and ended lives... to being inconvenienced over a fucking piece of cloth.

Seriously.  Grow the FUCK up!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431008976406081536/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430649969719922688/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1430649969719922688/



Triage means helping those with the highest chance of survival. Sounds like most COVID-19 patients that end up in the ICU don’t make it out.


----------



## SuperMatt

Highlights (lowlights?) of an anti-vax rally:


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> WHAT  THE  FUCK?!!




Seriously, you touch my child, I'll split you in fucking half.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## hulugu

DT said:


> Seriously, you touch my child, I'll split you in fucking half.




Yep. We're going to count all the bones by breaking them one at a time.

Speaking of COVID stupid, I went to a school board meeting, where a bunch of whinging dinguses roared about how the mask mandate was unfair. One particular dildo decided to yell at me that I had no right to photograph him, and demanded my news outlet. 

I, of course, responded that he had no expectation of privacy at a public forum, and that I had the right to do so under the First Amendment. He responded with who gave me the right to just take photographs, and I replied James Fucking Madison. Then, I told him to go fuck himself. And, I apparently said this so aggressively that he withered, and retreated. And, spent the rest of the night avoiding my gaze.

These goddamned people.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Texas Anti-Mask 'Freedom Rally' Organizer Fighting For His Life With COVID-19
					

His pregnant wife said this week that the hospital was "out of options" for her husband.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

This is a bit of a long & scary thread that goes into the peddling of things like horse wormer to people instead of a vaccine

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431040456364810242/


----------



## fooferdoggie

the logic fiefs logic. hopefully he was arrested.
Man suffocates baby at school board meeting to show how terrible masks, anti-maskers are








						VIDEO: Parents who disagree with school mask mandate shout during meeting
					

A meeting meant to unify a plan to get students back in the classroom ended abruptly after parents who don't want their children to wear masks showed up to express




					www.wfsb.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

I got a kick out of the sister she took care of the problem.


----------



## JayMysteri0

AMEN!




TESTIFY!!

Fuck those corny @## bitches.  Retire, you won't be missed, ...until we inevitably read about your mea culpa about the vaccine.


----------



## JayMysteri0

A new reason to be wary of the police.  When they roll up on you, THEY maybe the one's unvaccinated?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431309613681594369/

Or do we recognize that some police unions don't like the idea of rules being applied to them?


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> A new reason to be wary of the police.  When they roll up on you, THEY maybe the one's unvaccinated?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431309613681594369/
> 
> Or do we recognize that some police unions don't like the idea of rules being applied to them?



I think this video is worth a watch. It includes an interview with the Miami police chief who talks about the fact that numerous officers have died of COVID-19.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## hulugu

JayMysteri0 said:


> A new reason to be wary of the police.  When they roll up on you, THEY maybe the one's unvaccinated?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431309613681594369/
> 
> Or do we recognize that some police unions don't like the idea of rules being applied to them?




COVID-19 killed more police officers in 2020 and 2021 than anything else. In 2021, 119 police officers died from COVID-19, and 39 were shot to death. 

Of course, the head cowboy-mufti moron in Pinal County Sheriff Mark Lamb decided to take this opportunity to pledge that he would never require his deputies to get a COVID-19 vaccination in a classic bit of wingnut grandstanding.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> I think this video is worth a watch. It includes an interview with the Miami police chief who talks about the fact that numerous officers have died of COVID-19.





hulugu said:


> COVID-19 killed more police officers in 2020 and 2021 than anything else. In 2021, 119 police officers died from COVID-19, and 39 were shot to death.
> 
> Of course, the head cowboy-mufti moron in Pinal County Sheriff Mark Lamb decided to take this opportunity to pledge that he would never require his deputies to get a COVID-19 vaccination in a classic bit of wingnut grandstanding.




The issue raised isn't about how many officers compared to other ways they way were killed or even others.  It's the fact that it was decided that amongst those given the vaccine FIRST were the Police.  Because of not only recognition of the importance of their jobs, but because they are amongst those that risk the most early.  Only to have that tossed aside because of... reasons.

Once again, some people are offered a vaccine desperately wanted elsewhere, and they decide to pass.

Some police unions are more than happy to jump up on this. because it's yet something else that some of them feel they need not heed.  As if the police are separate from the rest.

The officers are like anyone else though.  They make a decision that affects not just themselves, but others as well.  If SOME die by Covid, it's their choice because some didn't want to take the vaccine.  But some police unions will use it as yet another thing to make political, and not really about the concern for the health of the individuals.



> https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/05/02/police-low-vaccination-rates-safety-concerns/





> Police officers were among the first front-line workers to gain priority access to coronavirus vaccines. But their vaccination rates are lower than or about the same as those of the general public, according to data made available by some of the nation’s largest law enforcement agencies.
> 
> The reluctance of police to get the shots threatens not just their own health, but also the safety of people they’re responsible for guarding, monitoring and patrolling, experts say.
> 
> At the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department, just 39 percent of employees have gotten at least one dose, officials said, compared to more than 50 percent of eligible adults nationwide. In Atlanta, 36 percent of sworn officers have been vaccinated. And a mere 28 percent of those employed by the Columbus Division of Police — Ohio’s largest police department — report having received a shot.
> 
> “I think it’s unacceptable,” Joe Lombardo, the head of Las Vegas police and sheriff of Clark County, said of the meager demand for the shots within his force.
> 
> The numbers paint a troubling picture of policing and public health. Because officers have high rates of diabetes, heart disease and other conditions, their hesitancy puts them at greater risk of serious illness from the coronavirus while also undermining force readiness, experts said. Police officers were more likely to die of covid-19 last year than of all other causes combined, according to data compiled by the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial Fund.






> Police hesitancy also means officers may be vectors of spread to vulnerable people with whom they interact during traffic stops, calls for service and other high-contact encounters. That could thwart efforts to restore community trust in a moment of heightened scrutiny after last month’s conviction of ex-officer Derek Chauvin in the killing of George Floyd.
> 
> “Police touch people,” said Sharona Hoffman, a professor of law and bioethics at Case Western Reserve University. “Imagine having a child in the car who’s not vaccinated. People would want to know if a police officer coming to their window is protected.”
> 
> Police ambivalence about immunization finds a parallel among other front-line workers. Just 52 percent of health-care workers surveyed by The Washington Post and the Kaiser Family Foundation between Feb. 11 and March 7 said they had received at least one dose.
> One solution is for departments to make vaccination compulsory, according to experts in bioethics and public health, just as some health-care settings and institutions of higher education have begun doing.
> 
> But department leaders and union officials said in interviews that such requirements could backfire or lead to lengthy litigation. Of more than 40 major metropolitan police departments contacted by The Post, none had made vaccination compulsory for employees.


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> AMEN!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TESTIFY!!
> 
> Fuck those corny @## bitches.  Retire, you won't be missed, ...until we inevitably read about your mea culpa about the vaccine.



Football players are famous for all having STEM-type PhDs and stuff.


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> A new reason to be wary of the police.  When they roll up on you, THEY maybe the one's unvaccinated? Or do we recognize that some police unions don't like the idea of rules being applied to them?




maybe they are just clueless psychopathic dumbfucks



			
				John Cantanzara said:
			
		

> “We’re in America, G-ddamn it. We don’t want to be forced to do anything. Period. This ain’t Nazi f---ing Germany, [where they say], ‘Step into the f---ing showers. The pills won’t hurt you.’ What the f--k?”


----------



## SuperMatt

Yoused said:


> Football players are famous for all having STEM-type PhDs and stuff.



Well they are vaccinated at 93%… a lot better than nurses and police officers. Now THAT is messed up. What could the difference be? Trying to think….. hmm….

Could it be… the NFL requiring it? Almost seems like requiring it actually works. I am already seeing lots of military members getting vaccines the day the news dropped that it is going to be mandatory.


----------



## Eric

CNN is savage.


Karen Alley is out of her mind from
      FuckYouKaren


----------



## Pumbaa

Eric said:


> CNN is savage.
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/FuckYouKaren/comments/pd87y9



Indeed. And it’s real, if a bit dated. 230K American lives… Those were the days!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1322206119486464004/


----------



## SuperMatt

This probably isn’t surprising to most people here, but you are 15 times more likely to die from COVID if you don’t get a vaccine.









						Report: Unvaccinated people are more than 15 times more likely to die from COVID-19
					

The North Carolina Department of Health and Human Services released new data showing that unvaccinated people were 15.4 times, or 1,540 percent, more likely to die from COVID-19 during the four-week period ending Aug. 21.




					www.wbtv.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Antivax police captain: I have been silenced. Covid-19: hold my ivermectin
Anti-vaxx police officer who had been taking horse worm medicine dies from Covid​








						Anti-vaxx police officer who had been taking horse worm medicine dies from Covid
					

Joe Manning complained that Facebook ‘censured’ him for posting misinformation about the coronavirus




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## fooferdoggie

Hop on the bus, kids. We're going to camp
RN Shannon Eckelbarger recently told the Shasta, CA Bd of Supervisors that hospitals who refuse to give alternative covid treatments are “guilty of murder.” She also said the CDC are about to round up unvaccinated people on busses and trains and put them in “covid camps.”

\https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431258225815560195/


----------



## Eric

Oh FFS Texas never lets us down.


We live in the dumbest timeline from
      facepalm


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> She also said the CDC are about to round up unvaccinated people on busses and trains and put them in “covid camps.”




That's just dumb.  What they're _actually_ planning is to reach a certain percentage of vaccinated people.  Then the CDC is going to flip a switch to activate whatever it is we've been given.  And then...

Sorry, I _really_ wish I knew what came next, but that's all I got. It was a friend's co-worker spouting this crap. She didn't figure out what came next either. My guess is, there's no thoughts at all beyond "they're going to flip a switch". These things usually aren't that well thought through.  

But what I DO know is if this all goes south, I really want it to be a master switch somewhere.  If I simply get picked up in a run-of-the-mill vehicle and shoved onto a train, I'm going to be sorely disappointed.  That's just so last century.  If you're going to trick me, plug my ass into the Matrix or something.


----------



## Renzatic

I do find it funny how the same people who were saying that covid is no worse than the flu, and hasn't seen anyone get anything more than the sniffles are talking about their dozens of vaccinated friends who are now dying en masse of the same virus.


----------



## SuperMatt

MEJHarrison said:


> That's just dumb.  What they're _actually_ planning is to reach a certain percentage of vaccinated people.  Then the CDC is going to flip a switch to activate whatever it is we've been given.  And then...
> 
> Sorry, I _really_ wish I knew what came next, but that's all I got. It was a friend's co-worker spouting this crap. She didn't figure out what came next either. My guess is, there's no thoughts at all beyond "they're going to flip a switch". These things usually aren't that well thought through.
> 
> But what I DO know is if this all goes south, I really want it to be a master switch somewhere.  If I simply get picked up in a run-of-the-mill vehicle and shoved onto a train, I'm going to be sorely disappointed.  That's just so last century.  If you're going to trick me, plug my ass into the Matrix or something.



Yeah, if the idea is to mind-control or track the Republicans, why would they put something into a vaccine that none of them are taking? If you want to mind-control or track them, you‘d put a tracker on all guns and pickup trucks and a mind-control chemical in the food at Cracker Barrel.


----------



## Renzatic

SuperMatt said:


> a mind-control chemical in the food at Cracker Barrel.




Don't bring Cracker Barrel into this! Cracker Barrel ain't done nothing to you!


----------



## JayMysteri0

One of the sad things about all this, is that some of the more well known victims are people who at one time liked to mock others.  In their suffering it's basically turned that all around back on them.

Case in point, I'm sure you remember 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431190248948645895/

Which understandably leads to this kind of response on social media, when the family understandably wants help in desperate times.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431485279022505984/

Because NOW such individuals are in need of the compassion they weren't so high on when others may have needed it instead.

Or...

You'd expect sympathy for a police officer passing, but when the circumstances are revealed...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431650926977171466/

The pandemic is upending so many norms that it shouldn't, but for some people it's a result of their own actions.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> One of the sad things about all this, is that some of the more well known victims are people who at one time liked to mock others.  In their suffering it's basically turned that all around back on them.
> 
> Case in point, I'm sure you remember
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431190248948645895/
> 
> Which understandably leads to this kind of response on social media, when the family understandably wants help in desperate times.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431485279022505984/
> 
> Because NOW such individuals are in need of the compassion they weren't so high on when others may have needed it instead.
> 
> Or...
> 
> You'd expect sympathy for a police officer passing, but when the circumstances are revealed...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431650926977171466/
> 
> The pandemic is upending so many norms that it shouldn't, but for some people it's a result of their own actions.



I feel like we've hit some next level of stupidity lately. It's incredibly infuriating reading all this crap. Take a look at r/HermanCainAward and r/LeopardsAteMyFace 

This sums up my feelings pretty well


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431697246911877122/

If your reaction to mask requirements where they've been clearly in place for more than a year involve the 'n' word, I'm thinking wearing a mask isn't your real issue.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431698116063997952/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431700148980170754/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431700793015558147/

Yet, these people lose their shit when they hear a military leader use the term "white rage".


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Possibly (probably) not appropriate to this thread, but I appreciate it's neutral message.  I know James recently moved out of CA for what he said was hunting practices and being attacked for it, but I feel he is on the same page socially.  I'm fairly confident he is on the same page with vaccinations, but knows a lot of his fans probably aren't and I respect his decision to not pick a side.  He, and many other celebrities, didn't sign up for this role model shit and on some level I don't think we should expect them to.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## JayMysteri0

As much as this person makes my skin crawl, I hope this isn't the worst

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431478569457393664/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431479542439370754/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431482905440788485/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Florida, again...   

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431662749017415680/


----------



## Thomas Veil

You know, I’d always heard that a lot of Republicans don't give a shit because they’re expecting the End Times. I’d always put that down to a gross exaggeration.

And then…









						Reeves: Mississippians 'Less Scared' of COVID, 'Believe in Eternal Life'
					

"When you believe in eternal life...then you don't have to be so scared of things," the Mississippi Republican governor said.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> Florida, again...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431662749017415680/



ma just like trump with that other drug. Jesus idiots on the same sagging tree branch of stupid.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> Florida, again...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431662749017415680/




DeSantis will go to hell and back to find ways to treat the ill.  But if you want to prevent people getting sick in the first place, then you're somehow the enemy.

It just makes no sense.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Thomas Veil said:


> You know, I’d always heard that a lot of Republicans don't give a shit because they’re expecting the End Times. I’d always put that down to a gross exaggeration.
> 
> And then…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reeves: Mississippians 'Less Scared' of COVID, 'Believe in Eternal Life'
> 
> 
> "When you believe in eternal life...then you don't have to be so scared of things," the Mississippi Republican governor said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com



My favorite response
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431737441304682497/

The problem?  He isn't speaking for just 'R's.  He's elected to run a state filled with a variety of people.  So for anyone not republican, or republican who's taken the vaccine, wears a mask, and wants to live...  Evidently 'F' 'em?

God will sort it out?

That's NOT the sentiments I want from the guy in charge of running things in a state that is worried about taking on anymore patients.


----------



## Edd

The list of famous anti-vaxxers dying from COVID grows. This prick took up an ICU bed for 3 weeks before he bought it. I can find no sympathy. Fuck him.









						Anti-vax radio host Marc Bernier has died after being hospitalized for COVID-19
					

Bernier, who worked at WNDB for decades, was public about the fact that he would not get vaccinated against COVID-19.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## Alli

Tate Reeves is about to lose half his state to Ida. Maybe between Ida and Covid there will be one less R state by next week.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Edd said:


> The list of famous anti-vaxxers dying from COVID grows. This prick took up an ICU bed for 3 weeks before he bought it. I can find no sympathy. Fuck him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-vax radio host Marc Bernier has died after being hospitalized for COVID-19
> 
> 
> Bernier, who worked at WNDB for decades, was public about the fact that he would not get vaccinated against COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.businessinsider.com



Another idiot down.

Boo hoo.


----------



## SuperMatt

Edd said:


> The list of famous anti-vaxxers dying from COVID grows. This prick took up an ICU bed for 3 weeks before he bought it. I can find no sympathy. Fuck him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-vax radio host Marc Bernier has died after being hospitalized for COVID-19
> 
> 
> Bernier, who worked at WNDB for decades, was public about the fact that he would not get vaccinated against COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.businessinsider.com



First Rush Limbaugh died, now a few more right-wing radio “personalities” have died of coronavirus. Seems like there’s a bit of a vacuum there. Could be an opening for somebody who’s always wanted to host their own show...


----------



## fooferdoggie

Those aren't "portable morgues" heading to Florida amid "unprecedented deaths", they're "freedom fridges" heading to Florida amid "unprecedented patriotism"
14 Portable Morgues Heading To Central Florida Hospitals Amid ‘Unprecedented Deaths’​








						14 Portable Morgues Heading To Central Florida Hospitals Amid 'Unprecedented Deaths'
					

After overwhelming numbers of COVID-19 cases, hospitals are running out of room for bodies.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## Thomas Veil

SuperMatt said:


> First Rush Limbaugh died, now a few more right-wing radio “personalities” have died of coronavirus. Seems like there’s a bit of a vacuum there. Could be an opening for somebody who’s always wanted to host their own show...



Oh, I’m sure. The line of people with big mouths and empty heads is a long one.


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431697246911877122/
> 
> If your reaction to mask requirements where they've been clearly in place for more than a year involve the 'n' word, I'm thinking wearing a mask isn't your real issue.
> 
> Yet, these people lose their shit when they hear a military leader use the term "white rage".



Some _follow up_ on this incident. Still, it's highly concerting that he wasn't taken into custody much sooner. Heck, try to walk through airport security with a large tube of toothpaste and you'll be wrestled to the ground by TSA agents in seconds...


----------



## Thomas Veil

From that follow up link:



> A Local 10 viewer said just before this confrontation, the man entered the women’s restroom near gate D23 and got into a physical altercation with his girlfriend. The viewer said the man was then denied boarding on the flight due to his aggressive and possibly Intoxicated behavior.



Good call there.


----------



## JayMysteri0

A little history that some of Covid stupidity is based on...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432060194276659203/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432060201511837710/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432060205001478144/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432061615084539910/

...



> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Onesimus (Bostonian) - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Thomas Veil

Good article from The Atlantic which states exactly how I feel about anti-vaxxers and anti-maskers. We are done catering to your irrational whims. Time’s up. 









						Vaccine Refusers Don’t Get to Dictate Terms Anymore
					

People who opt out of shots shouldn’t expect their employers, health insurers, and fellow citizens to accommodate them.




					www.theatlantic.com
				






> …the specific feelings and concerns of vaccine refusers should be largely irrelevant to vaccinated people who are eager to move on with their lives. Americans are entitled to make their own decisions, but their employers, health insurers, and fellow citizens are not required to accommodate them.





> When a ship is going down, passengers aren’t given the luxury of quibbling with the color or design of the life vest, and they can’t dither forever about whether to put one on or not. Emergencies invariably force people to make some choices that they might not consider ideal, but asking everyone to get vaccinated against a potentially lethal virus is not a big imposition.




There is no reason why in a pandemic that affects _everybody_ we should be dictated to by a recalcitrant minority.


----------



## Roller

Thomas Veil said:


> Good article from The Atlantic which states exactly how I feel about anti-vaxxers and anti-maskers. We are done catering to your irrational whims. Time’s up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vaccine Refusers Don’t Get to Dictate Terms Anymore
> 
> 
> People who opt out of shots shouldn’t expect their employers, health insurers, and fellow citizens to accommodate them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theatlantic.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There is no reason why in a pandemic that affects _everybody_ we should be dictated to by a recalcitrant minority.



Remember the allegations that the ACA incorporated "death panels?" Those claims were false. But, although we in healthcare are duty bound to treat patients regardless of their track record, political beliefs, religion, or any other non-medical considerations, vaccination status will have to factor into triage if resources remain as scarce as they are now in many places. For example, many hospitals are running low on oxygen. Layered on top of skilled staffing shortages, this will mean providing care to the people most likely to benefit from it.

I'm strongly in favor of strict vaccine mandates across the board. If people claim an exemption, especially on so-called religious grounds, they should be required to be tested regularly and follow non pharmaceutical  interventions like masking.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Ol' Ron catches a legal backhand thanks to both common f'n sense about "rights", and HIS own doing






Also if the anti vaxxers want to keep pushing, organizations will finally push back



> Duke employees who do not receive COVID-19 vaccine by Oct. 1 will be terminated, ineligible for rehire
> 
> 
> Duke University employees will have until Oct. 1 to prove they have received the COVID-19 vaccine, or be terminated and ineligible to be rehired at Duke in the future.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wral.com




Key point


> Employees that are fired for not receiving a vaccine will not be eligible to be rehired, according to Duke officials.
> 
> Vaccines are currently required for Duke students and faculty. Duke is one of the only major universities in the area to mandate vaccines.




NOT eligible to be rehired, they aren't fooling around.  How are you going to require students to vaccinate for the safety of themselves & others, and the employees NOT expect to vaccinate for the same reasons?  

This needs to keep happening.

If people want to keep on with their "freedumbs", go on.  Do it in the comfort of your own bubble where you won't risk infecting others.  Meanwhile the rest who've decided to actually get on with their lives & get things back to normal, like the anti vaxxers used to claim, will be free to exercise THEIR rights to do so at reduced risk.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> If people want to keep on with their "freedumbs", go on. Do it in the comfort of your own bubble where you won't risk infecting others. Meanwhile the rest who've decided to actually get on with their lives & get things back to normal, like the anti vaxxers used to claim, will be free to exercise THEIR rights to do so at reduced risk.



The GOP can’t really complain about this either. They were such champions of Hobby Lobby refusing to cover contraception or bigoted bakers refusing to bake cakes for gay people. They also have fought hard to make almost every state an “at-will employment” state. So the things companies are doing now to require vaccines were enabled by their own policy choices of the last few decades.


----------



## fooferdoggie

This is jsut going to get worse.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1431774976407867393/


----------



## SuperMatt

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432101388318822401/


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432101388318822401/



I've known some horse people and I have no doubt they would have pictures of themselves with their horses.


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> I've known some horse people and I have no doubt they would have pictures of themselves with their horses.



Same here... my aunt among them.


----------



## Alli

SuperMatt said:


> First Rush Limbaugh died, now a few more right-wing radio “personalities” have died of coronavirus. Seems like there’s a bit of a vacuum there. Could be an opening for somebody who’s always wanted to host their own show...



And in the 5 o’clock hour, it’s “Conspiracy Theories” with your host of hosts, Donnie J!


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> Remember the allegations that the ACA incorporated "death panels?" Those claims were false. But, although we in healthcare are duty bound to treat patients regardless of their track record, political beliefs, religion, or any other non-medical considerations, vaccination status will have to factor into triage if resources remain as scarce as they are now in many places. For example, many hospitals are running low on oxygen. Layered on top of skilled staffing shortages, this will mean providing care to the people most likely to benefit from it.
> 
> I'm strongly in favor of strict vaccine mandates across the board. If people claim an exemption, especially on so-called religious grounds, they should be required to be tested regularly and follow non pharmaceutical  interventions like masking.



What pisses me off is that the same people who legitimately criticize socialism for rewarding people who are half-assing, do the very thing when it comes to COVID: leaching off the efforts of others to contain the pandemic. They've now successfully turned this into a social darwinistic shit show. In the meantime, I have cancer patients who still didn't mount a humoral immune response despite a booster.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432101388318822401/



I'm really really really sick of this ivermectin shit from everyone

Sick of the conspiracy theorists because they are stupid. Sick of those who mock ivermectin, because the evidence isn't settled, so they will look bad *if* it turns out to have a *weak* mortality reducing effect. It's very very very hard to remain impartial in these issues, when laypeople startbetting on outcomes creating an unnecessary conflict of interest.

Two months ago I reviewed the evidence and it got me really really pissed off. In the meta-analyses (when they make moderately compromised at best efforts to pool data from multiple studies) the mortality reducing effect came from a subset of studies, from not very reputable institutions with oftentimes disproportionately high mortality reported in the control groups. One of these "studies" was actually retracted. The better designed ones were negative.

I think there *might be* a very weak signal for a mortality reducing effect, but you have to understand biases that come from lack of/improper blinding and patient selection. *I can certainly tell that the mortality reduction is AT BEST** 1-2 orders of magnitude lower than vaccination*. So as long as people are pushing for to study it as a treatment to complement vaccination, it's totally fine. The moment they demand unproven therapies without evidence, or try to sell it as an alternative to the vaccine problems start.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> I'm really really really sick of this ivermectin shit from everyone
> 
> Sick of the conspiracy theorists because they are stupid. Sick of those who mock ivermectin, because the evidence isn't settled, so they will look bad *if* it turns out to have a *weak* mortality reducing effect. It's very very very hard to remain impartial in these issues, when laypeople startbetting on outcomes creating an unnecessary conflict of interest.
> 
> Two months ago I reviewed the evidence and it got me really really pissed off. In the meta-analyses (when they make moderately compromised at best efforts to pool data from multiple studies) the mortality reducing effect came from a subset of studies, from not very reputable institutions with oftentimes disproportionately high mortality reported in the control groups. One of these "studies" was actually retracted. The better designed ones were negative.
> 
> I think there *might be* a very weak signal for a mortality reducing effect, but you have to understand biases that come from lack of/improper blinding and patient selection. *I can certainly tell that the mortality reduction is **at best 1-2 orders of magnitude lower than vaccination*. So as long as people are pushing for to study it as a treatment to complement vaccination, it's totally fine. The moment they demand unproven therapies without evidence, or try to sell it as an alternative to the vaccine problems start.



My opinion on this is similar to my opinion that drug commercials should not be allowed on TV. People see something advertised and want it, whether it’s the right medicine for them or not. I’m sure some of those medicines are good for the people that need them. Ivermectin might be good when used properly by a doctor. But an average person buying it and using it as a preventative? That’s asking for trouble.


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> What pisses me off is that the same people who legitimately criticize socialism for rewarding people who are half-assing, do the very thing when it comes to COVID: leaching off the efforts of others to contain the pandemic. They've now successfully turned this into a social darwinistic shit show. In the meantime, I have cancer patients who still didn't mount a humoral immune response despite a booster.



To clarify you are leaving out one important component besides "social darwinistic shit show".  Capitalism, making a buck. A lot of what you see that drives some of this is based on the old carny traveling sideshow days of pushing 'snake oil'.  Whether it's what brought us ivermectin from the traveling road show of doctors that had one believe cysts are the results of sex with demons.  Or a governor who back at the start of the pandemic took $18.5 million from wrestling entertainment company to be classified as an "essential service" to keep operating when other companies who didn't have that kind of money shut down.  To now taking money from the guy doing well with these covid treatement ( not vaccine ) pop up clinics. 

Only the days of snake oil ultimately being harmless, have long passed, with no concern to it's victims.

It's all about the benjamins baby!





_No insults directed at those seeking to capitalize off of the easily influenced who are now the ones dying to intentionally peddled misinformation. _

Certainly wouldn't want to insult those folks.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Thomas Veil said:


> You know, I’d always heard that a lot of Republicans don't give a shit because they’re expecting the End Times. I’d always put that down to a gross exaggeration.
> 
> And then…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reeves: Mississippians 'Less Scared' of COVID, 'Believe in Eternal Life'
> 
> 
> "When you believe in eternal life...then you don't have to be so scared of things," the Mississippi Republican governor said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com




The evangelicals got wind that atheists are getting into heaven through a “being a good person without His guidance” loophole.  So they’re trying to get as many followers up their to join in A Billion Soul March to His throne to remind Him being a good person has nothing to do with getting into heaven.  Getting into heaven should be decided by how much exclusionary scripture you can warp and how many times you’ve publicly judged and condemned people in His name.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> My opinion on this is similar to my opinion that drug commercials should not be allowed on TV. People see something advertised and want it, whether it’s the right medicine for them or not. I’m sure some of those medicines are good for the people that need them. Ivermectin might be good when used properly by a doctor. But an average person buying it and using it as a preventative? That’s asking for trouble.



AFAIK you need an FDA approval for that, which is a major difference. 

-----


JayMysteri0 said:


> To clarify you are leaving out one important component besides "social darwinistic shit show".  Capitalism, making a buck. A lot of what you see that drives some of this is based on the old carny traveling sideshow days of pushing 'snake oil'.  Whether it's what brought us ivermectin from the traveling road show of doctors that had one believe cysts are the results of sex with demons.  Or a governor who back at the start of the pandemic took $18.5 million from wrestling entertainment company to be classified as an "essential service" to keep operating when other companies who didn't have that kind of money shut down.  To now taking money from the guy doing well with these covid treatement ( not vaccine ) pop up clinics.
> 
> Only the days of snake oil ultimately being harmless, have long passed, with no concern to it's victims.
> 
> It's all about the benjamins baby!
> 
> 
> _No insults directed at those seeking to capitalize off of the easily influenced who are now the ones dying to intentionally peddled misinformation. _
> 
> Certainly wouldn't want to insult those folks.




The carnival analogy is a good one, because the share of potential profit is comparable to that of carnivals vs the whole entertainment industry. Drug repurposing is generally a good thing, so the issue is that people misinterpret a process/trend that could be beneficial in the right context. Ironically I clashed with a PhD _biologist_ who recommended ivermectin as an adjunctive therapy to cancer. WTF. There's literally no study on this... In the meantime, I found a single study on another dewormer in the context of cancer, which happened to be published my very colleagues. So if something actually good comes out of drug repurposing, people will already have a negative attitude towards it.


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> AFAIK you need an FDA approval for that, which is a major difference.
> 
> The carnival analogy is a good one, because the share of potential profit is comparable to that of carnivals vs the whole entertainment industry. Drug repurposing is generally a good thing, so the issue is that people misinterpret a process/trend that could be beneficial in the right context. Ironically I clashed with a PhD _biologist_ who recommended ivermectin as an adjunctive therapy to cancer. WTF. There's literally no study on this... In the meantime, I found a single study on another dewormer in the context of cancer, which happened to be published my very colleagues. So if something actually good comes out of drug repurposing, people will already have a negative attitude towards it.



Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:








						Judge orders Cinci hospital to treat COVID-19 patient with Ivermectin, despite CDC warnings - Ohio Capital Journal
					

A Butler County judge ruled in favor of a woman last week who sought to force a hospital to administer Ivermectin — an animal dewormer that federal regulators have warned against using in COVID-19 patients — to her husband after several weeks in the ICU with the disease. Butler County Common...




					ohiocapitaljournal.com
				




Hopefully, this decision will be appealed and struck down forcefully by a higher court. But if it stands, patients will bring similar lawsuits every time some new, untested therapy is proposed. I realize that courts sometimes get involved in medical care decisions, as for example when they order therapy for children over their parent's objections. But this is dangerous. Every sane healthcare provider and professional organization should speak out against this ruling.

BTW, I know and hope that medications indicated for other conditions may turn out to be effective against COVID-19. Hundreds are in various stages of clinical investigation. But until they have a demonstrable risk:benefit profile in well-conducted studies, it's harmful to evangelize their use, and it's even more harmful to compel it.


----------



## thekev

SuperMatt said:


> Highlights (lowlights?) of an anti-vax rally:





After seeing that last guy, I really want to go out and purchase a megaphone. Right now, I'm imagining how much entertainment I could derive by using it in conjunction with an air horn.


----------



## thekev

JayMysteri0 said:


>




Do keep in mind that this is probably exacerbated by many members of the same group failing to take other precautions (masks, social distancing, etc).


----------



## Pumbaa

Roller said:


> Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge orders Cinci hospital to treat COVID-19 patient with Ivermectin, despite CDC warnings - Ohio Capital Journal
> 
> 
> A Butler County judge ruled in favor of a woman last week who sought to force a hospital to administer Ivermectin — an animal dewormer that federal regulators have warned against using in COVID-19 patients — to her husband after several weeks in the ICU with the disease. Butler County Common...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ohiocapitaljournal.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, this decision will be appealed and struck down forcefully by a higher court. But if it stands, patients will bring similar lawsuits every time some new, untested therapy is proposed. I realize that courts sometimes get involved in medical care decisions, as for example when they order therapy for children over their parent's objections. But this is dangerous. Every sane healthcare provider and professional organization should speak out against this ruling.
> 
> BTW, I know and hope that medications indicated for other conditions may turn out to be effective against COVID-19. Hundreds are in various stages of clinical investigation. But until they have a demonstrable risk:benefit profile in well-conducted studies, it's harmful to evangelize their use, and it's even more harmful to compel it.




Not available in my country so I had to get it somewhere else. At least it was a doctor behind prescribing Ivermectin and not the court. Still smells fishy to me.



> After Smith was on the ventilator for 19 days, [Smith's wife and guardian] reached out to Dr. Fred Wagshul about Ivermectin usage to treat COVID-19, according to court documents. Wagshul prescribed 30mg of Ivermectin to Smith, but the hospital staff refused to administer this prescription.


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge orders Cinci hospital to treat COVID-19 patient with Ivermectin, despite CDC warnings - Ohio Capital Journal
> 
> 
> A Butler County judge ruled in favor of a woman last week who sought to force a hospital to administer Ivermectin — an animal dewormer that federal regulators have warned against using in COVID-19 patients — to her husband after several weeks in the ICU with the disease. Butler County Common...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ohiocapitaljournal.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, this decision will be appealed and struck down forcefully by a higher court. But if it stands, patients will bring similar lawsuits every time some new, untested therapy is proposed. I realize that courts sometimes get involved in medical care decisions, as for example when they order therapy for children over their parent's objections. But this is dangerous. Every sane healthcare provider and professional organization should speak out against this ruling.
> 
> BTW, I know and hope that medications indicated for other conditions may turn out to be effective against COVID-19. Hundreds are in various stages of clinical investigation. But until they have a demonstrable risk:benefit profile in well-conducted studies, it's harmful to evangelize their use, and it's even more harmful to compel it.



WTF is up with judges telling doctors how to do their jobs? If a judge tells a doctor to administer a drug that then kills somebody... ????? The judiciary in this country seems to need reforming.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Roller said:


> Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:




Now that's taking things WAY too far.  Doctors swear an oath to do no harm.  I don't see how a judge can overrule that.

Second, if you want to stick your damn nose into things, mandate the vaccine, not unproven medications.  Wield your power to prevent people from getting sick, not to let them pick their own treatment after getting sick.

It's like abolishing speed limits and drunk driving laws and trying to solve all the problems that would bring with better air bags.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge orders Cinci hospital to treat COVID-19 patient with Ivermectin, despite CDC warnings - Ohio Capital Journal
> 
> 
> A Butler County judge ruled in favor of a woman last week who sought to force a hospital to administer Ivermectin — an animal dewormer that federal regulators have warned against using in COVID-19 patients — to her husband after several weeks in the ICU with the disease. Butler County Common...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ohiocapitaljournal.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, this decision will be appealed and struck down forcefully by a higher court. But if it stands, patients will bring similar lawsuits every time some new, untested therapy is proposed. I realize that courts sometimes get involved in medical care decisions, as for example when they order therapy for children over their parent's objections. But this is dangerous. Every sane healthcare provider and professional organization should speak out against this ruling.
> 
> BTW, I know and hope that medications indicated for other conditions may turn out to be effective against COVID-19. Hundreds are in various stages of clinical investigation. But until they have a demonstrable risk:benefit profile in well-conducted studies, it's harmful to evangelize their use, and it's even more harmful to compel it.




Ooh, this is disturbing. This reminds me why I hated practicing in Ohio... 



> Julie Smith [patient's wife] found Ivermectin on her own and connected with Dr. Fred Wagshul, an Ohio physician who her lawsuit identifies as “one of the foremost experts on using Ivermectin in treating COVID-19.” He prescribed the drug, and the hospital refused to administer it.




For those who aren't in the field, there are a bunch of major red flags here:
1. You hardly ever prescribe drugs to a patient that is not under your direct inpatient care (rare exceptions are drugs that require special training like prescribing chemotherapy)
2. If you do so, you do it in collaboration with the team who actually is responsible for any side-effects and who are responsible for the day-to-day care planning
3. They could have requested a transfer if the hospital this guy is practicing out of can provide similar or higher level of care (and the patient is stable enough for transport)
4. How can someone be the "foremost expert" of something but have no peer reviewed publication in like 29 years on anything? (He has an unimpressive CV: https://covid19criticalcare.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/FLCCC-Alliance-member-CV-Wagshul.pdf)

But the absurdity isn't over here:


> Julie Smith filed the lawsuit on behalf of her husband of 24 years. He tested positive for COVID-19 July 9, was hospitalized and admitted to the ICU July 15, and was sedated and intubated and placed on a ventilator Aug. 1. He later developed a secondary infection he’s still wrestling with as of Aug. 23, court records say.



The guy had definitely cleared the virus already, so what's the expectation here? Timetravel?!


----------



## Runs For Fun

Roller said:


> Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge orders Cinci hospital to treat COVID-19 patient with Ivermectin, despite CDC warnings - Ohio Capital Journal
> 
> 
> A Butler County judge ruled in favor of a woman last week who sought to force a hospital to administer Ivermectin — an animal dewormer that federal regulators have warned against using in COVID-19 patients — to her husband after several weeks in the ICU with the disease. Butler County Common...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ohiocapitaljournal.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, this decision will be appealed and struck down forcefully by a higher court. But if it stands, patients will bring similar lawsuits every time some new, untested therapy is proposed. I realize that courts sometimes get involved in medical care decisions, as for example when they order therapy for children over their parent's objections. But this is dangerous. Every sane healthcare provider and professional organization should speak out against this ruling.
> 
> BTW, I know and hope that medications indicated for other conditions may turn out to be effective against COVID-19. Hundreds are in various stages of clinical investigation. But until they have a demonstrable risk:benefit profile in well-conducted studies, it's harmful to evangelize their use, and it's even more harmful to compel it.



Oh FFS Ohio.


----------



## Thomas Veil

P_X said:


> This reminds me why I hated practicing in Ohio...



Wait a minute…you were _here??_

Why didn’t you stop in and say hi?


----------



## Pumbaa

Thomas Veil said:


> Wait a minute…you were _here??_
> 
> Why didn’t you stop in and say hi?



Quick! Get a court order and have it fixed. Traveling through time is apparently a reasonable thing then, as noted by @P_X.


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> For those who aren't in the field, there are a bunch of major red flags here:




I would probably just call him a shithead.

For reference as to why:



> In an interview, Wagshul said the science behind Ivermectin’s use in COVID-19 patients is “irrefutable.” The CDC and FDA engaged in a “conspiracy,” he said, to block its use to protect the FDA’s emergency use authorization for COVID-19 vaccines. He said the mainstream media and social media companies have been engaging in “censorship” on Ivermectin’s merits, and that the U.S. government’s refusal to acknowledge its benefits amounts to genocide.




and..



> “If we were a country looking at another country allowing those [COVID-19] deaths daily … we would have been screaming, ‘Genocide!’” he said.




seriously (emphasis, mine)?




> Dr. Leanne Chrisman-Khawam, a physician and professor at the Ohio University Heritage College of Osteopathic Medicine, called the FLCCCA “snake oil salesmen.” She reviewed the association’s research on the drug’s uses and said there are some serious problems with its cited studies: many of them don’t show positive results, and those that do bear design flaws like *small control groups, unaccounted for variables, non-blinded studies*, not accounting for mitigations like vaccines and masking practices, and others.







SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432101388318822401/




How do you guys even find this shit? Also, for once it's not Futurama, even though Leela was a centaur in one episode. This time I'm going with Father Ted.


----------



## Eric

SMH


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/peisbv


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> SMH
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/peisbv



I pray that they learned something from this...


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Wait a minute…you were _here??_
> 
> Why didn’t you stop in and say hi?



I was too busy noping outta there


----------



## User.45

thekev said:


> I would probably just call him a shithead.




The thing is, you start understanding publications when you start publishing. Somebody with 1 cited paper in google scholar should not be writing guidelines and should definitely not make statements on the level of evidence.


----------



## Thomas Veil

And now a report from our affiliate in Florida, WDOA:


----------



## Herdfan

This probably would be funnier if not so true:


----------



## Runs For Fun

Eric said:


> SMH
> 
> 
> Pray for me! from
> facepalm



Why is it always send thoughts and prayers with these people?


SuperMatt said:


> I pray that they learned something from this...



They won’t. If they don’t die they’ll just say they were healed by all the thoughts and prayers.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Because at this point, it isn't hard to find, your daily dose of Covid Ka razy!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432478919299641348/


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> The thing is, you start understanding publications when you start publishing. Somebody with 1 cited paper in google scholar should not be writing guidelines and should definitely not make statements on the level of evidence.




That in itself holds in a lot of areas. People are usually recognized as experts in a particular area due to their ability to meaningfully contribute to answers needed by their peers. If they aren't publishing their knowledge in some format, you don't know whether it will hold up under criticism by others in their field.

Note that the comment regarding non-blinded studies and small control samples in conjunction with the silliness of people trying to prescribe their own treatment is what got to me. This goes beyond someone ignorant claiming to be an expert, as there are potential consequences.


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> Ooh, this is disturbing. This reminds me why I hated practicing in Ohio...
> 
> For those who aren't in the field, there are a bunch of major red flags here:
> 1. You hardly ever prescribe drugs to a patient that is not under your direct inpatient care (rare exceptions are drugs that require special training like prescribing chemotherapy)
> 2. If you do so, you do it in collaboration with the team who actually is responsible for any side-effects and who are responsible for the day-to-day care planning
> 3. They could have requested a transfer if the hospital this guy is practicing out of can provide similar or higher level of care (and the patient is stable enough for transport)
> 4. How can someone be the "foremost expert" of something but have no peer reviewed publication in like 29 years on anything? (He has an unimpressive CV: https://covid19criticalcare.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/FLCCC-Alliance-member-CV-Wagshul.pdf)
> 
> But the absurdity isn't over here:
> 
> The guy had definitely cleared the virus already, so what's the expectation here? Timetravel?!



Calling Wagshul's CV unimpressive is itself an understatement. He's published two articles in his career, one this year on antibiotics in asthma, and a case report in 1991. His only recognition was a "1967-1971 Scholastic Award Ohio State University," whatever that is. Under board certification, he's listed as eligible for the American Board of Internal Medicine, with mention of Pulmonary Medicine and Critical Care Medicine without elaboration. Actually, there is no certification in Pulmonary Medicine — it's Pulmonary Disease. As best as I can tell, he's not board certified in anything. His listed academic appointments include being a founding member of the FLCCC, but it's not an academic institution.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> Calling Wagshul's CV unimpressive is itself an understatement. He's published two articles in his career, one this year on antibiotics in asthma, and a case report in 1991. His only recognition was a "1967-1971 Scholastic Award Ohio State University," whatever that is. Under board certification, he's listed as eligible for the American Board of Internal Medicine, with mention of Pulmonary Medicine and Critical Care Medicine without elaboration. Actually, there is no certification in Pulmonary Medicine — it's Pulmonary Disease. As best as I can tell, he's not board certified in anything. His listed academic appointments include being a founding member of the FLCCC, but it's not an academic institution.



You're right. It appears that he never had internal medicine board cert (ABIM drops nothing). I don't think you can sit for the pulmonary boards without that. His licence in OH is expiring in a month. We'll see if he gets an extension. At least he's indeed listed on the AOA website, which is shocking. He seems to have a clinic where he does ivermectin televisits and that's it. https://www.lungcenterofamerica.org/copy-of-care-team


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432421066719342597/

Mitch, you're either an idiot, liar, or both.

Everyone knows you are NOT an idiot.

FUCK YOU for you tacit enabling of this shit, then wanting to act surprised when it starts to bite you & your state in the ass.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432421066719342597/
> 
> Mitch, you're either an idiot, liar, or both.
> 
> Everyone knows you are NOT an idiot.
> 
> FUCK YOU for you tacit enabling of this shit, then wanting to act surprised when it starts to bite you & your state in the ass.



Sorta rhetorical, but does anybody believe anything Mitch says? There's the strontium atomic clock, and there's Mitch. You always know what he's up to: whatever keeps him and his corporate overlords in power.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Families line up outside Venice chiropractor’s office to get medical exemption forms for school mask mandate​








						Families line up outside Venice chiropractor’s office to get medical exemption forms for school mask mandate
					

Families were lined up outside a chiropractor’s office in Venice on Monday night hoping to get medical exemption forms for their children in response to Sarasota County’s new school mas…




					www.wfla.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

got to love total stupid. so doctors who hate trump stop this drug from being used.
Rand Paul Claims ‘Hatred For Trump’ Hinders Ivermectin Research​








						Rand Paul Claims 'Hatred For Trump' Hinders Ivermectin Research
					

After people began purchasing doses meant for horses in order to self-medicate for the coronavirus, the FDA warned against using the drug.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## Huntn

Runs For Fun said:


> Why is it always send thoughts and prayers with these people?
> 
> They won’t. If they don’t die they’ll just say they were healed by all the thoughts and prayers.



Sure, I’ll pray that they become smarter people if they survive. What a great learning experience.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> got to love total stupid. so doctors who hate trump stop this drug from being used.
> Rand Paul Claims ‘Hatred For Trump’ Hinders Ivermectin Research​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rand Paul Claims 'Hatred For Trump' Hinders Ivermectin Research
> 
> 
> After people began purchasing doses meant for horses in order to self-medicate for the coronavirus, the FDA warned against using the drug.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com



He’s not his Dad.


----------



## User.45

News sources really need to stop posting pre-prints... I stumbled upon this which claims that natural immunity confers a longer/more robust protection against COVID. They do all sorts of group matching fully vaccinated vs. naturally infected unvaccinated (n=14K for the best matched groups), and come up with a ~6-fold higher risk of getting a *breakthrough COVID infection with the vaccine vs. a reinfection after natural COVID.

News media draws all the wrong conclusions.... The natural infection group had already survived and cleared the virus, so they are a group biased towards those immunocompetent at least against SARS-CoV2. This is a very important problem, because the "educated" vaccine skeptics (what an oximoron) will draw the conclusion to take their chances with the virus for better immunity. Yet if I'd guesstimate how the analysis would have looked if they included the deceased in the reinfection group for a more proper risk analysis there would have been ~65(!) times more deaths+reinfections in the natural immunity group than their presented number, which would translate to a ~3-fold lower risk in the vaccinated group. Which would suggest the actual opposite conclusions:

1. You probably get much better immunity through vaccination if you count the risk of dying into the risk involving the natural infection.
2. Your reinfection risk is indeed lower if you survived the first infection. But then there may be additional protection provided by a vaccine booster.

@Roller, thoughts?



			https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v1.full.pdf


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Families line up outside Venice chiropractor’s office to get medical exemption forms for school mask mandate
					

Families were lined up outside a chiropractor’s office in Venice on Monday night hoping to get medical exemption forms for their children in response to Sarasota County’s new school mas…




					www.wfla.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432730279559450626/

I'm out of words with these people.

If you're worked up about mask mandates, threatening to kill police officers doing their jobs, going to school board meetings when you didn't before, & summoning your religious deity's name, what the hell do they think the apocalypse will actually look like?


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432730279559450626/
> 
> I'm out of words with these people.
> 
> If you're worked up about mask mandates, threatening to kill police officers doing their jobs, going to school board meetings when you didn't before, & summoning your religious deity's name, what the hell do they think the apocalypse will actually look like?



the sound stops at demonic entities. well I was surprised her head did not swivel around.


----------



## JayMysteri0

fooferdoggie said:


> the sound stops at demonic entities. well I was surprised her head did not swivel around.



Not sure why, it's working fine for me.

She was a classic Christian who threw out the 'F' word at first chance.

She sounded like a character that Judy Greer would play


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432730279559450626/
> 
> I'm out of words with these people.
> 
> If you're worked up about mask mandates, threatening to kill police officers doing their jobs, going to school board meetings when you didn't before, & summoning your religious deity's name, what the hell do they think the apocalypse will actually look like?




These are the same people scared of Muslims because their religion makes them commit violent acts, right?  Just making sure I'm thinking of the right people here.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Who the Fuck cares what a dead guy burning in hell wants?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432818825972617221/

Get the F out of your feelings people, and quit scouring for the next chance to perform at school board meetings you didn't go to before.


----------



## JayMysteri0

When Covid Stupid *helps* cost you a spot on the Patriots

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432781501205295115/

I like Cam Newton, but bruh!  You already had a Covid "issue", and vaccine "hesistant".  Knowing full well if a team has a Covid breakout, they forfeit games, you think anyone wants to risk that happening?

Bruh!





> Patriots frustrated internally with the Cam Newton misunderstanding of COVID protocols, per report
> 
> 
> The door may be open for Mac Jones
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbssports.com




Bonus jokes
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432711469783732230/


----------



## JayMysteri0

When we move from Covid Stupid to Covid Idiocy & worse...



> Georgia anti-vaxxers shut down mobile vaccine event
> 
> 
> Anti-vaccine protestors in Georgia have disrupted several mobile COVID-19 vaccination drives and caused one to shut down completely, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.The office of Georgia …
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com





> Anti-vaccine protestors in Georgia have disrupted several mobile COVID-19 vaccination drives and caused one to shut down completely, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reported.
> 
> The office of Georgia Public Health Commissioner Kathleen Toomey told the newspaper Monday that public health staff at vaccination drives "have been harassed, yelled at, threatened and demeaned by some of the very members of the public they were trying to help." At a press conference Monday, Toomey said they had also received hostile and harassing emails.
> 
> "This is wrong. This is absolutely wrong," Toomey said, according to the Macon Telegraph. "These people are giving their lives to help others. We should be thanking them for trying to get life-saving vaccines to our state."
> 
> The mobile vaccination event that was shut down was set to take place in north Georgia, where a group of protestors showed up to harass public health professionals, according to the Journal-Constitution.
> 
> Nancy Nydam, Toomey's spokeswoman, told the newspaper that "aside from feeling threatened themselves, staff realized no one would want to come to that location for a vaccination under those circumstances, so they packed up and left."
> 
> Toomey said the harassment "comes with the territory to someone in my position" but that "it shouldn't be happening to those nurses who are working to try to keep this state safe," according to the Journal-Constitution.
> 
> The confrontations in Georgia are the latest in a series of incidents in which anti-vaccine and anti-mask protestors have publicly harassed and berated health care workers.




So what's the "logic" involved if you are anti vaxxer, for stopping others who WANT to get the vaccine.

What happened to "rights"?  It's NOW THEIR right to decide if someone gets the vaccine?  

What the fuck is it with people in their feelings?


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> When we move from Covid Stupid to Covid Idiocy & worse...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So what's the "logic" involved if you are anti vaxxer, for stopping others who WANT to get the vaccine.
> 
> What happened to "rights"?  It's NOW THEIR right to decide if someone gets the vaccine?
> 
> What the fuck is it with people in their feelings?



Their protest was not a lawful assembly. They used threat of violence to take away others’ rights. They should have been arrested.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432730279559450626/
> 
> I'm out of words with these people.
> 
> If you're worked up about mask mandates, threatening to kill police officers doing their jobs, going to school board meetings when you didn't before, & summoning your religious deity's name, what the hell do they think the apocalypse will actually look like?



Anyone wants to see the dark side of Christianity, this is  it, when religious fantasy becomes mental illness. I project she would be good with burnings at the stake to please her Lord Jesus Christ.


----------



## fooferdoggie

‘AntiVaxMomma’ from N.J. accused of selling 250 fake COVID vaccine card​A New Jersey woman - who went by “AntiVaxMomma” online - was accused Tuesday of selling about 250 fake COVID-19 vaccination cards using Instagram while healthcare workers who bought the bogus cards were also charged, New York prosecutors said.


Jasmine Clifford, of Lyndhurst, peddled the fake cards using her self-described anti-vaccine social media account for about $200, according to the Manhattan District Attorney’s Office. A co-conspirator employed at a New York clinic, Nadayza Barkley, would add the buyers to New York’s immunization database for an added $250 fee, prosecutors said.





__





						‘AntiVaxMomma’ from N.J. accused of selling 250 fake COVID vaccine cards
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Planning a Caribbean vacation? Remember that there are now two sets of islands -- the MAGA havens that will allow in unvaccinated, maskless plague rats by the cruise ship load, and the other wants that proof of vaccination. Choose wisely









						Vaccinated and Unvaccinated Travelers Are Going to Different Sets of Caribbean Islands
					

Unvaccinated travelers are gravitating to Caribbean islands that will let them in, while the vaccinated want places that keep the unimmunized out.




					www.nbcwashington.com


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> When we move from Covid Stupid to Covid Idiocy & worse...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So what's the "logic" involved if you are anti vaxxer, for stopping others who WANT to get the vaccine.
> 
> What happened to "rights"?  It's NOW THEIR right to decide if someone gets the vaccine?
> 
> What the fuck is it with people in their feelings?



Blatant self serving Fuck You Me>We hypocrisy.


----------



## SuperMatt

If you’re going to forge a vaccine card, try to spell the name of the vaccine correctly... 









						Illinois woman arrested after traveling on fake Covid vaccination card claiming she took the "Maderna" jab | Boing Boing
					

Illinois woman Chloe Mrozak, 24, went to Hawaii and presented a Covid vaccination card to avoid quarantine upon arrival. The card, unfortunately for Mrozak’s travel plans, said she received t…




					boingboing.net


----------



## fooferdoggie

part of her punishment should be to get vaccinated. only in America can you spend far more for something you could get for free.


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> ‘AntiVaxMomma’ from N.J. accused of selling 250 fake COVID vaccine card​A New Jersey woman - who went by “AntiVaxMomma” online - was accused Tuesday of selling about 250 fake COVID-19 vaccination cards using Instagram while healthcare workers who bought the bogus cards were also charged, New York prosecutors said.
> 
> 
> Jasmine Clifford, of Lyndhurst, peddled the fake cards using her self-described anti-vaccine social media account for about $200, according to the Manhattan District Attorney’s Office. A co-conspirator employed at a New York clinic, Nadayza Barkley, would add the buyers to New York’s immunization database for an added $250 fee, prosecutors said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ‘AntiVaxMomma’ from N.J. accused of selling 250 fake COVID vaccine cards
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com




So people paid upwards of $450 for a fake vaccination card?  And now they're out that money and I presume they'll be struck from the vaccinated list as well?

Hey dummies, mine cost $0, I'm still on the list and I'll be eligible to keep working this fall.


----------



## Eric

Not going to celebrate anyone's death but this is now 100% avoidable so it's frustrating to see.









						Texas anti-mask ‘Freedom Defender’ dies of COVID at age 30
					

His wife, Jessica, announced her husband’s death on a GoFundMe page that had detailed his fight with COVID-19 the past few weeks.




					www.mlive.com


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> Not going to celebrate anyone's death but this is now 100% avoidable so it's frustrating to see.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Texas anti-mask ‘Freedom Defender’ dies of COVID at age 30
> 
> 
> His wife, Jessica, announced her husband’s death on a GoFundMe page that had detailed his fight with COVID-19 the past few weeks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mlive.com



A brick up side the head seems to be the only way some people learn… the hard way. (Not advocating physical violence, that would be the metaphorical brick I referenced.)

But I don’t feel bad about the misguided freedom fighter. Maybe some of his loved ones  will benefit by thinking twice about the price of being an idiot, especially when it comes to serious contagious diseases that _I really don’t need a vaccine for, because I’m in denial, misguided, or macho. _ Yeah macho dead, a wasted life. The individual =0, the species +1.


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> News sources really need to stop posting pre-prints...




I can't comment on medicine, but the use of pre-prints is common in a lot of fields, since researchers will often post them where they are freely available. Otherwise you would have to obtain access by paying the relevant conference or journal if you are not a member of an institution that directly subscribes to them.



P_X said:


> *News media draws all the wrong conclusions....* The natural infection group had already survived and cleared the virus, so they are a group biased towards those immunocompetent at least against SARS-CoV2. This is a very important problem, because the "educated" vaccine skeptics (what an oximoron) will draw the conclusion to take their chances with the virus for better immunity. Yet if I'd guesstimate how the analysis would have looked if they included the deceased in the reinfection group for a more proper risk analysis there would have been ~65(!) times more deaths+reinfections in the natural immunity group than their presented number, which would translate to a ~3-fold lower risk in the vaccinated group. Which would suggest the actual opposite conclusions:




They do this a lot. These journalists should probably just report the data without forming their own conclusions, or they could seek opinions from researchers. It's kind of wacky how often this happens.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Hey, fuel for the anti-mask people.









						This Type of Mask May Not Do Anything to Protect You, New Study Says
					

A recent study found that cloth masks are not as protective as surgical masks at preventing symptomatic COVID.




					bestlifeonline.com
				




And if we’re going to be honest, a good amount of vaccinated people aren’t going to be tossing out their cloth masks and replacing them with surgical masks because of this study.

But I also wonder how much social distancing plays a factor.  Some cultures just love being piled up on each other and don’t see it as annoying in the slightest.   They just think that’s the way it is.  So for them 6 inches might feel like social distancing.


----------



## User.45

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Hey, fuel for the anti-mask people.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This Type of Mask May Not Do Anything to Protect You, New Study Says
> 
> 
> A recent study found that cloth masks are not as protective as surgical masks at preventing symptomatic COVID.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> bestlifeonline.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And if we’re going to be honest, a good amount of vaccinated people aren’t going to be tossing out their cloth masks and replacing them with surgical masks because of this study.
> 
> But I also wonder how much social distancing plays a factor.  Some cultures just love being piled up on each other and don’t see it as annoying in the slightest.   They just think that’s the way it is.  So for them 6 inches might feel like social distancing.



Isn't it pathetic though. People have been arguing about masks working or not, while in reality the question should have been, WHICH mask. These days I double mask, surgical below, 3-layer cotton above. I think cloth masks can be just fine, but the issue is the inconsistent quality. Also, last year I realized how awesome it is to wear a mask during the winter


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> Also, last year I realized how awesome it is to wear a mask during the winter




Ha!  Not like we have harsh winters here in the Bay Area, but I did notice when I had to be outside for an extended period of time in cold weather it was really nice having that mask on.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Joe Rogan Announces He Has COVID
					

Joe Rogan, the mega-popular podcaster who has questioned the necessity of the COVID vaccine on his show, revealed to his fans that he was sick from coronavirus and has to postpone a live show. Roga…




					variety.com
				




Covid don’t care about your skepticisms, yo.  Should we add this to your “I don’t know why people think I’m a Republican” list?  It’s currently in the top 5 reasons why people would think that (the other 4 also apply to you).


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Joe Rogan Announces He Has COVID
> 
> 
> Joe Rogan, the mega-popular podcaster who has questioned the necessity of the COVID vaccine on his show, revealed to his fans that he was sick from coronavirus and has to postpone a live show. Roga…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> variety.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Covid don’t care about your skepticisms, yo.  Should we add this to your “I don’t know why people think I’m a Republican” list?  It’s currently in the top 5 reasons why people would think that (the other 4 also apply to you).



If he dies of it, that might actually convince some anti-vaxxers to get the shot.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> If he dies of it, that might actually convince some anti-vaxxers to get the shot.



On the other side, if he gets well like so many others have, it will be the boost for ivermectin that no one needed.

If horse owners thought it was difficult to get before...


----------



## Runs For Fun

Joe Rogan, a podcasting giant who has been dismissive of vaccination, has Covid. (Published 2021)
					

“I got fevers, sweats, and I knew what was going on,” he said in a video on Instagram on Wednesday, after returning from a series of shows in Florida.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## fooferdoggie




----------



## Runs For Fun

Oh FFS
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433165332928032768/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Candace Owens is back in Covid news

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433265904075292672/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wisdom


----------



## fooferdoggie

Widow urges vaccination at funeral of St. Petersburg officer who died of COVID​








						Widow urges vaccination at funeral of St. Petersburg officer who died of COVID
					

The coronavirus is “grueling, dangerous — and it will destroy you,” warned Officer Michael Weiskopf’s wife.




					www.tampabay.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

It's like all the "classics" are making a come back

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433429929652228096/

We better be keeping an eye on any "tests" taking place in prisons as well.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> It's like all the "classics" are making a come back
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433429929652228096/
> 
> We better be keeping an eye on any "tests" taking place in prisons as well.



The people that are illegally testing drugs on inmates should be locked up in the same prison as them.

“Welcome to Arkansas State Prison. Here’s your new cellmate - remember him?"


----------



## Deleted member 215

I guess I don't understand why the anti-vax crowd is so obsessed with experimental treatments. Like, you won't get vaccinated because you "don't know what's in it" but you will take random chemicals that you heard might treat COVID but also might be toxic? 

But this is why I don't waste much time trying to parse the logic of stupid people.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> It's like all the "classics" are making a come back
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433429929652228096/
> 
> We better be keeping an eye on any "tests" taking place in prisons as well.




Another prison doctor in another story about stupid doctors?  Say it isn't so.   

Like I said before, people graduating at the top of their class probably aren't fighting to land a job in a nice prison.  These are most likely the people who couldn't get a job as a real doctor elsewhere.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> On the other side, if he gets well like so many others have, it will be the boost for ivermectin that no one needed.
> 
> If horse owners thought it was difficult to get before...




His advertised Covid cocktail comes as no surprise coming from Joe Rogan, but even now, after all the coverage of his Covid antics, he still seems to want to pretend like he’s unaware of his influence. If he said he had pancakes for breakfast while he was recovering there would be a run on bisquick.

I'm starting to believe they're pumping something into the air ducts in his house to advance his metamorphosis into a far-right loon.


----------



## SuperMatt

TBL said:


> I guess I don't understand why the anti-vax crowd is so obsessed with experimental treatments. Like, you won't get vaccinated because you "don't know what's in it" but you will take random chemicals that you heard might treat COVID but also might be toxic?
> 
> But this is why I don't waste much time trying to parse the logic of stupid people.



I’ll take a stab at the “logic” of this group.

The government wants you to take the vaccine for some nefarious purpose. There might be a microchip, or just a chemical that makes you find AOC attractive, or something.

The experimental drug is something “they” do not want you to take. Now that you realize it cures COVID, you won’t have to take their mind-control vaccine.


----------



## JayMysteri0

With rpaul spewing his own brand of covid stupid, muscomitch wants to pretend to be surprised at how all of this is going...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433440984726114304/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> just a chemical that makes you find AOC attractive, or something.




There are plenty of AOC haters who think she's hot, trust me.  It's similar to how the top porn search term in China is "Japanese".


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> I’ll take a stab at the “logic” of this group.
> 
> The government wants you to take the vaccine for some nefarious purpose. There might be a microchip, or just a chemical that makes you find AOC attractive, or something.
> 
> The experimental drug is something “they” do not want you to take. Now that you realize it cures COVID, you won’t have to take their mind-control vaccine.



The other part is that doctors are sometimes wrong. They might be right 99.9997% of the time, but there was that one guy who got better or failed to die, defying expectations. Therefore, if the doctor tells me the thing I do not want to hear, the possibility that he is mistaken, or that there is a viable alternative, does exist, so I will try that other thing. Because the doctor is sometimes (albeit extremely rarely) wrong.

It is like you drive to visit your parents and what you notice is three potholes in the road, not 250 miles of smooth pavement.


----------



## Eric

What a worthless tool, I'll never get what his appeal was to anyone but he was a huge anti-vaxer/mask advocate.


----------



## fooferdoggie

this is great.


----------



## JayMysteri0

When is someone going to come out & truly say it...  feelings & stupidity are the real pandemic we've always had to fear.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433613879075119111/






> Police on-scene at Vail elementary school after group threatens to zip-tie principal over COVID-19 protocols
> 
> 
> According to VUSD officials, a student at Mesquite Elementary School was asked to quarantine after he reportedly was in close contact with an individual who tested positive for COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kvoa.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> There are plenty of AOC haters who think she's hot, trust me.  It's similar to how the top porn search term in China is "Japanese".



They hate her and love her at the same time.


JayMysteri0 said:


> When is someone going to come out & truly say it...  feelings & stupidity are the real pandemic we've always had to fear.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433613879075119111/



Upon seeing this, I checked out the coffee shop’s Facebook page. I expected tons of comments chastising this criminal. There were a few, but there were many comments from like-minded “patriots” who are angry that their kids are being asked to quarantine simply because they *are not vaccinated*... WTF is wrong with these people?



> *Samantha Valle* I went today and peacefully spoke with the principal at Corona Foothills. This is the 3rd time my daughter has been asked to quarantine in the last month. Its ridiculous. All because she isnt vaccinated. Those who are, are allowed to remain in school. I truly believe this is above the schools decision. They are given protocols by the PCHD. Unfortunately they follow the rules or the school forces legal action. PCHD is who our anger and frustrations need to be focused at. Im extremely frustrated in all of this. The facts are vaccinated students can still have covid. They can be asymptomatic and still be spreading the virus. I know this for a fact, because I personally know a child who has been vaccinated and tested positive 2xs for covid, along with a couple other adults. The vaccine lessens the symptoms not prevention of infection.
> 
> Problem is, when students are not forced to be tested or quarantined because they are vaccinated, they are causing the spred. Then like my daughter she is forced to quarantine because she's non-vaccinated. Its total crap!
> 
> How is this not segregation?



The Yelp page is pretty telling too:









						Viva Coffee House - Tucson, AZ
					

Delivery & Pickup Options - 93 reviews of Viva Coffee House "Great atmosphere! I definitely see myself returning  with a good book next time. Got a maple pecan scone and a chai tea. Both delicious! Also the play area kept my son busy while I enjoyed my drink."




					www.yelp.com
				




One commenter claims he doesn’t even have a kid at the school where he attacked the principal. Is that true? Hmmm...

And of course he has been in trouble over COVID policies before:









						Coffee shop owner arrested at Board of Supervisors meeting
					

Co-owner of Viva Coffee House read threatening messages he's received since appearing on county's wall of shame.




					www.kold.com
				




I wonder when he switched from “we are complying with the policies, they are wrong” to “we are just going to openly defy the policies”?


----------



## fooferdoggie

even after her 13 year old kid died from covid this is not enough to Gert her to use y=her brain. hopefully she looses her job she should not be helping others
"Not enough research" Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19​








						"Not enough research" Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19
					

FLOYD County, Ga. (CBS46) -- Just one day after 13-year-old Porter Helm died of COVID-19, state Democrats are calling on Georgia Governor Brian Kemp to shut down in person learning




					www.cbs46.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> even after her 13 year old kid died from covid this is not enough to Gert her to use y=her brain. hopefully she looses her job she should not be helping others
> "Not enough research" Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Not enough research" Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19
> 
> 
> FLOYD County, Ga. (CBS46) -- Just one day after 13-year-old Porter Helm died of COVID-19, state Democrats are calling on Georgia Governor Brian Kemp to shut down in person learning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbs46.com



A dear friend who passed away a couple years ago used to lament the fact that many parents just don’t care about their kids. She was right, of course.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> A dear friend who passed away a couple years ago used to lament the fact that many parents just don’t care about their kids. She was right, of course.



If they did care about their kids I can totally understand them doubling down on the anti-vaxxer crap. Changing their mind would mean admitting/accepting that they were directly responsible for the deaths of their kids…


----------



## SuperMatt

Pumbaa said:


> If they did care about their kids I can totally understand them doubling down on the anti-vaxxer crap. Changing their mind would mean admitting/accepting that they were directly responsible for the deaths of their kids…



They care more about their political allegiance/conspiracy theory than they do about their kids’ well-being. That’s my view... but perhaps you’re right. Perhaps they truly believe that vaccines are deadlier than the disease, even when their own children die of the disease and all the vaccinated kids are doing fine. I just don’t know anymore.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> They care more about their political allegiance/conspiracy theory than they do about their kids’ well-being. That’s my view... but perhaps you’re right. Perhaps they truly believe that vaccines are deadlier than the disease, even when their own children die of the disease and all the vaccinated kids are doing fine. I just don’t know anymore.



If they actually believe the bullshit they’re spewing it would make sense for them to try to protect their kids from the evil deadly vaccine, bacteria infested masks, etc. That would at least be something I could understand, as opposed to putting political allegiance/conspiracy theories above the well-being of one’s kids.

In either case, just saying that If they have a kid die of the disease it would make sense for them to double down. Easier to live in a fantasy world than facing the reality of their actions.

There’s too much stupid out there. And too much malicious. Not a good combo.


----------



## SuperMatt

If you’re looking for a calm, gentle nudge to those who have yet to get the vaccine.









						Oh My Fucking God, Get the Fucking Vaccine Already, You Fucking Fucks
					

Hi, if you are reading this essay then congratulations, you are still alive. And if you are alive, then you have either gotten the COVID-19 vaccine...




					www.mcsweeneys.net


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Try wrapping your head around this conspiracy theory I recently heard. The Democrats created the (global) pandemic to kill off Republicans. They are having Democrats get vaccinated so only Republicans die. 

I don’t want to nitpick here, but can anybody point me to a news story about Republicans being prevented from getting vaccinated because that seems like that would be key for Democrats to pull off this diabolical plot.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Try wrapping your head around this conspiracy theory I recently heard. The Democrats created the (global) pandemic to kill off Republicans. They are having Democrats get vaccinated so only Republicans die.
> 
> I don’t want to nitpick here, but can anybody point me to a news story about Republicans being prevented from getting vaccinated because that seems like that would be key for Democrats to pull off this diabolical plot.



This is some seriously next-level shit! Dems should also loudly speak out against smoking, driving drunk, refusing to wear seatbelts, crossing busy streets without looking, jumping off bridges, drinking bleach, and more deadly things. Since Republicans are forced to do the opposite of what Democrats want, it should pretty easy to kill them all in no time.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Try wrapping your head around this conspiracy theory I recently heard. The Democrats created the (global) pandemic to kill off Republicans. They are having Democrats get vaccinated so only Republicans die.




I've got my own theory.  The virus is going after the stupid people.  The end.  Not that complicated.


----------



## Alli

SuperMatt said:


> If you’re looking for a calm, gentle nudge to those who have yet to get the vaccine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh My Fucking God, Get the Fucking Vaccine Already, You Fucking Fucks
> 
> 
> Hi, if you are reading this essay then congratulations, you are still alive. And if you are alive, then you have either gotten the COVID-19 vaccine...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mcsweeneys.net



I fucking loved this. My daughter shared it with Mum and me first thing this morning. Had us all howling.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Why?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433953302618718209/


----------



## fooferdoggie

[Murica] Sorry, can't treat your gunshot wound because too many people are blind with horse dewormer
Oklahoma's ERs are so backed up with people overdosing on ivermectin that gunshot victims are having to wait to be treated, a doctor says​








						Oklahoma's ERs are so backed up with people overdosing on ivermectin that gunshot victims are having to wait to be treated, a doctor says
					

An emergency-room doctor told a local news channel that he'd seen scary instances of people coming in with vision loss after taking ivermectin.




					www.insider.com


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> The people that are illegally testing drugs on inmates should be locked up in the same prison as them.
> 
> “Welcome to Arkansas State Prison. Here’s your new cellmate - remember him?"



It's actually 200% illegal to experiment on prisoners.


----------



## Alli

fooferdoggie said:


> [Murica] Sorry, can't treat your gunshot wound because too many people are blind with horse dewormer
> Oklahoma's ERs are so backed up with people overdosing on ivermectin that gunshot victims are having to wait to be treated, a doctor says​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oklahoma's ERs are so backed up with people overdosing on ivermectin that gunshot victims are having to wait to be treated, a doctor says
> 
> 
> An emergency-room doctor told a local news channel that he'd seen scary instances of people coming in with vision loss after taking ivermectin.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.insider.com



People taking ivermectin need to be at the far end of the triage scale.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Alli said:


> People taking ivermectin need to be at the far end of the triage scale.



I hear there's a cure for that...

Taking a vaccine instead.

You're less likely to go to the hospital because of Covid or horse dewormer OD with a vaccine.

You may still get shot though. Murica!


----------



## fooferdoggie

Alli said:


> People taking ivermectin need to be at the far end of the triage scale.



put them in a corral and wait for the vet.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I really need less stupid on my Twitter feed
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433944689879748608/

Also I wonder if anyone brought that "Freedom over force" sign on Jan 6th to DC?


----------



## Thomas Veil

P_X said:


> These days I double mask, surgical below, 3-layer cotton above. I think cloth masks can be just fine, but the issue is the inconsistent quality.



I recall in the early days of Covid there were articles about the questionable effectiveness of cloth masks. Remember when they recommended putting vacuum cleaner filters between layers? And then they tell us that isn't very effective because the vacuum cleaner filter inserts don't provide edge-to-edge protection in a mask. I quickly switched to KN95s and haven't looked back since. 

In other news...









						Angry Men With Zip-Ties Ambush School Principal After COVID Masking Request
					

The surreal confrontation stemmed from the Arizona school asking a child who was exposed to the virus to abide by public health guidelines.



					www.thedailybeast.com
				




So these three macho men decide to menace a female principal, threaten to call the cops on her or perform a citizen's arrest, all while carrying zip ties. They're telling an alternate version of what happened while erasing the video they themselves shot of the actual incident. All this, over a kid being asked to put on a mask.

What the fuck is *wrong* with these people??


----------



## SuperMatt

Thomas Veil said:


> I recall in the early days of Covid there were articles about the questionable effectiveness of cloth masks. Remember when they recommended putting vacuum cleaner filters between layers? And then they tell us that isn't very effective because the vacuum cleaner filter inserts don't provide edge-to-edge protection in a mask. I quickly switched to KN95s and haven't looked back since.
> 
> In other news...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Angry Men With Zip-Ties Ambush School Principal After COVID Masking Request
> 
> 
> The surreal confrontation stemmed from the Arizona school asking a child who was exposed to the virus to abide by public health guidelines.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So these three macho men decide to menace a female principal, threaten to call the cops on her or perform a citizen's arrest, all while carrying zip ties. They're telling an alternate version of what happened while erasing the video they themselves shot of the actual incident. All this, over a kid being asked to put on a mask.
> 
> What the fuck is *wrong* with these people??



@JayMysteri0 made a post on the prior page about this too… the coffee shop owner doesn’t even have a kid at that school. He has had multiple run-ins with the law over his refusal to follow rules related to limiting the spread of the pandemic.


----------



## shadow puppet

So Texans are pro-life when in utero but once born, all bets are off?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433838100652904451/


----------



## SuperMatt

shadow puppet said:


> So Texans are pro-life when in utero but once born, all bets are off?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433838100652904451/



His policies directly led to the deaths of children. There is no question of this. Shame on all Republicans at this point. We all need to come together to defeat this pandemic.


----------



## JayMysteri0

shadow puppet said:


> So Texans are pro-life when in utero but once born, all bets are off?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1433838100652904451/



Sadly what I think we're starting to see is that some are willing to 'chance it' or 'risk it' to test out the theory that younger folks ( especially children ) are less likely to get sick.  I also don't think it's a coincidence that those places are ones where the concern of the unborn is often greater than those born & most vulnerable.  It's just too on the nose.  To put it cruelly, they don't vote, their parents do.  Instead for some, their ( for many we've seen they don't even have children ) children are now just reasons to fight whatever new ideological battle they've gloomed onto to rally themselves.  I've read time after time from those circles where they will take any data to support that it's the elderly that are the most vulnerable, so evidently it's worth it take a little risk with the younger to desperately hope to return to 'normal'.

It's still a continuation of the behavior we saw very early on with the tears & tamper tantrums about masks & stay @ home, all the while pining & making mouth noises about how great it will be once there is a vaccine.  We've seen how that's turned out.  It's all about getting what you want, but some want to make the least amount of effort.  So if it involves OTHERS having to take the vaccine while they their 'freedums', so be it.  If we have to push that we need schools open so it's main building block to returning to 'normal', explain away AGAIN that it's the elderly that will die instead.

What stunned me the most was reading some other reach in another place about "Covid information", that basically throws out that unless we can find the last person who has Covid, the virus will always be around.  So basically 'F' it, let's get back to normal already.

For a nation that likes to tell others about the importance of "hard work", when it really matters & lives are on the line, the least amount of work when it comes to a pandemic seems waaaay too much for some.



SuperMatt said:


> His policies directly led to the deaths of children. There is no question of this. Shame on all Republicans at this point. We all need to come together to defeat this pandemic.



The real shame is that we've learned since the loss & suffering due to intentional inaction early on because of fear of the stock market tanking & hurt re election chances ( which they lost anyways ), there is NO consequence for this behavior.


----------



## fooferdoggie

[Dumbass] Police officer suspended after he bragged about want to be a walking pathogen

*








						Christian Cop Suspended for Bragging About Defying Oregon’s Vaccination Mandate
					

His faith-based ignorance shouldn't be rewarded.




					friendlyatheist.patheos.com
				



*


----------



## fooferdoggie

A leader of a movement touting toxic bleach as a 'miracle' COVID-19 cure has been charged following a 5-year-old boy's death​








						A leader of a movement touting toxic bleach as a 'miracle' COVID-19 cure has been charged following a 5-year-old boy's death
					

Argentinian authorities charged Andreas Kalcker, a German national, with falsely promoting a type of toxic bleach as a medical cure.




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## Thomas Veil

fooferdoggie said:


> [Dumbass] Police officer suspended after he bragged about want to be a walking pathogen
> 
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Christian Cop Suspended for Bragging About Defying Oregon’s Vaccination Mandate
> 
> 
> His faith-based ignorance shouldn't be rewarded.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> friendlyatheist.patheos.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *



From that story:



> All the other officers who don’t want to get vaccinated — and there are many of them — shouldn’t be in their jobs either.



If only. I agree with the sentiment. But if you fired every officer who was an anti-vaxxer, you'd have a fairly hollow police force.

As for who this guy _thinks_ he answers to, I wish I had a dime for every loser who believes he's serving God or the Constitution. I'd be wealthier than Warren Buffett.



fooferdoggie said:


> A leader of a movement touting toxic bleach as a 'miracle' COVID-19 cure has been charged following a 5-year-old boy's death​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A leader of a movement touting toxic bleach as a 'miracle' COVID-19 cure has been charged following a 5-year-old boy's death
> 
> 
> Argentinian authorities charged Andreas Kalcker, a German national, with falsely promoting a type of toxic bleach as a medical cure.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com



Good. If only we could do that to Tucker Carlson and the rest of the meatheads who are spreading their own brand of poison in our own country.


----------



## Roller

fooferdoggie said:


> even after her 13 year old kid died from covid this is not enough to Gert her to use y=her brain. hopefully she looses her job she should not be helping others
> "Not enough research" Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Not enough research" Paramedic still opposes vaccine after losing her child to COVID-19
> 
> 
> FLOYD County, Ga. (CBS46) -- Just one day after 13-year-old Porter Helm died of COVID-19, state Democrats are calling on Georgia Governor Brian Kemp to shut down in person learning
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbs46.com



One wonders what these people did the last time (pre-pandemic) a physician or other healthcare provider prescribed an antibiotic or other medication for an infection or other condition. Did they evaluate all the research that had been done prior to approval? Did they scrutinize the label for minuscule amounts of ingredients they might consider harmful? I'd be the answer would be "no" in the vast majority of cases. It's even crazier when  you consider how often antibiotics are prescribed on spec for viral infections against which they're useless.

The problem this time around is that millions of minds have been poisoned by purveyors of lies - people like Tucker Carlson who do this only to enrich themselves or further their political agendas - coupled with the wide availability of social media platforms like Facebook that do nothing to police their content.


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> One wonders what these people did the last time (pre-pandemic) a physician or other healthcare provider prescribed an antibiotic or other medication for an infection or other condition. Did they evaluate all the research that had been done prior to approval? Did they scrutinize the label for minuscule amounts of ingredients they might consider harmful? I'd be the answer would be "no" in the vast majority of cases. It's even crazier when  you consider how often antibiotics are prescribed on spec for viral infections against which they're useless.
> 
> The problem this time around is that millions of minds have been poisoned by purveyors of lies - people like Tucker Carlson who do this only to enrich themselves or further their political agendas - coupled with the wide availability of social media platforms like Facebook that do nothing to police their content.



I think you are right. That is why it is especially galling when you see people who latched onto Trump (who convinced his devotées of this nonsense) now pretending they don‘t understand why people won’t get vaccinated. Kay Ivey, Mitch McConnell, etc.

Just saw that Kay Ivey used $12 million in COVID funds to bring in more nurses to Alabama. How about just mandating the vaccine? It’s pretty rich to complain about people not getting the shot when you were in bed with the guy actively discouraging people from getting it.









						Ivey directs $12 million in COVID-19 funds to bring nurses to Alabama
					

A shortage of nurses is the most urgent need for Alabama hospitals filled with COVID-19 patients, the governor's office said.




					www.al.com


----------



## Herdfan

JayMysteri0 said:


> On the other side, if he gets well like so many others have, it will be the boost for ivermectin that no one needed.
> 
> If horse owners thought it was difficult to get before...




You do realize that it is approved by the FDA for use in humans right?  Maybe not for COVID, but it isn't JUST for horses.


----------



## Herdfan

I am a huge collge football fan.  Not just the game, but the whole atmosphere of game day.  I love it.  And even I was surprised in the games I watched Thusday, Friday and Saturday evenings just how packed the stands were.  And it wasn't a Red State/Blue State thing (although the WaPo only wanted to focus on Florida and ignored the 43,811 mostly maskless fans in attendance in College Park just a scant 8 miles away), stands were packed everywhere.

Reading some articles about it today, right leaning sources said it was the populace showing they were no longer afraid of the virus and left leaning sources simply blaming Red States (see above).  

I know most here like to blame the GOP for being stupid, but I have to guess a lot of the fans in the stands this weekend weren't thinking about political ideology, they simply want to go back to normal.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> You do realize that it is approved by the FDA for use in humans right?  Maybe not for COVID, but it isn't JUST for horses.



You do realize people are buying the one for horses and not the one for humans, right?









						One Hospital Denies Oklahoma Doctor's Story of Ivermectin Overdoses Causing ER Delays for Gunshot Victims
					

The hospital says it hasn’t experienced any care backlog due to patients overdosing on a drug that’s been falsely peddled as a covid cure




					www.rollingstone.com


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> You do realize people are buying the one for horses and not the one for humans, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One Hospital Denies Oklahoma Doctor's Story of Ivermectin Overdoses Causing ER Delays for Gunshot Victims
> 
> 
> The hospital says it hasn’t experienced any care backlog due to patients overdosing on a drug that’s been falsely peddled as a covid cure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.rollingstone.com




Well that's on them.  It's just the hysteria makes it seem like ALL Invermectin is bad.  Can't fix stupid just like the guy who drank fish tank cleaner because it had a bit of hydroxychloroquine in it.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I am a huge collge football fan.  Not just the game, but the whole atmosphere of game day.  I love it.  And even I was surprised in the games I watched Thusday, Friday and Saturday evenings just how packed the stands were.  And it wasn't a Red State/Blue State thing (although the WaPo only wanted to focus on Florida and ignored the 43,811 mostly maskless fans in attendance in College Park just a scant 8 miles away), stands were packed everywhere.
> 
> Reading some articles about it today, right leaning sources said it was the populace showing they were no longer afraid of the virus and left leaning sources simply blaming Red States (see above).
> 
> I know most here like to blame the GOP for being stupid, but I have to guess a lot of the fans in the stands this weekend weren't thinking about political ideology, they simply want to go back to normal.



In this situation, a larger number of Republicans are being stupid compared to Republicans. If we say that not getting a free vaccine to prevent a fatal disease is stupid, then Republicans are being more stupid than Democrats.

75% of Democrats have been vaccinated as of July. Only 41% of Republicans.



			https://www.usnews.com/news/the-report/articles/2021-07-23/coronavirus-vaccines-highlight-a-deadly-political-divide
		


Everybody wants to get back to normal, I agree. The difference is that Democrats are willing to get the vaccine to get us there. Republicans just want it to magically happen. That’s why the disease is running rampant in GOP-controlled states. It doesn’t help that the governors in Florida and Texas are actively helping the disease spread through wrongheaded policies.


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> Everybody wants to get back to normal, I agree …




Well, speak for yourself. "Normal" has been an unsustainable travesty for quite some while, and has been spiraling toward "much worse". Not quite _Everybody_ wants that back as it was.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> In this situation, a larger number of Republicans are being stupid compared to Republicans. If we say that not getting a free vaccine to prevent a fatal disease is stupid, then Republicans are being more stupid than Democrats.
> 
> 75% of Democrats have been vaccinated as of July. Only 41% of Republicans.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.usnews.com/news/the-report/articles/2021-07-23/coronavirus-vaccines-highlight-a-deadly-political-divide
> 
> 
> 
> Everybody wants to get back to normal, I agree. The difference is that Democrats are willing to get the vaccine to get us there. Republicans just want it to magically happen. That’s why the disease is running rampant in GOP-controlled states. It doesn’t help that the governors in Florida and Texas are actively helping the disease spread through wrongheaded policies.




I'm not sure it matters as much as you think it does.  Look at Israel.  Highest vaccination rate and currently one of the highest infections per capita rates.









						Highly Vaccinated Israel Is Seeing A Dramatic Surge In New COVID Cases. Here's Why
					

What happened? Here are six lessons learned from Israel's experience — and one looming question for the future of the pandemic.




					www.npr.org
				




I got vaccinated for 2 reasons.  My mom was 92 and had too many commodities to count and it was also the path to being mask free.  In absence of those, I would eventually have gotten it, but probably not as soon as I did.  

I think one reason the notion of using the term Delta Variant vs India variant has not a damn thing to do with protecting the people of India from being associated with it, but instead to cloak where it came from so the Republicans can be blamed.  The Delta variant seems to not really care if you are vaccinated or not, but COVID did not mutate into Delta because of a single Republican, vaccinated or not.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> You do realize that it is approved by the FDA for use in humans right? Maybe not for COVID, but it isn't JUST for horses.



We’ve already had this discussion regarding chloroquine. The FDA approves drugs for specific things. You don’t take an anti-parasitic for a virus even though said anti-parasitic is approved by the FDA. There are no studies proving efficacity of the drugs the right suddenly (for no reason) backs.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I'm not sure it matters as much as you think it does.  Look at Israel.  Highest vaccination rate and currently one of the highest infections per capita rates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Highly Vaccinated Israel Is Seeing A Dramatic Surge In New COVID Cases. Here's Why
> 
> 
> What happened? Here are six lessons learned from Israel's experience — and one looming question for the future of the pandemic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I got vaccinated for 2 reasons.  My mom was 92 and had too many commodities to count and it was also the path to being mask free.  In absence of those, I would eventually have gotten it, but probably not as soon as I did.
> 
> I think one reason the notion of using the term Delta Variant vs India variant has not a damn thing to do with protecting the people of India from being associated with it, but instead to cloak where it came from so the Republicans can be blamed.  The Delta variant seems to not really care if you are vaccinated or not, but COVID did not mutate into Delta because of a single Republican, vaccinated or not.



Do you ever read the articles you post? Or just the headlines? Talk about missing the point.…

And why are you insistent on naming variants after a country? That is not how they are named in the scientific community. They are named with a series of letters and numbers. The WHO simplified things by naming them after Greek letters. But don’t let that stop you from tossing China and India in there. Again, racism and xenophobia trump science.



> The World Health Organization has wrestled with the challenge of avoiding geographic descriptions for variants of concern, and on Monday it announced a naming scheme involving letters of the Greek alphabet. For example, the WHO has labelled B.1.1.7 as “Alpha,” B.1.351 as “Beta” and P.1 as “Gamma.”
> 
> 
> The system won’t replace Pango, but the WHO said the scientific names “can be difficult to say and recall, and are prone to misreporting. As a result, people often resort to calling variants by the places where they are detected, which is stigmatizing and discriminatory.” It has urged national authorities and media outlets to use the new labels.











						How do COVID-19 variants get their names?
					

Where do names like B.1.1.7 and P.1 for COVID-19 variants come from, and what do they mean?




					www.theglobeandmail.com


----------



## Pumbaa

Herdfan said:


> I think one reason the notion of using the term Delta Variant vs India variant has not a damn thing to do with protecting the people of India from being associated with it, but instead to cloak where it came from *so the Republicans can be blamed*.



Dude? Just…dude? (apologies for the steal, @Hrafn)

You got us. It’s all part of a worldwide conspiracy against Republicans.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1434638705285902337/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Herdfan said:


> I'm not sure it matters as much as you think it does.  Look at Israel.  Highest vaccination rate and currently one of the highest infections per capita rates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Highly Vaccinated Israel Is Seeing A Dramatic Surge In New COVID Cases. Here's Why
> 
> 
> What happened? Here are six lessons learned from Israel's experience — and one looming question for the future of the pandemic.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org



One thing to note about Israel unlike us.  While they've had a surge, including 'breakthrough' cases, what they have NOT experienced is the amount of death like we have from that surge.  Believed to be because of the high vaccination rate.  So while they experienced a surge that is declining, they didn't collapse their health system like we are close to do doing in a few states.  Yes people are getting sick, but they are NOT experiencing a high morbidity rate.

I believe in ONE DAY in August ( August 17th ) we hit 1,000 deaths & an average of 760+ a day on other days, while Israel hit something like 476 deaths in all of August.

Here we are reading daily of the latest individual who so embraced feelings & freedums over a vaccine, who's passed away leaving a grieving family & a mea culpa about vaccines.

THAT is reason enough for endorsing the vaccine.

God forbid a Covid outbreak happens at any of those games, because the transmission rate once that crowd disperses will be frightening.  As if Florida needs anymore influx of patients.  While those who are vaccinated may find themselves home & very sick, they will be AT HOME, instead of hoping for a bed in a hospital that's run out of them.  In some cases it's treat people for poisoning, as they took a horse dewormer for some reason.  While heart attack patients are dying because they can't get a bed.


----------



## Pumbaa

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1434638705285902337/



While the pointing out of makeup, nails, and hair made me chuckle, what about _the fracking t-shirt_? My face hurts from facepalming so hard.



> Just saw a chick walking around Target *in a t-shirt* which read: “Unvaccinated and Unmasked. Because* that’s how God made me*.”


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> And why are you insistent on naming variants after a country? That is not how they are named in the scientific community. They are named with a series of letters and numbers. The WHO simplified things by naming them after Greek letters. But don’t let that stop you from tossing China and India in there. Again, racism and xenophobia trump science.




 I told you why about the variant.  The left can blame Republican Governors and Red States for allowing Delta to develop and spread.  I'm sure if Delta mutated and was discovered in FL or TX you would be fine with naming it after those states.

For decades we named virus's after where they were first discovered.  Until China.  We are so afraid of offending them that we let them do whatever they please.   Everyone is this country should be furious at the CCP for how they initially handled COVID.  Buit we aren't because the media is too afraid of hitting them hard.  Our sports leagues won't say boo because of the money.    China is going to own our ass one day, I just hope I am gone before it happens.


----------



## Pumbaa

Herdfan said:


> I told you why about the variant.  The left can blame Republican Governors and Red States for allowing Delta to develop and spread.



So you’re saying that Republican Governors and Red States are horrible at handling covid-19. Got it. Sounds plausible.

Would those governors and states handle it better if the prominent variants were associated with foreign countries? Like stepping up out of some sort of patriotic duty to fight a foreign mutation? I have my doubts. Sounds more like a desire for deflection. Just blame outsiders for the problems and do nothing to fix any of them.



Herdfan said:


> I'm sure if Delta mutated and was discovered in FL or TX you would be fine with naming it after those states.
> 
> For decades we named virus's after where they were first discovered.  Until China.  We are so afraid of offending them that we let them do whatever they please.   Everyone is this country should be furious at the CCP for how they initially handled COVID.  Buit we aren't because the media is too afraid of hitting them hard.  Our sports leagues won't say boo because of the money.    China is going to own our ass one day, I just hope I am gone before it happens.



Why is the origin of the virus so important if fighting it isn’t?


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I told you why about the variant.  The left can blame Republican Governors and Red States for allowing Delta to develop and spread.  I'm sure if Delta mutated and was discovered in FL or TX you would be fine with naming it after those states.
> 
> For decades we named virus's after where they were first discovered.  Until China.  We are so afraid of offending them that we let them do whatever they please.   Everyone is this country should be furious at the CCP for how they initially handled COVID.  Buit we aren't because the media is too afraid of hitting them hard.  Our sports leagues won't say boo because of the money.    China is going to own our ass one day, I just hope I am gone before it happens.



If you’re mad at China about COVID, what do you think of DeSantis and Abbott and Trump? There is now copious evidence that lockdowns and masks prevented the spread. Countries that did better with these measures did better against the virus. But the 3 people mentioned above (and others too) did the opposite, leading to massive amounts of cases and deaths compared to most other nations.

And you are wrong - I would NOT support naming a virus after Texas or Florida. I think the governors of both states are bad people, but I don’t have a problem with most people that live there.

It doesn’t really make sense to name viruses after places anyway. Viruses don’t care about countries. And one of the most famous viruses named after a place: the Spanish Flu - did NOT originate there. So, it’s a stupid way of naming them, and the naming of the “Chinese Virus” by Trump and others was linked directly to violence against Asian people. I know you don’t care about anybody else, especially Asian people, but as somebody with friends and family who are Asian, if you want to contribute to an atmosphere in America that makes them unsafe, you can …


----------



## SuperMatt

Pumbaa said:


> Why is the origin of the virus so important if fighting it isn’t?



How else will you know which minority group to blame?


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> I told you why about the variant.  The left can blame Republican Governors and Red States for allowing Delta to develop and spread.  I'm sure if Delta mutated and was discovered in FL or TX you would be fine with naming it after those states.
> 
> For decades we named virus's after where they were first discovered.  Until China.  We are so afraid of offending them that we let them do whatever they please.   Everyone is this country should be furious at the CCP for how they initially handled COVID.  Buit we aren't because the media is too afraid of hitting them hard.  Our sports leagues won't say boo because of the money.    China is going to own our ass one day, I just hope I am gone before it happens.



I agree that the PRC government has much to answer for regarding how it dealt with the very early stages of the pandemic when it was potentially still possible to limit worldwide spread. But there is plenty of blame to go around — like climate change, viral diseases are and will forever be a global problem that will only be managed by coordinated action by many countries.

As for naming of SARS-CoV-2 strains, you are misinformed. Here's an excerpt from a National Geographic article about viral nomenclature:

_But there’s also a scientific argument for staying away from geographical names: Scientists point out that the names are misleading at best and totally inaccurate at worst. The truth is that scientists don’t know where the so-called South African variant actually originated. Sure, the variant was first identified in South Africa, but researchers haven’t yet found patient zero. It’s possible that South Africa was just the first country to find the variant because it was doing more genetic sequencing than other countries._

While a few states with Republican governors (Vermont is one) have done well, poor policies in many Republican-led states in the South like Florida, Alabama, and Mississippi have provably contributed to the current surge and irreversible effects on the healthcare system.

What's especially sad is that I don't believe anyone doesn't want the pandemic to end or at least settle down to a manageable endemic condition, but the more governors do to actively or passively counter effective public health measures, the less likely this goal will be achieved.


----------



## Herdfan

Pumbaa said:


> So you’re saying that Republican Governors and Red States are horrible at handling covid-19. Got it. Sounds plausible.
> 
> Would those governors and states handle it better if the prominent variants were associated with foreign countries? Like stepping up out of some sort of patriotic duty to fight a foreign mutation? I have my doubts. Sounds more like a desire for deflection. Just blame outsiders for the problems and do nothing to fix any of them.
> 
> 
> Why is the origin of the virus so important if fighting it isn’t?




No, I'm saying that is what the media wants everyone to believe.  Cuomo was killing old folks at a record clip, but all the media wanted to focus on was DeSantis.  Why, because they know he will be a front-runner in 2024 and they need to demonize him now.  

The media wants to keep everyone afraid because it gives them clicks.  I am not afraid nor will I be.  I realize some of you are afraid.  You double mask in your cars by yourself, you spray your mail with bleach water, don't go out of the house.  Knock yourself out.  But I am not going to live that way.  I did my part.  I wore a mask when required and got vaccinated.  

The origin is important because the people need to know where it came from and what the CCP did that enabled it to spread.  They could have possibly contained it had they not lied to the international community. By naming it the Wuhan virus, people would not quickly forget why we are where we are.  As for the variant names, as I said, hard to blame the GOP for a mutation that happened in India if it was named the Mumbai variant.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> How else will you know which minority group to blame?



Duh, all of them!


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> How else will you know which minority group to blame?




Is EVERYTHING about race with you?  Do you actively seek it out on a daily basis?  Looking for it when you are walking down the street or hearing conversations?  Man, that must just be exhausting.


----------



## Huntn

This is why you should like the idea of  *Darwin Awards*, it‘s a mechanism whether recognized or not that serves the species, self elimination of genes from the gene pool because of  poor choices.  It’s like watching two squirrels beside the road as your car approaches, they start to dart across, but one turns back, and one continues, getting flattened. The surviving squirrel is in a position now to pass it’s genes that are more likely to recognize road dangers, to the next generation.

At the human level, more of this action helps the cause of humanity. Right now the human species is in a race to save itself though making smart choices, and avoiding bad choices. As a group we are failing, witness environmental damage and climate change.

And regarding COVID, as previously observed, we are now in the position of having to wear masks to protect the dummies. More of this death by stupidity action can only help the species and as I previously stated. it  is why I wish COVID was more lethal, more of us need to be on board with prudent health precautions or pay a big penalty, and more lethality might do that while eliminating forces that are hostile to the progress, and ability of the species to survive and flourish. Think of that progress as moving towards the enlightenment of the species. 

Now someone will accuse me of wanting to see innocent people die. That is not quite correct.  I want to see the human species continue to flourish and I want the obstacles to our success minimized or eliminated, and if it takes this kind of volunteered sacrifice, I’m good with that:









						Three anti-vax conservative radio hosts have now died of Covid. This is how you should react
					

Many on the left have taken an almost smug satisfaction in the deaths of prominent anti-vaxxers. But that won’t change anything




					news.yahoo.com
				



…think greater good. I hope those souls get another chance to make better decisions.


----------



## fooferdoggie

[Murica] All kindergarten teachers at a San Antonio school are Covid-positive, parents learn. Not from the school, but from each other, because this is Greg Abbattoir's pro-life Texas
All kindergarten teachers at Kinder Ranch Elementary, part of Comal ISD, tested positive, according to a report from mycanyonlake.com. The COVID-19 cases were confirmed and news was shared on Open Comal Schools Safely, a Facebook page dedicated to updates on the school district.

A screenshot shared on the page September 1 shows an email from an unnamed Kinder Ranch teacher encouraging wearing a mask at the school following the positive cases. Kinder Ranch Elementary is located




__





						Every kindergarten teacher at this Texas school reportedly positive for COVID-19
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## Huntn

Pumbaa said:


> While the pointing out of makeup, nails, and hair made me chuckle, what about _the fracking t-shirt_? My face hurts from facepalming so hard.



COVID GENERALLY STUPID while they have a self image of being brilliant and witty. Come on COVID, help us out here!


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> I am a huge collge football fan.  Not just the game, but the whole atmosphere of game day.  I love it.  And even I was surprised in the games I watched Thusday, Friday and Saturday evenings just how packed the stands were.  And it wasn't a Red State/Blue State thing (although the WaPo only wanted to focus on Florida and ignored the 43,811 mostly maskless fans in attendance in College Park just a scant 8 miles away), stands were packed everywhere.
> 
> Reading some articles about it today, right leaning sources said it was the populace showing they were no longer afraid of the virus and left leaning sources simply blaming Red States (see above).
> 
> I know most here like to blame the GOP for being stupid, but I have to guess a lot of the fans in the stands this weekend weren't thinking about political ideology, they simply want to go back to normal.



I mostly agree with you here, but I don't fault the fans as much as I do governments and especially the educational institutions in whose name these games were played. Last year, far fewer folks were in attendance, and they were seated apart. Now, the stands are packed despite a dominant viral variant that is far more transmissible. Playing in an uncovered stadium helps, but transmission still happens with screaming people so close to one another.

Assuming that fans will be protected by vaccination is foolish, especially in places with poor vaccine uptake. For example, I estimate that only a small minority of people who attended the Alabama-Miami game in Atlanta were vaccinated, and very few masks were in evidence. So far, LSU is the only SEC team that is requiring fans to either show proof of vaccination or a negative COVID-19 test. Unfortunately, I doubt if others will follow suit soon. It's irresponsible.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Is EVERYTHING about race with you?  Do you actively seek it out on a daily basis?  Looking for it when you are walking down the street or hearing conversations?  Man, that must just be exhausting.



Says the person whose very first post on this forum was specifically about race. You’re the one who keeps making racist posts. I will keep calling them out. If you want to hang out with people that won’t call you out for things like blaming LeBron James for China’s problems, or calling Obama a “muslim sympathizer” or calling COVID the Chinese virus, then go elsewhere. If you make such posts here, I will call them out. Deal with it.

Racism IS exhausting to those targeted by it. Because racists don’t give a shit and will never stop until they are forced to.


----------



## DT

SuperMatt said:


> And why are you insistent on naming variants after a country?













						So what makes me a racist/white supremacist?
					

Ok, not sure what I am setting myself up for here, but I'm going to do it anyway.  So what have I said, posted, done that makes some of you think I am a racist or white supremacist?  I will take the White Supremacist part first.  In my mind, a WS is simply someone who thinks whites are better...




					talkedabout.com


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> For decades we named virus's after where they were first discovered.



Other than the improperly named Spanish flu - which viruses were named after locations?


Herdfan said:


> No, I'm saying that is what the media wants everyone to believe.



How do you know what the media wants everyone to believe, and why is that even important? And please try to keep in mind that Breitbart, OAN, and Fox are as much _the media_ as CNN. 


Herdfan said:


> The origin is important because the people need to know where it came from and what the CCP did that enabled it to spread.



With what expectation? We know that governors like Abbot and DeSantis are enabling spread as fast as they possibly can. Does it make a difference? Will Texas, Florida, and China somehow have to make restitution to the rest of the world?


----------



## Pumbaa

Herdfan said:


> No, I'm saying that is what the media wants everyone to believe.  Cuomo was killing old folks at a record clip, but all the media wanted to focus on was DeSantis.  Why, because they know he will be a front-runner in 2024 and they need to demonize him now.



Amazing how much you care about things related to the virus that happened early on, but not at all about what’s currently happening and how to deal with the ongoing pandemic.

It’s like someone’s been shot, lying here bleeding to death, and all you care is about assigning blame to your political adversaries and talking about forming a posse to go after the shooter (who by the way surely must be an outsider). Calling an ambulance, trying to save the bleeding victim? Naaaah.



Herdfan said:


> The media wants to keep everyone afraid because it gives them clicks.  I am not afraid nor will I be.  I realize some of you are afraid.  You double mask in your cars by yourself, you spray your mail with bleach water, don't go out of the house.  Knock yourself out.  But I am not going to live that way.  I did my part.  I wore a mask when required and got vaccinated.



Seems like your media wants to keep everyone angry because it gives them clicks…



Herdfan said:


> The origin is important because the people need to know where it came from and what the CCP did that enabled it to spread.  They could have possibly contained it had they not lied to the international community. By naming it the Wuhan virus, people would not quickly forget why we are where we are.  As for the variant names, as I said, hard to blame the GOP for a mutation that happened in India if it was named the Mumbai variant.



Around here I’d say pretty much everyone knows that the initial big outbreak was in China, that the Chinese government is constantly covering things up, have misrepresented things and most certainly have been doctoring numbers to look good. We didn’t need China or Wuhan in the name for that.

You need to realize that the answer to “why we are where we are” involves more than just the beginning of the journey. It hasn’t been a straight path. Lot’s of decisions have been made along the way, both good and bad ones. And the journey isn't over, far from it, I fear.

As for variant names and blaming, you and I obviously get our news from different sources. I haven’t seen GOP being blamed for the appearance of the delta variant, just for letting it spread. Is that something that’s actually happened?

And how would one even know that the mutation happened in India? Was it engineered in a lab there? Or documented as it appeared in the first person ever infected with it?


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Says the person whose very first post on this forum was specifically about race. You’re the one who keeps making racist posts. I will keep calling them out. If you want to hang out with people that won’t call you out for things like blaming LeBron James for China’s problems, or calling Obama a “muslim sympathizer” or calling COVID the Chinese virus, then go elsewhere. If you make such posts here, I will call them out. Deal with it.
> 
> Racism IS exhausting to those targeted by it. Because racists don’t give a shit and will never stop until they are forced to.




Yes, I started that thread.  Basically because you and a couple of others did nothing but call me a racist over at PRSI and I wanted to understand why.  The why is because I breathe.  

But l,et me clarify a couple of things.  I don't blame Lebron for China's problems.  I blame him for taking their dirty money all the while keeping his mouth shut about everything else they do.  More of an NBA problem than a LeBron problem, he is just the most visible.  Me calling Obama a Muslim sympathizer is not racist.  It has nothing to do with race.  For decades we called diseases and virus's based on the country of their discovery.  Until China.  We have to bow to China.  Well if you have ever called the H1N1 Flu the Spanish Flu, are you a racist?  

You seem to be targeted by it a bit more, well a lot more, than most.  I don't know if you actually are, think you are or you just go looking for it.  My friend Jay is Black.  He isn't always looking for it.  If he were, we would not be friends.  I don't see him walking into a c-store in southern WV wondering which one of these rednecks is going to kill me.  We go in, get some food and we leave.  Just like every other white person does.  Now maybe he goes home and tells his wife all the racists he saw that day, I don't know.  But he doesn't seem the type.  Not everything is racist and some things that may be, are not necessarily meant to be.  I will say this: if your wife, daughter, mother, son, grandmother or anyone else you care about breaks down or gets a flat tire while traveling through WV, you want me to be one to roll up to help them.  I will make sure they get back on their way safely.  I will protect them like my own family.  Just like I would anyone else.  Even you.   And if they think I am a racist, I can live with that.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Me calling Obama a Muslim sympathizer is not racist. It has nothing to do with race. For decades we called diseases and virus's based on the country of their discovery. Until China. We have to bow to China. Well if you have ever called the H1N1 Flu the Spanish Flu, are you a racist?



Of course it’s racist. You would agree with that if anyone called someone a Christian sympathizer. You only disagree because…Muslim. And that’s what makes it racist.

And no, for decades we did not name viruses based on the location of their discovery.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Me calling Obama a Muslim sympathizer is not racist. It has nothing to do with race.



It is not only racist, but it demonizes a religion practiced by over a billion people. Would you point out a white person you consider to be a Muslim sympathizer? Of course not. Obama is black, he has a name some might think is a “Muslim” name. (Actually his first name is Hebrew, the middle name is Arabic in origin, and the last name is an ancient Kenyan surname). This is why the birther movement started. This is why he is called a Muslim sympathizer. I have Muslim friends. They don’t need my sympathy, but if they did, I’d gladly share it with them. So why don’t you call me a Muslim sympathizer?

And by the way, only about 15% of the world’s Muslims are Arabs. Most Americans don’t realize that.


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> Other than the improperly named Spanish flu - which viruses were named after locations?




Is that a serious question?

Ebola, West Nile, MERS, Marburg, Zika, German Measles, Lassa Fever, Legionaires, Lyme Disease......  Do I need to go on?

And yes, the N1H1 Flu of 1918 was improperly named the Spanish Flu because due to WW1, neutral Spain was the only place news outlets were allowed to report about it.


Alli said:


> With what expectation? We know that governors like Abbot and DeSantis are enabling spread as fast as they possibly can. Does it make a difference? Will Texas, Florida, and China somehow have to make restitution to the rest of the world?




But are they really?  Maybe you should look a little closer to home.  As of today, using a 7-day rolling average, your home state of Alabama has a per capita rate of 87.64/100K while DeSantis's Florida is at 70.28/100K.    Should Alabama being paying restitution as well?


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> Of course it’s racist. You would agree with that if anyone called someone a Christian sympathizer. You only disagree because…Muslim. And that’s what makes it racist.
> 
> And no, for decades we did not name viruses based on the location of their discovery.




Muslim isn't a race.  And being prejudiced against a certain religion is Sectarianism, not Racism.  

And yes we did.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Muslim isn't a race.  And being prejudiced against a certain religion is Sectarianism, not Racism.
> 
> And yes we did.



Another term for prejudice against people based on their religion is *bigotry*. So let’s say it’s bigotry that you are espousing. But it is also racism because you have only tossed this term out there towards a black man.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Another term for prejudice against people based on their religion is *bigotry*. So let’s say it’s bigotry that you are espousing. But it is also racism because you have only tossed this term out there towards a black man.




That is exactly what I am saying.  You are looking for racism.  By your post, I can never criticize Obama because he is Black.   Or any criticism against him is racist no matter what he did.  Sorry, not the way the world works.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Let's pour one out for our passing homey, ...irony.





https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1434871760986390532/


----------



## Pumbaa

Herdfan said:


> That is exactly what I am saying.  You are looking for racism.  By your post, I can never criticize Obama because he is Black.   Or any criticism against him is racist no matter what he did.  Sorry, not the way the world works.



That’s a typical racist conclusion, though, even if you probably don’t see it.

But let’s stick to COVID Stupid here.


----------



## Herdfan

Pumbaa said:


> That’s a typical racist conclusion, though, even if you probably don’t see it.
> 
> But let’s stick to COVID Stupid here.




You got a "Like" for trying to get us back on topic.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> That is exactly what I am saying.  You are looking for racism.  By your post, I can never criticize Obama because he is Black.   Or any criticism against him is racist no matter what he did.  Sorry, not the way the world works.



The ”muslim sympathizer” attack on him is racism and bigotry. You don’t think it is, because well… you don’t see yourself as a racist. You may not be a racist, but that statement is. As I said, white people with “American” names are not being called Muslim sympathizers. It is Obama getting nailed with it. The black guy with a “foreign” name.

And the LeBron James / China thing? That’s just plain racism. There are many politicians and businesspeople who actually could speak out against Chinese human rights violations. If you cannot see the racism that makes one skip over hundreds of people until you get to a black one to start placing blame for problems in China… well you’re not looking very carefully.

PS - Calling out China for locking up Uyghurs makes you a Muslim sympathizer too, right?


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> That is exactly what I am saying.  You are looking for racism.  By your post, I can never criticize Obama because he is Black.   Or any criticism against him is racist no matter what he did.  Sorry, not the way the world works.



Racism can be easily mixed in with religious prejudice when looking at groups of people associated with a religion. And the people who wanted to call President Obama a Muslim, it was because they were trying to pin false sympathies equivalent  to treason on him, AND because he is black. Ok, maybe not you, but that does not mean this appraisal is inaccurate.


----------



## Renzatic

I'm tired of trying to reason with people, so I'm just going full tilt troll these days.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> You do realize people are buying the one for horses and not the one for humans, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One Hospital Denies Oklahoma Doctor's Story of Ivermectin Overdoses Causing ER Delays for Gunshot Victims
> 
> 
> The hospital says it hasn’t experienced any care backlog due to patients overdosing on a drug that’s been falsely peddled as a covid cure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.rollingstone.com



And obviously getting the dosage wrong. These people are not very smart.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Illinois man killed half-brother by shooting him in the head during heated family argument over COVID-19 vaccines, police say​








						Illinois man killed half-brother by shooting him in the head during heated family argument over COVID-19 vaccines, police say
					

Larry Cavitt, 68, is charged with first-degree murder after police say he used a 9mm handgun to shoot his relative in the head last Saturday night.




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> And the LeBron James / China thing? That’s just plain racism.* There are many politicians and businesspeople who actually could speak out against Chinese human rights violations. *If you cannot see the racism that makes one skip over hundreds of people until you get to a black one to start placing blame for problems in China… well you’re not looking very carefully.



Ask Daryl Morey how that turned out for him.  Like I said, it is more of an NBA thing, he is just very visible and makes millions from China.


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> Yes, I started that thread.  Basically because you and a couple of others did nothing but call me a racist over at PRSI and I wanted to understand why.  The why is because I breathe.
> 
> But l,et me clarify a couple of things.  I don't blame Lebron for China's problems.  I blame him for taking their dirty money all the while keeping his mouth shut about everything else they do.  More of an NBA problem than a LeBron problem, he is just the most visible.  Me calling Obama a Muslim sympathizer is not racist.  It has nothing to do with race.  For decades we called diseases and virus's based on the country of their discovery.  Until China.  We have to bow to China.  Well if you have ever called the H1N1 Flu the Spanish Flu, are you a racist?
> 
> You seem to be targeted by it a bit more, well a lot more, than most.  I don't know if you actually are, think you are or you just go looking for it.  My friend Jay is Black.  He isn't always looking for it.  If he were, we would not be friends.  I don't see him walking into a c-store in southern WV wondering which one of these rednecks is going to kill me.  We go in, get some food and we leave.  Just like every other white person does.  Now maybe he goes home and tells his wife all the racists he saw that day, I don't know.  But he doesn't seem the type.  Not everything is racist and some things that may be, are not necessarily meant to be.  I will say this: if your wife, daughter, mother, son, grandmother or anyone else you care about breaks down or gets a flat tire while traveling through WV, you want me to be one to roll up to help them.  I will make sure they get back on their way safely.  I will protect them like my own family.  Just like I would anyone else.  Even you.   And if they think I am a racist, I can live with that.




H1N1 is the correct reference to a virus otherwise known as Swine Flu. The Spanish Flu is the virus that created the 1918 pandemic, and originated in Kansas, before it was spread across the world by U.S. soldiers.

So, maybe naming viruses after their origin is less useful than naming viruses after a nomenclature like SARS-CoV-2, or COVID-19.

The people pushing for it to be called the Chinese Flu are always looking to blame China for the virus, and thereby hope to undercut how disastrous conservatives have been at blunting its spread, from Trump's bumbling to DeSantis' obvious corruption.

As for your buddy Jay, it's worth considering that if a person of color doesn't tell you about a racist interaction, it may not be because they don't have them, but rather they don't trust you to talk about them.

Sure, not everything is racist, and lots of people are navigating the world the right way without intentionally racist intentions, but the desperate need to call SARS-CoV-2 the Chinese Flu is one. And, so were the arguments that Obama was a secret Muslim because they were based on race, sectarianism, and overt bigotry.

Bigotry drives the attacks on China. But, to be clear, China is run by people who routinely violate human rights, and we should acknowledge how they're treating the Uighurs, and those in Hong Kong. And, we also have to be really thoughtful about how China has worked power structures in North Africa and Afghanistan, and how we are in a long-term cold war with them over resources and places like Taiwan. We also have to acknowledge that they're a huge trading partner, and a complex culture, and that simply treating them like an enemy is stupid, and so is spending billions on the idea that we're getting into a shooting war with them. Rather, we're in an economic war that we're losing.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> You do realize people are buying the one for horses and not the one for humans, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One Hospital Denies Oklahoma Doctor's Story of Ivermectin Overdoses Causing ER Delays for Gunshot Victims
> 
> 
> The hospital says it hasn’t experienced any care backlog due to patients overdosing on a drug that’s been falsely peddled as a covid cure
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.rollingstone.com




You do realize this story has been debunked, right.  Totally false.


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> You do realize this story has been debunked, right.  Totally false.




Glad you noted this. Rolling Stone used to be far better, and they need to go rehire the old magazine fact-checkers who would have never let this one fly. 

That said, it's clear that ERs and ICUs are getting hit with far too many people who didn't get the vaccine, and that hospitals nationwide are burning through resources in such a way that triage is necessary. Someone's going to die because they couldn't get oxygen, or a vent, or treatment because we are a nation of adolescents.


----------



## Herdfan

hulugu said:


> As for your buddy Jay, it's worth considering that if a person of color doesn't tell you about a racist interaction, it may not be because they don't have them, but rather they don't trust you to talk about them.




Maybe.  I really don't know.  But I do know me being a racist doesn't stop him from calling me to do stuff as much as I call him.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Ask Daryl Morey how that turned out for him.  Like I said, it is more of an NBA thing, he is just very visible and makes millions from China.



You are still skipping over everybody else that has business in China and going straight to the most prominent *black* person who benefits from business in China. Do you go after the CEO of Nike? No, you go after LeBron who benefits from Nike’s business in China.


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> Maybe.  I really don't know.  But I do know me being a racist doesn't stop him from calling me to do stuff as much as I call him.




Friendships are complex things. And, so is race in America. There are Black people who will actively argue against the idea of modern racism, thinking that it ended with the Civil Rights era, and there are people who shrink and get furious at every supposed lapse. As people, we need to be more honest, more thoughtful, and more forgiving.


----------



## Herdfan

hulugu said:


> Glad you noted this. Rolling Stone used to be far better, and they need to go rehire the old magazine fact-checkers who would have never let this one fly.




Rolling Stone isn't really the problem.  It is when other supposed real journalists like Maddow tweet it to her 10.5M followers.  Rolling Stone did the correct thing and issued an update, but Maddow will never update the tweet or send the correction.

The other issue I see with this media push to link Ivermectin with horse dewormer is that Ivermectin one of the most prescribed anti-parasitic medicines in the world.   So imagine someone who has be infected with roundworm and the Dr. says they are going to prescribe Ivermectin and the person freaks because the media told them it was horse dewormer.  The media as a whole needs to be more responsible.


----------



## hulugu

SuperMatt said:


> You are still skipping over everybody else that has business in China and going straight to the most prominent *black* person who benefits from business in China. Do you go after the CEO of Nike? No, you go after LeBron who benefits from Nike’s business in China.




Right. LeBron is a piper compared to U.S. multinationals, like G.E., Ford, Boeing, General Motors, and Coca-Cola.


----------



## SuperMatt

hulugu said:


> As for your buddy Jay, it's worth considering that if a person of color doesn't tell you about a racist interaction, it may not be because they don't have them, but rather they don't trust you to talk about them.



At my workplace, we had an incident of disgusting overt racism by one person that was very public. As a result, we had some small-group discussions about the issue. Almost every black person had a story of somebody making a racist comment or joke towards them at some point, and usually the offender would laugh it off. Even if they told the offender it bothered them, the offender would insist they were just joking and act annoyed at the offended person for not “getting it.”

The offended people never mentioned these things before. It took a “big event” for attention to be paid, and when people started telling their stories, I know a lot of people were surprised. People that deal with this kind of racism don’t bring it up, or they get hit with statements like those I saw in this thread and quite often at MR: “Why are YOU making everything about race?”

So just because the one black guy who hangs out with a group of white people doesn’t bring up racist things they said/did doesn’t mean they aren’t happening.


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> Rolling Stone isn't really the problem.  It is when other supposed real journalists like Maddow tweet it to her 10.5M followers.  Rolling Stone did the correct thing and issued an update, but Maddow will never update the tweet or send the correction.
> 
> The other issue I see with this media push to link Ivermectin with horse dewormer is that Ivermectin one of the most prescribed anti-parasitic medicines in the world.   So imagine someone who has be infected with roundworm and the Dr. says they are going to prescribe Ivermectin and the person freaks because the media told them it was horse dewormer.  The media as a whole needs to be more responsible.




Ivermectin is a useful anti-parasitic, but the formula that people are regularly buying from veterinarians and large animals hospitals is horse dewormer and sheep-dip. It's accurate to say that people who buy the paste from the large animal food store are taking horse dewormer.

There's a different formula for people. 

And, there's vanishingly little evidence that Ivermectin actually works. One meta-study was withdrawn, and there are other signs that its totally ineffective. 

So, who should bear responsibility is the people selling an ineffective and dangerous solution that's increasingly expensive—and making it hard for people to care for their animals to boot—when they should be pushing the free and safe vaccine? The right-wing media who left reality years ago and are now selling snake oil and bullshit.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> You do realize this story has been debunked, right.  Totally false.



Thanks for pointing that out... Kind of a shame too, because taking a horse dose of ivermectin IS dangerous. Rolling Stone needs to consider whether they want to continue employing the author of the article. When you get something like that wrong, it gives ammunition to people trying to argue that Ivermectin is safe to take without a prescription, in horse dosage… which it is not.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> Rolling Stone isn't really the problem.  It is when other supposed real journalists like Maddow tweet it to her 10.5M followers.  Rolling Stone did the correct thing and issued an update, but Maddow will never update the tweet or send the correction.
> 
> The other issue I see with this media push to link Ivermectin with horse dewormer is that Ivermectin one of the most prescribed anti-parasitic medicines in the world.   So imagine someone who has be infected with roundworm and the Dr. says they are going to prescribe Ivermectin and the person freaks because the media told them it was horse dewormer.  The media as a whole needs to be more responsible.



Wasn’t it farm supply outlets that it was suggested as a place to buy this medication by some brilliant Right Wing  mouth pieces (Without a prescription)?


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> Wasn’t it farm supply outlets that it was suggested as a place to buy this medication by some brilliant Right Wing  mouth pieces (Without a prescription)?




No idea about that.  Lord I hope not.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Huntn said:


> Wasn’t it farm supply outlets that it was suggested as a place to buy this medication by some brilliant Right Wing  mouth pieces (Without a prescription)?



That’s exactly what it was.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435030030527176707/


----------



## Pumbaa

Roller said:


> Now we have judges ordering hospitals to administer ivermectin:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge orders Cinci hospital to treat COVID-19 patient with Ivermectin, despite CDC warnings - Ohio Capital Journal
> 
> 
> A Butler County judge ruled in favor of a woman last week who sought to force a hospital to administer Ivermectin — an animal dewormer that federal regulators have warned against using in COVID-19 patients — to her husband after several weeks in the ICU with the disease. Butler County Common...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ohiocapitaljournal.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully, this decision will be appealed and struck down forcefully by a higher court. But if it stands, patients will bring similar lawsuits every time some new, untested therapy is proposed. I realize that courts sometimes get involved in medical care decisions, as for example when they order therapy for children over their parent's objections. But this is dangerous. Every sane healthcare provider and professional organization should speak out against this ruling.
> 
> BTW, I know and hope that medications indicated for other conditions may turn out to be effective against COVID-19. Hundreds are in various stages of clinical investigation. But until they have a demonstrable risk:benefit profile in well-conducted studies, it's harmful to evangelize their use, and it's even more harmful to compel it.



Reversed. Judge citing advisories from FDA and CDC etc. Obviously a deep state activist judge, right?









						Judge says Ohio hospital cannot be forced to give ivermectin, reversing earlier decision
					

"Public policy should not and does not support allowing physicians to try 'any' type of treatment on human beings," the judge wrote.




					www.nbcnews.com
				






> In an 11-page decision, Hamilton County Common Pleas Judge Michael Oster Jr. wrote that there “was no doubt that the medical and scientific communities do not support the use of ivermectin as a treatment for Covid-19.”






> “While this court is sympathetic to the plaintiff and understands the idea of wanting to do anything to help her loved one, public policy should not and does not support allowing physicians to try ‘any’ type of treatment on human beings,” he wrote.


----------



## SuperMatt

Pumbaa said:


> Reversed. Judge citing advisories from FDA and CDC etc. Obviously a deep state activist judge, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge says Ohio hospital cannot be forced to give ivermectin, reversing earlier decision
> 
> 
> "Public policy should not and does not support allowing physicians to try 'any' type of treatment on human beings," the judge wrote.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com



I think this is a very good ruling. After all, what if your relative believes in this therapy from “What About Bob?” Will the judge force a doctor to try it?

”Death Therapy - It’s a guaranteed cure!”


----------



## fooferdoggie

not a nurse who should work around people
Nurse investigated for allegedly writing mask opt-out notes at public park​'








						I-TEAM: Nurse investigated for allegedly writing mask opt-out notes at public park
					

Is a local registered nurse selling mask and vaccine opt out forms at a public park? That’s the claim that’s now under investigation after complaints from fellow health care professionals.




					www.news4jax.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

One landlord is making tenants get vaccinated. Whether it’s legal is still undecided​








						One landlord is making tenants get vaccinated. Whether it’s legal is still undecided
					

FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. – If you’re not vaccinated for COVID-19, you can forget about moving into any of eight apartment complexes in Broward and Miami-Dade counties owned by Santiago A. Alvarez and his family. And if you’re still unvaccinated when it comes time to renew your lease, you’ll have to...




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

Will we have to get to this point?  



> Man Sentenced to 5 Years in Prison for Spreading Covid-19
> 
> 
> The man has been linked to at least eight illnesses and one death.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com





> A man in Vietnam has been sentenced to five years in prison after he broke strict covid-19 quarantine rules in the country, contracting the disease in a large city and bringing it back to his rural hometown. The man’s actions have been linked to eight illnesses and one death from covid-19.
> 
> Le Van Tri, a 28-year-old man from the province of Ca Mau, was convicted this week of “spreading dangerous infectious diseases,” according to the state-run Vietnam News Agency and Australia’s ABC News.
> 
> Tri reportedly traveled by motorcycle to Ho Chi Minh City and back to Ca Mau in early July against Vietnam’s strict coronavirus rules. Anyone traveling between regions is supposed to self-quarantine for 21 days, something Tri failed to do. Tri also reportedly lied to authorities when they asked about his travel history.
> 
> Ca Mau has reported just 191 cases of covid-19 and two deaths from the disease since the pandemic began, making Tri’s actions all the more egregious. Tri was fined roughly $880 in addition to his five year prison sentence, according to Yahoo News.


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> Will we have to get to this point?



man this would be great in the US trump would be in jail now.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Will we have to get to this point?



We’d have to turn Florida into a prison to fit all the people like this in America.


----------



## Edd

SuperMatt said:


> We’d have to turn Florida into a prison to fit all the people like this in America.



Yeah, like Escape From New York. Only rule is once you go in, you don’t come out. The sea levels rise and the gators come for everyone.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Pumbaa said:


> Reversed. Judge citing advisories from FDA and CDC etc. Obviously a deep state activist judge, right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Judge says Ohio hospital cannot be forced to give ivermectin, reversing earlier decision
> 
> 
> "Public policy should not and does not support allowing physicians to try 'any' type of treatment on human beings," the judge wrote.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com



Good, that was absolutely ridiculous.


----------



## JayMysteri0

What.  Wha?!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435204185465700361/






If true, THIS, over a vaccine still?


----------



## JayMysteri0

Here's some frustrating stupidity to consider

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435175829835812865/


----------



## Eric

Sad.


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/pjl2p1


----------



## Renzatic

fooferdoggie said:


> One landlord is making tenants get vaccinated. Whether it’s legal is still undecided​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> One landlord is making tenants get vaccinated. Whether it’s legal is still undecided
> 
> 
> FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. – If you’re not vaccinated for COVID-19, you can forget about moving into any of eight apartment complexes in Broward and Miami-Dade counties owned by Santiago A. Alvarez and his family. And if you’re still unvaccinated when it comes time to renew your lease, you’ll have to...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com




I'm not 100% sure that'd be legal, considering that housing could be considered one of the base necessities, and what you do in your private residence doesn't necessarily effect the community at large.


----------



## Eric

Just got off of a work call where one guy said his son went to see the new Shang-Chi movie on Friday and is now sick, going to get a test today. We also have two others who couldn't join because they do have COVID. The appetite for a lockdown is over but the virus doesn't care and nobody seems to be concerned with the burden on the healthcare system.


----------



## MEJHarrison

In all this time, I've gotten 3 notifications from work that there were potential exposures in the building.  The first exposure was in the finance department last month.  #2 was Friday and #3 was Sunday.  To be fair, #2 was in the department that delivers medical equipment to people's homes.  #3 was from a team heavy with nurses.  Not sure why we have nurses in the building since we're the insurance people, but there's a whole RN department for some insurance purpose.  Fortunately, I've not actually stepped foot in the building in well over a year now.  And I would have been nowhere near those people anyway.

Not sure how long they've had that notification up and running, so there may have been others in the past.  It's nice that they let the entire company know, even if we're not there.  I do need to return _*someday*_ to pick up my stuff I still have there.


----------



## Eric

Another one on his way down


Florida man, covid denier, anti-vaxxer, Q-Anon follower, and Volusia County council member, Fred Lowry has been hospitalized with COVID-19. from
      LeopardsAteMyFace


----------



## Edd

Eric said:


> Another one on his way down
> 
> 
> Florida man, covid denier, anti-vaxxer, Q-Anon follower, and Volusia County council member, Fred Lowry has been hospitalized with COVID-19. from
> LeopardsAteMyFace



Oh man, he just looks like he suuuuuucks.


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> What.  Wha?!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435204185465700361/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If true, THIS, over a vaccine still?



I just read this study. To be fair, it's somewhat sketchy. But the point is that people should not be self-prescribing ivermectin, especially not animal formulations. There is as yet no convincing evidence that ivermectin has anything more than minimal benefit compared to vaccines. One Israeli study that has received a lot of attention was also flawed methodologically.


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> What.  Wha?!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435204185465700361/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If true, THIS, over a vaccine still?




Well, __they__ were already a bunch of limp dicks, so it's not much a change ...


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## User.45

Michael, self-described ass-hole, gets his award. His wife dies of COVID just 13 days later, leaving 3 kids without parents. from
      HermanCainAward

This is sad AF...


----------



## JayMysteri0

I hadn't thought of it like this...


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> I hadn't thought of it like this...



It's like Blue Lives Matter. More cops died of COVID than murdered in the past 5-10 years altogether. So if you back the blue but don't do the pandemic measures, your actual goal is to support police brutality and not to protect the health of cops.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JFC



Also for all the idiots sick and praying for a miracle


----------



## SuperMatt

This lady:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435200650804146177/

Even if COVID wasn‘t a thing, you don’t go around coughing on people, period. You don’t know what illness others have.


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> This lady:
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435200650804146177/
> 
> Even if COVID wasn‘t a thing, you don’t go around coughing on people, period. You don’t know what illness others have.



Would love to see her in the ICU, better yet, sent home because she does not need no stink’n vaccine and see how much she smirks then.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> This lady:
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435200650804146177/
> 
> Even if COVID wasn‘t a thing, you don’t go around coughing on people, period. You don’t know what illness others have.



Let’s for a moment ignore the garbage sentences coming out of her mouth and that she is intentionally coughing at people. If she actually suffers from allergies that cause her to uncontrollably cough/sneeze all over the place, wouldn’t that be a very good reason to wear a mask around other people, pandemic or not?


----------



## Huntn

P_X said:


> Michael, self-described ass-hole, gets his award. His wife dies of COVID just 13 days later, leaving 3 kids without parents. from
> HermanCainAward
> 
> This is sad AF...



It’s really sad when kids have STUPID parents. At this point at best hopefully this is a life lesson they can learn/benefit  from.


----------



## DT

SuperMatt said:


> This lady:
> 
> Even if COVID wasn‘t a thing, you don’t go around coughing on people, period. You don’t know what illness others have.




That's some of that bullshit "trump empowerment", before the last few years, I don't think anyone would've been as much of an aggressive fuckwit.

And look, I'm not advocating violence, especially vs. a woman, but I have a trigger, and some idiot comes up to me and COUGHS on me?  It might get pulled and they might be taking a trip to the ER ...

Oh, and look, that dumb bitch has been ID'ed:









						Who is Janene Hoskovec? Maskless Woman Who Intentionally Coughed on Shoppers at Nebraska Grocery Store Identified as Arizona-Based IT Employee
					

The SAP released a statement saying it was investigating the incident involving one of its employees.




					www.ibtimes.sg
				




Bye bye corporate job!  Bye bye shopping at that store any longer!

BYE!


----------



## Huntn

DT said:


> That's some of that bullshit "trump empowerment", before the last few years, I don't think anyone would've been as much of an aggressive fuckwit.
> 
> And look, I'm not advocating violence, especially vs. a woman, but I have a trigger, and some idiot comes up to me and COUGHS on me?  It might get pulled and they might be taking a trip to the ER ...
> 
> Oh, and look, that dumb bitch has been ID'ed:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Who is Janene Hoskovec? Maskless Woman Who Intentionally Coughed on Shoppers at Nebraska Grocery Store Identified as Arizona-Based IT Employee
> 
> 
> The SAP released a statement saying it was investigating the incident involving one of its employees.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ibtimes.sg
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bye bye corporate job!  Bye bye shopping at that store any longer!
> 
> BYE!



She should be charged with assault.


----------



## DT

Huntn said:


> She should be charged with assault.




Yep, and especially given the people attempted to move away from her and she pursued them.   I bet if they would've filled her face with some pepper spray, she would've left them alone.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Huntn said:


> She should be charged with assault.



There is precedent for charges being pressed, jail time, and fines.



> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maskless Florida Woman Jailed for Coughing on Customer
> 
> 
> A Florida woman who purposefully coughed on another customer without wearing a mask in a Pier 1 store last summer has received jail time and fines.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.webmd.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *





> April 12, 2021 -- A Florida woman who purposefully coughed on another customer without wearing a mask in a Pier 1 store last summer has received jail time and fines, according _to The Washington Post._
> 
> Debra Hunter, 53, will serve 30 days in jail, followed by 6 months of probation. She is also required to take an anger management course and pay a $500 fine. She was charged with second-degree assault, which is a misdemeanor.
> 
> In an online sentencing session on Thursday, Judge James A. Ruth said Hunter’s actions at the Jacksonville store on June 25 could have had “deadly consequences” for the customer, Heather Sprague, who was being treated for a brain tumor.
> 
> In a video that Sprague recorded and shared on social media, Hunter is waiting at a Pier 1 checkout counter and having an argument with store employees. She turns to Sprague and confronts her for recording the scene.
> 
> “Do you really need this? What do you want to do, post it for you? How about that?” Hunter said and held up two middle fingers. Then she walked toward Sprague.
> 
> “I think I’ll get real close to you and cough on you then. How’s that?” she said as she approached the camera and then coughed.






> https://www.newsobserver.com/news/nation-world/national/article250951124.html





> A former California teacher was charged with assault 10 months after authorities said she pulled down her mask and coughed in a baby’s face at a yogurt shop.
> 
> Nancy Nordland, 66, of San Jose fled after she coughed into a 1-year-old’s face on June 12 at a Yogurtland in San Jose, the Santa Clara County District Attorney’s office said Friday.
> 
> Nordland got into a fight with another woman while waiting in line at the shop, according to prosecutors, who say she “did not like how close the woman was standing to her.”


----------



## JayMysteri0

...and the fuckery grows

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435641889169027076/


----------



## JayMysteri0

...and grows

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435472901818372097/

"laws for thee, but not for me"

Hypothetically, what could go wrong?





> COVID outbreak shuts down entire Metro East police department
> 
> 
> Every officer from the Venice Police Department in southern Illinois has tested positive for COVID-19 forcing the entire department to shut down, the mayor said Thursday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.audacy.com




Oh.


----------



## JayMysteri0

...and finally what makes you want to just give up.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435650634703904770/


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> ...and grows
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435472901818372097/
> 
> "laws for thee, but not for me"
> 
> Hypothetically, what could go wrong?




Hey now, don't go picking on Portland.  The Portland Police Department has the finest cops in all of Portland.  You'd need to go somewhere else to find better cops.


----------



## JayMysteri0

MEJHarrison said:


> Hey now, don't go picking on Portland.  The Portland Police Department has the finest cops in all of Portland.  You'd need to go somewhere else to find better cops.



Evidently not the Venice Police Dept in Southern Ill, who found out what can happen.

Or perhaps a Florida school board meeting if you're 'Karen'

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435386709836025858/


----------



## Runs For Fun

What an idiot 








						‘Joe Rogan Is Getting This Completely Wrong,’ Says The Scientist Who Conducted The Vaccine Study
					

“He's taking very careful work about evolutionary scenarios of the future, and from that, erroneously concluding that people should not be vaccinated now," says Andrew Read, professor of biology and entomology at Pennsylvania State and author of the study.




					www.forbes.com


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> ...and the fuckery grows
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435641889169027076/



I didn’t really understand what happened there. Did the police simply refuse to enforce the order?


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Evidently not the Venice Police Dept in Southern Ill, who found out what can happen.
> 
> Or perhaps a Florida school board meeting if you're 'Karen'
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435386709836025858/



So the cops are refusing to follow the orders of people that they supposedly answer to? I would think, even with Union protection, that officers could be fired for refusing to follow lawful orders.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> So the cops are refusing to follow the orders of people that they supposedly answer to? I would think, even with Union protection, that officers could be fired for refusing to follow lawful orders.



You're not appreciating how much politicians fear police & fire unions.

The police are in no danger of being asked to follow a rule, unless it's something so bad done on camera.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> I didn’t really understand what happened there. Did the police simply refuse to enforce the order?



At this point does it matter anymore?  If the parents are willing to use their kids to further their feelings, and a cop is standing right there with no mask, why give a 'f'?

At this point, let it all go to pot.

The survivors will be screaming how it's all Joe Biden's & the democrats fault anyways, so what they hey?  They were "patriots" to the end.


----------



## hulugu

JayMysteri0 said:


> At this point does it matter anymore?  If the parents are willing to use their kids to further their feelings, and a cop is standing right there with no mask, why give a 'f'?
> 
> At this point, let it all go to pot.
> 
> The survivors will be screaming how it's all Joe Biden's & the democrats fault anyways, so what they hey?  They were "patriots" to the end.




The school should just enforce its code of conduct, and suspend the students. If this means a loss of grade points, or extracurricular activities, including sports, tough shit.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> ...and grows
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435472901818372097/
> 
> "laws for thee, but not for me"
> 
> Hypothetically, what could go wrong?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh.



Fuck’m quit!


----------



## JayMysteri0

hulugu said:


> The school should just enforce its code of conduct, and suspend the students. If this means a loss of grade points, or extracurricular activities, including sports, tough shit.



Which is what many of the comments online pointed out.  

In the past schools have enforced all kinds of sometimes arbitrary seeming dress code rules on girls or hairstyle rules that would only apply to specific portion of the students.

In fairness, the same should be applied with masks.  A rule was made for the entire student body, if the entire student body isn't held to it, it becomes hypocritical.


----------



## Thomas Veil

SuperMatt said:


> So the cops are refusing to follow the orders of people that they supposedly answer to? I would think, even with Union protection, that officers could be fired for refusing to follow lawful orders.



Cops are often trained in de-escalation techniques to get people like her out instead of having to slap on the cuffs, which could result in a big scene (which you _know_ someone would use against the school board). Still, there's only so long you wait for someone to calm down, especially when the person in question is holding up a public event.

We don't know any other, hidden motivations. You have to wonder, if Krazy Karen had been something other than white, whether they would have had her out of there a whole lot quicker. And yes, the cops may have been sympathetic to her "cause".



Huntn said:


> Fuck’m quit!



Yup!


----------



## JayMysteri0

This is NOT helping make police look good on top of their resistance

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435634793404899336/


----------



## Eric

Who can blame him.









						No Vax, No Visit: Florida Doctor Won't Treat Unvaccinated Patients in Person
					

A Florida doctor says she will stop treating patients in person if they are not vaccinated against COVID-19, citing the risk of exposing immunocompromised patients and staffer to the virus that has killed over 46,000 people in the state and more than 648,000 nationwide. “I understand that people...




					www.nbcnewyork.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

HOLEEE F'N WHAT WHAT?!!!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435726003737874433/


----------



## Thomas Veil

*Sickening. *









						Women laugh as student discusses grandmother's death during mask debate
					

The incident occurred at a Rutherford County School Board meeting to discuss whether to bring in a coronavirus mask mandate.




					www.newsweek.com
				






> "This time last year, my grandmother, who was a former teacher at the Rutherford County school system, died of COVID because someone wasn't wearing a mask."





> The comment resulted in a number of people laughing and expressing their disagreement.





> The clip shows two women sitting behind the student holding "let our kids smile" placards smirking and shaking her head as he tries to continue with his side of the debate.




Seriously. These are extremely sick people.


----------



## JayMysteri0

With Joe Rogan popping up in this discussion, anyone remember this guy?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435817075667357696/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Once again, Texas has their students & communities best interests in mind

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435841780457648128/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

From a journalist interviewing people in Missouri on why they won’t get vaccinated.  

“Well, the one thing is, they shafted my president,” said Wayland. “They would have had the vaccine–already had it, already had it, but they wouldn’t give it to him because they knew damn good well he would be reelected… so they had to swindle around and scare around and keep it from him, just as soon as the election was over, we got it.”

Its impossible to unpack that without sounding elite.  So I guess just say bless his heart and move on.


----------



## DT

DT said:


> Bye bye corporate job!




Yep. 


https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435761328887635969/









						Maskless woman seen coughing on shoppers at Nebraska grocery store fired
					

A clip of former SAP employee Janene Hoskovec coughing at a mother who was shopping with her child has been viewed 4 million times.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## Huntn

DT said:


> Yep.
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435761328887635969/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maskless Woman Seen Coughing on Shoppers at Nebraska Grocery Store Fired
> 
> 
> A clip of former SAP employee Janene Hoskovec coughing at a mother who was shopping with her child has been viewed 4 million times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com



She looked like she was having so much fun harassing other masked customers. It‘s a shame…NOT. What that woman did was outrageously stupid, a prime example of letting your emotions screw yourself. This incident could  very well could be an obstacle for getting rehired.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Huntn said:


> She looked like she was having so much fun harassing other masked customers. It‘s a shame…NOT. What that woman did was outrageously stupid, a prime example of letting your emotions screw yourself. This incident could  very well could be an obstacle for getting rehired.




But when done right she could at least possibly be featured as the muse for a Karen metal video.









						Karen Metal
					






					talkedabout.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

WTF?!

Back on the F'N stupid train...



> Joe Rogan slams CNN over controversial drug Ivermectin
> 
> 
> Joe Rogan is not “horseplaying” around with CNN; he might sue.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com




This is not counting that Rogan himself doesn't get the facts right about the vaccine studies he claims back up his claims.



> ‘Joe Rogan Is Getting This Completely Wrong,’ Says The Scientist Who Conducted The Vaccine Study
> 
> 
> “He's taking very careful work about evolutionary scenarios of the future, and from that, erroneously concluding that people should not be vaccinated now," says Andrew Read, professor of biology and entomology at Pennsylvania State University and author of the study.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.forbes.com





> Joe Rogan’s public misrepresentation of a 2015 vaccine study has gone viral. His misunderstanding of the study leads Rogan to wrongly conclude that vaccinating people against COVID-19 will increase the chances of  some hyper-virulent mutation. You can watch the video below. But before you do, the lead scientist and author of the study who spent 10 years conducting this research has something to say. Because he’s horrified.
> 
> “Joe Rogan is getting this completely wrong,” says Andrew Read, professor of biology and entomology at Pennsylvania State. “He's taking very careful work about evolutionary scenarios of the future, and from that, erroneously concluding that people should not be vaccinated now.”
> 
> *Rogan quotes a line from the paper’s abstract out of context: “Vaccines that keep hosts alive but still allow transmission could thus allow very virulent strains to circulate in a population.”*
> 
> Read responds: “We're talking a very different virus and very different vaccines. The details in biology really matter a lot. The chicken vaccines we worked with, the first-generation vaccine, definitely reduced disease, severity and death.” But unlike the COVID mRNA vaccines, the chicken vaccine “didn't stop transmission at all.” And this is one of the key differences between what was being studied in Read’s paper and our current situation with the global pandemic. “Those [vaccinated] chickens just kept churning out the virus for weeks and weeks and weeks.” Again, this is a key difference. “It’s a very different virus from SARS-2. A key issue here is transmissibility.”
> 
> *More transmission increases the likelihood of mutation. Thankfully, COVID-19 Vaccines reduce transmission and reduce opportunity for mutation.*
> 
> “Think about what's happening with evolution,” offers Read. “Mutations can occur anytime the [virus] replicates. So the more replication, the more variants are generated. At the moment, the vast majority of the replication is happening in unvaccinated people. You can tell that because the majority of cases in the hospital are unvaccinated individuals. That is where the evolutionary action is happening at the moment.”





> Joe Rogan's COVID treatment blasted by CNN medical analyst: 'He's not helping matters'
> 
> 
> Dr. Jonathan Reiner lamented Rogan’s choice of ‘folk remedies’ but hopes the experience will push him to encourage vaccination.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.yahoo.com





> Spotify airs Joe Rogan podcast touting ivermectin as part of his COVID-19 treatment, despite the FDA calling it 'dangerous'
> 
> 
> Spotify aired Joe Rogan's podcast where he defended his use of ivermectin to treat COVID-19, despite the FDA and CDC warning against using the drug.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com









At this point Rogan has jumped on the ivermectin bandwagon, just for the increased notoriety.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> WTF?!
> 
> Back on the F'N stupid train...
> 
> 
> 
> This is not counting that Rogan himself doesn't get the facts right about the vaccine studies he claims back up his claims.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At this point Rogan has jumped on the ivermectin bandwagon, just for the increased notoriety.



Celebrities over experts. Could that be the root of America’s problems? It certainly gave us one of the worst presidents ever. And this type of thing with Rogan is not new. Suzanne Sommers was selling miracle cures years ago, and I know she wasn’t the first celebrity to do so. It just seems to me that years ago, people tended to see through those things and make fun of them. Today, a lot more people are buying into it hook, line, and sinker.


----------



## Pumbaa

DT said:


> Yep.
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435761328887635969/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maskless Woman Seen Coughing on Shoppers at Nebraska Grocery Store Fired
> 
> 
> A clip of former SAP employee Janene Hoskovec coughing at a mother who was shopping with her child has been viewed 4 million times.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com



I bet she feels like she’s the victim here. A poor innocent casualty of cancel culture for having the courage to speak the truth. A martyr, even?


----------



## SuperMatt

An amusing take on anti-vax insanity:


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yeaaaahhhhh, it will be awhile before I fly, as long as these idiots roam the Earth...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435976246693859332/

As if flying hasn't become more stressful already.


----------



## JayMysteri0

"They hurt the children!"   

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435997915064020992/



You always wonder in the movies that has some silly super villain, what could motivate some dumb @$$ plan like killing everyone or some alien power judges us lacking.

Then you see folks like that...

"They hurt the children". Where the F are people getting this from?


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> "They hurt the children!"




And why are they so fucking bombastic and violent?  I've never seen a person wearing a mask flip and start screaming at people.

I mean, I know why ...


----------



## Pumbaa

DT said:


> And why are they so fucking bombastic and violent?  I've never seen a person wearing a mask flip and start screaming at people.
> 
> I mean, I know why ...



Yes, it is obvious. Everyone knows why. Persons wearing masks are obedient sheep so of course they won’t flip and start screaming at people.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I was thinking about the Afghanistan veterans who feel they fought and died for nothing. Soon after I realized there’s something a lot worse, anti-vax Trump supporters. They are truly fighting and dying for nothing, less than nothing. Trump couldn’t give less of a shit about them and they serve as little more than cannon fodder for his ego. I have no doubt he gets a stiffy when thinking about people who died as the result of his passing thoughts.  They're an entire army of useful idiots.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435800376515743749/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436151663421763586/

Do some people NOT understand that many people when they see someone stand in or near a corn field, their first thought is to run from that nut?!

Also does anyone really believe anyone's buying this whole "I'm not saying anything about violence, but 'wink' 'wink' if some mythical gestapo that's never shown up shows up... "you know what to do"?  How the 'F' do these nut jobs know what to do, they're still waiting for Obama to come take their guns!  It's always some assbag who wouldn't go out & risk own their life, asking "their fellow Americans" to "know what to do".

Over a VACCINE?!!

Again whether it's a mask or vaccine these individuals suddenly discover the suffering of others in the past that they didn't have empathy for 30 minutes earlier.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436164317167116291/

"Get the manager please"

Me:


----------



## JayMysteri0

Some reminders

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436201317937074180/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436005248800264196/

Some people need to get out of their feelings.  It may keep them and the people who actually do need those beds alive.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Adults laughed at a teen who was talking at a Tennessee school-board meeting about his grandmother dying of COVID-19, video shows
					

A woman in the background can be seen laughing, smirking, and shaking her head while he was speaking.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436216115676418061/

They do vote for Joe Manchin


----------



## Runs For Fun

Good








						Woman in video seen coughing on customers loses her job
					

Lincoln woman coughs in people's faces at a grocery store.




					www.3newsnow.com


----------



## Pumbaa

Pumbaa said:


> I bet she feels like she’s the victim here. A poor innocent casualty of cancel culture for having the courage to speak the truth. A martyr, even?




Who woulda’ thunk it? She feels like she has been wrongly convicted by the social media mob, compares herself to “our men in blue”.

Feelings aside:


> You do not know the whole story and have not seen the videos plural in their entirety.



What could possibly justify the assault coughs?


----------



## ronntaylor

Runs For Fun said:


> Good
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Woman in video seen coughing on customers loses her job
> 
> 
> Lincoln woman coughs in people's faces at a grocery store.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.3newsnow.com



She's lucky she didn't get her clock cleaned. Depending on the age of the other woman's child, that should be considered assault on a minor/child endangerment. The parents should pursue charges or this Karen will continue to feel entitled. In fact, losing her job will give her more incentive as a form of payback.


----------



## JayMysteri0

For all those saying losing patience with the unvaccinated is the wrong approach...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436369564342816784/


> Kali Cook, Galveston County's youngest COVID fatality, was 'beautiful', mother says
> 
> 
> The child died in her sleep at home within hours of manifesting a slight fever, her mother said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.galvnews.com





> Kali Cook was 4 years old. She hated bows and liked to play with worms.
> 
> She lived in Bacliff with her mother, father and older siblings. She attended pre-kindergarten classes in the Dickinson Independent School District.
> 
> On Tuesday, she died of COVID-19, according to the Galveston County Health District.
> 
> The death came quickly and underscores warnings from local physicians that although children tend to fare well against COVID, when they do become ill they can become very ill and illness can progress rapidly.




What the hell happened to all those types who used to eagerly cite "tough love" for others?

We lose patience, because we are losing lives!


----------



## JayMysteri0

WTF?!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436411293490159628/

Entitlement is a f'n addictive thing it seems.

Is there proof of this actual walk out?  Can't find it.  Only an article saying "allegedly", based on this video.

And...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436424645486465029/

For a group who believes they've been lied to often, they aren't shy with the use of misinformation themselves.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> For all those saying losing patience with the unvaccinated is the wrong approach...




I think it is absolutely the wrong approach.  That's not how you change minds.  With that said, my job is programming computers, not changing people's minds about the vaccine.  So I say screw them. The quicker all the dumb people are gone, the quicker we stop hearing about tragedies like that.  I'm not losing my patience. It's long gone by now.

You thought you were smarter than those who know better.
You had nothing but distrust for those who did their best to tell you otherwise and help you.
You ignored similar stories from others who have suffered loss from this.
You gambled your family's very lives on your intelligence.
You were wrong and lost big time.
You're now stuck with a loss that can never be fully healed.

Take your sad story elsewhere.  I was smart enough to get my vaccine.  I don't need to hear your tale of stupidity.  I do hope her message changes at least one other person's mind about the vaccine, so I don't begrudge her getting her tale out there.  Though I highly suspect it's getting far more attention from the side that doesn't need to hear it than the side that does need to hear it.  So I doubt much good will come from it.  Just another pointless loss.


----------



## Runs For Fun

The idiocy of this statement is infuriating
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436365999960432644/

You are definitely not getting my vote in November.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Take a moment...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436438630231416832/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Runs For Fun said:


> The idiocy of this statement is infuriating
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436365999960432644/
> 
> You are definitely not getting my vote in November.



Take about up trying to have it both ways.  I heard the man's spine snap trying to contort as he typed that.

He recognizes that the vaccine is the best option, but it should be up to people if they want it.

SOME people have already shown if there's a choice between their feelings, and what's best for their fellow countrymen & women feelings ALWAYS win now.  It's for those people we need mandates at all, since suddenly this ONE vaccine as opposed to the others they already took somehow infringes on their mythical rights.  As if maintaining a pandemic isn't an infringement on the rights of others.


----------



## ronntaylor

JayMysteri0 said:


> We lose patience, because we are losing lives!



I lost my patience many months ago. Fuck her and similar jackasses. She should be charged with homicide.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436481463436840965/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436483905276764161/


----------



## Thomas Veil

JayMysteri0 said:


> Take about up trying to have it both ways.



You literally took the words out of my mouth. That was my reaction even _before_ I scrolled down and saw that you'd beaten me to it.

As far as Biden's mandates, I have no problem with them. The real problem is that whether we are talking about diseases or racism (or am I being redundant?), we are allowing a minority of obnoxious, angry bullies to push around the rest of us. High time we push back, I say.


----------



## SuperMatt

There are indications that Biden's poll numbers are going back up after the vaccine mandate. That makes sense; a majority have been vaccinated and they're sick of the troglodytes that refuse to be functioning members of society.


----------



## SuperMatt

Really good article from the former science reporter of the NY Times (it is a month old):









						What Is Biden Waiting For?
					

The Delta variant is making clear what the Administration should have done back in January: mandate vaccines, mandate passports and crack…




					donaldgmcneiljr1954.medium.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> There are indications that Biden's poll numbers are going back up after the vaccine mandate. That makes sense; a majority have been vaccinated and they're sick of the troglodytes that refuse to be functioning members of society.



I think the biggest cause for such numbers, is the reasoning that some people are trying to use.  It's one thing if you are uncertain, yes the vaccine was made at record speed, but it was based on work done years before up until today.   What doesn't work is that SOME of those same people uncertain don't think something can be done so fast, but cheer leaded when their president of choice got the ball rolling with "Operation Warp Speed".  What the 'f' did those people think that title meant?  That the unvaccinated in the former president's world would be forced to wear 'red shirts'?  The other excuse of it not being approved, got shut down, and STILL some moved on to yet another excuse.  Which makes it clear what the problem is.  It's all about feelings & trying to 'stick it' to others because SOME want to imagine their side of the aisle can claim credit for getting the work done to get us this far.  All the while, being unwilling to do the work it will take to get us across the finish line.  All because of this minority group's feeling, who ironically want to cite themselves as minorities they couldn't give a crap about any other time.  Most realize it isn't reasoning, but just temper tantrum feelings carried over from the last election.

That's why I say "who give a 'f' if this crowd learns anything", if they get shamed.  Stupid weak @$$ excuses for NOT doing the responsible thing, when they didn't have an issue with it BEFORE the pandemic.  Such intentional bad behavior invites being shamed back into their homes where they can get each other sick safely away from others.

If you're part of the crowd who cried the loudest about things getting back to normal when this started, over masks & stay @ home orders.  You deserve biggest cup of 'STFU' filled with the vaccine.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436499794772611074/

43.  Think about that.  43 hospitals filled with many Covid patients, with odds that they are the unvaccinated.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> I think the biggest cause for such numbers, is the reasoning that some people are trying to use.  It's one thing if you are uncertain, yes the vaccine was made at record speed, but it was based on work done years before up until today.   What doesn't work is that SOME of those same people uncertain don't think something can be done so fast, but cheer leaded when their president of choice got the ball rolling with "Operation Warp Speed".  What the 'f' did those people think that title meant?  That the unvaccinated in the former president's world would be forced to wear 'red shirts'?  The other excuse of it not being approved, got shut down, and STILL some moved on to yet another excuse.  Which makes it clear what the problem is.  It's all about feelings & trying to 'stick it' to others because SOME want to imagine their side of the aisle can claim credit for getting the work done to get us this far.  All the while, being unwilling to do the work it will take to get us across the finish line.  All because of this minority group's feeling, who ironically want to cite themselves as minorities they couldn't give a crap about any other time.  Most realize it isn't reasoning, but just temper tantrum feelings carried over from the last election.
> 
> That's why I say "who give a 'f' if this crowd learns anything", if they get shamed.  Stupid weak @$$ excuses for NOT doing the responsible thing, when they didn't have an issue with it BEFORE the pandemic.  Such intentional bad behavior invites being shamed back into their homes where they can get each other sick safely away from others.
> 
> If you're part of the crowd who cried the loudest about things getting back to normal when this started, over masks & stay @ home orders.  You deserve biggest cup of 'STFU' filled with the vaccine.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436499794772611074/
> 
> 43.  Think about that.  43 hospitals filled with many Covid patients, with odds that they are the unvaccinated.



That is incredibly sad… what a nightmare. They are literally killing others through not getting the vaccine, and they still don’t care. These are not patriots. I guess we already knew that because real patriots tend NOT to label themselves as such.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> ...and finally what makes you want to just give up.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435650634703904770/



Uhhm. We should dial back on the propaganda and listen to the whole thing. 





He is elaborating and sorta makes sense superficially, but actually he is so full of shit. 

1. So he starts up with complaining about being misquoted, then follows it up with - by the same standard - misquoting Fauci
2. He argues that herd immunity isn't happening and Fauci was wrong about 50% vaccination stops surges. The thing is, and I mentioned it here before, the concept of herd immunity assumes a relatively random distribution of immunized people in the population. Since the vaccines are available to all, the distribution of unimmunized isn't random anymore. 
3. He's touting the push for early treatments and tries to sell it as a success story. Without diving into Florida's data I can tell on a global scale that we've not improved the hospitalization-to-fatality ratios, meaning that the treatments aren't way better than a year ago. Depending how you count it, but people with COVID-like symptoms are ≥8x less likely to need hospitalization. Vaccinated breakthrough cases can still get "early treatment" so the comparison is horseshit on another level. 
4. I would argue that masking works better on a scale than "early treatment", even if I use a risk reduction of 10%.
5. His claims of increasing discharges I don't even have to validate, because I know that Florida's unvaxxers are younger people so they are expected to have shorter hospitalizations. 

So. The conclusion is similarly bad to your Twitter post, just more complex. DeSantis is not dumb, which means he's a liar. Shocking.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1435800376515743749/



TIL that Donald Trump Jr does not know the meaning of caste.... Ivy league education isn't the same as it used to be, LOL.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Even facing death, there are some who still cling to their delusions.



> "Don't tell me I have COVID. I don't believe in COVID," patients have told McFarlane, who teared up as she recounted combative patients….





> "They stick to their guns," Luciani explained, and even on their death bed she's had to listen to people deny that they have the virus, while maintaining their fervent anti-vaccine sentiment. "In my mind, that life is essentially over as we know it. ... Some people just refuse. And it's kind of like a slap in the face."




I don’t blame medical caretakers for mentally writing off people like that. There is really nothing left there to save.









						Even on their death beds, some COVID-19 patients in Idaho still reject vaccination
					

Just a few months ago, there were only five COVID-19 patients, at Saint Alphonsus Regional Medical Center in Boise, Idaho.  Nearly all of these patients are not vaccinated, a reflection of "the amount of misinformation that's being absorbed, and taken as truth in our community because people are...




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Thomas Veil said:


> Even facing death, there are some who still cling to their delusions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don’t blame medical caretakers for mentally writing off people like that. There is really nothing left there to save.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Even on their death beds, some COVID-19 patients in Idaho still reject vaccination
> 
> 
> Just a few months ago, there were only five COVID-19 patients, at Saint Alphonsus Regional Medical Center in Boise, Idaho.  Nearly all of these patients are not vaccinated, a reflection of "the amount of misinformation that's being absorbed, and taken as truth in our community because people are...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com



even the threat of death cant always fix stupid.


----------



## JayMysteri0

This thread will help remind you why some have an issue with police that have a "rules for thee, but not for me" attitude.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436867562499887104/


----------



## ronntaylor

JayMysteri0 said:


> This thread will help remind you why some have an issue with police that have a "rules for thee, but not for me" attitude.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436867562499887104/



This is a dangerous gang member waiting to take out a citizen. Involved in two lawsuits that cost the city tens of thousands. And three of six complaints substantiated against him.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Uh... WTF?!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436890806736936961/

GET OUT of YOUR FEELINGS PEOPLE!!

It's like some people have decided that if they can't have the right to make you sick, they'd rather just attack you instead.


----------



## JayMysteri0

A brief detour into TFG territory, as we are reminded why so many are assholes during this trying time

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436731361335861258/


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Take about up trying to have it both ways.  I heard the man's spine snap trying to contort as he typed that.
> 
> He recognizes that the vaccine is the best option, but it should be up to people if they want it.
> 
> SOME people have already shown if there's a choice between their feelings, and what's best for their fellow countrymen & women feelings ALWAYS win now.  It's for those people we need mandates at all, since suddenly this ONE vaccine as opposed to the others they already took somehow infringes on their mythical rights.  As if maintaining a pandemic isn't an infringement on the rights of others.



What cracks me up is him saying people AND BUSINESS OWNERS. hahaha. So businesses should have more power than the feds?!


----------



## JayMysteri0

What the Bloody F?!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437136126582603782/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437136139283046403/

Florida will lead the way!!


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437168773287583754/


----------



## hulugu

JayMysteri0 said:


> A brief detour into TFG territory, as we are reminded why so many are assholes during this trying time
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436731361335861258/




It's pretty clear that the right wants the pandemic to continue because they hope to use COVID-19 as a way to attack Biden and Congressional Democrats next year. 

They'll argue that Biden promised to end the pandemic, and if there's a smattering of cases next year, that means he failed and thus, people should vote for  the GOP. 

It's fucking transparent. 



JayMysteri0 said:


> What the Bloody F?!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437136126582603782/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437136139283046403/
> 
> Florida will lead the way!!




The state's medical board should rescind his credentials.


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> It's pretty clear that the right wants the pandemic to continue because they hope to use COVID-19 as a way to attack Biden and Congressional Democrats next year.
> 
> They'll argue that Biden promised to end the pandemic, and if there's a smattering of cases next year, that means he failed and thus, people should vote for  the GOP.
> 
> It's fucking transparent.



It's not a bad strategy, except for the unvaxxer distribution and the resulting deaths may be significant enough to start affecting toss up races. There's probably a multiplier too: a dead antivaxxer is one less vote, but the shocked family members may also rethink their value system. So while coming elections will overlap with the COVID season, at one point this pandemic will tame into a flu-like illness once everyone is exposed one way (thru vaccination) or another (natural infection). This is inevitable, but dying in the process isn't, which is about 8x more likely for antivaxxers.



hulugu said:


> The state's medical board should rescind his credentials.



You mean the credentials that should not render him eligible to give out mask exemption paperwork. It's a statewide policy problem.


----------



## hulugu

P_X said:


> It's not a bad strategy, except for the unvaxxer distribution and the resulting deaths may be significant enough to start affecting toss up races. There's probably a multiplier too: a dead antivaxxer is one less vote, but the shocked family members may also rethink their value system. So while coming elections will overlap with the COVID season, at one point this pandemic will tame into a flu-like illness once everyone is exposed one way (thru vaccination) or another (natural infection). This is inevitable, but dying in the process isn't, which is about 8x more likely for antivaxxers.
> 
> 
> You mean the credentials that should not render him eligible to give out mask exemption paperwork. It's a statewide policy problem.




The attrition is a problem, but I suspect that the GOP doesn't care, and figures that most of those who die from COVID-19 weren't active voters. I do think that strategically, they're creating a bigger issue for themselves as vaccines are popular and so too are mask mandates. Meanwhile, GOP governors fighting against public health officials are losing ground. 

Right, the state board should remove his credentials because he's clearly not following his ethical guidelines. Giving people a medical exemption where medical records are "helpful, but not mandatory" is a clear sign.


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> The attrition is a problem, but I suspect that the GOP doesn't care, and figures that most of those who die from COVID-19 weren't active voters. I do think that strategically, they're creating a bigger issue for themselves as vaccines are popular and so too are mask mandates. Meanwhile, GOP governors fighting against public health officials are losing ground.



Agree. They are digging themselves into a hole that will be quite difficult to get out of unscathed. Plus as I detailed at the TFG thread, as much as I'm up to date with the data, even conservative measurements on the effect of universal masking seems to have a greater impact on reducing COVID deaths than "early treatments" DeSantis is bullshitting about. He's trying to cover ivermectin which is popular among conspiracy nuts, without having to say ivermectin. 



hulugu said:


> Right, the state board should remove his credentials because he's clearly not following his ethical guidelines. Giving people a medical exemption where medical records are "helpful, but not mandatory" is a clear sign.



Being a chiropractic "doctor" is the clear sign.


----------



## hulugu

P_X said:


> Agree. They are digging themselves into a hole that will be quite difficult to get out of unscathed. Plus as I detailed at the TFG thread, as much as I'm up to date with the data, even conservative measurements on the effect of universal masking seems to have a greater impact on reducing COVID deaths than "early treatments" DeSantis is bullshitting about. He's trying to cover ivermectin which is popular among conspiracy nuts, without having to say ivermectin.
> 
> 
> Being a chiropractic "doctor" is the clear sign.




Yep. I still think it's bizarre that antivaxers, who mumble something about how they're worried about taking the vaccine for COVID-19 are in the midst of taking some cocktail of Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquine, with additions of everything from a "urine protocol" to viper venom. 

One idiot that I know rather well—and did not know that she was an anti-vax idiot [her husband works with viruses to cure cancer, FFS]—is currently taking some "nutraceutical/herbal" mix, "Vira Con"—capsules of Elderberry and Zinc—an IV of vitamins, and nebulized hydrogen peroxide after she got COVID. 

How in the hell is this recipe of "who-the-fuck-knows" somehow better than just taking the vaccine six months ago? 

I hope she's okay, but sweet baby Jesus, she'll be insufferable if she comes out of this unscathed.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437083582552416257/

Something else for the faux "for my freedumb" _patriots_ to rail about


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> Yep. I still think it's bizarre that antivaxers, who mumble something about how they're worried about taking the vaccine for COVID-19 are in the midst of taking some cocktail of Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquine, with additions of everything from a "urine protocol" to viper venom.
> 
> One idiot that I know rather well—and did not know that she was an anti-vax idiot [her husband works with viruses to cure cancer, FFS]—is currently taking some "nutraceutical/herbal" mix, "Vira Con"—capsules of Elderberry and Zinc—an IV of vitamins, and nebulized hydrogen peroxide after she got COVID.
> 
> How in the hell is this recipe of "who-the-fuck-knows" somehow better than just taking the vaccine six months ago?
> 
> I hope she's okay, but sweet baby Jesus, she'll be insufferable if she comes out of this unscathed.



I've seen this on reddit. Someone (engineer) dives into data they don't understand quoting some pseudonymous internet blog that rails on the inaccuracies of public health officials' statements, so they review the "truth" by analyzing papers they spend 20 pages analyzing just to make a mistake that invalidates the whole argument. The cognitive biases are incredible but also stereotypical:
1. Vaccine has poorly known side-effects - for COVID only deaths count, morbidity (i.e. side-effects of the disease) doesn't
2. Vaccine is dangerous - prolonged prophylaxis with ivermectin/HCQ on the same scale is safe
3. Vaccination is a choice that only impacts self - people favoring adherence to public health measures are selfish

Same shit, every single fucking time.  

Zinc has some evidence for shortening the duration of colds. The rest is bullshit. I'll add that zinc overdosing can cause B12 deficiency-like toxic myelopathies (bad shit).


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## JayMysteri0

Since we don't have the other place, I don't have access to the other point ( Technically there is the thread about working from home, but... ) I harped on a lot about the pandemic.  

That we learned a lot the things we took for granted as true, were actually just bullshit that heavily benefitted employers.


----------



## fooferdoggie

of course he ignored it. How do you do that in this day and age?
[Dumbass] Kentucky man who paid COVID "no attention" wants you to know that he's smarter now, seeing as how he contracted it and all, and thinks you should be listening to his advice now








						A Kentucky man says he paid Covid-19 no attention. Now he has it and he wants you to know it's no joke | CNN
					

Billy Couch didn't think much about Covid-19 until he got it and it sent him to the hospital.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

After Delta Airlines announced a $200/mo surcharge for unvaccinated employees, 4,000 of them got vaccinated and zero quit
huge-number-of-unvaccinated-delta-workers-got-vaccine-after-200-surcharge-announcement-official-says


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> Zinc has some evidence for shortening the duration of colds. The rest is bullshit. I'll add that zinc overdosing can cause B12 deficiency-like toxic myelopathies (bad shit).



It's ironic that intranasal zinc given as a spray or gel has been associated with long-lasting or permanent anosmia (loss of sense of smell), which is a symptom of COVID-19.


----------



## Roller

hulugu said:


> Right, the state board should remove his credentials because he's clearly not following his ethical guidelines. Giving people a medical exemption where medical records are "helpful, but not mandatory" is a clear sign.



As a chiropractor he no doubt has a great deal of experience manipulating people, so he's in familiar territory.


----------



## DT

Posted this on another site in response to some (a very few unfortunately) who are trying to promote science over people making claims about, well, everything you'd expect from a Covidiot ...




> Here's what I find equal parts baffling and hysterical: when did all these people suddenly get so engaged with the specifics of vaccinations, pharmaceuticals, infectious disease protocols - at what point did they decide they had any subject matter expertise in these areas?
> 
> (I mean, we all know when and why ...)
> 
> Seriously, you'd think some of these people would keel over with chest pains, wind up in the ER, and before the cardio doctor performs any tests or procedures, they'd chime in with:
> 
> "_Oh, wait Doc, I need to check Facebook to verify what you're doing. What's my profession? I work in the plumbing department at Lowes ... but I do the research ..._"
> 
> I looked at the last few pages and there are some people posting who clearly have zero understanding of basic statistics, no rudimentary comprehension of epidemiology - who are taking hard stances, while being unbelievably uninformed.





It's a car site, for a make/model I no longer own, just hanging around since it's like 80% halfwits, I should cross post some of the really special contributions 

FWIW, this one guy was so incoherent, I ran a long rant of his through a Grammarly plugin, his Flesch-Kincaid score came back as a 3.6 (it's on a scale to 100 ...)


----------



## DT

Oh FFS, this is a thing now?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437477930368524288/


----------



## DT

I feel like I'm missing a business opportunity ...

*Covidaway™ Deluxe Family Kit*
$49.99

Kit includes rectal delivery tube, a four person supply of Covidaway™ solution*, and tube of our special lubricant**


* Covidaway™ contains kerosene, rat poison, Sweet Baby Rays BBQ sauce and Rain-X
** Lubricant contains no lubricant


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> It's ironic that intranasal zinc given as a spray or gel has been associated with long-lasting or permanent anosmia (loss of sense of smell), which is a symptom of COVID-19.



Spraying a metallic solution into one’s nose is OK, but the vaccine is dangerous, LOL. What usually comes up on neuro boards is someone drinking *denture* *paste* by the gallon coming in with subacute sensory ataxia, with lower limb hyperreflexia and mild spasticity on exam. Because apparently denture paste is full of zink.




DT said:


> Posted this on another site in response to some (a very few unfortunately) who are trying to promote science over people making claims about, well, everything you'd expect from a Covidiot ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a car site, for a make/model I no longer own, just hanging around since it's like 80% halfwits, I should cross post some of the really special contributions
> 
> FWIW, this one guy was so incoherent, I ran a long rant of his through a Grammarly plugin, his Flesch-Kincaid score came back as a 3.6 (it's on a scale to 100 ...)



This is what i told my wife yesterday, that one of the more shocking things I’ve learned about humanity is that the average person only has a concept of probability estimation on an intuitive level. You provide concrete examples they are fine, but the moment you start throwing percentages around there emerges a huge risk that they’ll misinterpret risks. Since COVID this has been happening on a huge scale.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

‘You’re not getting this damn vaccine’: Alabama teen’s struggle for COVID shot mirrors struggles nationwide
					

The day after the argument with his parents, Andrew’s father took him to the pharmacy and signed, without saying a word.




					www.al.com
				




I was a rocker and then a goth in high school.  My parents took no issue with that (as teachers they knew not to judge the more "artsey" kids).  This kid is coming near to blows with his parents over wanting to get vaccinated.  I guess times have changed.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


>



Stealing this!



fooferdoggie said:


> After Delta Airlines announced a $200/mo surcharge for unvaccinated employees, 4,000 of them got vaccinated and zero quit
> huge-number-of-unvaccinated-delta-workers-got-vaccine-after-200-surcharge-announcement-official-says



So these anti-vax idiots are selling out for $200? Yeah maybe they really don’t believe their own bullshit.


----------



## Renzatic

Runs For Fun said:


> So these anti-vax idiots are selling out for $200? Yeah maybe they really don’t believe their own bullshit.




It's not about the vaccines, it's about pitching a fit for FREEDOM!


----------



## DT

Renzatic said:


> It's not about the vaccines, it's about pitching a fit for FREEDOM!




I guess freedom is worth about $200 a month ...


----------



## Renzatic

DT said:


> I guess freedom is worth about $200 a month ...




Hell yeah. You know how many pizzas someone could buy with that much money?


----------



## tobefirst

DT said:


> I guess freedom is worth about $200 a month ...



Freedom isn’t free
There’s a heavy F-in fee
If you don’t pay your buck-o-five
Who will?

(Or something like that.)


----------



## DT




----------



## SuperMatt

DT said:


> View attachment 8653



Looks like the person’s response to that was to delete their original tweet. It doesn’t seem to have stopped them from spamming other anti-vax tweets though.

So this person was embarrassed to be ignorant, but not embarrassed enough to stop posting things they clearly must know are lies now. A semi-functional adult?


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Looks like the person’s response to that was to delete their original tweet. It doesn’t seem to have stopped them from spamming other anti-vax tweets though.
> 
> So this person was embarrassed to be ignorant, but not embarrassed enough to stop posting things they clearly must know are lies now. A semi-functional adult?



We know certain people who do this...



DT said:


> View attachment 8653



I think this is an old one. Antimaskers gave up on the hypercapnia (high CO2), hypoxia bullshit last year.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Can’t get much more stupid than this








						Israeli anti-vaxx leader dies of COVID-19
					

An Israeli anti-vaxxer died due to the coronavirus on Monday, claiming police poisoned him.




					www.jpost.com


----------



## Yoused

we can only hope




(I mean, I cannot confirm this tweet, and it is in really bad taste, but it made me laugh.)


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437626248277024772/

Possible reason for this result?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437614521795895296/

Just kidding, some of us are just 'in our feelings' idiots.


----------



## JayMysteri0

As the anti mask / vaccine people continue to pass away, I wonder when are we going to start calling Covid = Karma for some

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437537633157074950/

I was wondering why "Another one bites the dust" was trending on Twitter, but not for entertainment.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Finally, I find myself slowly joining the ranks sadly of "just let them kill themselves"

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437463857874841608/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437465235703705601/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437468380148244483/

At what point are we going to find ourselves throwing our hands up because some people would rather swallow bullshit instead of the cure for their freedoms?  Not take medicine that their highest leaders took long ago secretly.  We're going to have to accept that we & gov't will be blamed for NOT helping a group of people who didn't want help because of their "freedom" & some kind of ideological spite.


----------



## JayMysteri0

And to wrap up all the fucking stupidity I can already take in one day...












Wha?  Wha? What is going on?!!

_Yes, that was unfortunately real._

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437652234402091015/


----------



## JayMysteri0

A recap


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> As the anti mask / vaccine people continue to pass away, I wonder when are we going to start calling Covid = Karma for some
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437537633157074950/
> 
> I was wondering why "Another one bites the dust" was trending on Twitter, but not for entertainment.



you beat me to it I was just going to post about this scum bag.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> you beat me to it I was just going to post about this scum bag.


----------



## Alli

My husband is the blue sheep of the family. He has one niece who is also a free thinker. The rest of the family, unfortunately, are why Alabamians maintain the reputation they have. So my brother-in-law has been dating his 2nd ex-wife again for about the last 10 years. She is as right-wing redneck as they come. I couldn’t even maintain a relationship with her on Facebook. They made a pact that neither of them would take the vaccine cause it just wasn’t worth it. (?!) She is now suffering from Covid. From what I understand it’s a bad case and she’s been sent home from the hospital after getting oxygen. Nobody mentioned Regeneron. I’m assuming she did not get it. And all I can think is “thoughts and prayers.” But mostly I wonder if she dies, will my idiot brother-in-law get the vaccine?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Standup comedian Patton Ozwalt on the haters giving him shit cancelling shows at venues where they won’t make people show proof they were vaccinated.  

“And by the way, if that is your philosophy, don’t die for me, go die seeing Lizzo. That’s a good last concert to see,” he cracked. “You shouldn’t die for any entertainer. But if you are, make it count. Don’t be in the hospital, (saying) ‘I’m so glad I got to see that fat nerd whine about ‘The Mandalorian.’”


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437538520923443203/


She is absolutely killing it, in her responses to people who think they have something for her.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Standup comedian Patton Ozwalt on the haters giving him shit cancelling shows at venues where they won’t make people show proof they were vaccinated.
> 
> “And by the way, if that is your philosophy, don’t die for me, go die seeing Lizzo. That’s a good last concert to see,” he cracked. “You shouldn’t die for any entertainer. But if you are, make it count. Don’t be in the hospital, (saying) ‘I’m so glad I got to see that fat nerd whine about ‘The Mandalorian.’”



On the flip side of that...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437552287396896768/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> On the flip side of that...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437552287396896768/




Jim Breuer is the thinking man's Rob Schneider.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Remember when things used to "Jump the Shark"?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437933644140752900/

When is this stupidity going to "jump"?


----------



## Edd

JayMysteri0 said:


> Remember when things used to "Jump the Shark"?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437933644140752900/
> 
> When is this stupidity going to "jump"?



I don’t think there’s a bottom. It’s all a reality show now.


----------



## Yoused

Edd said:


> It’s all a reality show now.





Spoiler: And we are all rooting for



Charles Robert Darwin, FRS FRGS FLS FZS


----------



## JayMysteri0

In case you weren't aware or didn't get my Tucker Carlson / Nicki Minaj post, here's the recap that had Twitter clowning all day











https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437994778344312834/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437827548247887876/

Quite a few on Black Twitter were more mad that Minaj basically offered herself up to the likes of Carlson & MTGreene to help further their anti vax ways.  People that normally would give her the time of day if she was lying on the street bleeding, and instead step over her and say "Chicago".


----------



## fooferdoggie

Intoxicated, COVID-positive patient accused of biting medic​








						Intoxicated, COVID-positive patient accused of biting medic
					

An intoxicated woman who also tested positive for COVID-19 is being accused of biting a medic while in her treatment room on September 4, according to the probable cause affidavit.




					www.abc57.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

I have a friend named josh and is a antivaxxer so I had to send this to him. in the end all those antivaxx memes did not save him​
Josh Wasn't Afraid Of COVID​Josh Britt, 36, of Greenville, TN filled his Facebook page with anti-vax, anti-mask memes for months. On 9/11, Josh died from COVID.









						Josh Wasn't Afraid Of COVID
					

Josh Britt, 36, of Greenville, TN filled his Facebook page with anti-vax, anti-mask memes for months. On 9/11, Josh died from COVID.




					crooksandliars.com


----------



## lizkat

Nothing seems to deter the clueless still digging a bottomless pit in search of the next great alternative to common sense. 

Too bad we can't unplug them from the internet for a week or so of detox.    But then we'd have billions of people experiencing withdrawal symptoms, and all loose on the streets instead of just whaling on their keyboards at home.


----------



## Alli

lizkat said:


> Nothing seems to deter the clueless still digging a bottomless pit in search of the next great alternative to common sense.
> 
> Too bad we can't unplug them from the internet for a week or so of detox.    But then we'd have billions of people experiencing withdrawal symptoms, and all loose on the streets instead of just whaling on their keyboards at home.



I’m willing to start a GoFundMe for all these halfwits so that they can take an intro to research class.


----------



## lizkat

The AP has a summary of state legislation that has impeded health officials' powers, and it goes past just overrides of mask mandates or vaccination requirements....  down to more dangerous levels of impeding quarantine or isolation rules -- and not necessarily limited to this covid pandemic.    No wonder the Biden administration is considering something past federal guidelines.









						Most states have cut back public health powers amid pandemic
					

Republican legislators in more than half of U.S. states, spurred on by voters angry about lockdowns and mask mandates, are taking away the powers that state and local officials use to protect the public against infectious diseases.




					apnews.com
				




Where were these don't-tread-on-me guys when suddenly you couldn't even take embroidery scissors on an airplane.  Oh well ten they were all in on restraining potential terrorists.   Today's terrorist is some moron with asymptomatic covid deciding to pop into a diner on his coffee break and doing it defiantly maskless because some right wing talk show hands out attaboys for that stuff.


----------



## Thomas Veil

lizkat said:


> The AP has a summary of state legislation that has impeded health officials' powers, and it goes past just overrides of mask mandates or vaccination requirements....  down to more dangerous levels of impeding quarantine or isolation rules -- and not necessarily limited to this covid pandemic.    No wonder the Biden administration is considering something past federal guidelines.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Most states have cut back public health powers amid pandemic
> 
> 
> Republican legislators in more than half of U.S. states, spurred on by voters angry about lockdowns and mask mandates, are taking away the powers that state and local officials use to protect the public against infectious diseases.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Where were these don't-tread-on-me guys when suddenly you couldn't even take embroidery scissors on an airplane.  Oh well ten they were all in on restraining potential terrorists.   Today's terrorist is some moron with asymptomatic covid deciding to pop into a diner on his coffee break and doing it defiantly maskless because some right wing talk show hands out attaboys for that stuff.



Yeah, that's true here in Ohio too. Remember when Grover Norquist said he wanted to shrink government until it was small enough to drown in a bathtub? They've done it with regulators. They've done it with the IRS. Here it is again. Scary stuff.

Meanwhile, I know you've all been waiting for this week's Anti-Vax Right Wing Radio Host Who Died of Covid. Here he is.









						Conservative radio host who swore off Covid-19 vaccine dies after contracting virus, co-host says
					

Conservative radio host Pastor Robert "Bob" Enyart, who swore off Covid-19 vaccines, has died from complications due to the virus, his co-host announced on social media Monday.




					www.cnn.com
				






> "Bob Enyart was one of the smartest, and without question the wisest person I've known," said Williams.



Yeah, well, about that...


----------



## Renzatic

Thomas Veil said:


> Meanwhile, I know you've all been waiting for this week's Anti-Vax Right Wing Radio Host Who Died of Covid. Here he is.


----------



## Pumbaa

Alli said:


> I’m willing to start a GoFundMe for all these halfwits so that they can take an intro to research class.



Reminds me of high school, there was an elective, Astronomy, and a bunch of students thoroughly disappointed when they were informed that learning to write horoscopes wasn’t part of the curriculum.

Your halfwits are going to get equally disappointed when the class isn't about how to find Karen on Facebook and stuff.


----------



## Thomas Veil

That's the thing. They even have their own idea now of what constitutes science. It's crazy.

We've come so far from KellyAnne Conway and her "alternate facts". By which I mean, it just keeps getting worse.


----------



## Yoused

Thomas Veil said:


> Meanwhile, I know you've all been waiting for this week's Anti-Vax Right Wing Radio Host Who Died of Covid. Here he is.
> 
> https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/14/media/bob-enyart-death-covid/index.html



Was this the * who read the names of people who died of AIDS while Queen's _Another One Bites the Dust_ played in the background?


----------



## MEJHarrison

Thomas Veil said:


> "Bob Enyart was one of the smartest, and without question the wisest person I've known," said Williams.
> 
> Yeah, well, about that...




That same line stood out to me last night.  If that's the smartest and wisest person you know, that's pretty damn scary.  It's like saying Hitler was one of the kindest people you know.  That might be absolutely true, but holy shit, who are your other friends???

My second favorite part is that his show seems to have been called Real Science Radio.


----------



## JayMysteri0

...And a followup, because this "swollen testicles" story still makes me giggle...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438183898358366208/

This is where we are people, officials having to debunk a celebrity's anecdote about a "friend of her cousin".

To think people didn't get why I hated when people use anecdotes in discussions in forums over actual documented instances.

Also... "swollen testicles", he's impotent, and his woman left him before they were supposed to get married.





VAAAAACCCCIIIINNNNNNEEESS!!!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438194219269689352/
"Flat tire".


----------



## Eric

My wife went to a Sherman Williams paint store today and an older guy without a mask kept scowling at her, to the point it was enough to make her leave. We don't know if it was because she was wearing a mask or because she was Asian but these rural areas can be scary right now.


----------



## Runs For Fun

This seems so hypocritical 








						As Child COVID Toll Mounts, Governor Says Legislature Has Tied His Hands
					

Gov. Mike DeWine on Tuesday blamed Republican lawmakers for his inability to take stronger action against a surge in coronavirus cases — ...




					patch.com
				




When he previously said this


Runs For Fun said:


> The idiocy of this statement is infuriating
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1436365999960432644/
> 
> You are definitely not getting my vote in November.




WTF


----------



## Eric

Perfect description.


If you haven't already, get vaccinated. Only way to put this pandemic behind us from
      PoliticalHumor


----------



## JayMysteri0

A followup from earlier about a comedian

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438320773924626438/

and...



> Nearly all Fox staffers vaccinated for Covid even as hosts cast doubt on vaccine
> 
> 
> More than 90% of Fox Corporation staff inoculated, according to memo announcing daily testing for unvaccinated employees
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com





> The vast majority of employees at Fox Corporation, the umbrella company for the conservative Fox News channel, are vaccinated against coronavirus and those who are not will be required to do daily testing, according to a memo sent out from bosses – despite some of its biggest screen stars questioning the vaccine.
> 
> A daily test is stricter than the Biden administration’s firm mandate that businesses with more than 100 employees must require either vaccination or weekly testing.
> 
> The news came as Joe Biden was scheduled to meet with business leaders on Wednesday, including from Disney and Microsoft, to urge vaccine mandates for employees across US businesses.
> 
> Such mandates, which have earned the president both praise and flak since he announced them last week, are expected to cover 80 million workers at large firms along with 17 million healthcare professionals across the country.
> 
> In the memo, which was sent out on Tuesday to Fox Corporation employees, Kevin Lord, the company’s executive vice-president, announced that more than 90% of the company’s full-time employees had been vaccinated, CNN first reported on Tuesday night.
> 
> The information was uploaded on a secure system where employees could share their vaccination status, the memo said.
> 
> “Employees who are not vaccinated or have not provided their vaccination status and wish to access one of our facilities will not incur the cost of testing,” a Fox Corporation representative told the Guardian on Wednesday.


----------



## ronntaylor

Eric said:


> My wife went to a Sherman Williams paint store today and an older guy without a mask kept scowled at her, to the point it was enough to make her leave. We don't know if it was because she was wearing a mask or because she was Asian but these rural areas can be scary right now.



When we went back to Virginia after 15 months, same thing. Lots of sneers, frowns and a couple sarcastic assholes at the one joint I *was* okay with eating in the past due to our masks. Most not masked, including in places that ask for customers to wear one. And we hit the Trifecta:  Black X Asian Queer couple


----------



## fooferdoggie

ivermectin the new republican god.

Tennessee has the highest COVID rate in the US right now, and this preacher is doing all he can to lower it...... by breaking patients out of hospitals to heal them with prayer and Ivermectin


https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438131143354855424/


----------



## fooferdoggie

Young bride-to-be would like to tell you that the covid vaccine does not cause infertility. That is, she'd probably like to tell you that, but








						Kentucky bride-to-be who hesitated to get vaccinated dies of Covid
					

Exclusive: Samantha Wendell was worried the vaccine would affect her fertility. Instead of attending her wedding, her family is now planning her funeral.




					www.aol.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> Perfect description.
> 
> 
> If you haven't already, get vaccinated. Only way to put this pandemic behind us from
> PoliticalHumor




Some cartoonist needs to do one of the long queue line outside heaven’s gates standing behind the sign that reads “Sticking it to liberals/because Biden”.


----------



## Eric

Gotta love it when celebes weigh in with their own research...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1437532566945341441/

Then there's this...


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

A friend tested positive last week for covid.  We don't really get into political conversations but she's for sure right-leaning.  I could give you examples of why I know that but I'll let you connect the dots on this one.  Her parents have many slave themed chotskies in their house and a nice painting of slaves plowing wheat fields in their dining room.  Other than that, nice salt of the earth people.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Oh no



			https://twitter.com/i/events/1437912969220800512?s=20


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Runs For Fun said:


> Oh no
> 
> 
> 
> https://twitter.com/i/events/1437912969220800512?s=20




There's plenty of evidence for people on the right.  "Somebody said it" is all the evidence they require.


----------



## shadow puppet

Stark raving nuts.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438296278245560321/


----------



## hulugu

shadow puppet said:


> Stark raving nuts.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438296278245560321/




Tucker is the same guy who bloviated on about the song "WAP" with a segment "What is This Doing to Our Kids?" 

Yeah, I believe that this man cares about free speech.


----------



## Eric

shadow puppet said:


> Stark raving nuts.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438296278245560321/



Censored? That tweet is still up. Fox loves to make shit up that doesn't exist.


----------



## Joe

I haven't talked to my sister in 5 years (long story), but I still communicate and visit my nieces and nephews (her kids). We all live in the Houston area now so it's easy to visit each other.  Anyway, she is anti vaccine. And she told my nieces and nephews if they got vaccinated that they weren't allowed to visit her at her house. How fucking stupid and crazy is that? They recently just all went and got it regardless. I think they waited so long partially because of her bullying. She's a horrible person and one of the many reason I cut ties with her 5 years go.


----------



## Eric

I stand with Nicki is trending so I threw in my support...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438605480679510020/


----------



## Thomas Veil

Runs For Fun said:


> Oh no
> 
> 
> 
> https://twitter.com/i/events/1437912969220800512?s=20



Next week it’ll be Liquid Plumbr.

The week after that, Raid.

How come these nuts never try to cure anything with Hostess Ho-Hos?


----------



## MEJHarrison

Thomas Veil said:


> How come these nuts never try to cure anything with Hostess Ho-Hos?




I'm sure their diet probably already contains a healthy dose of Ho-Ho's.  So they've probably already ruled that out.

What gets me is all the crazy home remedies they're willing to try.  But suggesting that they try something that keeps them from getting it in the first place?  Oh hell no!


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

MEJHarrison said:


> I'm sure their diet probably already contains a healthy dose of Ho-Ho's.  So they've probably already ruled that out.
> 
> What gets me is all the crazy home remedies they're willing to try.  But suggesting that they try something that keeps them from getting it in the first place?  Oh hell no!




I can sympathize with not wanting to be called deplorable or an idiot, but the desperate lengths they are willing to go in an attempt to disprove that is truly breathtaking. They are literally willing to die in the off chance that their white trash voodoo concoction protects them. If God was an isolationist Republican he’d be firing up his base by telling them we aren’t sending our best people to heaven and setting up refugee camps outside the gates.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438576693229326337/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438576693229326337/



Only 3,000 out of 2.7 million? I wish we had such low numbers in America.









						Many healthcare workers still haven’t gotten COVID-19 vaccines. Here’s why.
					

A U.S. study finds 27 percent of healthcare workers were unvaccinated as of early summer, posing a risk to sick and elderly patients.




					news.northeastern.edu


----------



## JayMysteri0

One conspiracy theory of sorts to share with the more hardcore 'r' anti vaxxers...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438556596955750413/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438557151564345355/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438560606534225920/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438563006963650561/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438563786852610052/

Perhaps if it's spun this way to some of them, maybe...


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> One conspiracy theory of sorts to share with the more hardcore 'r' anti vaxxers...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438556596955750413/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438557151564345355/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438560606534225920/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438563006963650561/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438563786852610052/
> 
> Perhaps if it's spun this way to some of them, maybe...



What's interesting is that being Black after correction for socioeconomic and other risk factor stuff was shown to be associated with lower COVID mortality....but only after the adjustment, of course.


----------



## JayMysteri0

D@MN!
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438548301654151169/


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> D@MN!
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438548301654151169/



Now we know what it feels like to be a Republican responding to a poor child in need of a school lunch.


----------



## Yoused

Runs For Fun said:


> Oh no
> 
> 
> 
> https://twitter.com/i/events/1437912969220800512?s=20




um

What was that? Because, now it is a whole pageful of warnings about "_Don't Do Betadine!_"


----------



## JayMysteri0

Eric said:


> Now we no what it feels like to be a Republican responding to a poor child in need of a school lunch.



Welll...

Bit of a stretch to compare an Anti Vaxxer to a poor child, since the Anti Vaxxer made a choice to put themselves in that position.

I get the lack of sympathy part, but some 'r's have made cruelty a part of their way of doing things.  The lack of sympathy for Anti Vaxxers is of their own doing, due to belligerence, denial, and thriving on spite.  None of those things a poor child in need of a school lunch has seemingly done.  At some point karmically those who've shown the least amount of sympathy, may find it turned upon themselves.


https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438549213852278791/


----------



## SuperMatt

Seriously, DeSantis?









						DeSantis opens new war with Biden over Covid treatments
					

The governor says Biden is taking away much-needed treatments. The White House wants to make distribution 'equitable.'




					www.politico.com
				






> “We've been handed a major curveball here, with a really huge cut from HHS and the Biden administration,” DeSantis said at a press conference in Broward County. “We're going to make sure we leave no stone unturned. Whoever needs a treatment, we're going to work like hell to get them the treatment.”
> 
> He added that Florida is being punished for peddling the Covid-19 antibody treatment before the White House while the highly transmissible Delta variant began spreading in Southern states like Florida, Texas or Louisiana.
> 
> *“I think we could have averted, in this country, a lot of people going to the hospital,” DeSantis said. “I think it would have saved a lot of lives.”*




Say what? Your state and 6 other southern states with abysmal records on vaccination were combining to take up 70% of the nation’s supply of monoclonal antibodies. Now that Biden is trying to redistribute some of that medicine to other states, you suddenly give a  about your constituents’ well-being? Yeah, if only somebody could have thought of a way to save a lot of lives…..


----------



## Runs For Fun

Yoused said:


> um
> 
> What was that? Because, now it is a whole pageful of warnings about "_Don't Do Betadine!_"



That exactly what it was. I'm guessing some right wing nutjob was shilling it just like Ivermectin.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> What's interesting is that being Black after correction for socioeconomic and other risk factor stuff was shown to be associated with lower COVID mortality....but only after the adjustment, of course.




I may be in a bubble living in the Bay Area, but I really don’t understand the issue with the poor not getting vaccinated.  They are being given for free at places like Walgreens which are quite common even in poor or lower population areas.  Even if you subtract people who live on a farm in bumfuck that still leaves a lot of people with access that aren’t getting vaccinated.


----------



## Pumbaa

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I may be in a bubble living in the Bay Area, but I really don’t understand the issue with the poor not getting vaccinated.  They are being given for free at places like Walgreens which are quite common even in poor or lower population areas.  Even if you subtract people who live on a farm in bumfuck that still leaves a lot of people with access that aren’t getting vaccinated.



Someone somewhere mentioned they couldn’t afford to risk having to take an unpaid day off work due to reactions to the shot, if they were to get those flu-like symptoms for a day after. Didn‘t dig deeper.


----------



## User.45

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I may be in a bubble living in the Bay Area, but I really don’t understand the issue with the poor not getting vaccinated.  They are being given for free at places like Walgreens which are quite common even in poor or lower population areas.  Even if you subtract people who live on a farm in bumfuck that still leaves a lot of people with access that aren’t getting vaccinated.



Lack of Walgreens and a car. I don't think it's an excuse but it is definitely a major factor.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> Lack of Walgreens and a car. I don't think it's an excuse but it is definitely a major factor.




Do they also farm all their own food?  I can’t imagine this being more difficult than going to the grocery store.  

I understand there are people who are home bound because of health or age reasons, but I don’t think that explains the large number of unvaccinated people.  Are their any statistics that show the difference between dead mining town poor and city poor neighborhood poor?


----------



## User.45

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Do they also farm all their own food?  I can’t imagine this being more difficult than going to the grocery store.



Ummm, have you heard the term food desert before? Welcome to the _real_ America. 




__





						What Is a Food Desert? Causes, Statistics, & Resources | Ohio University
					

What is a food desert? Learn how food deserts prevent individuals from accessing nutritious food options in their communities and what you can do to help.



					onlinemasters.ohio.edu


----------



## JayMysteri0

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Do they also farm all their own food?  I can’t imagine this being more difficult than going to the grocery store.
> 
> I understand there are people who are home bound because of health or age reasons, but I don’t think that explains the large number of unvaccinated people.  Are their any statistics that show the difference between dead mining town poor and city poor neighborhood poor?



I know in the earlier days, getting a vaccine at Walgreens was like trying to get a PS5, Xbox, or a new box of Pokemon cards.  Things seemed to be setup so that the urban Walgreens were flooded with who ( teachers, workers, etc ) the city or state wanted vaccinated, so it became a well known tactic to look for Walgreens in suburban more well off areas to make an appointment.  So urban Walgreens seemed to get more traffic than other areas.  I learned that if you went on their app or site on Sunday when they didn't want you to, you could find openings for the next 2 weeks, and make your appt then.   The poor pharmacist at my local Walgreens is so overwhelmed and they doubled the staff.  Just trying to get prescriptions you got before the pandemic has become a zoo that adds 20 minutes because of all the increased traffic they face.  The literally split their counter space to Vaccines / Pick ups, because of their increased volume.

Which I of course found interesting that supposedly the original supposed most vaccine hesitant community had the greater obstacles to getting a vaccine over the areas that were supposed to be the least vaccine hesistant.

In the end though, I highly recommend if one can & has a vehicle using the local hospital system.  To get my mother's vaccines was as simple as asking for one, driving up, leaving 15 minutes later.  Of course that means having a car, and internet access.  What I really commend is that the city has started mobile vaccine clinics that are in small mall parking lots that anyone can walk up to.  Problem?  To know where that mobile vaccine clinic will be, you need to check online, or go thru some hoops on the phone.


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> Ummm, have you heard the term food desert before? Welcome to the _real_ America.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What Is a Food Desert? Causes, Statistics, & Resources | Ohio University
> 
> 
> What is a food desert? Learn how food deserts prevent individuals from accessing nutritious food options in their communities and what you can do to help.
> 
> 
> 
> onlinemasters.ohio.edu



Ah yes, back to the discussions of the "success" of Dollar stores, over grocery stores & the nutritional impact in lower income areas.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Oh yeah, why I originally stopped by...


https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438673812241846274/


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Seriously, DeSantis?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DeSantis opens new war with Biden over Covid treatments
> 
> 
> The governor says Biden is taking away much-needed treatments. The White House wants to make distribution 'equitable.'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.politico.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Say what? Your state and 6 other southern states with abysmal records on vaccination were combining to take up 70% of the nation’s supply of monoclonal antibodies. Now that Biden is trying to redistribute some of that medicine to other states, you suddenly give a  about your constituents’ well-being? Yeah, if only somebody could have thought of a way to save a lot of lives…..



I just looked at the FDA data on regeneron. Regeneron's better than I expected, with a ~70% risk reduction for hospitalization and death for those at high risk. So it cuts your risk to its third. Costs, $1300 a pop (Reuters reads $2100 but I'll be conservative here). Vaccine is how much? $35?

So let's make some projections for 100M. W/o vaccine you get roughly 200,000 hospitalizations (roughly real life data). Per medicaid, the average COVID hospitalization costs $20K (suspiciosly low but that's what other analyses used). So that's $4B in hospitalization costs. 

Let's assume that every 33rd person gets hospitalized (see placebo data in the regeneron study). So let's say you'll treat every high-risk exposure (let's assume that all hospitalizations are high risk).

So in a regeneron scenario, you treat roughly 6.6M people and prevent about 140,000 hospitalizations. A dose is somewhere between $1.3 and $2.3K. If I use the lower number, that is $8.5B in regeneron treatments on this scale to save 3.2B. So you'll have a net cost of $5.3B and you'll have 60,000 hospitalizations/deaths. 

Now let's count that for the vaccine:
You fully vaccinate 100M people for $7B with Moderna ($35 per shot) or $4B with Pfizer ($20 per shot), you'll prevent 180,000 hospitalizations, saving $3.6B on hospital costs. Your net cost is $1.9B (for mix of the vaccines, range if pfizer or moderna is used only $0.4-3.4B), and you'll have 20,000 hospitalizations/deaths.

So even if I use prices that are best-case scenario for Regeneron, the shot itself yields 3x better outcomes for 2x cheaper. 

#fiscalresponsibility









			https://www.fda.gov/media/145611/download


----------



## User.45

If I add masks and use the very conservative 12% risk reduction number then it's 24,000 hospitalizations spared in the same thought experiment. So it all boils down to how much money people spend annually on masks. If I say people spend $5/yr on masks, it's $0.5B investment saving roughly $0.5B. So it is costs net $0. If people spend $30 on masks then it's a net $2.5B cost. 


So if I compare the cost-efficiency of these three interventions to prevent a single hospitalization, we'd get roughly:
1. Regeneron ~$22,900
2. Vaccine  ~$11,110
3. Masks ??? ($0 if we count with a $5 spending but $100,000 if you count with $30)


----------



## JayMysteri0

Let's just face it, some people for completely partisan reasons not qualifications, elected their own doom for their entire state.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438673862468804608/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438666865992163329/



> Fact Check: Has there ever been a mandated "AIDS vaccine"?
> 
> 
> Georgia Governor Brian Kemp referred to an "AIDS vaccine" while on a podcast, and questioned new rules around COVID-19 vaccinations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.newsweek.com





> "I mean that's basically how the AIDS vaccine worked, you know people wouldn't take it early on 'cause it was mandated, they started educating people and now it's doing a lot of good out there."
> 
> A WFXG article from earlier this year also quoted the Republican governor mentioning an "AIDS vaccine."
> 
> He was discussing mask mandates, and according to the report said: "Well we are not going to have a statewide mask mandate. Dr. Tumi and I believe that they do not work. They did not work with the AIDs vaccine and they're not going to work with the corona vaccine."
> 
> A spokesperson for Kemp has since clarified to _Newsweek _that the governor intended to refer to the HPV vaccine.




Pretend to act surprised that "the governor intended to refer to", and what mandate he was referring to also.  Bullshit.  He's an idiot.


----------



## Pumbaa

JayMysteri0 said:


> Pretend to act surprised that "the governor intended to refer to", and what mandate he was referring to also. Bullshit. *He's an idiot.*



Best case, yeah. Realistically worse, probably knew exactly what he was saying, intentionally getting the message out there before much later much less publicly “correcting” it.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Pumbaa said:


> Someone somewhere mentioned they couldn’t afford to risk having to take an unpaid day off work due to reactions to the shot, if they were to get those flu-like symptoms for a day after. Didn‘t dig deeper.




I think that’s trying to conflate 2 separate issues. Until recently there was an eviction moratorium and financial assistance for those experiencing financial hardship for covid related reasons. I haven’t heard of anybody losing their job or home because they went and got vaccinated. _Sometimes_ repression of the poor is the voter fraud of the left. If the numbers aren’t supporting your narrative then shoehorn in repression of the poor. And I said sometimes, damnit. Not all the time.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> Ummm, have you heard the term food desert before? Welcome to the _real_ America.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What Is a Food Desert? Causes, Statistics, & Resources | Ohio University
> 
> 
> What is a food desert? Learn how food deserts prevent individuals from accessing nutritious food options in their communities and what you can do to help.
> 
> 
> 
> onlinemasters.ohio.edu




Real America, as in only folksy people are American?

That's why I was asking if there is any data comparing city poor vs rural poor.  Where I live we have poor people but if you throw a rock you'd probably hit a vaccination center.  

We mostly just talk about the vaccinated vs the willingly unvaccinated, but there are also people who don't get vaccinated because they don't think it's a priority and if they are too isolated to get vaccinated they might also assume they are too isolated to get covid.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I haven’t heard of anybody losing their job or home because they went and got vaccinated.



That's not what was claimed.


Pumbaa said:


> Someone somewhere mentioned they couldn’t afford to risk having to take an unpaid day off work due to reactions to the shot, if they were to get those flu-like symptoms for a day after.



People living paycheck-to-paycheck might not lose their job if they take a day off. But they also won't get paid if they miss a couple days of work due to side effects. The Biden administration addressed this issue, so hopefully it has been working for people who had been putting off getting the vaccine.









						Biden announces paid leave tax credit for vaccinations
					

The U.S. will surpass the 200 million milestone this week




					www.ny1.com


----------



## Pumbaa

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I think that’s trying to conflate 2 separate issues. Until recently there was an eviction moratorium and financial assistance for those experiencing financial hardship for covid related reasons. I haven’t heard of anybody losing their job or home because they went and got vaccinated. _Sometimes_ repression of the poor is the voter fraud of the left. If the numbers aren’t supporting your narrative then shoehorn in repression of the poor. And I said sometimes, damnit. Not all the time.



It was presented as worrying about the consequences of losing the payment for those hours rather than losing the job, but yeah, not going to disagree with you.

Could simply be a convenient excuse for not getting a jab. Could be due to misinformation or a lack of information about their rights and available support. Could be outdated. Could be made up.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> That's not what was claimed.
> 
> People living paycheck-to-paycheck might not lose their job if they take a day off. But they also won't get paid if they miss a couple days of work due to side effects. The Biden administration addressed this issue, so hopefully it has been working for people who had been putting off getting the vaccine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Biden announces paid leave tax credit for vaccinations
> 
> 
> The U.S. will surpass the 200 million milestone this week
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ny1.com




But again, if you missed pay and couldn't pay some of your rent as a result there was an eviction moratorium and related financial assistance.  And I've never seen any proof of this hypothetical situation actually happening (like voter fraud).


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> But again, if you missed pay and couldn't pay some of your rent as a result there was an eviction moratorium and related financial assistance.  And I've never seen any proof of this hypothetical situation actually happening (like voter fraud).



The point isn’t that millions of people have lost their homes because they got a vaccine. It’s about allaying fears. People are worried they COULD lose their their job or miss a rent payment, so they refuse the vaccine. This tax credit is meant to take away one possible reason for refusing or putting off the vaccine. The point is to get people vaccinated.

I have sympathy for somebody that (accurately or not) sees the risk of taking time off work as more dangerous than a disease they may or may not catch. They know if they miss 2 days of work, what that does to their budget. They might greatly underestimate the risk of COVID. I am in favor of the Biden tax credit to help people overcome that worry and get vaccinated.

I do NOT have much sympathy for people that refuse the vaccine as some sort of political virtue signaling.

And I have contempt for people that actively discourage others to refuse the vaccine for their own political or financial gain.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Pumbaa said:


> It was presented as worrying about the consequences of losing the payment for those hours rather than losing the job, but yeah, not going to disagree with you.
> 
> Could simply be a convenient excuse for not getting a jab. Could be due to misinformation or a lack of information about their rights and available support. Could be outdated. Could be made up.




I picture a news reporter attempting to go up to a poor person on the street to ask them why they aren’t vaccinated and some middle class hero runs into the frame and goes “I got this, bro. They aren’t vaccinated because they can’t afford to take time off work. And the government prioritized the rich. And Republicans blocked vaccine outreach and want non white poor people to die.”


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> The point isn’t that millions of people have lost their homes because they got a vaccine. It’s about allaying fears. People are worried they COULD lose their their job or miss a rent payment, so they refuse the vaccine. This tax credit is meant to take away one possible reason for refusing or putting off the vaccine. The point is to get people vaccinated.
> 
> I have sympathy for somebody that (accurately or not) sees the risk of taking time off work as more dangerous than a disease they may or may not catch. They know if they miss 2 days of work, what that does to their budget. They might greatly underestimate the risk of COVID. I am in favor of the Biden tax credit to help people overcome that worry and get vaccinated.
> 
> I do NOT have much sympathy for people that refuse the vaccine as some sort of political virtue signaling.
> 
> And I have contempt for people that actively discourage others to refuse the vaccine for their own political or financial gain.




Well, I was going to post this, but you beat me to it....



Chew Toy McCoy said:


> But again, if you missed pay and couldn't pay some of your rent as a result there was an eviction moratorium and related financial assistance.  And I've never seen any proof of this hypothetical situation actually happening (like voter fraud).



I don't believe that's what's been referenced.  Similar to what we heard when people were doing the feel good "essential workers" ( the individuals who showed up restaurants to work to serve food for those who got to stay @ home, or grocery clerks, or other jobs that were looked down upon earlier ) before we moved to people being "lazy", was the recognition that some people couldn't afford NOT to work.  It was the THREAT of a loss a job no matter how crappy it was, that would keep people going to work even if they were sick or infected.  The hypothetical isn't that we aren't aware of numbers of people who lost jobs getting a vaccine, the hypothetical was that people may have feared the THREAT of wage loss or firing because they took time off for the vaccine.  If they were like me, that time off wouldn't have included just the time to get the vaccine but the 24 - 36 hours it knocked me out so I couldn't get out of bed.  

So if you believe the possible threat of losing wages or job, that might prevent you from getting the vaccine.  Especially if your off days are so filled with other responsibilities, finding a place to get the vaccine then doing it might be something one would rather avoid.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I picture a news reporter attempting to go up to a poor person on the street to ask them why they aren’t vaccinated and some middle class hero runs into the frame and goes “I got this, bro. They aren’t vaccinated because they can’t afford to take time off work. And the government prioritized the rich. And Republicans blocked vaccine outreach and want non white poor people to die.”



That's kind of a dramatic 90 degree swerve that doesn't rely on ever finding out why "the poor person" is unvaccinated.

Maybe the person is, maybe they don't have the resources to find out, or maybe being vaccinated just doesn't seem like the 'end of the world' necessity it does to everyone else in that scenario.

A large part of the focus of the frustration with the unvaccinated isn't towards those who are *genuinely* undecided, can't, or unable.  It's with those who put on the show of comparing themselves to those in the past going to gas chambers or being enslaved.


----------



## User.45

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Real America, as in only folksy people are American?



No, but _real_ America includes things that happen outside our segregated social/work bubbles. 
As I said it's not an excuse, but a factor. Can we actually look up the stats on the socioeconomic distribution of the unvaxxed instead dropping hypothetics for 2 pages?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> I have sympathy for somebody that (accurately or not) sees the risk of taking time off work as more dangerous than a disease they may or may not catch. They know if they miss 2 days of work, what that does to their budget. They might greatly underestimate the risk of COVID. I am in favor of the Biden tax credit to help people overcome that worry and get vaccinated.




I want to sympathize with that but I don’t think that is a wide spread reason and if that is the reason they are giving, it’s not their one and only reason. It’s interesting that we are now in a situation where they could lose their job if they don’t get vaccinated. I think there are a lot of people attempting to play the least offensive excuse shell game.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> Can we actually look up the stats on the socioeconomic distribution of the unvaxxed instead dropping hypothetics for 2 pages?




Apparently I can't.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> That's kind of a dramatic 90 degree swerve that doesn't rely on ever finding out why "the poor person" is unvaccinated.
> 
> Maybe the person is, maybe they don't have the resources to find out, or maybe being vaccinated just doesn't seem like the 'end of the world' necessity it does to everyone else in that scenario.
> 
> A large part of the focus of the frustration with the unvaccinated isn't towards those who are *genuinely* undecided, can't, or unable.  It's with those who put on the show of comparing themselves to those in the past going to gas chambers or being enslaved.




I agree that was a little silly over the top, and for today's performance I'm being a little hardline in that the virus doesn't make a distinction between anti-vax idiots and the undecided (who are never going to be decided at this point).


----------



## User.45

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Apparently I can't.











						New Tool Tracks Vaccination and Vaccine Hesitancy Rates Across Geographies, Population Groups
					

New Household Pulse Survey interactive tracker allows users to view characteristics of the vaccinated and vaccine-hesitant populations.




					www.census.gov
				




Here. It's all about education level.


----------



## User.45

P_X said:


> New Tool Tracks Vaccination and Vaccine Hesitancy Rates Across Geographies, Population Groups
> 
> 
> New Household Pulse Survey interactive tracker allows users to view characteristics of the vaccinated and vaccine-hesitant populations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.census.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here. It's all about education level.
> 
> View attachment 8720



My favorite is "doctor didn't recommend". Stated by 10% of the 10% i.e.  1% of the entire population claims their doctor didn't recommend. The prevalence of those with legitimate relative contraindications are probably 1 in 1,000 to 1 in 10,000, i.e in 1-10% of the group that makes this claim.

edited for clarity


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> New Tool Tracks Vaccination and Vaccine Hesitancy Rates Across Geographies, Population Groups
> 
> 
> New Household Pulse Survey interactive tracker allows users to view characteristics of the vaccinated and vaccine-hesitant populations.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.census.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here. It's all about education level.
> 
> View attachment 8720




It would be interesting to see education level matched with who/what they are getting their information from.  

Another dark side to the internet, before it existed people could legitimately be uninformed.  Now they are actively being made dangerously ignorant.


----------



## DT




----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

The Kaiser Family Foundation recently studied three months of data from the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, and concluded that “preventable Covid-19 hospitalizations” have cost the health care system an estimated $5.7 billion. The foundation defines preventable hospitalization as “hospitalizations of unvaccinated adults.” (If you want to read the report, it’s at www.kff.org.)


----------



## shadow puppet

If this is true, then yay for Club Moderna.  My third jab is Monday morning! 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438914824851922945/


----------



## ronntaylor

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438701951554887680/

COVID-19 idiocy spans every demographic


----------



## Roller

DT said:


> View attachment 8724



Shortest Hardy Boys book of them all... mystery solved in 5 minutes.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Now Minaj is becoming Covid stupid related tangentially 

First she claimed she was invited by the WH over this whole thing, when in fact they offered to call her to share facts about the vaccine, and now this...



> Nicki Minaj Just Tried to Dox Two Reporters
> 
> 
> It seems like she isn't very happy about what's going on?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> jezebel.com





> However, on Friday afternoon, Minaj hopped on Instagram and posted screenshots to her Story that allegedly show a conversation between a reporter in Trinidad attempting to contact some of her family members. One assumes that this reporter must be doing so in order to verify the claims of swollen balls, but we will likely never know the truth, because Minaj also used her Story to attempt to dox the reporters by posting a picture of a business card, a name and a phone number, followed by a few pictures ganked from Google of the reporter in question. (Linking to the Story in this piece would be irresponsible, so if you’re so inclined to watch this sort of drama play out in real time, you can certainly find it for yourself.)




For 'F' sake the stupidity never seems to end when it comes to Covid.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Now Minaj is becoming Covid stupid related tangentially
> 
> First she claimed she was invited by the WH over this whole thing, when in fact they offered to call her to share facts about the vaccine, and now this...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For 'F' sake the stupidity never seems to end when it comes to Covid.



Don’t take health advice from a rapper, and don’t ask Dr. Fauci to rap.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Can’t say I’m surprised 








						At least 7 conservative radio hosts and anti-mask advocates have died from COVID-19 after bashing the vaccines
					

Misinformation around the COVID-19 and vaccines remains widespread as cases are rising in the US, especially in states like Florida and Texas.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> don’t ask Dr. Fauci to rap




Watch it there, laddo, with all the deep-fakery available to, basically all of us, someone is sure to make the FauciRap video.


----------



## JayMysteri0

BOOM!
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438984003135016961/


----------



## fooferdoggie

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438897295819517953/


----------



## Edd

Runs For Fun said:


> Can’t say I’m surprised
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least 7 conservative radio hosts and anti-mask advocates have died from COVID-19 after bashing the vaccines
> 
> 
> Misinformation around the COVID-19 and vaccines remains widespread as cases are rising in the US, especially in states like Florida and Texas.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.businessinsider.com



Nice to read some feel-good news.


----------



## Yoused

Ole-fucking-ander​

I mean, come on, really? I heard that Prussian Blue, mixed with several nightshade berries, salted with arsenic and just a touch of strychnine will do the trick. If you take enough, and add a hefty dollop of warfarin, that is.


----------



## Alli

Yoused said:


> Ole-fucking-ander​
> I mean, come on, really? I heard that Prussian Blue, mixed with several nightshade berries, salted with arsenic and just a touch of strychnine will do the trick. If you take enough, and add a hefty dollop of warfarin, that is.



And don’t forget a good dose of foxglove.


----------



## Hrafn

Alli said:


> And don’t forget a good dose of foxglove.



And a touch of hemlock.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy




----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439430301864898562/


----------



## Thomas Veil

Ladies and gentlemen…this is natural selection at work.

*More people died in Alabama during 2020 than were born as Covid-19 deaths continue rising in the US*



> Alabama had more people die last year during the onset of the Covid-19 pandemic than births, a top health official said, as the US continues to grapple with rising coronavirus cases and deaths.





> "This past year, 2020, is going to be the first year that we know of in the history of our state where we actually had more deaths than births," Alabama Health Officer Dr. Scott Harris said Friday during a news briefing.





> In Alabama, where 41% of people are fully vaccinated, according to data from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), officials said more hospital beds have recently become available, though it's not because people are recovering from the virus.





> "It is not because these patients are miraculously getting better and going home. It's because they're dying," Dr. Kierstin Kennedy, the chief of hospital medicine at the University of Alabama Medicine.




I’m sure we’ve all known in the back of our minds that this disease might start to burn itself out when it can find no more hosts, but that’s actually—slowly, agonizingly—starting to happen. Not because of immunity, but because of…I don’t know, call it self-selection.









						More people died in Alabama during 2020 than were born as Covid-19 deaths continue rising in the US | CNN
					

Alabama had more people die last year during the onset of the Covid-19 pandemic than births, a top health official said, as the US continues to grapple with rising coronavirus cases and deaths.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

so sad.​Amazon Sellers Are Price Gouging Horse Dewormer Because People Want To Eat It​









						Amazon Sellers Are Price Gouging Horse Dewormer Because People Want To Eat It
					

A $7 horse deworming treatment is commanding prices as high as $45 on Amazon thanks to unfounded claims that it is a cure for COVID.




					www.buzzfeednews.com


----------



## Edd

Thomas Veil said:


> Ladies and gentlemen…this is natural selection at work.
> 
> *More people died in Alabama during 2020 than were born as Covid-19 deaths continue rising in the US*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I’m sure we’ve all known in the back of our minds that this disease might start to burn itself out when it can find no more hosts, but that’s actually—slowly, agonizingly—starting to happen. Not because of immunity, but because of…I don’t know, call it self-selection.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> More people died in Alabama during 2020 than were born as Covid-19 deaths continue rising in the US | CNN
> 
> 
> Alabama had more people die last year during the onset of the Covid-19 pandemic than births, a top health official said, as the US continues to grapple with rising coronavirus cases and deaths.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com



Wow, they’re not fucking around with owning the libs down there.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Don't leave Mississippi out, it's gov certainly wouldn't want you to

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439588188201308172/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439581162146607105/

These stats are frightening, and gop governors seem to be alright with it.


----------



## Thomas Veil

> "If Mississippi were its own country, you would be second in the world only to Peru in terms of deaths per capita... With all due respect, governor, your way is failing."





> "The question here is not about what we do in Mississippi, it's about what this POTUS is trying to impose on the American worker."




Excuse my French, but that response is just fucking crazy.


----------



## Alli

Thomas Veil said:


> Excuse my French, but that response is just fucking crazy.



So is Tate Reeves.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wait.  What?!!    

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439611078200147969/

A funeral home is advertising for people to NOT get vaccinated?!!  

Actually it seems like trolling... 



> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wilmore Funeral Home
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wilmorefuneralhome.com




In a good way.


----------



## lizkat

To summarize what it means to have lost more than 670,000 so far to covid in the USA:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439359038073020418/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Don't leave Mississippi out, it's gov certainly wouldn't want you to
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439588188201308172/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439581162146607105/
> 
> These stats are frightening, and gop governors seem to be alright with it.



Can you imagine a football coach in Mississippi being asked, after a loss, if he would do anything different, and answering this way? He’d be fired within the hour.

Why do people care more about their team winning football games than about dying of this disease?


----------



## JayMysteri0

I'm going to need you to make sure you are seated  before watching this, because you have NO idea where it's going to go...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439543430401732613/


Spoiler: You have been warned



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439538322473463808/


----------



## Edd

JayMysteri0 said:


> I'm going to need you to make sure you are seated  before watching this, because you have NO idea where it's going to go...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439543430401732613/
> 
> 
> Spoiler: You have been warned
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439538322473463808/



“I’ve never had anal sex. I don’t want to have anal sex. I don’t want my kids having anal sex.”

Thank you ma’am this is all good to know . Shit, SNL would have a field day with this if it wasn’t summer.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> I'm going to need you to make sure you are seated  before watching this, because you have NO idea where it's going to go...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439543430401732613/
> 
> 
> Spoiler: You have been warned
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439538322473463808/



Maybe a book suggesting corn holing should not be in Middle School, but I’d be ok with it in High School if  considered worthy literature.   I read a controversial book (at the time) in high school *Catcher In the Rye *(profanity, premartial sex,  alcohol abuse) but can’t remember if it was in the school’s library or not.


----------



## Yoused

I think I was in my late 20s when I read the famous William S Burroughs book. There was so much anal sex in it that it got tedious. Perhaps that is the way to deal with such a subject: just hammer on it until the teenagers lose interest.


----------



## Pumbaa

Yoused said:


> I think I was in my late 20s when I read the famous William S Burroughs book. There was so much anal sex in it that it got tedious. Perhaps that is the way to deal with such a subject: just hammer on it until the teenagers lose interest.



And perhaps the best way to make teenagers’ interest peak is to loudly ban it.


----------



## MEJHarrison




----------



## Edd

MEJHarrison said:


>



AD is the best.


----------



## Runs For Fun

This was a tough read. These people's stupidity affects way more people than just their own dumb asses.

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/comments/pqm303

Just like people who legitimately needed hydroxyquinoline couldn't get it.


			https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/09/19/ivermectin-horse-dewormer-owners-covid/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Well, ...this happened...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439668869560512515/


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> Well, ...this happened...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439668869560512515/



That guy sounds like a real piece of work. Like a mask is going to destroy your business? What?


----------



## ronntaylor

JayMysteri0 said:


> Well, ...this happened...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439668869560512515/



I would gladly skip such assholes. Especially if I have to worry about my child getting sick.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Well, ...this happened...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439668869560512515/



F*&! the “blood sweat and tears” he put into the business. What’s sad about America is that even though his policy could endanger the health of a kid, a bunch of anti-vax turds will probably now make a point of eating at his dump.


----------



## Runs For Fun

WTF?
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439341949857697794/


----------



## ronntaylor

ronntaylor said:


> COVID-19 idiocy spans every demographic



Welp! Additional details in the Texans in the Carmine's melee. The women *did show proof of vaccination* (confirmed by the restaurant staff and video proof) and claim the hostess started the melee after using a racial slur. The Times rundown of the video appears to show that there was a verbal dispute that turned physical, with conflicting accounts. So it'll have to sorted out by the court.









						Footage Reveals New Details in Tourist Melee at N.Y.C. Restaurant (Published 2021)
					

Three Black women from Texas were arrested, but a lawyer for one called it “mutual combat” after they were called a racial slur.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> Well, ...this happened...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439668869560512515/



Fucking evil.…


----------



## Huntn

Runs For Fun said:


> WTF?
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1439341949857697794/



Part of me wishes it was 10x deadlier, then maybe a dent would have been made in some thick, stupid skulls.


----------



## Herdfan

If we are going to call out stupid, do we get to call out both sides?  Or are celebs exempt?









						Emmy viewers call out celebs for not wearing masks, social distancing at 2021 show
					

The Emmys were skewered on social media as viewers took notice of the lack of coronavirus safety measures, specifically masks.




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> If we are going to call out stupid, do we get to call out both sides?  Or are celebs exempt?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Emmy viewers call out celebs for not wearing masks, social distancing at 2021 show
> 
> 
> The Emmys were skewered on social media as viewers took notice of the lack of coronavirus safety measures, specifically masks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com



Yep, Fox is stupid. It’s ok to say it. You’d think they would realize that masks are to protect the unvaccinated by now, especially considering that’s exactly what they do in their own newsroom. But… no. 









						Emmys Media COVID-19 Vaccinations/Testing
					

Media outlets that have been selected for Red Carpet access must follow Covid-19 protocols.COVID-19 PROTOCOLTo protect the health and safety of all participating media, there is a COVID-19 protocol that must be completed by individuals assigned to cover the 73rd Emmy Awards on-site.Credential...




					www.emmys.com


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Yep, Fox is stupid. It’s ok to say it. You’d think they would realize that masks are to protect the unvaccinated by now, especially considering that’s exactly what they do in their own newsroom. But… no.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Emmys Media COVID-19 Vaccinations/Testing
> 
> 
> Media outlets that have been selected for Red Carpet access must follow Covid-19 protocols.COVID-19 PROTOCOLTo protect the health and safety of all participating media, there is a COVID-19 protocol that must be completed by individuals assigned to cover the 73rd Emmy Awards on-site.Credential...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.emmys.com




Missed the point.  Probably because the goalposts moved.

It's stupid because authorities are doing their best to get people to wear masks and then all these celebs are on TV maskless.  Not going to convince the normal folks that they need to wear masks when they see celebs on TV not doing so.  

Even Seth Rogan called them out.  And he was one of them.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> Missed the point.  Probably because the goalposts moved.
> 
> It's stupid because authorities are doing their best to get people to wear masks and then all these celebs are on TV maskless.  Not going to convince the normal folks that they need to wear masks when they see celebs on TV not doing so.
> 
> Even Seth Rogan called them out.  And he was one of them.



Well there are the vaccinated on one side and STUPID on  the other. And actually the goal posts have moved.  Masks were the standard before the vaccine was readily available, now among the vaccinated, masks are to give STUPID a break. And in my view a lot of the vaccinated are now getting attitudes about putting up with  STUPID.

Interesting this is a critique coming from Faux News. They just don’t miss a chance to be two faced deceptive, and manipulative.


----------



## SuperMatt

Huntn said:


> Well there are the vaccinated on one side and STUPID on  the other. And actually the goal posts have moved.  Masks were the standard before the vaccine was readily available, now among the vaccinated, masks are to give STUPID a break. And in my view a lot of the vaccinated are now getting attitudes about putting up with  STUPID.
> 
> Interesting this is a critique coming from Faux News. They just don’t miss a chance to be two faced deceptive, and manipulative.







__





						Fox News Requires Employees to Report Vaccination Status, Mandates Masks for Workers in ‘Confined Spaces’
					





					www.msn.com
				




Fox is attacking the producers of the Emmys for having the same policy they have in their newsroom. And the Fox viewers   eat it up. They also conflate Fauci = Deep State = Hollywood elites = Emmys producers without even thinking twice. Since they dislike these groups or people, they assume they are all working together.


----------



## Eric

Not going to body shame but ignorance and hypocrisy are center stage here. Also, IMO that first photo is of a beautiful and talented young woman, what a shame.


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalHumor/comments/prsfev


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> If we are going to call out stupid, do we get to call out both sides?  Or are celebs exempt?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Emmy viewers call out celebs for not wearing masks, social distancing at 2021 show
> 
> 
> The Emmys were skewered on social media as viewers took notice of the lack of coronavirus safety measures, specifically masks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com




Since you seem to be soliciting for opinions, here's mine.

Everyone had to show proof of vaccination AND test negative to attend.  I have no problem with it.

All the angry messages in the article were stupid.  You kid has to wear a mask to school?  Does your child's school require proof of vaccination AND a negative test from EVERY child?  If not, what does one have to do with the other?

Seems like the Obama birthday party all over again.  People who don't want to wear a mask or get a vaccine are finding every little excuse they can to justify their poor behavior.  Like pointing out crap like this.

Vaccinated people doing all the right things and having a celebration shouldn't be the big news story.  The big story here is that most of America can't have fun like this because of all the people doing all the wrong things.

If Fox News cared more about the truth than keeping viewers, they would be telling America that they too could celebrate like this if they would just go get their vaccine.  But that's not the message people are tuning in to hear.  So they give the audience what they're asking for and we end up with useless stories like this.


----------



## Huntn

MEJHarrison said:


> Since you seem to be soliciting for opinions, here's mine.
> 
> Everyone had to show proof of vaccination AND test negative to attend.  I have no problem with it.
> 
> All the angry notes messages in the article were stupid.  You kid has to wear a mask to school?  Does your child's school require proof of vaccination AND a negative test from EVERY child?  If not, what does one have to do with the other?
> 
> Seems like the Obama birthday party all over again.  People who don't want to wear a mask or get a vaccine are finding every little excuse they can to justify their poor behavior.  Like pointing out crap like this.
> 
> Vaccinated people doing all the right things and having a celebration shouldn't be the big news story.  The big story here is that most of America can't have fun like this because of all the people doing all the wrong things.
> 
> If Fox News cared more about the truth than keeping viewers, they would be telling America that they too could celebrate like this if they would just go get their vaccine.  But that's not the message people are tuning in to hear.  So they give the audience what they're asking for and we end up with useless stories like this.



>*Everyone had to show proof of vaccination AND test negative to attend. I have no problem with it.*<


----------



## Huntn

I think this was mentioned but anyway, bravo to my former employer: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/25/del...-200-fees-if-they-dont-get-covid-vaccine.html


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> >*Everyone had to show proof of vaccination AND test negative to attend. I have no problem with it.*<




I have 2 problems with it.

First, people can still spread it even if they are vaccinated.  Isn't that what we have been told?  Pretty sure the CDC guidance is still masking indoors, EVEN FOR VACCINATED PEOPLE.  They can say it was outdoors all they want, but it was in an enclosed tent.  

Second, you can test NEGATIVE up to 10 days AFTER being exposed.  So a negative test is almost useless in this situation.

Look, I knew what the response would be.  Had the same situation been a bunch of Republicans (all Vaxxed and tested) doing the same thing, this place would be full of posts condemning it.  And as usual it became more about Fox than the issue they were reporting.  It was not a good look and I think more of you know it than are willing to admit it.

I am vaxxed, but I can guarantee I will NEVER put a mask back on because a politician tells me to.  They have lost all credibility on this issue.  So if that means I am stuck at the house, so be it.  COVID has been good enough for my business that I can not work for a year and still be on track.  And I have plenty of things to do at my house and mom's house to keep me busy.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Had the same situation been a bunch of Republicans (all Vaxxed and tested) doing the same thing, this place would be full of posts condemning it. And as usual it became more about Fox than the issue they were reporting. It was not a good look and I think more of you know it than are willing to admit it.



I already pointed out a bunch of Republicans that do the same thing every day - Fox News.

I haven't seen any posts here condemning them for this policy. People *are* upset that they require vaccines at their workplace while decrying Biden's vaccine mandates and actively discouraging people from getting the vaccines that they themselves already got. That is rank hypocrisy.

But their vaccine mandate, so that they can safely let people go on air without masks? I've yet to see anybody raise an issue on that. I applaud it.

You love to pose hypotheticals and claim you know what the response of others would be. In this case, we have an ACTUAL situation that matches your hypothetical, and you can see Fox is *not* being condemned for having anchors vaccinated and going on the air without masks.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> I already pointed out a bunch of Republicans that do the same thing every day - Fox News.
> 
> *I haven't seen any posts here condemning them for this policy. People are upset that they require vaccines at their workplace while decrying Biden's vaccine mandates and actively discouraging people from getting the vaccines that they themselves already got. That is rank hypocrisy.*



There is a difference between what a business requires of its employees vs what the government requires businesses to require of their employees.  I know you probably don't see it, or care if you do.  But there is a difference.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> There is a difference between what a business requires of its employees vs what the government requires businesses to require of their employees.  I know you probably don't see it, or care if you do.  But there is a difference.



You haven't refuted my point, but you have insinuated that I'm either stupid or willfully ignorant or both. So, good work. That tells me this debate is already over... that and the rant about locking yourself in your house for a year just to avoid wearing a mask.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> You haven't refuted my point, but you have insinuated that I'm either stupid or willfully ignorant or both. So, good work. That tells me this debate is already over... that and the rant about locking yourself in your house for a year just to avoid wearing a mask.




Not a rant.  Not even a rant about masks.  A pushback against "Rules for thee, but not for me".


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Not a rant.  Not even a rant about masks.  A pushback against "Rules for thee, but not for me".



Yeah, but that's not even true. Again, Fox News and the Emmys had the same policy. You didn't give a hoot about Fox's policy, but you're angry about the Emmys. If you're angry at anybody, it should be the unvaccinated. If everybody got their shots, masks would now be a distant memory.



Herdfan said:


> I am vaxxed, but I can guarantee I will NEVER put a mask back on because a politician tells me to. They have lost all credibility on this issue. So if that means I am stuck at the house, so be it. COVID has been good enough for my business that I can not work for a year and still be on track. And I have plenty of things to do at my house and mom's house to keep me busy.



Seems a bit rant-ish to me, and I rant a lot so...


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> I have 2 problems with it.
> 
> First, people can still spread it even if they are vaccinated.  Isn't that what we have been told?  Pretty sure the CDC guidance is still masking indoors, EVEN FOR VACCINATED PEOPLE.  They can say it was outdoors all they want, but it was in an enclosed tent.
> 
> Second, you can test NEGATIVE up to 10 days AFTER being exposed.  So a negative test is almost useless in this situation.
> 
> Look, I knew what the response would be.  Had the same situation been a bunch of Republicans (all Vaxxed and tested) doing the same thing, this place would be full of posts condemning it.  And as usual it became more about Fox than the issue they were reporting.  It was not a good look and I think more of you know it than are willing to admit it.
> 
> I am vaxxed, but I can guarantee I will NEVER put a mask back on because a politician tells me to.  They have lost all credibility on this issue.  So if that means I am stuck at the house, so be it.  COVID has been good enough for my business that I can not work for a year and still be on track.  And I have plenty of things to do at my house and mom's house to keep me busy.



Here is my view, at this point the issue is the dummies who in the name their libertay are refusing to get vaccinated. The other part of the issue is the wholesale disregarding of wearing masks, nobody is listening, well a few are. I wear a mask  when entering a store. I’ve stopped wearing a mask at the gym, mostly because I am not concerned about dieing. I’d estimate maybe 5% wear masks while working out at my Houston gym. 

That said,  if we had 95% vaccination rate, the seriousness of this pandemic would be over, our emergency rooms and ICUs would not be overflowing. This was the reason why everything shut down in the first place, the medical infrastructure being overwhelmed. So at this point, if you want to cast blame, the seriousness of this pandemic is directly on the shoulders of the anti-vaxers.

I accept your anger, if it is not faux, political anger about mask non-compliance. Wearing a mask would help reduce transmission, but if everyone was vaccinated, it would not be the big deal that it is. We are back to 2000 a day dieing. I say you should have gotten vaccinated, and consequently, an abundance of Darwin Awards being handed out to people who deserved such an award. Or maybe we should be blaming The Head Turd (2020) and other Trump leeches  who politicized this pandemic in the first place calling it a hoax and a non-issue to keep their base barefoot and STUPID.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Look, I knew what the response would be.  Had the same situation been a bunch of Republicans (all Vaxxed and tested) doing the same thing, this place would be full of posts condemning it.




Believe it or not, I was on your side before I clicked the link.  I figured it would be a bunch of celebrities skipping their mask for the cameras.  I would have had issues with them doing something dumb.

I personally don't agree with the choices they did make for the reasons you mentioned.  But I also never stopped wearing my mask.  I held on to mine "just in case" (we now refer to "just in case" as simply the "Delta Variant").  So ***I*** would not have done what they did even though I'm vaccinated and negative as far as I know.  But I don't have a problem with ***them*** doing what they did under the conditions they did it.

I'm willing to meet you that far.  I have nothing against you personally.  I don't automatically have issues with your sources or stories.  I sometimes hit their website to see what they think is important in the country today.  I just disagree with their take on that story and that they would choose to cover this instead of pushing people to get vaccinated.



Herdfan said:


> I am vaxxed, but I can guarantee I will NEVER put a mask back on because a politician tells me to.




Neither would I.  But I also differentiate between a politician telling me to do it, and a politician telling me to do it based on the latest available science and medical advice.  And, as mentioned above, I wore mine even when the politicians were saying I didn't need to.  So I don't necessarily take mine _off_ when they tell me to either.  That's like winning a big battle in a war and declaring victory and withdrawing all your troops and going back home.  It's not over till it's over.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Probably not the right covid thread for this, but had to get tested this morning because one of my coworkers tested positive.  Googling the closest testing location, going there to get tested (drive-thru testing), and getting the result all took about an hour.  Test came back negative.  

Test cost $60 but my employer will reimburse me.  The vaccination is free.  I don't know where other employers stand on paying for tests, but if you are poor then $60 isn't easy to write off and I can't imagine an employer is going to want to fork that out weekly (or whatever the mandate says) to people who refuse to get vaccinated.


----------



## Huntn

At this point I would define “STUPID” as those setting themselves up to die, because they don’t trust experts and authority, or put their faith in corrupt politicians playing them.  A sad touch is at the end when they are begging to be saved.

Now it’s very likely we might have a debate about who those corrupt politicians were and are. The easy answer is: they are the ones lying to you because you’ll love them for it. Give a little ”baa” of approval on your way down the shoot to being sheered.  

What disturbs me the most is the distain directed at Dr Fauci, this strikes me as just more politics, teeth knashing coming from an angry Right looking for someone’s ass to bite because their chosen flaming loser, who was a completely sick and pathetic imbecile, (predictably by everyone but them), failed to survive the disgust of the majority.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Probably not the right covid thread for this, but had to get tested this morning because one of my coworkers tested positive.  Googling the closest testing location, going there to get tested (drive-thru testing), and getting the result all took about an hour.  Test came back negative.
> 
> Test cost $60 but my employer will reimburse me.  The vaccination is free.  I don't know where other employers stand on paying for tests, but if you are poor then $60 isn't easy to write off and I can't imagine an employer is going to want to fork that out weekly (or whatever the mandate says) to people who refuse to get vaccinated.



Standby: employer mandates. No one wants COVID messing up their business model.


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> Or maybe we should be blaming The Head Turd (2020) and other Trump leeches  who politicized this pandemic in the first place calling it a hoax and a non-issue to keep their base barefoot and STUPID.




If you want to go there, you have to include all the Dems who publicly stated they would never take the "Trump" vaccine.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> If you want to go there, you have to include all the Dems who publicly stated they would never take the "Trump" vaccine.



Really who? I’d like your list.

Note: I never left there, you want blame for politicizing  this from the start?


​


----------



## JayMysteri0

Speaking of "stupid", the efforts some will put towards making up disinformation

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438942851895894018/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> I am vaxxed, but I can guarantee I will NEVER put a mask back on because a politician tells me to.  They have lost all credibility on this issue.  So if that means I am stuck at the house, so be it.  COVID has been good enough for my business that I can not work for a year and still be on track.  And I have plenty of things to do at my house and mom's house to keep me busy.




Let me put this in terms right leaners can understand, not saying you specifically.

Let’s say Guns and Ammo magazine comes out promoting some armor piercing bullet as being the best for hunting and protecting your family. There’s a rush on the market for those bullets. Then the country’s leading ballistics expert comes out and says those bullets really aren’t effective for hunting or protecting your family. Later they come out and say they only said that because they didn’t want the military to have a shortage of that bullet.

Are 2nd amendment supporters going to go “I don’t know what to believe. What else are they lying about or not telling us?”. Fuck no. They are going to go back to stocking up on those bullets because if it’s good enough for the military then it’s good enough for them. Yet, for some reason they can’t come to the same logical conclusion that masks might actually be effective considering medical professionals who are surrounded by covid patients all day long are using masks and not dropping like flies.


----------



## SuperMatt

Huntn said:


> Really who? I’d like your list.
> 
> Note: I never left there, you want blame for politicizing  this from the start?
> 
> View attachment 8772​




I remember Kamala Harris saying this:



> "I will say that I would not trust Donald Trump and it would have to be a credible source of information that talks about the efficacy and the reliability of whatever he's talking about," Harris told CNN's Dana Bash in September.
> 
> “If the public health professionals, if Dr. Fauci, if the doctors tell us we should take it, I’ll be the first in line to take it, absolutely,” Harris said during her debate against Pence roughly a month later. “But if Donald Trump tells us we should take it, I’m not taking it.”



That's not "I will never take a Trump vaccine." It's saying they trust a doctor more than the orange buffoon.

I did find it interesting to see that Republicans in fall 2020 were quite gung-ho about the vaccine and accusing Kamala Harris of being an anti-vaxxer. Why did they all flip-flop? Hmm.... 









						These Dems balked at a coronavirus vaccine under Trump. Will they change their tune now?
					

When President Trump first told the American public that a coronavirus vaccine could come this year -- at the time he said possibly before Election Day -- Democrats including Vice President-elect Kamala Harris said they would not trust Trump as to any vaccine's safety.




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> If you want to go there, you have to include all the Dems who publicly stated they would never take the "Trump" vaccine.



Ring-a-ding-ding: BULLLLL FUCKING SHIT! Here comes the trifecta of 1) drop-a-lie 2) ignore-request-to-clarify 3) hide-until-topic's-changed.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> I remember Kamala Harris saying this:
> 
> 
> That's not "I will never take a Trump vaccine." It's saying they trust a doctor more than the orange buffoon.
> 
> I did find it interesting to see that Republicans in fall 2020 were quite gung-ho about the vaccine and accusing Kamala Harris of being an anti-vaxxer. Why did they all flip-flop? Hmm....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These Dems balked at a coronavirus vaccine under Trump. Will they change their tune now?
> 
> 
> When President Trump first told the American public that a coronavirus vaccine could come this year -- at the time he said possibly before Election Day -- Democrats including Vice President-elect Kamala Harris said they would not trust Trump as to any vaccine's safety.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com



There's a subreddit for people who take Trump's medical advice. It's called r/HermanCainAward


----------



## JayMysteri0

For F**KING F**K SAKE!!!

These people are eventually going to push me to finally saying, "DIE ALREADY"!!!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440005294914867200/

There's no compassion, no sympathy, no F' ing NOTHING for these sort of people who are so far up their own asses in their feelings.

They are whiny temperamental ASSHOLES throwing never ending "adult" temper tantrums who don't even realize while wallowing in their bullshit, they are showing their ass & that they are racist too.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440032049281200128/



> Newberg school employee goes to work in 'black face,' put on administrative leave
> 
> 
> NEWBERG, Ore. – An employee at a Newberg school went to work in Blackface last week, according to a message from the district. “It is important to remember how Blackface has been used to misrepresent Black communities and do harm. We acknowledge the violence this represents and the trauma it...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> katu.com









D@MN IT!  Get out of your feelings already!!!

The must frustrating part?  After shit like this, the school board performances, and whatever, these same people seem mystified why no one takes them 'F'N' seriously.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Also somewhat related to Covid ( actually GOP ) stupidity, as if anyone else didn't see this coming

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440034445164093448/

This idea that if you force people to work AND risk their lives for $7+ they have to obey, was the dream of those who believe in cloaked conscription.

The pandemic highlighted the wage issues, learn from it already.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> For F**KING F**K SAKE!!!
> 
> These people are eventually going to push me to finally saying, "DIE ALREADY"!!!




I kept reading thinking "Don't be the Newberg in Oregon, don't be the Newberg in Oregon, don't be the Newberg in Oregon".  Then "oh, you lousy fucks.  WHY?!?!?!"  That's about 30 minutes from here.


----------



## Herdfan

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Yet, for some reason they can’t come to the same logical conclusion that masks might actually be effective considering medical professionals who are surrounded by covid patients all day long are using masks and not dropping like flies.




And yet I have many doctors as clients, some specialists with degrees from the top medical schools.  Not a single one either 1) wore a mask around me or 2) ask me to wear one.  Our neighbor is a nurse who posts about ICU capacity on FB almost daily.  She and her husband had dinner with us weekly all through the pandemic, at our house, her house, restaurants. etc.  She posted one thing and did another.

I realize this is anecdotal, but it is my reality much more than Fauci saying we need to wear masks, then not wearing one.  And then making a lame excuse.  

Sorry, but I have quit listening.  Judge me all you want.  Celebrate my death from COVID if it happens (unlikely since I am vaccinated, but still possible) if you want.  

And let me say (@SuperMatt this is a rant) that I find it absolutely disgusting that people on here celebrate people's deaths from COVID.  Not matter how stupid they are.  They are human beings with families and friends and coworkers.  Just because they did something you didn't agree with is no reason to celebrate their death.  Again, it is disgusting behavior!!!!


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Let me put this in terms right leaners can understand, not saying you specifically.
> 
> Let’s say Guns and Ammo magazine comes out promoting some armor piercing bullet as being the best for hunting and protecting your family. There’s a rush on the market for those bullets. Then the country’s leading ballistics expert comes out and says those bullets really aren’t effective for hunting or protecting your family. Later they come out and say they only said that because they didn’t want the military to have a shortage of that bullet.
> 
> Are 2nd amendment supporters going to go “I don’t know what to believe. What else are they lying about or not telling us?”. Fuck no. They are going to go back to stocking up on those bullets because if it’s good enough for the military then it’s good enough for them. Yet, for some reason they can’t come to the same logical conclusion that masks might actually be effective considering medical professionals who are surrounded by covid patients all day long are using masks and not dropping like flies.



Why “STUPID” is prominently featured in my posts and this thread. Option 2 is people blinded by their prejudices, but ironically this is when their leadership intentionally misleads them using incinerary language designed to inflame and mislead, but that also has to come back to if not stupid, a short supply of intelligence.


----------



## Edd

Herdfan said:


> And yet I have many doctors as clients, some specialists with degrees from the top medical schools.  Not a single one either 1) wore a mask around me or 2) ask me to wear one.  Our neighbor is a nurse who posts about ICU capacity on FB almost daily.  She and her husband had dinner with us weekly all through the pandemic, at our house, her house, restaurants. etc.  She posted one thing and did another.
> 
> I realize this is anecdotal, but it is my reality much more than Fauci saying we need to wear masks, then not wearing one.  And then making a lame excuse.
> 
> Sorry, but I have quit listening.  Judge me all you want.  Celebrate my death from COVID if it happens (unlikely since I am vaccinated, but still possible) if you want.
> 
> And let me say (@SuperMatt this is a rant) that I find it absolutely disgusting that people on here celebrate people's deaths from COVID.  Not matter how stupid they are.  They are human beings with families and friends and coworkers.  Just because they did something you didn't agree with is no reason to celebrate their death.  Again, it is disgusting behavior!!!!



As a poster guilty of some celebrating, I’d draw a distinction between a typical Breitbart-reading dupe who’s a nobody, and a right-wing radio host actively discouraging listeners to follow COVID protocols and get vaccinated. That’s a fate they richly deserve.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> And yet I have many doctors as clients, some specialists with degrees from the top medical schools.  Not a single one either 1) wore a mask around me or 2) ask me to wear one.  Our neighbor is a nurse who posts about ICU capacity on FB almost daily.  She and her husband had dinner with us weekly all through the pandemic, at our house, her house, restaurants. etc.  She posted one thing and did another.
> 
> I realize this is anecdotal, but it is my reality much more than Fauci saying we need to wear masks, then not wearing one.  And then making a lame excuse.
> 
> Sorry, but I have quit listening.  Judge me all you want.  Celebrate my death from COVID if it happens (unlikely since I am vaccinated, but still possible) if you want.



As expected, we went from blaming the antivaxxer democrats for low Trumpist vaccination rates, to anecdotal mask inadherence.





Herdfan said:


> And let me say (@SuperMatt this is a rant) that I find it absolutely disgusting that people on here celebrate people's deaths from COVID.  Not matter how stupid they are.  They are human beings with families and friends and coworkers.  Just because they did something you didn't agree with is no reason to celebrate their death.  Again, it is disgusting behavior!!!!



Moral high-grounds start with not lying about stuff. Just my 2 cents. 


You can find my opinion here:



P_X said:


> Michael, self-described ass-hole, gets his award. His wife dies of COVID just 13 days later, leaving 3 kids without parents. from
> HermanCainAward
> 
> This is sad AF...


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> And yet I have many doctors as clients, some specialists with degrees from the top medical schools.  Not a single one either 1) wore a mask around me or 2) ask me to wear one.  Our neighbor is a nurse who posts about ICU capacity on FB almost daily.  She and her husband had dinner with us weekly all through the pandemic, at our house, her house, restaurants. etc.  She posted one thing and did another.
> 
> I realize this is anecdotal, but it is my reality much more than Fauci saying we need to wear masks, then not wearing one.  And then making a lame excuse.
> 
> Sorry, but I have quit listening.  Judge me all you want.  Celebrate my death from COVID if it happens (unlikely since I am vaccinated, but still possible) if you want.
> 
> And let me say (@SuperMatt this is a rant) that I find it absolutely disgusting that people on here celebrate people's deaths from COVID.  Not matter how stupid they are.  They are human beings with families and friends and coworkers.  Just because they did something you didn't agree with is no reason to celebrate their death.  Again, it is disgusting behavior!!!!




_Sorry, but I have quit listening.  Judge me all you want.  Celebrate my death from COVID if it happens (unlikely since I am vaccinated, but still possible) if you want._

You got vaccinated, that is not stupid. So compared to STUPID, I give you an atta-boy! 
I’m going to assume you got it because you believe it work, yes? Don’t let me down! 
Why would I celebrate your death from COVID after getting vaccinated? No need for self pity.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Herdfan said:


> And let me say (@SuperMatt this is a rant) that I find it absolutely disgusting that people on here celebrate people's deaths from COVID.  Not matter how stupid they are.  They are human beings with families and friends and coworkers.  Just because they did something you didn't agree with is no reason to celebrate their death.  Again, it is disgusting behavior!!!!




I think in fairness you may want to put out such individuals who said such things.

I realize it's a touchy thing, but there is the remotest possibility that perhaps they didn't mean what was said in the way you choose to take it.

If people aren't made aware of their actions that so offend others, there is no way they can acknowledge & address what you find
"disgusting".

I say this as a person who used to read in the former forums a favorite phrase of some "Darwin games.  Play stupid games, win stupid prizes", and many seemed to have no issue with that, no matter how callous it came across.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> And yet I have many doctors as clients, some specialists with degrees from the top medical schools.  Not a single one either 1) wore a mask around me or 2) ask me to wear one.  Our neighbor is a nurse who posts about ICU capacity on FB almost daily.  She and her husband had dinner with us weekly all through the pandemic, at our house, her house, restaurants. etc.  She posted one thing and did another.
> 
> I realize this is anecdotal, but it is my reality much more than Fauci saying we need to wear masks, then not wearing one.  And then making a lame excuse.
> 
> Sorry, but I have quit listening.  Judge me all you want.  Celebrate my death from COVID if it happens (unlikely since I am vaccinated, but still possible) if you want.




For you personally, what is the point of not wearing a mask out in public?  What's the harm if you do wear a mask?


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> I remember Kamala Harris saying this:
> 
> 
> That's not "I will never take a Trump vaccine." It's saying they trust a doctor more than the orange buffoon.
> 
> I did find it interesting to see that Republicans in fall 2020 were quite gung-ho about the vaccine and accusing Kamala Harris of being an anti-vaxxer. Why did they all flip-flop? Hmm....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These Dems balked at a coronavirus vaccine under Trump. Will they change their tune now?
> 
> 
> When President Trump first told the American public that a coronavirus vaccine could come this year -- at the time he said possibly before Election Day -- Democrats including Vice President-elect Kamala Harris said they would not trust Trump as to any vaccine's safety.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com



Agreed, I would not ever take any advice from Mr Conn either, but that’s a far cry from _Democrats _not taking the “_Trump Vaccine_”.  It’s interesting how @Herdfan interprets this for the sake of political debate.


----------



## User.45

Edd said:


> As a poster guilty of some celebrating, I’d draw a distinction between a typical Breitbart-reading dupe who’s a nobody, and a right-wing radio host actively discouraging listeners to follow COVID protocols and get vaccinated. That’s a fate they richly deserve.



My principle is never ever ever to make fun of anybody's death no matter what, but to be completely honest, this principle is much harder to adhere to when it comes to a person who systematically made fun of the casualties of the AIDS pandemic because he did not deem them worthy to be alive.


----------



## ronntaylor

Huntn said:


> Agreed, I would not ever take any advice from Mr Conn either, but that’s a far cry from _Democrats _not taking the “_Trump Vaccine_”. It’s interesting how @Herdfan interprets this for the sake of political debate.



That's a nice way of saying his rants are full of shit.


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> You got vaccinated, that is not stupid. So compared to STUPID, I give you an atta-boy!
> I’m going to assume you got it because you believe it work, yes? Don’t let me down!
> Why would I celebrate your death from COVID after getting vaccinated? No need for self pity.




Sorry to let you down.  It was a combination of two things.  One, it was the quickest path to being mask free.  Second, my mom was 92, had a list of commodities longer than my arm and was going into an assisted living facility that required them to access the premises at any time (otherwise you had Sundays and certain holidays).  So I was not going to just put her in there and let them cut me off except when they decided it was OK.   

As to whether or not I believe it works, sure as well as the flu vaccine does.  Better for some, not so great for others.    Right now it seems the betters are outpacing the not so greats. 

And I may not have been clear, I don't recall anyone celebrating those who died after being vaccinated, but there certainly has been some for the unvaxxed that have died.  Yes, some of them did some stupid stuff, but celebrating someone's death for simply not getting vaccinated and paying the ultimate price is not something I will ever condone.


----------



## Eric

My take is if they ask you to wear it, wear it. If they ask you to wear underpants so you're not pissing all over everyone, go ahead and wear those too. Right now the free market (for the most part) is speaking, long held Republican principles and one would think they would embrace it. Alternatively, you don't have to patronize that establishment either, that is certainly your right.


----------



## Herdfan

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> For you personally, what is the point of not wearing a mask out in public?  What's the harm if you do wear a mask?




I hate them.  I can't breath well with them on.  It is not about freedom or any of that BS.  Just like some guys like boxers over briefs because one isn't comfortable or some women don't like bras, masks are not comfortable to me. 

I wore one when required, but will not again.  I will simply stay home.  Seeing too many politicians and celebs lecturing me (not me personally) about wearing them only to be caught not wearing them.  And someone always makes an excuse for them, just like at the Emmy's.  Follow the science they say, well the CDC (the science) says don't do what they did and all of a sudden the science doesn't matter because FoxNews did the report.


----------



## Herdfan

Eric said:


> My take is if they ask you to wear it, wear it. If they ask you to wear underpants so you're not pissing all over everyone, go ahead and wear those too. Right now the free market (for the most part) is speaking, long held Republican principles and one would think they would embrace it. Alternatively, you don't have to patronize that establishment either, that is certainly your right.




If an establishment asks me to wear one, I will if I really want to patronize that business.  But no government agency is going to force me to.  Nor will Lowe's.  They reinstated their mask policy for employees on August 2nd and call for social distancing.  So now all the employees are wearing chinstraps.  Plus my local one had 2 registers open the other day side by side forcing the people checking out to be within 3' feet of one another.  They don't really believe in masks, they just want to look like they are doing something.


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> If an establishment asks me to wear one, I will if I really want to patronize that business.  But no government agency is going to force me to.  Nor will Lowe's.  They reinstated their mask policy for employees on August 2nd and call for social distancing.  So now all the employees are wearing chinstraps.  Plus my local one had 2 registers open the other day side by side forcing the people checking out to be within 3' feet of one another.  They don't really believe in masks, they just want to look like they are doing something.



You should walk in with your pants hanging down half of your ass and then start farting on everyone, that would be great. Don't forget to share the video.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Sorry to let you down.  It was a combination of two things.  One, it was the quickest path to being mask free.  Second, my mom was 92, had a list of commodities longer than my arm and was going into an assisted living facility that required them to access the premises at any time (otherwise you had Sundays and certain holidays).  So I was not going to just put her in there and let them cut me off except when they decided it was OK.
> 
> As to whether or not I believe it works, sure as well as the flu vaccine does.  Better for some, not so great for others.    Right now it seems the betters are outpacing the not so greats.
> 
> And I may not have been clear, I don't recall anyone celebrating those who died after being vaccinated, but there certainly has been some for the unvaxxed that have died.  Yes, some of them did some stupid stuff, but celebrating someone's death for simply not getting vaccinated and paying the ultimate price is not something I will ever condone.



I don’t care why people get vaccinated. I posted a link where you could get free tickets to a MLB game if you get the vaccine. If that gets somebody there, who cares?

Most people thought a couple things that turned out differently.

1) Herd immunity would happen at around 70%. The Delta variant turned out to be more transmissible, and it seems that herd immunity might need a higher number.
2) People would be glad to get vaccinated so they could get rid of their masks. Nope. Some areas said “if you’re vaccinated you can take off the masks” and people realized “you can’t tell if I’m vaccinated or not! I will take off my mask even though I didn’t get vaccinated.”

So, we are back to mask mandates because of people not getting vaccinated and the more contagious Delta variant.

I feel bad for some people who didn’t get vaccinated and then died. I will call them victims of disinformation. These are possible true believers of Trump. They loved operation Warp Speed, but when Trump didn’t get re-elected, suddenly they don’t want a vaccine anymore. Or maybe they are getting scared from lies on Facebook or some website.

The people I don’t feel bad for are those who died but also caused other deaths by spreading the disinformation. Right-wing radio hosts, etc. I feel bad for a guy who commits suicide alone. I do not feel bad for the suicidal terrorists on 9/11, or somebody who shoots up a school and then takes his own life.

The truly evil ones? Those who got the vaccine but are discouraging others from getting it. Their own actions show they know it is safe and life-saving. But they spread lies to make money off of people who don’t know better. These are mass murderers with no remorse.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> I don’t care why people get vaccinated. I posted a link where you could get free tickets to a MLB game if you get the vaccine. If that gets somebody there, who cares?
> 
> Most people thought a couple things that turned out differently.
> 
> 1) Herd immunity would happen at around 70%. The Delta variant turned out to be more transmissible, and it seems that herd immunity might need a higher number.
> 2) People would be glad to get vaccinated so they could get rid of their masks. Nope. Some areas said “if you’re vaccinated you can take off the masks” and people realized “you can’t tell if I’m vaccinated or not! I will take off my mask even though I didn’t get vaccinated.”
> 
> So, we are back to mask mandates because of people not getting vaccinated and the more contagious Delta variant.
> 
> I feel bad for some people who didn’t get vaccinated and then died. I will call them victims of disinformation. These are possible true believers of Trump. They loved operation Warp Speed, but when Trump didn’t get re-elected, suddenly they don’t want a vaccine anymore. Or maybe they are getting scared from lies on Facebook or some website.
> 
> The people I don’t feel bad for are those who died but also caused other deaths by spreading the disinformation. Right-wing radio hosts, etc. I feel bad for a guy who commits suicide alone. I do not feel bad for the suicidal terrorists on 9/11, or somebody who shoots up a school and then takes his own life.
> 
> The truly evil ones? Those who got the vaccine but are discouraging others from getting it. Their own actions show they know it is safe and life-saving. But they spread lies to make money off of people who don’t know better. These are mass murderers with no remorse.



I agree with most of this. 

To be clear though, we hoped that herd immunity would eradicate COVID. That ship has sailed. COVID is here to stay and it will most likely tame to a flu-like illness once everybody's exposed at least once. The only question is whether we sacrifice millions of lives unnecessarily in this process or not. 

What hits home about the r/HermanCainAward subreddit is the normal human response to impending death is what's usually shown as the last or the post before in these sequences. Most of us experience the same fear when we face our demise, it's part of the human condition. What's been shocking to me is how many nominally grown up humans still think they are invincible.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> I feel bad for some people who didn’t get vaccinated and then died. I will call them victims of disinformation. These are possible true believers of Trump. They loved operation Warp Speed, but when Trump didn’t get re-elected, suddenly they don’t want a vaccine anymore. Or maybe they are getting scared from lies on Facebook or some website.




Let me mention another reason people might not want the vaccine.  And you mentioned it - FB and the other socials.  In an effort to stop disinformation, they are also suppressing true experiences.  If you had an actual bad reaction to the vaccine and wanted to post about it on FB, your post would be deleted.  That is not disinformation if it is the actual truth (yes, it's hard to tell sometimes) but they will censor it anyway.  So some people are leery about getting it because they believe that some of the side effects are being hidden, and they are by the socials, mainly FB and Twitter.   

So in their effort to prevent disinformation, they are also scaring some people away from the vaccine.


----------



## Yoused

*F F S*​








						Telling People To Get Vaccinated Is Leftist Plot Against Trump Voters, Breitbart Claims
					

In an article published this month, writer John Nolte says Democrats are using "reverse psychology" to trick opponents into dying of COVID-19.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

When you get to the stage that it becomes time to blame the liberals for the anti vaxxers decisions



> Nolte: Howard Stern Proves Democrats Want Unvaccinated Trump Voters Dead
> 
> 
> Do you want to know why I think Howard Stern is going full-monster with his mockery of three fellow human beings who died of the coronavirus? Because leftists like Stern and CNNLOL and Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi and Anthony Fauci are deliberately looking to manipulate Trump supporters into not...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.breitbart.com





> Do you want to know why I think Howard Stern is going full-monster with his mockery of three fellow human beings who died of the coronavirus? Because leftists like Stern and CNNLOL and Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi and Anthony Fauci are deliberately looking to manipulate Trump supporters into not getting vaccinated.
> 
> Nothing else makes sense to me.
> 
> In a country where elections are decided on razor-thin margins, does it not benefit one side if their opponents simply drop dead?
> 
> If I wanted to use reverse psychology to convince people not to get a life-saving vaccination, I would do exactly what Stern and the left are doing… I would bully and taunt and mock and ridicule you for not getting vaccinated, knowing the human response would be, _Hey, fuck you, I’m never getting vaccinated!_




All the time, it was reverse psychology by the libs.

Ohhhhhh!

Are we forgetting when Geraldo wanted to call the vaccine "the Trump"?  Are we confessing out loud the belief that a portion of the American people is so stupid?

Is this why people trusted vaccines until it became a political thing, then it isn't to be trusted?  Science is a thing to be believed only if it supports our views?  Instead for some, the vaccine has to be declared from their preferred choice of political leader, before they will take it?








Yoused said:


> *F F S*​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Telling People To Get Vaccinated Is Leftist Plot Against Trump Voters, Breitbart Claims
> 
> 
> In an article published this month, writer John Nolte says Democrats are using "reverse psychology" to trick opponents into dying of COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com



_Was just typing this, and you beat me to it._


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Let me mention another reason people might not want the vaccine.  And you mentioned it - FB and the other socials.  In an effort to stop disinformation, they are also suppressing true experiences.  If you had an actual bad reaction to the vaccine and wanted to post about it on FB, your post would be deleted.  That is not disinformation if it is the actual truth (yes, it's hard to tell sometimes) but they will censor it anyway.  So some people are leery about getting it because they believe that some of the side effects are being hidden, and they are by the socials, mainly FB and Twitter.
> 
> So in their effort to prevent disinformation, they are also scaring some people away from the vaccine.



People can THINK this, but it‘s definitely not true. Again, anybody who believes what you said above is a victim of disinformation. I blame the peddlers of the disinformation.

Nobody is intentionally covering up true stories of issues people are having. Just look at the CDC site for proof that these stories are being recorded publicly. They are not being covered up by the government. It’s bull-.









						COVID-19 Vaccination
					

COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.




					www.cdc.gov
				




BS Facebook groups full of lies are shut down, and then far right nut jobs start claiming that they are covering things up. The whole thing is nonsense, and blaming Facebook instead of the people peddling the lies is a cop-out. And you wouldn’t even know about this unless you read about it on right-wing sites… which are the same ones selling vaccine lies.

So again, shame on the people fear-mongering that “Facebook is covering up millions of vaccine deaths.” But blaming Facebook when they shut down the groups run by these scam artists is what you think is the REAL problem? Just wow.


----------



## Huntn

Herdfan said:


> Sorry to let you down.  It was a combination of two things.  One, it was the quickest path to being mask free.  Second, my mom was 92, had a list of commodities longer than my arm and was going into an assisted living facility that required them to access the premises at any time (otherwise you had Sundays and certain holidays).  So I was not going to just put her in there and let them cut me off except when they decided it was OK.
> 
> As to whether or not I believe it works, sure as well as the flu vaccine does.  Better for some, not so great for others.    Right now it seems the betters are outpacing the not so greats.
> 
> And I may not have been clear, I don't recall anyone celebrating those who died after being vaccinated, but there certainly has been some for the unvaxxed that have died.  Yes, some of them did some stupid stuff, but celebrating someone's death for simply not getting vaccinated and paying the ultimate price is not something I will ever condone.




Vaccines have been proven effective for 200 years.
Vaccines are +100, vs taking your chances are 0-10.
Vaccines don’t keep you from getting sick, they just provide some benefit  from avoiding disfiguration, to permanent debilitation, to death and for the vast majority it keeps you out of a hospital on a ventilator, and or further permanent health complications, so give vaccines their due. Cheer for vaccines! Don’t slap them with political BS.
And don’t confuse distain with celebration, I’m the former with many of these right wing  libertay idiots, but not all, some people are just ignorant, gullible victims, I have some sympathy for them. Actually it’s a tragedy. The answer has been here all along yet some have chosen to play in traffic In the name of their political idol.

So you can have sympathy for them and their families, I don’t begrudge you, but in the end after so much resistance to the obvious answer, idiots shouting from the rooftops “COVID is a scam!”  to be followed by them whimpering on their death beds, I’ve run out of sympathy for STUPID. And they can be adults and accept responsibility for their actions, and I can mutter you win a Darwin Award.


----------



## Clix Pix

Herdfan said:


> I hate them.  I can't breath well with them on.  It is not about freedom or any of that BS.  Just like some guys like boxers over briefs because one isn't comfortable or some women don't like bras, masks are not comfortable to me.
> 
> I wore one when required, but will not again.  I will simply stay home.  Seeing too many politicians and celebs lecturing me (not me personally) about wearing them only to be caught not wearing them.  And someone always makes an excuse for them, just like at the Emmy's.  Follow the science they say, well the CDC (the science) says don't do what they did and all of a sudden the science doesn't matter because FoxNews did the report.




Well, aren't you just so _special_?!!!   You hate the mask.  Now that you've been vaccinated, you won't wear one.   News flash: You're not the only one for whom wearing a mask isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread.  Sure, it's not comfortable with regard to breathing, sure, it can fog up one's glasses, an annoyance, but somehow those who are responsible, thoughtful individuals wear the mask anyway.   For some people there's more to this, as well, including the very logistics of putting the darned thing on and keeping it in place, but those of us who do have issues with donning a mask have managed to deal with this, as it's important and can make a difference.    Sure, it's not easy to breathe in a mask, and it's annoying when my glasses fog up, but I'd much rather wear the mask for a short time when going to the grocery store or other places in public and be able to take it off when I'm back in my car or at home than to be struggling to breathe due to COVID-19 and then finding myself in the ICU with the announcement that I would need to be put on a ventilator (if I were even conscious and aware enough to know that this was being implemented)......


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> And I may not have been clear, I don't recall anyone celebrating those who died after being vaccinated, but there certainly has been some for the unvaxxed that have died.  Yes, some of them did some stupid stuff, but celebrating someone's death for simply not getting vaccinated and paying the ultimate price is not something I will ever condone.




Just to be clear, since I do like to ride that line.  I'm not celebrating the death of anyone.  But I will celebrate that they can no longer influence others with bad health advise.  If it took a death to shut their pie hole, that's sad, but the world is a better place without them spreading lies and misinformation.  I'm celebrating one less idiot with the power to influence others to do the wrong thing.  But just in case I ever come off as a cold jerk, I'd MUCH RATHER read stories about talk show hosts coming to their senses without the needless pain and suffering.  I'd prefer to read stories about these people using their platform to advocate for people doing the right thing.

I've just about run out of sympathy.  I'm tired of reading about people in the hospital having a change of heart.  But that's a far car from being happy about someone else's death.


----------



## SuperMatt

More about vaccine mandates/incentives. Lots of football fans are right-wing in their views, especially where I come from in WNY. However, mandates for vaccines can work.



> When the Erie County Department of Health and Buffalo Bills announced following Week 1 that every fan over the age of 11 in attendance at home games would need to be vaccinated, they offered season ticket holders the chance to get a refund for the season. Of the 58,000 to 60,000 season ticket holders, only 762 took up the offer according to Sal Capaccio of WGR 550. We don’t know the exact number of season tickets sold, but it’s about 1.3 percent.




That 98.7% of Bills season ticket holders are NOT all Biden fans. But they were wiling to get vaccinated so they could see their favorite team in person. I guess this could be seen as more of an incentive than a mandate since football games are not a necessity of life, but if people want something bad enough, they will get the shot.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440115948980035588/

Mr.  Rather, it's actually "FOR FUCK SAKE"!!!

You're welcome.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> More about vaccine mandates/incentives. Lots of football fans are right-wing in their views, especially where I come from in WNY. However, mandates for vaccines can work.
> 
> 
> 
> That 98.7% of Bills season ticket holders are NOT all Biden fans. But they were wiling to get vaccinated so they could see their favorite team in person. I guess this could be seen as more of an incentive than a mandate since football games are not a necessity of life, but if people want something bad enough, they will get the shot.



We need more of this! Want to go out and have fun? Get the damn vaccine. No? Well have fun staying home.


----------



## lizkat

Just in case anyone thinks it's only in the USA that Covid-Stupidity is a severe ailment:  In Australia, riots in Victoria have caused the construction industry to be shut down for two weeks,  to cool off over violent objections to vaccination mandates.









						Construction industry to be shut down for two weeks after clashes at CFMEU
					

The Andrews government will announce the closure of the building industry after a day of violent protests outside the Victorian headquarters of the CFMEU.




					www.smh.com.au
				






> Victoria’s building industry will be shut for two weeks after a day of unprecedented protests at the construction union’s head office, where windows were smashed, projectiles thrown at senior officials and riot police used rubber bullets to disperse the crowd.






> All projects in metropolitan Melbourne, City of Ballarat, City of Greater Geelong, Surf Coast Shire and Mitchell Shire will be shuttered, with limited exempts for workers to attend closed sites to respond emergencies or perform urgent and essential work to protect health and safety.
> 
> Industrial Relations Minister Tim Pallas said the decision had been driven by multiple outbreaks linked to the industry, as well as “widespread non-compliance” with COVID safety rules.
> 
> “We put the industry on notice just a week ago, we have seen appalling behaviour on site and on our streets, and now we’re acting decisively and without hesitation,” he said in a statement.






> Fluoro-clad protesters had earlier pelted the construction union office with plastic bottles, a plastic crate and smashed windows. The crowd included a mix of construction workers, far-right activists and people opposed to COVID-19 vaccines.
> 
> One flyer distributed to members said: “Our rights and conditions are under threat, there is a core group of members within union delegates and within members who believe this attack on our conditions and rights should not be allowed. We will no longer sit in the dark, this is our union, our city and we will take it back if need be.”
> 
> The protests at the union office quickly grew on Monday, with attacks on both the union leadership and the state government.
> 
> Members threatened to burn their union tickets and directed abuse at CFMEU Victorian secretary John Setka, who addressed the crowd, but was shouted down and called the “bitch” of Victorian Premier Daniel Andrews.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Just when you thought the dis / misinformation & stupidity couldn't get any worse, here come some of the purveyors who profit from dis / misinformation to say "hold my beer".

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440107078299815938/

Like anyone needed these lying assholes to crawl out of their sewer of embarrassment.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440129888292311041/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Meanwhile in New Zealand.









						Pair with trunk 'full of KFC' arrested while trying to enter locked-down Auckland, where restaurants remain shut
					

Two alleged gang associates found with a car trunk "full of KFC" takeout were arrested as they tried to enter New Zealand's largest city on Sunday in breach of strict coronavirus lockdown rules, according to police.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## DT

Herdfan said:


> Seeing too many politicians and celebs lecturing me (not me personally) about wearing them only to be caught not wearing them.  And someone always makes an excuse for them, just like at the Emmy's.




That's outstanding reasoning for not wearing a mask, that's akin to a "_Billy doesn't have to eat his broccoli_" excuse you'd hear from a 5 year old.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440115948980035588/
> 
> Mr.  Rather, it's actually "FOR FUCK SAKE"!!!
> 
> You're welcome.



Reminds me of this.







DT said:


> That's outstanding reasoning for not wearing a mask, that's akin to a "_Billy doesn't have to eat his broccoli_" excuse you'd hear from a 5 year old.



@Herdfan doesn't like masks. It is known.
He tells us at least once a month. It is known.
His excuses change q2months. It is known.
He's a hero for surviving this medical procedure that he doesn't like. It is known. 
He's even a bigger hero for sticking it to the Man for not doing stuff that requires his facediaper. It is known. 
He has heavy confirmation bias. It is known.
He'll let us know about it. It is known.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Just when you thought the dis / misinformation & stupidity couldn't get any worse, here come some of the purveyors who profit from dis / misinformation to say "hold my beer".
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440107078299815938/
> 
> Like anyone needed these lying assholes to crawl out of their sewer of embarrassment.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440129888292311041/



Why aren’t the pharma companies pounding people like this with lawsuits?


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> Reminds me of this.



I *respectfully* disagree.

While I do appreciate the origin of the phrase, my own reasoning is simple.

FUCK is not an individual or even a thing when I normally use it.  So if I am "thinking" about it & not blurting it out loud I go with for "FUCK" sake.  Mind you, when I am blurting out that phrase in disgust I acknowledge I have gone with "Fuck's" version.  I prefer the former version myself for me though.

I am also a big fan of calling any epic bullshit "Fuckery", even if it is not considered a word.  I don't care.

Case in point:  Project Veritas = Fuckery.

This IS Fuckery:


> This Doctor Spread False Information About COVID. She Still Kept Her Medical License
> 
> 
> Simone Gold isn't alone. NPR found other physicians who retained their licenses despite spreading misinformation online and to the media about effective COVID-19 vaccines and unproven treatments.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org





> Last month, Dr. Simone Gold stood before a crowd at a conservative church in Thousand Oaks, Calif., and delivered a talk riddled with misinformation. She told people to avoid vaccination against the coronavirus. As an alternative, she pushed drugs that have not been proven effective at treating COVID-19 — drugs that she also offered to prescribe to the audience in exchange for $90 telehealth appointments.
> 
> "Don't text me when you've gotten a positive test; I don't want to hear it," she said to the gathering. "I've told you ahead of time to get the medicines. It can take a week because we're so swamped."
> 
> Almost everything Gold said in her 45-minute talk was contrary to the best science and medical standards of care for treating COVID-19. But there was one thing she said that was at least partially true: "I am an emergency physician."
> 
> NPR found that Gold's emergency medicine certification lapsed in December of last year, but she still is, as she claims, a licensed physician in the state of California (her license lists her professional address as a UPS shipping store in Beverly Hills).




Lastly, I am glad I could have this discussion, whereas the old place it wouldn't be allowed.  I thank you for your time.  Stay safe.






Don't come @ me!  Fuck is my favorite word in the English language.  I ain't having it, for 'F' sake.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Proving once again Memes wont save you from covid.​'Unmasked, unmuzzled, unvaccinated' mother-of-four dies of COVID​A California mother-of-four who was outspoken against vaccines and masks has died of COVID-19.

Kristen Lowery, 40, from Escalon, California, 'unexpectedly' passed away on September 15th, according to a GoFundMe page raising money for her funeral expenses.

In screenshots taken from Facebook, family members say she lost her battle against COVID-19 — after frequently posting content protesting vaccines and labeling herself 'unmasked and unmuzzled' and a 'free thinker.'





__





						'Unmasked, unmuzzled, unvaccinated' mother-of-four dies of COVID
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## Alli

fooferdoggie said:


> Kristen Lowery, 40, from Escalon, California, 'unexpectedly' passed away on September 15th, according to a GoFundMe page raising money for her funeral expenses.
> 
> In screenshots taken from Facebook, family members say she lost her battle against COVID-19 — after frequently posting content protesting vaccines and labeling herself 'unmasked and unmuzzled' and a 'free thinker.'



Thoughts and prayers.

The vaccine cost nothing. Funeral expenses, a little more.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Proving once again Memes wont save you from covid.​'Unmasked, unmuzzled, unvaccinated' mother-of-four dies of COVID​A California mother-of-four who was outspoken against vaccines and masks has died of COVID-19.
> 
> Kristen Lowery, 40, from Escalon, California, 'unexpectedly' passed away on September 15th, according to a GoFundMe page raising money for her funeral expenses.
> 
> In screenshots taken from Facebook, family members say she lost her battle against COVID-19 — after frequently posting content protesting vaccines and labeling herself 'unmasked and unmuzzled' and a 'free thinker.'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'Unmasked, unmuzzled, unvaccinated' mother-of-four dies of COVID
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com



Imagine if Fox did these stories all day instead of spreading lies. The viewers might actually go get vaccinated.


----------



## lizkat

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Meanwhile in New Zealand.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pair with trunk 'full of KFC' arrested while trying to enter locked-down Auckland, where restaurants remain shut
> 
> 
> Two alleged gang associates found with a car trunk "full of KFC" takeout were arrested as they tried to enter New Zealand's largest city on Sunday in breach of strict coronavirus lockdown rules, according to police.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com




And with $100k NZ dollars and "empty ounce bags" also on board, do we think the police remark that (past the penalty for the covid rules breach),  "further charges are likely" will just be limited to the fast food haul? 

I get the food gig though.  Heh, parceling out a whole lot of whatever that kind of money can buy into "ounce bags" is likely tedious and some fast food in a locked down city seems like a pretty nice perk for whoever the workers were going to be.

"Best laid plans" department meets Murphy's law.  Wonder if the cops got to eat the KFC evidence.  Shame to waste it!


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

lizkat said:


> And with $100k NZ dollars and "empty ounce bags" also on board, do we think the police remark that (past the penalty for the covid rules breach),  "further charges are likely" will just be limited to the fast food haul?
> 
> I get the food gig though.  Heh, parceling out a whole lot of whatever that kind of money can buy into "ounce bags" is likely tedious and some fast food in a locked down city seems like a pretty nice perk for whoever the workers were going to be.
> 
> "Best laid plans" department meets Murphy's law.  Wonder if the cops got to eat the KFC evidence.  Shame to waste it!




This also reminded me of Jim Jefferies bit on US gun control – When Australia had its largest mass shooting the government went “That’s it! No more guns!” and the country collectively went “Alright then. That seems about fair.” In the US when there is a mass shooting the government goes “Maybe we should think about more restrictions, maybe.” and half the country goes “Fuck you! You aren’t taking away my guns.!”

New Zealand had 1 covid case and the government went “That’s it! We’re locking everything down!” and the country went “Alright then. Fair enough.” In the US when hundreds of thousands of people have died from covid the government went “You should wear masks and get vaccinated” and half the country went “Fuck you! You aren’t taking away my freedom!”


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> I hate them.  I can't breath well with them on.  It is not about freedom or any of that BS.  Just like some guys like boxers over briefs because one isn't comfortable or some women don't like bras, masks are not comfortable to me.
> 
> I wore one when required, but will not again.  I will simply stay home.  Seeing too many politicians and celebs lecturing me (not me personally) about wearing them only to be caught not wearing them.  And someone always makes an excuse for them, just like at the Emmy's.  Follow the science they say, well the CDC (the science) says don't do what they did and all of a sudden the science doesn't matter because FoxNews did the report.




I commend you for getting vaccinated, avoiding going out in crowds, and wearing a mask when a business requires it.  I'm lucky enough to live where almost everybody is on the same page.  I haven't seen or heard about any confrontations, although I'm sure it has probably happened.  

Eventually the mask mandates will go away and then we'll just watch the unvaccinated die off as they somehow feel safer just because the mask mandates were lifted.  They won't be lifted because it's substantially safer but because at some point we can't let these people hold everybody else back.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Seeing too many politicians and celebs lecturing me (not me personally) about wearing them only to be caught not wearing them. And someone always makes an excuse for them, just like at the Emmy's. Follow the science they say, well the CDC (the science) says don't do what they did and all of a sudden the science doesn't matter because FoxNews did the report.




Here's what the health department had to say.



> In a statement Monday, the county Department of Public Health insisted that while current rules require mask-wearing indoors regardless of vaccination status, exemptions are provided for film, television and music productions.
> 
> "The Emmy Award show is a television production, and persons appearing on the show are considered performers," according to the agency. "All persons appearing on or in the audience of the Emmy Award show were fully vaccinated against COVID-19. Also, Public Health was informed that each of these persons had a verified negative PCR test prior to the show. In addition, production crew, pursuant to Cal-OSHA requirements, were required to be fully vaccinated or are testing, either PCR or antigen, twice per week."
> ​According to the statement, officials with the Television Academy reached out to the health department in advance to review safety protocols, "which exceeded the baseline requirements for television and film productions."
> 
> "Public Health will continue to review the protocols of future large television production events and prescribe additional safety modifications to mitigate the risk of COVID-19 transmission," according to the agency.




Fox allows their anchors and guests to be on TV unmasked, because they track vaccination status and administer COVID tests to unvaccinated employees. No complaints from the right. Same thing happens at the Emmys, and the right-wingers get all up in their feelings.


----------



## Eric

Thanks, Libs!


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/psjftk


----------



## Edd

Eric said:


> Thanks, Libs!
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/psjftk



Gee, we didn’t even know we were trying to make them not vaccinate. Hard to believe this is even real.


----------



## lizkat

Edd said:


> Gee, we didn’t even know we were trying to make them not vaccinate. Hard to believe this is even real.




Hah, Trump's point was always to devalue even the effort of sorting out questions of truth or reality, so his followers would just look to him to guide them through the chaos of disinformation that he himself stirred up all the while.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Eric said:


> Thanks, Libs!
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/psjftk




Dammit, you figured it out!!!  You should tell everyone you know what's "really" going on.  Spread it far and wide.  Make sure everyone knows how badly they've been tricked.  Please.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> Thanks, Libs!
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/psjftk




This seems to be a theme on the right. “So you _think_ I’m dumb?!?  I will now prove I am!  Take that!”

“I’m tired of lying politicians!  I will now worship an even bigger liar.  Whose the dumb one now!?!”


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

An Idaho nurse who told her family not to get vaccinated even as her mother was in a coma from COVID-19 has died of the disease
					

The nurse's brother told CNN that his sister didn't think there had been studies conducted on COVID-19 vaccines.




					www.insider.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> An Idaho nurse who told her family not to get vaccinated even as her mother was in a coma from COVID-19 has died of the disease
> 
> 
> The nurse's brother told CNN that his sister didn't think there had been studies conducted on COVID-19 vaccines.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.insider.com



man she took out two people with her crap. amazing I guess losing her relative was not a big deal. some people are not smart enough to access the internet.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> man she took out two people with her crap. amazing I guess losing her relative was not a big deal. some people are not smart enough to access the internet.



It seems like accessing the Internet was the problem. Some people only look at Facebook, which could be full of disinformation. Zuckerberg doesn’t give a  if people die - as long as he keeps getting profits. The lie-peddlers only care about clicks and ad impressions. It’s quite possible to use the internet and never read a single thing that is true.



> Daryl Rise told the news outlet that his sister didn't think there had been studies conducted on the vaccines. She told her family not to get vaccinated, he said, even as her mother was lying in a coma.
> 
> "I think it was from misinformation, I think it was falling into negative social media and bloggers, YouTubers," Rise told CNN.



I really don’t get the thinking…



> Daryl Rise said he got vaccinated the day after his sister died. He said his mother, who is recovering, is still undecided about the vaccine.





> "It was the hardest decision of my life, you know, am I doing right by God? Am I doing right by Natalie?" he told CNN. "And I got it out of fear."



Why was it the hardest decision of your life? There is something horribly wrong with the thought processes of that entire family. Based on the vaccination rates I’m seeing from Idaho, a majority of people there are equally messed-up in their thinking.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> Why was it the hardest decision of your life? There is something horribly wrong with the thought processes of that entire family. Based on the vaccination rates I’m seeing from Idaho, a majority of people there are equally messed-up in their thinking.



I know its really bad. America the land of the stupid anymore. FreeDumb is king.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> It seems like accessing the Internet was the problem. Some people only look at Facebook, which could be full of disinformation. Zuckerberg doesn’t give a  if people die - as long as he keeps getting profits. The lie-peddlers only care about clicks and ad impressions. It’s quite possible to use the internet and never read a single thing that is true.
> 
> 
> I really don’t get the thinking…
> 
> 
> 
> Why was it the hardest decision of your life? There is something horribly wrong with the thought processes of that entire family. Based on the vaccination rates I’m seeing from Idaho, a majority of people there are equally messed-up in their thinking.




I also wonder how hard it is to get out of the disinformation matrix, sincerely wonder. Think of how many times you watched something on YouTube on a topic a couple times and then you are blasted with recommendations for similar content for the next month. I imagine things like Facebook and Twitter are even worse.

There really should be a tool or service that wipes your interest history and maybe also something that will point you to better or more positive information.


----------



## MEJHarrison

SuperMatt said:


> It’s quite possible to use the internet and never read a single thing that is true.




If that's true, then that's a lie too.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Tennessee limiting monoclonal antibody treatment to unvaccinated residents
					

"Clinically, it makes sense," a top Tennessee health official said.




					www.nbcnews.com
				




A lot to unpack here, possibly even deserves its own thread.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Tennessee limiting monoclonal antibody treatment to unvaccinated residents
> 
> 
> "Clinically, it makes sense," a top Tennessee health official said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A lot to unpack here, possibly even deserves its own thread.



There is a special place in hell for the Republicans who are actively preventing mask and vaccine mandates. They are killing people. And they are doing it for personal gain. Shame on them, and as they said after 9/11 - never forget.


----------



## User.45

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Tennessee limiting monoclonal antibody treatment to unvaccinated residents
> 
> 
> "Clinically, it makes sense," a top Tennessee health official said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A lot to unpack here, possibly even deserves its own thread.



Truth be told probably they get the best bang for the buck in that group, but not necessary fair either.


----------



## JayMysteri0

What the F'N 'F' 'F'?!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440405175018029056/

GET OUT OF YOUR FEELINGS AND LOOK AT YOURSELVES!!!


----------



## Clix Pix

_The Washington Post _headlined an article:    _ "Unvaccinated should get priority for monoclonal antibodies treatment, some officials say"_

My instant reaction to this is "_no way_!!!"   If someone is idiotic and stupid enough to not get the freely available vaccine which could protect them from this virus, then IMHO  they sure do not deserve any special consideration when it comes to medical care.   Why should they be prioritized for administration of monoclonal antibodies or any other potential treatment which may come along?   They've already blown their opportunities for staying COVID-free and healthy.   They've refused the vaccine.   So, fine, let them deal with the consequences, whether it's a mild case of COVID-19, a serious case leaving them gasping for breath in the ICU and a ventilator on the horizon in the treatment plan with no guarantee of this saving their lives, or if they do manage to seemingly recover,  yet find themselves still struggling with symptoms and serious long-term effects which may be with them for the rest of their lives (i.e., "long COVID"), well, too bad, too sad.    Whatever happens to someone who deliberately chooses to not be vaccinated, to not wear a mask, to scream about his or her "rights", is hmmm.......going to take its course, then, isn't it? 

IMHO priority for monoclonal antibodies treatment should be reserved for those who have been vaccinated and who still developed COVID-19 anyway and/or those who were unable to be vaccinated due to pre-existing medical conditions which contraindicated administration of the vaccine.


----------



## Runs For Fun

File this under “no shit”

https://theconversation.com/nicki-m...of-celebrity-misinformation-and-fandom-168242

I have to wonder though who are these idiots listening to medical advice from celebrities? WTF?


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

'Unmasked and unafraid': Proud anti-vaxxer dies of Covid
					

A mother of four has died from Covid compilations after refusing to get vaccinated. Read more here.




					au.news.yahoo.com
				




So many of the quotes in these stories are full of irony and denial.


----------



## JayMysteri0

An update on Seth Rogen & his comments at the Emmy awards



> Emmys producers weren't happy with Seth Rogen's COVID comments
> 
> 
> The actor remarked how unsafe the Emmys venue felt while the Delta variant gains speed in the U.S.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.avclub.com





> Producer Ian Stewart told _Variety_ that the crew had “worked for months and months to make that a safe space.” He added, “We’ve worked with all the health authorities. We were signed off by LA County, we came up with a plan with them. Those tables were distanced. Everyone was vaccinated. Everyone was negative tested in that audience. And also he had rehearsed. So he knew exactly what it was. So, I just felt it was an unfortunate misdirect from him. Because it wasn’t just our decision. This is the health authorities’ decision as well, to say that it’s a completely safe environment if you do all those things.”
> 
> Stewart—who had even more to say about the Rogen situation—noted that “many discussions to get [health protocols] right feel a little bit wasted” and said that after Rogen went off script, producers had to “play catch up” so the audience wouldn’t think it was unsafe and unethical to be there. “We work in this industry, we’re desperately aware of COVID. I’ve done 50 productions nearly in COVID and not have people get sick. So, it’s deeply frustrating,” Stewart said.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> An update on Seth Rogen & his comments at the Emmy awards



Has Seth apologized? He also mispronounced the name of the winner of the award he presented. He seems like he just doesn’t give a  about anybody or anything. Then he pretends to care about COVID-19 but didn’t check any facts before he started spouting.

Most celebrity actors don’t know much about anything but acting. Same for pop stars and reality stars. Voting for them as world leaders or taking health advice from them seems stupid to me. But for many, celebrity = credibility.


----------



## Yoused

Disturbing AP story about the extent to which anti-health-regulations rules and laws are being passed in _a lot_ of states.
*… Lori Tremmel Freeman, head of the National Association of County and City Health Officials … said her city and county health officials’ group has meager influence and resources, especially in comparison with (ALEC) …
The new laws are meant to reduce the power of governors and restore the balance of power between states’ executive branches and legislatures, said Jonathon Hauenschild, director of the ALEC task force on communications and technology. “Governors are elected, but they were delegating a lot of authority to the public health official, often that they had appointed …”*​
_Darn, governors are appointing people and then letting them do their jobs! It is a _travesty_ I tells ya, _a travesty_!_

Fuck ALEC, goddamn nihilist bastards, fuck them all, up the dark place, sideways, with three porcupines and a cobra.


----------



## Thomas Veil

I loathe ALEC with a passion.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> But for many, celebrity = credibility.




Trump was a D level celebrity now trusted and worshipped by D level voters.  

That was smug!


----------



## Yoused

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Trump was a D level celebrity now trusted and worshipped by D level voters.




F

("D" sounds too much like "Democrat")


----------



## SuperMatt

A great take on "do your research" - Great Scientists of the 21st Century!









						Great Scientists of the 21st Century | Boing Boing
					

Visit the post for more.




					boingboing.net


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> A great take on "do your research" - Great Scientists of the 21st Century!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Great Scientists of the 21st Century | Boing Boing
> 
> 
> Visit the post for more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> boingboing.net
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 8838



Thanks, this perfectly captured the tragicomedy of this school of thought.


----------



## Yoused

I suspect they are trying to inundate and suffocate us in ever growing heaps of erratic, increasingly _whaaaa???_ perilous goofiness.









						DANGER! Don’t Nebulize Hydrogen Peroxide and Breathe It to Try to Treat or Prevent COVID-19
					

A concerning and dangerous trend is circulating on social media channels like Facebook, Twitter, and TikTok. People are breathing in hydrogen peroxide through nebulizers to try to prevent or treat COVID-19. DO NOT put hydrogen peroxide into your nebulizer and breathe it in. This is dangerous! It...




					community.aafa.org
				




And, of course, deranged, psychotic CTs: Michael Flynn believes "they" are plotting to put the vaccine into salad dressing. (I mean, do MAGAts even eat any non-meat foods? BBQ sauce would make more sense.)


----------



## Edd

Runs For Fun said:


> I suspect they are trying to inundate and suffocate us in ever growing heaps of erratic, increasingly _whaaaa???_ perilous goofiness.





Yoused said:


> DANGER! Don’t Nebulize Hydrogen Peroxide and Breathe It to Try to Treat or Prevent COVID-19
> 
> 
> A concerning and dangerous trend is circulating on social media channels like Facebook, Twitter, and TikTok. People are breathing in hydrogen peroxide through nebulizers to try to prevent or treat COVID-19. DO NOT put hydrogen peroxide into your nebulizer and breathe it in. This is dangerous! It...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> community.aafa.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And, of course, deranged, psychotic CTs: Michael Flynn believes "they" are plotting to put the vaccine into salad dressing. (I mean, do MAGAts even eat any non-meat foods? BBQ sauce would make more sense.)



Wasn’t this Trump’s “flood the zone” tactic often cited when he was in office? I’ve wondered if that was really a thing, since he’s so incompetent. I’d guess “mainstream” media just misses the clicks and posts all RW zany thoughts.

Edit: Eh fuck, a previous quote from RunsForFun got mixed in with the other and I can’t get rid of it. This software can be brutally annoying.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Yoused said:


> I suspect they are trying to inundate and suffocate us in ever growing heaps of erratic, increasingly _whaaaa???_ perilous goofiness.



I'm tellin' ya...only a matter of time before they start spraying WD40 up their noses.



Yoused said:


> And, of course, deranged, psychotic CTs: Michael Flynn believes "they" are plotting to put the vaccine into salad dressing. (I mean, do MAGAts even eat any non-meat foods? BBQ sauce would make more sense.)




True. I doubt they eat many leafy greens.

But sure, you laugh. Have you taken a good look at your salad dressing lately?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Yoused said:


> I suspect they are trying to inundate and suffocate us in ever growing heaps of erratic, increasingly _whaaaa???_ perilous goofiness.




Creating confusion to the point of exhaustion is straight out of the fascists playbook.  People will cling on to anybody who claims they can make it stop.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440756102581264385/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Meanwhile back in the world that logic forgot

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440889687158231048/

Yes, those other vaccines he already took with no issue because it was required were alright, but THIS one...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440859050548203526/

FFS


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Meanwhile back in the world that logic forgot
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440889687158231048/
> 
> Yes, those other vaccines he already took with no issue because it was required were alright, but THIS one...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1440859050548203526/
> 
> FFS



Jokes aside, military has to be fully vaccinated for everything possible because of national security.
These are the same people who were so eager to consider COVID an act of bioterrorism,
yet they manage to push back against eliminating that very threat with the same ferocity.

Which takes us back to the territory of COVID stupid.


----------



## fooferdoggie

[Murica] Giving out leftover vaccine doses to eligible recipients in Texas after checking with your supervisor? That's a firing and a referral to the grand jury, foreign sounding doctor guy
Gokal was told by HCPH Human Resources that he "did not 'equitably' distribute the vaccine and that Dr. Gokal gave the vaccine to too many individuals with 'Indian' sounding names," the lawsuit says. 

Texas doctor fired for using leftover Covid-19 vaccine doses sues county for discrimination​








						Texas doctor fired for using leftover Covid-19 vaccine doses sues county for discrimination
					

A Texas public health doctor fired earlier this year for using leftover doses of Covid-19 vaccine on eligible individuals is suing Harris County for $1 million, saying he was fired for giving "the vaccine to too many individuals with 'Indian' sounding names."




					www.cnn.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

so a lets hire someone that doesn't to believe in medicine and wanted to use heard immunity. what could possibly go wrong?
 New surgeon general announces that Covid-19 will always have a home in Fark's favorite state
Florida’s new surgeon general skeptical of vaccines, opposes masks​








						Florida’s new surgeon general skeptical of vaccines, opposes masks
					

Ladapo signed the Great Barrington Declaration and suggests embracing "the reality of viral spread."




					arstechnica.com


----------



## User.45

fooferdoggie said:


> so a lets hire someone that doesn't to believe in medicine and wanted to use heard immunity. what could possibly go wrong?
> New surgeon general announces that Covid-19 will always have a home in Fark's favorite state
> Florida’s new surgeon general skeptical of vaccines, opposes masks​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Florida’s new surgeon general skeptical of vaccines, opposes masks
> 
> 
> Ladapo signed the Great Barrington Declaration and suggests embracing "the reality of viral spread."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> arstechnica.com



I'm baffled about the hills these folks decided to die on. 

Ironically, soda taxes and interventionalist policies are quantifiably better at fighting obesity. So the issue with this, "we'll promote health and weight loss" is that they aren't actually going to do that very well either.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> Jokes aside, military has to be fully vaccinated for everything possible because of national security.
> These are the same people who were so eager to consider COVID an act of bioterrorism,
> yet they manage to push back against eliminating that very threat with the same ferocity.
> 
> Which takes us back to the territory of COVID stupid.



This "officer" already dropped his retirement papers. He is angling for a career in politics when he gets out. They should give him a reduction in rank to E-1 for insubordination on his way out the door.

"Selfless Service" is one of the key Army Values they preach constantly. This "officer" is extremely selfish.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Mississippi Governor Tate Reeves.

"I'm often asked by some of my friends on the other side of the aisle about Covid… and why does it seem like folks in Mississippi and maybe in the Mid-South are a little less scared, shall we say," the conservative added. "When you believe in eternal life — when you believe that living on this earth is but a blip on the screen God's plan for you on earth actually sucks, then you don't have to be so scared of things."

Felt I needed to make a correction there to make it more honest.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Mississippi Governor Tate Reeves.
> 
> "I'm often asked by some of my friends on the other side of the aisle about Covid… and why does it seem like folks in Mississippi and maybe in the Mid-South are a little less scared, shall we say," the conservative added. "When you believe in eternal life — when you believe that living on this earth is but a blip on the screen God's plan for you on earth actually sucks, then you don't have to be so scared of things."
> 
> Felt I needed to make a correction there to make it more honest.



Christianity is generally NOT associated with this type of belief. People don’t get converted and then immediately jump off a bridge to get their souls into heaven. Many churches have fitness programs for their congregants.

Christianity doesn’t encourage people to play in traffic, or take part in other high-risk behaviors. It is stunning to see Tater Tot’s misinterpretation of a religion that he believes everybody in his state adheres to.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Mississippi Governor Tate Reeves.
> 
> "I'm often asked by some of my friends on the other side of the aisle about Covid… and why does it seem like folks in Mississippi and maybe in the Mid-South are a little less scared, shall we say," the conservative added. "When you believe in eternal life — when you believe that living on this earth is but a blip on the screen God's plan for you on earth actually sucks, then you don't have to be so scared of things."
> 
> Felt I needed to make a correction there to make it more honest.



Tate Reeves is an absolute imbecile. Recently cornered by CNN and presented with the fact that his state has *the world's highest per capita covid death rate (except for Peru)*, he fum-fuhed something about "lagging indicators". 

It's so nice that he's not only ready to meet God, but ready to take the rest of his state with him.   









						Tate Reeves and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad CNN interview
					

Pressed on state's soaring pandemic deaths, Gov. Tate Reeves pivoted to politics, referring to dead Mississippians as "lagging indicators."




					mississippitoday.org


----------



## MEJHarrison

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Mississippi Governor Tate Reeves.
> 
> "I'm often asked by some of my friends on the other side of the aisle about Covid… and why does it seem like folks in Mississippi and maybe in the Mid-South are a little less scared, shall we say," the conservative added. "When you believe in eternal life — when you believe that living on this earth is but a blip on the screen God's plan for you on earth actually sucks, then you don't have to be so scared of things."
> 
> Felt I needed to make a correction there to make it more honest.




I want to tell people like that to just strip naked and lay on the ground.  If God wants them to live, they'll be protected from the elements and receive manna from heaven.

"God has a plan for my life" is a convenient excuse to bring out when they don't want to do something.  They take other means to prolong their lives without even thinking about it.  Until they don't want to, then "God has a plan".

I don't care if you believe in God or you don't.  Just be consistent in your beliefs.  That's all I ask.  If you won't protect yourself from a deadly disease because God will protect you, but take shelter from a tornado because you don't have faith that God will protect you, then perhaps it's time to give that some deeper thought and see if it leads anywhere.  That's all I'm saying.


----------



## User.45

MEJHarrison said:


> I want to tell people like that to just strip naked and lay on the ground.  If God wants them to live, they'll be protected from the elements and receive manna from heaven.
> 
> "God has a plan for my life" is a convenient excuse to bring out when they don't want to do something.  They take other means to prolong their lives without even thinking about it.  Until they don't want to, then "God has a plan".
> 
> I don't care if you believe in God or you don't.  Just be consistent in your beliefs.  That's all I ask.  If you won't protect yourself from a deadly disease because God will protect you, but take shelter from a tornado because you don't have faith that God will protect you, then perhaps it's time to give that some deeper thought and see if it leads anywhere.  That's all I'm saying.



Dunno but I grew up with the Christian saying/principle that addresses this stupid shit circulating here: "help yourself and so will God". 
The overlapping sentiment of world religions is preventing mass death in your believers (at least compared to competing religions), otherwise they would have died out or overgrown by more "sane" movements. These people are giving Christianity a bad rep. But are we surprised? We are the country of pro-life gun enthusiasts advocating for death penalties.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## Yoused




----------



## JayMysteri0

Just a reminder of who's out there amongst you

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441145597717741577/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Just a reminder...



> Ivermectin Research Has a Big Fraud Problem, Scientists Say
> 
> 
> Numerous studies suggesting ivermectin can treat or prevent covid-19 have dodgy data behind them, according to an international group of researchers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com





> Watchdog scientists are sounding the alarm over covid-19 studies involving ivermectin, a long-used antiparasitic that some claim can be effective at treating or preventing the viral illness. In a new article this week, they argue that the research into ivermectin has been plagued by widespread fraud and lax oversight by other researchers. The best way to prevent similar issues moving forward, they say, is to impose stricter standards in general on how data is collected and re-analyzed by scientists conducting reviews of the evidence.
> 
> Ivermectin has emerged as an unexpected cultural totem of the pandemic. Some people, who often also distrust vaccines or have downplayed the pandemic, believe that ivermectin is a highly effective covid-19 drug that has been kept away from the public at the behest of Big Pharma. Many people have been rightly skeptical of these claims, though some have been fooled by reports claiming that overdoses of ivermectin have overwhelmed emergency rooms or that it’s causing a mass epidemic of infertility in users.
> 
> In truth, ivermectin is an immensely valuable drug that’s very safe and effective when taken as an antiparasitic. But despite some early studies in animals or in the lab suggesting that it could also help kill the coronavirus, the bulk of the evidence does not point to a major benefit from the drug for actual covid-19 patients, at least to date. The largest and seemingly highest-quality studies have found no real effect on mortality or prevention of infection. Meanwhile, the findings of some studies that seemed to show a tremendous effect have since been thrown into question.





> In a new article published this week in Nature Medicine, scientists from the UK, Australia, Sweden, and the U.S. highlight two of these suspect studies that they’ve brought attention to in the past: a purported clinical trial in Egypt that has now been pulled from the preprint server where it was released amid allegations of plagiarism and suspect data, and another in Iran that found a benefit in reducing mortality among hospitalized patients. The Iran study may have failed to properly randomize participants to the treatment and control groups, an important step for obtaining valid results, the authors say.




There's always HCQ...

We still do that right?


----------



## JayMysteri0

By now I'm sure a few of you have already seen this






"If you had to choose?"


----------



## fooferdoggie

Canada is losing it.
Man punches nurse in the face multiple times after his wife is vaccinated for Covid​








						Man punches nurse in the face multiple times after his wife is vaccinated for Covid | CNN
					

Police are looking for a man in Canada they say punched a nurse in the face multiple times, knocking her to the ground after she administered a Covid-19 vaccine to his wife without his permission.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## Eric

Not going to celebrate this but JFC 

Kathy was anti-vax. Some of her friends tried to save her, some pushed her towards death. Covid kills in many ways, fast and slow. It took her very quickly. Get vaccinated.


			https://www.reddit.com/gallery/pugz5o


----------



## Runs For Fun

Eric said:


> Not going to celebrate this but JFC
> 
> Kathy was anti-vax. Some of her friends tried to save her, some pushed her towards death. Covid kills in many ways, fast and slow. It took her very quickly. Get vaccinated.
> 
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/gallery/pugz5o



I've been following that subreddit for a while. I certainly don't celebrate anyone's death, but those posts just leave me shaking my head. So many easily preventable deaths. How the hell did we get here where people have politicized a vaccine and made it their entire identity to the point where they're dying because of their own stupidity.


----------



## Eric

Runs For Fun said:


> I've been following that subreddit for a while. I certainly don't celebrate anyone's death, but those posts just leave me shaking my head. So many easily preventable deaths. How the hell did we get here where people have politicized a vaccine and made it their entire identity to the point where they're dying because of their own stupidity.



You see, Liberals used trickery...









						Breitbart Writer Claims ‘Organized Left’ Uses ‘Reverse Psychology’ to ‘Trick’ People Into Refusing ‘Trump Vaccine’
					

Breitbart's John Nolte is a right-wing media figure who wants to see his readers vaccinated




					www.thewrap.com


----------



## lizkat

lizkat said:


> Just in case anyone thinks it's only in the USA that Covid-Stupidity is a severe ailment:  In Australia, riots in Victoria have caused the construction industry to be shut down for two weeks,  to cool off over violent objections to vaccination mandates.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Construction industry to be shut down for two weeks after clashes at CFMEU
> 
> 
> The Andrews government will announce the closure of the building industry after a day of violent protests outside the Victorian headquarters of the CFMEU.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.smh.com.au




As a followup to my earlier post -- Murphy's Law seems to have spotted the opportunity afforded it by the riots-caused shutdown of construction in Victoria.    Two days later a 5.9 earthquake rumbled through the area causing assorted (mostly minor) structural damage.    But ol' Murphy was foiled since lawmakers had built in a few exceptions to the shutdown, including unforeseen need for emergency structural repairs.  Good thing too,  since there were six aftershocks to that quake even that same day, with more expected in the near term.









						‘Chance of significant aftershocks’: Victoria hit by earthquake, warnings of more to come
					

Buildings shook across Victoria on Wednesday morning just after 9am, with residents from metropolitan Melbourne to Geelong to Gippsland reporting violent shaking, but the SES says no injuries have been reported.




					www.smh.com.au
				




 Meanwhile protests continued in Melbourne  against Victoria's  two-week shutdown of construction, mandated due to industry members' high noncompliance with covid-mitigating measures.  The state police further intervened by restricting low-altitude airspace use and so temporarily enjoining news helicopter coverage of the disturbances.

However that all works out, Australian health services remain stressed by spikes of illness in the pandemic, to the point that thousands of retired health professionals are now being asked to rejoin service.


----------



## Runs For Fun

These people are murderers.

'Vigilante treatments': Anti-vaccine groups push people to leave ICUs








						'Vigilante treatments': Anti-vaccine groups push people to leave ICUs
					

As the anti-vaccine movement escalates its rhetoric, doctors warn that they're dealing with the fallout: "They’re starting to target people, the messengers — nurses and doctors."




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## lizkat

Runs For Fun said:


> These people are murderers.
> 
> 'Vigilante treatments': Anti-vaccine groups push people to leave ICUs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'Vigilante treatments': Anti-vaccine groups push people to leave ICUs
> 
> 
> As the anti-vaccine movement escalates its rhetoric, doctors warn that they're dealing with the fallout: "They’re starting to target people, the messengers — nurses and doctors."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcnews.com




Whoever underwrites this incitement to cozy up to disease and death -- apparently by way of infiltrating the GOP's already partisan take on public health--  is not actually a friend of the USA, even if waving an American flag over whatever their latest hot tip for a homebrew covid cure is.

 One begins to wonder who past the ignorant are involved in these dangerous scenarios.  Sure for some pranksters it's probably been just another social media lark  --look ma, got a hundred thousand likes on that one!--  and for some a sincere if midguided belief,  but at this point it seems to me that provocateurs who are not just run-of-mill partisan hacks have probably realized there's gold in them thar hills... the rebellious hills where it's all about stirring pots against vaccination and masking as well... and now even professional healthcare?

The longer that covid spikes persist here and there, undermining the health care system and other significant segments of our economy as well  -- but all without quite landing the USA in herd immunity heaven--   the better for her enemies, whether they be domestic or foreign. 

Heh, maybe it's all down to shortsellers.   Gets hard trying to make a recovering economy stumble anew, eh?


----------



## Thomas Veil

Eric said:


> You see, Liberals used trickery...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Breitbart Writer Claims ‘Organized Left’ Uses ‘Reverse Psychology’ to ‘Trick’ People Into Refusing ‘Trump Vaccine’
> 
> 
> Breitbart's John Nolte is a right-wing media figure who wants to see his readers vaccinated
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.thewrap.com




What a coincidence. I was just about to mention that, but from a different source.









						The Conservatives Who’d Rather Die Than Not Own the Libs — The Atlantic
					

Rarely has so significant a faction in American politics behaved in a way that so directly claims the life of its own supporters.




					apple.news
				






> At _Breitbart News_, the politics of vaccination have taken a strange turn. A longtime writer at the populist-right website who wants to save his Donald Trump–supporting readers from COVID-19 is *speculating that the left has tricked them into rejecting safe and effective vaccines.*





> John Nolte is vaccinated himself and, in an article this week, correctly notes that the shots are “a lifesaver.” But every time he touts what he calls the “Trump vaccine,” his Twitter feed and comment threads on his articles get flooded with irrational arguments and unfounded assertions from anti-vaxxers, he writes. That’s no surprise. The populist-right milieu that Nolte inhabits includes lots of influential voices that spread misinformation about vaccines on Fox News, talk radio, and Facebook. For example, America’s most prominent populist commentator, the Fox host Tucker Carlson, has been amplifying Nicki Minaj’s thirdhand claim that a vaccine had swollen her cousin’s friend’s testicles.





> In Nolte’s account, however, a conspiracy of evil leftist elites are to blame for vaccine skepticism on the right. “I sincerely believe the organized left is doing everything in its power to convince Trump supporters NOT to get the life-saving Trump vaccine,” Nolte writes. They are “putting unvaccinated Trump supporters in an impossible position,” he insists, “where they can either NOT get a life-saving vaccine or CAN feel like cucks caving to the ugliest, smuggest bullies in the world.”




(My bold.)

When I read that I thought, _that's it. Logic and reason have been turned *completely *inside out._

How pathetic that is, to be such a prisoner of your echo chamber, to be so completely terrified of admitting that the left had been correct all along, that you are willing to invent and embrace such Byzantine theories.

These peoples' minds are encased in ten inch thick, impenetrable pig iron. Nothing can get through to them.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Thomas Veil said:


> What a coincidence. I was just about to mention that, but from a different source.




What a terrible dilemma.  So you either admit that you were wrong, or you admit you were tricked (I prefer the word outsmarted).  I think I'd rather admit to be wrong than being tricked.  But who am I to make that call for other people?  Maybe getting tricked is preferable to admitting they were wrong from the start?

I'm sure there must be some third, face-saving option here.  But I'm too smart to think of what it might be.  That's ok, I'm sure the horse goo people will think of something.  Maybe they weren't tricked, but instead controlled by the 5Gs to make them refuse the vaccine?  I don't know.  Doesn't sound dumb enough.  But I have faith someone will think of something.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Courtesy of Facebook






> Pastor Gives Christians Who Claim 'Religious Exemption' From Masks And Vaccines An Epic Bible Lesson
> 
> 
> Keith Marshall—a Lutheran pastor from Enumclaw, Washington—wrote an article for his local paper that went viral about the use of Christian religious exemptions from pandemic protocols then received death threats as a result.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.comicsands.com


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> Courtesy of Facebook



Be sure to follow up as soon as he's on a ventilator asking if it's too late to get the vaccine.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Eric said:


> Be sure to follow up as soon as he's on a ventilator asking if it's too late to get the vaccine.






> Pastor Schools Christians Claiming ‘Religious Exemption’ From Vaccines And Masks With A Bible Lesson
> 
> 
> "Empathetic, level-headed pastors: the mortal enemy of religious extremists everywhere."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> god.dailydot.com





> A pastor in Washington state shared his opinion on the idea of Christians citing “religious exemption” to avoid mask and vaccine mandates, and people are applauding him for it.
> 
> Pastor Keith Marshall wrote an opinion piece for the local paper in his small town of Enumclaw, Washington, titled “What does your religion exempt you from?”
> 
> “Recently I was asked if Christians should be able to claim Religious Exemption when public health is in jeopardy,” Marshall said, before asking himself the question: “What does my faith in Jesus Christ exempt me from?”
> 
> Citing scriptures to back up each of his conclusions, he determined that his faith exempts him from “putting my wants above the needs of others,” “claiming my freedom in Christ as liberty to act without responsibility,” and “refusing to protect the most vulnerable in our midst.”
> 
> “Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit. Rather, in humility value others above yourselves, not looking to your own interests but each of you to the interests of the others,” he wrote, quoting Philippians 2:3-4.





> Pastor Marshall was very clear in his op-ed that he understands people may use political or personal reasons to claim exemption from getting vaccinated or wearing a mask, but says that using the Christian religion to do so is wrong.​



Perhaps I am misunderstanding


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> Perhaps I am misunderstanding



Ahh, okay got it. It's clearly me misunderstanding.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Eric said:


> Ahh, okay got it. It's clearly me misunderstanding.



That's usually me, posting at 7:00 in the morning before I've had my coffee.


----------



## JayMysteri0

This is us

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441543912569536517/

What's fascinating to me is that seemingly when people of various races were demanding not to be killed by police, many of these people may have been wondering why all the fuss?

And are now out doing this...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441546157323288576/

This whole performance theatre about masks & vaccines, has turned into another organized grab by those who represent the fewest, to gain any power for themselves.  You know the *real* people organizing this shit are vaccinated and either don't have kids / or kids going to any of those schools.  It's about wanting to reshape school boards, to dictate what is taught.  They are aided by the same "F your feelings crowd in 2016 turned what about my feelings 2020 crowd", needing something to rage about.  Since they aren't really the targets of anything, they need to create a villain that is targeting them, and always drag in the "most vulnerable" to feel noble about it.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441416333925785607/


----------



## Eric

They did their own research.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> This is us
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441543912569536517/
> 
> What's fascinating to me is that seemingly when people of various races were demanding not to be killed by police, many of these people may have been wondering why all the fuss?
> 
> And are now out doing this...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441546157323288576/
> 
> This whole performance theatre about masks & vaccines, has turned into another organized grab by those who represent the fewest, to gain any power for themselves.  You know the *real* people organizing this shit are vaccinated and either don't have kids / or kids going to any of those schools.  It's about wanting to reshape school boards, to dictate what is taught.  They are aided by the same "F your feelings crowd in 2016 turned what about my feelings 2020 crowd", needing something to rage about.  Since they aren't really the targets of anything, they need to create a villain that is targeting them, and always drag in the "most vulnerable" to feel noble about it.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1441416333925785607/



50 years from now, I hope videos like this are in history lessons about how barbaric people *used* to be.

I like how many of these angry people pivot from anti-mask to anti-CRT in seconds. Sorry, how are those related? Oh yeah, Tucker Carlson whines about both of them, so his sheep need to do the same I guess.

Thanks for the reminder of BLM marches and protests. People were protesting their neighbors and friends being murdered by police, and these same anti-mask folks were telling them to get over it, go home, etc. But when a school actually wants to PROTECT the lives of their teachers and students from the Petri dish that is a public school, these ”very fine people” are out screaming and wailing against it.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Sheriff's Deputy to high school girl: Take down your Instagram posts saying you have COVID or I'm gonna arrest you. Judge to Deputy: WTF is wrong with you man?
Wisconsin high schooler wins lawsuit against sheriff over COVID-19 social media post​








						Wisconsin high schooler wins lawsuit against sheriff over COVID-19 social media post
					

A Wisconsin high schooler on Friday won her lawsuit against a sheriff’s deputy who allegedly threatened her with arrest if she did not take down several social media posts related to COVID-19…




					thehill.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Sheriff's Deputy to high school girl: Take down your Instagram posts saying you have COVID or I'm gonna arrest you. Judge to Deputy: WTF is wrong with you man?
> Wisconsin high schooler wins lawsuit against sheriff over COVID-19 social media post​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Wisconsin high schooler wins lawsuit against sheriff over COVID-19 social media post
> 
> 
> A Wisconsin high schooler on Friday won her lawsuit against a sheriff’s deputy who allegedly threatened her with arrest if she did not take down several social media posts related to COVID-19…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com



You’d better tell IcanHazMac about this. He’s a crusader against all forms of censorship… except the posts he disagrees with and spams the “report” button on, of course.


----------



## SuperMatt

Wearing a mask is just like being assaulted… wut?









						Washington State county commissioner likens mask wearing to sexual assault, flips off constituent | Boing Boing
					

At a public meeting on September 21, Klickitat County Commissioner Dan Christopher moved to fire countys health officer, Dr. Amy Person because she called to revive a state mask mandate. No one sup…




					boingboing.net


----------



## Runs For Fun

SMH


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> Spotted at the Trump rally. I think we can all agree she encapsulates this sub perfectly. from
> HermanCainAward
> 
> SMH



Parent of the year!


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> They did their own research.
> 
> 
> Parent's expert day from
> PoliticalHumor



Seriously the world went from nobody giving a shit about me posting medical literature to arguing about misinterpreted preprints.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## JayMysteri0

> Woman Arrested With Fake 'Maderna' Vaccine Card Reportedly Bails on Zoom Hearing
> 
> 
> Chloe Mrozak is now facing a warrant for her arrest after failing to show up at a virtual court hearing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com





> The 24-year-old woman who was arrested earlier this month for allegedly trying to enter Hawaii with a fake coronavirus vaccine card has skipped out on a virtual court hearing, the Associated Press reported.
> 
> Chloe Mrozak, the suspect in question, was previously released without bail after she was arrested at Honolulu’s Daniel K. Inouye International Airport on misdemeanor charges of violating two of Hawaii’s pandemic regulations. All visitors to Hawaii must either present a vaccine card upon entry or quarantine for 10 days upon arrival; using a forged card would allow one to skip the line and hit the beaches without the mandatory quarantine. Authorities say that Mrozak uploaded a fake card, which had misspelled the vaccine manufacturer Moderna as “Maderna,” to a digital system Hawaii uses to vet travelers. If convicted on the original charges, Mrozak could face up to a year in prison.
> 
> According to the AP, Mrozak was scheduled to appear at the hearing via Zoom on Wednesday. After her non-appearance, Judge Karin Holma issued a $500 warrant for her arrest. Not exactly the greatest plan to get out of the first one.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Booster shot jokes



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442113406081843203/


----------



## JayMysteri0

X 100 =

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442139253924712448/

When people don't realize their "research" is mostly feelings & NOT fact.

How the 'F' does anyone at this point NOT KNOW the likes of 45 friends got vaccinated BEFORE most did?


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> X 100 =
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442139253924712448/
> 
> When people don't realize their "research" is mostly feelings & NOT fact.
> 
> How the 'F' does anyone at this point NOT KNOW the likes of 45 friends got vaccinated BEFORE most did?



Athlete's concern is the 1 to 5,000 risk of mild heart muscle inflammation associated with the vaccine. Ironically, the risk for the same with even asymptomatic COVID is higher than 1 in 3. Thus far more than 1 in 8 Americans tested positive for COVID. So an average American would have a 1 to 24 chance to get asymptomatic peri/myoarditis. He's gotta have 200x lower risk of catching COVID to have this single relevant vaccine complication to be on par with the risk of COVID. Which, well also comes with a million other complications.


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> Athlete's concern is the 1 to 5,000 risk of mild heart muscle inflammation associated with the vaccine. Ironically, the risk for the same with even asymptomatic COVID is higher than 1 in 3. Thus far more than 1 in 8 Americans tested positive for COVID. So an average American would have a 1 to 24 chance to get asymptomatic peri/myoarditis. He's gotta have 200x lower risk of catching COVID to have this single relevant vaccine complication to be on par with the risk of COVID. Which, well also comes with a million other complications.



Which is all fine & good, but that wasn't their concern.  What point you are making actually involves research.  They are instead using 45 & religious beliefs as his unreliable research, then when countered, claims he is being singled out & misrepresented.

If you are going to claim you've done any research to arrive at your own personal conclusion,  that research doesn't include any actual facts, it's a little hard to take seriously when you don't want to hear the facts as a counter point.   Just own up your conclusion is based on feelings, and deal with the frustration of those who deal with facts.  It's your life & your opinion yes, but don't pretend like it's deeply researched over deeply meditated for one's self.

That's the frustration involved.  Because when you use the former president who intentionally got himself vaccinated in secret, to further his own political needs, as your reasoning for you NOT getting the vaccine... It doesn't make one look terribly knowledgeable.

Just played, and further our slide down the pandemic rat hole.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Which is all fine & good, but that wasn't their concern.  What point you are making actually involves research.  They are instead using 45 & religious beliefs as his unreliable research, then when countered, claims he is being singled out & misrepresented.
> 
> If you are going to claim you've done any research to arrive at your own personal conclusion,  that research doesn't include any actual facts, it's a little hard to take seriously when you don't want to hear the facts as a counter point.   Just own up your conclusion is based on feelings, and deal with the frustration of those who deal with facts.  It's your life & your opinion yes, but don't pretend like it's deeply researched over deeply meditated for one's self.
> 
> That's the frustration involved.  Because when you use the former president who intentionally got himself vaccinated in secret, to further his own political needs, as your reasoning for you NOT getting the vaccine... It doesn't make one look terribly knowledgeable.
> 
> Just played, and further our slide down the pandemic rat hole.



I don't follow athletes commenting on topics they generally have very little knowledge about. 
I do assume they have very knowledgable advisors they were actually presented with the above stats.
So in a sense someone did the legit research for them, they've just decided to ignore it in favor of less legit stuff.
Thus I fully ignore attempts to justify opinions like this, but I also don't get upset about it for the same reason.


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> I don't follow athletes commenting on topics they generally have very little knowledge about.
> I do assume they have very knowledgable advisors they were actually presented with the above stats.
> So in a sense someone did the legit research for them, they've just decided to ignore it in favor of less legit stuff.
> Thus I fully ignore attempts to justify opinions like this, but I also don't get upset about it for the same reason.



The point is the comments are actually provided to put in proper context so everyone could get what the issue is.  No following needed.

You can be presented with the knowledge of how to perform proper knee surgery on one's self, how to minimize the risks of needing such d.i.y.  surgery, and more.  It doesn't means squat though if one own "research" leads to using pliers dipped in holy water, rocks from the Dead sea, an autographed pic from a 2X impeached former president, and a fervent belief in one's God.

The concern is for organizations that depend on their people to remain healthy as to NOT infect others, and keep the company running.  Yet there's an entitled group who believes ( what's the phrase I read now & then? ) "rules for thee, but not for me?"  



> Report: NBA dealing with anti-COVID vaccine theories from Kyrie Irving, Jonathan Isaac and more
> 
> 
> While about 90% of NBA players are vaccinated against COVID-19, it sounds like getting the rest of the way there is going to be a battle.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sports.yahoo.com




So whether you are a professional athlete, police officer, or medical personnel it's a distressing thing to behold.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> The point is the comments are actually provided to put in proper context so everyone could get what the issue is.  No following needed.
> 
> You can be presented with the knowledge of how to perform proper knee surgery on one's self, how to minimize the risks of needing such d.i.y.  surgery, and more.  It doesn't means squat though if one own "research" leads to using pliers dipped in holy water, rocks from the Dead sea, an autographed pic from a 2X impeached former president, and a fervent belief in one's God.
> 
> The concern is for organizations that depend on their people to remain healthy as to NOT infect others, and keep the company running.  Yet there's an entitled group who believes ( what's the phrase I read now & then? ) "rules for thee, but not for me?"
> 
> 
> 
> So whether you are a professional athlete, police officer, or medical personnel it's a distressing thing to behold.



SO there are 30 teams, with rosters of probably 20 each. 90% fully vaccinated. So they have like 540 players vaccinated. That's pretty good.
My point really was that 99.99% of these people can only come up with reasoning that either sociopathically selfish or simply insane, or most commonly both.


----------



## Yoused

Arrgh









						Unvaccinated TikTokers embrace eugenicist fascism of Potter fantasy by identifying as ‘pureblood’
					

If it wasn’t already clear that the anti-vaccination/anti-masking/pro-COVID contingent of the Trumpian right has great difficulty distinguishing reality from fiction, their latest trending social-media hashtag is its penultimate manifestation:...




					www.dailykos.com
				




"Purebloods"? Why not just go for "Clueless".


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> SO there are 30 teams, with rosters of probably 20 each. 90% fully vaccinated. So they have like 540 players vaccinated. That's pretty good.
> My point really was that 99.99% of these people can only come up with reasoning that either sociopathically selfish or simply insane, or most commonly both.



Which brings us back to why others are of us are concerned.  It only takes 1% to 'F' crap up for the rest of us.

It's *believed* to be A reason why Cam Newton is gone from New England.



> Did Cam Newton's Vaccination Status Impact Patriots' Decision To Start Mac Jones?
> 
> 
> Cam Newton was seemingly unvaccinated, and some wonder if it was one of the reasons the team opted to go with Mac Jones at quarterback.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> boston.cbslocal.com




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1432713292204621826/

In the case of the NFL, if an outbreak occurs amongst your team, you aren't allowed to play.  Thus you are forced to forfeit any game you were supposed to play.  That's a lot of revenue tossed down the drain because of someone's "research".

The same issues face the rest of us with nurses & police wanting to be exempt from being vaccinated, but they people they interact would have no say about that interaction.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yoused said:


> Arrgh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unvaccinated TikTokers embrace eugenicist fascism of Potter fantasy by identifying as ‘pureblood’
> 
> 
> If it wasn’t already clear that the anti-vaccination/anti-masking/pro-COVID contingent of the Trumpian right has great difficulty distinguishing reality from fiction, their latest trending social-media hashtag is its penultimate manifestation:...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.dailykos.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> "Purebloods"? Why not just go for "Clueless".



Similar to the cadre of the same sorts who identify with the empire in Star Wars.

Yet spent during a previous presidency overusing the line "jack booted thugs" for the gov't forces that never came for their firearms.

Yet they cheered on ICE doing raids where they weren't allowed to, or just arresting individuals, and ignoring the management that hired those individuals who knew full well they didn't have documentation.


----------



## Runs For Fun

When will this stupidity end?
People on Social Media Are Claiming That Inhaling Hydrogen Peroxide Can Cure COVID, But Doctors Say It's Dangerous








						People on Social Media Are Claiming That Inhaling Hydrogen Peroxide Can Cure COVID, But Doctors Say It's Dangerous
					

Inhaling hydrogen peroxide vapor to cure COVID-19 doesn't work and can be dangerous, according to doctors. Find out more here.




					www.health.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> When will this stupidity end?
> People on Social Media Are Claiming That Inhaling Hydrogen Peroxide Can Cure COVID, But Doctors Say It's Dangerous
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People on Social Media Are Claiming That Inhaling Hydrogen Peroxide Can Cure COVID, But Doctors Say It's Dangerous
> 
> 
> Inhaling hydrogen peroxide vapor to cure COVID-19 doesn't work and can be dangerous, according to doctors. Find out more here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.health.com



I think it was better back when people were shining flashlights in their ears and drinking Lysol. Who would’ve thought people would be even dumber with Trump out of office?


----------



## SuperMatt

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438627772029669382/


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438627772029669382/



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442481816573657103/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1438627772029669382/




But I thought interacting with black people was the leading cause of death in law enforcement.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> But I thought interacting with black people was the number one cause of death in law enforcement.



I think that’s called the *thin blue lie*.


----------



## SuperMatt

Is this guy trying to be funny?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442474104192442370/


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> Is this guy trying to be funny?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442474104192442370/



proving trump supports are not the brightest or the best.


----------



## lizkat

SuperMatt said:


> I think it was better back when people were shining flashlights in their ears and drinking Lysol. Who would’ve thought people would be even dumber with Trump out of office?




The former guy really opened up a lot of Pandora's boxes in this country, that's for sure.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442441253774299139/


----------



## DT

SuperMatt said:


> Is this guy trying to be funny?




Maybe he should try dropping his pants ...


----------



## DT

P_X said:


> Athlete's concern is the 1 to 5,000 risk of mild heart muscle inflammation associated with the vaccine. Ironically, the risk for the same with even asymptomatic COVID is higher than 1 in 3. Thus far more than 1 in 8 Americans tested positive for COVID. So an average American would have a 1 to 24 chance to get asymptomatic peri/myoarditis. He's gotta have 200x lower risk of catching COVID to have this single relevant vaccine complication to be on par with the risk of COVID. Which, well also comes with a million other complications.




Is there a reduction in likelihood of myocarditis for people who contract Covid but __are__ vaccinated?


----------



## Yoused

DT said:


> Maybe he should try dropping his pants ...



Is that what you call your "dark humor" ?


----------



## User.45

DT said:


> Is there a reduction in likelihood of myocarditis for people who contract Covid but __are__ vaccinated?



I can’t find data on it. One of the issues is that the main demographic of breakthrough cases is 60 or older so even if someone is looking for this specifically it will take time to accumulate enough that are young adults.
Of note, my numbers came from military reports on the CDC website on myocarditis cases. Subsequent larger sample analysis suggest that the incidence of symptomatic cases of myocarditis is even lower, like one in 100k. To be fair, one thing to lose 10% of your heart pumping capacity transiently as an average Joe, and another do you have 10% of your performance cut off as a pro athlete.


----------



## JayMysteri0

FFS  






> Bradley Beal on coronavirus vaccine: ‘It’s funny that it only reduces your chances of going to the hospital’
> 
> 
> Bradley Beal's argument against coronavirus vaccines: They prevent only hospitalizations and death.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sports.yahoo.com





> “I would like an explanation to people with vaccines – why are they still getting COVID if that’s something that we are supposed to highly be protected from?” Beal said. “It’s funny that it only reduces your chances of going to the hospital. It doesn’t eliminate anybody from getting COVID. Right?”
> 
> A reporter emphasized that vaccinated people are less likely to die or be hospitalized.
> 
> “OK,” Beal said, grinning as if he perfectly set up a gotcha. “But you can still get COVID.”
> 
> As if getting hospitalized or dying is some trivial consideration.
> 
> Severe illness and death are the entire reason this pandemic is so serious. If it weren’t so harmful to people’s health, coronavirus wouldn’t be such a big deal. Other viruses have spread rampantly without being as destructive. It’s only because of those severe outcomes a positive/negative designation for coronavirus matters.




How can one not simplify things?  What's worse?  The results of trying to recover from Covid IF one can, or the "researched" results of what may happen to someone vaccinated?



> How elite athletes have struggled with the long-term effects of Covid
> 
> 
> For some athletes, the road back to 100 percent isn’t a straight line.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.sbnation.com





> Mo Bamba and Jayson Tatum struggled with conditioning at 22 years old​Mohammed Bamba of the Orlando Magic and Jayson Tatum of the Boston Celtics are two NBA players who have openly discussed the long road back from Covid. Despite each recovering and showing no symptoms, they have found it hard to get their wind under them as they work themselves back into top form.
> 
> Bamba, known for his elite shot-blocking ability, was drafted No. 6 overall in 2018 to the Orlando Magic. Despite the talent he brought to Orlando, he played limited minutes and had marginal production due to the Magic’s crowded front court. Bamba was diagnosed with the virus on June 11th, 2020, but tested negative before reporting to the bubble, where he played a total of 10 minutes. Nearly six months later, he still had not fully recovered.
> 
> Leading into the 2021 NBA All-Star break, Bamba has only played 16 games for the Magic and has spent most of his time out of the rotation. Like many, his initial symptoms were loss of his senses: lack of taste and smell. He also dealt with fatigue and muscle soreness, but his conditioning has held him back though he is cleared to play.
> 
> Boston Celtics star Jayson Tatum has also had issues getting his wind under him after his return. Tatum tested positive for the virus on January 9th and returned to the floor after missing more than two weeks later that month. Tatum detailed his struggles to feel 100 percent, saying: “Just running up and down the court a few times, it’s easier to get out of breath or tired a lot faster. I’ve noticed that since I’ve had COVID. It’s just something I’m working on. It’s gotten better since the first game I played, but I still deal with it from time to time.”




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442602460254638087/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> FFS
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How can one not simplify things?  What's worse?  The results of trying to recover from Covid IF one can, or the "researched" results of what may happen to someone vaccinated?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442602460254638087/



I didn’t go to medical school. So when it comes to health, I listen to the doctor. When 99% or more of doctors are telling us all to do something… maybe we should listen.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> FFS



Pretty hilarious.


----------



## Runs For Fun

I’m hearing there’s this conspiracy theory going around that hospitals and healthcare workers are killing people to drive up COVID death numbers so they’re *not* going to the hospitals now. That might actually be helpful since hospitals won’t be overrun with their unvaccinated dumb asses.








						Anti-Vaccine Cartoonist Ben Garrison Says He's Got Covid-19, Won't Go to Hospital
					

The pro-Trump cartoonist says he's lost about 15 pounds and is taking ivermectin.




					gizmodo.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> I’m hearing there’s this conspiracy theory going around that hospitals and healthcare workers are killing people to drive up COVID death numbers so they’re *not* going to the hospitals now. That might actually be helpful since hospitals won’t be overrun with their unvaccinated dumb asses.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-Vaccine Cartoonist Ben Garrison Says He's Got Covid-19, Won't Go to Hospital
> 
> 
> The pro-Trump cartoonist says he's lost about 15 pounds and is taking ivermectin.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com



so he is depending on that most people get over covid on their own? this is the problem with covid it is way too nice. wait till he cant get it up or hurts himself he will go to a doctor then of course.


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> I’m hearing there’s this conspiracy theory going around that hospitals and healthcare workers are killing people to drive up COVID death numbers so they’re *not* going to the hospitals now. That might actually be helpful since hospitals won’t be overrun with their unvaccinated dumb asses.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-Vaccine Cartoonist Ben Garrison Says He's Got Covid-19, Won't Go to Hospital
> 
> 
> The pro-Trump cartoonist says he's lost about 15 pounds and is taking ivermectin.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com



I wouldn‘t trust that guy. He might be falsely claiming to have it in order to later claim that he cured it with a mixture of eye of newt and wing of bat.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> I wouldn‘t trust that guy. He might be falsely claiming to have it in order to later claim that he cured it with a mixture of eye of newt and wing of bat.



what a antivaxxer lie? say it an't so.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Runs For Fun said:


> I’m hearing there’s this conspiracy theory going around that hospitals and healthcare workers are killing people to drive up COVID death numbers so they’re *not* going to the hospitals now. That might actually be helpful since hospitals won’t be overrun with their unvaccinated dumb asses.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-Vaccine Cartoonist Ben Garrison Says He's Got Covid-19, Won't Go to Hospital
> 
> 
> The pro-Trump cartoonist says he's lost about 15 pounds and is taking ivermectin.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com




In a twisted way, it makes perfect sense.  If you're going to turn down something that can help you from getting a deadly virus, why wouldn't you then delay medical assistance for as long as humanly possible?


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## SuperMatt

Another poll shows that unvaccinated people do not know how vaccines work.









						Poll: 71% of unvaccinated say booster doses mean vaccines aren’t working
					

"We will not boost our way out of this pandemic."




					arstechnica.com
				




Good news: about 75% of those eligible for the vaccine (16 and older) have gotten at least 1 shot. Also, the racial disparities in vaccination rates seem to have equaled out now.

Bad news: The number one indicator of vaccination status is political affiliation. 90% of Dems, 58% of Republicans, and 68% of independents. Of course, that makes me think “independent” voters are mostly Republicans trying to pretend otherwise.. there’s no other explanation I can think of for their low vaccination rate.


----------



## MEJHarrison

SuperMatt said:


> Bad news: The number one indicator of vaccination status is political affiliation. 90% of Dems, *58% of Republicans*, and 68% of independents.




I have some good news on that front.  As more and more of the other 42% die senselessly, that percentage will steadily rise.

One side reached their goal with a free shot.  The other side will reach that goal through attrition.


----------



## Runs For Fun

MEJHarrison said:


> I have some good news on that front.  As more and more of the other 42% die senselessly, that percentage will steadily rise.
> 
> One side reached their goal with a free shot.  The other side will reach that goal through attrition.



Republicans: Why is our voter turnout so low?
(Hint: they're all dead)


----------



## Yoused

Runs For Fun said:


> Republicans: Why is our voter turnout so low?
> (Hint: they're all dead)



There is a problem with that, though. At present, we have two essentially fully entrenched parties that amount to "pick one or the other because lesser parties have no traction", but each party has a membership around 25~30% of the populace. That means that the "one or the other" major candidates are picked by a majority of those minorities, or 13~16% of the voters. If the R party gets smaller without losing traction (entirely possible in a money-driven system), the minority that chooses one of the main candidates will be an even smaller number. And the constriction of the R party will lead to an even crazier, more desperate membership.

Oh, and ICWMI, here is the nutbag list:









						List of unproven methods against COVID-19 - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## JayMysteri0

Get 'em while they are still warm



> Network of Right-Wing Health Care Providers Is Making Millions Off Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin, Hacked Data Reveals
> 
> 
> The data also reveals that 72,000 people paid at least $6.7 million for Covid-19 consultations promoted by America’s Frontline Doctors and vaccine conspiracist Simone Gold.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> theintercept.com





> A NETWORK OF health care providers pocketed millions of dollars selling hydroxychloroquine, ivermectin, and online consultations, according to hacked data provided to The Intercept. The data show that vast sums of money are being extracted from people concerned about or suffering from Covid-19 but resistant to vaccinations or other recommendations of public health authorities.
> 
> America’s Frontline Doctors, a right-wing group founded last year to promote pro-Trump doctors during the coronavirus pandemic, is working in tandem with a small network of health care companies to sow distrust in the Covid-19 vaccine, dupe tens of thousands of people into seeking ineffective treatments for the disease, and then sell consultations and millions of dollars’ worth of those medications. The data indicate patients spent at least $15 million — and potentially much more — on consultations and medications combined.
> 
> The Intercept has obtained hundreds of thousands of records from two companies, CadenceHealth.us and Ravkoo, revealing just how the lucrative operation works. America’s Frontline Doctors, or AFLDS, has been spreading highly politicized misinformation about Covid-19 since the summer of 2020 and refers its many followers to its telemedicine partner SpeakWithAnMD.com, which uses Cadence Health as a platform. People who sign up then pay $90 for a phone consultation with “AFLDS-trained physicians” who prescribe treatments such as hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin to prevent and treat Covid-19. The drugs are delivered by Ravkoo, a service that works with local pharmacies to ship drugs to patients’ doors. Of course, that’s if patients ever get the consultation; many customers told Time they never received the call after paying.
> 
> The data from the Cadence Health and Ravkoo sites was provided to The Intercept by an anonymous hacker who said the sites were “hilariously easy” to hack, despite promises of patient privacy. It was corroborated by comparing it to publicly available information. The Intercept is not publishing any individual patient data and has taken steps to secure the data. After The Intercept reached out, Cadence Health’s Roque Espinal-Valdez said he shut the platform down, not wanting any part in profiting off of Covid-19 “quackery.”


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443007801924718596/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443014684341374978/


----------



## Runs For Fun

Tell me you don’t know how vaccines work without saying you don’t know how vaccines work








						Unvaccinated Americans falsely say the need for booster shots proves Covid vaccines don't work, Kaiser survey shows
					

A Kaiser Family Foundation survey shows that 71% percent of unvaccinated respondents said boosters are a sign that vaccines are not working.




					www.cnbc.com


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443014684341374978/




According to my boss, who is a Director, but not in HR, my company is allowing for medical and religious exemptions.

According to him, at this point the valid medical exceptions points you to the state's guidelines which point you to the CDC guidelines which state you can be granted an exemption if 1) you had an adverse reaction to the first shot or 2) you have adverse reactions to vaccinations.  He said there used to be a third rule about immunocompromised people, but it was removed since it's not a live vaccine.

As for the religious exemptions, he mentioned a Native American tribe that doesn't believe in vaccinations.  And he said you pretty much have to PROVE you're a member of that tribe.  Not sure if there were other exemptions or not (it was Happy Hour, so not really a serious business discussion).

So even though we allow exemptions, they're apparently locked down pretty tight.  A chiropractor's note  isn't going to cut it. A note from your friend pretending to be your pastor isn't going to cut it. You need to prove you qualify for a _*valid*_ exemption.

I love the company I work for.


----------



## Alli

Maddow just pointed out that not only is the Pope vaccinated, but he’s mandating that those working in the Vatican be vaccinated.


----------



## Runs For Fun

MEJHarrison said:


> As for the religious exemptions, he mentioned a Native American tribe that doesn't believe in vaccinations. And he said you pretty much have to PROVE you're a member of that tribe.



I seriously want to know what religions forbid vaccines. I've seen this asked whenever mentioning religious exemptions and no one has been able to name one. This is the closest I've heard of a legitimate exemption.


----------



## Pumbaa

Runs For Fun said:


> I seriously want to know what religions forbid vaccines. I've seen this asked whenever mentioning religious exemptions and no one has been able to name one. This is the closest I've heard of a legitimate exemption.



Couldn't find much in the way of theological objections, just a few fringe ”Christian” off-shoots.





__





						Immunizations and Religion | Vanderbilt Faculty & Staff Health and Wellness
					






					www.vumc.org


----------



## MEJHarrison

Runs For Fun said:


> I seriously want to know what religions forbid vaccines. I've seen this asked whenever mentioning religious exemptions and no one has been able to name one. This is the closest I've heard of a legitimate exemption.




I was curious too.  Here's the best article I found find.  The religions that object to vaccinations seemed to be Dutch Reformed Congregations, Faith healing denominations and Christian Science people.

https://www.localsyr.com/health/cor...ent-religions-stand-on-covid-19-vaccinations/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

'He is a hypocrite': Health care worker on Pope getting vaccinated - CNN Video
					

CNN's Miguel Marquez sits down with two health care workers who refuse to get vaccinated for Covid-19 despite the risk of losing their jobs due to the state mandate.




					www.cnn.com
				




Wow.  Catholic calling the pope a hypocrite AND most likely worshipping party/Trump over God.


----------



## Huntn

YouTube (owned by Google) is cracking down on Anti-Vax content. About damned time….









						YouTube Is Taking a Huge Step Against 'Dangerous' Anti-Vax Videos
					

Social media sites like YouTube are stepping up their enforcement against anti-vax content.




					www.sciencealert.com
				




175 hospital workers at North Carolina hospital are fired for COVID vaccination non compliance. 99% of the hospital staff complied. Stupid got let go. 









						A North Carolina hospital system fired 175 employees who failed to follow its Covid-19 vaccination rule. But over 99% of its workers complied
					

Novant Health, a North Carolina not-for-profit system of 15 medical centers with more than 2,300 physicians, said this week it had terminated roughly 175 employees for non-compliance with its mandatory Covid-19 vaccination program.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

NETWORK OF RIGHT-WING HEALTH CARE PROVIDERS IS MAKING MILLIONS OFF HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE AND IVERMECTIN, HACKED DATA REVEALS








						Network of Right-Wing Health Care Providers Is Making Millions Off Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin, Hacked Data Reveals
					

The data also reveals that 72,000 people paid at least $6.7 million for Covid-19 consultations promoted by America’s Frontline Doctors and vaccine conspiracist Simone Gold.




					theintercept.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

For those saying Covid deaths are being over reported because some people had preexisting health issues, I have some logic follow up questions.

A person who has cancer drives their car off a cliff. What was the cause of death?

A person with heart disease falls through a hole in a frozen over lake and is trapped under the ice. What was the cause of death?

Here’s a toughy for your logic train. A person refuses to get vaccinated completely based on views expressed by right wing media and politicians, gets Covid, and dies. What was the cause of death?


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> For those saying Covid deaths are being over reported because some people had preexisting health issues, I have some logic follow up questions.
> 
> A person who has cancer drives their car off a cliff. What was the cause of death?
> 
> A person with heart disease falls through a hole in a frozen over lake and is trapped under the ice. What was the cause of death?
> 
> Here’s a toughy for your logic train. A person refuses to get vaccinated completely based on views expressed by right wing media and politicians, gets Covid, and dies. *What was the cause of death?*



Well that depends, it may concern people who died because they had something like heart disease in addition to COVID, which can be used as evidence either way (for or against vaccination) depending on if the person was vaccinated or not vaccinated.

But there are also many cases of healthy people getting deathly ill and/or dieing and the bottom line is the fact that our hospitals are abnormally full and it’s directly associated with COVID, so the seriousness of it can’t be rationalized away as for other causes. Why are our emergency rooms and ICUs full? COVID.

Answer to your last question: Deaf and blind, anti-vaxer, sheep being sheparded by evil shepards, or just plain STU-PID. I’m wondering if the mental aspects of prejudice cross a wide spectrum of life issues from racial prejudice to distrust of science or is this better described as a  low level of intelligence?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Huntn said:


> Well that depends, it may concern people who died because they had something like heart disease in addition to COVID, which can be used as evidence either way (for or against vaccination) depending on if the person was vaccinated or not vaccinated.
> 
> But there are also many cases of healthy people getting deathly ill and/or dieing and the bottom line is the fact that our hospitals are abnormally full and it’s directly associated with COVID, so the seriousness of it can’t be rationalized away as for other causes. Why are our emergency rooms and ICUs full? COVID.
> 
> Answer to your last question: Deaf and blind, anti-vaxer, sheep being sheparded by evil shepards, or just plain STU-PID.




Honestly, I don't think preconditions should even matter as we are largely an unhealthy country and many people probably don't even bother to get regular checkups or do anything about their condition.  And at the risk of sounding divisive, people on the right are probably way more unhealthy than those on the left.  If the winner of the civil war was decided by a sprint race, the right would lose by a mile...literally.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Honestly, I don't think preconditions should even matter as we are largely an unhealthy country and many people probably don't even bother to get regular checkups or do anything about their condition.  And at the risk of sounding divisive, people on the right are probably way more unhealthy than those on the left.  If the winner of the civil war was decided by a sprint race, the right would lose by a mile...literally.



I agree and have advocated that vaccinated people should be prioritized for life threatening issues as compared to the willfully unvaccinated. Not that it makes any difference as applied to the generalization of the health of left vs right, but I know some people who fall on the side of liberal and are anti-medicine, anti-dentist ie they don’t really take care of their personal health unless there is a crisis.  Some of this may have to do with the associated expense and ability to pay the system.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443264851359551490/

Buh... buh... freedumbs & liburty!!

Reminder



> Sage Steele says she only took vaccine because of ESPN’s ‘sick’ and ‘scary’ mandate
> 
> 
> ESPN anchor Sage Steele said she only got the COVID-19 vaccine because of her company’s mandate, which she described as “sick” and “scary.” During an appearance on &#82…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com




When push comes to shove in some cases the b.s. & stupidity fall away.  For some it isn't really about vaccine hesitancy...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443271574413578243/

Still, summing up most of us...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443088832564367361/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443264851359551490/
> 
> Buh... buh... freedumbs & liburty!!



In related news, toddlers across the world who were denied candy did NOT die from holding their breath.


----------



## SuperMatt

The unvaccinated patients (and healthcare workers) are costing the lives even of those who have been vaccinated by taking over the hospitals.



			https://wapo.st/3CRMMw2


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Yoused said:


> There is a problem with that, though. At present, we have two essentially fully entrenched parties that amount to "pick one or the other because lesser parties have no traction", but each party has a membership around 25~30% of the populace. That means that the "one or the other" major candidates are picked by a majority of those minorities, or 13~16% of the voters. If the R party gets smaller without losing traction (entirely possible in a money-driven system), the minority that chooses one of the main candidates will be an even smaller number. And the constriction of the R party will lead to an even crazier, more desperate membership.




Further upstream we’re already minority ruled regardless of how we vote as both parties work on behalf of corporations and the ultra rich. Right now the entire Democrat agenda is being held hostage by 2 corporate extremists and on the right they just toss the media mic to their attention whore nutjobs so McConnell can quietly obstruct everything on behalf of the same interests, like a gentleman.


----------



## JayMysteri0

> United Airlines Set To Terminate Nearly 600 Employees For Refusing To Get Vaccinated
> 
> 
> The airline announced on Tuesday that it would start processing the termination of 593 employees, nearly two months after informing workers about the new policy.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nowthisnews.com





> United Airlines announced on Tuesday in a memo to employees that it would begin the termination process for the nearly 600 U.S.-based employees who decided against getting COVID-19 vaccines.
> 
> The company became the first U.S. airline to mandate COVID-19 vaccines among its 67,000 staff members in the U.S.
> 
> United’s President Brett Hart and Chief Executive Scott said in a memo: “This was an incredibly difficult decision but keeping our team safe has always been our first priority,” adding, “Our rationale for requiring the vaccine for all United’s U.S.-based employees was simple — to keep our people safe — and the truth is this: everyone is safer when everyone is vaccinated, and vaccine requirements work.”
> 
> Airline officials also said that employees who change their minds during the termination process and decide to get vaccinated may do so and save their jobs. Collectively, the group of employees set to be terminated makes up nearly 3% of United’s workforce.
> 
> For employees seeking religious exemptions, the airline will provide an unpaid leave with a delayed start date of October 15 as a result of a lawsuit initiated by six current employees meant to stop vaccine mandates from taking effect. The workers behind the lawsuit, including a flight attendant and two pilots, asked a federal judge to block the vaccine requirement, claiming that the policy violates the Civil Rights Act and Americans with Disabilities Act.
> 
> A spokesperson for United also said that the company will hire roughly 25,000 employees in the next few years, with plans to hold the same vaccination requirements in place. Students enrolled in a United Airlines pilot program will be required to get the COVID-19 vaccine as well.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I look forward to Republicans praising the unvaccinated as job creators.


----------



## JayMysteri0

And a variation of things arrives in the NBA

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443263443390418951/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Saw this on Chris Hayes today, and couldn't believe it.

Deathantis has moved to making Australia as some new bad guy he needs to rail on, because they've done the difficult unpleasant work we wouldn't.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443418329142726657/


----------



## JayMysteri0

I guess this prevented them from getting Covid



> New Mexico reports two deaths from ivermectin
> 
> 
> New Mexico has linked two deaths in the state to misuse of ivermectin, a medicine typically used for parasitic infections in animals that has repeatedly been used by people as an anti-COVID-19 medi…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com





> New Mexico has linked two deaths in the state to misuse of ivermectin, a medicine typically used for parasitic infections in animals that has repeatedly been used by people as an anti-COVID-19 medication.
> 
> New Mexico reported the two deaths on Wednesday, according to the state health department. They were among the 14 patients in the state hospitalized after being poisoned by the use of ivermectin, which has been promoted by both podcast host Joe Rogan and Alex Jones, the conspiracy theorist.
> 
> While the FDA has approved the use of ivermectin in specified doses for humans suffering from intestinal parasites such as worms, it isn’t intended or used to treat viruses.
> 
> David Scrase, the acting head of the state health department, said the two patients who died — ages 38 and 79 years old — had both contracted the coronavirus and attempted to treat it themselves with ivermectin. In one patient, the use of the drug led to kidney failure.
> 
> “It’s the wrong medicine for something really serious,” Scrase said.
> 
> Amid a surge of prescriptions for the drug, as well as an increase in people purchasing the version of the drug meant for livestock, the FDA has continued to warn of the dangers.




THIS does NOT need to happen!


----------



## lizkat

Alabama has come up with a perhaps uniquely Alabamian way to deal with its covid-related problems using the federal funds meant to help offset the states' loss of revenues from the covid pandemic:   build new prisons.



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/09/29/kay-ivey-alabama-prison-coronavirus-funds/
		




> ... Ivey convened a special session of the Alabama legislature on Monday to address the state’s ailing prison infrastructure, which she admitted was “broken.” Using the funding in this way, she said, aimed to provide an “Alabama solution to this Alabama problem.”
> 
> The plan, backed by Ivey, to build three new prisons and renovate others will involve using up to $400 million from the state’s share of American Rescue Plan funds, according the Associated Press. Alabama has reported almost 15,000 covid-related deaths, according to the latest state data, making it one of the hardest hit parts of the country from the pandemic.






> However, the funding plans have been met with some objections. They prompted a letter to Treasury Secretary Janet L. Yellen from House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerrold Nadler (D-N.Y.), in which he petitioned the agency to “prevent the misuse of [American Rescue Plan] funding by any state, including Alabama.”






> “Directing funding meant to protect our citizens from a pandemic to fuel mass incarceration is, in direct contravention of the intended purposes of the ARP legislation,” Nadler wrote.
> 
> Ivey insisted in her statement Tuesday that the American Rescue Plan Act allows for funds to be used in this way.




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443316030638546950/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1442869266936569864/


----------



## JayMysteri0

What covid stupidity has reduced some "adults" to...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443576917773324301/


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> What covid stupidity has reduced some "adults" to...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443576917773324301/




Yeah well the question there is who exactly are the sheep?

When I see stuff like that involving school kids, I do get angry.   I think of the situation of a neighboring couple.  They are both vaccinated.  The wife has type 1 diabetes so is at elevated risk for some complications (compared to other vaccinated individuals) if she does get covid despite the vaccine.  So they mask wherever they go and still try to minimize exposure to the public in general. Meanwhile they are guardian of an elementary-school age grandchild in the local public school district.  Kids are too young to be vaccinated so they rely on the school staff being vaccinated and everyone --- teachers, admins, students, being masked. 

Yet there are some parents in that school district who routinely ignore masking guidelines for themselves and their kids, and in fact the principal of the middle and high school was recently suspended without pay for refusing to get vaccinated or to submit to weekly testing.  She claimed a nonexistent "religious freedom" exemption from the state's mandated "get vaccinated or get tested weekly" options, and cited assorted scripture that she said requires her "to consult the Holy Spirit" on what to do when not finding specific Biblical prescriptions on dealing with any particular life issue. 

The school board and district supervisor are backing the suspension of that principal,  but it was obvious from their careful public language (emphasizing the suspension is a state controlled issue and not originating with the local district) that they realize there's still a lot of anti-masking and/or anti-vaxxing sentiment around here.

Meanwhile everything about the stats on deaths from covid continue to point to lack of vaccination as key to that end point.  Yet the politicization of responses to covid continues.   I don't get it.  What do the objectors think is the reason other countries with better adherence to guidelines have better stats on how they've fared in this pandemic?     God's punishing the USA for being wicked or something like that?   How resisting vaccination (short of personalized medical advice against it) or not wearing a mask makes one more perfect in God's eyes sure beats me.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> What covid stupidity has reduced some "adults" to...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443576917773324301/




Scenes like this makes me want to root for a quick demise to this stupidity. You can interpret that anyway you like <cough> _Darwin Awards._ 

This type of thinking does not deserve success. A pox on your houses with a caveat… _the arrogance of ignorance_, you’d fling you mask away, happily breath deep, shouting your BS until individually you realize you are in deep shit medically, and then whimper like a baby crying to be saved. So sad, for the human species. Do us a favor and win you award.


----------



## lizkat

There's some truth though that mocking anti-vaxxers or even trying to educate as to the safety and success stats of getting vaccinated doesn't really work well for die-hard opponents. 

What does have some success, apparently, is taking the tack that has been taken in the past by public health officials and doctors when people resist vaccination for measles, mumps, etc.  It amounts to scaring them, but not with horror stories, just information on the potential undesirable health complications of a non-fatal case of those illnesses, e.g. a potential for sterility in the case of mumps infection   So maybe media should focus more on some of the research still ongoing with respect to  aftereffects of covid in the body, and including the dread  "long covid" in which assorted functional deficits persist for long periods of time.


----------



## DT

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443625318414176261/


----------



## Huntn

lizkat said:


> There's some truth though that mocking anti-vaxxers or even trying to educate as to the safety and success stats of getting vaccinated doesn't really work well for die-hard opponents.
> 
> What does have some success, apparently, is taking the tack that has been taken in the past by public health officials and doctors when people resist vaccination for measles, mumps, etc.  It amounts to scaring them, but not with horror stories, just information on the potential undesirable health complications of a non-fatal case of those illnesses, e.g. a potential for sterility in the case of mumps infection   So maybe media should focus more on some of the research still ongoing with respect to  aftereffects of covid in the body, and including the dread  "long covid" in which assorted functional deficits persist for long periods of time.



If education does not work, then really it’s a dead end along with some of them.  Their eyes and ears are shut, where does that leave us in a pandemic? Let me think, businesses shut, hospital ICUs full. What we really needed was a pandemic with a 30%+ death rate, then maybe it would get though to STUPID and help the planet too.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> What covid stupidity has reduced some "adults" to...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443576917773324301/




If that's not against the law, then we should create a new law.  If you're caught harassing school children like this, you go to jail.  That's just unacceptable.


----------



## Renzatic

JayMysteri0 said:


> THIS does NOT need to happen!




No, it does need to happen. You can't fix stupid, and you can't save people from themselves. Let them eat Ivermectin.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> What covid stupidity has reduced some "adults" to...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443576917773324301/




I'd LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to show up with a sign that says "Don't be a sheep.  Slavery happened."  My guess is that the cops would suddenly find a reason to shut things down, if not me personally.  Because I'd wager good money that these are the same people that would shit their pants over a sign they _don't_ agree.


----------



## lizkat

MEJHarrison said:


> I'd LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to show up with a sign that says "Don't be a sheep.  Slavery happened."  My guess is that the cops would suddenly find a reason to shut things down, if not me personally.  Because I'd wager good money that these are the same people that would shit their pants over a sign they _don't_ agree.




Well here in northern Bible Belt, I can assure you that if there had been porch flags being flown during the Trump admin that spelled out "F Trump" in full view of the school bus routes, there would have been riots at the town council meetings if not some incidents of theft or outright vandalism just to get such flags gone the quick and easy way.

But when it's those "F Biden" flags being flown off porches,  there's just talk of free speech from the right,  and apparently zero recollection of past incidents where the same people tolerating such flags were complaining at town hall meetings about college students using profanity within the hearing of children in semi-public places like supermarkets or their parking lots.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443688752489156611/

Soooooooo, if the doctors' had treated her husband with horse dewormer ( which may go against their training ) and her husband still passed away, she would NOT be trying to sue?  

Really?


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443688752489156611/
> 
> Soooooooo, if the doctors' had treated her husband with horse dewormer ( which may go against their training ) and her husband still passed away, she would NOT be trying to sue?
> 
> Really?



“Real America’s Voice”??? What is ”real” America? Based on their Twitter feed, “real” America loves lip injections and worshipping Donald Trump and hates all liberals (aka socialists) and immigrants.


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> “Real America’s Voice”??? What is ”real” America? Based on their Twitter feed, “real” America loves lip injections and worshipping Donald Trump and hates all liberals (aka socialists) and immigrants.




well, yeah


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> You were warned. from
> HermanCainAward



I am not getting any sound.


----------



## fooferdoggie

see if this work

You were warned. from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## Runs For Fun

mic drop  





						Leonard Pitts Jr.
					

Political column from Leonard Pitts Jr.




					m.arcamax.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> “Real America’s Voice”??? What is ”real” America? Based on their Twitter feed, “real” America loves lip injections and worshipping Donald Trump and hates all liberals (aka socialists) and immigrants.




Listened to a podcast recently that explained the "real Americans" being people in rural areas campaign started in the 50’s to counter the more liberal, socialist, and communist ideas that tend to gain popularity in coastal cities.   People in rural ares tend to take more comfort in the status quo, are change adverse, and are more like, well, sheep politically.  Their concept of free thinking actually bolsters the status quo of the right.  Freedom to them means freedom from having to change.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Listened to a podcast recently that explained the "real Americans" being people in rural areas campaign started in the 50’s to counter the more liberal, socialist, and communist ideas that tend to gain popularity in coastal cities.   People in rural ares tend to take more comfort in the status quo, are change adverse, and are more like, well, sheep politically.  Their concept of free thinking actually bolsters the status quo of the right.  Freedom to them means freedom from having to change.



In my opinion, this leads to a stagnant society. Do you know who else didn’t embrace change? Every fallen empire of the past.


----------



## Yoused

The Nisqually Tribe had a safe space in the small town of Roy WA for tribal members to quarantine while recovering from the virus. They did some clearing, making the cabins visible to the highway and the nutbags started posting online that it was some sort of concentration camp that should be burned down, forcing the tribe to evacuate the people there.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1443915652050345988/


----------



## Eric

Nailed it.


Happening now. Dallas, Texas. from
      pics


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yes, vaccine mandates can work

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1444741887160725510/



> Andrew Wiggins update: Warriors wing gets COVID-19 vaccine, Steve Kerr says - Sports Illustrated
> 
> 
> Wiggins would not have been eligible to play in home games for the Warriors had he not been vaccinated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.si.com





> Warriors wing Andrew Wiggins has received the COVID-19 vaccine, coach Steve Kerr told reporters Sunday.
> 
> Wiggins's vaccination status had been a focal point in recent weeks as San Francisco is one of two local jurisdictions in NBA markets that is requiring people to be fully vaccinated to be allowed indoors for entertainment.
> 
> As a result, Wiggins would not have been eligible to play in home games for the Warriors had he not been vaccinated.
> 
> Wiggins was asked to clarify his vaccination status last Monday during Media Day but declined, saying, "it's none of your business."
> 
> On Wednesday, NBA spokesperson Mike Bass said that players who do not comply with local vaccination requirements will not be paid for the games that they miss due to their status. Wiggins would have been subject to such a policy.





> In March, Wiggins said publicly he would not be getting the vaccine.
> 
> "To each his own, really. Whoever wants to get it, can get it; whoever doesn't want to get it, don't get it," Wiggins said. "Right now, I'm not getting it, but it's no knock on anyone else that's getting it. I make my own decisions. But right now, I decided not to get it.
> 
> "I'm just going to keep fighting for what I believe and for what I believe is right. What's right to one person, isn't right to the other and vice versa."




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1444744804257214472/

When push comes to shove for many this sudden concern for personal liberties when it comes to vaccines that they didn't have before, tends to disappear when their check is affected.  Yes it's a personal choice to get or NOT get the vaccine.  It's no longer a personal choice if you interact with others who may not have your lack of concern about catching Covid.  It's one thing if your job is to play basketball alone in your house on your gaming system.  It's another thing when you are on a court with others breathing & sweating on them possibly endangering OTHERS health.  As well as possibly risking the team's finances in missed games or worse.

As I posted earlier, we are getting to this point with those concerned with feelings over...






https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1444743113243717633/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1444746115258085377/


----------



## Runs For Fun

Oh this is brilliant. I love it!


----------



## Runs For Fun

More

UPDATE: Halloween Tombstones Decor - thanks for all the suggestions! from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## Yoused

I was browsing through the biography section of the local Sunday paper and saw one that said the woman had succumbed to "vaccine induced thrombotic thrombocytopenia". Each of those four words means an actual meaning. Assembled in that construction, they mean "self-proctology".


----------



## Eric

She did her own research


----------



## Huntn

Yoused said:


> I was browsing through the biography section of the local Sunday paper and saw one that said the woman had succumbed to "vaccine induced thrombotic thrombocytopenia". Each of those four words means an actual meaning. Assembled in that construction, they mean "self-proctology".



What?
I looked it up:








						Vaccine-induced Thrombotic Thrombocytopenia (VITT) and COVID-19 Vaccines: What Cardiovascular Clinicians Need to Know - American College of Cardiology
					






					www.acc.org
				



_VITT is characterized by the presence of two conditions concurrently: thrombosis (often in unusual sites like the cerebral veins or splanchnic veins) thrombocytopenia. Early mechanistic evaluations have identified antibodies directed against the platelet factor 4 (PF4)-heparin complex which activate platelets, similar to HIT antibodies. Detection of the PF4 antibodies can be done using a HIT ELISA test, but not reliably with other HIT laboratory tests.

The incidence of VITT is not certain, but it appears to be extremely rare._


Thrombosis- Thrombosis is the formation of a blood clot inside a blood vessel, obstructing the flow of blood through the circulatory system

Thrombocytopenia- is a condition characterized by abnormally low levels of platelets, also known as thrombocytes, in the blood


----------



## SuperMatt

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445123241413160963/

They don’t want anybody interfering in their lives by “forcing” them to get a shot. But they have zero problem going around interfering in a violent way in others’ lives.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445123241413160963/
> 
> They don’t want anybody interfering in their lives by “forcing” them to get a shot. But they have zero problem going around interfering in a violent way in others’ lives.



they are just doing their research on the tent


----------



## Yoused

Huntn said:


> What?
> I looked it up:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vaccine-induced Thrombotic Thrombocytopenia (VITT) and COVID-19 Vaccines: What Cardiovascular Clinicians Need to Know - American College of Cardiology
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.acc.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _VITT is characterized by the presence of two conditions concurrently: thrombosis (often in unusual sites like the cerebral veins or splanchnic veins) thrombocytopenia. Early mechanistic evaluations have identified antibodies directed against the platelet factor 4 (PF4)-heparin complex which activate platelets, similar to HIT antibodies. Detection of the PF4 antibodies can be done using a HIT ELISA test, but not reliably with other HIT laboratory tests.
> 
> The incidence of VITT is not certain, but it appears to be extremely rare._
> 
> 
> Thrombosis- Thrombosis is the formation of a blood clot inside a blood vessel, obstructing the flow of blood through the circulatory system
> 
> Thrombocytopenia- is a condition characterized by abnormally low levels of platelets, also known as thrombocytes, in the blood




Nonetheless, thrombotic thrombocytopenia is not a fatal condition. It is easily treatable. The author of the "biography" in question was using the opportunity to politicize the biography page, which is not ok.


----------



## JayMysteri0

The mealy mouthed fuckery. 

I also love the reaction of someone who's NOT used to facing some pushback.

To then spin around & cry about partisanship, when your decision making is based on partisanship.

And the clincher... bringing in AOC...


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> The mealy mouthed fuckery.
> 
> I also love the reaction of someone who's NOT used to facing some pushback.
> 
> To then spin around & cry about partisanship, when your decision making is based on partisanship.
> 
> And the clincher... bringing in AOC...



What an entitled butt-head. “You asked ME to come…” This is the same turd that sued a school district because he wanted to coach sports teams there, and the school decided he was probably too busy as governor to have time to focus on the kids.


----------



## Huntn

Yoused said:


> Nonetheless, thrombotic thrombocytopenia is not a fatal condition. It is easily treatable. The author of the "biography" in question was using the opportunity to politicize the biography page, which is not ok.



I posted because I had never heard of It or knew what it was.


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> What an entitled butt-head. “You asked ME to come…” This is the same turd that sued a school district because he wanted to coach sports teams there, and the school decided he was probably too busy as governor to have time to focus on the kids.



He made a calculation based not on what is prudent, the smart and necessary thing,  but based it on the next election and what the numnuts back home would regard  as a violation of _my freedom to be stupid!!   _


----------



## SuperMatt

Huntn said:


> He made a calculation based not on what is prudent, the smart and necessary thing,  but based it on the next election and what the numnuts back home would regard  as a violation of _my freedom to be stupid!!  _



Number one Album among Republicans in 2021:


----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> Nonetheless, thrombotic thrombocytopenia is not a fatal condition. It is easily treatable. The author of the "biography" in question was using the opportunity to politicize the biography page, which is not ok.



Khmmm. It can be fatal if undiagnosed or if it presents with a massive pulmonary embolism. Let’s not trivialize this.


----------



## Pumbaa

P_X said:


> Khmmm. It can be fatal if undiagnosed or if it presents with a massive pulmonary embolism. Let’s not trivialize this.



Thanks for trying to keep things correct and clear of stupid.

Hope @Weaselbot won’t suspend you.


----------



## JayMysteri0

There's always receipts

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445395611960893446/


----------



## Roller

SuperMatt said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445123241413160963/
> 
> They don’t want anybody interfering in their lives by “forcing” them to get a shot. But they have zero problem going around interfering in a violent way in others’ lives



I have no patience or empathy left for these people. I don't mean the ones who have legitimate questions about vaccine safety who can be engaged with — it's the folks who've gone over the edge, with so much rage that they take down a COVID testing booth. It's their choice not to get vaccinated and suffer the consequences, whether it's losing their livelihood, getting sick, or dying. But I can't abide what they do to the rest of us by spreading disease and limiting access to care.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Well, 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445566038855217158/

...that happened.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Texas Man Gets Prison Time for Facebook Hoax About Covid-19 Patient Licking Grocery Items​








						Covid-19 Hoax on Facebook Gets Texas Man 15 Months in Prison
					

The 40-year-old has been sentenced to 15 months for hoaxes related to biological weapons.




					gizmodo.com


----------



## Huntn

Roller said:


> I have no patience or empathy left for these people. I don't mean the ones who have legitimate questions about vaccine safety who can be engaged with — it's the folks who've gone over the edge, with so much rage that they take down a COVID testing booth. It's their choice not to get vaccinated and suffer the consequences, whether it's losing their livelihood, getting sick, or dying. But I can't abide what they do to the rest of us by spreading disease and limiting access to care.



They don’t even understand what liberty means, it’s just _me, me, my, my, my right to be stupid and endanger you.   _


----------



## Eric

fooferdoggie said:


> Texas Man Gets Prison Time for Facebook Hoax About Covid-19 Patient Licking Grocery Items​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Covid-19 Hoax on Facebook Gets Texas Man 15 Months in Prison
> 
> 
> The 40-year-old has been sentenced to 15 months for hoaxes related to biological weapons.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com



This is what Republicans regard as "free speech" but it actually has far reaching consequences. Additionally, FB is like a trojan horse, feeding this sort of misinformation to the most ignorant of people. It's time for Congress to act.

Glad to see this is finally being taken seriously, I hope it sets a precedent going forward.


----------



## Edd

Eric said:


> This is what Republicans regard as "free speech" but it actually has far reaching consequences. Additionally, FB is like a trojan horse, feeding this sort of misinformation to the most ignorant of people. It's time for Congress to act.
> 
> Glad to see this is finally being taken seriously, I hope it sets a precedent going forward.



Kinda related, but Alex Jones losing in court recently makes me happy, but it’s not clear yet how much he’ll really pay. I want it to hurt badly. Without painful consequences these fuckers won’t stop telling harmful lies.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> This is what Republicans regard as "free speech" but it actually has far reaching consequences. Additionally, FB is like a trojan horse, feeding this sort of misinformation to the most ignorant of people. It's time for Congress to act.
> 
> Glad to see this is finally being taken seriously, I hope it sets a precedent going forward.




_“Perez’s actions were *knowingly designed to spread fear and panic* and today’s sentencing illustrates the seriousness of this crime. The FBI would like to thank our law enforcement partners for their help in this case.”_

Isn't that Fox News' tagline?


----------



## lizkat

Lindsey Graham can't even pitch _*thinking *_about getting vaccinated to constituents down home in South Carolina... they booed him.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445547364547055621/


----------



## Edd

lizkat said:


> Lindsey Graham can't even pitch _*thinking *_about getting vaccinated to constituents down home in South Carolina... they booed him.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445547364547055621/



First response to that tweet 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445556220639604739/

Those dopes have $? It is a fundraiser. They can all get fucked.


----------



## Yoused

Edd said:


> Kinda related, but Alex Jones losing in court recently makes me happy, but it’s not clear yet how much he’ll really pay. I want it to hurt badly. Without painful consequences these fuckers won’t stop telling harmful lies.




He may have screwed himself by not responding to court orders to provide discovery. In a case like that, he lacks any grounds for appeal, as far as I can tell. If he had lost the case, he might be able to reach SCotUS on appeals and obtain a judgement that harmful lies have 1A protection (this turdy SCotUS might well come down on his side), but when you straight up lose by default (equivalent to a FTA), there does not seem to be anything to appeal.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JFC…….








						Documents: Murder suspect wanted to confront pharmacist brother over COVID-19 vaccine
					

The man accused of killing three people wanted to confront his brother, who he's accused of killing, based on his profession and COVID-19 vaccines.




					www.wbaltv.com


----------



## Huntn

Edd said:


> First response to that tweet
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445556220639604739/
> 
> Those dopes have $? It is a fundraiser. They can all get fucked.



Holy crap. The Koolaid drinkers chugged it and now they expect Lindsey to keep drinking.   He will get tossed out to be replaced by another MTG whack job.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445749433140924417/


He doesn't know kids aldready get vaccines?  Ooh boy!  When he finds out...





https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445854691569672195/


----------



## Edd

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445749433140924417/
> 
> 
> He doesn't know kids aldready get vaccines?  Ooh boy!  When he finds out...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445854691569672195/



Oh man, he recorded that, perhaps watched it, and said “Yep, this should be on the internet!”


----------



## Eric

Do you even have developed delts, bro?


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> Do you even have developed delts, bro?
> 
> View attachment 9054



I assume this was in the MR Community forum, non-political COVID thread? Who knows why Ethrem  had extreme pain in his arm after his COVID shot. Both of my shots, I had minimal, just noticeable soreness that was gone by the day after.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Maryland man allegedly fatally shot his pharmacist brother for ‘killing people’ with the COVID vaccine, court records show​








						Maryland man allegedly fatally shot his pharmacist brother for ‘killing people’ with the COVID vaccine, court records show
					

A Cumberland man allegedly killed his brother and sister-in-law in their Ellicott City home last week because his brother, a pharmacist, administered COVID-19 vaccines, according to charging documents filed Wednesday in a Howard County court. Jeffrey Burnham told his mother he had to confront...




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Doctors grow frustrated over COVID-19 denial, misinformation​The COVID-19 patient’s health was deteriorating quickly at a Michigan hospital, but he was having none of the doctor’s diagnosis. Despite dangerously low oxygen levels, the unvaccinated man didn’t think he was that sick and got so irate over a hospital policy forbidding his wife from being at his bedside that he threatened to walk out of the building.

Dr. Matthew Trunsky didn’t hold back in his response: “You are welcome to leave, but you will be dead before you get to your car,’” he said.

Such exchanges have become all-too-common for medical workers who are growing weary of COVID-19 denial and misinformation that have made it exasperating to treat unvaccinated patients during the delta-driven surge.

The Associated Press asked six doctors from across the country to describe the types of misinformation and denial they see on a daily basis and how they respond to it. 











						Doctors grow frustrated over COVID-19 denial, misinformation
					

The COVID-19 patient's health was deteriorating quickly at a Michigan hospital, but he was having none of the doctor's diagnosis. Despite dangerously low oxygen levels, the unvaccinated man didn't think he was that sick and got so irate over a hospital policy forbidding his wife from being at...




					apnews.com


----------



## Herdfan

"I am just wearing it because I have a Republican tracker here" - Rep. Tlaib caught on video referring to her mask.

If you wonder why people are not following guidelines or not getting vaccinated, look no further than our politicians.


----------



## JayMysteri0

There's mocking shitty behavior because it's over the top, then there's behavior that's just unfuckingforgivable, because some people can't get out of their d@mn feelings.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445849453471014916/

Yet if their children were being chased by some mythical maniacal mask dictators, these people would be screaming for the Army to step in for protection.


----------



## DT

Eric said:


> Do you even have developed delts, bro?




Hahaha, posted about that already, hahahaha!

He must be a lightweight, I'm so ripped, the virus is too scared to get near me ...


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> There's mocking shitty behavior because it's over the top, then there's behavior that's just unfuckingforgivable, because some people can't get out of their d@mn feelings.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1445849453471014916/
> 
> Yet if their children were being chased by some mythical maniacal mask dictators, these people would be screaming for the Army to step in for protection.




That's really F-ed up, seriously, someone might get a free trip to the ER getting up in my child's face like that.


----------



## Eric

DT said:


> Hahaha, posted about that already, hahahaha!
> 
> He must be a lightweight, I'm so ripped, the virus is too scared to get near me ...



Yeah but not where is fragile ego can see it.


----------



## DT

My immune system benches 350 !!!


----------



## Eric

This woman is going to die as a result of refusing the vaccine, you just can't wrap your head around something so senseless.









						UCHealth denies kidney transplant to unvaccinated woman in stage 5 renal failure
					

A Colorado woman with stage 5 renal failure is scrambling to find a new hospital to get a kidney transplant after she and her donor were denied the transplant at one hospital due to them being unvaccinated.




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Eric said:


> This woman is going to die as a result of refusing the vaccine, you just can't wrap your head around something so senseless.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> UCHealth denies kidney transplant to unvaccinated woman in stage 5 renal failure
> 
> 
> A Colorado woman with stage 5 renal failure is scrambling to find a new hospital to get a kidney transplant after she and her donor were denied the transplant at one hospital due to them being unvaccinated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.foxnews.com



lets see no kidney you will die vaccine you will die much worser I guess.


----------



## Eric

fooferdoggie said:


> lets see no kidney you will die vaccine you will die much worser I guess.



Hospitals have had enough of Karen's shit, they're flat out refusing any transplants unless they're vaccinated.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> If you wonder why people are not following guidelines or not getting vaccinated, look no further than our politicians.




While they should be setting a good example, I wouldn't go so far as to blame them.  Only an idiot would base their life on "what would a politician do?"  I suspect the vast majority are simply using politicians as a good excuse to do the wrong thing.  The Lindsey Graham video points that out pretty clearly.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Eric said:


> Hospitals have had enough of Karen's shit, they're flat out refusing any transplants unless they're vaccinated.



well this is not new they required all vaccinations before. what a stupid hill to die on. no other place is going to give her a transplant so either she gets a vaccination or she dies. well maybe a back street kidney transplant would work.


----------



## fooferdoggie




----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

fooferdoggie said:


> View attachment 9073




Ironically that truck screams probable child molester.


----------



## SuperMatt

Ron DeSantis: “I’m cutting funding to schools that have mask mandates because I love to see kids dying in the hospitals!"
Joe Biden: “Fuck off. I am giving federal money to everybody you tried to de-fund."
DeSantis: “Oh yeah? For every dollar you send, I’m taking a dollar away from them!"



			https://wapo.st/3aj4YCz
		

(Paywall removed)

Shame on DeSantis for actively working to kill people. I know there is a very special place in Hell waiting, probably in the same cell block as other infamous genocidal maniacs of old. I just wish we could get some pictures when the time comes.

Right-wingers: YOU CANNOT DEFUND POLICE!
Also Right-wingers: DEFUNDING SCHOOLS IS AWESOME!!

Think about what you get if you put more money into policing than into education. 

You get....

*Florida!*


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Cuyahoga Falls student, 10, tells anti-maskers: 'Please be quiet. It's inappropriate'
					

The youngest person who spoke Wednesday to the Cuyahoga Falls Board of Education about the mask mandate stood her ground against mask opponents.



					www.beaconjournal.com
				




Bravo.  A 10-year-old is more emotionally mature and respectful than grown ass adults who are frequently moved to weeping over the thought of wearing a mask.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Really good read.








						Ivermectin: How false science created a Covid 'miracle' drug
					

Thousands worldwide have taken ivermectin to fight Covid. But what's the evidence?



					www.bbc.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

man this is funny as hell.

Anti-vaxxers turn up at police HQ to report Covid vaccine for ‘attempted murder’​








						Anti-vaxxers turn up at police HQ to report Covid vaccine for 'attempted murder'
					

The group told police the vaccine was being 'given to children against their will'.




					metro.co.uk


----------



## Roller

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1446490840000446465/

I've read several accounts of life in the ICU during the pandemic, but this is one of the best. Even in normal times, ICUs are ultra high-stress facilities staffed by dedicated people who do their best around the clock to keep patients alive and, whenever possible, to move to a lower level of acute care. The work is all the much harder when the need for ICU admission, and even for hospitalization, was preventable.

If I had my way, purveyors of COVID-19 lies like Tucker Carlson would be forced to spend time in ICUs witnessing what they've wrought and have their sleep pierced by endless nightmares.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1446891200552767490/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Roller said:


> If I had my way, purveyors of COVID-19 lies like Tucker Carlson would be forced to spend time in ICUs witnessing what they've wrought and have their sleep pierced by endless nightmares.




That's working under the misconception that Tucker Carlson has a conscience to cause nightmares.

I believe carlson established long ago, that wasn't the case.


----------



## JayMysteri0

...And some more feelings inspired shittiness

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1446856020073062400/


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> ...And some more feelings inspired shittiness
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1446856020073062400/




Last time I took the train, on a 2-day trip, the car attendant advised us that if we were intractably petulant about the mask rule, we would be put off in the next town (some of which were in BFE) with a national perma-ban on train, airplane and bus travel. It seems as though some of these people fail to grasp the gravity of being a maskhole.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SMH








						Apple Store security guard stabbed over face mask dispute in NYC | CNN
					

A dispute over wearing a face mask led to the stabbing of an Apple Store security guard Friday, a spokesperson with the New York City Police Department told CNN.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1446875927456190470/


> Los Angeles firefighters sue city, seek halt to vaccine mandate
> 
> 
> A group of more than 500 Los Angeles Fire Department employees has sued the city of Los Angeles in an effort to prevent the vaccine mandate for city employees from being enforced. The L.A. City Cou…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ktla.com



The part that just made me tired of this shit...


> The filing directly referenced the City Council’s vaccine mandate and the 13-0 vote that approved it, s*aying the firefighters are “pawns in a political chess match, ordered by thirteen politicians on the Los Angeles City Council to inject themselves with an experimental vaccine*—over their objections—or lose their jobs.”






> Robert F. Kennedy Jr., son of the late senator and presidential candidate and a prominent anti-vaccine activist, is also listed as an attorney for the firefighters, pending approval to represent clients in California on this case alone.
> 
> On Twitter, Kennedy often pushes back against vaccine mandates.




Really?  The fire fighters are pawns of the politicians?

Really?

Ya hired an anti vaxxer lawyer, as opposed to a lawyer who would try to argue under some actual civil liberty issues, and your pawns of the politicians?

Really?

FFS


----------



## ronntaylor

Took Amtrak from NYC to Virginia. Unlike the last trip South, the staff were on top of masking policies. Constant reminders after every major stop. Direct warnings to 3/4 people, including for not wearing masks properly (mostly a couple people with it below the nose) and ultimately had someone nearly escorted off the train for a third interaction. The police at that stop had him taken to the platform and after his nearly tear-filled plea, allowed him back on. But onto another car as we were fed up with him in the Quiet Car. He was the third person kicked from the Quiet Car. Usually fellow passengers will politely inform you if you're violating the policy. This trip people were quick with calling staff members over if they didn't confront people directly..

Didn't see a single person without a mask and except for the few assholes mentioned above, everyone wore them properly. Getting update on Monday on how the county and our particular district is doing in terms of the Pandemic. I know at the two local universities dozens got COVID-19 within the first week of classes. They're too relaxed about the Pandemic and it wouldn't surprise me if there's a return to remote learning this semester. Not looking forward to the next 2-3 weeks.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> Do you even have developed delts, bro?
> 
> View attachment 9054



Thanks, my wife has a bad day and this cracked her up too
This could make the "how can you tell you have a personality disorder without telling that you have such".


----------



## JayMysteri0

Pointing out the bullshit in how people use religion in this country.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447185395356037121/


----------



## Herdfan

Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated.  And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.

But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?




That's the scary potentiality being thrown about, but thus far, it doesn't seem to be the case.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated.  And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.
> 
> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?



Are you serious?

First, workers are OVERWHELMINGLY complying with vaccine mandates. We are talking well over 90% of people are willing to get the shot even if they disagree, because they need their job.

Second, the ICU beds are full of PEOPLE DYING OF COVID!!!!! This is a much larger cause of people quitting than having to get the vaccine.









						‘Nursing Is in Crisis’: Staff Shortages Put Patients at Risk (Published 2021)
					

“When hospitals are understaffed, people die,” one expert warned as the U.S. health systems reach a breaking point in the face of the Delta variant.




					www.nytimes.com
				




Third, do you want a nurse infected with COVID taking care of you if you’re in the ICU?

Vaccine mandates are working.









						Vaccine compliance high among health care workers here | HeraldNet.com
					

Providence reports 92%; Swedish 98%; EvergreenHealth in Monroe over 95%.




					www.heraldnet.com
				






> At Novant Health, a large hospital group based in North Carolina, 375 workers were suspended after not meeting the system’s vaccination’ deadline this month. Another 200 agreed to comply, increasing the *vaccination rate to over 99 percent* of its more than 35,000 employees, according to Novant.











						Many health workers at big U.S. hospital chains with vaccine mandates are getting shots. (Published 2021)
					

Some employees left their posts in protest, but a hefty majority, particularly at large hospital chains, appear to be complying.




					www.nytimes.com
				




Here’s another what if: What if Republicans actually looked at the numbers and/or did a bit of research every once in a while? Then maybe we wouldn’t have all the voting restrictions to prevent virtually non-existent voter fraud. Or we wouldn’t ban abortions even though legal bans are shown to have no downward effect on the number of abortions performed. Or we would have saved a few hundred thousands lives from COVID… etc.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Renzatic said:


> That's the scary potentiality being thrown about, but thus far, it doesn't seem to be the case.



Because what's being done is to avoid a different scary potentional.

Health care workers infecting others, in the last place anyone should get Covid.

Police officers already dying more from Covid than on the job instances.

Or more directly protecting occupations considered vital from becoming zones of outbreak, thus crippling them from doing their necessary tasks in already risk heavy stressful jobs.

It's one thing to see things as "cheering" someone losing their job, it's another to see it as "cheering" that efforts are being made to protect those who are most often the most vulnerable who will have to interact with those individuals.  It's important to see what motivation drives that perception.


----------



## SuperMatt

https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/c/embed/694e9f6d-c573-4d52-9841-39acdae42624

Tried to embed the video without success…

It talks about vaccination efforts in West Virginia. The last minute of the video - an interview with a WV resident who didn’t want the vaccine explains exactly why vaccine mandates work.

People don‘t want to wear seatbelts, but you make them do it to protect them. Same with the vaccine.


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated.  And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.
> 
> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?



The problem with insufficient ICU and other acute care beds predated vaccine mandates and is largely due to mostly unvaccinated patients with COVID-19. The "my body, my choice" crowd seem to think that neither the government nor businesses have the right to require vaccination, but can't explain why COVID is different than all the other vaccines that have long been required to attend school, serve in the military, travel, work, and so on. And, in some cases, they're even being offered the alternative of repeated testing.

So, when you or your family suffer or die because you can't get needed care, you can blame all the patients who have crowded hospitals because they refused a no-cost, effective vaccine. The latter includes the patient who apparently was refused an organ transplant because they declined vaccination. These people are at higher risk of severe COVID because of the immunosuppressive medications they receive. What idiocy!


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Are you serious?
> 
> First, workers are OVERWHELMINGLY complying with vaccine mandates. We are talking well over 90% of people are willing to get the shot even if they disagree, because they need their job.



Deadly (NPI).









						The Vaccine Mandate For Healthcare Workers Means Hospitals Are Losing Staff
					

New York healthcare workers must be vaccinated for COVID-19 or lose their jobs. At one rural hospital, opposition to the vaccine is exacerbating an existing labor shortage, forcing cuts to services.




					www.npr.org
				








__





						Bloomberg - Are you a robot?
					





					www.bloomberg.com
				






> Nearly one in four beds lies empty at TaraVista Behavioral Health Center in central Massachusetts -- not for lack of patients, but for lack of staff.
> 
> Even before the pandemic, nurses and lower-paid aides were in perennially short supply, but the 116-bed facility could still run full, said Chief Executive Officer Michael Krupa. At similar hospitals around Massachusetts, hundreds of beds can’t be filled, and “the reason is exclusively staff,” he said.






			https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/oregon/articles/2021-10-07/vaccine-mandate-latest-hurdle-in-oregon-nursing-shortage
		




> Currently, 90% of the members in the Oregon Nurses Association — the state's largest nursing union, which represents 15,000 people — are vaccinated.




Yes, 90% is a good number, but can the state's healthcare system afford to lose 10% of their nurses when they are already short staffed?

Another thought.  We asked these HC workers to help us during the pandemic.  They put themselves and their families at risk to take care of those seriously ill with COVID.  Now we are ready to kick them to the curb.  The question is what will happen in 5 years when the next virus escapes from a lab?  Are they going to be willing to do it again?


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated.  And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.
> 
> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?



Yet again, another pile of steaming horseshite posed as a faux question. You can take a break now, you've met your weekly quota.
I think your quarterly "masks are sooo hard, but I comply" swan song is also coming due soon.

My wife happens to be an ICU nurse and well, the staffing issue is secondary to nurses burning out and/or taking very well-paying traveling jobs in the COVID-ridden South. And as @Roller said these largely Southern hospitals are filled with people who "refused to live in fear".

The thing is, ICU nurses are the cream of the crop, which also means they are much more likely to understand why vaccines are mandated and thus get vaccinated.. If you cared about the demographic distribution of unvaccinated workers, you'd always see how robust the inverse correlation is with education level and that includes healthcare too, which means it isn't physicians or RNs who are the bulk of the unvaccinated healthcare worker population.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?




You do the right thing because it's the right thing to do, not because you got a particular percentage of people to agree to it.  You don't let the vocal minority manipulate you into doing the dumb thing.  You don't let the stupid dictate what is reasonable.

Maybe some bad things will happen as a consequence.  But you'd need to prove nothing bad would happen by doing the wrong thing before you'd have a valid argument.  All you have at this point is hypotheticals.

If none of that makes sense, I leave you with a hypothetical of my own: But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired keep working and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them due to them catching it from the very people who are supposed to be there healing people?

As long as we're making up scenarios, I think mine is every bit as valid as yours.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated.  And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.
> 
> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?



I refuse to be treated by an unvaccinated health-care worker.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> Deadly (NPI).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Vaccine Mandate For Healthcare Workers Means Hospitals Are Losing Staff
> 
> 
> New York healthcare workers must be vaccinated for COVID-19 or lose their jobs. At one rural hospital, opposition to the vaccine is exacerbating an existing labor shortage, forcing cuts to services.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bloomberg - Are you a robot?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bloomberg.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/oregon/articles/2021-10-07/vaccine-mandate-latest-hurdle-in-oregon-nursing-shortage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 90% is a good number, but can the state's healthcare system afford to lose 10% of their nurses when they are already short staffed?
> 
> Another thought.  We asked these HC workers to help us during the pandemic.  They put themselves and their families at risk to take care of those seriously ill with COVID.  Now we are ready to kick them to the curb.  The question is what will happen in 5 years when the next virus escapes from a lab?  Are they going to be willing to do it again?



Oh, absolutely fuck you, LOL

^This is the proportionate effort response to your post above, but below is the response you don't deserve, but still get:

Edit:
NONE of the 3 articles posted by you supports the point you are trying to make. Quite the opposite:



> Oregon's hospital staffing issue has been significantly exacerbated during the pandemic. On Thursday, officials from the Oregon Nurses Association said 60% of nurses at the state's largest hospital — Oregon Health & Science University — indicated that they are considering leaving the profession entirely.






> “The current nursing crisis the state of Oregon is facing … has been decades in the making,” Natasha Schwartz, a member on the Oregon Nurses Association Board of Directors, said during a news conference. “As we see a small number of nurses potentially leave the profession due to their decision to decline the vaccination, we are also concerned burnout will lead to an even larger number of nurses leaving the bedside — and in Oregon, we will not be able to educate a large enough number of nurses to replace them.”






> Health care workers say the staffing crisis is a culmination of issues, including *reliance on traveling nurses*, pay disparities, “hospital executives who have consistently chosen to put profit ahead of patients” and the *pandemic — which has resulted in overworked and exhausted employees.*




In contrast, they mostly support that assholes exacerbating the pandemic drive away nurses from the profession.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Deadly (NPI).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Vaccine Mandate For Healthcare Workers Means Hospitals Are Losing Staff
> 
> 
> New York healthcare workers must be vaccinated for COVID-19 or lose their jobs. At one rural hospital, opposition to the vaccine is exacerbating an existing labor shortage, forcing cuts to services.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bloomberg - Are you a robot?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bloomberg.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/oregon/articles/2021-10-07/vaccine-mandate-latest-hurdle-in-oregon-nursing-shortage
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, 90% is a good number, but can the state's healthcare system afford to lose 10% of their nurses when they are already short staffed?
> 
> Another thought.  We asked these HC workers to help us during the pandemic.  They put themselves and their families at risk to take care of those seriously ill with COVID.  Now we are ready to kick them to the curb.  The question is what will happen in 5 years when the next virus escapes from a lab?  Are they going to be willing to do it again?



The NUMBER ONE complaint from nurses is that people aren’t getting the vaccine, and showing up demanding treatment. You really are working hard to make sure that this thread is aptly named.

I highly recommend the video I posted. See what healthcare workers in WV are going through because nobody will get the vaccine. Then look what happens when there is a vaccine mandate… people begrudgingly go and get it because they need their jobs. This is good for their health, and also good when they realize it didn’t hurt them to get the shot.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Yet again, another pile of steaming horseshite posed as a faux question. You can take a break now, you've met your weekly quota.
> I think your quarterly "masks are sooo hard, but I comply" swan song is also coming due soon.
> 
> 
> The thing is, ICU nurses are the cream of the crop, which also means they are much more likely to understand why vaccines are mandated and thus get vaccinated.. If you cared about the demographic distribution of unvaccinated workers, you'd always see how robust the inverse correlation is with education level and that includes healthcare too, which means it isn't physicians or RNs who are the bulk of the unvaccinated healthcare worker population.




Sorry, but I haven't really been on a mask rant on this board.  Maybe a few comments, but nothing like over at PRSI.  Mainly because my governor rescinded the mandate and has publicly stated he will not impose another one.  So for me, that topic is mainly dead.  Besides, I am vaccinated and the President has said on more than one occasion that vaccinated people can't get it or spread it so I don't need a mask anymore anyway.  I assume he is correct.

Ok, so it may be the more educated HC workers, but can a hospital function without/with fewer aides, LPN's, cleaning staff or non-patient facing employees?


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> The NUMBER ONE complaint from nurses is that people aren’t getting the vaccine, and showing up demanding treatment. You really are working hard to make sure that this thread is aptly named.




I get that.  And it is a problem.  But not the only problem.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> Sorry, but I haven't really been on a mask rant on this board.  Maybe a few comments, but nothing like over at PRSI.  Mainly because my governor rescinded the mandate and has publicly stated he will not impose another one.  So for me, that topic is mainly dead.  Besides, I am vaccinated and the President has said on more than one occasion that vaccinated people can't get it or spread it so I don't need a mask anymore anyway.  I assume he is correct.
> 
> Ok, so it may be the more educated HC workers, but can a hospital function without/with fewer aides, LPN's, cleaning staff or non-patient facing employees?



You were trying to make a point about ICUs lacking nurses due to vaccine mandates. LPNs don't belong in an ICU. Nurses aides aren't always that helpful... So you would largely get ICU level of care. Nursing homes is another question, but if you don't understand why people working in nursing homes need to be vaccinated, then you're beyond hope.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> You were trying to make a point about ICUs lacking nurses due to vaccine mandates. LPNs don't belong in an ICU. Nurses aides aren't always that helpful... So you would largely get ICU level of care. Nursing homes is another question, *but if you don't understand why people working in nursing homes need to be vaccinated, then you're beyond hope.*




I completely understand the need.  However, what you, I or anyone else on this board thinks is irrelevant.  If healthcare workers are being fired because they are unvaccinated and staffing issues become worse, then it is a problem.  

Don't forget, one of the main reasons for me to get vaccinated when I did was so I could visit my mom in an assisted living facility.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Oh, absolutely fuck you, LOL
> 
> ^This is the proportionate effort response to your post above, but below is the response you don't deserve, but still get:
> 
> Edit:
> NONE of the 3 articles posted by you supports the point you are trying to make. Quite the opposite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In contrast, they mostly support that assholes exacerbating the pandemic drive away nurses from the profession.




I'm sorry, did I trigger you with a non-Fox source?  Go find a safe space and I will try to do better.

Yes, some are being driven away due to unvaccinated people.  I get that.  So with those people leaving and a certain percentage being fired for not being vaccinated, the end result is the same: too few HC workers.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> I completely understand the need.  However, what you, I or anyone else on this board thinks is irrelevant.  If healthcare workers are being fired because they are unvaccinated and staffing issues become worse, then it is a problem.




And if hospitals decide to keep these people on, and they end up spreading a highly infectious disease in, say, an oncology ward, well, that's a bit of a problem too.

Given that there's no good choice here, they're having to make a decision on whether to go with bad or worse.


----------



## Runs For Fun

My brain cannot twist enough to wrap my mind around this logic. Spend years in college studying this stuff and you complain about getting fired because you won't get a life saving vaccine because reasons. Uh, what???

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/comments/q4j6z7


----------



## Renzatic

Runs For Fun said:


> My brain cannot twist enough to wrap my mind around this logic. Spend years in college studying this stuff and you complain about getting fired because you won't get a life saving vaccine because reasons. Uh, what???




Hey guys! I spent all this time, money, and effort on a nursing degree, only to get canned because I got caught up in some fucking internet fad!


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Yes, some are being driven away due to unvaccinated people.  I get that.  So with those people leaving and a certain percentage being fired for not being vaccinated, the end result is the same: too few HC workers.



The first of these is an actual problem that is quite serious. The source for that info is in the articles you posted.

The problem of people being fired for vaccination is far less serious, as it impacts a very small number of people comparatively. Also, in the article you posted, the firings haven’t happened yet, so they are projecting what might happen. We already know what NOT vaccinating does.

Even people working at Tyson, processing chicken, need to get vaccinated. And they did get vaccinated:









						Tyson Foods hits 91 percent vaccination rate two months after mandate announced
					

Nearly two months after announcing a vaccine mandate for its employees, a top official at Tyson Foods revealed that 91 percent of its workforce is now fully vaccinated against COVID-19.Claudia Copl…




					thehill.com
				




There is literally ZERO excuse to allow healthcare workers to be unvaccinated. If they quit, good. They probably didn’t care about the patients very much to begin with if they were willing to carry diseases that could kill them.

Also, removing unvaccinated healthcare workers reduces the risk of infection for patients, so whatever small loss of workers is experienced, the remaining workers will be part of a safer environment for the patients.

But I guess you aren’t going to let go of this narrative no matter how badly the evidence is stacked against it? It feels like a contrarian stance for no other purpose than to be contrarian. It completely ignores any positive effects of requiring vaccines in the name of ”some healthcare workers might quit.” Yeah, and others might decide to take their jobs, knowing that they will be working with a 100% vaccinated workforce.


----------



## Renzatic

SuperMatt said:


> It feels like a contrarian stance for no other purpose than to be contrarian.




That's exactly what this is. I can think of no reason why a large group of people have suddenly decided to doubt 120 years of medical science, and all the experts thereof other than the fact they enjoy pissing in their own mouths for the pure spectacle of it.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> I'm sorry, did I trigger you with a non-Fox source?  Go find a safe space and I will try to do better.



Thanks, these two sentences sum you up quite well:
You receive the _effort-proportionate_ response to your repeatedly not reading YOUR OWN articles that actually contradict the point you're trying make. Yet, you still manage to bring up a conservative talking point about an imaginary phenomenon that has nothing to do with this discussion.

At this point, your primary skill is your absolute lack of shame about the level of ignorance you exhibit. Good on you.

*Luckily though, this is THE right thread for you.



Herdfan said:


> Yes, some are being driven away due to unvaccinated people.  I get that.  So with those people leaving and a certain percentage being fired for not being vaccinated, the end result is the same: too few HC workers.



You obviously need someone to read your linked articles for you and hold your hand interpreting them. Which one number is higher, 60% (of nurses consider leaving the field) or 10% (who let's say oppose the vaccine)? I'll help, 60% is the higher number, by 6-folds. This suggests that nurses switching careers is much more impactful than a vaccine mandate. If you cared more about nurses leaving the field you could reduce the burn out by not spreading stupid shit on the internetz.

Lastly, I agree with @Alli and @SuperMatt, we don't need nurses who don't believe in vaccines. We might be better off with them looking for another profession.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Alli said:


> I refuse to be treated by an unvaccinated health-care worker.



well you will know they have not been vaccinated if they don't glow.


----------



## User.45

fooferdoggie said:


> well you will know they have not been vaccinated if they don't glow.



You're joking but my workplace sent out glowing badge attachments to indicate your COVID vaxx status...


----------



## JayMysteri0

It's been shown before, but it really does help illustrate what we're dealing with...


----------



## JayMysteri0

Also
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447351979781595138/



> Eric Clapton reportedly donated £1,000 and lent his own van to anti-lockdown music group touring the UK
> 
> 
> Eric Clapton reportedly donated £1,000 and lent his own van to UK anti-lockdown music group Jam For Freedom, congratulating the founder for "great work".
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nme.com





> A new _Rolling Stone_ story reports on the guitarist’s support of Jam For Freedom, who describe their purpose as “spearheading the pro-freedom revolution happening globally as a response to restrictions on our basic human rights to work, travel and live” by playing free shows or ‘jams’ in public spaces. One of the group’s songs, ‘We Are The 99%’, features the lyric, “_stick your poisonous vaccine up your arse_“, the _Economist_ reported in July.
> 
> Clapton donated £1,000 to a GoFundMe page to help support the group, its founder Cambel McLaughlin told _Rolling Stone_. McLaughlin thought it could have been fake, but emailed the account listed with the donation and got a text from Clapton himself.
> 
> “It was something complimentary, along the lines of, ‘Hey, it’s Eric – great work you’re doing,’,” McLaughlin said of the text message.
> 
> Jam For Freedom revealed Clapton’s donation on social media in April. “Delighted to announce one of the greatest modern musicians alive has helped us stay afloat after damage to our equipment from police recklessness on Saturday,” they wrote at the time, referring to an encounter with the police they had at an anti-lockdown rally in Hyde Park on April 24.


----------



## SuperMatt

This far-right nutter is hospitalized with COVID and still tweeting against vaccines.





__





						Allen West, Republican running for governor of Texas, hospitalized with covid-19
					





					www.msn.com
				




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447195964511490052/

He insists on stopping people from getting vaccinated because there are treatments available in the hospital? Yeah there are treatments for HIV too, but we still are looking for a vaccine so that YOU DON’T GET IT IN THE FIRST PLACE!

I’m not supposed to wish for people to die, but if somebody actively trying to murder others by lying to them gets killed by a virus in the process, I wouldn’t cry either.


----------



## Herdfan

JayMysteri0 said:


> Also
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447351979781595138/




He may never play guitar again, or at least not to the level he used to.  









						Eric Clapton's Anti-Vaccine Diatribe Blames 'Propaganda' for 'Disastrous' Experience
					

Hall of Famer, who also appeared on Van Morrison’s single in December, expressed opinions to anti-lockdown activist




					www.rollingstone.com


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Lastly, I agree with @Alli and @SuperMatt, we don't need nurses who don't believe in vaccines. We might be better off with them looking for another profession.




Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them.  Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.

And let's be real.  Is anyone really going to say to a Dr. in an emergency situation "You aren't vaccinated, don't touch me".  Are you really willing to die because the Dr. or nurse is not vaccinated?  I seriously doubt it.  Talk about stupid.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.




Assuming for a second that China did purposefully released this virus, the antivax, anti quarantine pushback against it has only served to show them just how effective such a weapon would be against us.

It's not like any of our greatest patriots or loudest politicians have taken any great strides to protect the country against it. Quite the opposite, in fact. Instead of taking cover, and applying proper tactics to the situation, they proudly stood in the line of fire, proclaiming they're not afraid of a little lead poisoning.


----------



## Herdfan

Renzatic said:


> Assuming for a second that China did purposefully released this virus, the antivax, anti quarantine pushback against it has only served to show them just how effective such a weapon would be against us.




Please show exactly where I stated China did it on purpose.  

But you are correct in that it does show them how vulnerable we would be.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Please show exactly where I stated China did it on purpose.






> Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.




How else am I supposed to take this?


----------



## Herdfan

Renzatic said:


> How else am I supposed to take this?




Any way you want.  If I meant China as a political entity, I would have used the term CCP.  This wasn't the first time a virus has originated in China and probably won't be the last as long as they allow the wet markets to operate.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Any way you want.  If I meant China as a political entity, I would have used the term CCP.  This wasn't the first time a virus has originated in China and probably won't be the last as long as they allow the wet markets to operate.




I dunno why anyone would want to eat a pangolin anyway.

Regardless if it where it came from, or whether it was done on purpose or not, the fact that we now consider our responses and treatments to virulent diseases as yet another political wedge issue just goes to show that EVERYTHING is political these days, and we're all kinda fucked.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Herdfan said:


> Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them.



First of all we didn't have a good way to combat the virus at the beginning other than PPE. They were pretty much all on the front line with some tinfoil body armor. Now we have an incredibly effective solution but some refuse it. Second (someone correct me if I'm wrong) I'm pretty sure nurses are required to have several other vaccines and had no problem with getting those, but they are against the COVID vaccine because of misinformation and conspiracy bullshit. How stupid. What a strange hill to die on. We are not saying FU to them. Their decision not only affects them, but everyone around them in a very dangerous way. They are saying FU to everyone around them. There are consequences to your actions.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them.  Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.
> 
> And let's be real.  Is anyone really going to say to a Dr. in an emergency situation "You aren't vaccinated, don't touch me".  Are you really willing to die because the Dr. or nurse is not vaccinated?  I seriously doubt it.  Talk about stupid.



Are you calling a doctor stupid? I’m not sure you know what the word means.

Gotta love the “china releasing a virus on us” nonsense too. You’re really knocking it out of the park today.

How’s life under the bridge?


----------



## User.45

Renzatic said:


> Assuming for a second that China did purposefully released this virus, the antivax, anti quarantine pushback against it has only served to show them just how effective such a weapon would be against us.
> 
> It's not like any of our greatest patriots or loudest politicians have taken any great strides to protect the country against it. Quite the opposite, in fact. Instead of taking cover, and applying proper tactics to the situation, they proudly stood in the line of fire, proclaiming they're not afraid of a little lead poisoning.



Exactly, if someone really believes that COVID-19 was indirect act of bioterrorism, making sure we are as vulnerable to the pathogen as possible would be an act of treason. 



Herdfan said:


> Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them.  Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.



You mean to get my wife or me help you in a situation like this? Hint, trying not to be so fucking stupid helps. If this concern was honest you’d already had cut your bullshit, lol. You are a phony



Herdfan said:


> And let's be real.  Is anyone really going to say to a Dr. in an emergency situation "You aren't vaccinated, don't touch me".  Are you really willing to die because the Dr. or nurse is not vaccinated?  I seriously doubt it.  Talk about stupid.



Bbbbut Where’s muh medical freedumb to chose a competent provider?! Another bullshit scenario out your ass keep it coming, this thread is about you


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> Exactly, if someone really believes that COVID-19 was indirect act of bioterrorism, making sure we are as vulnerable to the pathogen as possible would be an act of treason.
> 
> 
> You mean to get my wife or me help you in a situation like this? Hint, trying not to be so fucking stupid helps. If this concern was honest you’d already had cut your bullshit, lol. You are a phony
> 
> 
> Bbbbut Where’s muh medical freedumb to chose a competent provider?! Another bullshit scenario out your ass keep it coming, this thread is about you



Here’s a doctor that won’t be working at UCLA anymore.









						UCLA anesthesiologist, vocal against COVID vaccine mandates, is escorted out of workplace
					

UCLA anesthesiologist Dr. Christopher B. Rake was escorted out of his workplace for not being vaccinated against COVID-19.




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Are you calling a doctor stupid? I’m not sure you know what the word means.
> 
> 
> 
> How’s life under the bridge?




If a Dr.  willing to die vs being treated by an unvaccinated person isn't stupid, then you may be correct in that I don't understand what it means.

Nice and cool.  A bit damp though.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Here’s a doctor that won’t be working at UCLA anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> UCLA anesthesiologist, vocal against COVID vaccine mandates, is escorted out of workplace
> 
> 
> UCLA anesthesiologist Dr. Christopher B. Rake was escorted out of his workplace for not being vaccinated against COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com



Just imagine, anesthesiologists actually do airway procedures on COVID positive patients.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> Just imagine, anesthesiologists actually do airway procedures on COVID positive patients.



Are physicians so specialized that an anesthesiologist truly doesn’t understand virology at all? Or is this guy just seeking attention and maybe a commentator spot on Fox?


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Exactly, if someone really believes that COVID-19 was indirect act of bioterrorism, making sure we are as vulnerable to the pathogen as possible would be an act of treason.
> 
> 
> You mean to get my wife or me help you in a situation like this? Hint, trying not to be so fucking stupid helps. If this concern was honest you’d already had cut your bullshit, lol. You are a phony
> 
> 
> Bbbbut Where’s muh medical freedumb to chose a competent provider?! Another bullshit scenario out your ass keep it coming, this thread is about you




I will say this, some of you need to get out of your bubbles.  People outside of your circles think different ways.  You don't have to agree with them, but you need to at least acknowledge they exist.

This poll is 6 months old, but it shows that Americans 58-18, with 34ud think the virus came from a lab, not a bat.  Now since Republicans only make up 35%ish of the electorate, you can't blame this solely on them.

Freedom has nothing to do with it.  If you are traveling and have an accident, is "are you vaccinated" the first question you are going to ask the paramedic?


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Are physicians so specialized that an anesthesiologist truly doesn’t understand virology at all? Or is this guy just seeking attention and maybe a commentator spot on Fox?



No, these are very very very basic things. 
People pretend like workers with direct patient contact haven’t been compliant with mandatory annual flu shots since forever… some of those shots had way lower efficacy than the COVid shots


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> I will say this, some of you need to get out of your bubbles. People outside of your circles think different ways.




And what other school of thought is there on this subject? People who work around and care for sick people on a daily basis are more likely to contract a virus, spreading it other sick people under their care, and thus have a more compelling reason to be vaccinated than your average person. But...

...what? I'm trying to see an exception here that makes sense. Maybe you could enlighten me on the subject.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> I will say this, some of you need to get out of your bubbles.  People outside of your circles think different ways.  You don't have to agree with them, but you need to at least acknowledge they exist.
> 
> This poll is 6 months old, but it shows that Americans 58-18, with 34ud think the virus came from a lab, not a bat.  Now since Republicans only make up 35%ish of the electorate, you can't blame this solely on them.
> 
> Freedom has nothing to do with it.  If you are traveling and have an accident, is "are you vaccinated" the first question you are going to ask the paramedic?



Interestingly that would be the same proportion to the Americans who believe angels are real. Do we think now that reality is defined by popularity of concepts? You’re also totally contradicting yourself, you propose it’s a bubble issue but you also suggest it’s not a bubble issue.

You mean I shouldn’t be concerned about people meeting the minimum requirements of the job they are doing? Do you ask your doctor whether they have a license? 

Also, ANSWER: if COVID is bioterrorism isn’t vaccination patriotic?


----------



## Renzatic

P_X said:


> Also, ANSWER: if COVID is bioterrorism isn’t vaccination patriotic?




No, because the CDC, the hospitals, and the pharmaceutical companies are in on it too!


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them.




If they're refusing a vaccination, they're already saying a big FU to me and society.  So first off, I'm absolutely fine saying FU to them.  I literally have no issues with that at all.  Their consequences are a result of _their_ actions, not mine.  I'm not going to feel guilty about the choices _they_ made.  Regardless of what they might have done a year ago, today they are most definitely NOT "taking care of us".

I work in healthcare.  Not directly with patients, but regardless, we're required to be 100% vaccinated.  You know how many people I've heard complain about all the good people we might lose?  None.  0.  Zilch.  My boss did bring the topic up at our last happy hour, and no one cared enough to talk about it.  Couldn't even get that conversation off the ground.  This is about us getting back to normal, not protecting the rights of the stupid.  I don't know how that translates to other professions or groups of people, but in the case of my job and the people I work with, no one seems to care.

You seem to want to paint these people as heroes.  And to be fair, they may have performed heroically.  But that doesn't earn them special privilege to do the wrong thing now.  They get no free passes to keep this nonsense going.  They don't get to freely infect 1 person for every 10 punches on their Hero card.  The time they've spent fighting this are worth no bonus points when it comes to their opinions.

On a completely unrelated topic, every time my sister spouts off some nonsense on Facebook, you seem to show up here with the same arguments.  I find that to be an interesting coincidence and it makes me wonder what your source might be.  I think you two might be feeding off the same plate of disinformation.  You might want to check your sources.  Garbage in, garbage out is a real thing.


----------



## Renzatic

MEJHarrison said:


> This is about us getting back to normal, not protecting the rights of the stupid.




It's not even about protecting rights, rather it's about not capitulating to stupid demands.

Some people need to understand that freedoms are a double edge sword, and apply to others as equally as it applies to themselves. For example, you cannot force anyone to take the vaccine against their will. If you don't want to take it, you don't have to take it. Your body, your right. On the flipside of that, anyone who wants to instate a vaccine mandate at their privately owned business is equally free to do so. Their property, their right. You cannot force them to continue to employ you.

In this free country we find ourselves living in, no one is outright beholden to anyone by default, and anyone who represents a risk or burden to the wellbeing of others will be treated as such.

...I remember when this was a conservative argument.


----------



## fischersd

Herdfan said:


> Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them.  Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.
> 
> And let's be real.  Is anyone really going to say to a Dr. in an emergency situation "You aren't vaccinated, don't touch me".  Are you really willing to die because the Dr. or nurse is not vaccinated?  I seriously doubt it.  Talk about stupid.



Actually, people won't have to check.  Most areas of the world, health professionals won't have jobs if they're not vaccinated.  Of course, in 'merica - at least in the red states, it's unlikely you'll enact legislation that would actually protect people.  

Love the China bit - you're obviously an avid Fox News watcher.


----------



## Edd

There’s a conservative fantasy about how they’re all Grizzly Adams, making their own way on the frontier, and aren’t members of a functioning society. The frontier in the US is gone. You have to think about others.


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## hulugu

P_X said:


> Interestingly that would be the same proportion to the Americans who believe angels are real. Do we think now that reality is defined by popularity of concepts? You’re also totally contradicting yourself, you propose it’s a bubble issue but you also suggest it’s not a bubble issue.
> 
> You mean I shouldn’t be concerned about people meeting the minimum requirements of the job they are doing? Do you ask your doctor whether they have a license?
> 
> Also, ANSWER: if COVID is bioterrorism isn’t vaccination patriotic?




The fact that a certain segment of the population believes in a theory doesn't prove the theory, rather it illustrates that the GQP's constant iterative propaganda often works. They wanted it to be the fault of China because that was an attempt to insulate the Republican party from its often disastrous response. And, once they discovered that they could use the idea to ding Fauci, who became a target because of his criticism, they pushed even harder. 

Certainly, there are good reasons to be suspicious of the Chinese government— and we need to be sure that the lab-borne theory is wrong because understanding how this virus spread is the key to stopping the next one—but much of the effort around the lab-borne theory is disingenuous. 

So, of course, a reasonable person who thinks that COVID-19 is an attack would also accept that making the country immune would be a smart strategic goal. 

But, it's not a reasonable idea. The people who believe that China attacked us also vehemently fight the vaccine, because they're fundamentally irrational.


----------



## Renzatic

hulugu said:


> Certainly, there are good reasons to be suspicious of the Chinese government— and we need to be sure that the lab-borne theory is wrong because understanding how this virus spread is the key to stopping the next one—but much of the effort around the lab-borne theory is disingenuous.




Right now, the consensus among the intelligence community seems to be split, and among those who do believe it's likely lab borne, they don't believe it was a purposeful attack.

It's less "China created a bioweapon designed to wipe out the western hemisphere", and more "Some Chinese lab was studying a strain of SARS, and they didn't follow basic safety and control protocols."


----------



## hulugu

Renzatic said:


> Right now, the consensus among the intelligence community seems to be split, and among those who do believe it's likely lab borne, they don't believe it was a purposeful attack.
> 
> It's less "China created a bioweapon designed to wipe out the western hemisphere", and more "Some Chinese lab was studying a strain of SARS, and they didn't follow basic safety and control protocols."




Right. Even if we accept the lab-borne theory, there's a big difference between a failure of containment and an intentional act. The GQP will insist on the latter, even after the former is proven. And, even if every bit of evidence shows that it's just bad luck, the GQP will push the lab-borne idea because they're fundamentally counter-factual.


----------



## Roller

> However, what you, I or anyone else on this board thinks is irrelevant.



I wouldn't assume that.



> Don't forget, one of the main reasons for me to get vaccinated when I did was so I could visit my mom in an assisted living facility.



That's good — the desire to be physically close to family and friends can be a strong motivator. So, too, can the need to maintain a livelihood. What most troubles us in healthcare is that many of the workers who are refusing vaccination are doing so not for any legitimate reason, but rather because they're being told to. That endangers not only their own health, but that of the people they should care about, including patients. This is largely the result of the poison they're fed by Fox News, where employees are required to be vaccinated. Absent that and other sources of misinformation, and mandates probably wouldn't be needed.


----------



## SuperMatt

hulugu said:


> Right. Even if we accept the lab-borne theory, there's a big difference between a failure of containment and an intentional act. The GQP will insist on the latter, even after the former is proven. And, even if every bit of evidence shows that it's just bad luck, the GQP will push the lab-borne idea because they're fundamentally counter-factual.



Gotta love how people with no degrees in science whatsoever are suddenly “Gain of function” this and “hydroxychloroquine” that. Ask them what gain of function means or show them 4 skeletal formulas and ask them which one is Hydroxychloroquine and none of them will know.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Freedom has nothing to do with it.  If you are traveling and have an accident, is "are you vaccinated" the first question you are going to ask the paramedic?



I count on hospital directors to require vaccines so that when I have an emergency, nobody working there will be unvaccinated and give me a disease. This is EXACTLY why we need mandates for health workers. I don’t get a choice when a paramedic comes for me, so those workers MUST be vaccinated to protect the health of those they serve. If they don’t like it? They’re probably working in the wrong field.

This stance against vaccine mandates is just completely and utterly moronic. If you oppose vaccine mandates, you are pushing for people to die of COVID. You don’t have the freedom to drive drunk because you could hit me with your car. Same exact concept when it comes to safety procedures among healthcare workers.

If you want healthcare workers to have all this freedom to decide which safety measures they take when caring for patients... are you ok with them not wearing a mask in the ER? How about not wearing gloves or washing their hands? Don’t they have the FREEDOM to show up to work in shorts and a t-shirt without having taken a bath for a week, and stick their dirty hands in open wounds?


----------



## SuperMatt

More from Allen West:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447562535113150465/

You know the vaccine only costs about $20 and doesn’t require you to go to the hospital, right? You’d think a “common sense” Republican would know the old adage “an ounce of prevention…”

Instead, you’d rather be hospitalized and taking all manner of treatments over one simple vaccine? This  makes my head hurt.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Yet it was these same people who took care of "us" during the early stages of the pandemic putting their lives and their family's lives at risk and we are just saying FU to them. Good luck getting them to help the next time China releases a virus on us.



This was my response. 


Runs For Fun said:


> First of all we didn't have a good way to combat the virus at the beginning other than PPE. They were pretty much all on the front line with some tinfoil body armor. Now we have an incredibly effective solution but some refuse it. Second (someone correct me if I'm wrong) I'm pretty sure nurses are required to have several other vaccines and had no problem with getting those, but they are against the COVID vaccine because of misinformation and conspiracy bullshit. How stupid. What a strange hill to die on. We are not saying FU to them. Their decision not only affects them, but everyone around them in a very dangerous way. They are saying FU to everyone around them. There are consequences to your actions.


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> The fact that a certain segment of the population believes in a theory doesn't prove the theory, rather it illustrates that the GQP's constant iterative propaganda often works. They wanted it to be the fault of China because that was an attempt to insulate the Republican party from its often disastrous response. And, once they discovered that they could use the idea to ding Fauci, who became a target because of his criticism, they pushed even harder.
> 
> Certainly, there are good reasons to be suspicious of the Chinese government— and we need to be sure that the lab-borne theory is wrong because understanding how this virus spread is the key to stopping the next one—but much of the effort around the lab-borne theory is disingenuous.
> 
> So, of course, a reasonable person who thinks that COVID-19 is an attack would also accept that making the country immune would be a smart strategic goal.
> 
> But, it's not a reasonable idea. The people who believe that China attacked us also vehemently fight the vaccine, because they're fundamentally irrational.




This is going to be longish, but since most of y'all mature I'll drop it here. 


To be scientifically sound, the lab leak idea isn't even a theory. It's a hypothesis. It's important to emphasize, because it's totally fine to hypothesize anything, including that COVID may have been a result of a lab leak. Hypotheses are there for testing and if they hold after thorough testing, they become theories. And theories that become proven over and over and over again become facts. Biomedical facts are perhaps the hardest to establish. This is a phenomenon people usually don't care until they are suddenly become impacted. When this happens, they start lashing out on the people tasked to _actually_ overcome these issues, like Anthony Fauci. 

The issue with the lab leak hypothesis is that to date, it had not had sufficient supporting evidence to even progress into what I'd consider a theory, yet people like @Herdfan already throw it around like it was a fact and try to weaponize this in a conversation to make a (n insincere) point. The consequence is that people cannot have a mature discussion about this. I was asked about what I think about a lab leak a year ago, and my opinion hasn't changed a lot since:

1) It's not impossible because there are some really weird things about this _acute_ infectious pandemic, such as being perpetuated by asymptomatic carriers. You could hypothesize that such feature could enable an outbreak among lab workers to run undetected until it's way too late. 

2) However, RNA viruses can mutate easier due to the less stable genome and if people can believe in the emergence of vaccine-resistant variants they should also easily believe that something can develop through natural evolution. 

3) More recent analyses show that the initial epicenter(s) of the outbreak may have been separated in both space and time from the Wuhan Institute of Virology. 

4) The fact that evolutionarily intermediate coronavirus strains are found in mammals and the rate of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies in deers inNorth America  (vast majority testing positive) for example can indicate how enormous the pool of susceptible animal hosts for this virus and it's not "human specific". 

Now, mature adults can discuss these without jumping into conclusions, but children will do what @Herdfan is doing, select aspects that they confirm their ideas, and fully ignore others that contradict those. 

I used the verbiage "indirect act of bioterrorism", because it's obvious that COVID-19 served nobody's short-term interests (not even big pharma's, which is a very risk-averse industry). My impression has been that even the right wingers agree with this. The issue is accidental bioweapon production is still bioweapon production. So this is where the next level of dishonesty gets released on us, implying US funding of  such research even though there not only absolutely zero evidence that such played a role in COVID. Even better, I've never seen Rand Paul back pedal so quickly when he admitted that his gain-of-function circus has nothing to do with COVID. The soundbites didn't include that for Fox. So we can talk gain-of-function all day long, Rand admitted to have no corroborative evidence to link it to COVID. It's sole purpose was political theatrics. 

The only gain-of-function I see is how people who couldn't care less about life-sciences, now gained the ability to mutate any sort of evidence into some Frankenstein's monster of literally toxic confirmation bias. 



SuperMatt said:


> More from Allen West:
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447562535113150465/
> 
> You know the vaccine only costs about $20 and doesn’t require you to go to the hospital, right? You’d think a “common sense” Republican would know the old adage “an ounce of prevention…”
> 
> Instead, you’d rather be hospitalized and taking all manner of treatments over one simple vaccine? This  makes my head hurt.



Like Allen West. A self-proclaimed fiscal conservative who fails to recognize the cost-efficiency differential between the vaccine and Regeneron (I did the estimate here before, and AFAIR it was >100x more expensive than shots...).


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> First of all we didn't have a good way to combat the virus at the beginning other than PPE. They were pretty much all on the front line with some tinfoil body armor. Now we have an incredibly effective solution but some refuse it. Second (someone correct me if I'm wrong) I'm pretty sure nurses are required to have several other vaccines and had no problem with getting those, but they are against the COVID vaccine because of misinformation and conspiracy bullshit. How stupid. What a strange hill to die on. We are not saying FU to them. Their decision not only affects them, but everyone around them in a very dangerous way. They are saying FU to everyone around them. There are consequences to your actions.



While I agree with this statement, @Herdfan has already achieved his goal here. His goal was to imply that not getting vaccinated is a highly prevalent issue among MDs and RNs. It's not. See this article from a month ago:









						Most nurses are vaccinated – so why do people think health workers are vaccine hesitant?
					

Many registered nurses see vaccination as their ‘moral responsibility’ and want everyone else to get theirs too




					www.theguardian.com
				





> It can be startling to read reports of disparate vaccination rates among health workers. In the south or the borough of Staten Island in New York City, for example, there are pockets of health workers who are strongly opposed to vaccination. Vaccine hesitancy tends to be more common among the staff of long-term care facilities, where only 60% of staff is vaccinated. A CDC reportin July found the lowest vaccination rate of health workers was among aides, including certified nursing assistants, nurse aides and medication aides and assistants, at 45.6% – but that figure was as of March, and it’s likely that rate has risen since. (Nursing aides or assistants usually undergo a four- to 12-week training course, while registered nurses receive two- or four-year degrees and must pass a licensing test.)






> *In contrast, 88% of nurses and 96%* of physicians in the US have already gotten vaccinated or plan to do so, according to surveys by the American Nurses Association and the American Medical Association.*






> *Those with hesitations often said they were waiting for full approval from the Food and Drug Administration, or they weren’t sure about side-effects during pregnancy and breastfeeding, Valdez said*


----------



## Runs For Fun

Idiot 








						Texas Gov. Greg Abbott bans COVID-19 vaccine mandates by any entity
					

The executive order goes further than Abbott's previous ban, which prohibited vaccine mandates by state entities.




					www.axios.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> Idiot
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Texas Gov. Greg Abbott bans COVID-19 vaccine mandates by any entity
> 
> 
> The executive order goes further than Abbott's previous ban, which prohibited vaccine mandates by state entities.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.axios.com



I wish voters would ban him.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Abbott is losing it. Not only is his order moot with regard to federal employees or facilities in Texas (Biden's order overrides it), but I don't see businesses, counties and municipalities standing for this. This is one cigar that's gonna blow up in Abbott's face.


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Abbott is losing it. Not only is his order moot with regard to federal employees or facilities in Texas (Biden's order overrides it), but I don't see businesses, counties and municipalities standing for this. This is one cigar that's gonna blow up in Abbott's face.



He impresses me like he's been trying to one-up DeSantis but without the strategic thought behind any of it.


----------



## Runs For Fun

P_X said:


> He impresses me like he's been trying to one-up DeSantis but without the strategic thought behind any of it.



Yep. I swear they’re trying to constantly out-do each other.


----------



## hulugu

P_X said:


> This is going to be longish, but since most of y'all mature I'll drop it here.
> 
> 
> To be scientifically sound, the lab leak idea isn't even a theory. It's a hypothesis. It's important to emphasize, because it's totally fine to hypothesize anything, including that COVID may have been a result of a lab leak. Hypotheses are there for testing and if they hold after thorough testing, they become theories. And theories that become proven over and over and over again become facts. Biomedical facts are perhaps the hardest to establish. This is a phenomenon people usually don't care until they are suddenly become impacted. When this happens, they start lashing out on the people tasked to _actually_ overcome these issues, like Anthony Fauci.
> 
> 
> 
> Like Allen West. A self-proclaimed fiscal conservative who fails to recognize the cost-efficiency differential between the vaccine and Regeneron (I did the estimate here before, and AFAIR it was >100x more expensive than shots...).




I meant theory in the colloquial sense, but I think you're right to point out the difference. In fact, I'd go further in saying that they're not even creating hypothesis, but engaging in wild suppositions. 

And, you're correct about West. 

He refused to take the vaccine, a cheap and viable way to mitigate COVID, and has instead promoted a wide-range of treatments, including Regeneron monoclonal antibody infusion therapy, Budesonide nebulizer treatments, as well as "healthy over the counter therapies" such as zinc, D3, vitamin C, Hydroxychloroquine, Ivermectin. 

His wife meanwhile received the vaccine, and is apparently fine. 

From any reasonable public policy standpoint, West's entire "treatment" protocol is a risky and expensive proposition. Rather than a $20 shot, he's asking people to take a wide-range of treatments, including a failed prophylactic protocol, so they can then spend even more on treatment, including a multi-day hospital stay.

And, he's still sick, and is currently on blood-thinners. 

Moreover, he's arguing that the medical professionals "listened" to him and put him on these treatments, as if they're not part of the evolving standard of care, and haven't been for months. 

Lastly, he darkly argued that "I am not a conspiracy theorist but something very nefarious is at work here , and the innocent blood of Texans are on some dirty, corrupt hands. I promise y'all, as Governor of Texas, I will find those hands and ensure they're held accountable." 

The reality is that men like West told people to take zinc, and that the medical establishment was untrustworthy, and yet, when push came to shove, they ran to the very people they've attacked and begged for expensive treatments available only to the privileged. 

West has always been a ridiculous character. And, COVID-19 didn't change that.


----------



## hulugu

Thomas Veil said:


> Abbott is losing it. Not only is his order moot with regard to federal employees or facilities in Texas (Biden's order overrides it), but I don't see businesses, counties and municipalities standing for this. This is one cigar that's gonna blow up in Abbott's face.




They keep insisting on fighting this culture war because they think it will undermine Biden, and win them some votes. Never mind that they're leading lambs to slaughter. 

It's clear that Abbot doesn't care about his constituents, rather he'd rather make political hay at their expense. He's a terrible leader and always has been, but I suspect that he'll do well in Texas because that state's politics are ridiculous.


----------



## JayMysteri0

FB pic of the day


----------



## Alli

hulugu said:


> West has always been a ridiculous character. And, COVID-19 didn't change that.



Personally, I resent West getting the Regeneron treatment. That should be reserved for people who are not anti-vaxxers.


----------



## Herdfan

Renzatic said:


> And what other school of thought is there on this subject? People who work around and care for sick people on a daily basis are more likely to contract a virus, spreading it other sick people under their care, and thus have a more compelling reason to be vaccinated than your average person. But...
> 
> ...what? I'm trying to see an exception here that makes sense. Maybe you could enlighten me on the subject.




The bubble comment was not about vaccines, but about 58% of people believing it came from a lab. 

I am going to say this as loudly and succinctly as possible:

I do believe in vaccines.  I wish more people were vaccinated.  Where I draw the line is the government mandating them.  Businesses can do what they want.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> The bubble comment was not about vaccines, but about 58% of people believing it came from a lab.
> 
> I am going to say this as loudly and succinctly as possible:
> 
> I do believe in vaccines.  I wish more people were vaccinated.  Where I draw the line is the government mandating them.  Businesses can do what they want.



You are full of baloney. If you “believe” in vaccines, then you should know we ALL need them to protect society. That’s why vaccines for many diseases are MANDATORY when kids start school. Did you refuse to send your daughter to school when they required them? Did you write in bold red letters to your school board? Nope, it’s just THIS vaccine, because the total fucking moron Donald Trump started blathering about “Freedom” when it comes to THIS vaccine... and he only did so once he lost the election. Before that, he had no problem with the vaccine, and his minions would have been first in line if he mandated it. You don’t even know what freedom is. There are millions more like you, and America is falling into the shitter because of it.

People who know NOTHING about medicine are spouting off as if they do. I recommend watching this movie for the logical conclusion of ignoring the experts and attacking “intellectuals" because of hurt feelings and/or nonsensical notions of “freedom."









						Idiocracy (2006) - IMDb
					

Idiocracy: Directed by Mike Judge. With Luke Wilson, Maya Rudolph, Dax Shepard, Terry Crews. Private Joe Bauers, a decisively average American, is selected as a guinea pig for a top-secret hibernation program but is forgotten, awakening to a future so incredibly moronic he's easily the most...




					www.imdb.com
				




PS - Anybody’s “belief” in the vaccines doesn’t matter. The FACT is that they work. The FACT on vaccines is that you need as many people as possible to get them. So if you “believe” in the REALITY of vaccines, then you also MUST believe that a mandate is necessary if enough people aren’t voluntarily getting it.


----------



## Herdfan

Can anyone here explain the Mayo Clinic's vaccine mandate?

It seems they have one, but not really.



> The Rochester, Minn.-based health system said July 26 that all staff must be fully vaccinated by Sept. 17.
> 
> 
> *Those who do not meet the deadline will be able to keep their jobs. However, they will be required to complete education modules, wear face masks and maintain social distancing while on campus.*
> The mandate will affect the health system's staff regardless of location.
> 
> 
> "Getting vaccinated for COVID-19 is the single most important thing all of us can do to protect our patients, visitors, colleagues and communities," Gianrico Farrugia, MD, president and CEO of Mayo Clinic, said in a statement.




So as long as you take some classes, wear a mask (which most probably do anyway) and stay away from others, you won't be required to be vaccinated.  How is that a mandate?

Isn't Mayo one of the top medical facilities in the country?  And yet they allow a loophole you can drive a dump truck though.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> I do believe in vaccines.  I wish more people were vaccinated.  Where I draw the line is the government mandating them.  Businesses can do what they want.




State governments have been mandating vaccines for well over a century now. The only real contentious issue facing us these days is Biden leveraging OSHA to mandate them at the federal level, though that's more a symbolic gesture, given that he'd have a hard time enforcing it if there's any real pushback against it.


----------



## User.45

i have a proposal. We as the TalkedAbout Community shouls ignore posts that contain specific statements without sources. 

When it comes to @Herdfan the first necessary thing to do is check whether his question is based on a lie or not. Then we can discuss verified claims. Source your mayo policy or go away.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Source your mayo policy or go away.




Sourced.



> All Mayo Clinic staff, regardless of work location, are expected to be fully vaccinated or participate in a declination process. *Staff who decline to be vaccinated for COVID-19 must complete education modules and will be required to wear masks and socially distance when on campus.*











						Mayo Clinic announces next phase of vaccination requirements for COVID-19 - Mayo Clinic News Network
					

Guided by its values and deep commitment to patients, Mayo Clinic is requiring all employees to be fully vaccinated for COVID-19 or complete a declination process by Sept. 17. "We are proud of our staff's high vaccination rates and are grateful that the vast majority have embraced the...




					newsnetwork.mayoclinic.org
				




I am going to assume that the mayoclinic.org is valid enough.  There is also a summary at Becker's Hospital Review.  Do I need to double source?  


So now that you have lost that reason not to answer, what say you?


So while I was sourcing this for you, I decided to check on the Cleveland Clinic.  And I found this tidbit that YOU claim is a right-wing/Foxnews talking point:



> Clinic CEO Tom Mihaljevic said there are concerns about large numbers of staff members quitting.












						Cleveland Clinic Mandates Vaccines For Staff - UH Reviewing Biden's Order
					

Neither UH or Cleveland Clinic officials have announced how they will implement the new policy.




					www.ideastream.org
				




I guess the CEO regurgitates RW talking points.  Who knew?


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> Nope, it’s just THIS vaccine, because the total fucking moron Donald Trump started blathering about “Freedom” when it comes to THIS vaccine... and he only did so once he lost the election. Before that, he had no problem with the vaccine, and his minions would have been first in line if he mandated it.



This is so accurate it hurts.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Can anyone here explain the Mayo Clinic's vaccine mandate?
> 
> It seems they have one, but not really.
> 
> 
> 
> So as long as you take some classes, wear a mask (which most probably do anyway) and stay away from others, you won't be required to be vaccinated.  How is that a mandate?
> 
> Isn't Mayo one of the top medical facilities in the country?  And yet they allow a loophole you can drive a dump truck though.



As with the military, there are different ways of enforcing a vaccine mandate; discharging the military member is the last resort. It seems like they’re starting with a “punishment” of making you go to classes and get tested and wear masks in areas where others might not need to wear them. They could add harsher penalties up to and including termination, but they started with this model instead.

Same thing with driving violations. Speeding is prohibited, but they don’t start with taking away your license and putting you in jail. They initially fine you and make you go to traffic school to remove points from your license if you get more tickets. I’d hardly call this kind of progressive punishment a “loophole."

The July mandate has been quite effective, it seems. 98% of doctors and 87% of staff overall are vaccinated 3 weeks after the initial deadline.





__





						Mayo Clinic staff vaccination rate exceeds 87% 3 weeks after deadline - Atlanta Business Journal
					

Mayo Clinic announced in July its requirement that all staff must be fully vaccinated…




					atlantabusinessjournal.com
				




Also, the federal mandate is different than the one Mayo instituted in July might require termination of the employee. Mayo isn’t talking about how that will be implemented yet.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> The July mandate has been quite effective, it seems. 98% of doctors and 87% of staff overall are vaccinated 3 weeks after the initial deadline.




I don't really trust those numbers.  After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%.  But it won't be because the rest of the people complied. 

It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.




P_X said:


> i have a proposal. We as the TalkedAbout Community shouls ignore posts that contain specific statements without sources.
> 
> When it comes to @Herdfan the first necessary thing to do is check whether his question is based on a lie or not. Then we can discuss verified claims. Source your mayo policy or go away.




I had another thought about this post.  You typed around 50 words when a Google search using 4 words (Mayo Clinic Vaccine Mandate) would have given you the answer.  My link was the top hit, so you don't even have to go though multiple hits.

I guess you were hoping I didn't have a source or that I would link a Fox or OAN or NewsMax etc source so you could spend time talking about that instead of something that goes against what you want to believe.  Sorry to have messed that up for you.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I don't really trust those numbers.  After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%.  But it won't be because the rest of the people complied.
> 
> It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.



So are they firing people or not? I thought the whole point of your post was that they are NOT firing people...?


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> So are they firing people or not? I thought the whole point of your post was that they are NOT firing people...?




Conflation of two different things.  And I think you know it.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> I don't really trust those numbers. After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%. But it won't be because the rest of the people complied.
> 
> It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.




It's a possibility, but do you have any compelling reason to assume that's the case here?


----------



## Herdfan

On a different note, the Brooklyn Nets have issued a statement that Kyrie Irving will not be allowed to participate in games or practices until he is vaccinated.  They won't allow him to be a part-time player.

I can't imagine they came to this position without Harden and Durant being onboard.  I know they don't have to pay him for games he misses at home or in SF or LA, but not sure if they have to pay him for other away games since he is able and willing to play.

So I am going with Stupid since he will be giving up more than half his $39M salary.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Conflation of two different things.  And I think you know it.



No, it absolutely isn’t. I’m quoting the numbers from the Mayo Clinic, which you said isn’t firing anybody. So these numbers are the people that chose vaccine either because they know it works or to avoid having to attend “vaccine class.” This is literally apples to apples.


----------



## Herdfan

Renzatic said:


> It's a possibility, but do you have any compelling reason to assume that's the case here?




It is going to be the case for any company that fires employees for not being vaccinated.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> It is going to be the case for any company that fires employees for not being vaccinated.




And you can say this with 100% certainty based upon what?


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> No, it absolutely isn’t. I’m quoting the numbers from the Mayo Clinic, which you said isn’t firing anybody. So these numbers are the people that chose vaccine either because they know it works or to avoid having to attend “vaccine class.” This is literally apples to apples.




Yep, my bad.  The Mayo link didn't populate the first time so I didn't make the connection.


----------



## Herdfan

Renzatic said:


> And you can say this with 100% certainty based upon what?




Math.  If the denominator goes down, the percentage goes up.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Math.  If the denominator goes down, the percentage goes up.





But first you'll need to provide evidence that they're firing people to up those percentages.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> I don't really trust those numbers.  After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%.  But it won't be because the rest of the people complied.
> 
> It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had another thought about this post.  You typed around 50 words when a Google search using 4 words (Mayo Clinic Vaccine Mandate) would have given you the answer.  My link was the top hit, so you don't even have to go though multiple hits.
> 
> I guess you were hoping I didn't have a source or that I would link a Fox or OAN or NewsMax etc source so you could spend time talking about that instead of something that goes against what you want to believe.  Sorry to have messed that up for you.



Funny you brought up fox news the third time, I haven’t mentioned it at all. It’s just basic decency not to expect others to do your job by providing support to your statements. You high fiving yourself for meeting the bare minimum of communication is hilarious on its own.

So now that you have your sources up, what do you think about that ~98% vaccination rate from a few months ago? Is it something worth arguing about? How come the most educated people in healthcare are >96% compliant even without a mandate?

About staffing shortage, your article doesn’t get into it, but so you know, that emerged more than a year ago and has very very little to do with vaccine mandates and more so with people having more leverage when it comes to lower paying, lower skilled jobs.

This whole mandate shitshow is a protracted temper tantrum about being forced. In the meantime, hospital systems at the caliber of Mayo had mandatory Influenza vaccination requirements for a decade. Yet you never whined about that. Why is that? Because it’s not about vaccines or mandates for you.


----------



## hulugu

SuperMatt said:


> ....Nope, it’s just THIS vaccine, because the total fucking moron Donald Trump started blathering about “Freedom” when it comes to THIS vaccine... and he only did so once he lost the election. Before that, he had no problem with the vaccine, and his minions would have been first in line if he mandated it. You don’t even know what freedom is. There are millions more like you, and America is falling into the shitter because of it.




Worth noting" Fox News requires vaccinations, and nearly everyone in the network, including those jabbering on about "freedom" got vaccinated. So did nearly everyone in the Trump inner-circle. 

The people espousing this idea that "freedom" trumps public health are all well-protected by the vaccine and their wealth and privilege, and are working against the vaccine because they believe that it will hurt Biden. 

Anyone talking about the idea that freedom is damaged by vaccinations is either part of the plot against America, or a fucking dolt.


----------



## SuperMatt

COVID has killed 4x more police officers than gunfire has.



> More than 460 American law enforcement officers have died from Covid-19 infections tied to their work since the start of the pandemic, according to the Officer Down Memorial Page, making the coronavirus by far the most common cause of duty-related deaths in 2020 and 2021. More than four times as many officers have died from Covid-19 as from gunfire in that period. There is no comprehensive accounting of how many American police officers have been sickened by the virus, but departments across the country have reported large outbreaks in the ranks.




125 of those deaths have come since August 2021. So all 125 of those were certainly preventable if the officers had been vaccinated.



> Yet as more departments in recent weeks have considered requiring members to be vaccinated, officers and their unions have loudly pushed back, in some cases threatening resignations or flooding systems with requests for exemptions.




I don’t think municipalities should allow the police to push them back on the mandates. After all, if they don’t get the shots, they’ll probably die anyway, and you’re still gonna be short on police officers.









						Hundreds of Police Officers Have Died From Covid. Vaccines Remain a Hard Sell.
					

Far more law enforcement officers in the U.S. have died from Covid-19 than from any other work-related cause in 2020 and 2021. Even so, police unions are fighting vaccine mandates.




					www.nytimes.com
				



(Paywall removed)


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> I don't really trust those numbers.  After all, if you have 50% of a company vaccinated and then fire 100% of the unvaccinated, you can then claim 100%.  But it won't be because the rest of the people complied.
> 
> It is a tactic businesses use to make their books look better called Denominator Management.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had another thought about this post.  You typed around 50 words when a Google search using 4 words (Mayo Clinic Vaccine Mandate) would have given you the answer.  My link was the top hit, so you don't even have to go though multiple hits.
> 
> I guess you were hoping I didn't have a source or that I would link a Fox or OAN or NewsMax etc source so you could spend time talking about that instead of something that goes against what you want to believe.  Sorry to have messed that up for you.




Next time you could just post the source and stop making people jump through hoops. And, yeah, people jump on Fox and the rest because they're part of a ridiculous propaganda network, and no one wants to click through their bullshit to get to the actual story.


----------



## Herdfan

hulugu said:


> Next time you could just post the source and stop making people jump through hoops. And, yeah, people jump on Fox and the rest because they're part of a ridiculous propaganda network, and no one wants to click through their bullshit to get to the actual story.




I just figured since he knows everything, he already knew what their policy was.


----------



## hulugu

Alli said:


> Personally, I resent West getting the Regeneron treatment. That should be reserved for people who are not anti-vaxxers.




I have no problem with people getting the treatment they need based on medical science, but West's case just proves how fucking dumb he is. 

(I'm swearing a lot today, but it's because I'm irritated and trying to emphasize my points.) 

So, West ducked the $20 shot that his wife got, blathering on about freedom. Then, he got COVID-19. Now, his wife was vaccinated, but because of his stupidity, they both got the Regeneron treatment. Now, Regeneron is not FDA approved yet—still being used under the EUA—and it was developed using a decades-old fetal line.


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> I just figured since he knows everything, he already knew what their policy was.




Can you just link the thing, next time?


----------



## Herdfan

hulugu said:


> Can you just link the thing, next time?




Yes, I will try to do better.


----------



## SuperMatt

Why didn’t Ozzy Osbourne get COVID-19... Could it be...














						After family members contracted COVID-19, Ozzy Osbourne says worshiping Satan protected him from virus
					

What in God’s good name? Ozzy Osbourne is thanking Lucifer for protecting him from the coronavirus.




					www.nydailynews.com


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> Yes, I will try to do better.




Thank you. 

And, really for all of us, this is an important point. If we are making an argument we should source it. And, this should come from original sources as much as possible. So, rather than the Yahoo News! article, let's go to the entity, or a local news source.


----------



## Edd

Re: Fox. This clip I watched today has a different overall topic than COVID, but has a supercut of Fox twits hilariously offended by government mandating vaccines for any reason, like it’s all brand new.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> I do believe in vaccines. I wish more people were vaccinated. Where I draw the line is the government mandating them. Businesses can do what they want.



The government (federal or state) should also not prevent businesses from mandating them. (Looking at you, Governor Abbott.)


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> The government (federal or state) should also not prevent businesses from mandating them. (Looking at you, Governor Abbott.)



I do agree with that also.


----------



## hulugu

Alli said:


> The government (federal or state) should also not prevent businesses from mandating them. (Looking at you, Governor Abbott.)




Yeah, we're in this goofy tug-of-war between the Biden administration and Texas' government over vaccine mandates. And,  the increasingly strident fools in the GQP are pushing against not only the COVID-19 vaccine, but against any kind of vaccine mandate, presaging a sudden growth in childhood diseases that are normally kept at bay.

While it's clear that the federal government has the right to require vaccines under OSHA, Texas could challenge that specific order. But, rather than consider that challenge, instead, the governor has decided to undermine every vaccination program in the state.

And, the state can't possibly win on this. They're fighting a legal battle on three sides—challenging the federal government's supremacy clause, undermining the rights of private businesses, and undermining the rights of local governments like school districts, cities, and counties.


----------



## SuperMatt

hulugu said:


> Yeah, we're in this goofy tug-of-war between the Biden administration and Texas' government over vaccine mandates. And,  the increasingly strident fools in the GQP are pushing against not only the COVID-19 vaccine, but against any kind of vaccine mandate, presaging a sudden growth in childhood diseases that are normally kept at bay.
> 
> While it's clear that the federal government has the right to require vaccines under OSHA, Texas could challenge that specific order. But, rather than consider that challenge, instead, the governor has decided to undermine every vaccination program in the state.
> 
> And, the state can't possibly win on this. They're fighting a legal battle on three sides—challenging the federal government's supremacy clause, undermining the rights of private businesses, and undermining the rights of local governments like school districts, cities, and counties.



I’m sure they can get the Supreme Court to allow the law to stand as an “emergency order” until the law can be challenged… if the most recent precedent is any indicator.

I am concerned about how ideological the Supreme Court has become. We’ve had a conservative court for a while, but the blatant disregard for precedent in favor of far-right ideology while going on public relations tours to justify the behavior worries me.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Many on this board cheer when people get fired for not getting vaccinated.  And that's fine, you have the freedom and right.
> 
> But what happens when so many healthcare workers get fired and YOU need critical care and there are no ICU beds, not because they are filled with COVID patients, but because there are not enough workers to staff them?



Steve Doocy asked the same question... So let’s have Jen Psaki answer:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1446550310252515330/

Of course, I’m getting now where you probably got the question from.


----------



## DT

Pictured:  *Doocy* (left), *Psaki* (right)


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> I just figured since he knows everything, he already knew what their policy was.



I'll let you in on a secret: I use search engines quickly and efficiently and I make a substantial effort  (at least on your scale) to understand opposing viewpoints. I start calling people out when I repeatedly catch them on not reading their own sources. Which has been my impression about you. I suspect you only read headlines and even cherry pick those.

The other thing I call people out for is intellectual cowardice. When your statements meet opposition, you make a 30sec effort to push back and if defending your stance takes more than that, you just wait out the topic change. Like here, I've asked you a bunch of questions and you've just tried to change the topic.

*1. If you are such an advocate of medical freedom and oppose vaccine mandates, how come this didn't come to your mind when it came to Influenza?*

Mayo's researchers' stand:








						Vaccinating health care workers against influenza: The ethical and legal rationale for a mandate
					





					mayoclinic.pure.elsevier.com
				




Most hospitals I worked at has had an Influenza vaccine mandate for a looong time:




__





						Honor Roll: Honorees with Influenza Vaccination Mandates
					





					www.immunize.org
				




But academic programs mandate this and suspend clinical access of students if they aren't up to date:
MGH for example:




__





						Immunization and Certification Requirements
					

Immunization and Certification Compliance at MGH Institute of Health Professions Students at MGH Institute of Health Professions (the Institute) must maintain their compliance with the Immunization and Certification policy throughout the duration of their enrollment in their academic programs...




					www.mghihp.edu
				




That above is a pretty standard list, and my antibody titers were assessed and I got repeat shots for diseases where my titers were low.
Again standard procedure. Where were you to defend my medical freedom then? 

*2. Are you willing to admit that staffing issues predate COVID vaccine mandates?
3. Are you willing to admit that running ICUs at capacity had contributed manyfold more to the staffing shortage than mandates?*

An example from a local WV Hospital system:


> It is particularly concerning as facilities from other states call West Virginia hospitals seeking beds for their own patients.
> “Should we get to a capacity point, which we are close to, we will probably not have the ability to transfer patients to other states, or we’ll have challenges transferring patients to other states,” Hoyer said.






> Health-care staffing shortages pre-date COVID-19, but the pandemic has exacerbated the problem.






> At a time when the patient census is at or nearing capacity, staff members are unable to work because of COVID-19 infection or COVID-19 exposure requiring quarantine. This is being seen in hospitals across the state.











						Staffing is 'number one challenge' facing hospitals as facilities reach capacity
					

Staffing shortages that were plaguing hospitals in the Mountain State and across the nation before the pandemic are now reaching critical levels as COVID-19 fills hospitals to capacity and sidelines




					www.wvnews.com
				




*4. If you admit that staffing issues are most significantly impacted by the pandemic itself, wouldn't measures that control the pandemic be the most effective way to fight staffing issues?

5. You still have to answer: if COVID-19 is an indirect act of bioterrorism, isn't it the patriotic thing to do is to get vaccinated?*

To provide my stance on all of this as a father of small children. The ultimate parenting success is to get your kids do the right thing without intimidation, but sometimes you have to be assertive to prevent them from hurting themselves. I believe in the same principle societally. America did a truly impressive job making smoking uncool and frowned upon. Opposing vaccination should receive similar societal attitudes. Yet here you are claiming to be a "vaccine-believer" but also normalizing antivaxxer sentiments.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Both can go 'F' themselves for their disingenuity...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447956225971433480/

Irving knew what he was doing, and what was coming.

The other F'N fat former 2X impeached F for writing Kaep's for his clown show bullshit.


----------



## JayMysteri0

To put the discussion another way...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447624443715522568/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1447977557958266884/





Because they worked too well?  

We didn't ban coaches who cover up sexual assault so well...


----------



## Yoused

Today's moment of zen









						UPDATE: Virus delays Wells parent's protest of mask mandate
					

ELKO – A Wells-area parent announced he would take his unmasked children to school Tuesday in protest of Gov. Steve Sisolak’s mask mandate, then postponed his plan after one of




					elkodaily.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Yoused said:


> Today's moment of zen
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> UPDATE: Virus delays Wells parent's protest of mask mandate
> 
> 
> ELKO – A Wells-area parent announced he would take his unmasked children to school Tuesday in protest of Gov. Steve Sisolak’s mask mandate, then postponed his plan after one of
> 
> 
> 
> 
> elkodaily.com



This is the content I come here for!!!!


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1448223249570144258/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Trigger warning!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1448002160051073028/


----------



## User.45

P_X said:


> I'll let you in on a secret: I use search engines quickly and efficiently and I make a substantial effort  (at least on your scale) to understand opposing viewpoints. I start calling people out when I repeatedly catch them on not reading their own sources. Which has been my impression about you. I suspect you only read headlines and even cherry pick those.
> 
> The other thing I call people out for is intellectual cowardice. When your statements meet opposition, you make a 30sec effort to push back and if defending your stance takes more than that, you just wait out the topic change. Like here, I've asked you a bunch of questions and you've just tried to change the topic.
> 
> *1. If you are such an advocate of medical freedom and oppose vaccine mandates, how come this didn't come to your mind when it came to Influenza?*
> 
> Mayo's researchers' stand:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vaccinating health care workers against influenza: The ethical and legal rationale for a mandate
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mayoclinic.pure.elsevier.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Most hospitals I worked at has had an Influenza vaccine mandate for a looong time:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Honor Roll: Honorees with Influenza Vaccination Mandates
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.immunize.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But academic programs mandate this and suspend clinical access of students if they aren't up to date:
> MGH for example:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Immunization and Certification Requirements
> 
> 
> Immunization and Certification Compliance at MGH Institute of Health Professions Students at MGH Institute of Health Professions (the Institute) must maintain their compliance with the Immunization and Certification policy throughout the duration of their enrollment in their academic programs...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mghihp.edu
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That above is a pretty standard list, and my antibody titers were assessed and I got repeat shots for diseases where my titers were low.
> Again standard procedure. Where were you to defend my medical freedom then?
> 
> *2. Are you willing to admit that staffing issues predate COVID vaccine mandates?
> 3. Are you willing to admit that running ICUs at capacity had contributed manyfold more to the staffing shortage than mandates?*
> 
> An example from a local WV Hospital system:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Staffing is 'number one challenge' facing hospitals as facilities reach capacity
> 
> 
> Staffing shortages that were plaguing hospitals in the Mountain State and across the nation before the pandemic are now reaching critical levels as COVID-19 fills hospitals to capacity and sidelines
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wvnews.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *4. If you admit that staffing issues are most significantly impacted by the pandemic itself, wouldn't measures that control the pandemic be the most effective way to fight staffing issues?
> 
> 5. You still have to answer: if COVID-19 is an indirect act of bioterrorism, isn't it the patriotic thing to do is to get vaccinated?*
> 
> To provide my stance on all of this as a father of small children. The ultimate parenting success is to get your kids do the right thing without intimidation, but sometimes you have to be assertive to prevent them from hurting themselves. I believe in the same principle societally. America did a truly impressive job making smoking uncool and frowned upon. Opposing vaccination should receive similar societal attitudes. Yet here you are claiming to be a "vaccine-believer" but also normalizing antivaxxer sentiments.



Exactly:



@Herdfan


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> @Herdfan



Will get you a reply tomorrow.  Lot to write.  Not ignoring it I promise.


----------



## SuperMatt

The problem is NOT some imagined future exodus of healthcare workers because they are refusing vaccines. It is hospitals so crowded with COVID patients that 1 in 5 families need to delay their healthcare. 









						With hospitals crowded from COVID, 1 in 5 American families delays health care — NPR
					

Putting off surgeries or routine treatments for serious illnesses has become common during the pandemic, a new NPR/Harvard poll finds.




					apple.news


----------



## fooferdoggie

Another brilliant GOPr

Alaska state Sen. Lora Reinbold, a Republican who was banned from an airline earlier this year for refusing to comply with its mask policy, said Tuesday she tested positive for COVID-19 and touted a “recipe” of unproven treatments, including the anti-parasitic drug ivermectin.
Another state Republican, Sen. David Wilson, also tested positive, and both are quarantining at home, the Anchorage Daily News reported. A third GOP senator, Click Bishop, said he was feeling ill, but reportedly tested negative for the virus
Anti-Mask Alaska State Senator Gets COVID-19, Touts Unproven Treatments​








						Anti-Mask Alaska State Senator Gets COVID-19, Touts Unproven Treatments
					

Sen. Lora Reinbold was banned from Alaska Airlines earlier this year for refusing to comply with its mask policy.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

My cousin keeps texting me links to recent Joe Rogan alternative covid facts YouTube videos.

My cousin and I agree on a lot of things and he’s not a far-right extremist, but I told him a long time ago, even before covid, that I’m done with Joe Rogan because he plays fast and loose with right-wing talking points. It’s not that I think every right-wing view is categorically wrong, but Rogan fans are like Trump supporters. They’ll see every word he says as gospel and complete truth and not bother to research further, especially if it counters any view of the left, data, or science. They’ll also use what he says to validate what originated from a random nutjob.

Needless to say, I don’t care what Rogan says and certainly not about Covid.


----------



## Deleted member 215

Rogan just did an interview with Dr. Sanjay Gupta and got Gupta to admit CNN was wrong to call ivermectin "horse dewormer". So of course that's now being played as a major victory for Rogan and the ivermectin crowd even though I don't think Gupta conceded much else.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

TBL said:


> Rogan just did an interview with Dr. Sanjay Gupta and got Gupta to admit CNN was wrong to call ivermectin "horse dewormer". So of course that's now being played as a major victory for Rogan and the ivermectin crowd even though I don't think Gupta conceded much else.




That is the most recent video my cousin sent me with "This is Rogan at his best!"

I really don't give a shit to know about these alternatives.  If you have cancer you don't forgo getting it surgically removed because somebody said eating copious amounts of sunflower seeds gets the same result.  Maybe it does.  Maybe it doesn't.  Maybe it only does for certain people.  You go with the option that is 90%+ effective.  If that fails then maybe look at other options.   You don't start with the most suspect and least effective options and slowly work your way to the best proven option.


----------



## Herdfan

TBL said:


> Rogan just did an interview with Dr. Sanjay Gupta and got Gupta to admit CNN was wrong to call ivermectin "horse dewormer". So of course that's now being played as a major victory for Rogan and the ivermectin crowd even though I don't think Gupta conceded much else.




I guess the bigger question is why CNN felt the need to do that in the first place.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> I guess the bigger question is why CNN felt the need to do that in the first place.




An even bigger question is why did so many people specifically seek out and purchase the horse dewormer version? I think it’s safe to assume it wasn’t the result of CNN’s marching orders.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I guess the bigger question is why CNN felt the need to do that in the first place.



No, it’s not.

That literally is what it’s used for.. deworming horses.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> No, it’s not.
> 
> That literally is what it’s used for.. deworming horses.



It’s also used to kill lice. Drug of many hats.
It can also deworm humans, though probably my drug of choice would be albendazole or mebendazole. I’ve never prescribed any of these.


----------



## Runs For Fun

__





						Alaskan state senator banned from airline for refusing to wear a mask has caught COVID-19
					





					www.msn.com
				






> “Its my turn to battle Covid head on... game on! Who do you think is going to win?” she wrote on Facebook.
> 
> “I am taking lots of vitamins ABCD & Quercitin & zinc citrate. Vit E and aspirin to reduce clotting. I am blessed to have gotten *Ivirmectin the ‘de -covider.’* My Vicks steamer has been a God send! My naturopath gave me tips too- that I am sure will work!”



FFS


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alaskan state senator banned from airline for refusing to wear a mask has caught COVID-19
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FFS



Again these f-ing morons acting like heroes trying dozens of treatments to fight a disease they could have prevented with a free vaccine.


----------



## fischersd

So, here's how things are going in BC, Canada (at the Health Authority that I work at - in IT) - long-term / critical care already had their dates previously, for the rest of us it boils down to:  Have your first shot by Oct 26.  If you don't, you're on 2 weeks unpaid leave.  Still don't after that?  You're terminated.

Yes, for about 97% of us we're already vaccinated, but just about every department is going to lose people because they bought into all of the conspiracy crap that's been coming out of the US.

Word is the feds are finally cutting off the CERB (UI benefit for anyone who lost their jobs due to covid) - and all of the Millennials that work in the service industry are now shocked and defiant that they're being expected to be vaccinated to work in a restaurant or bar.  Not sure what rock they've been living under.


----------



## fooferdoggie

ntivax Alaska lawmaker is rushed to hospital with COVID. His fellow antivaxxers, one of them a lawmaker, spend four days harassing doctors and nurses, trying to get in hospital, pretending to have authority to make his medical decisions. He dead
GOP Pol Waged Insane Battle to Treat Dying COVID Patient With Ivermectin​








						GOP Pol Waged Insane Battle to Treat Dying COVID Patient With Ivermectin
					

As William Topel’s condition rapidly deteriorated, an Alaska hospital was bombarded with harassing calls and visits.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

[Murica] Having successfully tested his scientific hypothesis of not taking a Covid-19 vaccines anti-vax, flat-Earther now has a front row seat to see from the heavens to test his hypothesis on whether or not the Earth is flat
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1448761420997435393/


----------



## Roller

fooferdoggie said:


> [Murica] Having successfully tested his scientific hypothesis of not taking a Covid-19 vaccines anti-vax, flat-Earther now has a front row seat to see from the heavens to test his hypothesis on whether or not the Earth is flat
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1448761420997435393/



Makes me wonder what it takes to be an influential flat-Earther... did he fall over the edge and climb back up onto terra firma to tell his story?


----------



## Roller

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> That is the most recent video my cousin sent me with "This is Rogan at his best!"
> 
> I really don't give a shit to know about these alternatives.  If you have cancer you don't forgo getting it surgically removed because somebody said eating copious amounts of sunflower seeds gets the same result.  Maybe it does.  Maybe it doesn't.  Maybe it only does for certain people.  You go with the option that is 90%+ effective.  If that fails then maybe look at other options.   You don't start with the most suspect and least effective options and slowly work your way to the best proven option.



That's pretty much what Steve Jobs did. he delayed surgery for his pancreatic neuroendocrine tumor by nine months in favor of alternative therapy. Though nothing is certain, he may very well still be alive had he followed his physicians' advice.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> That's pretty much what Steve Jobs did. he delayed surgery for his pancreatic neuroendocrine tumor by nine months in favor of alternative therapy. Though nothing is certain, he may very well still be alive had he followed his physicians' advice.



I’ve always found Jobs’ demise karmic.  The same behaviors that made him insanely successful ended up causing his demise. For the vast majority of humans, this behavior is the prime preventative of success.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> No, it’s not.
> 
> That literally is what it’s used for.. deworming horses.




No, it was developed for treating River Blindness in HUMANS.





__





						ivermectin oral: Uses, Side Effects, Interactions, Pictures, Warnings & Dosing - WebMD
					

Find patient medical information for ivermectin oral on WebMD including its uses, side effects and safety, interactions, pictures, warnings and user ratings.




					www.webmd.com
				












						Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
					

Discovered in the late-1970s, the pioneering drug ivermectin, a dihydro derivative of avermectin—originating solely from a single microorganism isolated at the Kitasato Intitute, Tokyo, Japan from Japanese soil—has had an immeasurably ...




					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




So here you have a reputable news organization calling it horse dewormer.  So what happens when a Dr. prescribes it for one of the conditions it is indicated for and the patient won't take it because CNN said it was for horses.  100% irresponsible reporting.

It is also used on horses.  Ever hear of Ketamine?  It is also used on both Humans and horses.  There is a whole list of drugs that can and are used on humans, horse and other animals.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> No, it was developed for treating River Blindness in HUMANS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ivermectin oral: Uses, Side Effects, Interactions, Pictures, Warnings & Dosing - WebMD
> 
> 
> Find patient medical information for ivermectin oral on WebMD including its uses, side effects and safety, interactions, pictures, warnings and user ratings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.webmd.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
> 
> 
> Discovered in the late-1970s, the pioneering drug ivermectin, a dihydro derivative of avermectin—originating solely from a single microorganism isolated at the Kitasato Intitute, Tokyo, Japan from Japanese soil—has had an immeasurably ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So here you have a reputable news organization calling it horse dewormer.  So what happens when a Dr. prescribes it for one of the conditions it is indicated for and the patient won't take it because CNN said it was for horses.  100% irresponsible reporting.
> 
> It is also used on horses.  Ever hear of Ketamine?  It is also used on both Humans and horses.  There is a whole list of drugs that can and are used on humans, horse and other animals.



Now you’re moving the goalposts to “it was developed for” instead of what it’s used for.

Is it used as a horse dewormer?

Yes. So, the reporting is accurate.

It may be other things as well. They didn’t say it is NOT used for other things.

Some things we do know: it has no helpful effect if you have COVID, and can have adverse effects if taken in large doses. It’s also unlikely to be prescribed by a reputable doctor if you have COVID, so people are buying it from animal feed stores, in the dose meant for DEWORMING HORSES... it says it right on the label I posted.

Even the FDA’s website warning people not to use it for COVID has a picture of a horse on it. You are beyond ridiculous, sir. Do NOT drink any more of Tucker Carlson’s Kool-Aid.









						Why You Should Not Use Ivermectin to Treat or Prevent COVID-19
					

Using the Drug ivermectin to treat COVID-19 can be dangerous and even lethal. The FDA has not approved the drug for that purpose.




					www.fda.gov


----------



## MEJHarrison

Roller said:


> Makes me wonder what it takes to be an influential flat-Earther...




Well, clearly, one must be dumb.  But to be influential, you have to dumb enough to believe it, but smart enough to pass that stupidity on to others.  Not every dummy has what it takes to train other dummies.  If you believe the earth is flat, but also grasp elementary science at say at least the grade school or middle school level, I'd think you'd be setup perfectly to be an influencer.

If you take an average person, these people are on the dumb side of that line.  So if you take the average dumb person, I believe flat earthers on still on the dumb side of that dumb line.  So basically the influencers are the smartest people in the dumbest subgroup.

That's my guess.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> So what happens when a Dr. prescribes it for one of the conditions it is indicated for and the patient won't take it because CNN said it was for horses.




That's just one more dumb patient getting advice from sources other than doctors.  Taking medicine for the wrong reasons is just as bad as refusing medicine for the wrong reasons.

The problem isn't who is and isn't taking the drug.  The problem is people trusting advice found on the internet over that of medical doctors.

I'm not really clear what the point is here.  To me it's just another flavor of stupid.


----------



## SuperMatt

MEJHarrison said:


> That's just one more dumb patient getting advice from sources other than doctors.  Taking medicine for the wrong reasons is just as bad as refusing medicine for the wrong reasons.
> 
> The problem isn't who is and isn't taking the drug.  The problem is people trusting advice found on the internet over that of medical doctors.
> 
> I'm not really clear what the point is here.  To me it's just another flavor of stupid.



Maybe this is the point?





__





						Urban Dictionary: contrarian
					

Someone who automatically tends to take the opposite point of view from the person to whom they're speaking, or to disagree with society at large out of a sort of knee-jerk reflex.




					www.urbandictionary.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> I’ve always found Jobs’ demise karmic.  The same behaviors that made him insanely successful ended up causing his demise. For the vast majority of humans, this behavior is the prime preventative of success.




If only Jobs had access to Joe Rogan and his small unit of contrarian doctors.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Now you’re moving the goalposts to “it was developed for” instead of what it’s used for.
> 
> Is it used as a horse dewormer?
> 
> Yes. So, the reporting is accurate.
> 
> It may be other things as well. They didn’t say it is NOT used for other things.




Well, it is currently being used on Afghani refugees entering the US.  So it is being used for what it was developed for.  Goal posts moved back.

And yes, it is also used  as a horse dewormer.

Even CNN's own Dr. Gupta said CNN probably shouldn't have said it was horse dewormer.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> No, it was developed for treating River Blindness in HUMANS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ivermectin oral: Uses, Side Effects, Interactions, Pictures, Warnings & Dosing - WebMD
> 
> 
> Find patient medical information for ivermectin oral on WebMD including its uses, side effects and safety, interactions, pictures, warnings and user ratings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.webmd.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
> 
> 
> Discovered in the late-1970s, the pioneering drug ivermectin, a dihydro derivative of avermectin—originating solely from a single microorganism isolated at the Kitasato Intitute, Tokyo, Japan from Japanese soil—has had an immeasurably ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So here you have a reputable news organization calling it horse dewormer.  So what happens when a Dr. prescribes it for one of the conditions it is indicated for and the patient won't take it because CNN said it was for horses.  100% irresponsible reporting.
> 
> It is also used on horses.  Ever hear of Ketamine?  It is also used on both Humans and horses.  There is a whole list of drugs that can and are used on humans, horse and other animals.




This whole situation is making me realize the power of pharmaceutical ads.  If I have an issue with something I know nothing about I'm going to go to an expert and get their advice.  Apparently, a scary amount of people think their television is the expert.  I'd want to punch myself in the face if I ever went to an expert with "So I saw on TV....."


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Well, it is currently being used on Afghani refugees entering the US.  So it is being used for what it was developed for.  Goal posts moved back.
> 
> And yes, it is also used  as a horse dewormer.
> 
> Even CNN's own Dr. Gupta said CNN probably shouldn't have said it was horse dewormer.



It is a horse dewormer. It doesn’t treat COVID. I don’t give a shit what Don Lemon or Joe Rogan say. Facts are facts, and Joe Rogan can have his stupid crybaby “waaah people accused me of eating horse medicine” moment if he wants. Who cares? Dude eat a whole tube of the stuff if you want. Hope it goes well for you.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Now you’re moving the goalposts to “it was developed for” instead of what it’s used for.
> 
> Is it used as a horse dewormer?
> 
> Yes. So, the reporting is accurate.
> 
> It may be other things as well. They didn’t say it is NOT used for other things.
> 
> Some things we do know: it has no helpful effect if you have COVID, and can have adverse effects if taken in large doses. It’s also unlikely to be prescribed by a reputable doctor if you have COVID, so people are buying it from animal feed stores, in the dose meant for DEWORMING HORSES... it says it right on the label I posted.
> 
> Even the FDA’s website warning people not to use it for COVID has a picture of a horse on it. You are beyond ridiculous, sir. Do NOT drink any more of Tucker Carlson’s Kool-Aid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Why You Should Not Use Ivermectin to Treat or Prevent COVID-19
> 
> 
> Using the Drug ivermectin to treat COVID-19 can be dangerous and even lethal. The FDA has not approved the drug for that purpose.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.fda.gov



The only context this drug ever came up since my medschool pharmacology classes was de-licing (not me, I’m bald, LOL). 

I made my stance on this before, RW nuts really doing a disservice to the drug repurposing movement, which is a dirty shame…

@Herdfan where are your promised responses? You’ve posted enough over here to cover the effort you promised to make to have an actual 2-way conversation. Also, did you read what river blindness is?


----------



## Pumbaa

P_X said:


> @Herdfan where are your promised responses? You’ve posted enough over here to cover the effort you promised to make to have an actual 2-way conversation.



Probably just two weeks away.


----------



## User.45

Pumbaa said:


> Probably just two weeks away.



My impression is that he made his promise to get me off his back while never actually planning to deliver. Alternatively he is stress testing the questions with RW people at other sites/avenues and awaiting ammo produced by others. No matter what, this behavior just seems to be corroborating my comment on intellectual cowardice.


----------



## Eric

In the last month two people I personally knew have died from COVID, I know we like to point call them out but it's just sad and so unnecessary at this point.


----------



## Hrafn

Eric said:


> In the last month two people I personally knew have died from COVID, I know we like to point call them out but it's just sad and so unnecessary at this point.



My SIL lost two family members in the past month as well.  I did not know them, but it’s hurting her family


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> In the last month two people I personally knew have died from COVID, I know we like to point call them out but it's just sad and so unnecessary at this point.





Hrafn said:


> My SIL lost two family members in the past month as well.  I did not know them, but it’s hurting her family



Yup, COVID still sucks


----------



## Eric

Hrafn said:


> My SIL lost two family members in the past month as well.  I did not know them, but it’s hurting her family



Sorry to hear that, this delta variant really changed things and IMO we loosened restrictions way too fast. What's done is done but hopefully we can all learn from it.


----------



## User.45

May have been posted elsewhere, but here's COVID Smart:









						In Portugal, There Is Virtually No One Left to Vaccinate
					

Portugal is among the most highly vaccinated countries in the world. Vice Adm. Henrique Gouveia e Melo, who led the campaign, said there was a key to his success: Keep politics out of it.




					www.nytimes.com
				






> Portugal’s health care system was on the verge of collapse. Hospitals in the capital, Lisbon, were overflowing and the authorities were asking people to treat themselves at home. In the last week of January, nearly 2,000 people died as the virus spread.
> 
> The country’s vaccine program was in a shambles, so the government turned to Vice Adm. Henrique Gouveia e Melo, a former submarine squadron commander, to right the ship.
> 
> Eight months later, Portugal is among the world’s leaders in vaccinations, with roughly 86 percent of its population of 10.3 million fully vaccinated. About 98 percent of all of those eligible for vaccines — meaning anyone over 12 — have been fully vaccinated, Admiral Gouveia e Melo said.







> But for the moment, as bars and nightclubs buzz with life, infections dwindle and deaths plummet, the country’s vaccination drive has succeeded even after encountering many of the same hurdles that caused others to flounder.
> 
> The same flood of misinformation about vaccines has filled the social media accounts of the Portuguese. The country is run by a minority left-wing government, a reflection of its political divisions. And, according to public opinion polls, there was widespread doubt about the vaccines when they first arrived.
> 
> Admiral Gouveia e Melo has been credited with turning it around. With a background working on complicated logistical challenges in the military, he was named in February to lead the national vaccination task force.
> 
> Standing 6 feet 3 inches, the admiral made it a point to wear only his combat uniform in his many public and television appearances as he sought to essentially draft the nation into one collective pandemic-fighting force.






> He quickly assembled a team of some three dozen people, led by elite military personnel — including mathematicians, doctors, analysts and strategic experts from Portugal’s Army, Air Force and Navy.
> 
> Asked what other countries can do to bolster their own vaccination efforts, he did not hesitate to offer his best advice.
> 
> “They need to find people who are not politicians,” he said.
> 
> Before the pandemic, Portugal was fortunate to have a robust national vaccination program. It grew out of the country’s devastating experience battling polio, which was still affecting the country after Admiral Gouveia e Melo was born in 1960. He recalls when the daughter of a family friend fell ill from the disease and the suffering that followed.
> 
> Manuela Ivone da Cunha, a Portuguese anthropologist who has studied anti-vaccination movements, said that “vaccine doubters and anti-vaxxers are in the minority in Portugal, and they are also less vocal” than they are in many other countries.






> Protesters were blocking the entrance to a vaccination center in Lisbon, so he donned his combat uniform and went there with no security detail.
> 
> “I went through these crazy people,” he said. “They started to call me ‘murderer, murderer.’”
> 
> As the television cameras rolled, the admiral calmly stood his ground.
> 
> “I said the murderer is the virus,” Admiral Gouveia e Melo recalled. The true killer, he said, would be people who live like it is the 13th century without any notion of reality.
> 
> “I attempted to communicate in a very true and honest way about all doubts and problems,” he said.






> “In the beginning, we had some 40 percent who were unsure,” Admiral Gouveia e Melo said. Now, according to polls, he said, only 2.2 percent do not want the vaccine.
> 
> As he stepped down from the task force this week, the admiral said he felt the country was on a good course. But, ever the submariner, he cautioned that vigilance would remain essential to ensuring that this war was won.





And something a little softer but still packaged in american flags with eagles could have totally flown in the USA.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> May have been posted elsewhere, but here's COVID Smart:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In Portugal, There Is Virtually No One Left to Vaccinate
> 
> 
> Portugal is among the most highly vaccinated countries in the world. Vice Adm. Henrique Gouveia e Melo, who led the campaign, said there was a key to his success: Keep politics out of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And something a little softer but still packaged in american flags with eagles could have totally flown in the USA.



If Trump was pushing the vaccine like this (or at all) we would be over 90% for sure. Because people who have half a brain would get the vaccine regardless of what Trump does… and the Trumpers would all want to be the first to show their support for their leader.


----------



## Herdfan

First, the idea that I am afraid of any of you intellectually, emotionally or physically is laughable.  Just sayin'.




P_X said:


> I'll let you in on a secret: I use search engines quickly and efficiently and I make a substantial effort  (at least on your scale) to understand opposing viewpoints. I start calling people out when I repeatedly catch them on not reading their own sources. Which has been my impression about you. I suspect you only read headlines and even cherry pick those.
> 
> The other thing I call people out for is intellectual cowardice. When your statements meet opposition, you make a 30sec effort to push back and if defending your stance takes more than that, you just wait out the topic change. Like here, I've asked you a bunch of questions and you've just tried to change the topic.
> 
> *1. If you are such an advocate of medical freedom and oppose vaccine mandates, how come this didn't come to your mind when it came to Influenza?*
> 
> Most hospitals I worked at has had an Influenza vaccine mandate for a looong time:




And most people knew that going in.  They knew it BEFORE they spent years and thousands of dollars on their education and training.  

So to drop a new condition of employment on them is wrong in my opinion.  As for the flu vaccine, while I don't know all the reason HC workers are not wanting to take the vaccine, the speed in which it was developed certianly could factor into this decision and the flu, and other vaccines you mention, have been around for decades and people feel safe taking them.  Don't forget, just a year ago there were several prominent Dems saying they wouldn't take the "Trump" vaccine.  I wonder if those comments have had any bearing on some of these decisions.




> *2. Are you willing to admit that staffing issues predate COVID vaccine mandates?*




Sure.  They did.  But vaccine mandates will make is worse.  If "X" is the ideal number of people it takes to run an ICU, but due to staffing you only have "Y", but enough to run it, remove a few more people due to mandates and you can go from short-staffed to not being able to open a wing.




> *3. Are you willing to admit that running ICUs at capacity had contributed manyfold more to the staffing shortage than mandates?*




That's possible.  Perhaps even likely.  The pandemic has caused burn-out in a number of industries, HC certainly being one hit the hardest.  Causing further staffing shortages certainly won't help.





> *4. If you admit that staffing issues are most significantly impacted by the pandemic itself, wouldn't measures that control the pandemic be the most effective way to fight staffing issues?*




The question uses the premise that the vaccine is the only way.  My governor has proposed a bill that having had COVID is equivalent to being vaccinated for mandate purposes. I won't post any links because for everyone I post supporting that, there will be a link not supporting it.  So I don't think we know for sure which is better.

This question also assumes HC workers who have left the field because of the pandemic or even prepandemic, will return when the pandemic is over.  Or when staffing shortages ease (I get not wanting to work 60-70 hours a week) that these workers will come back.




> *5. You still have to answer: if COVID-19 is an indirect act of bioterrorism, isn't it the patriotic thing to do is to get vaccinated?*




Two things can be true.  It could have been created in a lab AND released on accident.  I won't go so far as to blame the CCP for releasing it on purpose.   So no, it wasn't an act of bioterrorism so no patriotic duty exists.



> To provide my stance on all of this as a father of small children. The ultimate parenting success is to get your kids do the right thing without intimidation, but sometimes you have to be assertive to prevent them from hurting themselves. I believe in the same principle societally. America did a truly impressive job making smoking uncool and frowned upon. Opposing vaccination should receive similar societal attitudes. Yet here you are claiming to be a "vaccine-believer" but also normalizing antivaxxer sentiments.




Opposing the vaccine and opposing the mandate for the vaccine are two completely different things.  Like I have posted in the past, businesses can mandate whatever conditions on employees they want, but I don't like when a government does it.


----------



## fooferdoggie

New Brunswick pastor jailed for a week as judge considers COVID-19 contempt charge​








						New Brunswick pastor jailed for a week as judge considers COVID-19 contempt charge
					

A New Brunswick pastor is in custody after a court hearing Friday over his alleged breaches of COVID-19 public health rules was adjourned until next week.




					atlantic.ctvnews.ca


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> First, the idea that I am afraid of any of you intellectually, emotionally or physically is laughable.  Just sayin'.
> 
> And most people knew that going in.  They knew it BEFORE they spent years and thousands of dollars on their education and training.
> 
> So to drop a new condition of employment on them is wrong in my opinion.  As for the flu vaccine, while I don't know all the reason HC workers are not wanting to take the vaccine, the speed in which it was developed certianly could factor into this decision and the flu, and other vaccines you mention, have been around for decades and people feel safe taking them.  Don't forget, just a year ago there were several prominent Dems saying they wouldn't take the "Trump" vaccine.  I wonder if those comments have had any bearing on some of these decisions
> 
> Sure.  They did.  But vaccine mandates will make is worse.  If "X" is the ideal number of people it takes to run an ICU, but due to staffing you only have "Y", but enough to run it, remove a few more people due to mandates and you can go from short-staffed to not being able to open a wing.
> 
> That's possible.  Perhaps even likely.  The pandemic has caused burn-out in a number of industries, HC certainly being one hit the hardest.  Causing further staffing shortages certainly won't help.
> 
> The question uses the premise that the vaccine is the only way.  My governor has proposed a bill that having had COVID is equivalent to being vaccinated for mandate purposes. I won't post any links because for everyone I post supporting that, there will be a link not supporting it.  So I don't think we know for sure which is better.
> 
> This question also assumes HC workers who have left the field because of the pandemic or even prepandemic, will return when the pandemic is over.  Or when staffing shortages ease (I get not wanting to work 60-70 hours a week) that these workers will come back.
> 
> Two things can be true.  It could have been created in a lab AND released on accident.  I won't go so far as to blame the CCP for releasing it on purpose.   So no, it wasn't an act of bioterrorism so no patriotic duty exists.
> 
> Opposing the vaccine and opposing the mandate for the vaccine are two completely different things.  Like I have posted in the past, businesses can mandate whatever conditions on employees they want, but I don't like when a government does it.



I'll comment on a few of your points:

1. The biggest driver for HCWs leaving our profession is burnout that began with facing a disease that was, at the beginning of the pandemic, barely treatable past a certain stage, coupled with the risk it put on them and their families. But that was followed by the much bigger disappointment of dealing with patients whose hospitalization, morbidity, and mortality could have been prevented by a free vaccine. It's as if a large segment of the population suddenly stopped using seat belts.

2. Infection with SARS-CoV-2 confers some immunity, but not as much as a full course of the top vaccines.

3. Your point about the newness of the vaccines being a cause for anxiety doesn't hold water if one takes the time to understand how they were developed and acknowledge that they've been administered hundreds of millions of times with excellent safety profiles. It also makes no sense that the politicians and others who favor monoclonal antibodies over vaccines have no such concerns.

4. You say that you don't like when governments mandate vaccination. Does that also apply to vaccines that have been required by state governments, the military, and others for many years?


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> First, the idea that I am afraid of any of you intellectually, emotionally or physically is laughable.  Just sayin'.



This is a forum where all we know about a person is what and _how_ they post. The fact that it took a promise and 2-3 days to come up with the above answers speak very loudly. So does your urge to point out that you aren't physically intimidated. Did any of us threaten you?



Herdfan said:


> And most people knew that going in.  They knew it BEFORE they spent years and thousands of dollars on their education and training. So to drop a new condition of employment on them is wrong in my opinion.



So you are suggesting that in any field, professional standards should only be upheld at the level they where when the person entered the profession?
*Yes* or *No*?




Herdfan said:


> As for the flu vaccine, while I don't know all the reason HC workers are not wanting to take the vaccine, the speed in which it was developed certianly could factor into this decision and the flu, and other vaccines you mention, have been around for decades and people feel safe taking them.



COVID vaccines were just as adequately tested in phase I, II, III and now IV trials as influenza vaccinations (plural, there are many of them).
Those who value the age of evidence over its quality do not make an informed decision. As there are conventional COVID vaccines too, this is a transparent excuse. Concurrently:


> Two randomized controlled studies evaluating the effect of health care worker vaccination on nursing home resi- dents found that health care worker influenza vaccination was associated with a 44% decrease in resident mortality.



Not killing your patients actively is a very minimal professional standard.
Source: https://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/pdfplus/10.2105/AJPH.2009.190751



Herdfan said:


> Don't forget, just a year ago there were several prominent Dems saying they wouldn't take the "Trump" vaccine.  I wonder if those comments have had any bearing on some of these decisions.



"Those comments" don't exist and you know it, which makes you a LIAR.
County level voting and vaccination data shows the opposite.
Antivaxxerism is now a GOP issue and trying to push the responsibility to the other side is COWARDICE.



Herdfan said:


> Sure.  They did.  But vaccine mandates will make is worse.  If "X" is the ideal number of people it takes to run an ICU, but due to staffing you only have "Y", but enough to run it, remove a few more people due to mandates and you can go from short-staffed to not being able to open a wing.






Herdfan said:


> That's possible.  Perhaps even likely.  The pandemic has caused burn-out in a number of industries, HC certainly being one hit the hardest.  Causing further staffing shortages certainly won't help.



OK so you admitted staffing issues pre-date the COVID vaccine mandates and that COVID greatly contributed to said shortages.

Let's say 35% of ICU beds are used for COVID since 2020 and  95% of those are occupied by unvaxxed people, then >30% of your staffing is to cover preventable admissions. Burn out is 50% among nurses, and let's say antivaxxers are around 5%. In this scenario, you wasted third of your resources, burned out 50% of your nurses to keep 5% of the (wo)manpower. If this is responsible management for you, you're clearly not a fiscal conservative.




Herdfan said:


> The question uses the premise that the vaccine is the only way.  My governor has proposed a bill that having had COVID is equivalent to being vaccinated for mandate purposes. I won't post any links because for everyone I post supporting that, there will be a link not supporting it.  So I don't think we know for sure which is better.



No, I used the word "control" and not "vaccinate" so you can't hide behind a _non sequitur._



Herdfan said:


> This question also assumes HC workers who have left the field because of the pandemic or even prepandemic, will return when the pandemic is over.



Only you made such an assumption. HC workers are a dynamic resource, but not infinite, unlike what Abbot and his ilk imply.



Herdfan said:


> Two things can be true.  It could have been created in a lab AND released on accident.  I won't go so far as to blame the CCP for releasing it on purpose.   So no, it wasn't an act of bioterrorism so no patriotic duty exists.



Read my question again. I used the term _indirect_, because if SARS-CoV-2 was developed in a lab, it is a bioweapon and releasing it even by accident is an act of bioterrorism. The patriotic duty to uphold national security only exists if it's  the southern border or if the attack is intentional? Is this what you're saying?



Herdfan said:


> Opposing the vaccine and opposing the mandate for the vaccine are two completely different things.  Like I have posted in the past, businesses can mandate whatever conditions on employees they want, but I don't like when a government does it.



1) Let's change the word "business" to "employer." The government is a major employer.
2) You can oppose mandates but actually call out antivaxxers for the idiots 99% of them actually are.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> And most people knew that going in. They knew it BEFORE they spent years and thousands of dollars on their education and training.
> 
> So to drop a new condition of employment on them is wrong in my opinion. As for the flu vaccine, while I don't know all the reason HC workers are not wanting to take the vaccine, the speed in which it was developed certianly could factor into this decision and the flu, and other vaccines you mention, have been around for decades and people feel safe taking them. Don't forget, just a year ago there were several prominent Dems saying they wouldn't take the "Trump" vaccine. I wonder if those comments have had any bearing on some of these decisions.



Are you saying healthcare workers should only be required to get vaccines that existed when they started medical or nursing school? Don’t healthcare workers know that new medicines and vaccines are invented all the time? This argument doesn‘t even stand up to a mild breeze.

Don‘t auto mechanics need to work on new cars that come out? You wouldn’t get much work as a mechanic if you worked only on cars sold before you started your career…

I am not a doctor, but I believe the flu shot changes every year. If that’s true, then healthcare workers are agreeing to a new vaccine each year, and it makes no sense to be against the COVID one specifically. The only reason I can think of for doing so is being part of the Trump death cult…


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> "Those comments" don't exist and you know it, which makes you a LIAR.



After this post I am done.  You can call me wrong, incorrect, misinformed or even ignorant.  But you can't call me a liar. 









						'I will not take his word for it': Kamala Harris says she would not trust Trump alone on a coronavirus vaccine
					

Democratic vice presidential nominee Kamala Harris said that President Donald Trump's word alone on any potential coronavirus vaccine is not enough.




					www.cnn.com
				












						Democrat Biden warns against rushing out coronavirus vaccine, says Trump cannot be trusted
					

Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden on Wednesday rejected President Donald Trump's charge that he is spreading fear about the safety of a potential coronavirus vaccine, urging Trump to defer to scientists and not rush its rollout.




					www.reuters.com
				








__





						Loading…
					





					www.washingtonpost.com
				





> Every time you write about such things, though, the pushback is similar: What about New York Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo (D) and Vice President Harris?
> 
> Months ago, *both made comments of questionable wisdom about the safety of the then-impending vaccines. *Both indicated that they didn’t fully trust the Trump administration to oversee the process.




I will end by saying both are idiots.  Trump had nothing to do with the development of any of these vaccines.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> After this post I am done.  You can call me wrong, incorrect, misinformed or even ignorant.  But you can't call me a liar.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'I will not take his word for it': Kamala Harris says she would not trust Trump alone on a coronavirus vaccine
> 
> 
> Democratic vice presidential nominee Kamala Harris said that President Donald Trump's word alone on any potential coronavirus vaccine is not enough.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Democrat Biden warns against rushing out coronavirus vaccine, says Trump cannot be trusted
> 
> 
> Democratic presidential candidate Joe Biden on Wednesday rejected President Donald Trump's charge that he is spreading fear about the safety of a potential coronavirus vaccine, urging Trump to defer to scientists and not rush its rollout.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Loading…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.washingtonpost.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I will end by saying both are idiots.  Trump had nothing to do with the development of any of these vaccines.



Those quotes and your “take” on them are NOT the same thing. You are saying one thing, and if you read the article, you’ll see you’ve missed the mark when you said:



> Don't forget, just a year ago there were several prominent Dems saying they wouldn't take the "Trump" vaccine.




What was actually said (from your linked article):



> "I will say that I would not trust Donald Trump and it would have to be a credible source of information that talks about the efficacy and the reliability of whatever he's talking about," she continued in the clip from an exclusive interview airing Sunday on CNN's "State of the Union" at 9 a.m. ET. "I will not take his word for it."




She wouldn’t take his word for it, she would rely on a credible source of information (like the NIH, CDC, or FDA).

As for Biden:



> “Let me be clear: I trust vaccines, I trust scientists, but I don’t trust Donald Trump,” Biden said. “At this moment, the American people can’t either.”
> 
> Biden warned against trying to rush out an unfinished vaccine ahead of the Nov. 3 election.




Trying to rush a vaccine without testing it would endanger people, and Trump was pressing to have it ready before the election regardless of the status of the testing.

The clear difference between your CLAIM and the REALITY is why I think @P_X called you a liar. Neither Harris nor Biden said they wouldn’t take a vaccine, but that they trust the scientists and doctors, NOT Donald Trump.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> After this post I am done.  You can call me wrong, incorrect, misinformed or even ignorant.  But you can't call me a liar.



Sure, you're not a liar. You're just Calculon.


----------



## Herdfan

Not sure how you will blame the GOP in this one.  But go ahead and try:





__





						Nearly 40% of California state workers are unvaccinated against COVID despite Newsom order
					





					www.msn.com
				




Also probably not a majority of Republicans:









						‘Defund The Media!’: Protest Against Vax Mandate Erupts Outside New York Times Building
					

Protestors demonstrated Saturday against vaccine mandates in front of the New York Times (NYT) building in New York City, chanting, "defund the media!"




					dailycaller.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Not sure how you will blame the GOP in this one.  But go ahead and try:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nearly 40% of California state workers are unvaccinated against COVID despite Newsom order
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also probably not a majority of Republicans:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ‘Defund The Media!’: Protest Against Vax Mandate Erupts Outside New York Times Building
> 
> 
> Protestors demonstrated Saturday against vaccine mandates in front of the New York Times (NYT) building in New York City, chanting, "defund the media!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dailycaller.com



What is the purpose of your preface to the first story? Has anybody here previously mentioned that story and/or blamed anybody for it? In my reading of it, it looks like *Newsom* screwed up by allowing people to test instead of getting the vaccine. It should be: vaccine or go home. The testing is a needless ongoing expense. You want to work for the state of California? Great, get a vaccine. If not, find another employer.

And I don’t understand your analysis of the 2nd story. Do you believe those protesters in NYC holding “F*&* Biden” signs are democrats? Not bloody likely.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Not sure how you will blame the GOP in this one.  But go ahead and try:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Nearly 40% of California state workers are unvaccinated against COVID despite Newsom order
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also probably not a majority of Republicans:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ‘Defund The Media!’: Protest Against Vax Mandate Erupts Outside New York Times Building
> 
> 
> Protestors demonstrated Saturday against vaccine mandates in front of the New York Times (NYT) building in New York City, chanting, "defund the media!"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dailycaller.com



You’re quoting a source started by Tucker Carlson? Well that definitely provides entertainment value.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> What is the purpose of your preface to the first story? Has anybody here previously mentioned that story and/or blamed anybody for it?
> 
> And I don’t understand your analysis of the 2nd story. Do you believe those protesters in NYC holding “F*&* Biden” signs are democrats? Not bloody likely.



Just two more stories he didn’t read. Business as usual.


----------



## Herdfan

Here are some clips from both Biden & Harris talking about the vaccine.


SuperMatt said:


> What is the purpose of your preface to the first story? Has anybody here previously mentioned that story and/or blamed anybody for it?
> 
> And I don’t understand your analysis of the 2nd story. Do you believe those protesters in NYC holding “F*&* Biden” signs are democrats? Not bloody likely.




People blame the GOP for being anti-vax in general.  I don't necessarily agree, but it is what it is.  So you would think in heavy Democratic CA, there would be more say compliance with vaccine mandates ordered by a Dem Governor.

Hate to break it to you, lots of Dems are not happy with Biden right now.  So the idea a Dem would be carrying a F-Biden sign is not out of line.


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> You’re quoting a source started by Tucker Carlson? Well that definitely provides entertainment value.




I will apologize for that one.  I was going through several sources and didn't realize the DC was one of them.  I am trying not use those sources.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Hate to break it to you, lots of Dems are not happy with Biden right now.  So the idea a Dem would be carrying a F-Biden sign is not out of line.



Yes it is out of line. Let me guess, because the protesters are in NYC, you assume they are democrats or some nonsense like that?

Check out the NY Post coverage of the event. Then tell me that’s a group of Democrats. Come on dude, are you even trying? Absolutely pathetic, lazy attempt.

#anattemptwasmade









						Hundreds demand ‘freedom’ from COVID-19 vaccine at Times Square rally
					

Nearly 1,000 people flocked to a Times Square rally Saturday to protest the COVID-19 vaccine and mandates that they get jabbed.




					nypost.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I will apologize for that one.  I was going through several sources and didn't realize the DC was one of them.  I am trying not use those sources.



I don’t mind the source - it shows everything we need to know. Who is covering the story? What is their angle? You can post right-wing sources all day unless you are trying to make a presumably factual statement (such as effectiveness of vaccines or the science on climate change)… THEN I care about the veracity of the source. As for coverage of a political rally or some nonsense? Please post the right-wing sources so I can see their spin and get some insight into why people could ever believe that an angry white mob wearing anti-MSM t-shirts, F-Biden signs, etc. could POSSIBLY be a mob of Democrats.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> People blame the GOP for being anti-vax in general. I don't necessarily agree, but it is what it is.



Look at DeSantis and Abbott. They are major figures in the GOP, possibly both with presidential ambitions, and in charge of 2 of the largest states in America. They are vehemently anti-vaccine and anti-mask. Vaccination rates directly correspond with political party. This is a sad state of affairs, because it doesn’t need to be this way. The GOP decided they don’t care how many people die… they just want to score political points by “PWNING” Fauci and Biden. And the GOP sheep line up for the slaughter.



> Only 14% of Americans say they will definitely not get vaccinated. But this group is 69% white, compared with 7% Black and 12% Hispanic. Republicans make up 58% of this group, while Democrats account for 18%.



But sure, how dare we blame the GOP for something they definitely are responsible for?









						Unvaccinated Americans Whiter, More Republican Than Vaccinated
					

Black and Hispanic people disproportionately make up the unvaccinated group that is waiting to see whether problems arise, poll finds




					www.voanews.com


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Yes it is out of line. Let me guess, because the protesters are in NYC, you assume they are democrats or some nonsense like that?
> 
> Check out the NY Post coverage of the event. *Then tell me that’s a group of Democrats. Come on dude, are you even trying? Absolutely pathetic, lazy attempt.
> *
> #anattemptwasmade
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hundreds demand ‘freedom’ from COVID-19 vaccine at Times Square rally
> 
> 
> Nearly 1,000 people flocked to a Times Square rally Saturday to protest the COVID-19 vaccine and mandates that they get jabbed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nypost.com




Now I get to ask if you even read the article?



> Anti-vaxxer Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the board chair of Children’s Health Defense, addressed the crowd of about 900 and said, “the vaccine is not safe and effective.”




If you click the link on Anti-vaxxer Robert F. Kennedy Jr. it will take you to another story which says this:



> Robert F. Kennedy Jr.,* the left’s most prominent anti-vaxxer *— wait, doesn’t the left despise all things anti-vax? — has a new book, a big feature in Town & Country online, and a starring role on op-ed pages agitating for parole for his father’s assassin.




So a left-wing speaker is at the event, and addresses the crowd, yeah I am going to think there are some Dems in it.  You may not.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Look at DeSantis and Abbott. They are major figures in the GOP, possibly both with presidential ambitions, and in charge of 2 of the largest states in America. They are vehemently anti-vaccine and anti-mask.




I would not agree that DeSantis and Abbott are anti-vaccine.  They are anti-mandate.  There is a difference.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Now I get to ask if you even read the article?
> 
> 
> 
> If you click the link on Anti-vaxxer Robert F. Kennedy Jr. it will take you to another story which says this:
> 
> 
> 
> So a left-wing speaker is at the event, and addresses the crowd, yeah I am going to think there are some Dems in it.  You may not.



Robert F Kennedy is not a left-wing speaker. He’s a long time anti-vax nutbag. He’s been on that crazy train for more than a decade, claiming vaccines cause autism.

Come on, man…


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> I would not agree that DeSantis and Abbott are anti-vaccine.  They are anti-mandate.  *There is a difference.*



Not when it comes to infecting others there isn't, they're explicitly and knowingly allowing this virus to spread and as a result those of us who want to do the right thing end up needing boosters and extra protection, not to mention they're a breeding ground for this thing to mutate. In the end it's a needlessly selfish act that has life and death consequences.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I would not agree that DeSantis and Abbott are anti-vaccine.  They are anti-mandate.  There is a difference.



No, there fucking isn’t. As pointed out many times to you, to beat the disease, we need to get 70-80% of everybody vaccinated at least. You don’t know jack shit about public health, and yet continually ignore scientists and doctors in favor of your own take on things… why? Only one reason. You are brainwashed by GOP propaganda. Baaaa…. 

You are the perfect example of why I blame the GOP for COVID getting so bad. If you didn’t need the vaccine to see your mother, you admit you would not have gotten it… even though you’ve gotten many other vaccines in your life. It’s all due to propaganda.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> No, there fucking isn’t. *As pointed out many times to you, to beat the disease, we need to get 70-80% of everybody vaccinated at least. *You don’t know jack shit about public health, and yet continually ignore scientists and doctors in favor of your own take on things… why? Only one reason. You are brainwashed by GOP propaganda. Baaaa….




I agree with that.  I just prefer the carrot, you prefer the stick.


----------



## Herdfan

I know many won't agree with this, but Fauci is doing the administration no favors.  People don't want or need permission from the government to get together with their family.  And stuff like this just pisses them off whether you will acknowledge it or not.



> "I believe strongly that -- particularly in the vaccinated people, if you’re vaccinated and your family members are vaccinated, those who are eligible, that is obviously very young children and not yet eligible, that you can enjoy the holidays.












						Fauci says Americans can enjoy holidays with family if fully vaccinated
					

President Biden’s chief medical adviser, Anthony Fauci, provided reassurance to Americans eager to spend time with relatives in the coming months, saying on Sunday that they could convene if&n…




					thehill.com


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> I agree with that.  I just prefer the carrot, you prefer the stick.



When 1 person can infect 9, you pull out the stick. As a nurse put it recently "you'll either get the vaccine or you'll get COVID".


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I know many won't agree with this, but Fauci is doing the administration no favors.  People don't want or need permission from the government to get together with their family.  And stuff like this just pisses them off whether you will acknowledge it or not.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fauci says Americans can enjoy holidays with family if fully vaccinated
> 
> 
> President Biden’s chief medical adviser, Anthony Fauci, provided reassurance to Americans eager to spend time with relatives in the coming months, saying on Sunday that they could convene if&n…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com



Oh, the anti-vax people are pissed? Who gives a fucking fuck? THEY are the reason we still all have to wear masks. THEY are the reason hospitals are overflowing. THEY are the reason healthcare workers are so overworked and stressed that they quit the profession.

They have ZERO right to be angry. Plus, as we’ve seen CONSISTENTLY during this pandemic, they aren’t going to obey the rules, and they already hate Fauci with a red-hot passion simply because he dared to disagree with their fat orange cult leader.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> I agree with that.  I just prefer the carrot, you prefer the stick.



Bullshit. Aren’t you the guy bitching about San Francisco isn’t tough enough on crime? You’re pretty supportive of the “stick” in that case.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Oh, the anti-vax people are pissed?



No, people who don't want the government telling them who they can assemble with and when.  It is very elitist no matter the reason.  That is my point.

He could have said what he said in a number of different ways, yet he took the authoritarian route that will not play in much of the country.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> No, people who don't want the government telling them who they can assemble with and when.



Well, the government CAN do that for public health reasons. But if you actually read the article you posted about Fauci (hahahaha yeah right) you will see it’s a recommendation, not a requirement. So… the government is not telling them who they can assemble with and when. Again, you didn’t read the f-ing article.


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> Bullshit. Aren’t you the guy bitching about San Francisco isn’t tough enough on crime? You’re pretty supportive of the “stick” in that case.



I would also question the "stick" reference. If they choose not to get the vaccine and lose their job, it's a choice they're making. All anyone is saying is you cannot knowingly put others at risk and allow the virus to mutate. If you want to sit at home and bitch about the government on your antivaxx FB page all day long, you can, it's also a choice you can make.


----------



## fooferdoggie

I don't feel sorry for these people anymore. if you choose to not listen to your doctor about a vaccine but everything else you are a IDOT. if you choose to suffering most likely die because you listen and use Facebook to make your medical decisions you are a IDIOT. if you choose the above and claim religion reasons you are a IDIOT.
Cleveland Clinic denies woman liver transplant over COVID vaccine refusal: ‘It was heartbreaking’​








						Cleveland Clinic denies woman liver transplant over COVID vaccine refusal: ‘It was heartbreaking’
					

An Ohio woman is the latest patient being denied a lifesaving transplant surgery over the COVID-19 vaccine.




					wgno.com


----------



## Eric

fooferdoggie said:


> I don't feel sorry for these people anymore. if you choose to not listen to your doctor about a vaccine but everything else you are a IDOT. if you choose to suffering most likely die because you listen and use Facebook to make your medical decisions you are a IDIOT. if you choose the above and claim religion reasons you are a IDIOT.
> Cleveland Clinic denies woman liver transplant over COVID vaccine refusal: ‘It was heartbreaking’​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cleveland Clinic denies woman liver transplant over COVID vaccine refusal: ‘It was heartbreaking’
> 
> 
> An Ohio woman is the latest patient being denied a lifesaving transplant surgery over the COVID-19 vaccine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wgno.com



As I quoted above, the consensus is that if you don't get the vaccine, you'll likely get COVID. I don't know the survival rate of those with transplants but even the slightest infection of any kind can be deadly to them. They're probably making a calculated decision to give the liver to someone who will survive it.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Well, the government CAN do that for public health reasons. But if you actually read the article you posted about Fauci (hahahaha yeah right) you will see it’s a recommendation, not a requirement. So… the government is not telling them who they can assemble with and when. Again, you didn’t read the f-ing article.





Eric said:


> I would also question the "stick" reference. If they choose not to get the vaccine and lose their job, it's a choice they're making. All anyone is saying is you cannot knowingly put others at risk and allow the virus to mutate. If you want to sit at home and bitch about the government on your antivaxx FB page all day long, you can, it's also a choice you can make.



Time to stop engaging liars and shitposters...

My post from May


P_X said:


> This is quite scary:
> 
> View attachment 5064
> View attachment 5063




I've also posted data in the past about how about ≥90% of the highest vaccinated congressional districts are represented by Democrats and ≥90% of lowest vaccinated districts have a GOP representation. Which objectively makes the antivaxx movement a GOP issue, even if we assume that the entire matter is confounded by education level. Despite some efforts to obfuscate, it's a done discussion with very clear indicators.

Source:




__





						COVID-19 Vaccine Rollout across US Congressional Districts
					






					geographicinsights.iq.harvard.edu
				




And just to be clear that this is recognized by GOP members too:


> Rep. Brad Wenstrup (R-Ohio), who co-chairs the Congress’ GOP Doctors Caucus, said he has focused on understanding and responding to vaccine hesitancy in conservative communities across the country and his Cincinnati district, where 42 percent of residents have received at least a first shot — about 9 percentage points behind the national pace. He has sat in on focus groups with Donald Trump supporters and has cut a public service announcement with fellow Republican physicians in Congress.











						The partisan divide in vaccinations is starker than you realize
					

The effort to reach the unvaccinated has become the latest political fault line in the Covid response.




					www.politico.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Eric said:


> As I quoted above, the consensus is that if you don't get the vaccine, you'll likely get COVID. I don't know the survival rate of those with transplants but even the slightest infection of any kind can be deadly to them. They're probably making a calculated decision to give the liver to someone who will survive it.



20 to 40% chance covid will cause serious issues or death. so yes there is a big reason why they want them vaccinated.


----------



## User.45

fooferdoggie said:


> 20 to 40% chance covid will cause serious issues or death. so yes there is a big reason why they want them vaccinated.



Correct, they take medications to suppress their immune system to prevent transplant rejection. Getting the vaccine in prior to immune suppression gives them the best chance to mount a response. If this person gets COVID, the managing team would have to make decisions about risking transplant rejection by holding immunosuppressing drugs, or risk death by COVID by continuing those drugs. Even if the person decides to get the shot eventually, once on immunosuppressants, they will be much less likely to mount a response. So yeah, the managing team's decision is logical and the person refusing the shot prefers to die as a medical freedom fighter than they can do it freely.


----------



## Joe




----------



## Herdfan

fooferdoggie said:


> I don't feel sorry for these people anymore. if you choose to not listen to your doctor about a vaccine but everything else you are a IDOT. i




Does that advice also apply for those who's doctors advise against the vaccine for health reasons?


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Does that advice also apply for those who's doctors advise against the vaccine for health reasons?



The number of people who have been medically advised against the vaccine is infinitesimal. I wish people would stop bringing that up.


----------



## User.45

Alli said:


> The number of people who have been medically advised against the vaccine is infinitesimal. I wish people would stop bringing that up.



It's the same person that brought this up 3 times by now and received responses from 2 physicians. These aren't real questions.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Herdfan said:


> Does that advice also apply for those who's doctors advise against the vaccine for health reasons?



is that what I said? nope their doctors told them they had to be  vaccinated. they chose to believe fake info over their doctors advice. I have seen at least two pother people loose their transplant opportunity because they would not get vaccinated against their doctors advice.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Alli said:


> The number of people who have been medically advised against the vaccine is infinitesimal. I wish people would stop bringing that up.



they have real doctors excuses Dr Facebook and Dr tucker Carlson.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> It's the same person that brought this up 3 times by now and received responses from 2 physicians. These aren't real questions.



Do some people think the title of this thread is an indication of how they should behave?


----------



## Eric

Alli said:


> The number of people who have been medically advised against the vaccine is infinitesimal. I wish people would stop bringing that up.



Same goes for masks.


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> The number of people who have been medically advised against the vaccine is infinitesimal. I wish people would stop bringing that up.




It is.  But they still do exist.



P_X said:


> It's the same person that brought this up 3 times by now and received responses from 2 physicians. These aren't real questions.




So are you saying there are no legitimate contraindications for the vaccines?

Simple Yes or No question.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Do some people think the title of this thread is an indication of how they should behave?



Some certainly do...


Eric said:


> Same goes for masks.



I think @Weaselbot would use the term "relitigation" for this phenomenon.

Some also think they get to ignore questions, but deserve answers. LOL.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Some certainly do...
> 
> I think @Weaselbot would use the term "relitigation" for this phenomenon.
> 
> Some also think they get to ignore questions, but deserve answers. LOL.




I thought you had me on Ignore.


----------



## SuperMatt

Mandates are starting to work. Vaccine rates are up, and unsurprisingly, cases and deaths are going down.









						U.S. COVID-19 vaccine rates up thanks to mandates; cases and deaths down -officials
					

Vaccination rates against COVID-19 in the United States have risen by more than 20 percentage points after multiple institutions adopted vaccine requirements, while case numbers and deaths from the virus are down, Biden administration officials said on Wednesday.




					www.reuters.com
				






> WASHINGTON, Oct 13 (Reuters) - Vaccination rates against COVID-19 in the United States have risen by more than 20 percentage points after multiple institutions adopted vaccine requirements, while case numbers and deaths from the virus are down, Biden administration officials said on Wednesday.
> 
> White House COVID-19 response coordinator Jeff Zients told reporters that 77% of eligible Americans had received at least one shot of a vaccine.
> 
> Vaccination rates went up thanks to mandates put into place by private businesses, healthcare systems, social institutions and state and local governments, he said in a briefing.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Mandates are starting to work. Vaccine rates are up, and unsurprisingly, cases and deaths are going down.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. COVID-19 vaccine rates up thanks to mandates; cases and deaths down -officials
> 
> 
> Vaccination rates against COVID-19 in the United States have risen by more than 20 percentage points after multiple institutions adopted vaccine requirements, while case numbers and deaths from the virus are down, Biden administration officials said on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com



Stress test #1 was the start of the school year. Stress test #2 will be when the cold weather arrives nationwide. You can see that with the vaccinations the waves got delayed by a month or two. I'm curious whether population immunity or virus seasonality will win out later this fall.


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> I know many won't agree with this, but Fauci is doing the administration no favors.  People don't want or need permission from the government to get together with their family.  And stuff like this just pisses them off whether you will acknowledge it or not.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fauci says Americans can enjoy holidays with family if fully vaccinated
> 
> 
> President Biden’s chief medical adviser, Anthony Fauci, provided reassurance to Americans eager to spend time with relatives in the coming months, saying on Sunday that they could convene if&n…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com



Your opening phase is accurate.

How anyone can read the article you posted or listen to what Dr. Fauci said today and conclude what you did is beyond comprehension. I read the article and watched the ABC News segment. He wasn't giving permission, he was providing guidance to vaccinated people who aren't sure what's safe and what isn't. If I recall correctly, you said you were vaccinated so you could visit your mom in an assisted living facility. If a knowledgeable physician like Dr. Fauci had advised you that you would be putting your mother at risk despite vaccination, would you still have visited her?

People are free to engage in behaviors that put themselves at risk as long as doing so doesn't endanger others. So, for example, you can pick and eat mushrooms even if you don't know which ones are safe. If you get sick or die, it's on you. (I've seen patients who succumbed after doing this.) But if you own a restaurant and serve poisonous mushrooms to customers, you're putting them in danger. In many cases, society has determined that there is a public health interest in enacting requirements that benefit individuals, such as mandatory seat belts or helmets for motorcycle riders.

No, what Dr. Fauci did was a service to Americans, just like when people with a particular disease ask their physician if a particular activity is safe. It's something we do routinely in medicine. Unfortunately, many people have decided to go against the preponderance of medical advice because they heard something on Fox News or did their own "research" through Google.


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> Your opening phase is accurate.
> 
> How anyone can read the article you posted or listen to what Dr. Fauci said today and conclude what you did is beyond comprehension. I read the article and watched the ABC News segment. He wasn't giving permission, he was providing guidance to vaccinated people who aren't sure what's safe and what isn't. If I recall correctly, you said you were vaccinated so you could visit your mom in an assisted living facility. If a knowledgeable physician like Dr. Fauci had advised you that you would be putting your mother at risk despite vaccination, would you still have visited her?
> 
> People are free to engage in behaviors that put themselves at risk as long as doing so doesn't endanger others. So, for example, you can pick and eat mushrooms even if you don't know which ones are safe. If you get sick or die, it's on you. (I've seen patients who succumbed after doing this.) But if you own a restaurant and serve poisonous mushrooms to customers, you're putting them in danger. In many cases, society has determined that there is a public health interest in enacting requirements that benefit individuals, such as mandatory seat belts or helmets for motorcycle riders.
> 
> No, what Dr. Fauci did was a service to Americans, just like when people with a particular disease ask their physician if a particular activity is safe. It's something we do routinely in medicine. Unfortunately, many people have decided to go against the preponderance of medical advice because they heard something on Fox News or did their own "research" through Google.


----------



## Runs For Fun

A Florida school says vaccinated students must stay home for 30 days after each shot, citing a false claim that they'll infect others
					

School officials said that the quarantine mandate exists because they believe vaccinated students can infect unvaccinated students. That's false.




					www.businessinsider.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> A Florida school says vaccinated students must stay home for 30 days after each shot, citing a false claim that they'll infect others
> 
> 
> School officials said that the quarantine mandate exists because they believe vaccinated students can infect unvaccinated students. That's false.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.businessinsider.com



you beat me to it. yes a vaccine with no covid in it somehow sheds. man you dont want to be educated by people so dumb.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Battle against COVID personal (and difficult) for Potter County judge​POTTER COUNTY, Texas — For Potter County Judge Nancy Tanner, the fight against COVID-19 is very personal. She’s not only lost a number of friends and acquaintances to the disease, it’s a daily part of her job.
“I just did a probate of a guy… his dying words were, ‘I wish I had got the shot,’” Judge Tanner recalled on Inside Texas Politics.









						Battle against COVID personal (and difficult) for Potter County judge
					

Potter County Judge Nancy Tanner not only lost a number of friends and acquaintances to the disease, it’s a daily part of her job.




					www.wfaa.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

I guess the solution is to stay home and not got to the hospital.​
Utah Protesters Claim Hospitals Are Killing People Who Have COVID​And infected patients coming into the hospital are much more hostile than they were before.​








						Utah protesters claim hospitals are killing people who have COVID
					

And infected patients coming into the hospital are much more hostile than they were before.




					www.motherjones.com


----------



## Renzatic

SuperMatt said:


> No, it’s not.
> 
> That literally is what it’s used for.. deworming horses.




They've got it in apple flavor? Well hell, now I want some!


----------



## Pumbaa

Renzatic said:


> They've got it in apple flavor? Well hell, now I want some!



That’s the iVermectin. Just wait for the ‘Unleashed’ Apple Event!


----------



## Joe

Whoever gave the link to that reddit page "HermanCainAward" thank you!  OMG, I'm just blown away at how stupid people are. 

Good riddance. One less Trump voter.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Ladies & gentlemen...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450153630112403456/


----------



## Herdfan

JagRunner said:


> Whoever gave the link to that reddit page "HermanCainAward" thank you!  OMG, I'm just blown away at how stupid people are.
> 
> *Good riddance. One less Trump voter.*




Sorry but some of you are fucking sick. 

Everyone who dies is someone's parent, child, spouse, sibling, grandparent or other loved one.  Just disgusting.

Attack away.  If you think this is acceptable then I really don't give a rat's ass what you think.


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> Sorry but some of you are fucking sick.
> 
> *Everyone who dies is someone's parent, child, spouse, sibling, grandparent or other loved one.  Just disgusting.*
> 
> Attack away.  If you think this is acceptable then I really don't give a rat's ass what you think.



I would never celebrate one's death. However, it's also hard to mourn them when they are making deliberate and calculated decisions to avoid a vaccine that would've prevented every single one. These people have always taken them for other things without question, there have been 6.6 BILLION (with a B) given and we know it's safe and effective. They are risking death for a stupid political view, it is on them to a degree and it should make us all sad.

Just a side note, one would hope you are this passionate about the families of people like George Floyd losing one of their own, who was a son, a father, and loved by his family. I'm sure you were though, feel free to share that with us anytime and put me in my place.


----------



## Joe

Herdfan said:


> Sorry but some of you are fucking sick.
> 
> Everyone who dies is someone's parent, child, spouse, sibling, grandparent or other loved one.  Just disgusting.
> 
> Attack away.  If you think this is acceptable then I really don't give a rat's ass what you think.




I don't give a flying fuck what you think. I said what I said. Sorry Not Sorry.


----------



## Joe

Eric said:


> I would never celebrate one's death. However, it's also hard to mourn them when they are making deliberate and calculated decisions to avoid a vaccine that would've prevented every single one. These people have always taken them for other things without question, there have been 6.6 BILLION (with a B) given and we know it's safe and effective. They are risking death for a stupid political view, it is on them to a degree and it should make us all sad.
> 
> Just a side note, one would hope you are this passionate about the families of people like George Floyd losing one of their own, who was a son, a father, and loved by his family. I'm sure you were though, feel free to share that with us anytime and put me in my place.




These Trump supporters are some of the worse human beings you'll ever meet, but they sure are good at playing victim. 

I said I don't give a crap if they die or not BECAUSE ITS ALL ON THEM. There are options out there but they choose to be ignorant. It would be different if there were no vaccine available or no options. What do conservatives love to say? "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes?" 

I looked at that HermanCainAward reddit page and almost all of them had the same story.

The person posts meme after meme calling people sheep and all kinds of names for taking the vaccine. Joe Biden is this. Liberals that. Just stupid uneducated meme after meme. Facebook fake news memes. The whole works. 
Then they get sick and all of a sudden "Covid is no joke people" *post selfie from hospital bed* 
Followed by a relative posting that so and so passed away and how good of a person they were.
Me laughing at them saying how good of a person so and so was after seeing all the crap they posted on facebook that said otherwise. 
Like I said, good riddance. I don't care if anyone here agrees with me or not. I live in Texas. I am surrounded by these idiots on a daily basis. I don't play nice with these people. They don't. Trump supporters like to poke at the bear and poke and poke "fuck your feelings" ect....and then when you attack back all of a sudden you're classless and aggressive. I don't play that game. 

#ThoughtsAndPrayers


----------



## Herdfan

Eric said:


> I would never celebrate one's death. However, it's also hard to mourn them when they are making deliberate and calculated decisions to avoid a vaccine that would've prevented every single one. These people have always taken them for other things without question, there have been 6.6 BILLION (with a B) given and we know it's safe and effective. They are risking death for a stupid political view, it is on them to a degree and it should make us all sad.
> 
> Just a side note, one would hope you are this passionate about the families of people like George Floyd losing one of their own, who was a son, a father, and loved by his family. I'm sure you were though, feel free to share that with us anytime and put me in my place.




There is a difference between not mourning their death and outright celebrating it.  Yes, the death is on them and you can assign that blame, but to celebrate it, especially because they might vote a certain way is just wrong.

I would find it hard to mourn someone I didn't know or follow.  I would think about their families, but no I wouldn't have grief over it.

And yes, I felt for George Floyd's family.  Especially when it was on TV all the time and they kept having to see it.  And I certainly didn't celebrate it.

@P_X accused me of being a coward because I didn't answer a post in the allotted time.  I wonder how many people here have the guts to call this out as disgusting behavior. 

I truly hope none of you experiences a loss and then have someone celebrate it.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Sorry but some of you are fucking sick.
> 
> Everyone who dies is someone's parent, child, spouse, sibling, grandparent or other loved one.  Just disgusting.
> 
> Attack away.  If you think this is acceptable then I really don't give a rat's ass what you think.




Rather than bringing up the same lame point every few pages, why don't you go back and read the replies from the last time you brought up this same topic.  It might save us a bit of time not rehashing the same crap over and over.


----------



## Joe

I said “good riddance”. I didn’t say I celebrated. I’m not out buying a celebratory cake every time an antivax person dies. I’m not doing a happy dance in my living room.  I just no longer care. 

After almost 2 years of this crap because some people choose to believe in conspiracy theories, I no longer care what happens to them. If they want to play games with their life that’s on them. Don’t expect me to feel sorry for you or donate to your go fund me page.


----------



## Eric

JagRunner said:


> I said “good riddance”. I didn’t say I celebrated. I’m not out buying a celebratory cake every time an antivax person dies. I’m not doing a happy dance in my living room.  I just no longer care.
> 
> After almost 2 years of this crap because some people choose to believe in conspiracy theories, I no longer care what happens to them. If they want to play games with their life that’s on them. Don’t expect me to feel sorry for you or donate to your go fund me page.



My wife always says "well, it's their own damned fault then" every time it comes up on the news. I never go that far personally but I do get the sentiment. It's like running around on a busy freeway, if they do it and get hit by a car how many people would be saying "oh that poor person". 99.9% of these people are from the party of personal responsibility but are acting like spoiled children. It's really hard to have any sympathy for them.


----------



## Joe

Eric said:


> My wife always says "well, it's their own damned fault then" every time it comes up on the news. I never go that far personally but I do get the sentiment. It's like running around on a busy freeway, if they do it and get hit by a car how many people would be saying "oh that poor person". 99.9% of these people are from the party of personal responsibility but are acting like spoiled children. It's really hard to have any sympathy for them.




And the same people that hate ObamaCare and are against Universal Healthcare because it’s “socialism”, are all needing GoFundMe pages to get by after.  These people have no idea how much they vote against their own interest. 

The party of personal responsibility asking for donations when shit hits the fan.


----------



## User.45

JagRunner said:


> I said “good riddance”. I didn’t say I celebrated. I’m not out buying a celebratory cake every time an antivax person dies. I’m not doing a happy dance in my living room.  I just no longer care.
> 
> After almost 2 years of this crap because some people choose to believe in conspiracy theories, I no longer care what happens to them. If they want to play games with their life that’s on them. Don’t expect me to feel sorry for you or donate to your go fund me page.



I was the one who shared the subreddit here. I visit the subreddit regularly and it makes me incredibly sad every single time. TBH, I found the HCA starter pack distasteful. However, it's important to put things in perspective. These people actively partook in spreading disinformation, largely died because of their pathologically lacking insight, and caused grief (literally) to their loved ones in the process. They also waste resources that could be spent on less preventable healthcare utilization, and greatly contribute to the burnout of healthcare workers, who actually cry when one of these people die... SO if this subreddit convinced only 1000 hesitant people to get vaccinated,* it already saved a life*.

In contrast, there's a person here who regurgitates propaganda from the same sources these HCA awardees took their ideas that killed them, and actively tries to convince people of extremely inflated vaccination risks, overcalls the number of antivaxx doctors and nurses and tries to normalize their behavior. Well, a person like this does not have the moral superiority to judge others' response to the HCA subreddit.

Certain people like to use a term for this phenomenon: _virtue signalling. _


----------



## Runs For Fun

Herdfan said:


> Sorry but some of you are fucking sick.
> 
> Everyone who dies is someone's parent, child, spouse, sibling, grandparent or other loved one.  Just disgusting.
> 
> Attack away.  If you think this is acceptable then I really don't give a rat's ass what you think.



And they were all preventable deaths if they weren’t so stupid and did one simple thing instead of trying to “own the libs”. 


Herdfan said:


> There is a difference between not mourning their death and outright celebrating it.  Yes, the death is on them and you can assign that blame, but to celebrate it, especially because they might vote a certain way is just wrong.
> 
> I would find it hard to mourn someone I didn't know or follow.  I would think about their families, but no I wouldn't have grief over it.
> 
> And yes, I felt for George Floyd's family.  Especially when it was on TV all the time and they kept having to see it.  And I certainly didn't celebrate it.
> 
> @P_X accused me of being a coward because I didn't answer a post in the allotted time.  I wonder how many people here have the guts to call this out as disgusting behavior.
> 
> I truly hope none of you experiences a loss and then have someone celebrate it.



No one is celebrating any one’s death. But it’s really fucking hard to have any sympathy for these morons. They are the reason this pandemic isn’t over all because they’ve tied their entire identity to a political belief and fallen full hog for all the conspiracy theories. Not to mention they mock and insult people who got the vaccine and are all around pretty nasty people. Sorry but I have zero fucks to give for these people.


----------



## Herdfan

JagRunner said:


> I said “good riddance”. I didn’t say I celebrated. I’m not out buying a celebratory cake every time an antivax person dies. I’m not doing a happy dance in my living room.  I just no longer care.
> 
> After almost 2 years of this crap because some people choose to believe in conspiracy theories, I no longer care what happens to them. If they want to play games with their life that’s on them. Don’t expect me to feel sorry for you or donate to your go fund me page.




Well I don't know what "Good Riddance" means to you, but to myself and the Merriam-Webster Dictionary it means:



> —used to say that one is glad that someone is leaving or that something has gone




In this case it is a someone, a human being, who died.  And you're glad to be rid of them because they voted in a way different from what you find acceptable.  Disgusting!



Eric said:


> My wife always says "well, it's their own damned fault then" every time it comes up on the news. I never go that far personally but I do get the sentiment. It's like running around on a busy freeway, if they do it and get hit by a car how many people would be saying "oh that poor person". 99.9% of these people are from the party of personal responsibility but are acting like spoiled children. It's really hard to have any sympathy for them.




Sympathy is not required and assigning blame is fine.  Being glad about it is the difference.



P_X said:


> I was the one who shared the subreddit here. I visit the subreddit regularly and it makes me incredibly sad every single time. TBH, I found the HCA starter pack distasteful. However, it's important to put things in perspective. These people actively partook in spreading disinformation, largely died because of their pathologically lacking insight, and caused grief (literally) to their loved ones in the process. They also waste resources that could be spent on less preventable healthcare utilization, and greatly contribute to the burnout of healthcare workers, who actually cry when one of these people die... SO if this subreddit convinced only 1000 hesitant people to get vaccinated,* it already saved a life*.
> 
> In contrast, there's a person here who regurgitates propaganda from the same sources these HCA awardees took their ideas that killed them, and actively tries to convince people of extremely inflated vaccination risks, overcalls the number of antivaxx doctors and nurses and tries to normalize their behavior. Well, a person like this does not have the moral superiority to judge others' response to the HCA subreddit.
> 
> Certain people like to use a term for this phenomenon: _virtue signalling. _




Ok, so they are stupid and paid the ultimate price for it.  And so did their loved ones.  It is what it is and nothing is going to change it.  

But as I said earlier, being glad about it because they voted for Trump is .....  I will refrain from saying what I really want to say.

Trust me, it is certainly not virtue signalling.



JagRunner said:


> And the same people that hate ObamaCare and *are against Universal Healthcare because it’s “socialism”,* are all needing GoFundMe pages to get by after.  These people have no idea how much they vote against their own interest.
> 
> The party of personal responsibility asking for donations when shit hits the fan.




Or it could simply be I am against it because I had to fight with Medicare to get my mom into a rehab facility with a broken leg.  She couldn't walk, yet Medicare didn't want to cover the rehab.  @Eric had to fight Medicaid to get what his mom should have been entitled to.  It isn't about socialism, it is about quality of care.


----------



## User.45

> *Virtue signalling* is a pejorative neologism for the expression of a disingenuous moral viewpoint with the intent of communicating good character.






> Virtue signalling may be thought of as a form of moral grandstanding, in which a viewpoint or answer is calculated to "look good", thereby making the object or speaker appear virtuous to others, rather than being chosen because it is strictly honest.









__





						Virtue signalling - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Joe

Herdfan said:


> Well I don't know what "Good Riddance" means to you, but to myself and the Merriam-Webster Dictionary it means:
> 
> 
> 
> In this case it is a someone, a human being, who died.  And you're glad to be rid of them because they voted in a way different from what you find acceptable.  *Disgusting!*
> 
> 
> 
> Sympathy is not required and assigning blame is fine.  Being glad about it is the difference.
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, so they are stupid and paid the ultimate price for it.  And so did their loved ones.  It is what it is and nothing is going to change it.
> 
> But as I said earlier, being glad about it because they voted for Trump is .....  I will refrain from saying what I really want to say.
> 
> Trust me, it is certainly not virtue signalling.
> 
> 
> 
> Or it could simply be I am against it because I had to fight with Medicare to get my mom into a rehab facility with a broken leg.  She couldn't walk, yet Medicare didn't want to cover the rehab.  @Eric had to fight Medicaid to get what his mom should have been entitled to.  It isn't about socialism, it is about quality of care.




A lot of the stuff these people are posting is disgusting. They are horrible shitty human beings and then after they die people have the nerve to post how great they were. Sorry, but the lie detector determined that was a lie. They post the most horrible things and then people are like "OMG, Billy Bob was such a great person" Meanwhile his profile picture is him with the confederate flag(Racist!) and a facebook template that says "I don't care if you got your vaccine" or "I have an immune system"  Yeah, how did that work out for you?

I'm sorry that you're offended that I don't care about them.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Virtue signalling - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org




Think what you want.

But the poster who made the comment in question is "communicating horrible character."  What I post about it doesn't change that, does it?


----------



## ronntaylor

Some of the more prominent assholes celebrated when others died (I recall a radio asshat that would play "Another One Bites the Dust" while reading the obits of AIDS victims). Many of them spread COVID-19 and probably wound up killing others because of their intentional acts. So good riddance to them. Folks who like to use "Play stupid games..." roulette are hypocrites in this instance of whining.


----------



## Herdfan

JagRunner said:


> A lot of the stuff these people are posting is disgusting. They are horrible shitty human beings and then after they die people have the nerve to post how great they were. Sorry, but the lie detector determined that was a lie. They post the most horrible things and then people are like "OMG, Billy Bob was such a great person" Meanwhile his profile picture is him with the confederate flag(Racist!) and a facebook template that says "I don't care if you got your vaccine" or "I have an immune system"  Yeah, how did that work out for you?
> 
> *I'm sorry that you're offended that I don't care about them.*




I don't care that you don't care.  That completely misses the point.

You said:


JagRunner said:


> *Good riddance. One less Trump voter.*




Your words indicate you are glad a Trump voter is DEAD!  And that makes you a horrible human being.

And for those who think I am just virtue signalling like @P_X, many of you have read my posts here and at PRSI for years, have you _ever_ seen me go after a poster like this?  No because I don't do it.  I take a lot of crap from many of you and I don't react like this.  It is just that this one just hit a nerve and I am sorry for those who don't want to be involved having to read through it.


----------



## Joe




----------



## ronntaylor

More of this please!









						Washington State fires its football coach over his refusal to be vaccinated.
					

Nick Rolovich and four of his assistants lost their jobs because they would not comply with the state’s mandate.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## Joe

ronntaylor said:


> More of this please!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Washington State fires its football coach over his refusal to be vaccinated.
> 
> 
> Nick Rolovich and four of his assistants lost their jobs because they would not comply with the state’s mandate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com




My employer fired a good bunch a couple weeks ago for refusing the vaccine.


----------



## fooferdoggie

JagRunner said:


> I said “good riddance”. I didn’t say I celebrated. I’m not out buying a celebratory cake every time an antivax person dies. I’m not doing a happy dance in my living room.  I just no longer care.
> 
> After almost 2 years of this crap because some people choose to believe in conspiracy theories, I no longer care what happens to them. If they want to play games with their life that’s on them. Don’t expect me to feel sorry for you or donate to your go fund me page.



yes 2000 a week would be a lot of celebrating. you would get really fat on all that cake.


----------



## Joe

fooferdoggie said:


> yes 2000 a week would be a lot of celebrating. you would get really fat on all that cake.




I love cake, but not that much lol


----------



## SuperMatt

ronntaylor said:


> More of this please!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Washington State fires its football coach over his refusal to be vaccinated.
> 
> 
> Nick Rolovich and four of his assistants lost their jobs because they would not comply with the state’s mandate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com



When people see that businesses and governments are serious about enforcing the mandates, I think more will get the shot.


----------



## lizkat

SuperMatt said:


> When people see that businesses and governments are serious about enforcing the mandates, I think more will get the shot.




Happened in Australia recently,  Victoria shut down its construction industry because of noncompliance...  no big surprise that vax rates then went up (despite a lot of street protests etc by the construction workers) and now the shutdown is being lifted end of the week...


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450217882294624256/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450223261250428929/





They give you a REAL one for FREE, with the FREE vaccine, that your employer mandates for the safety of EVERYONE else.


----------



## JayMysteri0

ronntaylor said:


> More of this please!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Washington State fires its football coach over his refusal to be vaccinated.
> 
> 
> Nick Rolovich and four of his assistants lost their jobs because they would not comply with the state’s mandate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com



This part boggles my mind, but does NOT surprise me sadly...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450287240660209669/

"The state's highest paid employee".

Wait.  What?


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450373535029997568/



Interesting.  When it comes to endangering ANYONE & EVERYONE, then Chicago is really motivated to react to officers endangering it's citizens.  Wonder if we can get brutality eventually labelled as a pandemic for the safety of some more citizens?


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> This part boggles my mind, but does NOT surprise me sadly...
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450287240660209669/
> 
> "The state's highest paid employee".
> 
> Wait.  What?



College football coaches are very highly paid and often do quite well when they're terminated without cause. Ed Orgeron, who will leave LSU at the end of the current season, will be paid almost $17 million though 2025, with his first check about $5.68 million due in December. Auburn fired two coaches in recent years. Gus Malzahn's buyout was $21.45 million. Gene Chizik's was smaller, but still substantial. Current Senator Tommy Tuberville also got large buyouts from two universities, including Auburn. It's crazy.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Roller said:


> College football coaches are very highly paid and often do quite well when they're terminated without cause. Ed Orgeron, who will leave LSU at the end of the current season, will be paid almost $17 million though 2025, with his first check about $5.68 million due in December. Auburn fired two coaches in recent years. Gus Malzahn's buyout was $21.45 million. Gene Chizik's was smaller, but still substantial. Current Senator Tommy Tuberville also got large buyouts from two universities, including Auburn. It's crazy.



Indeed it is.

I also think it's a nice look into the concept of entitlement that some people will claim doesn't exist.  Because like some coaches, some athletes, some workers, some police unions, they believe that who they are will exempt them from an effort for the greater good.  Not because of some known scientific reasoning, but for some just because they believe they ( because of who they are ) should be exempted if they feel like it.

No.

Welcome to the rest of the world.  We're trying to get by too.

As it's been said before, as truly horrible as this pandemic has been, it's also a wake up call for so many things that some took for granted as the norms.  Norms that were barely tenable before the pandemic, and made untenable & unacceptable now.


----------



## Joe

Herman Cain Award winner post this before dying of Covid himself but I should feel sad for him. 

*DISGUSTING*!


----------



## Alli

JagRunner said:


> And the same people that hate ObamaCare and are against Universal Healthcare because it’s “socialism”, are all needing GoFundMe pages to get by after.  These people have no idea how much they vote against their own interest.
> 
> The party of personal responsibility asking for donations when shit hits the fan.



This is a great analogy.


Herdfan said:


> In this case it is a someone, a human being, who died. And you're glad to be rid of them because they voted in a way different from what you find acceptable. Disgusting!



It has little to do with the way they voted, although it does seem a disproportionate number of anti-vaxers did vote for the former guy. It has everything to do with them being unwilling to take a vaccine that has been proven safe and effective in order to hasten herd immunity (which can only be achieved with vaccination).


----------



## ronntaylor

JayMysteri0 said:


> This part boggles my mind, but does NOT surprise me sadly...
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450287240660209669/
> 
> "The state's highest paid employee".
> 
> Wait.  What?



It's ridiculous that that is the case for many coaches. Especially since they exploit the talent of "amateur" athletes in college programs that generates billions.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450217882294624256/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450223261250428929/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They give you a REAL one for FREE, with the FREE vaccine, that your employer mandates for the safety of EVERYONE else.




Hold up. Are you saying the point is to get vaccinated and not to just get the card? I thought this was like when celebrities are given iPads even though they can clearly afford to buy one themselves. Now I just feel dumb.


----------



## Joe

I can't believe people are losing their jobs over this crap. My employer terminated close to 100 people a few weeks ago. Based on all of the GoFundMe's out there, I doubt these folks have a good financial egg to lean on in between jobs. 

These conservative politicians and fox news folks are living it up while convincing these idiots to give up their jobs SMH


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JagRunner said:


> I can't believe people are losing their jobs over this crap. My employer terminated close to 100 people a few weeks ago. Based on all of the GoFundMe's out there, I doubt these folks have a good financial egg to lean on in between jobs.
> 
> These conservative politicians and fox news folks are living it up while convincing these idiots to give up their jobs SMH




I imagine these people are inexplicably missing from conservative media’s “these people need to get back to work!” attacks.

“Hey, how did you land that great new job?” “The person in that position before me refused to get vaccinated.” Free market, baby.


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Sorry but some of you are fucking sick.
> 
> Everyone who dies is someone's parent, child, spouse, sibling, grandparent or other loved one.  Just disgusting.
> 
> Attack away.  If you think this is acceptable then I really don't give a rat's ass what you think.




It's like watching someone play on a busy interstate. You tell them not to, but they don't listen to you, and sure enough, they end up causing a pile up, and get flattened by a semi.

Then, a bunch of other people inspired by this man's act of true bravery decide to play on the interstate as well. You tell that they're stupid, that they're going to get themselves killed, but they do it anyway. Sure enough, they too cause multiple pileups, get end up being flattened by a few semis.

So a few laws are passed, forbidding people from playing on the interstate. Fortunately for us, we have a number of brave patriots willing to stand up to such tyranny. They march as one, proclaiming it's their god given right to play in traffic. So they go out, and sure enough, they cause even more pileups, and get flattened by even more semis.

At some point between that first death, and the latest death toll, it went from being a pointless tragedy, to GODDAMN FUCKING HILARIOUS!


----------



## lizkat

Pro Trumpers seem to have authority issues, big time.   Even though they like the idea of a strongman.  Weird.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

I'd like to see an exposé on defiant anti-vaxxer employers and the great career opportunities they are offering.  I imagine you probably shouldn't expect quality health insurance to be part of the package, but I could be wrong.


----------



## ronntaylor

Renzatic said:


> At some point between that first death, and the latest death toll, it went from being a pointless tragedy, to GODDAMN FUCKING HILARIOUS!



Except for the part where unsuspecting drivers are entangled and injured or killed by the idiots. And the first responders that come out to assist and wind up overworked or even possibly injured and killed. But Free-Dumb & 'Murca!!!


----------



## User.45

JagRunner said:


> I can't believe people are losing their jobs over this crap. My employer terminated close to 100 people a few weeks ago. Based on all of the GoFundMe's out there, I doubt these folks have a good financial egg to lean on in between jobs.
> 
> These conservative politicians and fox news folks are living it up while convincing these idiots to give up their jobs SMH



TBH, i really suspect that this is a really efficient way to remove the most incompetent people from your workforce. In healthcare that’s definitely the case.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> College football coaches are very highly paid and often do quite well when they're terminated without cause. Ed Orgeron, who will leave LSU at the end of the current season, will be paid almost $17 million though 2025, with his first check about $5.68 million due in December. Auburn fired two coaches in recent years. Gus Malzahn's buyout was $21.45 million. Gene Chizik's was smaller, but still substantial. Current Senator Tommy Tuberville also got large buyouts from two universities, including Auburn. It's crazy.



I've always wondered what these coaches have to do with education...  If this is education, they shouldn't be paid more than professors. If this is entertainment, then well, the "student" athletes should be compensated too, who obviously make way more money than their tuition/scholarship if coaches can be paid such obnoxious salaries.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> *I've always wondered what these coaches have to do with education...*  If this is education, they shouldn't be paid more than professors. If this is entertainment, then well, the "student" athletes should be compensated too, who obviously make way more money than their tuition/scholarship if coaches can be paid such obnoxious salaries.



 University recognition.  Most people would never have heard of Gonzaga if they weren't in the Final 4 last year.  A winning team attracts out-of-state student who pay higher tuition rates, ergo the school gets more money.

As for coach's compensation, much of those huge buyout figures are paid by wealthy boosters, not the university.  While most coaches are paid well by the state, they majority of their compensation packages come from TV/radio shows, free cars from local dealers, donations to the athletic boosters etc.

As for athletes being compensated, they are getting a free college education and I personally think that is enough.  But starting this year, athletes can profit from NIL (Name, Image & Likeness) meaning they can have a shoe contract or get a free car from a dealer etc.  Some schools are working to get everyone on the team something, but others just let the free market dictate.  While not a fan of NIL, I have always thought that athletic scholarships (also usually paid by boosters) should be able to include the full cost of education.  Academic scholarships can offer small stipend, so athletic scholarships should have been able to also.  Not pay as in salary, but a couple hundred dollars a month to be able to go on a date or order a pizza.


----------



## MEJHarrison

P_X said:


> TBH, i really suspect that this is a really efficient way to remove the most incompetent people from your workforce. In healthcare that’s definitely the case.




I don't mourn for a single health care worker losing their job over a vaccination.  If they won't get the vaccine, they shouldn't be in health care in the first place.  To me, they're almost as bad as a school teacher who can't read.


----------



## User.45

MEJHarrison said:


> I don't mourn for a single health care worker losing their job over a vaccination.  If they won't get the vaccine, they shouldn't be in health care in the first place.  To me, they're almost as bad as a school teacher who can't read.



There's a lot of irony in it. These people will def not be a hot commodity on the healthcare market. They are in a for a rude awakening too when they realize that the job security of healthcare doesn't apply to most other fields...


----------



## ronntaylor

P_X said:


> I've always wondered what these coaches have to do with education...  If this is education, they shouldn't be paid more than professors. If this is entertainment, then well, the "student" athletes should be compensated too, who obviously make way more money than their tuition/scholarship if coaches can be paid such obnoxious salaries.



Shhhh!!! That would be communism, right? You actually want to pay Black, Brown and poor "amateurs" a portion of the billions their hard work generates? They're already gettin a free education. I mean their graduation rates for the elite Division I behemoths are through the roof with no cheating, easy courses and marketable skills. Right?


----------



## User.45

ronntaylor said:


> Shhhh!!! That would be communism, right? You actually want to pay Black, Brown and poor "amateurs" a portion of the billions their hard work generates? They're already gettin a free education. I mean their graduation rates for the elite Division I behemoths are through the roof with no cheating, easy courses and marketable skills. Right?



Exactly. Smells a bit like slavery. These kids should take being exploited for granted because "they'll get an [very low quality] education" out of this.


----------



## ronntaylor

P_X said:


> Exactly. Smells a bit like slavery. These kids should take being exploited for granted because "they'll get an [very low quality] education" out of this.



They shouldn't settle for pennies for the use of their likeness and other such BS. They should get a healthy percentage of *all* revenue generated, including television rights. And all athletic scholarships should be guaranteed through graduation. No matter how long it takes. You don't want to see student-athletes spending several years working toward a degree? Well then, no "scholarships" for those that are only there to play ball. The NBA and NFL+ can come up with something similar to MLB's minor leagues. Just give real world minimum salaries and housing for minor leagues players.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450396941834014725/


> LaMay’s Friday sign-off, which was shared tens of thousands of times on social media, came as several law enforcement officers and other first responders across the United States resisted coronavirus vaccination and fought mandates. Those holdouts remain reluctant to get the shots even as covid-19 has emerged as the No. 1 cause of line-of-duty deaths in the first half of 2021, according to the National Law Enforcement Officers Memorial, which reported 71 deaths between January and June.
> 
> Anthony S. Fauci, the nation’s top infectious-disease expert, appealed to officers directly to get the immunization Monday, saying the resistance “doesn’t make any sense” given that “more police officers die of covid than they do in other causes of death.”
> 
> 
> In Washington state, most government employees — about 89 percent — have complied with the mandate, according to data provided to The Washington Post by the governor’s office. When including those who received accommodations, the compliance is about 92 percent. Spokesman Mike Faulk said officials expect the final figures, which will include employees who got the shots in the two weeks that preceded Monday’s deadline, to be higher than that.
> 
> But there have been pockets of resistance, with state troopers joining an ultimately unsuccessful last-ditch lawsuit seeking to put the mandate on hold. For those choosing to leave their jobs rather than get the shots, Faulk said, “We thank them for their service and wish them well, but this state is moving forward to get people vaccinated and to end this crisis.”
> 
> LaMay, who went public with his opposition to the mandate in August, told The Post that he was skeptical about the safety and effectiveness of the vaccines, despite repeated assurances from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. He said he was concerned that “the people pushing it are politicians.” He cited fears over long-term effects, including on fertility, though health officials have said there is no evidence of such harm.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I was wondering why people are proudly showing they've been 'blocked' by Travis Tritt on Twitter
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450647491381190661/

Now I know why

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450280269781610498/


----------



## ronntaylor

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450396941834014725/



He's probably getting a full pension and will need a GFM should he get COVID unvaccinated. Good Bye & Good Riddance!

More like this please


----------



## SuperMatt

The anti-vaxxers in this rally use some colorful language when explaining their conspiracy theories.


----------



## Joe

SuperMatt said:


> The anti-vaxxers in this rally use some colorful language when explaining their conspiracy theories.




These are people I should be nice to /s


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> University recognition.  Most people would never have heard of Gonzaga if they weren't in the Final 4 last year.  A winning team attracts out-of-state student who pay higher tuition rates, ergo the school gets more money.
> 
> As for coach's compensation, much of those huge buyout figures are paid by wealthy boosters, not the university.  While most coaches are paid well by the state, they majority of their compensation packages come from TV/radio shows, free cars from local dealers, donations to the athletic boosters etc.
> 
> As for athletes being compensated, they are getting a free college education and I personally think that is enough.  But starting this year, athletes can profit from NIL (Name, Image & Likeness) meaning they can have a shoe contract or get a free car from a dealer etc.  Some schools are working to get everyone on the team something, but others just let the free market dictate.  While not a fan of NIL, I have always thought that athletic scholarships (also usually paid by boosters) should be able to include the full cost of education.  Academic scholarships can offer small stipend, so athletic scholarships should have been able to also.  Not pay as in salary, but a couple hundred dollars a month to be able to go on a date or order a pizza.



It depends on the place. At the University of Alabama in Tuscaloosa, the football program brings in far more than enough dollars to cover Nick Saban's compensation. The same is true of other top-tier schools. Sports are a cost center at many other institutions, but they can't attract students without them.

The crazy part is the size of the coach buyouts. True, boosters may cover some of these expenses (especially at Auburn), but they demand and get influence for their contributions. It also sends a bad message that someone like Ed O can get paid $17m to do nothing. 

I have mixed feelings about NIL, though I do think college athletes have been taken advantage of for years. For football players, it was mostly the promise of a highly lucrative NFL career, but not many of them achieve that. Now, it's true that without scholarships many of them wouldn't attend college at all, but their academic progress is often on a different playing field (pardon the pun) than their fellow students. And those who are injured suffer the consequences later in life.


----------



## SuperMatt

I could have posted this in Police Brutality as well…









						A Subway Rider Confronted Unmasked Police Officers. They Kicked Him Out. (Published 2021)
					

Andrew Gilbert said he repeatedly asked two officers to wear masks in accordance with M.T.A. and Police Department policy. He was eventually pushed out of the station.




					www.nytimes.com
				






> A New York City police officer grabs a male commuter by his jacket and pushes him through an emergency exit door at a subway station in Manhattan, video posted to social media shows. “You’re being disruptive,” the officer tells him.
> 
> The man in the 35-second video clip — which has garnered more than one million views and ushered in a fresh wave of criticism of the police — said in an interview that the confrontation erupted when he asked the officer and his partner to put on masks.


----------



## JayMysteri0

FFS

The desperation to make anything related to the pandemic political is f'n pathetic at this point

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450880667546525699/

I believe she forgot to include, "WE are already calling it Biden's..."  With zero f'n concern about HOW we got into this mess.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> FFS
> 
> The desperation to make anything related to the pandemic political is f'n pathetic at this point
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450880667546525699/
> 
> I believe she forgot to include, "WE are already calling it Biden's..."  With zero f'n concern about HOW we got into this mess.



Next time she should make a little more effort to appear atleast a little convinced about this bullshit.


----------



## SuperMatt




----------



## Runs For Fun

QAnon Poet Snowflake accepts his HCA from
      HermanCainAward

Excuse me while I try to erase this shit from my memory with…..something


----------



## thekev

SuperMatt said:


> The anti-vaxxers in this rally use some colorful language when explaining their conspiracy theories.




The comment  2:09"I've got some swampland in Florida for you" made me laugh really hard.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

'I've lost my joy': Anti-vax Republican, who worked for the Trump campaign and embraced QAnon, says she has COVID-19
					

Lauren Witzke, the 2020 GOP candidate for US Senate in Delaware, told followers she had "lost all of my senses."




					www.businessinsider.com
				




Like Trump, she has an expansive vocabulary.  Everything is "demonic".


----------



## User.45




----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450863466856599556/

So if you make something a mandate, a rule seemingly with little wriggle room, SOME officials would quit rather than comply?  

Makes you wonder how hard it would be to make other things mandates?  A lot of other lives may have been saved long ago.

I do honestly fear will all the q nuttery going on, if we aren't seeing our next set of radicalized.  Because you know their loss of employment CAN'T be THEIR fault, it HAS to be the fault of others.  Which is basic 101 grist for going extremist.  They are the victims here & a system they imagined they were protecting, turned on them while they were just trying to do their job.  Etc.  Etc.  Etc...


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1450863466856599556/
> 
> So if you make something a mandate, a rule seemingly with little wriggle room, SOME officials would quit rather than comply?
> 
> Makes you wonder how hard it would be to make other things mandates?  A lot of other lives may have been saved long ago.
> 
> I do honestly fear will all the q nuttery going on, if we aren't seeing our next set of radicalized.  Because you know their loss of employment CAN'T be THEIR fault, it HAS to be the fault of others.  Which is basic 101 grist for going extremist.  They are the victims here & a system they imagined they were protecting, turned on them while they were just trying to do their job.  Etc.  Etc.  Etc...



I don’t WANT people like that as police officers.

One thing I’d like to point out: Police officers that quit don’t get paid. That means less funding being paid out to the police department. So, the police are defunding themselves? Shouldn’t Republicans be screaming at them? What a bunch of Communists they must be!


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> I don’t WANT people like that as police officers.
> 
> One thing I’d like to point out: Police officers that quit don’t get paid. That means less funding being paid out to the police department. So, the police are defunding themselves? Shouldn’t Republicans be screaming at them? What a bunch of Communists they must be!



I hadn't thought of the 'self defunding' aspect.

I've read how many people suspect 'the worst' maybe leaving the police because of this, so they imagine it a good thing.

I fear 'the worst' have to go somewhere.


----------



## fooferdoggie

​Anti-vaxxers spread vicious lies about couple who died of Covid and left five children orphaned​Anti-vaxxers have called the death of a Virginia couple with five children from Covid-19 “fake news”, according to their devastated family.

Unvaccinated Covid sceptics Misty and Kevin Mitchem died just weeks apart after they both fell ill with the virus, and both regretted not getting the shots on their death beds, say relatives.










						Anti-vaxxers post lies about couple who died of Covid and left five children orphaned
					

The US has seen around 45.2m Covid-19 cases and more than 732,000 deaths during pandemic




					www.independent.co.uk


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> I've read how many people suspect 'the worst' maybe leaving the police because of this, so they imagine it a good thing.
> 
> I fear 'the worst' have to go somewhere.



Paul Blart, Unvaccinated Mall Cop


----------



## Yoused

Herdfan said:


> Sorry but some of you are fucking sick.





*Really?*










						For Christians, Dying From COVID (Or Anything Else) Is A Good Thing
					

It is long past time for Christians individually and corporately to repent for the way we and our institutions responded to the COVID-19 outbreak.




					thefederalist.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Yoused said:


> *Really?*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For Christians, Dying From COVID (Or Anything Else) Is A Good Thing
> 
> 
> It is long past time for Christians individually and corporately to repent for the way we and our institutions responded to the COVID-19 outbreak.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thefederalist.com




Well at least they are going to their own private compound known as heaven and that's less of them to fuck things up here.  In that regard I support their migration decision.  They most likely believe they are moving back to where they came from.


----------



## Yoused

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> at least they are going to their own private compound known as heaven



If heaven is full of religious people and I am not nasty enough for hell, I think I would rather spend my afterlife in purgatory. Or, you know, maybe just cease to exist, where I can fail to hang out with Camus, Nietzsche, London, Sartre and folks like that.


----------



## Joe

Yoused said:


> If heaven is full of religious people and I am not nasty enough for hell, I think I would rather spend my afterlife in purgatory. Or, you know, maybe just cease to exist, where I can fail to hang out with Camus, Nietzsche, London, Sartre and folks like that.




If I believed in heaven or hell I wouldn't want to be with these people in heaven. These people hiding behind religion are some of the worse people you can meet.


----------



## fooferdoggie

anti-masker threatens a woman, pushes an older guy, all while threatening to “fuck them up,” then gets punched in the face and cries about “assault” - very satisfying

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1452752299558846470/


----------



## Runs For Fun

They created this monster now they have to deal with it 








						Fox anchor Neil Cavuto urged viewers to get vaccinated. Then came the death threats
					

Cavuto, who is immunocompromised, encouraged viewers to get vaccinated against COVID-19 after announcing his own breakthrough infection. When he returned to the air, he brought their emails with him.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Eric

Runs For Fun said:


> They created this monster now they have to deal with it
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fox anchor Neil Cavuto urged viewers to get vaccinated. Then came the death threats
> 
> 
> Cavuto, who is immunocompromised, encouraged viewers to get vaccinated against COVID-19 after announcing his own breakthrough infection. When he returned to the air, he brought their emails with him.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org



To be fair, Neil has always been one of the more sane people at the network (along with Chris Wallace).


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> To be fair, Neil has always been one of the more sane people at the network (along with Chris Wallace).




I feel like shepard smith spent his last year at the network rolling his eyes while he was reporting.


----------



## fooferdoggie

He didn't want to be a martyr, he wanted to live." Narrator: He didn't
Man their hero dies of covid so what do they do? use it to push no masks or vaccines. 
Realities diverge after Anchorage conservative activist dies from COVID​








						Realities diverge after Anchorage conservative activist dies from COVID - Alaska Public Media
					

William Topel died shortly after demonstrating against an indoor mask mandate at the Anchorage Assembly. To some, his death shows the dangers of not taking precautions against COVID-19, but to friends, his death is an illustration of the medical establishment's refusal to treat patients with...




					www.alaskapublic.org


----------



## fooferdoggie

true covid stupid on display.


----------



## Runs For Fun

fooferdoggie said:


> true covid stupid on display.
> View attachment 9434



Covet 19.


----------



## SuperMatt

Vacations and mandeats are killing us!


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> Vacations and mandeats are killing us!



The vacation part surprised me. Didn’t know y’all actually had those!


----------



## SuperMatt

Pumbaa said:


> The vacation part surprised me. Didn’t know y’all actually had those!



Exactly, and yet people wonder why 4.3 million Americans quit their jobs in a month…


----------



## Cmaier

SuperMatt said:


> Exactly, and yet people wonder why 4.3 million Americans quit their jobs in a month…




That statistic is misleading. I quit my job 4.299 million times last month.


----------



## Pumbaa

SuperMatt said:


> Exactly, and yet people wonder why 4.3 million Americans quit their jobs in a month…



Vaccine mandates, duh!

/me hides


----------



## Yoused

That tailgate has got to be a false flag. It is some antifa person deliberately misspelling everything to make the paytriot types look silly.

/s


----------



## fischersd

fooferdoggie said:


> anti-masker threatens a woman, pushes an older guy, all while threatening to “fuck them up,” then gets punched in the face and cries about “assault” - very satisfying
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1452752299558846470/



Really hope the guy that punched that asshole doesn't get charged.  Couldn't happen fast enough.


----------



## User.45

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/comments/qiyukv


This absolutely belongs here. He as a paramedic is definitely accountable for spreading disinformation that literally infected his family. HCA mostly makes me sad, but this one made me angry.


----------



## Eric

P_X said:


> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/comments/qiyukv
> 
> 
> This absolutely belongs here. He as a paramedic is definitely accountable for spreading disinformation that literally infected his family. HCA mostly makes me sad, but this one made me angry.



Unbelievable, you see this time and time again and I get the anger toward these people, at this point dying from it is nearly 100% avoidable. He said in one of the posts that he chose "life over fear" but if you simply get the vaccine you don't need to live in fear any more, remove the "choice" with common sense preventative measures. I don't wish this thing on anyone but will never understand their logic.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> Unbelievable, you see this time and time again and I get the anger toward these people, at this point dying from it is nearly 100% avoidable. He said in one of the posts that he chose "life over fear" but if you simply get the vaccine you don't need to live in fear any more, remove the "choice" with common sense preventative measures. I don't wish this thing on anyone but will never understand their logic.



Virtue signaling without the competence to meet basic professional standards met with a paradoxically inflated sense of competence. It usually takes an environment where none of your colleagues call you out for being an ass. 

I've had a FB argument with a classmate from med school who pulled some antivaxx/mask BS last year. I asked him to provide supportive data to his claims so he very quickly descended into using _ad hominems (_which is sad because we used to be friends back in the days). Looked a few weeks ago...he deleted it all because it was embarrassing for him.


----------



## fooferdoggie

The Parable of the Drowning Man in the Age of COVID​The joke goes something like this: A ferocious storm sweeps through a town, and in the aftermath, a man clambers onto his roof to escape the floodwaters. As he sits there, someone in a canoe comes by and offers to carry him to safety. “No, thanks,” the man replies. “God will save me.” The man paddles off, and the waters continue to rise. Shortly afterward, someone in a boat pulls up to offer help. “No, thank you,” the man says again. “God will deliver me.” The waters rise higher. Finally, a Coast Guard helicopter appears; someone with a megaphone offers to drop a ladder. “No, thank you,” the man says for a final time. “I prayed for God to save me.” The helicopter flies off, the waters engulf the roof, and the man drowns. When the man arrives in heaven, he asks in confusion, “What happened, God? Why didn’t you rescue me?” God replies, “I sent you a canoe, a boat, and a helicopter. What more did you want?”


The joke goes something like this: A ferocious storm sweeps through a town, and in the aftermath, a man clambers onto his roof to escape the floodwaters. As he sits there, someone in a canoe comes by and offers to carry him to safety. “No, thanks,” the man replies. “God will save me.” The man paddles off, and the waters continue to rise. Shortly afterward, someone in a boat pulls up to offer help. “No, thank you,” the man says again. “God will deliver me.” The waters rise higher. Finally, a Coast Guard helicopter appears; someone with a megaphone offers to drop a ladder. “No, thank you,” the man says for a final time. “I prayed for God to save me.” The helicopter flies off, the waters engulf the roof, and the man drowns. When the man arrives in heaven, he asks in confusion, “What happened, God? Why didn’t you rescue me?” God replies, “I sent you a canoe, a boat, and a helicopter. What more did you want?”


If you ever regularly attended a Christian church, you’ve probably heard a version of this story, sometimes called the “parable of the drowning man.” But in the last year, a new version has cropped up. In it, a man ignores advice to wear masks, avoid large gatherings, and get the COVID vaccine. When he dies after contracting the virus at a party, God tells the confused Christian that he gave public health officials the intelligence to develop the vaccine and to educate the public about social distancing, hand-washing, masks, and other measures. “I imparted wisdom to your leaders, who realized the dangers of COVID-19 and how humans could protect themselves,” this version of God says in a Florida newspaper column in July, in one of a number of similar editorials in local and regional newspapers. “Many of your leaders made sure they communicated to everyone. What more could I have done?”


----------



## JayMysteri0

Man, I miss the 'mask tears' thread from the other place.

What's worse?  People are still supplying material for it.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1454498077104951296/


----------



## Edd

JayMysteri0 said:


> Man, I miss the 'mask tears' thread from the other place.
> 
> What's worse?  People are still supplying material for it.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1454498077104951296/



I’m sure this guy has super-healthy relationships and a thriving personal life outside of this store. He’s just having a bad day.


----------



## Joe

JayMysteri0 said:


> Man, I miss the 'mask tears' thread from the other place.
> 
> What's worse?  People are still supplying material for it.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1454498077104951296/




lol I think this is the same one you shared last year on MR. 

Most of my shopping is done online or curbside so I haven't ran into many of these people.


----------



## hulugu

Herdfan said:


> No, it was developed for treating River Blindness in HUMANS.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ivermectin Oral: Uses, Side Effects, Interactions, Pictures, Warnings & Dosing - WebMD
> 
> 
> Find patient medical information for ivermectin oral on WebMD including its uses, side effects and safety, interactions, pictures, warnings and user ratings.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.webmd.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective
> 
> 
> Discovered in the late-1970s, the pioneering drug ivermectin, a dihydro derivative of avermectin—originating solely from a single microorganism isolated at the Kitasato Intitute, Tokyo, Japan from Japanese soil—has had an immeasurably ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So here you have a reputable news organization calling it horse dewormer.  So what happens when a Dr. prescribes it for one of the conditions it is indicated for and the patient won't take it because CNN said it was for horses.  100% irresponsible reporting.
> 
> It is also used on horses.  Ever hear of Ketamine?  It is also used on both Humans and horses.  There is a whole list of drugs that can and are used on humans, horse and other animals.




Your own link says that Ivermectin was "originally introduced as a veterinary drug," as it "kills a wide range of internal and external parasites in commercial livestock and companion animals.



> ...It was quickly discovered to be ideal in combating two of the world’s most devastating and disfiguring diseases which have plagued the world’s poor throughout the tropics for centuries. It is now being used free-of-charge as the sole tool in campaigns to eliminate both diseases globally. It has also been used to successfully overcome several other human diseases and new uses for it are continually being found. This paper looks in depth at the events surrounding ivermectin’s passage from being a huge success in Animal Health into its widespread use in humans, a development which has led many to describe it as a 'wonder' drug.




Now, to go further, while there's no evidence that the anti-parasitic is effective against COVID-19, people on the right-wing have been pushing the drug, and unfortunately, because of this, people have been taking the version meant for horses and livestock.

Now, CNN's Don Lemmon should not have made the crack that Rogan was taking "horse dewormer." 

And, CNN's reporting should always be devoted to clarity on the subject: Rogan's promoting a drug as a cure-all when there's no evidence it helps, and probably pushing people away from the vaccines, which will risk lives. 

Rogan's a crackpot, who has been given into snake-oil nonsense on a dozen other subjects, and has no education, training or clarity on any of these subjects.

As CNN put it to the Washington Post:



> ....The heart of this debate has been purposely confused and ultimately lost. It’s never been about livestock versus human dosage of Ivermectin. The issue is that a powerful voice in the media, who by example and through his platform, sowed doubt in the proven and approved science of vaccines while promoting the use of an unproven treatment for COVID-19—a drug developed to ward off parasites in farm animals.




Meanwhile, Fox News continues to espouse deranged nonsense on vaccines and masks, despite their own corporate mandates for both.

CNN keeps following Fox News' complete lack of standards and accountability. And, Rogan's has no credibility on any of this, either.


----------



## JayMysteri0

JagRunner said:


> lol I think this is the same one you shared last year on MR.
> 
> Most of my shopping is done online or curbside so I haven't ran into many of these people.



Sadly it's supposedly from 2 days ago on the Daily Mail's Tik Tok account.


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> And, CNN's reporting should always be devoted to clarity on the subject: Rogan's promoting a drug as a cure-all when there's no evidence it helps, and probably pushing people away from the vaccines, which will risk lives.



And this exactly is the issue. My interest is how to use biomarkers to design clinical trials that are much more likely to succeed (or if they fail we understand exactly why), and there isn't really a quicker avenue than drug repurposing for turning hypotheses into clinical evidence. But now if I wanna run a trial with another dewormer (which I was considering before this ivermectin craze), it will come with a lot of totally unnecessary connotations and potential sources of bias I wasn't trained to deal with. All thanks to schmucks like Rogan, or Musk.


----------



## hulugu

P_X said:


> And this exactly is the issue. My interest is how to use biomarkers to design clinical trials that are much more likely to succeed (or if they fail we understand exactly why), and there isn't really a quicker avenue than drug repurposing for turning hypotheses into clinical evidence. But now if I wanna run a trial with another dewormer (which I was considering before this ivermectin craze), it will come with a lot of totally unnecessary connotations and potential sources of bias I wasn't trained to deal with. All thanks to schmucks like Rogan, or Musk.




I hadn't thought of that, but that makes some unfortunate sense. Anyone wanting to run a study on Ivermectin has to manage all these outside biases, even just to see if the drug works. 

And, this gets compounded too because most people aren't just taking Ivermectin, but a constellation of other compounds at the same time


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> I hadn't thought of that, but that makes some unfortunate sense. Anyone wanting to run a study on Ivermectin has to manage all these outside biases, even just to see if the drug works.
> 
> And, this gets compounded too because most people aren't just taking Ivermectin, but a constellation of other compounds at the same time



Let's say I sketch up a trial concept and apply for NIH funding. Even though there's at least 5 years worth of bench and 3 years of clinical data generated in my institution [i.e., the basic science and clinical feasibility are both there], I suspect it would impact the score my grant would get.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> Man, I miss the 'mask tears' thread from the other place.
> 
> What's worse?  People are still supplying material for it.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1454498077104951296/




That move works better if you scream while thrashing about wildly.  And you're 2.


----------



## fooferdoggie

how do you sell something everyone gets for free?
Man pleads guilty to attempting to sell COVID-19 vaccines​








						Man pleads guilty to attempting to sell COVID-19 vaccines
					

A Maryland man pleaded guilty to federal charges on Friday for participating in a scheme attempting to sell fake COVID-19 vaccines.Odunayo Oluwalade of Windsor Mills pleaded guilty to a single…




					thehill.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> how do you sell something everyone gets for free?
> Man pleads guilty to attempting to sell COVID-19 vaccines​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Man pleads guilty to attempting to sell COVID-19 vaccines
> 
> 
> A Maryland man pleaded guilty to federal charges on Friday for participating in a scheme attempting to sell fake COVID-19 vaccines.Odunayo Oluwalade of Windsor Mills pleaded guilty to a single…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> thehill.com



This guy texted me this morning… he’s back at it.


----------



## fooferdoggie

man. itsgoign to be hard to get another job now.
Anti-masker New York realtor is fired after filming himself chasing young children and accusing their parents of abusing them for forcing them to wear masks​








						Realtor films himself chasing small children down street over masks
					

New York realtor Curtis Goldstein filmed himself chasing mask-wearing school children. Goldstein used a bullhorn to tell the kids they were being 'abused' by parents as they left their school.




					www.dailymail.co.uk


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> This guy texted me this morning… he’s back at it.



seriously?


----------



## fooferdoggie

Texas Hold my beer again​The Pharmacies Giving Ivermectin To People Bamboozled By Right-Wing Misinformation​When you visit the “COVID-19 Info” page on Austin Compounding Pharmacy’s website, it tells you in no uncertain terms that “taking Ivermectin once a week will decrease your risk of infection and reduce the severity if you do contract COVID-19.” There is no evidence that is true.
The Texas pharmacy also has a special order form that lists 10 COVID-19 medications, none of which has been approved by the Food and Drug Administration to treat or prevent the disease. Ivermectin is at the top, followed by hydroxychloroquine (which has been proved to be ineffective against COVID), and a list of non-prescription items to create your own “Corona Six Pack.” The choices include zinc, melatonin and a pulse oximeter because, according to the form, “Oxygen saturation is important.”








						The Pharmacies Giving Ivermectin To People Bamboozled By Right-Wing Misinformation
					

Ivermectin isn’t approved by federal authorities to treat COVID-19, but that’s not stopping people from seeking it out — or others from making money off of it.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> seriously?



It might be him - got a spam text asking me to buy a COVID booster shot


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> It might be him - got a spam text asking me to buy a COVID booster shot



thats crazy for sure.


----------



## lizkat

fooferdoggie said:


> Texas Hold my beer again​The Pharmacies Giving Ivermectin To People Bamboozled By Right-Wing Misinformation​When you visit the “COVID-19 Info” page on Austin Compounding Pharmacy’s website, it tells you in no uncertain terms that “taking Ivermectin once a week will decrease your risk of infection and reduce the severity if you do contract COVID-19.” There is no evidence that is true.
> The Texas pharmacy also has a special order form that lists 10 COVID-19 medications, none of which has been approved by the Food and Drug Administration to treat or prevent the disease. Ivermectin is at the top, followed by hydroxychloroquine (which has been proved to be ineffective against COVID), and a list of non-prescription items to create your own “Corona Six Pack.” The choices include zinc, melatonin and a pulse oximeter because, according to the form, “Oxygen saturation is important.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Pharmacies Giving Ivermectin To People Bamboozled By Right-Wing Misinformation
> 
> 
> Ivermectin isn’t approved by federal authorities to treat COVID-19, but that’s not stopping people from seeking it out — or others from making money off of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com




It's past time for profiteers off covid-19 misinfo to land in the slam. Federal agencies and AGs of some states are still turning a blind eye.


----------



## Eric

Anyone here still knowingly hanging out with people who choose not to vaccinate? There seems to be a couple of trains of thought here, if you're vaccinated you should be protected but is it worth risking a breakthrough? To me, there is absolutely no way I'll do it. 

It's one thing to pass them wearing masks in a store or whatever but to actively visit in closed quarters (and most antivaxxers are anti maskers as well) is out of the question. Not only that, I feel divided with these people and can't see this as anything other than a selfish act on their part.


----------



## Pumbaa

Eric said:


> Anyone here still knowingly hanging out with people who choose not to vaccinate? There seems to be a couple of trains of thought here, if you're vaccinated you should be protected but is it worth risking a breakthrough? To me, there is absolutely no way I'll do it.
> 
> It's one thing to pass them wearing masks in a store or whatever but to actively visit in closed quarters (and most antivaxxers are anti maskers as well) is out of the question. Not only that, I feel divided with these people and can't see this as anything other than a selfish act on their part.



Nope. To be fair, the only one I know about is my elderly neighbor, and me avoiding her as much as possible predates the vaccine…

That said, I would absolutely refrain from knowingly hanging out with people who choose not to vaccinate. Not worth the risk, and I probably wouldn’t enjoy the company anyway.


----------



## Edd

Yeah, if you chose not to vaccinate for non-health reasons, you’re too much of a shithead for me to hang with.


----------



## Edd

lizkat said:


> It's past time for profiteers off covid-19 misinfo to land in the slam. Federal agencies and AGs of some states are still turning a blind eye.



I’m counting on them ignoring my Covid-protection crystals, available soon. Buying some ad space on Newsmax and Fox & Friends should set me up for early retirement. That’s the stupidest demographic. I recommend the red one, never been sick with it on my nightstand.


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> Let's say I sketch up a trial concept and apply for NIH funding. Even though there's at least 5 years worth of bench *and 3 years of clinical data generated in my institution [i.e., the basic science and clinical feasibility are both there], I suspect it would impact the score my grant would ge*t.




How much junk has made it through to publication in these areas?


----------



## Alli

Eric said:


> Anyone here still knowingly hanging out with people who choose not to vaccinate? There seems to be a couple of trains of thought here, if you're vaccinated you should be protected but is it worth risking a breakthrough? To me, there is absolutely no way I'll do it.



It’s why I won’t see the in-laws (again) this holiday season. We’ve had 3 jabs each and none of them have had one.


----------



## hulugu

Eric said:


> Anyone here still knowingly hanging out with people who choose not to vaccinate? There seems to be a couple of trains of thought here, if you're vaccinated you should be protected but is it worth risking a breakthrough? To me, there is absolutely no way I'll do it.
> 
> It's one thing to pass them wearing masks in a store or whatever but to actively visit in closed quarters (and most antivaxxers are anti maskers as well) is out of the question. Not only that, I feel divided with these people and can't see this as anything other than a selfish act on their part.




I try to maintain a wider social circle, but this pandemic really showed people's true colors. Those who were fiscal conservatives, or maybe thought about guns differently, still got vaccinated because they understood the virus was real, and they had a duty to protect their loved ones. 

The one person who tried to "woowoo" her way through this, turned out to be a narcissistic asshat. She got COVID, and suffered for weeks, but now she's fine and has become increasingly insufferable. I try to be forgiving, but I muted her on Facebook for 30 days because I was done with her shit. 

Will I hang out with her? Sure, our kids are friends, and I like her husband. But, if she wants to talk about COVID-19, we're getting into a knock-down argument.


----------



## hulugu

SuperMatt said:


> This guy texted me this morning… he’s back at it.




So, he's committing fraud still. Tell the prosecutor's office. A pattern of action is a fantastic way to make a case around fraud.


----------



## User.45

thekev said:


> How much junk has made it through to publication in these areas?



On Ivermectin and COVID, not _that_ much. Some of the shit never survived peer review, but had been cited from preprint servers....

The issue with repurposing is that it's easy to run a database and identify candidate drugs for certain indications. 
Running adequate clinical trials to test these hypotheses takes special expertise (and infrastructure), that is much harder to come by than people who can do literature reviews. That's generally been the issue with HCQ or IVER, people equate low quality evidence as proof.


----------



## Eric

hulugu said:


> I try to maintain a wider social circle, but this pandemic really showed people's true colors. Those who were fiscal conservatives, or maybe thought about guns differently, still got vaccinated because they understood the virus was real, and they had a duty to protect their loved ones.
> 
> The one person who tried to "woowoo" her way through this, turned out to be a narcissistic asshat. She got COVID, and suffered for weeks, but now she's fine and has become increasingly insufferable. I try to be forgiving, but I muted her on Facebook for 30 days because I was done with her shit.
> 
> Will I hang out with her? Sure, our kids are friends, and I like her husband. But, if she wants to talk about COVID-19, we're getting into a knock-down argument.



Yeah, we babysat the dog for our friends who refuse to vaccinate (at least last we heard) and we just did the exchange outside when the dropped her off and picked her up. There is no way anyone who refuses this thing will ever step foot into my house, nor I theirs.


----------



## Eric

Sworn to protect and serve...


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/SelfAwarewolves/comments/qjsll3


----------



## hulugu

Eric said:


> Yeah, we babysat the dog for our friends who refuse to vaccinate (at least last we heard) and we just did the exchange outside when the dropped her off and picked her up. There is no way anyone who refuses this thing will ever step foot into my house, nor I theirs.




At this point, it's not really a fear of getting sick. It's just that there's a lack of common values that's been exposed. 

I believe in subjective reality, and in duty and even sacrifice, to one's family and friends, and the place we live. People who refused to take the vaccine fail one or both of these two tests. We just don't share values any longer, and I'm not interested in hanging out with people who don't share values.


----------



## Eric

hulugu said:


> At this point, it's not really a fear of getting sick. It's just that there's a lack of common values that's been exposed.
> 
> I believe in subjective reality, and in duty and even sacrifice, to one's family and friends, and the place we live. People who refused to take the vaccine fail one or both of these two tests. We just don't share values any longer, and I'm not interested in hanging out with people who don't share values.



Right, chances are if I get a breakthrough I'll be find and I get that, but who wants a breakthrough because some selfish asshole refused to get the vaccine? You're right about seeing people's true colors and frankly I just want nothing to do with them any more and it's unfortunately.


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> On Ivermectin and COVID, not _that_ much. Some of the shit never survived peer review, but had been cited from preprint servers....
> 
> The issue with repurposing is that it's easy to run a database and identify candidate drugs for certain indications.
> Running adequate clinical trials to test these hypotheses takes special expertise (and infrastructure), that is much harder to come by than people who can do literature reviews. *That's generally been the issue with HCQ or IVER, people equate low quality evidence as proof.*




I have noticed that. People also have strange takeaways. Some of the weirdos on some other site (can't remember which, this is just an anecdote) were claiming a complete immune system collapse a few months post-vaccination, based on statistics from the UK, yet none of the reports even appeared to suggest that. Some of these people have genuinely weird takeaways. Personally, I still avoid high densities of people, in spite of being vaccinated. I don't really expect to change that until the topic of COVID is better understood.



Eric said:


> Sworn to protect and server...
> 
> 
> Police Protesting Vaccine Mandates With 'Do Not Comply' Signs from
> SelfAwarewolves




It amuses me that someone in a police march referenced "The Usual Suspects". As I said before, it's not just the resistance to a vaccine mandate but also the resistance to required testing. Basically they want to work in roles where they may have to come into close contact with the general public, yet they don't want to be subjected to efforts to control the spread of a disease.


----------



## hulugu

thekev said:


> I have noticed that. People also have strange takeaways. Some of the weirdos on some other site (can't remember which, this is just an anecdote) were claiming a complete immune system collapse a few months post-vaccination, based on statistics from the UK, yet none of the reports even appeared to suggest that. Some of these people have genuinely weird takeaways. Personally, I still avoid high densities of people, in spite of being vaccinated. I don't really expect to change that until the topic of COVID is better understood.
> 
> 
> 
> It amuses me that someone in a police march referenced "The Usual Suspects". As I said before, it's not just the resistance to a vaccine mandate but also the resistance to required testing. Basically they want to work in roles where they may have to come into close contact with the general public, yet they don't want to be subjected to efforts to control the spread of a disease.




The officers who refuse vaccination and testing requirements also largely ignore mask requirements, and hold themselves above civilian authority. 

Which is why I'm happy to see them all be fired. They've said that their personal interests are above the interests of their fellow officers, their city, and have shown an absolute refusal to adhere to civilian authority. They've rejected the values of the police force, and so the police force should reject them in kind. 

And, most police officers have gotten the vaccine. So, why are we punishing officers who are duty-bound and spend so much attention on people who are clearly uninterested in doing the gig.


----------



## User.45

hulugu said:


> The officers who refuse vaccination and testing requirements also largely ignore mask requirements, and hold themselves above civilian authority.
> 
> Which is why I'm happy to see them all be fired. They've said that their personal interests are above the interests of their fellow officers, their city, and have shown an absolute refusal to adhere to civilian authority. They've rejected the values of the police force, and so the police force should reject them in kind.
> 
> And, most police officers have gotten the vaccine. So, why are we punishing officers who are duty-bound and spend so much attention on people who are clearly uninterested in doing the gig.



Also, COVID killed more cops than violence. So there we have it. The departure of these guys will imediately improve LEO mortality stats. 
Are they still considered "Blue Lives" after they left the force?


----------



## thekev

hulugu said:


> Which is why I'm happy to see them all be fired. They've said that their personal interests are above the interests of their fellow officers, their city, and have shown an absolute refusal to adhere to civilian authority. They've rejected the values of the police force, and so the police force should reject them in kind.




Also, fuck their union reps for supporting this kind of garbage. The ones who genuinely do not want to accept the vaccine should have been all in on other preventative measures, including reassignment and/or regular testing. Their resistance to any and all change is in itself enough to reveal them as bad cops.


----------



## User.45

thekev said:


> Also, fuck their union reps for supporting this kind of garbage. The ones who genuinely do not want to accept the vaccine should have been all in on other preventative measures, including reassignment and/or regular testing. Their resistance to any and all change is in itself enough to reveal them as bad cops.



Psst! Don't tell them. This is the police defunding itself.


----------



## hulugu

thekev said:


> Also, fuck their union reps for supporting this kind of garbage. The ones who genuinely do not want to accept the vaccine should have been all in on other preventative measures, including reassignment and/or regular testing. Their resistance to any and all change is in itself enough to reveal them as bad cops.




Yep. The unions should be in the position of educating their fellows, and reminding them of their duty to civilians and their fellow officers. Instead, because a lot of them are knee-jerk against civilians, or Oath Keepers and Trumpsters, they agree with the anti-vaxers. 

The unions have failed in two ways: first, they're putting themselves in a losing argument over new rules, and second: they're doing so in a way that sacrifices public safety and officer lives. 

City leaders are learning that the unions are a problem, and they're going to be increasingly disinterested in supporting them, even from usually pro-union liberals. And, conservatives are showing that they'll support unions for a hot minute, but will immediately undermine them too because they're functionally expendable. 

Unions had an opportunity to lead. And, they utterly failed the test.


----------



## hulugu

P_X said:


> Psst! Don't tell them. This is the police defunding itself.




Yep. The reality is that the officers who were most strident against change are also way more likely to be anti-vaxxers. 

To them, I say, "well, bye."


----------



## SuperMatt

hulugu said:


> Yep. The unions should be in the position of educating their fellows, and reminding them of their duty to civilians and their fellow officers. Instead, because a lot of them are knee-jerk against civilians, or Oath Keepers and Trumpsters, they agree with the anti-vaxers.
> 
> The unions have failed in two ways: first, they're putting themselves in a losing argument over new rules, and second: they're doing so in a way that sacrifices public safety and officer lives.
> 
> City leaders are learning that the unions are a problem, and they're going to be increasingly disinterested in supporting them, even from usually pro-union liberals. And, conservatives are showing that they'll support unions for a hot minute, but will immediately undermine them too because they're functionally expendable.
> 
> Unions had an opportunity to lead. And, they utterly failed the test.



And it hasn’t just been police unions. Unions across all industries had knee-jerk reactions to employers mandating the vaccine, treating it like an attack by employers on employers. A vast majority of workers want the vaccine, and the union leaders should have been pushing for a mandate too. This protects most of their workers from the foolish actions of a few.


----------



## thekev

hulugu said:


> City leaders are learning that the unions are a problem, and they're going to be increasingly disinterested in supporting them, even from usually pro-union liberals. And, conservatives are showing that they'll support unions for a hot minute, but will immediately undermine them too because they're functionally expendable.




I wouldn't expect typical liberal support of unions to be unconditional, but this is a weird political alliance. Conservatives historically disliked unions on the basis of their being unionized labor, not due to specific grievances with individual leadership.

I guess it's possible that conservative politicians are trying to carve out an exception for police unions, although this relies on branding capitol police as "Feds" and therefore unworthy of such support.

There are occasional dolts that really surprise me. Capitol police officers died in connection with January 6th, and this jackass thinks it's appropriate to build bridges. I would hope that this is sufficient to at least force the guy into retirement. Being a Republican doesn't make this kind of crap okay.









						Capitol Police officer, facing charges for aiding Jan. 6 rioter, resigns from the force
					

The officer allegedly urged a participant in the Capitol breach to delete incriminating social media posts.




					www.politico.com
				






> While Riley did note in a message to the unnamed riot suspect that the Capitol Police had “over 50 officers hurt, some pretty bad,” about 10 days after the riot, Riley invited the person to join him at his home in the future and to return to the Capitol, the indictment returned by a grand jury in Washington Thursday alleges.
> 
> “Next time you want to come to DC just call me, you can stay at my house on shore for free and bring your daughter to the museums,” Riley wrote, according to the indictment. “If you want to see the capitol building, lets do it legally next time….I know a guy who can get you a tour...lol.”







SuperMatt said:


> And it hasn’t just been police unions. Unions across all industries had knee-jerk reactions to employers mandating the vaccine, treating it like an attack by employers on employers. A vast majority of workers want the vaccine, and the union leaders should have been pushing for a mandate too. This protects most of their workers from the foolish actions of a few.




At an individual level, they really deserve whatever backlash they get. It seems like they're unwilling to accept anything other than business as usual.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Wut?


----------



## User.191

Unvaxxed Man Becomes MAGNETIZED After Being Near Vaxxed Family
					

The Stew Peters Show




					www.redvoicemedia.com
				




#NotTheOnion


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1455553003713220613/

"We have seen the enemy, and..."


----------



## Herdfan

JayMysteri0 said:


> Man, I miss the 'mask tears' thread from the other place.
> 
> What's worse?  People are still supplying material for it.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1454498077104951296/




I'm here.  We can start another one.


----------



## Eric

China's not fucking around. Communism has it's pitfalls but this is an area where it has its advantages, good luck trying to pull a Karen there.









						China Locks 30,000 Visitors Inside Shanghai Disneyland After One Guest Got Covid-19
					

Under China’s “zero tolerance” policy, guests were required to take a coronavirus test to exit the park, which will be shut until at least Wednesday.




					www.wsj.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

Herdfan said:


> I'm here.  We can start another one.



Not a fan of repeating bits / threads.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1455553003713220613/
> 
> "We have seen the enemy, and..."



This is cute but also symbolic. Lucifer comes from Lux Ciphere: Light-bringer. Some of these people actively avoid enlightenment.


----------



## Yoused

P_X said:


> This is cute but also symbolic. Lucifer comes from Lux Ciphere: Light-bringer. Some of these people actively avoid enlightenment.



Everything you know is wrong. Or, everything, you know, is wrong.

The Christians have painted the devil as some kind of bad guy, but is he really? I mean, how many people has murdered or tortured compared to that Jehovallah guy? I believe that the Christians have their polytheism backwards, and their hero (a lot like a certain other group) is just a sleazy conman who has used his powerful PR department to make the devil look evil, when, in fact, he makes wonderful cake and snack eggs.


----------



## Eric

Turns out Aaron Rodgers lied about being vaccinated.









						Source: Pack's Rodgers tests positive for COVID
					

Packers QB Aaron Rodgers has tested positive for COVID-19, a source confirmed to ESPN, and Jordan Love will make his first career start against Kansas City on Sunday.




					www.espn.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> Turns out Aaron Rodgers lied about being vaccinated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Source: Pack's Rodgers tests positive for COVID
> 
> 
> Packers QB Aaron Rodgers has tested positive for COVID-19, a source confirmed to ESPN, and Jordan Love will make his first career start against Kansas City on Sunday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.espn.com



Bortles!!!







> Veteran quarterback Blake Bortles is flying to Green Bay on Wednesday with the expectation that he will be signed to the practice squad and be eligible for the 53-man roster on Sunday, a source told ESPN's Adam Schefter.


----------



## User.45

Buddy just texted me that their physicians' assistant is departing due to the vaccine mandate. 
Once again, this is a pretty clean way to get rid of those who are shit at their job; at least in healthcare.


----------



## Eric

P_X said:


> Buddy just texted me that their physicians' assistant is departing due to the vaccine mandate.
> Once again, this is a pretty clean way to get rid of those who are shit at their job; at least in healthcare.



Zero sympathy, good luck finding another comparable career that won't require it.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Just when you think you’ve seen it all


----------



## Joe

Runs For Fun said:


> Just when you think you’ve seen it all




That's hilarious.


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> Just when you think you’ve seen it all



I doubt that it's real, but it's pretty funny regardless


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Tim Pool Got Covid-19 After Railing Against Vaccine Mandates
					

Pool, a YouTuber, has continually portrayed vaccine mandates as indicative of a looming, 1984-style totalitarian takeover.




					gizmodo.com
				




I first heard of Tim when he was more of a moderate liberal and I found what he said interesting, more of a "let’s not treat everybody on the right like they are insane idiots" view.  This was before covid but soon after he started derailing into what the article describes and I had to stop listening.  Very much like Rogan, start with "I’m an open minded liberal" and then spend the rest of the time parroting Fox News talking points.  

I’ve been bagging on liberals a lot lately but it’s not from the view that I agree with Fox News on most everything.  It’s mostly from the view that they aren’t achieving most progressive goals that would help a lot of people.


----------



## fooferdoggie

the newest Herman Cain award this guy is a flat farther and does nor believe covid was real but yer=t still took horse dewormer. so you take something that is supposed to help with something you dont think is real?
Outspoken B.C. COVID-denier Mak Parhar dies, coroner investigating​








						Outspoken B.C. COVID-denier Mak Parhar dies, coroner investigating  | Globalnews.ca
					

The cause of death has not been determined and will be investigated by the BC Coroners Service.




					globalnews.ca


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> the newest Herman Cain award this guy is a flat farther and does nor believe covid was real but yer=t still took horse dewormer. so you take something that is supposed to help with something you dont think is real?
> Outspoken B.C. COVID-denier Mak Parhar dies, coroner investigating​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Outspoken B.C. COVID-denier Mak Parhar dies, coroner investigating  | Globalnews.ca
> 
> 
> The cause of death has not been determined and will be investigated by the BC Coroners Service.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> globalnews.ca



Maybe he thought he had worms?


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> Maybe he thought he had worms?




Maybe he self-identified as a horse.


----------



## DT

SuperMatt said:


> Maybe he thought he had worms?





It was either follow the massive collection of peer reviewed data that indicates the vaccine is safe and effective ...

=or=

... listen to Joe Rogan.


----------



## Eric

DT said:


> It was either follow the massive collection of peer reviewed data that indicates the vaccine is safe and effective ...
> 
> =or=
> 
> ... listen to Joe Rogan.



Vaccine given to more than 6.5 billion people

or

Horse dewormer


----------



## JayMysteri0

You know someone realizes THEY F'd up, when they start labelling those who are calling THEM out on their bullshit, "woke".

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1456675951849484294/

Bro, your ass got caught lying, then you got Covid.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1456680185286234118/

Dafuq?!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1456697659725471745/


----------



## SuperMatt

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1456465964963295234/

These wonderful people assault a bakery owner, then call the cops, and are shocked when the cops arrest them instead of the shop owner…..


----------



## Joe

fooferdoggie said:


> the newest Herman Cain award this guy is a flat farther and does nor believe covid was real but yer=t still took horse dewormer. so you take something that is supposed to help with something you dont think is real?
> Outspoken B.C. COVID-denier Mak Parhar dies, coroner investigating​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Outspoken B.C. COVID-denier Mak Parhar dies, coroner investigating  | Globalnews.ca
> 
> 
> The cause of death has not been determined and will be investigated by the BC Coroners Service.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> globalnews.ca




That page reminds me how stupid people are. 

All of them are facebook conspiracy theories. 

Oh well. #ThotsAndPlayers #YouTriedIt #YouLost


----------



## Thomas Veil

Runs For Fun said:


> Covet 19.




Covet 19 *vacations*.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JagRunner said:


> That page reminds me how stupid people are.
> 
> All of them are facebook conspiracy theories.
> 
> Oh well. #ThotsAndPlayers #YouTriedIt #YouLost




I think I would have more empathy for somebody who walked up to the edge of a pier, tied a rope around their waist and the other end to a boulder, and said "It’s ok.  I’m a strong swimmer." just before shoving the boulder off the pier.


----------



## Joe

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I think I would have more empathy for somebody who walked up to the edge of a pier, tied a rope around their waist and the other end to a boulder, and said "It’s ok.  I’m a strong swimmer." just before shoving the boulder off the pier.




They post some of the most hateful vulgar things while hiding behind christianity. Then when they die their friends and family are like "So and so was such a great person! Heaven gained a good one" #SureJan


----------



## Thomas Veil

JagRunner said:


> That page reminds me how stupid people are.
> 
> All of them are facebook conspiracy theories.
> 
> Oh well. #ThotsAndPlayers #YouTriedIt #YouLost




Coroner's Report:

Cause of death:  _Complications arising from stupidity_


----------



## Pumbaa

Thomas Veil said:


> Coroner's Report:
> 
> Cause of death:  _Complications arising from stupidity_



Yepp. Comorbidities. Inflating the fake death count.


----------



## ronntaylor

DT said:


> It was either follow the massive collection of peer reviewed data that indicates the vaccine is safe and effective ...
> 
> =or=
> 
> ... listen to Joe Rogan.



Can we start calling these The Joe Rogan Award?


----------



## SuperMatt

ronntaylor said:


> Can we start calling these The Joe Rogan Award?



Or the walk of shame?


----------



## lizkat

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Maybe he self-identified as a horse.




Or some part thereof.   RIP but hope his death teaches someone still able to avoid covid by getting vaxxed instead of dissing its power and then trying to offset that by taking something not meant to deter covid.


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> Or the walk of shame?



More like the plop of shame.


----------



## ronntaylor

lizkat said:


> Or some part thereof.   RIP but hope his death teaches someone still able to avoid covid by getting vaxxed instead of dissing its power and then trying to offset that by taking something not meant to deter covid.



The cultists are more likely to sprout some conspiracy ultimately laying blame on some uninvolved entity like "demoncraps" or such other BS.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Damnit 








						Court halts Biden vaccine, testing mandate for businesses
					

A federal appeals court temporarily halted the Biden administration's occupational safety rule that required businesses with over 100 employees to mandate the COVID-19 vaccine or regular testing.




					www.fox13now.com


----------



## lizkat

Runs For Fun said:


> Damnit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Court halts Biden vaccine, testing mandate for businesses
> 
> 
> A federal appeals court temporarily halted the Biden administration's occupational safety rule that required businesses with over 100 employees to mandate the COVID-19 vaccine or regular testing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.fox13now.com




Is there some new constitutional amendment made it over the transom?  A right to drag the US into the school of hard knocks?


----------



## Eric

Runs For Fun said:


> Damnit
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Court halts Biden vaccine, testing mandate for businesses
> 
> 
> A federal appeals court temporarily halted the Biden administration's occupational safety rule that required businesses with over 100 employees to mandate the COVID-19 vaccine or regular testing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.fox13now.com



Great. Europe is going through another huge outbreak, can't wait for it to mutate and spread amongst the selfish assoles here again so the responsible ones have to get another booster.


----------



## JayMysteri0

What still fascinates me is the crowd primarily behind this behavior.  Something that's considered life saving on a massive scale like masks & vaccines are too much for them.  It's encroaching on... a way of life.  Meanwhile fatal encounters ending life, ...meh.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457110921235550210/

Yet when there were BLM protests demanding not to be killed by the police, THAT was a bridge too far for others to gather in civil obedience.  Now I know the tired reach will be about "riots", but lets consider the life, societal, and economic cost.  From those supposed "riots" a few businesses were lost, covered by insurance.  Businesses have been wiped out now in greater numbers, never to return.  Lives were lost if you use the most generous accounting method during the height of BLM, but NOTHING in comparison to the lives lost to Covid.

Wanting to protest the number of lives lost by interactions with police ( the irony of course being what's taken the place of killing the most police & the police's new stand on whether someone should comply with a lawful order ) that result in death is unacceptable.  Wanting to protest against measures intended to save hundreds of thousands of lives, protect the economy, etc...  LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

The priorities afforded because of the privilege of some is astounding.


----------



## JayMysteri0

> City Is Cooperating With FBI Investigation Of Loretto Hospital, Lightfoot Says
> 
> 
> "They've asked individuals questions about things related to Loretto," Mayor Lori Lightfoot said of the federal investigation into the West Side hospital.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> blockclubchicago.org





> CHICAGO — The city is “cooperating” with a federal investigation into Loretto Hospital on the West Side, Mayor Lori Lightfoot said Friday.
> 
> Block Club Chicago and the Better Government Association revealed Tuesday the FBI is investigating the hospital’s vaccination program.
> 
> Reporters found two federal grand jury subpoenas were issued to the Illinois Department of Public Health in May and September after Block Club Chicago revealed the hospital vaccinated ineligible people at Chicago’s Trump Tower, where Loretto’s chief financial officer, Dr. Anosh Ahmed, lived, as well as a luxury jewelry shop and a high-end Gold Coast steakhouse where Ahmed hung out.
> 
> At a Friday news conference, Mayor Lori Lightfoot said the city is cooperating with the probe, though she does not think any city agencies have been subpoenaed.
> 
> “Yes, we are cooperating. … They’ve asked individuals questions about things related to Loretto,” Lightfoot said. “I don’t want to go any further because this is an ongoing federal investigation. But of course we’ve cooperated.”
> 
> Lightfoot would not say what agency has questioned “individuals” at the city.
> 
> Earlier this week, Gov. JB Pritzker said the Illinois Department of Public Health is also cooperating.
> 
> “If there was wrongdoing, we need to find those people out and they need to be held accountable,” he said at a news conference.
> 
> The subpoenas to the state health department, issued “pursuant to an official criminal investigation,” seek patient records and other documents over a two-day period in March when Chicagoans were scrambling to secure scarce vaccination appointments.
> 
> Loretto administrators have not responded to requests for comment.





> The subpoenas to the state health department, issued “pursuant to an official criminal investigation,” seek patient records and other documents over a two-day period in March when Chicagoans were scrambling to secure scarce vaccination appointments.
> 
> Loretto administrators have not responded to requests for comment.
> 
> The subpoenas represent demands for records and information and made no allegations of wrongdoing against any Loretto official. They also do not spell out the scope of the grand jury investigation or its targets.
> 
> Still, those documents signal a new depth to the turmoil swirling around the small safety-net hospital on the West Side. The Illinois Attorney General’s Office is already investigating the hospital following reports from Block Club and the Better Government Association that revealed one of Ahmed’s friends won contracts worth $4 million from the nonprofit hospital while Loretto board members took hospital-funded Caribbean trips, among other benefits.
> 
> “This is not a fishing expedition,” said Chicago attorney Stephen Lee, who formerly served as a senior counsel to the Chicago U.S. attorney’s health care fraud unit and who reviewed the subpoenas at the request of reporters. “Sometimes these investigations don’t really go anywhere, but there’s something they’re looking into, and it’s something more than just what’s unethical.”
> 
> Ahmed resigned in March amid the Block Club disclosures, saying he didn’t want to become a “distraction.” He did not respond to requests for comment Monday.





> As the pandemic tore through low-income communities of color, officials administered Illinois’ first vaccinations at Loretto in December, in large part to assure Black and Latino citizens they would be prioritized and protected.
> 
> On May 11, Block Club and the BGA published an internal Loretto audit that showed more than half of the hospital’s early on-site coronavirus vaccine doses went to white and Asian people, while the neighborhood Loretto serves is 79 percent Black. Loretto had tried to keep that audit from the public.
> 
> About two weeks later, on May 27, the FBI issued its first subpoena to the state health department, demanding information on the vaccination status of 70 people inoculated through Loretto on March 10 and 47 people vaccinated by Loretto the next day, March 11. The second subpoena, sent four months later, on Sept. 15, asked health officials more broadly for all records on any COVID-19 vaccinations administered by Loretto at any location on those two days in March.
> 
> The subpoenas were released following a public records request by Block Club and the BGA, but much of the 14 pages — including the names of people who received vaccines on those two days — were blacked out because of medical privacy concerns.
> 
> At the time, inoculations were limited to health care staff, essential frontline workers and people 65 and older, but doses proved scarce even for members of those groups. Many people scoured websites for appointments, dialed endlessly into overwhelmed phone banks and responded to text alerts for slots that were quickly snatched up.




_"On May 11, Block Club and the BGA published an internal Loretto audit that s*howed more than half of the hospital’s early on-site coronavirus vaccine doses* *went to white and Asian people*, *while the neighborhood Loretto serves is 79 percent Black*. Loretto had tried to keep that audit from the public."_



Systemic?  Nah.


----------



## fooferdoggie

funny as hell.
Fake vaccination cards. News: Doctors giving water vaccinations to provide "real" fake vaccination cards. Fark: Doctors give real vaccinations to people who think they're getting water vaccines








						Anti-vaxxers bribe doctors for “vaccination” with water, end up with the real vaccine - Keep Talking Greece
					

Mass fake vaccinations have been taking place in dozens of vaccination centers throughout Greece, me




					www.keeptalkinggreece.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

The "Hey, let's film ourselves harassing a shop owner" quickly turns into "Hey, let's film ourselves getting arrested"
man the stupid in this is amazing. but not that you expect much from antivaxxers and anti maskers. 








						2 arrested after violent attack over face masks caught on video inside Oregon cookie shop
					

It all began when a man and woman walked into a cookie shop in downtown Eugene, Oregon, without face coverings. However, they were holding a camera that was already recording.




					abc7.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/HermanCainAward/comments/qognpl


----------



## JayMysteri0

When Terry Bradshaw goes for the 'cheap pop', at Aaron Rodger's expense...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457399613892272132/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457192862244802561/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457317352362680321/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457317352362680321/



He has some copycats:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457436254711259138/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

SuperMatt said:


> He has some copycats:
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457436254711259138/




Everybody knows Sesame Street is the InfoWars of the left.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> He has some copycats:
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457436254711259138/



Ted Cruz is a trollservative. This monster is nurtured by attention. Don’t feed it.


----------



## fooferdoggie




----------



## Yoused

fooferdoggie said:


> View attachment 9649



Why does that posting have a big pink penis over the username?


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yoused said:


> Why does that posting have a big pink penis over the username?



I believe that is a new Twitter feature they are experimenting with only certain users, that allows one to use a preferred symbol as their Twitter handle.


----------



## JayMysteri0

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1455553003713220613/
> 
> "We have seen the enemy, and..."



An update on the author of that tweet...








> Newsmax distanced itself from its White House correspondent after she claimed COVID vaccines contain a 'bioluminescent marker' to track people
> 
> 
> Newsmax's White House reporter Emerald Robinson claimed falsely that COVID-19 vaccines contain luciferin. She was promptly suspended by Twitter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.businessinsider.com


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> I believe that is a new Twitter feature …



That looks more like a FB post, though.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yoused said:


> That looks more like a FB post, though.



Like I said, it's a new selective feature for VERY special people.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Yoused said:


> Why does that posting have a big pink penis over the username?



keeps things legal. the mod has to do that to keep from getting in trouble with Facebook. it is from things antivaxxers say Facebook group. plus tis because they are a big dick.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Wow…
Big Bird got 'vaccinated' against COVID-19, drawing outrage from Republicans








						Big Bird got 'vaccinated' against COVID-19, drawing outrage from Republicans
					

Big Bird, who is technically 6 years old, got his COVID-19 vaccine over the weekend. His announcement did not sit well with conservatives like Sen. Ted Cruz, who called it "government propaganda."




					www.npr.org
				




Yo Texas WTF 
Unvaccinated Texans make up vast majority of COVID-19 cases and deaths this year, new state data shows








						Unvaccinated Texans make up vast majority of COVID-19 cases and deaths this year, new state data shows
					

The new state survey is the first time Texas health officials have been able to statistically measure the vaccine's true impact on the pandemic.




					www.texastribune.org


----------



## JayMysteri0

Jordan Klepper once again showing all that needs to be said


----------



## januarydrive7

The thread title made me think this was for covid deniers... 

*sigh of relief


----------



## Runs For Fun

januarydrive7 said:


> The thread title made me think this was for covid deniers...
> 
> *sigh of relief



Ha never thought about it in that way. But Covid deniers would not be tolerated around here.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> An update on the author of that tweet...



If you’re too crazy for NewsMax…. Dang.


----------



## JayMysteri0

New thing.  Covid causing short term memory loss

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1457905192859471878/


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> New thing. Covid causing short term memory loss



As I have said before, the past is what we understand it to be. It is not a solid thing, carved in stone, and because that understanding is subject to revision, the past is as dynamic and uncertain as the future. Thus, if you can convince enough people of a thing, that thing literally becomes part of history, as the past, again, is entirely what we know of it. This is the goal of these people: to form an image of prior events firmly enough that the bullshit is impossible to surmount. They are on the verge of succeeding.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Whaaaaa?



> A Bogus Anti-Vaccine Video of a 'Karen' on a Plane Is Going Viral on TikTok
> 
> 
> If the video appears designed to be shared widely by anti-vaxxers… that’s because it is
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.rollingstone.com





> Six days ago, a TikTok creator named Anjelo Tavera posted a video of a blond woman in a blue sweater having a meltdown on what appears to be a commercial passenger jet. In the video, the woman speaks in stilted, almost mid-Atlantic tones as she delineates to an extremely patient flight attendant why she refuses to take her seat on the plane.
> 
> “I work hard. I paid for my seat. Which is clearly going to put my life in danger,” she intones in the video, which appears to be recorded from the vantage point of another passenger. As a baby cries in the background and music dramatically swells, the woman explains that she asked her seat-mate to provide his vaccination card, he did not, leading her to believe he wasn’t vaccinated. “I cannot be made to breathe his oxygen. That’s not fair!” she screams before the handsome, broad-shouldered captain emerges to deliver a rousing speech.
> 
> “Vaccinated or unvaccinated, we should respect each other,” he says, adding that he will not tolerate “discrimination” against the unvaccinated on his flight before rousting her from the airplane, to a round of applause from the other passengers.





> The video appears to have been engineered in a lab to achieve mass virality, particularly for an audience inclined to side with the airline crew. It has everything: a dramatic soundtrack; a buzzy social issue (in this case, vaccination requirements on international flights); a high-strung white woman, or “Karen” in internet parlance, publicly berating harried airline employees, and a stoic, barrel-chested authority figure to serve as the voice of reason during chaotic times. And go viral it did, with Tavera’s video on TikTok racking up more than 34 million views; it has also been reposted and retweeted thousands of times on Twitter, as well as the YouTube channel for the conservative outlet Turning Point USA, where it has more than 150,000 views.





> But if the video seemed like it was designed to go viral, that’s because it basically was. The clip appears to have been produced by content creator Prince Ea, aka Richard Williams, also responsible for such staged clickbait as “Racist Lady Gets Covid — What Happens Next Will Shock You,” “This Virus Spreads Faster than Covid” and “‘Woke’ bully shames comedian, instantly regrets it.” Williams, who has 5.6 million YouTube subscribers, also posted the video for “Covid Flight” on Nov. 1 on Facebook, where it got 23 million views. His post was captioned, “She must have been having a bad day,” but did not disclose that the video was staged in the post.





> According to an IMDB page for “Covid Flight” posted by the Twitter account @HoaxEye, the role of the irate Karen was played by Diana Winter, an English actor from Bournemouth, United Kingdom who is registered with UK Equity and has appeared in a smattering of short films. The role of the flight attendant appears to have been played by an actor named Jordan Holland, who is represented by the agency Aston Management and wrote a now-deleted post on her Facebook about her experience working on the film. “Great fun filming today with a fun crew! Got to play the part of an airline hostess dealing with a not-so-happy Karen,” she wrote in the caption of the post, which featured a photo of the cast and crew, including Winter, on the airplane seen in the viral video. (Holland and Aston Management did not immediately respond to requests for comment, nor did Williams.)
> 
> The director credited on IMDB as helming the video, Jamie Hull-Greenwood, also posted photos from the set on Instagram, including a selfie also dated Oct. 27 of the airplane interior that shows Holland in her flight attendant costume in the frame. “Filming on a plane for Prince Ea, directing a micro short is normally fun but with a fear of flying it’s pretty scary,” he wrote in the caption of a selfie showing him in the cockpit, followed by the “joy” emoji.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Whaaaaa?



Just like the moon landing… ;-)


----------



## fooferdoggie

North Dakota Lawmaker Gets COVID, Forced To Miss His Anti-Vaccine Rally​








						North Dakota Lawmaker Gets COVID, Forced To Miss His Anti-Vaccine Rally
					

Republican Rep. Jeff Hoverson said he is taking the deworming drug ivermectin as a COVID-19 treatment, and has not checked into a hospital.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## Joe

P_X said:


> Ted Cruz is a trollservative. This monster is nurtured by attention. Don’t feed it.




He's not stupid. He just knows how to work up his crazy base.


----------



## User.45

JagRunner said:


> He's not stupid. He just knows how to work up his crazy base.



Oh, i know. This is why I’m saying that he just does it for attention which he then converts into campaign donations. If we stop getting upset or offended, he could not cash in on his trolling.


----------



## Edd

JagRunner said:


> He's not stupid. He just knows how to work up his crazy base.



I guess so but imagine going through the trouble of getting a law degree and ultimately just conducting yourself like a 19 year old Infowars commenter. He’s beholden to zero standards of professionalism, he just talks shit all day.


----------



## Joe

Edd said:


> I guess so but imagine going through the trouble of getting a law degree and ultimately just conducting yourself like a 19 year old Infowars commenter. He’s beholden to zero standards of professionalism, he just talks shit all day.




He saw that it worked with Trump.


----------



## Yoused

Largely upset about covet 19 related restrictions,









						Oroville City Council votes to declare the city as a Constitutional Republic City
					

OROVILLE, Calif. - The City of Oroville is getting national attention for a resolution they recently passed.




					www.actionnewsnow.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Just sayin’.  No reason to draw conclusions

…other then there are substantially less Trump voters around. 2024 might be the first year that we do see massive dead voter fraud.


----------



## Yoused

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> 2024 might be the first year that we do see massive dead voter fraud.



INFWRDI


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> View attachment 9660
> 
> Just sayin’.  No reason to draw conclusions
> 
> …other then there are substantially less Trump voters around. 2024 might be the first year that we do see massive dead voter fraud.



Here’s the full article about this phenomenon… paywall removed: 









						U.S. Covid Deaths Get Even Redder
					

The partisan gap in Covid’s death toll has grown faster over the past month than at any previous point.




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Here’s the full article about this phenomenon… paywall removed:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> U.S. Covid Deaths Get Even Redder
> 
> 
> The partisan gap in Covid’s death toll has grown faster over the past month than at any previous point.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com



These people hate socialism, but actually the most legitimate criticism of socialism is that there will be people who will not respect shared resources. Like in this pandemic where now >90% of the healthcare resources are spent on unvaccinated people. If this was a just system, they'd pay proportionately more for insurance, just like in Singapore where the unvaccinated have to foot bill for their COVID care.


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> These people hate socialism, but actually the most legitimate criticism of socialism is that there will be people who will not respect shared resources. Like in this pandemic where now >90% of the healthcare resources are spent on unvaccinated people. If this was a just system, they'd pay proportionately more for insurance, just like in Singapore where the unvaccinated have to foot bill for their COVID care.



It's somewhat surprising that third-party payers haven't done something similar. Paying more for coverage if you engage in risky practices is a well-established tenet in the insurance industry.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> It's somewhat surprising that third-party payers haven't done something similar. Paying more for coverage if you engage in risky practices is a well-established tenet in the insurance industry.



I'm surprised too. It's probably bad business insuring these people.


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Yoused

The Big Bird thing raises a question: he said that his wing was sore – but was it his Right Wing or his Left Wing?


----------



## User.45

Edd said:


> I guess so but imagine going through the trouble of getting a law degree and ultimately just conducting yourself like a 19 year old Infowars commenter. He’s beholden to zero standards of professionalism, he just talks shit all day.



You two clearly have different value systems. TC's strategy makes sense if you forget about most of our hopes to be valuable/contributing members of society and replace it with the goal of maximizing power and financial comfort achieved with the lowest effort. He created a persona that only flies with red voters but in exchange, he really don't have to perform, just be vocal. He'll never be president, and he knows, but all he has to do is type in some offensively stupid shit to Twitter and as long as he isn't freebasing money and gets his bribes legally, he'll be set for life.


----------



## fooferdoggie

The power of Christ compels you to not get vaccinated. The power of the Court compels your nursing school to figure out how you can do clinical rotations required to graduate, even though hospitals can and do require you to be vaccinated









						Judge takes side of unvaccinated nursing students at Maricopa Community Colleges
					

A federal judge granted nursing students a preliminary injunction request, barring Maricopa Community Colleges from enforcing its vaccination policy.




					www.yahoo.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1458410605149368321/





Also, bonus B.S.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1458500138830372866/


----------



## SuperMatt

Twitter thread about leading causes of death in Texas:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1458778724149739521/


----------



## Herdfan

Roller said:


> It's somewhat surprising that third-party payers haven't done something similar. *Paying more for coverage if you engage in risky practices is a well-established tenet in the insurance industry.*




Pretty sure the ACA banned this practice.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Pretty sure the ACA banned this practice.



It’s not that simple.





__





						Loading…
					





					www.cms.gov


----------



## fooferdoggie

Herman cain ward winner mom. even death cant change some idiots minds. 
Unvaccinated mum whose baby died with Covid says she ‘doesn’t regret decision’​








						Unvaccinated mum whose baby died with Covid says she 'doesn't regret decision'
					

Health experts strongly advise pregnant women to get jabbed.




					metro.co.uk


----------



## fooferdoggie

Regretting getting vaccinated? No problem, these cures will not only get rid of the vaccine, but will also turn you back into a virgin
n a TikTok video that has garnered hundreds of thousands of views, Dr. Carrie Madej outlined the ingredients for a bath she said will “detox the vaxx” for people who have given into Covid-19 vaccine mandates.

The ingredients in the bath are mostly not harmful, although the supposed benefits attached to them are entirely fictional. Baking soda and epsom salts, she falsely claims, will provide a “radiation detox” to remove radiation Madej falsely believes is activated by the vaccine.  Bentonite clay will add a “major pull of poison,” she says, based on a mistaken idea in anti-vaccine communities that toxins can be removed from the body with certain therapies. 


Then, recommends adding in one cup of borax, a cleaning agent that’s been banned as a food additive by the Food and Drug Administration, to “take nanotechnologies out of you.”








						Vaccine holdouts are caving to mandates — then scrambling to ‘undo’ it
					

In a TikTok video that has garnered hundreds of thousands of views, Dr.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## Eric

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/qs2jxj


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Restaurant Finds This Anti-Masker’s 1-Star Review So Ridiculous That They Put It On A T-Shirt And People Are Loving It
					

A restaurant in North Carolina got an absurd 1-star review from an anti-masker saying they were satan worshipers and the owner found it so hilarious, he put it on a T-shirt with a picture of a devil with a mask.




					www.boredpanda.com


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> Pretty sure the ACA banned this practice.



Risk-adjusted premiums are widely applied for auto, life, travel, and other forms of insurance, and the ACA allows premium adjustment based on tobacco use. To be clear, I think healthcare coverage should be provided to everyone, perhaps with penalties and/or incentives for a few specific behaviors such as smoking, though that's unlikely to ever come to pass here.

Remember when Trump promised to end coverage denial for people with pre-existing conditions? The closest he got was an executive order that was meaningless in the real world. And how many times have the Republicans tried to repeal the ACA, coming within one vote in 2018, without proposing a viable alternative? That's what happens when a party is bereft of ideas and, with few exceptions, cares more for their continued power than the well-being of their constituents.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1459245134827118592/


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1459245134827118592/




That guy is my hero! 

I wished more people went about in public saying things like "Hi, I'm Fred.  I don't believe in the moon landing, I'm slightly racist and I don't trust science".  What a wonderful world this would be if you could tell so easily who to avoid.  That's why I like MAGA hats.  They're telling me so much about themselves right up front.  I don't need to find that out hours later in an awkward conversation.


----------



## Edd

When I’m in full agreement with Gene Simmons, my existence has become surreal. 









						After Contracting COVID, Gene Simmons Speaks Out: "I Don't Care About Your Political Beliefs" - American Songwriter
					

Speaking to TalkShopLive on Wednesday (November 10), KISS frontman Gene Simmons made his opinions known regarding COVID-19 and vaccinations. Simmons said: “If you’re willing to walk among us unvaccinated, you are an enemy.” “I don’t care about your political beliefs,” Simmons added, talking...




					americansongwriter.com


----------



## Joe

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1459245134827118592/




It's like the people running around with "Lets go Brandon" stickers on the back of their vehicles. People so willingly to let you know they're in a cult LOL


----------



## SuperMatt

Has the sorry state of math education in America contributed to people questioning vaccine effectiveness? One author thinks so.



			https://wapo.st/3ophaZg
		




> Lots of people, of course, never get that far. They make simpler mistakes: thinking that if 30 percent of people testing positive are vaccinated, that means 30 percent of vaccinated people tested positive, or believing that if a vaccine is 95 percent effective against hospitalization, that means 5 percent of vaccinated people will end up in the hospital. And it isn’t just random people on Twitter who make these errors. CNN, in an article on how to fly safely, infamously suggested that a 90 percent effective vaccine would still mean that 10 percent of vaccinated fliers might catch the coronavirus. (What it really means is that a vaccinated person’s risk of being infected on the plane would be 90 percent lower than an unvaccinated person’s risk.)


----------



## SuperMatt

Hey Oklahoma, do you feel safer now that your governor replaced the adjutant of your national guard for getting a vaccine and following Pentagon rules on vaccines for soldiers?

Yep, the governor of Oklahoma fired the Major General in charge of its national guard because he followed Pentagon policy on vaccines.









						New Oklahoma National Guard leader changes COVID-19 vaccine policy
					

New Adjutant General Thomas Mancino updated the Oklahoma National Guard's COVID-19 vaccine policy in his first full day on the job.




					news.yahoo.com
				




Now you’ve got a lower-ranked Brigadier General in charge of your National Guard, whose only qualification seems to be that he is refusing to follow the Pentagon’s vaccine mandate.

Oklahoma residents had better hope the guard isn’t needed for an emergency, because that’s no way to pick a leader.

Even dumber, only 800 soldiers in the state have refused the shot.

Hey Republicans, stop with this anti-vaccine NONSENSE. You are being extremely stupid. In 50 years, the history books will talk about the idiots who refused to get vaccines during the 2020 pandemic. Nobody will remember you as heroes, but rather as an example of the stupid barbarians from the bad old days.


----------



## MEJHarrison

SuperMatt said:


> Has the sorry state of math education in America contributed to people questioning vaccine effectiveness? One author thinks so.
> 
> 
> 
> https://wapo.st/3ophaZg




That absolutely makes sense in my opinion.  My favorite is "why are you afraid of something with a 99% survival rate?"

I've also found that if someone doesn't understand the math, they resist understanding the math when someone tries to explain it.  They just do an eye-roll to reset reality (their reality) and carry on.  It really has a "don't let Satan tempt you" religious vibe to it.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1459559995163484162/

When your privilege takes you so far, that you take a religious symbol and rebrand it as a symbol signifying that you're an asshole.


----------



## Clix Pix

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1459559995163484162/
> 
> When your privilege takes you so far, that you take a religious symbol and rebrand it as a symbol signifying that you're an asshole.




How DARE they?   That is absolutely disgusting!    They're more than assholes.....


----------



## Eric

Got more info on my friend's mother who died of COVID, her and her son (who survived) were both unvaccinated in rural PA without transportation, but they were holed up and never really left the house as they are/were disabled. However, their caregiver (an actual nurse) who shopped for them is an outspoken anti-vaxxer I guess, went into their home sick and infected them both while knowing she had it.

Not sure what to make of all of this but the negligence is off the charts here, no health professional should be able to practice without being vaccinated, period. My friend looks at it like this person murdered her mother, the irony is that she (my friend) took her mother and brother to get vaccinated two days before this nurse infected them but it wasn't enough time for it to kick in yet.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> Got more info on my friend's mother who died of COVID, her and her son (who survived) were both unvaccinated in rural PA without transportation, but they were holed up and never really left the house as they are/were disabled. However, their caregiver (an actual nurse) who shopped for them is an outspoken anti-vaxxer I guess, went into their home sick and infected them both while knowing she had it.
> 
> Not sure what to make of all of this but the negligence is off the charts here, no health professional should be able to practice without being vaccinated, period. My friend looks at it like this person murdered her mother, the irony is that she (my friend) took her mother and brother to get vaccinated two days before this nurse infected them but it wasn't enough time for it to kick in yet.



An unvaccinated healthcare worker infecting patients with COVID should be held liable for medical malpractice. This would also fix the mandate debate...


----------



## Eric

P_X said:


> An unvaccinated healthcare worker infecting patients with COVID should be held liable for medical malpractice. This would also fix the mandate debate...



I would also wonder if this is criminally negligent if you know you have it and spread it, they have similar laws for AIDS for example.









						Quiet About Your HIV Status? You Could Go to Jail in Many U.S. St
					

Iowa is the first in the nation to consider revising such laws in light of new scientific evidence.




					www.healthline.com


----------



## User.45

Today one thing came to my mind.

1. Many Republicans (including a person here) consider it a fact that COVID is a human-made global calamity. In reality, there is very little current supportive evidence, but plenty to point towards other, much more likely origins. Thus, the COVID lab-leak is actually a poorly substantiated hypothesis.

2. Many Republicans consider the idea of Climate Change being a human-made global calamity a poorly substantiated hypothesis. In reality we have half a century worth of supportive evidence and a multidisciplinary consensus among scientists. So even on the conservative spectrum of thought, Climate Change is as close to be a fact as it can get.


So why is that these guys really need extremely high level of evidence to believe the human cause of one global calamity, but settle with extremely low evidence of the other?


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> I would also wonder if this is criminally negligent if you know you have it and spread it, they have similar laws for AIDS for example.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Quiet About Your HIV Status? You Could Go to Jail in Many U.S. St
> 
> 
> Iowa is the first in the nation to consider revising such laws in light of new scientific evidence.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.healthline.com



I'm not a lawyer, and don't play on on the internet either, but I think if the HCW is aware of their infection and fail to comply with infection prevention methods, they are criminally liable.


----------



## Eric

Thoughts and prayers. from
      WhitePeopleTwitter


----------



## Edd

Eric said:


> Thoughts and prayers. from
> WhitePeopleTwitter



How is that not funny? Like, it’s objectively hilarious.


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> I'm not a lawyer, and don't play on on the internet either, but I think if the HCW is aware of their infection and fail to comply with infection prevention methods, they are criminally liable.



I agree that no healthcare worker who interacts with patients should be permitted to work unvaccinated. That doesn't eliminate the likelihood of transmission, but it's much better. I also think HCWs should be required to wear masks. Unfortunately, there's a segment of society, HCWs included, that believes their personal needs outweigh all other considerations. 

In a sane world, licensing bodies would sanction those who depart significantly from acceptable medical practice, particularly for advocating therapies like ivermectin and hydroxycholorquine that have repeatedly been shown to be ineffective for COVID-19. But, aside from a few warnings from specialty boards, I haven't seen much evidence of this. The refusal of the Florida Board of Medicine to take action against DeSantis' lap dog surgeon general, Dr. Joseph Ladapo, is a case in point. Of course, board members are appointed by the governor, so he'd probably fire them if they did.

People have been criminally prosecuted for coughing on others, though it's not always clear-cut. Based on what I've read, the prosecution would have to prove intent to harm show the perpetrator knew they were infected. But isn't it almost as bad if you tell someone you're infected (even if you aren't) and cough to scare or intimidate them?

It's also interesting to consider civil liability, which generally has lower thresholds for findings against defendants. Could a patient sue an unvaccinated and/or non-mask-wearing physician or nurse if they contract COVID-19 after interacting with them?


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> Today one thing came to my mind.
> 
> 1. Many Republicans (including a person here) consider it a fact that COVID is a human-made global calamity.




I don't consider it a fact, I consider it an unknown.  



Roller said:


> I agree that no healthcare worker who interacts with patients should be permitted to work unvaccinated. *That doesn't eliminate the likelihood of transmission, but it's much better. *




Sure it does.  Biden himself said it on October 7th in Chicago.  His exact quote was:



> "We’re making sure health care workers are vaccinated, because if you seek care at a health care facility, you should have the certainty that the people providing that care are protected from COVID and *cannot spread it to you."*




Now I know that is incorrect, but it is just as stupid as many of the other things in this thread, but no one will call him out on it.


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> I don't consider it a fact, I consider it an unknown.
> 
> 
> 
> Sure it does.  Biden himself said it on October 7th in Chicago.  His exact quote was:
> 
> 
> 
> Now I know that is incorrect, but it is just as stupid as many of the other things in this thread, but no one will call him out on it.



I've read criticism of some of Biden's statements from experts who were quoted in the mainstream press, notably his use of the phrase "pandemic of the unvaccinated," which isn't entirely accurate. But I'll take any of Biden's misstatements about COVID-19 over his predecessor's any day. Disinfectant injections or powerful light in the body, anyone?

I don't expect politicians to be 100% accurate when they talk about science, engineering, medicine, or other disciplines, but I don't think they should be far off target, either. Speaking of the atomic bomb that was used on Hiroshima, President Harry Truman described it as unleashing "(the) force from which the sun draws its power." That wasn't quite right, since the bomb used fission instead of fusion. But it was close enough.


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> I don't expect politicians to be 100% accurate when they talk about science, engineering, medicine, or other disciplines, but I don't think they should be far off target, either.



Agreed. Vaccination is not 100% protection, but vaccinated healthcare workers are MUCH safer for patients to be around. It really is farcical to see people that supported Trump and his constant lies to go after a slight inaccuracy in a statement by Biden. And they harp on these minor discrepancies in a way that actually attempts to discredit the effectiveness of vaccines. Engaging in such behavior is immoral in my opinion.

Do not forget, this poster has posted disinformation about COVID infection rates in the past and has zero credibility on the subject.

To call an overstatement from Biden on the ability of the vaccine to stop the spread of the virus *equivalent* to the insane and dangerous COVID stupidity in this thread… is offensive.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> I don't consider it a fact, I consider it an unknown.





> The question is what will happen in 5 years when the next virus escapes from a lab?



I'll keep it in mind next time you get caught on an "inconsistency."



Herdfan said:


> Sure it does.  Biden himself said it on October 7th in Chicago.  His exact quote was:





Herdfan said:


> Now I know that is incorrect, but it is just as stupid as many of the other things in this thread, but no one will call him out on it.




Ohh, this sudden longing for accuracy. This "incredibly stupid" statement overestimates risk reduction of the vaccines by 15% in a speech that intends to promote an intervention that reduces COVID deaths by 92%. Interestingly, lies that claimed tens of thousands of lives were not a deal breaker for you in the past as a repeat Trump voter.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Sure it does.  Biden himself said it on October 7th in Chicago.  His exact quote was:
> 
> 
> 
> Now I know that is incorrect, but it is just as stupid as many of the other things in this thread, but no one will call him out on it.




I'll call him out as being incorrect.  Yet I can also see that his intentions seem to be good.  As others have mentioned, I don't expect the president to be a source of sound medical advice.  But the president should act as a guidepost in my opinion, pointing people in the right direction.  I feel he's met that criteria.

So it would have been nice if it had been a more accurate statement from the president.  But at least he's not actively pointing people in the wrong direction.

I'm not sure what level of "calling out" you're looking for here.  But I'm willing to meet you that far.


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> I'll call him out as being incorrect.  Yet I can also see that his intentions seem to be good.  As others have mentioned, I don't expect the president to be a source of sound medical advice.  But the president should act as a guidepost in my opinion, pointing people in the right direction.  I feel he's met that criteria.
> 
> So it would have been nice if it had been a more accurate statement from the president.  But at least he's not actively pointing people in the wrong direction.
> 
> I'm not sure what level of "calling out" you're looking for here.  But I'm willing to meet you that far.




And I would give him more credit had the WH not refused to comment on it.  Had they simply corrected his statement it would be one thing, but they didn't.



P_X said:


> I'll keep it in mind next time you get caught on an "inconsistency."
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ohh, this sudden longing for accuracy. This "incredibly stupid" statement overestimates risk reduction of the vaccines by 15% in a speech that intends to promote an intervention that reduces COVID deaths by 92%. Interestingly, lies that claimed tens of thousands of lives were not a deal breaker for you in the past as a repeat Trump voter.




For someone who has my posts on IGNORE, you certainly seem to know a lot about them.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> For someone who has my posts on IGNORE, you certainly seem to know a lot about them.



Why not respond to the substance of the post instead of airing a grievance about who is or isn’t ignoring whom? I’d like to see your response to what P_X actually said.


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> you take a religious symbol and rebrand it



The yellow star is a pre-rebranded symbol, though. In that form represents the singling out of a group of people for being treated badly. They are claiming Holocaust-equivalent oppression is being visited upon them for opposing a call to be decent to other people by following public health guidelines.

Which is to say, there is so much wrong in their claims that it is a waste of effort to even try to unpack it.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Why not respond to the substance of the post instead of airing a grievance about who is or isn’t ignoring whom? I’d like to see your response to what P_X actually said.



I found that post holographically hilarious. If we could expect this request to be fulfilled he couldn't complain about his well-known post history getting him on an ignore list that he also seems quite irritated about. At the end of the day it's all about pretending to be a victim of some sort, while spewing malignant nonsense.



Yoused said:


> The yellow star is a pre-rebranded symbol, though. In that form represents the singling out of a group of people for being treated badly. They are claiming Holocaust-equivalent oppression is being visited upon them for opposing a call to be decent to other people by following public health guidelines.
> 
> Which is to say, there is so much wrong in their claims that it is a waste of effort to even try to unpack it.






Clix Pix said:


> How DARE they?   That is absolutely disgusting!    They're more than assholes.....




I'll say it out loud: these people are holocaust deniers. The only question is whether the motivation is delusion, ignorance, malice or a combination of these.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I thought I was done for the night, but this was too good to pass up...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1460040257311805440/


----------



## Roller

I encourage everyone to read this thread by someone who spent time in an ICU for COVID. It's the harsh reality that many patients face, whether they survive (and it's rarely a quick return to normal if they do) or die. Anti-vaxxers and others will claim that this is fear-mongering and that most people have no or few symptoms, which is true. But why take the chance of getting sick or infecting others when there are free, effective vaccines that reduce the risk of severe disease and transmission?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1458600993621430272/

And here's another thread by Steve Schmidt on the stark differences between how COVID is approached in the U.S.A. vs. France. You can argue specific points, but I agree with his central thesis about the sources of misinformation. 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1460113943939198977/


----------



## Runs For Fun

Wow he just keeps digging in harder








						PolitiFact - No lie: COVID-19 is largely spread by unvaccinated people.
					

NFL quarterback Aaron Rodgers kicked off quite the social media stir after he tested positive for COVID-19 Nov. 3 and th




					www.politifact.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> Hey Oklahoma, do you feel safer now that your governor replaced the adjutant of your national guard for getting a vaccine and following Pentagon rules on vaccines for soldiers?
> 
> Yep, the governor of Oklahoma fired the Major General in charge of its national guard because he followed Pentagon policy on vaccines.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> New Oklahoma National Guard leader changes COVID-19 vaccine policy
> 
> 
> New Adjutant General Thomas Mancino updated the Oklahoma National Guard's COVID-19 vaccine policy in his first full day on the job.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now you’ve got a lower-ranked Brigadier General in charge of your National Guard, whose only qualification seems to be that he is refusing to follow the Pentagon’s vaccine mandate.
> 
> Oklahoma residents had better hope the guard isn’t needed for an emergency, because that’s no way to pick a leader.
> 
> Even dumber, only 800 soldiers in the state have refused the shot.
> 
> Hey Republicans, stop with this anti-vaccine NONSENSE. You are being extremely stupid. In 50 years, the history books will talk about the idiots who refused to get vaccines during the 2020 pandemic. Nobody will remember you as heroes, but rather as an example of the stupid barbarians from the bad old days.




Update:



> Defense Secretary Has Authority to Order Mandatory COVID-19 Shots
> 
> 
> The secretary of defense has the authority needed to order all members of the military – including the National Guard – to receive COVID-19 vaccinations, Pentagon Press Secretary John F. Kirby said.
> 
> 
> 
> www.defense.gov





> The secretary of defense has the authority needed to order all members of the military – including the National Guard – to receive COVID-19 vaccinations, Pentagon Press Secretary John F. Kirby said during a news conference today.
> 
> The mandate to get the vaccines is a readiness issue, Kirby said, and the secretary sees the vaccinations as the best way to protect service members from COVID-19.
> 
> The National Guard serves under three authorities: Title 10 (federal service), Title 32 (state status but federal government pays) and state status. The secretary has the authority to order guardsmen to receive the shots "even if they are in Title 32 status," Kirby said.
> 
> "The secretary of defense has the authority to require these vaccines for all members of the force, including the National Guard, as I said, even in a Title 32 status," the press secretary said. "When (guardsmen are) called up for their monthly training, they're still federally funded. So (the secretary) has those authorities. And he believes and this is a larger point that vaccinated forces are a more ready force."
> 
> Kirby pointed to the myriad missions that guardsmen have performed over just the past year. The Guard has helped in everything from fighting wildfires in a number of states, to helping mitigate hurricane damage. Guardsmen also helped secure the U.S. Capitol following the insurrection on January 6, 2021.
> 
> Guardsmen are also instrumental in getting this life-saving vaccine into the arms of millions of Americans across the country.




It's on.


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> Wow he just keeps digging in harder
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PolitiFact - No lie: COVID-19 is largely spread by unvaccinated people.
> 
> 
> NFL quarterback Aaron Rodgers kicked off quite the social media stir after he tested positive for COVID-19 Nov. 3 and th
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.politifact.com



I have no idea who this guy is, or why his opinion on COVID matters, LOL.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Lastly, why is it anti vaxxers of late seem to always need to co opt another group?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1460433496229490688/


----------



## JayMysteri0

P_X said:


> I have no idea who this guy is, or why his opinion on COVID matters, LOL.



If you're not a fan of football, ...he hosted Jeopardy.  Which would impart in some way that he's supposedly intelligent.  Judging by another guest host, turned host, that isn't an uncommon viewpoint.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> Update:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's on.



There should be no question on this. If the guard from Oklahoma gets called up to deploy, they’ll be in tight quarters with lots of troops on a transport. You need everybody to be vaccinated if/when that happens. Letting each state decide things like that is a disaster waiting to happen. I suspect there will be consequences for the Brigadier General who is defying orders too.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> If you're not a fan of football, ...he hosted Jeopardy.  Which would impart in some way that he's supposedly intelligent.  Judging by another guest host, turned host, that isn't an uncommon viewpoint.



Not much of a fan of American football or even real football. All i can say based on his shit, he definitely like _jeopardy. _Ba-dum-tsss!



SuperMatt said:


> There should be no question on this. If the guard from Oklahoma gets called up to deploy, they’ll be in tight quarters with lots of troops on a transport. You need everybody to be vaccinated if/when that happens. Letting each state decide things like that is a disaster waiting to happen. I suspect there will be consequences for the Brigadier General who is defying orders too.



This active duty military antivax thing is laughable.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I'm not even sure where to post this, because it covers so much f---ery

Faux News, and the creative reinterpretation of what the 'line of duty' is.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1459886793982160897/



> Tucson sector Supervisory Border Patrol Agent Anibal Perez dies in line of duty, chief says
> 
> 
> A Tucson sector border patrol agent reportedly died in the line of duty earlier this month.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.abc15.com





> TUCSON, AZ — A Tucson sector border patrol agent reportedly died in the line of duty earlier this month.
> 
> Supervisory Border Patrol Agent Anibal “Tony” A. Perez reportedly died Nov. 5, according to United States Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz.
> 
> ABC15 reached out to United States Customs and Border Protection for more information on the incident, but the department said, "At this time no additional information is available."
> 
> Governor Doug Ducey ordered flags at all state buildings to be lowered to half-staff on Nov. 13 in his honor.






> https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/arizona/articles/2021-11-12/border-patrol-agent-dies-in-line-of-duty-death





> TUCSON, Ariz. (AP) — Border Patrol officials say a supervisory agent from the agency's Tucson sector has died in what is being described as a “line of duty” death.
> 
> U.S. Border Patrol Chief Raul Ortiz said this week that Anibal “Tony” A. Perez died Nov. 5. The exact cause of death was withheld for privacy reasons.






> Border Patrol mourns loss of Tucson Sector agent who dies from COVID-19
> 
> 
> TUCSON (KVOA) - Border Patrol mourned the loss of one of its own Thursday after a Tucson Sector agent recently died in the line of duty.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kvoa.com





> Border Patrol sources say Perez died after he contracted COVID-19.
> 
> Details surrounding Perez's passing are limited at this time.
> 
> Stay with News 4 Tucson for the latest updates.




Wait.  What?  

Which one is correct?  Can you pass from covid 19, and it be in the line of duty?   Especially if the border patrol has a vaccine mandate?


----------



## Alli

SuperMatt said:


> There should be no question on this. If the guard from Oklahoma gets called up to deploy, they’ll be in tight quarters with lots of troops on a transport. You need everybody to be vaccinated if/when that happens. Letting each state decide things like that is a disaster waiting to happen. I suspect there will be consequences for the Brigadier General who is defying orders too.



They problem is that the NG has a different setup than the regular Army. Each state’s guard is led by the TAG, but the TAG is not necessarily a military person, just a political appointment. We had one here in AL for a short while, whose first experience in uniform was when he was appointed. I think that was the one that I got in trouble for criticizing. It was worth it.


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> If you're not a fan of football, ...he hosted Jeopardy.  Which would impart in some way that he's supposedly intelligent.  Judging by another guest host, turned host, that isn't an uncommon viewpoint.



I actually liked him on Jeopardy, a bit sedate but was impressed that he did so well when he was a celebrity contestant as well. Then he lied about the vaccine and went to Joe Rogan for advice on how to handle it publicly, any respect I had for him went right out the window.


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> Can you pass from covid 19, and it be in the line of duty?



The answer is quite straightforward. Examine the story carefully. After poring over the text repeatedly to try to figure it out, take a look at the top of the page. Yes, that is correct, he died in the line of duty because his death was announced on Thursday.


----------



## Yoused

And, they have the covid stupid in Canada too



			https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/nova-scotia-gospel-light-baptist-church-covid-outbreak-1.6250957
		


Pastor: "_the deaths were unfortunate, but they were part of god's plan_"


----------



## fooferdoggie

Yoused said:


> And, they have the covid stupid in Canada too
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/nova-scotia-gospel-light-baptist-church-covid-outbreak-1.6250957
> 
> 
> 
> Pastor: "_the deaths were unfortunate, but they were part of god's plan_"



not sure where in the Bible it says to sacrifice three to save one.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Is the wife of a man who ignored medical experts and sued demanding she get ivermectin for Covid still alive? Neigh








						Florida Woman Who Sued for Ivermectin Dies From COVID
					

A Florida teacher hospitalized with COVID-19 has died after her husband unsuccessfully sued to force doctors to treat her with ivermectin, a drug popular among some skeptics of accepted coronavirus treatments despite a lack of studies proving its effectiveness




					www.nbcmiami.com


----------



## Edd

fooferdoggie said:


> Is the wife of a man who ignored medical experts and sued demanding she get ivermectin for Covid still alive? Neigh
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Florida Woman Who Sued for Ivermectin Dies From COVID
> 
> 
> A Florida teacher hospitalized with COVID-19 has died after her husband unsuccessfully sued to force doctors to treat her with ivermectin, a drug popular among some skeptics of accepted coronavirus treatments despite a lack of studies proving its effectiveness
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nbcmiami.com



I was feeling all judgy for a minute, but the article doesn’t mention if she was vaccinated or not.


----------



## Joe

Edd said:


> I was feeling all judgy for a minute, but the article doesn’t mention if she was vaccinated or not.




I'll be judgy for you. 

#ThotsAndPrayers


----------



## Runs For Fun

I’d be willing to bet that anyone pushing for Ivermectin as a treatment are anti-vaxxers.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Runs For Fun said:


> I’d be willing to bet that anyone pushing for Ivermectin as a treatment are anti-vaxxers.




Add that to "If she had walked out of the hospital she could have had the medication" and a picture does start to form.    It's not proof, but there's reasons to lean one direction over another.


----------



## Herdfan

P_X said:


> I'll keep it in mind next time you get caught on an "inconsistency."




Well you know what they say about "A foolish consistency........"

Anyway, it is not inconsistent.

There are multiple variables here and even more combinations.

The origination:

1. Natural
2. Man-made

The release:

A. Natural
B. Accidental
C. On purpose

So the combinations would be:

1A.  Naturally occurring and spread to humans in the wet markets.
1B.  Occurred naturally, but was being studied with our tax-dollars in a lab and accidentally got out.
1C.  Occurred naturally, but was being studied in a lab and was released on purpose.
2A.  Not likely, might not even been possible
2B.  Virus was lab created, but released accidentally.
2C.  Virus was lab created and released on purpose.

So based on these combinations, I am still correct in that we don't know how it came about and was still released on purpose.  Maybe if the CCP had been a bit more open with their data we would know more.



P_X said:


> I found that post holographically hilarious. If we could expect this request to be fulfilled he couldn't complain about his well-known post history getting him on an ignore list that he also seems quite irritated about. At the end of the day it's all about pretending to be a victim of some sort, while spewing malignant nonsense.




Not irritated at all, just a bit confused.  To be honest, not really sure how the whole "Ignore Posts" works as I have never done it.  Do you see that I posted, but the content is covered so you have to accept to view it or do you not even see I posted anything?  If it is covered, yet you have to accept to see, which you obviously have done, why are you ignoring something that you end up seeing anyway.  It just makes no sense.


----------



## Herdfan

Alli said:


> They problem is that the NG has a different setup than the regular Army. Each state’s guard is led by the TAG, but the TAG is not necessarily a military person, just a political appointment. We had one here in AL for a short while, whose first experience in uniform was when he was appointed. I think that was the one that I got in trouble for criticizing. It was worth it.




So am I correct in that no one in the Army COC has any power over anyone in the NG until formally activated by the Secretary of the Army for a Federal Mission?


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Well you know what they say about "A foolish consistency........"
> 
> Anyway, it is not inconsistent.
> 
> There are multiple variables here and even more combinations.
> 
> The origination:
> 
> 1. Natural
> 2. Man-made
> 
> The release:
> 
> A. Natural
> B. Accidental
> C. On purpose
> 
> So the combinations would be:
> 
> 1A.  Naturally occurring and spread to humans in the wet markets.
> 1B.  Occurred naturally, but was being studied with our tax-dollars in a lab and accidentally got out.
> 1C.  Occurred naturally, but was being studied in a lab and was released on purpose.
> 2A.  Not likely, might not even been possible
> 2B.  Virus was lab created, but released accidentally.
> 2C.  Virus was lab created and released on purpose.
> 
> So based on these combinations, I am still correct in that we don't know how it came about and was still released on purpose.  Maybe if the CCP had been a bit more open with their data we would know more.



Keep in mind that although you list a lot of them, those possibilities are not of equal *probability*.

It is extremely unlikely that COVID was created in a lab, and also highly unlikely that it was released from a lab of any kind.



> SARS-CoV-2 emerged essentially as predicted: a natural event associated with either direct transmission of a bat coronavirus to humans or indirect transmission to humans via an intermediate host such as a Malaysian pangolin (_Manis javanica_) or another, yet-to-be-identified mammal.28–31
> 
> It should be clarified that theories about a hypothetical man-made origin of SARS-CoV-2 have been thoroughly discredited by multiple coronavirus experts.21,28,29 SARS-CoV-2 contains neither the genetic fingerprints of any of the reverse genetics systems that have been used to engineer coronaviruses nor does it contain genetic sequences that would have been “forward engineered” from preexisting viruses, including the genetically closest sarbecoviruses. That is, SARS-CoV-2 is unlike any previously identified coronavirus from which it could have been engineered. Moreover, the SARS-CoV-2 receptor-binding domain, which has affinity for cells of various mammals, binds to human ACE2 receptors via a novel mechanism.
> 
> Engineering such a virus would have required 1) published or otherwise available scientific knowledge that did not exist until after COVID-19 recognition; 2) a failure to follow obvious engineering pathways, resulting in an imperfectly constructed virus; and 3) an ability to genetically engineer a new virus without leaving fingerprints of the engineering. Furthermore, the 12 amino acid furin-cleavage site insertion between the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein’s S1 and S2 domains, which some have alleged to be a sign of genetic engineering, is found in other bat and human coronaviruses in nature, probably arising via naturally occurring recombination.24
> 
> It is also highly unlikely that SARS-CoV-2 was released from a laboratory by accident because no laboratory had the virus nor did its genetic sequence exist in any sequence database before its initial GenBank deposition (early January 2020). China’s laboratory safety practices, policies, training, and engineering are equivalent to those of the United States and other developed countries,32 making viral “escape” extremely unlikely, and of course impossible without a viral isolate present. SARS-CoV-2 shares genetic properties with many other sarbecoviruses, lies fully within their genetic cluster, and is thus a virus that emerged naturally.












						The Origin of COVID-19 and Why It Matters
					

The COVID-19 pandemic is among the deadliest infectious diseases to have emerged in recent history. As with all past pandemics, the specific mechanism of its emergence in humans remains unknown. Nevertheless, a large body of virologic, epidemiologic, ...




					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




Also, the statement about China hiding information - it is possible they are hiding information. They have a very bad history when it comes to things like that. But scientists can tell a lot just from examining the virus. You should rely on that instead of assuming some evil geniuses engineered a deadly virus so well that other scientists cannot find the fingerprint of their supposed genetic engineering. Choose the science over trust/distrust of the Chinese government.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> So am I correct in that no one in the Army COC has any power over anyone in the NG until formally activated by the Secretary of the Army for a Federal Mission?



Yes and no. They must follow all regular Army protocols…including vaccinations. That way they can fit in seamlessly with the “regular” Army when called up.


----------



## Huntn

I got my COVID booster (3rd Pfizer shot) yesterday at my grocery store. I’ve never seen this many people milling around the pharmacy before. I asked the nurse how many shots was she giving today, and she said about 60. This morning I woke up, and no adverse feelings, can I assume this is because my existing antibodies beat the vaccine up?   I will be swimming today.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> So based on these combinations, I am still correct in that we don't know how it came about and was still released on purpose.  Maybe if the CCP had been a bit more open with their data we would know more.



Another follow-up on this, check out the post I put in the general COVID thread. 

TLDR; virus is almost certainly naturally occurring and first started affecting humans on Dec 11 in a Wuhan fish market.









						How can there not be a COVID-19 thread?
					

More cold water dumped on the “lab leak” hypothesis for COVID-19’s origin.  https://www.cbsnews.com/news/origin-covid-19-us-scientist-patient-zero-wuhan-china-evidence-market/  This was from a scientist that had previously thought it might be a lab leak. Because he’s an actual scientist, he...




					talkedabout.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

another brilliant one.
Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA​









						Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA
					

"Now you’ll want to know what’s in my DNA,” Republican Winsome Sears said when asked about whether she has received a COVID vaccine.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## rdrr

Huntn said:


> I got my COVID booster (3rd Pfizer shot) yesterday at my grocery store. I’ve never seen this many people milling around the pharmacy before. I asked the nurse how many shots was she giving today, and she said about 60. This morning I woke up, and no adverse feelings, can I assume this is because my existing antibodies beat the vaccine up?   I will be swimming today.




I had a day of feeling under the weather on my booster, but of course I did a mix of mrna shots (Pfizer for the first 2, and then Moderna for the booster).   Also one slight side effect is my thumb where I have had mild arthritis had a flare up about three days after.   It has been subsiding, but it was really was noticeable at first.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> another brilliant one.
> Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA
> 
> 
> "Now you’ll want to know what’s in my DNA,” Republican Winsome Sears said when asked about whether she has received a COVID vaccine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com



Manipulative and liar as expected.


----------



## Huntn

rdrr said:


> I had a day of feeling under the weather on my booster, but of course I did a mix of mrna shots (Pfizer for the first 2, and then Moderna for the booster).   Also one slight side effect is my thumb where I have had mild arthritis had a flare up about three days after.   It has been subsiding, but it was really was noticeable at first.



Maybe that is good from an effectiveness aspect?


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> another brilliant one.
> Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA
> 
> 
> "Now you’ll want to know what’s in my DNA,” Republican Winsome Sears said when asked about whether she has received a COVID vaccine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com



This is what Virginians voted for. No takebacks…


----------



## JayMysteri0

We need to treat Americans like Americans when it comes to Covid?


----------



## fooferdoggie

​What if we run out of Herman Cain awards? is there an unlimited supply?​These Fools Thought a COVID Party Sounded Fun. Now They Are on Respirators.​








						These Fools Thought a COVID Party Sounded Fun. Now They Are on Respirators.
					

Investigators have launched an inquiry into a series of “COVID parties” in northern Italy where people try to get the deadly virus to get around vaccine mandates.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> Keep in mind that although you list a lot of them, those possibilities are not of equal *probability*.
> 
> It is extremely unlikely that COVID was created in a lab, and also highly unlikely that it was released from a lab of any kind.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Origin of COVID-19 and Why It Matters
> 
> 
> The COVID-19 pandemic is among the deadliest infectious diseases to have emerged in recent history. As with all past pandemics, the specific mechanism of its emergence in humans remains unknown. Nevertheless, a large body of virologic, epidemiologic, ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also, the statement about China hiding information - it is possible they are hiding information. They have a very bad history when it comes to things like that. But scientists can tell a lot just from examining the virus. You should rely on that instead of assuming some evil geniuses engineered a deadly virus so well that other scientists cannot find the fingerprint of their supposed genetic engineering. Choose the science over trust/distrust of the Chinese government.



As far as I know, there are no indicators that COVID-19 was man made. And if not man made more unlikely it would be in lab or just as likely that it was introduced by a dead animal at a market.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> We need to treat Americans like Americans when it comes to Covid?



I’ve not found anyone who would give up their socialized health care for a greed driven capitalis, corporatist system. My wife did a sleep study last night, $4700, after insurance paid a portion, a real bargain at $1200.  If you had asked me how much a sleep study should cost, hook you up to a monitor and record while you sleep, I’d guess maybe $500 tops.


----------



## Huntn

Edd said:


> I was feeling all judgy for a minute, but the article doesn’t mention if she was vaccinated or not.



Most likely NOT.


----------



## ronntaylor

fooferdoggie said:


> another brilliant one.
> Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Virginia's Lt. Gov.-Elect Likens Vaccine Status To Inquiring About One's DNA
> 
> 
> "Now you’ll want to know what’s in my DNA,” Republican Winsome Sears said when asked about whether she has received a COVID vaccine.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com



Back in Virginia. Disappointed to see the landlords had yard signs for this fool in the hallway. They claimed late last month that the signs were just dropped off. Guess they know how we feel about the GQP in the county and thought they'd be reasonable folk. I think all they care about is tax issues. Certainly hope these educators aren't swayed by anti-CRT rhetoric.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Shaking my head…









						Seven From Anti-Vax Doctors’ COVID Conference Fall Sick Within Days
					

That includes Bruce Boros, who claimed ivermectin was keeping him healthy and said he wanted to smack his own father for getting the vaccine.



					www.thedailybeast.com
				




Seven From Anti-Vax Doctors’ COVID Conference Fall Sick Within Days​


> “I have been on ivermectin for 16 months, my wife and I,” Dr. Bruce Boros declared at the end of the meeting at the World Equestrian Center in Ocala. “I have never felt healthier in my life.”





> Two days later, the 71-year-old cardiologist fell ill with COVID-19, according to the organizer of the one-day gathering and two other people with direct knowledge.





> …Boros remained seriously ill at his Key West home, according to people who know him but who asked not to be identified.





> …However Boros is faring, there remains the question of why he became seriously ill in the first place if ivermectin is the wonder drug the anti-vaccine crowd claims it is, rather than primarily a treatment for parasites and head lice in humans, as well as a horse dewormer.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Man any day they are going to run out of Herman Cain award?


----------



## Eric

The person being intubated is a friend of a friend and she as a vocal antivaxxer who spent all her time on FB railing against masks and the vaccine. Thoughts and prayers are just as good though.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
*Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending “contamination parties” which uh…we don’t really get.* 

According to the NOS, certain groups of people are intentionally getting themselves sick to receive a recovery certificate which will allow them entry into public venues for a year. 

Meaning that some people would much rather go to the trouble of actually getting COVID-19 than getting the free vaccine.  

Contamination parties​“Contamination parties” were being hosted on websites like jaikwilcorona.com, where people could meet each other to get infected with the virus. 








						Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
					

Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending "contamination parties" which uh...we don't really get. 😐




					dutchreview.com


----------



## Edd

fooferdoggie said:


> Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
> *Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending “contamination parties” which uh…we don’t really get.*
> 
> According to the NOS, certain groups of people are intentionally getting themselves sick to receive a recovery certificate which will allow them entry into public venues for a year.
> 
> Meaning that some people would much rather go to the trouble of actually getting COVID-19 than getting the free vaccine.
> 
> Contamination parties​“Contamination parties” were being hosted on websites like jaikwilcorona.com, where people could meet each other to get infected with the virus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
> 
> 
> Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending "contamination parties" which uh...we don't really get. 😐
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dutchreview.com



The need to be a contrarian is deep and mysterious.


----------



## SuperMatt

House minority leader Kevin McCarthy attempts to blame Biden for the COVID-19 resurgence:









						G.O.P. Fights Covid Mandates, Then Blames Biden as Cases Rise
					

Republicans have fought mask requirements and vaccine mandates for months, but as coronavirus infections again rise, they are blaming the president for failing to end the health crisis.




					www.nytimes.com
				






> As of mid-September, 90 percent of adult Democrats had been vaccinated, compared with 58 percent of adult Republicans.
> 
> Yet Mr. McCarthy, the House Republican leader, pressed his point: “I took President Biden at his word; I took him at his word when he said he was going to get Covid under control,” he declared in the dead of night. “Unfortunately, more Americans have died this year than last year under Covid.”




The GOP convinced many of their voters not to take the vaccine, and block vaccine mandates in states they govern. The effects are hundreds of thousands dead. Blaming Biden for this is even dumber than thinking “Let’s Go Brandon” is clever.



> As Mr. McCarthy faulted Mr. Biden for failing to stop the virus, he also criticized him for demanding people get vaccinated, even health care workers.



What?


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> The GOP convinced many of their voters not to take the vaccine, and block vaccine mandates in states they govern. The effects are hundreds of thousands dead. Blaming Biden for this is even dumber than thinking “Let’s Go Brandon” is clever.
> 
> 
> What?



Ya magic thinking there. maybe Biden should have handed out tubes of horse paste pumpkin spice flavor right now.  GOP the brains of politics.


----------



## Joe

fooferdoggie said:


> Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
> *Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending “contamination parties” which uh…we don’t really get.*
> 
> According to the NOS, certain groups of people are intentionally getting themselves sick to receive a recovery certificate which will allow them entry into public venues for a year.
> 
> Meaning that some people would much rather go to the trouble of actually getting COVID-19 than getting the free vaccine.
> 
> Contamination parties​“Contamination parties” were being hosted on websites like jaikwilcorona.com, where people could meet each other to get infected with the virus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
> 
> 
> Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending "contamination parties" which uh...we don't really get. 😐
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dutchreview.com




I remember we had Contamination Parties last year. It's not just a Dutch thing.


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
> *Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending “contamination parties” which uh…we don’t really get.*
> 
> According to the NOS, certain groups of people are intentionally getting themselves sick to receive a recovery certificate which will allow them entry into public venues for a year.
> 
> Meaning that some people would much rather go to the trouble of actually getting COVID-19 than getting the free vaccine.
> 
> Contamination parties​“Contamination parties” were being hosted on websites like jaikwilcorona.com, where people could meet each other to get infected with the virus.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some Dutchies are intentionally infecting themselves with COVID-19
> 
> 
> Yep, you read that right. Some Nederlanders are getting COVID-19 on purpose by attending "contamination parties" which uh...we don't really get. 😐
> 
> 
> 
> 
> dutchreview.com




I'd chip in for one of those parties.  Not to be cold, but the sooner we have no unvaccinated people running around, the better.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1463278877787275274/


----------



## Clix Pix

I have no plans this year for Thanksgiving, but if I did, it would not be with anyone who was not vaccinated.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Clix Pix said:


> I have no plans this year for Thanksgiving, but if I did, it would not be with anyone who was not vaccinated.



ya our granddaughter got everyone sick with a cold or flue or such. so no get togethers no one feels like it. I got it the least and can still work. well I would have to work anyway but still.


----------



## Runs For Fun

LOL maybe this might actually make it through some of these idiot’s thick skulls


----------



## Alli

Runs For Fun said:


> LOL maybe this might actually make it through some of these idiot’s thick skulls



Jay beat ya by two posts.


----------



## fooferdoggie

its nice covid likes these guys so much.

Marcus Lamb, 64, Dallas, TX, Televangelist, anti-vaxxer and anti-vaxx promoter, ICU with COVID.​
According to social media posts (below), Marcus is in the ICU with COVID. This is significant because Marcus is responsible for promoting and spreading more anti-vaxx and pro-alternative treatment disinformation to more people than anyone on sorry-anti-vaxxer so far. In fact, he's claimed that he and his wife Joni have been taking Ivermectin, Hydroxychloroquine, and vitamins and minerals as a preventative. Apparently that didn't work out for him. Marcus and Joni own Daystar Television Network the second largest Christian Network in the World behind CBN. Throughout the pandemic, they have been hosting and promoting the most notorious anti-vaxxers in the world, many of whom are members of the despicable American Frontline Doctors which is being investigated by Congress for fraudulent practices and spreading misinformation.









						Marcus Lamb, 64, Dallas, TX, Televangelist, anti-vaxxer and anti-vaxx promoter, dead from COVID.
					

UPDATE (11/30/21): Marcus has succumbed to COVID. See Below. Original Post (11/14/21): According to social media posts (below), Marcus is in the ICU with COVID. This is significant because Marcus is responsible for promoting and spreading more anti-vaxx and pro-alternative treatment...




					www.sorryantivaxxer.com


----------



## Thomas Veil

fooferdoggie said:


> According to the NOS, certain groups of people are intentionally getting themselves sick to receive a recovery certificate which will allow them entry into public venues for a year.



Gives new meaning to the phrase “dying to see that concert”.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Alli said:


> Jay beat ya by two posts.



Wow how did I miss that


----------



## Eric

Got called out by this nutjob antivaxxer and I've been replying with links to the CDC  They live in a bubble of ignorance and I don't think any real information gets to them. Social media is filled with them and it's really too bad that the likes of FB and Twitter allow it to propagate the way they do.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1463926843879403521/


----------



## Clix Pix

There just some awfully stupid people in this world.....   Well, maybe Miss "Erin Elizabeth Health Nut News" will change her tune when either she or a member of her family winds up in the ICU or the morgue.....  Don't waste your time on people like that.  Let them do what they want and then they will have to deal with the consequences.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

An interesting article I read the other day illustrating the frustrating reality of the anti-vaxx idiocy that has swept through social media and brainwashed people into risking their lives.









						ICU is full of the unvaccinated – my patience with them is wearing thin | Anonymous
					

Most of the resources we are devoting to Covid in hospital are being spent on people who have not had jab, says an NHS consultant




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## MEJHarrison

Eric said:


> Got called out by this nutjob antivaxxer and I've been replying with links to the CDC  They live in a bubble of ignorance and I don't think any real information gets to them. Social media is filled with them and it's really too bad that the likes of FB and Twitter allow it to propagate the way they do.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1463926843879403521/




When I saw "@unhealthytruth", I pretty much didn't need to read any longer.  That's a giant red flashing light that says "IGNORE THIS CONTENT".  It's like branding your cigarettes "Death Sticks".


----------



## Eric

MacRumors, where you're not allowed to say "sure Jan" but you're free to spread lies about the vaccine.


----------



## Pumbaa

Eric said:


> MacRumors, where you're not allowed to say "sure Jan" but you're free to spread lies about the vaccine.
> 
> View attachment 10035



Has anyone tried reporting the post? Multiple other posters have asked for citations/examples and none have been provided even though the antivaxxer has been active in the thread.


----------



## Eric

Pumbaa said:


> Has anyone tried reporting the post? Multiple other posters have asked for citations/examples and none have been provided even though the antivaxxer has been active in the thread.



No, I don't bother with reporting and they've made their policy about allowing it clear anyway.


----------



## Cmaier

Eric said:


> No, I don't bother with reporting and they've made their policy about allowing it clear anyway.



I don’t see the issue. He’s right. I got three doses of the vaccine and now I grew a tail. They don’t tell you about the tail-growing.


----------



## Eric

Cmaier said:


> I don’t see the issue. He’s right. I got three doses of the vaccine and now I grew a tail. They don’t tell you about the tail-growing.



Gotta read that fine print.


----------



## Eric

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1463187577129869312/


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1463187577129869312/



What’s a gas station?


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> What’s a gas station?



I get the feeling you would get the same look had you pulled up in an electric car to go in and get a bag of chips.


----------



## Renzatic

Cmaier said:


> I don’t see the issue. He’s right. I got three doses of the vaccine and now I grew a tail. They don’t tell you about the tail-growing.




You got a tail? LUCKY! All I got were a pair of gills under my ribcage.

I wouldn't be complaining about if they actually worked, but they don't. They're just for decoration.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> Got called out by this nutjob antivaxxer and I've been replying with links to the CDC  They live in a bubble of ignorance and I don't think any real information gets to them. Social media is filled with them and it's really too bad that the likes of FB and Twitter allow it to propagate the way they do.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1463926843879403521/



It's a pretty funny response. "Holistic doctor Joe Rogan style" reminded me of this holistic animorph


----------



## Eric

P_X said:


> It's a pretty funny response. "Holistic doctor Joe Rogan style" reminded me of this holistic animorph




Here he is owning a Lib who got vaccinated.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> MacRumors, where you're not allowed to say "sure Jan" but you're free to spread lies about the vaccine.
> 
> View attachment 10035



First sentence is technically correct, but the real risk of undercalling vaccine side effects is ignoring _inconveniences of_ some people, whereas overcalling those ignores the_ untimely death_ of a lot of people. I prefer to be correct, but if I err, I think inconvenience is a lot nicer than death. 

Second sentence is hilariously loaded:
1. It implies that there's only one vaccine tech used, whereas there are 2 completely different techs used for the approved ones (mRNA vs. adenovirus packed DNA).
2. All approved vaccines are evidently more effective than the gold standard of therapy we've had (nothing, lol). This is actually a definition of a successful phase III
3. Not sure what a "robust [drug] design" means, but I do know that it's like fantasy football without phase 1/2 trials
4. There's absolutely no currently known drug that is near the cost-efficiency of vaccinations.

Third sentence is like: well, we could start with everyone getting vaccinated, FFS. 

But hey, this guy "is an event manager and producer, with experience managing the biggest brand names and multi-million dollar campaigns" so he's gotta know what he's talking about, LOL.  


			https://amacfa.com


----------



## Cmaier

P_X said:


> First sentence is technically correct, but the real risk of undercalling vaccine side effects is ignoring _inconveniences of_ some people, whereas overcalling those ignores the_ untimely death_ of a lot of people. I prefer to be correct, but if I err, I think inconvenience is a lot nicer than death.
> 
> Second sentence is hilariously loaded:
> 1. It implies that there's only one vaccine tech used, whereas there are 2 completely different techs used for the approved ones (mRNA vs. adenovirus packed DNA).
> 2. All approved vaccines are evidently more effective than the gold standard of therapy we've had (nothing, lol). This is actually a definition of a successful phase III
> 3. Not sure what a "robust [drug] design" means, but I do know that it's like fantasy football without phase 1/2 trials
> 4. There's absolutely no currently known drug that is near the cost-efficiency of vaccinations.
> 
> Third sentence is like: well, we could start with everyone getting vaccinated, FFS.
> 
> But hey, this guy "is an event manager and producer, with experience managing the biggest brand names and multi-million dollar campaigns" so he's gotta know what he's talking about, LOL.
> 
> 
> https://amacfa.com




that guy may have the most punchable face I’ve seen.


----------



## Renzatic

Cmaier said:


> that guy may have the most punchable face I’ve seen.




Punchable face aside, I'm left wondering what it is he's trying to sell us here.


----------



## Cmaier

Renzatic said:


> Punchable face aside, I'm left wondering what it is he's trying to sell us here.



The same thing any member of any cult is trying to sell potential new recruits.


----------



## Renzatic

Cmaier said:


> The same thing any member of any cult is trying to sell potential new recruits.




That's literally what it is. He's basically selling an image of professionalism with no real substance behind it. He hints towards the availability of a number of company specific iOS apps, but mentions none by name, or provides any links to the App Store. Shows shots of him in front of a camera, but has no portfolio detailing his work. If you want to find out more, he only provides you a link to his email.

...stuff like this really irks me. I have no idea why, but it does.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

P_X said:


> First sentence is technically correct, but the real risk of undercalling vaccine side effects is ignoring _inconveniences of_ some people, whereas overcalling those ignores the_ untimely death_ of a lot of people. I prefer to be correct, but if I err, I think inconvenience is a lot nicer than death.
> 
> Second sentence is hilariously loaded:
> 1. It implies that there's only one vaccine tech used, whereas there are 2 completely different techs used for the approved ones (mRNA vs. adenovirus packed DNA).
> 2. All approved vaccines are evidently more effective than the gold standard of therapy we've had (nothing, lol). This is actually a definition of a successful phase III
> 3. Not sure what a "robust [drug] design" means, but I do know that it's like fantasy football without phase 1/2 trials
> 4. There's absolutely no currently known drug that is near the cost-efficiency of vaccinations.
> 
> Third sentence is like: well, we could start with everyone getting vaccinated, FFS.
> 
> But hey, this guy "is an event manager and producer, with experience managing the biggest brand names and multi-million dollar campaigns" so he's gotta know what he's talking about, LOL.
> 
> 
> https://amacfa.com




He looks like an absolute weapon


----------



## User.45

Renzatic said:


> That's literally what it is. He's basically selling an image of professionalism with no real substance behind it. He hints towards the availability of a number of company specific iOS apps, but mentions none by name, or provides any links to the App Store. Shows shots of him in front of a camera, but has no portfolio detailing his work. If you want to find out more, he only provides you a link to his email.
> 
> ...stuff like this really irks me. I have no idea why, but it does.



Well, he does have the ultimate indicator of multimillion dollar clients: a gmail account for contact.
Based on which it doesn't take genius to dig this masterpiece up:






And then you know that by more robustly designed [whatever] he meant hydroxychloroquine.


----------



## Cmaier

P_X said:


> Well, he does have the ultimate indicator of multimillion dollar clients: a gmail account for contact.
> Based on which it doesn't take genius to dig this masterpiece up:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And then you know that by more robustly designed [whatever] he meant hydroxychloroquine.



Figures. All the other signs of being in the Trump death cult were already present.


----------



## User.45

Cmaier said:


> Figures. All the other signs of being in the Trump death cult were already present.



A dive into his twitter completes the experience.

Honestly though, nothing indicates the insanity better than COVID disinformation being embraced along party lines.


----------



## Clix Pix

Is it my imagination or are we seeing more and more stupidity at the other place?   Not just around COVID-19 and vaccinations, or Trump, etc., but other topics as well.    I saw one post today where someone was apparently running a major OS update on his machine, a laptop, and with only a few minutes left in the updating process,  for whatever mindless, idiotic reason he pulled the power plug, thinking that things would just continue on using battery power.  Well, DUH, the whole process stopped and he was surprised when afterward all he gets now is the infamous question mark and slash rather than an OS screen......

Another example that I saw today is from someone I already have long suspected is seriously lacking in the IQ department, so not a big surprise when he started yet another new thread in the Digital Photography subforum, claiming that he couldn't find the POTD "forum....."     He was eager to share a photo he'd taken with "Mr Powershot."  

Yet another example is from some guy who frequently asks a lot of questions and who also rants about incompetent people at AppleCare / Support or even other places -- he seems surprised when people aren't responsive in the way he thinks they should be and accuses them of giving him wrong answers or no answers at all, fobbing him off, etc., etc.  It's very clear just reading his posts that he needs to do some personal self-evaluation and undergo an attitude adjustment.  He's every retailer's and customer service person's nightmare......


----------



## Renzatic

Clix Pix said:


> Another example that I saw today is from someone I already have long suspected is seriously lacking in the IQ department, so not a big surprise when he started yet another new thread in the Digital Photography subforum, claiming that he couldn't find the POTD "forum....." He was eager to share a photo he'd taken with "Mr Powershot."




Out of curiosity, I hopped over to MR to see if I could find this guy.

...it's JWolf, yall.


----------



## Hrafn

Renzatic said:


> Out of curiosity, I hopped over to MR to see if I could find this guy.
> 
> ...it's JWolf, yall.



Yeah, but hajime is the support complainer, and at least one of those sounds like iHorsehead.  Yeah, @Clix Pix, more than the usual stupid running around.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Clix Pix said:


> Is it my imagination or are we seeing more and more stupidity at the other place?



Well of course you are. The smart people are over here.


----------



## Pumbaa

Clix Pix said:


> Is it my imagination or are we seeing more and more stupidity at the other place?



Possibly. I for one have mostly written it off as selection bias; I rarely browse that forum unless something’s been mentioned here.

On the other hand, letting a certain selection of trolls troll and liars lie while penalizing other posters for just about anything  can’t be good in the long run.


----------



## Clix Pix

Hrafn said:


> Yeah, but hajime is the support complainer, and at least one of those sounds like iHorsehead.  Yeah, @Clix Pix, more than the usual stupid running around.




Yep, Hajime is the incessant questioner and complainer and JWolf is the irritating nuisance who has been plaguing the Digital Photography subforum with his stupid threads and inane questions for a while now....    Asking questions is perfectly fine, of course, but then neither of these characters seems to know how to appropriately deal with answers that are offered.   I didn't pay attention to the user name of the OP of the thread/post  whining about his OS update having abruptly aborted (thanks to his own stupidity).   I've seen that iHorsehead chap in a couple of threads, and I quite agree -- he's no prize, either!


----------



## SuperMatt

Is this guy really a doctor?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1464697497042006024/

So, what’s the theory here? Democrats created the Omicron variant in a lab and then flew to South Africa and infected people there with it?

And elections are a year away… so maybe this guy needs a calendar? Or maybe he just needs to lay off the bottle. I remember his nomination to be head of the VA was held up because of reports of excessive drinking on the job. Only the best people embrace the MAGA movement.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wait.  What the...?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1465215272705568768/


----------



## Eric

Lrrr's had it...


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1465510465908445191/


----------



## Eric

Wait, so thoughts and prayers along with that cocktail of everything excluding the vaccine didn't work? The hell you say!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1465754699819274241/


----------



## Clix Pix

Good, another anti-vaxxer bites the dust......     COVID-19 is doing a good job so far of cleaning up/purging the population, eh?


----------



## Eric

Clix Pix said:


> Good, another anti-vaxxer bites the dust......     COVID-19 is doing a good job so far of cleaning up/purging the population, eh?



That's my wife's take too but I personally find it sad and completely unnecessary that anyone should die now that there is a vaccine. Dying for your political view just to stick it to the libs is hardly worth it.


----------



## Clix Pix

If this were back just over a year ago, when we had no vaccine options yet available and people were falling ill and dying -- well, that was different, wasn't it?  No options, no choices for the general public to make. Once the vaccines became available, especially when they were accessible to most of the population and it clearly became an individual's choice to be vaccinated or not, well, that paints a different picture, shines a different light on things, doesn't it?   If someone refuses vaccination, well, he or she is going to have to deal with the consequences, and if those consequences include illness and dying, too bad, too sad, because that could have been prevented or the impact of falling ill at least ameliorated and lessened.  As we are seeing time and time again, you can't fix "stupid," and it sure looks as though a lot of stupid people are dying unnecessarily......


----------



## User.45

Clix Pix said:


> If this were back just over a year ago, when we had no vaccine options yet available and people were falling ill and dying -- well, that was different, wasn't it?  No options, no choices for the general public to make. Once the vaccines became available, especially when they were accessible to most of the population and it clearly became an individual's choice to be vaccinated or not, well, that paints a different picture, shines a different light on things, doesn't it?   If someone refuses vaccination, well, he or she is going to have to deal with the consequences, and if those consequences include illness and dying, too bad, too sad, because that could have been prevented or the impact of falling ill at least ameliorated and lessened.  As we are seeing time and time again, you can't fix "stupid," and it sure looks as though a lot of stupid people are dying unnecessarily......



My empathy for antivaxxers beyond the ethical minimum, is long gone and I generally agree. But i want to point out that there are people on immunosuppressive therapies who can't produce antibodies against SARS-CoV2 even after multiple shots. So this might be a choice for most, but it is not for many.


----------



## Clix Pix

Yes, people who for whatever good medical reasons cannot be vaccinated are in a different category, as they don' t really have the choice that the rest of the population does.  My lack of empathy and frank disgust is aimed strictly at those who refuse to be vaccinated and they have no good reasons for this.


----------



## MEJHarrison

P_X said:


> My empathy for antivaxxers beyond the ethical minimum, is long gone and I generally agree. But i want to point out that there are people on immunosuppressive therapies who can't produce antibodies against SARS-CoV2 even after multiple shots. So this might be a choice for most, but it is not for many.




That's a valid point.  All the same, they're not the "COVID Stupid" using their power to spread misinformation, causing scenes at grocery stores and school board meetings, and generally being asses about not taking the vaccine.  The people you speak of are unlikely (my guess) to show up in the types of stories we see posted here.

When I went to get my booster a few weeks back, it was a drive-thru for both testing and vaccination.  It was tough seeing people drive up and get a swab instead of a needle.  As easy and fun as it might be at times to blow off steam here over some stupid people, it was much harder seeing it on an individual level.  They might have been anti-vax fools who's luck ran out, or an innocent person who came in contact with a fool.  Regardless, it's easy to not care about "all those people" who won't get a free shot.  But in my experience, it's much harder not to care when it's an actual person in front of you.  I found it to be a good reminder that it's hitting people and not just generating amusing news stories for us to laugh at.  Whether what's coming is deserved or not, it sounds like a horrible experience for *anyone* to have to go through if things don't go well.

That said, I am happy that preacher-man won't be able to spread his nonsense to the gullible.  Hopefully that saves a few more lives in the long run.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

Here’s a sad story of a British guy who refused the vaccine ‘until more was learned about it’ and effectively died very young due to his own stupidity. 









						The life and tragic death of John Eyers – a fitness fanatic who refused the vaccine
					

He did triathlons, bodybuilding and mountain climbing and became sceptical of the Covid jab. Then, at 42, he contracted the virus




					www.theguardian.com
				




So sad for his family that are left behind and so unnecessary when we are all being offered protection. I bet his last thoughts were absolutely full of regret.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I'm sorry, what was the name of this thread again?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1466122257713881090/

Oh, yeah...


----------



## Edd

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> Here’s a sad story of a British guy who refused the vaccine ‘until more was learned about it’ and effectively died very young due to his own stupidity.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The life and tragic death of John Eyers – a fitness fanatic who refused the vaccine
> 
> 
> He did triathlons, bodybuilding and mountain climbing and became sceptical of the Covid jab. Then, at 42, he contracted the virus
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So sad for his family that are left behind and so unnecessary when we are all being offered protection. I bet his last thoughts were absolutely full of regret.



Read the story. I’m trying to feel bad for him but when I got to the point where he’s being pissy about wearing a mask in the gym I’m thinking “fuck this guy”.

Not being argumentative, just reporting my gut reaction.


----------



## SuperMatt

We have discussed in other threads the leaders of Missouri are terrible people based on their treatment of the wrongfully convicted and the pardon of white-power types who threatened peaceful protesters with guns.

But if you needed further convincing, here’s a story about them hiding results from a study that confirmed masks saved lives in their state.









						Missouri health department found mask mandates work, but didn’t make findings public
					

Jurisdictions with mask mandates averaged 15.8 cases per day for every 100,000 residents, compared to 21.7 in unmasked communities.




					news.stlpublicradio.org
				






> Mask mandates saved lives and prevented COVID-19 infections in Missouri’s biggest cities during the worst part of the delta variant wave, an analysis by the state Department of Health and Senior Services shows.
> 
> But the analysis, conducted at the request of Gov. Mike Parson’s office in early November, was never made public and was only obtained by The Missouri Independent and the Documenting COVID-19 project after a Sunshine Law request to the department.



These people have the gumption to call themselves “pro-life.”

PS:



> “Jackson County has imposed an unlawful, arbitrary, and capricious mask mandate that is not supported by the data or the science,” the opening sentence to Schmitt’s lawsuit against Jackson County states.



Gee I wonder why he wanted the data and science hidden…


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> I'm sorry, what was the name of this thread again?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1466122257713881090/
> 
> Oh, yeah...



That look on his face says it all.


----------



## Edd

SuperMatt said:


> We have discussed in other threads the leaders of Missouri are terrible people based on their treatment of the wrongfully convicted and the pardon of white-power types who threatened peaceful protesters with guns.
> 
> But if you needed further convincing, here’s a story about them hiding results from a study that confirmed masks saved lives in their state.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Missouri health department found mask mandates work, but didn’t make findings public
> 
> 
> Jurisdictions with mask mandates averaged 15.8 cases per day for every 100,000 residents, compared to 21.7 in unmasked communities.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.stlpublicradio.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These people have the gumption to call themselves “pro-life.”
> 
> PS:
> 
> 
> Gee I wonder why he wanted the data and science hidden…



I lived in Missouri as a kid and have visited as an adult. Can confirm it suuuuuuuucks. 

One caveat: The St Louis Arch is actually kinda cool.


----------



## ronntaylor

Edd said:


> One caveat: The St Louis Arch is actually kinda cool.



It was cool finally getting a chance to visit the Arch. Then I read a detailed history of it and was bummed out for the rest of my trip, and ever since.


----------



## Edd

ronntaylor said:


> It was cool finally getting a chance to visit the Arch. Then I read a detailed history of it and was bummed out for the rest of my trip, and ever since.



Sorry, I’m on my 3rd margarita and just skimmed Wikipedia but not seeing it. I’m all ears for additional reasons to hate Missouri, where half my family is from and haven’t spoken to in 20 years or so.


----------



## ronntaylor

Edd said:


> Sorry, I’m on my 3rd margarita and just skimmed Wikipedia but not seeing it. I’m all ears for additional reasons to hate Missouri, where half my family is from and haven’t spoken to in 20 years or so.




From Wikipedia's entry on the Arch



> *Civil rights activists regarded the construction of the arch as a token of racial discrimination. *On July 14, 1964, during the workers' lunchtime, civil rights protesters Percy Green and Richard Daly, both members of Congress of Racial Equality, climbed 125 feet up the north leg of the arch to "expose the fact that federal funds were being used to build a national monument that was racially discriminating against black contractors and skilled black workers." As the pair disregarded demands to get off, protesters on the ground demanded that at least 10% of the skilled jobs belong to African Americans. Four hours later, Green and Daly dismounted from the arch to charges of "trespassing, peace disturbance, and resisting arrest."[56][57] This incident _inter alia_ spurred the United States Department of Justice to file the first pattern or practice case against AFL–CIO under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, on February 4, 1966, but the department later called off the charges.[58] The 1966 lawsuit was an attempt by the Office of Federal Contract Compliance (OFCC) to desegregate building-trade unions nationwide.




Not mentioned is that 95% of the residents evicted from the area that would become the Arch project were African American. That the area was no more "blighted" than other surrounding areas. That 5000 jobs, mostly of Black workers, were destroyed. That the bond vote for the project was rigged and corrupt. The resulting jobs years later for the Arch project denied skilled Black workers opportunities, and the resulting Arch enhanced segregation that exists to this day.

A few years ago when the 50th Anniversary was celebrated, the official photo included few (no?) Black members of St. Louis officialdom or community groups. A perfect symbol of the Arch's history in a city with a majority Black population. Was glad the hubby turned down a position in St. Louis. I couldn't see myself living in the state even as a part-time, occasional resident.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Joe Rogan's eventual place in history will be as a Covid meme

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1466219285244698624/


----------



## Alli

Talked to a former AJROTC colleague this afternoon. He told me that another colleague of ours died from Covid. Anti-vaxer. I was unsurprised. I don’t quite understand how a guy could spend 20+ years as an Army officer and then another 20 years as a SAI and be that dumb.


----------



## SuperMatt

Alli said:


> Talked to a former AJROTC colleague this afternoon. He told me that another colleague of ours died from Covid. Anti-vaxer. I was unsurprised. I don’t quite understand how a guy could spend 20+ years as an Army officer and then another 20 years as a SAI and be that dumb.



A tribal mentality paired with the constant reinforcement of anti-vax or anti-mask propaganda on the right-wing tribe’s Facebook pages (and cable TV news) can harm even otherwise intelligent people.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

Edd said:


> Read the story. I’m trying to feel bad for him but when I got to the point where he’s being pissy about wearing a mask in the gym I’m thinking “fuck this guy”.
> 
> Not being argumentative, just reporting my gut reaction.




I definitely feel more sad for his sister and family than for him. He had the same information as the rest of us but chose to be influenced by conspiracy theorists and thought he knew better. He paid the ultimate price and learned an irreversible lesson. My cousin is very much of the mindset of this guy and isn’t vaccinated. She’s become very passionate for spreading misinformation and has started falling out with members of our family because she ‘feels alone’ as nobody in the family is ‘liking’ her rants on Facebook (because they don’t agree with her). 

It’s a difficult situation because on one hand I have the opinion that those who choose not to be vaccinated are stupid and reap what they sow, but then I know a few people who fall into this camp and I’d hate to see them die.


----------



## Edd

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I definitely feel more sad for his sister and family than for him. He had the same information as the rest of us but chose to be influenced by conspiracy theorists and thought he knew better. He paid the ultimate price and learned an irreversible lesson. My cousin is very much of the mindset of this guy and isn’t vaccinated. She’s become very passionate for spreading misinformation and has started falling out with members of our family because she ‘feels alone’ as nobody in the family is ‘liking’ her rants on Facebook (because they don’t agree with her).
> 
> It’s a difficult situation because on one hand I have the opinion that those who choose not to be vaccinated are stupid and reap what they sow, but then I know a few people who fall into this camp and I’d hate to see them die.



This doesn’t go for everyone but if they refuse to wear a mask in areas that require it, then they’re passively announcing that they don’t care about other people and let’s just see how it plays out. Like, they don’t care about being simply polite.


----------



## Herdfan

Edd said:


> This doesn’t go for everyone but if they refuse to wear a mask in areas that require it, then they’re passively announcing that they don’t care about other people and let’s just see how it plays out. Like, they don’t care about being simply polite.




Does this apply to politicians as well?  Because every time one of our leaders gets caught without a mask when it is required, a litany of excuses is made for them.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Does this apply to politicians as well?  Because every time one of our leaders gets caught without a mask when it is required, a litany of excuses is made for them.



Agreed. Look at all the excuses made for this politician. He got a positive COVID test, and then went into crowded places multiple times without a mask, and didn’t tell anybody he had put them at risk. Doesn’t that make you angry?



Spoiler: Who is this politician?






			https://wapo.st/3xOUMg6
		

 Click the link to find out…


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Does this apply to politicians as well?  Because every time one of our leaders gets caught without a mask when it is required, a litany of excuses is made for them.




No, it doesn't apply to politicians.  Here's why.  If you're already a monster, then by not wearing a mask, you're simply a monster not wearing a mask.  You can't say not wearing a mask makes them a monster because the mask didn't really change anything.  It's not part of the equation.  We might all have our favorite monsters, but let's never forget what they truly are.

Show me a politician who cares about others and is polite.  THEN we can have a conversation.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

Herdfan said:


> Does this apply to politicians as well? Because every time one of our leaders gets caught without a mask when it is required, a litany of excuses is made for them.




It always annoys me when I see politicians not wearing masks at public events to be honest. It send a very bad message to the public, some of which are questioning the whole pandemic for whatever dodgy reasons they’ve read on a blog. Politicians seem to deflect criticism away I think because they do a dozen or more PCR tests a week.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> We have discussed in other threads the leaders of Missouri are terrible people based on their treatment of the wrongfully convicted and the pardon of white-power types who threatened peaceful protesters with guns.
> 
> But if you needed further convincing, here’s a story about them hiding results from a study that confirmed masks saved lives in their state.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Missouri health department found mask mandates work, but didn’t make findings public
> 
> 
> Jurisdictions with mask mandates averaged 15.8 cases per day for every 100,000 residents, compared to 21.7 in unmasked communities.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.stlpublicradio.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These people have the gumption to call themselves “pro-life.”
> 
> PS:
> 
> 
> Gee I wonder why he wanted the data and science hidden…



Well the article does a poor job to back up the heavy statements.
1. We knew this, there'd been numerous studies from Missouri showing a reduction of covid cases once mask mandates were called despite the higher pop density and initially higher case load in 2020.
2. The graph showed in the article would require more data not just the absolute number of cases pre and post mandate 






If you want to have a comparative graph for the effect of mask mandate, it should graph case number changes relative to the numbers at the time of the mandate.


----------



## SuperMatt

Italian man tries to dodge Covid vaccine wearing fake arm
					

Anti-vaxxer is facing charges of fraud after turning up for jab with silicone arm in Biella




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## Edd

SuperMatt said:


> Italian man tries to dodge Covid vaccine wearing fake arm
> 
> 
> Anti-vaxxer is facing charges of fraud after turning up for jab with silicone arm in Biella
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 10167



Pretty wild.  I've started to wonder how much of the anti-vaxxers are just plain old scared of needles.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wow.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1466896200926334978/


----------



## Huntn

*Historical Note:*








						Gen. George Washington Ordered Smallpox Inoculations for All Troops
					

George Washington’s tactics included directing the first mass military inoculations




					health.mil
				




_Nevertheless, after weighing the odds, Washington informed Congress on Feb. 5, 1777, of his plans for a mass inoculation. The general's plans contraindicated a 1776 proclamation by the Continental Congress prohibiting inoculations._

*Question:* Any thoughts on chances of moderation if I was to post this in the MRs Community Forum, COVID Informational thread? Would this be considered political, and poking the bear?


----------



## Roller

At least hydroxychorquine and ivermectin are legitimately used to treat _something_, though they are useless against COVID-19. But this example illustrates how gullible and stupid people can be, shelling out more than $100 for dirt:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/magic-...ics-weirdest-mlm-rcna6950?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma


----------



## Huntn

Roller said:


> At least hydroxychorquine and ivermectin are legitimately used to treat _something_, though they are useless against COVID-19. But this example illustrates how gullible and stupid people can be, shelling out more than $100 for dirt:
> 
> https://www.nbcnews.com/news/magic-...ics-weirdest-mlm-rcna6950?cid=sm_npd_nn_tw_ma



This all boils down to a perception of mindless hate and rejection of liberalism, with the basis of selfishness and intolerance as the motivator. It has gotten so bad that with any idea that is framed as having liberal or progressive roots, there is zero thought applied, the idea is rejected and hate is applied. 

This is such a threat to our future success as a country (and the planet)  I hope more of the stupid ones bite it, then maybe we’ll have a chance at weathering the Stupid Tsunami. This is not me wishing ill will on those who would destroy us, those who have handicapped thinking, or lack of intelligence, it is me rooting for us to have a fighting chance of making it through this, for the US to still have a democracy on the other end and in the bigger picture for the human species to continue to be successful, not destroy ourselves and the planet.

I’ll note that these comments are U.S. centric, but I feel that humanity around the globe must smarten up pretty quickly or we are in for a bad time. We will prove or disprove we are the right caretakers for planet Earth. It’s just that in the US for the last 50 years the rise of stupid is so pronounced, I think I have good reason to be fearful for our future prospects.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1467177377776082947/


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## fooferdoggie

Evangelical scam artist Robin Bullock: The vaccine will steal your soul








						Evangelist: Genetic Testing Companies Like Vaccines Because They Want Your Soul
					

That's not how anything works.




					friendlyatheist.patheos.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

They knew their kid had covid. real asscovidiots.
Defiant California Parents Send Child With COVID To Elementary School, Trigger Outbreak​








						Defiant California Parents Send Child With COVID To Elementary School, Trigger Outbreak
					

The parents "jeopardized the health and safety of other children, their families and school staff," said an official.




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Evangelical scam artist Robin Bullock: The vaccine will steal your soul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Evangelist: Genetic Testing Companies Like Vaccines Because They Want Your Soul
> 
> 
> That's not how anything works.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> friendlyatheist.patheos.com



This is great news: there is no risk for those of that already sold our soul to the Devil!


----------



## fooferdoggie

A man bragged he was 'gonna be rich' off fake coronavirus vaccine cards, prosecutors say. Then he got charged.​








						A man bragged he was 'gonna be rich' off fake coronavirus vaccine cards, prosecutors say. Then he got charged.
					

A 23-year-old Maryland man has been charged with purchasing and distributing fake coronavirus vaccine cards to enrich himself, according to a criminal complaint unsealed in federal court Friday. The man, Amar Salim Shabazz, was allegedly not shy about his scheme, either.Subscribe to The Post...




					www.yahoo.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1468721106068680708/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1468721106068680708/



They’ve come a long way from drinking or injecting bleach or shining a flashlight in your ear.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1468721106068680708/




I always thought if something really bad happened, we'd all be fine.  All the smart scientist types would step up and save the world.  And they have.

I NEVER predicted members of our own government would do all they could to fight the scientists trying to save the world.

It sounds like a really bad B movie.  Or, I guess it sounds like a documentary about evil scientists trying to control the human population.  Depends on which side you take in this.  And there's another thing I never predicted.  That some humans would happily follow the politicians, not the scientists.

It's a crazy world!


----------



## SuperMatt

MEJHarrison said:


> I always thought if something really bad happened, we'd all be fine.  All the smart scientist types would step up and save the world.  And they have.
> 
> I NEVER predicted members of our own government would do all they could to fight the scientists trying to save the world.
> 
> It sounds like a really bad B movie.  Or, I guess it sounds like a documentary about evil scientists trying to control the human population.  Depends on which side you take in this.  And there's another thing I never predicted.  That some humans would happily follow the politicians, not the scientists.
> 
> It's a crazy world!



We can accomplish just about anything with science, engineering, etc.

But there’s something that still holds back humanity.

You can’t fix stupid.









						Rutter: Science finally proves you can't fix stupid
					

David Rutter on the science of stupidity




					www.chicagotribune.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

Who missed their point?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1469003850518458369/


----------



## lizkat

SuperMatt said:


> We can accomplish just about anything with science, engineering, etc.​
> But there’s something that still holds back humanity.
> 
> You can’t fix stupid.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rutter: Science finally proves you can't fix stupid
> 
> 
> David Rutter on the science of stupidity
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.chicagotribune.com




I can almost forgive stupid,  especially because some "stupidity" can indeed be fixed via things as simple as better nutrition and some basic factual education relevant to any given issue.   I mean we were not born seeking fake news.  Our stomachs crave real food and our brains are wired for learning real things.

But out here on the info highway, we tend to see only the most inane, insane and publicity-seeking versions of "stupid" on social media (and replays of that, thanks to traditional media outlets who do know better but succumb to get-the-clicks pressure).

And I grant you, that sort of stupid is hard to fix because it's quite entertaining,  and we're all on track to entertaining ourselves to death while the sun prepares to fry us anyway.

But in the meantime? I don't forgive the rafts of right wingers who have realized they don't have to legislate against federal government, they can just become part of it and then work to weaken it from within, at least partly by making it clear by example that it's a big joke and/or irrelevant and incompetent.

And I also don't forgive those who seem to regard all government as either entirely optional or simply obnoxious because it's inconvenient in some personal way.

There's a soft underbelly in the USA,  and it's based in part on the fact that a lot of us have never had to live in a state of anarchy, never had to acquire or carry something to bribe people with on the simplest trip to market, school, or job,  usually don't worry about food safety (although in the past 20 years that's become a larger concern thanks to deregulation), never had to walk miles to fetch drinking water as a daily routine...

I'm not talking about life in the grittier parts of our neglected urban or rural areas, I'm talking about life in the suburbs, where about 55-60% of us live nowadays. In short, our elective stupidity and our selectively amnesiac mockery of government are a luxury of living in a place where government still works.  There are traffic lights, grocery stores, water and sewer lines, electric and gas utilities, the internetz....  and, guess what:   voting booths, yeah.

_And it's so annoying when homeless people camp on the roadside or even worse get on the bus on some day when our car is in the shop, geez.  There should be a law, right? For those people..._​
And all these softnesses of experience are not invisible to enemies of this country.  It's silly to presume those enemies do not have armies of both cybertrolls and real pieces of work also joining in the clamor against the inconveniences of our government...

_... yeah, government by consent of the governed, with its messy, so complex ways of trying to sort out things democratically, when things could be made perfect in a wave of the hand if we just had a strong man up top and ditched Congress and those internal courts and the godblasted media.   A strongman like each one of us might imagine individually, molded to our singular expectations. _​
The erstwhile or still bamboozled followers of Trump and his merry "anti-establishment" advocates should get a grip and realize into whose hands they are playing.  It's not the hands of a small-d democrat, that's for sure.

 I say we tell all those folks this, and right to their faces :

"Hey if you want a fascist government, pull up stakes here and go look for it somewhere else.  This is the USA.  Messily under same old management of a sturdy Constitution guaranteed to keep things pretty messy under rule of law affecting us all.  Get over it."​
Some of the followers of the Trump-era charade-and-circus artists in Congress are pathetic in their yearning for things to be made simple and also to be kept entertaining.  I mean life in a government by informed consent can be eye-glazing for sure.

 But together,  those seeking simplicity and those seeking to impose it do create a real danger for the rest of us because they'll eventually settle on a leader more charismatic than Trump, far more politically savvy and connected to more of the levers of power behind federal policy regardless of who wins elections. 

We don't know who that future charismatic leader is yet. He could be of any or of no poltiical party.   Maybe he doesn't even know who he is yet.   But he's waiting in the wings and in the  meantime thanks to four years of a Donald Trump administration, whoever that person is already has sycophantic, malleable acolytes in the Congress, in agencies of the administration, in the military, in the judiciary. 

 Any strongman will do when someone dreams only of latching onto a singular share of power.  That's where "so much winning: has managed to take us.  We stopped asking exactly what we're winning.  That kind of stupid CAN BE FIXED.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> Who missed their point?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1469003850518458369/




While I can't agree with the ignorance she spouted, it's nice to finally see someone not just stand there making themselves look dumber and dumber with each word that comes out of their mouth.  She's not nearly as funny as the dumber people, but she has enough working brains cells to know when she's being mocked.  Half a point for knowing when to just walk away.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

MEJHarrison said:


> It sounds like a really bad B movie.




You mean like owning a place called Shooters Grill in a town named Rifle where staff is encouraged to openly wear firearms and then running for Congress and winning?

-Rep Lauren Boebert

I'd pass on that script.  It sounds ridiculous.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> You mean like owning a place called Shooters Grill in a town named Rifle where staff is encouraged to openly wear firearms and then running for Congress and winning?
> 
> -Rep Lauren Boebert
> 
> I'd pass on that script.  It sounds ridiculous.




If I time traveled back 10 years and tried to tell my younger self all the crazy stuff that is headed his way, the younger me would think he's going to lose his marbles at some point in the coming decade.


----------



## Eric

Every antivaxxer...


Every conspiraboomer in a nutshell from
      FuckYouKaren


----------



## Runs For Fun

Eric said:


> Every antivaxxer...
> 
> 
> Every conspiraboomer in a nutshell from
> FuckYouKaren



Conspiraboomer. Hahaha stealing that one


----------



## Eric

Ugh 


I'm adorable from
      facepalm


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> Ugh
> 
> 
> I'm adorable from
> facepalm



Shouldn’t he be holding a machine gun while he reads that? #MissedOpportunity


----------



## MEJHarrison

Eric said:


> Ugh
> 
> 
> I'm adorable from
> facepalm




Adorable comments.  I'd say "Tough shit kid.  We're all suffering through this together and the sooner you and your friends follow the rules, the quicker you won't need to follow the rules." 

Although my gut says in this case, those comments ought to be going to the parents as they are likely the actual authors of the note he's holding.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Eric said:


> Ugh
> 
> 
> I'm adorable from
> facepalm




Special snowflake phase 2: Dictators of government policy.









I'll cop to my hypocrisy when they're talking about climate change.


----------



## Huntn

lizkat said:


> I can almost forgive stupid,  especially because some "stupidity" can indeed be fixed via things as simple as better nutrition and some basic factual education relevant to any given issue.   I mean we were not born seeking fake news.  Our stomachs crave real food and our brains are wired for learning real things.
> 
> But out here on the info highway, we tend to see only the most inane, insane and publicity-seeking versions of "stupid" on social media (and replays of that, thanks to traditional media outlets who do know better but succumb to get-the-clicks pressure).
> 
> And I grant you, that sort of stupid is hard to fix because it's quite entertaining,  and we're all on track to entertaining ourselves to death while the sun prepares to fry us anyway.
> 
> But in the meantime? I don't forgive the rafts of right wingers who have realized they don't have to legislate against federal government, they can just become part of it and then work to weaken it from within, at least partly by making it clear by example that it's a big joke and/or irrelevant and incompetent.
> 
> And I also don't forgive those who seem to regard all government as either entirely optional or simply obnoxious because it's inconvenient in some personal way.
> 
> There's a soft underbelly in the USA,  and it's based in part on the fact that a lot of us have never had to live in a state of anarchy, never had to acquire or carry something to bribe people with on the simplest trip to market, school, or job,  usually don't worry about food safety (although in the past 20 years that's become a larger concern thanks to deregulation), never had to walk miles to fetch drinking water as a daily routine...
> 
> I'm not talking about life in the grittier parts of our neglected urban or rural areas, I'm talking about life in the suburbs, where about 55-60% of us live nowadays. In short, our elective stupidity and our selectively amnesiac mockery of government are a luxury of living in a place where government still works.  There are traffic lights, grocery stores, water and sewer lines, electric and gas utilities, the internetz....  and, guess what:   voting booths, yeah.
> 
> _And it's so annoying when homeless people camp on the roadside or even worse get on the bus on some day when our car is in the shop, geez.  There should be a law, right? For those people..._​
> And all these softnesses of experience are not invisible to enemies of this country.  It's silly to presume those enemies do not have armies of both cybertrolls and real pieces of work also joining in the clamor against the inconveniences of our government...
> 
> _... yeah, government by consent of the governed, with its messy, so complex ways of trying to sort out things democratically, when things could be made perfect in a wave of the hand if we just had a strong man up top and ditched Congress and those internal courts and the godblasted media.   A strongman like each one of us might imagine individually, molded to our singular expectations. _​
> The erstwhile or still bamboozled followers of Trump and his merry "anti-establishment" advocates should get a grip and realize into whose hands they are playing.  It's not the hands of a small-d democrat, that's for sure.
> 
> I say we tell all those folks this, and right to their faces :
> 
> "Hey if you want a fascist government, pull up stakes here and go look for it somewhere else.  This is the USA.  Messily under same old management of a sturdy Constitution guaranteed to keep things pretty messy under rule of law affecting us all.  Get over it."​
> Some of the followers of the Trump-era charade-and-circus artists in Congress are pathetic in their yearning for things to be made simple and also to be kept entertaining.  I mean life in a government by informed consent can be eye-glazing for sure.
> 
> But together,  those seeking simplicity and those seeking to impose it do create a real danger for the rest of us because they'll eventually settle on a leader more charismatic than Trump, far more politically savvy and connected to more of the levers of power behind federal policy regardless of who wins elections.
> 
> We don't know who that future charismatic leader is yet. He could be of any or of no poltiical party.   Maybe he doesn't even know who he is yet.   But he's waiting in the wings and in the  meantime thanks to four years of a Donald Trump administration, whoever that person is already has sycophantic, malleable acolytes in the Congress, in agencies of the administration, in the military, in the judiciary.
> 
> Any strongman will do when someone dreams only of latching onto a singular share of power.  That's where "so much winning: has managed to take us.  We stopped asking exactly what we're winning.  That kind of stupid CAN BE FIXED.



There seems to be a group of citizens who are focused on narrowly defined goals, an easily mentioned one is outlawing abortion, and this issue has become so important to them , and they have such tunnel vision, they would basically support any kind of a monster who feeds them what they want to hear regardless of the massive hit we would take as a country after our Federal Govt turns into a giant Den of Corruption, Fascist,  or broken down and ceases to function.

The other issue is some combination of stupidity, selfishness, and ignorance as to how liberty is defined, as if ME>WE, and while there is a distinct level of ME we all defend,  it does not trump the collective WE when it comes to actions that can be harmful to the group such as commutative disease, dangerous practices, or forcing your religious beliefs onto others.

Yet right now in the US, we have people trying to turn us into a Christian Theocracy, we have Evangelists selling their souls, and the GOP dismantling our democracy to hold onto power while telling record level of lies to keep their base onboard. And the latter depends on either Stupid or an agreement that Democracy no longer serves your individual needs so all becomes fair, an end that justifies basically any means.

The only thing that can stop this is for a majority of citizens to become Involved and take action. Easier said than done, and it will require a tipping point when enough citizens become alarmed enough to not let us slide any further towards the abyss.


----------



## JayMysteri0

This, happened...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1469345349668016128/


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> This, happened...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1469345349668016128/



*Cringe*


----------



## lizkat

It's not just regular ol' historians and poli sci guys gonna have a field day looking back at the conjunction of the Trump era and the covid-19 era in the USA.   There's enough material for a couple hundred thousand dissertations by students of psychology and sociology.  Never mind research papers by psychiatrists.

Or you know, maybe it will all just boil down to a bunch more bad "Christmas" movies.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I remember when this guy's audience & material was more diverse.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1469371430718644239/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1469381903849594883/




_Bonus Mysteri0 points if you get the reference_


----------



## Eric

File under "how can anyone be dumb enough to vote for Trump"


Win-win situation from
      MurderedByWords


----------



## fooferdoggie

who is more stupid the guy selling his arm or the people buying it?








						Covid-19: Man receives up to 10 vaccines in one day
					

The man is believed to have been paid for the jabs and to have visited several vaccination centres. Health officials are "very concerned", and are investigating.




					www.stuff.co.nz


----------



## fooferdoggie

Anti-vaccine group targets California's medical director








						Anti-vaccine group targets California's medical director
					

SAN FRANCISCO (AP) — The president of California’s medical board, which issues medical licenses and disciplines doctors, says a group of anti-vaccine activists stalked her at home and followed her to her office — where four men confronted her in a dark parking garage in what she described as a...




					apnews.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

seems police dont know the law that well.
Police, district investigating after police officer upset school bus driver over masks​









						Police, district investigating after police officer upset school bus driver over masks
					

Police, district investigating after police officer upset school bus driver over masks




					www.ksdk.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

Deep state play book for Corona: hide the name in the variants. /s from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## SuperMatt

Supreme Court justice Neil Gorsuch, who is reportedly a very stable genius:



> In his dissent on Monday in the case from New York, Justice Gorsuch wrote that the practical consequences of the court’s decision would be grave.
> 
> “Thousands of New York health care workers face the loss of their jobs and eligibility for unemployment benefits,” he wrote.
> 
> “These applicants are not ‘anti-vaxxers’ who object to all vaccines,” Justice Gorsuch added. “Instead, the applicants explain, they cannot receive a Covid-19 vaccine because their religion teaches them to oppose abortion in any form, and because each of the currently available vaccines has depended upon abortion-derived fetal cell lines in its production or testing.”



It is widely known that the mRNA vaccines (Pfizer and Moderna) include no fetal stem cell lines whatsoever. Neil Gorsuch is a goddamn Supreme Court Justice. He should know this.

Fuck him; what is the point of pandering to crazy right-wing religious nuts since you have a lifetime appointment to the court? Or is Gorsuch really that fucking stupid? So unbelievable to read vaccine disinformation in a SUPREME COURT OPINION. What a shitshow.


----------



## Eric

Won't make fun of the dead but SMH, these people don't need to die.


Today December 13th 1945 is Herman Cain's Birthday from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## Alli

They just get better and better. In this case I think the judge should be charged with accomplice to murder.


----------



## Joe

Alli said:


> They just get better and better. In this case I think the judge should be charged with accomplice to murder.
> 
> View attachment 10371




She got what she wanted. SMH


----------



## Herdfan

I still don't understand what it hurts to give it ( the real one for humans, not the horse dewormer paste) to them.   They are most likely going to die anyway, so why not.  The side effects are mild so if they recover, there likely won't be any long-term issues from having taken it.


----------



## Cmaier

Herdfan said:


> I still don't understand what it hurts to give it ( the real one for humans, not the horse dewormer paste) to them.   They are most likely going to die anyway, so why not.  The side effects are mild so if they recover, there likely won't be any long-term issues from having taken it.



Hippocratic oath. It can’t help them, and it can only hurt them. So you are asking doctors, who swear to do no harm, to prescribe medicines in contradiction to FDA-authorized use, where the use can, at best, do no good, and at worst can make the patient sick. 

All so that a bunch of politicians who have invested in the stock of the companies who make this garbage can make more money.


----------



## User.45

Alli said:


> They just get better and better. In this case I think the judge should be charged with accomplice to murder.
> 
> View attachment 10371



The few cases I've looked at the judgement happened far beyond the acute phase of COVID. The patients were already in multi-organ failure, etc.


Herdfan said:


> I still don't understand what it hurts to give it ( the real one for humans, not the horse dewormer paste) to them.   They are most likely going to die anyway, so why not.  The side effects are mild so if they recover, there likely won't be any long-term issues from having taken it.



This statement couldn't be more wrong. You think twice about giving any drug to someone in multi-organ failure. Direct drug-induced toxicity is complicated by drug-drug interactions in critically ill patients who are usually on a million drugs and sprinkle the dysfunction of the detoxing organs (kidney and liver) and a failing circulation on that mix.

Judges who order physicians to prescribe ivermectin should either share medical malpractice liability, or exempt providers from it.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> The few cases I've looked at the judgement happened far beyond the acute phase of COVID. The patients were already in multi-organ failure, etc.
> 
> This statement couldn't be more wrong. You think twice about giving any drug to someone in multi-organ failure. Direct drug-induced toxicity is complicated by drug-drug interactions in critically ill patients who are usually on a million drugs and sprinkle the dysfunction of the detoxing organs (kidney and liver) and a failing circulation on that mix.
> 
> Judges who order physicians to prescribe ivermectin should either share medical malpractice liability, or exempt providers from it.



Thank goodness that we make doctors go to medical school...


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Thank goodness that we make doctors go to medical school...



And intensivists have ≥2 years of pretty brutal ICU training on top of general training.


----------



## fooferdoggie

poor little gullible covid lovers
TGA issues warning about counterfeit ivermectin products and using them to treat COVID-19​








						TGA issues warning about counterfeit ivermectin
					

The national medical regulator warns people not to try and import ivermectin products, while also repeating warnings against using it to prevent or treat COVID-19.




					www.abc.net.au


----------



## Yoused

fooferdoggie said:


> poor little gullible covid lovers
> TGA issues warning about counterfeit ivermectin products and using them to treat COVID-19​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> TGA issues warning about counterfeit ivermectin
> 
> 
> The national medical regulator warns people not to try and import ivermectin products, while also repeating warnings against using it to prevent or treat COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.abc.net.au




Wait, so,


			
				linked story said:
			
		

> It found that, of the products tested, three had less than the active ingredient amount advertised on the label.



But one of the problems was that people were taking horse dosages (at least 5 times too much): if there is less  in the product, would that not be better? (ignoring that the extra non-ivermectin part might be whoknowswhat)


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

A lad who works on the shop floor at my work is off with Covid and has not been vaccinated. I was talking to him just a couple of weeks ago about it and he’d read ‘loads of stuff’ about how the vaccine was rushed out and not tested properly. It also doesn’t cover you fully as the survival rate is 99.2% anyway he said. It’s all a power grab by the governments of the world and once they’ve forgotten about covid, the restrictions will remain to control us indefinitely. It was interesting to listen to someone who had read and absorbed a monumental amount of unfounded shite and reminded me of my cousin who spends all day everyday retweeting anti-vax bollocks on twitter. 

The lad at work is in hospital at the moment with covid and thankfully he’s ok with a bit of help from our fantastic NHS. He’s 32 years old and is occupying a bed unnecessarily at the moment due to his choices, bless him.


----------



## User.45

Belongs here. Southwest CEO says masks are not necessary for Southwest flights, because of how good HEPA filters they have on the plane.



> The day after Southwest CEO Gary Kelly suggested at a Senate hearing that wearing masks on a plane was not necessary, Bastian said he doesn't agree. He said masks would be necessary for the foreseeable future.
> "I don't know that I agree with Gary's remarks, particularly as we see Omicron continue to enter into our country," Bastian said in an interview on CNBC. "Masks are going to be important as a safeguard for a while yet."
> Kelly and two other airline CEOs -- Doug Parker of American Airlines and Scott Kirby of United -- testified Wednesday about the financial support that the federal government provided to the US airline industry in 2020 and 2021. But Kelly was asked by the ranking Republican on the committee, Roger Wicker, if he thought that masks were still needed on planes.
> 
> 
> "I think the case is very strong that masks don't add much, if anything, in the air cabin environment. It is very safe and very high quality compared to any other indoor setting," said Kelly.
> Parker appeared at the hearing to agree with Kelly, saying, "I concur. An aircraft is the safest place you can be. It's true of all of our aircraft — they all have the same HEPA filters and air flow." But after the hearing American Airlines walked back Parker's remarks, saying that his concurrence with Kelly was on the point about the quality of the air in the aircraft cabin, not mask requirements.




Well, I flew Southwest in March and those assholes ignored COVID precautions so blatantly even then that I will never ever fly SW again. Because of their seating policy (first come first serve), it's Mortal Kombat and packed lines and then packed seating. It was a WTF moment when me and my fully vaccinated wife got seated between some assholes who couldn't even wear their objectively useless gaiters right.

So SW can't even meet droplet precautions (people coughing in your face) but this asshole is trying to sell airborne precautions as a replacement for masks? * COVID spreading on flights is a well documented phenomenon, and I know physicians who got COVID on flights personally (I.e. they know how to wear a mask) , so this is horseshit.


----------



## JayMysteri0

How do we not get to call this sort of person the real "woke" asshole?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471586976893652997/

These asshats are always comparing themselves to the Jewish people who actually suffered under nazis or like POC they wouldn't be caught dead living 60 seconds of their actual lives.  You are NOT a human being going thru some things.  You're an asshole who seems racist, trivializing the suffering of others because you're being inconvenienced for a short bit of time.

GTFO


----------



## JayMysteri0

When your state isn't big on mandates or vaccines, and you have to take matters into your own hands

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471573837959544842/

You better discover patience.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> When your state isn't big on mandates or vaccines, and you have to take matters into your own hands
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471573837959544842/
> 
> You better discover patience.



Meanwhile, there is no line at the vaccine tent. Just shows you how stupid people can be. Sit in line for hours for a test, when you could just get the vaccine for free and be back home before those other people even get to the end of the line.

We’re all kind of stupid to begin with, but the tribal nature of politics paired with misanthropic Republican politicians makes them dumber. The “great” America has more COVID deaths than any other country in the world.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Judge: No, you can't stop your ex-wife from vaccinating your children. Oh, and since your entire lawsuit is based on bullshiat, you're not allowed to talk to them about COVID either








						Alberta court settles COVID-19 vaccine dispute between Lethbridge, Alta. parents
					

An Alberta judge has ruled in favour of a woman who was fighting with her ex-husband over whether their children would be vaccinated against COVID-19.




					calgary.ctvnews.ca


----------



## fooferdoggie

Florida science teacher fired for teaching science the Florida way
Florida science teacher fired for refusing to wear mask​








						Florida science teacher fired for refusing to wear mask
					

A teacher in South Florida has been fired for repeatedly refusing to wear a mask.




					www.clickorlando.com


----------



## fooferdoggie




----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

fooferdoggie said:


> View attachment 10432




I support this.  Anything that reduces the amount of people who they would reproduce with works for me.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I support this.  Anything that reduces the amount of people who they would reproduce with works for me.



plus you dont want to vibrate differently that could set off earthquakes.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

fooferdoggie said:


> plus you dont want to vibrate differently that could set off earthquakes.




Well yeah, that's just science.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Judge: No, you can't stop your ex-wife from vaccinating your children. Oh, and since your entire lawsuit is based on bullshiat, you're not allowed to talk to them about COVID either
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Alberta court settles COVID-19 vaccine dispute between Lethbridge, Alta. parents
> 
> 
> An Alberta judge has ruled in favour of a woman who was fighting with her ex-husband over whether their children would be vaccinated against COVID-19.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> calgary.ctvnews.ca



Meanwhile in America, we have Supreme Court justices who actually believe the “vaccines are abortion” nonsense.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471955900130811915/


----------



## SuperMatt

SuperMatt said:


> Robert F Kennedy is not a left-wing speaker. He’s a long time anti-vax nutbag. He’s been on that crazy train for more than a decade, claiming vaccines cause autism.
> 
> Come on, man…



Robert Kennedy made the news today:









						Anti-Vaxxer Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s House Party Guests Told to Get Vaccinated Before Coming
					

When asked about the apparent hypocrisy at his festive gathering, RFK Jr. blamed his wife.



					www.thedailybeast.com
				




He knows the vaccine saves lives, and requires people to get it before coming to his house. But he gets out there and tells people not to get it so he can get attention and money. He is truly appalling.

This revelation along with the Fox News text messages about Jan 6 are proof that the right-wing talking heads and the anti-vaxxers are lying to their followers, just as we’ve been saying all along.

Will this clear and obvious proof change minds? I surely hope so, but people that follow end-of-the-world cults tend to stick with it even after the “doomsday” passes with no armageddon, and the cult leaders make up some new date for the “real” end of the world.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Robert Kennedy made the news today:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-Vaxxer Robert F. Kennedy Jr.’s House Party Guests Told to Get Vaccinated Before Coming
> 
> 
> When asked about the apparent hypocrisy at his festive gathering, RFK Jr. blamed his wife.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He knows the vaccine saves lives, and requires people to get it before coming to his house. But he gets out there and tells people not to get it so he can get attention and money. He is truly appalling.
> 
> This revelation along with the Fox News text messages about Jan 6 are proof that the right-wing talking heads and the anti-vaxxers are lying to their followers, just as we’ve been saying all along.
> 
> Will this clear and obvious proof change minds? I surely hope so, but people that follow end-of-the-world cults tend to stick with it even after the “doomsday” passes with no armageddon, and the cult leaders make up some new date for the “real” end of the world.



This is what I'm referring to. These people know the _stats _and use this knowledge to achieve their goals. 
Information is power, and even common knowledge can empower if you reduce the number of informed through disinformation.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Please make the stupid stop

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471907601491365891/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471915625496731648/


----------



## User.45

Do you guys remember people saying that masks kill people? I haven't heard it in a while.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

P_X said:


> Do you guys remember people saying that masks kill people? I haven't heard it in a while.




Yeah that was a hot topic between March 2020 and July 2020 wasn’t it?

I’d be interested to see the daily stats on people dying from inhaling their own carbon dioxide as I haven’t heard anything about it for over a year now.


----------



## Pumbaa

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> Yeah that was a hot topic between March 2020 and July 2020 wasn’t it?
> 
> I’d be interested to see the daily stats on people dying from inhaling their own carbon dioxide as I haven’t heard anything about it for over a year now.



Duh, they’re obviously hiding those deaths by registering them as fake covid deaths, just like they are doing with all the vaccine deaths! 



Yikes, that hurt to write.


----------



## Roller

SuperMatt said:


> Thank goodness that we make doctors go to medical school...



Unfortunately, we don't test them for qualities (empathy, compassion, ability to think critically, to name just three) that are just as important to delivery of health care. Too many doctors are contributing to the problem, whether through ignorance or greed.


----------



## Cmaier

Just found out my sister, who has long covid from march 2020, and who got two shots and a booster, just got covid again.  Omicron is not going to be pleasant, looks like.


----------



## Eric

Cmaier said:


> Just found out my sister, who has long covid from march 2020, and who got two shots and a booster, just got covid again.  Omicron is not going to be pleasant, looks like.



Yeah, I've cancelled all of my holiday plans, just not worth the risk. Hope the best for your sister.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1472313464869867526/


----------



## Clix Pix

This Omicron thing is scary.  It is moving way too fast.   I'm still feeling sad about having missed out on a concert which normally I would have attended, but I did was what I felt was right for me and canceled out.  Now I am worrying about the artist who performed and also the friends who DID attend that concert......


----------



## Roller

Clix Pix said:


> This Omicron thing is scary.  It is moving way too fast.   I'm still feeling sad about having missed out on a concert which normally I would have attended, but I did was what I felt was right for me and canceled out.  Now I am worrying about the artist who performed and also the friends who DID attend that concert......



The one thing that most experts seem to agree on about the Omicron variant is that it spreads more rapidly than the wild type or other previous variants, including Delta. My best guess is that case counts in the U.S. will rise quickly and Omicron will be the dominant strain in less than a week. Beyond that, it's hard to say because there are so many variables, including protection from prior infection and/or vaccination, as well as how intrinsically severe is COVID-19 infection from Omicron. But there are oddities — for example, the wave in Gauteng, South Africa seems to be cresting.

I don't think panic is warranted, but people should:

Get fully vaccinated (that's three doses of an mRNA vaccine — we shouldn't call the 3rd dose a booster)
Limit indoor interactions with unmasked people outside your immediate household
Do a rapid antigen test if you must get together with others over the holidays
Have a low threshold for self-testing and quarantining
Key point: The likelihood of becoming severely ill or dying from COVID-19 is much less than it was in 2020, and we have many tools that weren't available then. For example, Pfizer's anti-viral drug nirmatrelvir, given along with ritonavir (they're available in combination or separately) is very effective if given within a few days of symptom onset. The European Medicines Agency is recommending it for “adults with COVID-19 who do not require supplemental oxygen and who are at increased risk of progressing to severe disease.” I suspect the FDA will follow suit and provide EUA very soon.

If there were ever a good reason to invoke the Defense Production Act to enable widespread manufacturing and dissemination of these drugs, this is it. And this should happen worldwide.


----------



## Yoused




----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Please make the stupid stop
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471907601491365891/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1471915625496731648/



What these people are trying to elude to in the dumbest possible way is Years of Life Lost. Which is estimated to be about a decade for the US population. But interpreting those numbers takes some effort.


----------



## SuperMatt

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1472970767017127941/


----------



## Huntn

*Chap2: Overheard at the gym*

Ind A: _Mandates! (_teeth gnashing, 50-60ish white man appears worse for wear, with long hair, a substantial red handkerchief hanging out rear pocket of his dungarees (there for, appearances), works on an oil rig.)
Ind A: _When they can mandate what you stick in your arm, IT’S ALL OVER man!!_
Ind B: (slight disagreement, unintelligible)_ but if I was younger I might feel that way.  _(70-80ish white man)
Ind A:_ Do you believe in the Bible?_
Ind B: _Yes _(hesitant).
Ind A: _Are you familiar with the Old Testament story about (unintelligible)?_
Ind B: _I don’t really read the Bible._
Ind A: _Oh, that’s ok…._I Huntn walked out of eves-dropping range.
The perfect storm, COVID STUPID, the Old Testament, and the same guy whose “_ready to take it back, just waiting for the call_”. I did not catch the name of the Old Testament story or I might have hung around to try to hear it’s pearls of wisdom.  I really need to find some noise cancelling ear pieces for when in the gym. .


----------



## fooferdoggie

Been watching grays anatomy and just got the season with covid. man they show Covidiots in all their brilliant light.


----------



## Renzatic

Well-p, I've been exposed by proxy. My dad went to his eye doctor 5 days ago, and today, he got a call from their office saying that said doctor has now tested positive for covid, and was showing his first symptoms during the visit. Since my dad has no sense of table manners whatsoever, always coughing and sneezing with only the most minute effort made to block it, and I go over there every other day for random reasons, there's a very slight chance I may have come in contact with it.

In the meanwhile, I'm getting tested tomorrow, likely too early, and plan on stuffing my face in case my sense of taste goes.


----------



## User.45

Renzatic said:


> Well-p, I've been exposed by proxy. My dad went to his eye doctor 5 days ago



I'd say it's a significant exposure given the proximity necessary with the ophtho equipment. 
The recent week has been the first time I've been happy about wearing a faceshield and an N95 at clinic. 


Renzatic said:


> In the meanwhile, I'm getting tested tomorrow, likely too early, and plan on stuffing my face in case my sense of taste goes.



Haha. This made me chuckle. Best of luck! Don't convert COVID into food poisoning tho.


----------



## SuperMatt

Founder of the GOP stupidity caucus has surfaced again. With newer members like Lauren Boebert and Marjorie Taylor-Green getting all the Press these days, Sarah Palin wants to remind everybody she started the moron movement…



> Palin appeared at Turning Point USA’s “AmericaFest 2021” conference in Phoenix, AZ — where she spoke on stage with the organization’s founder, *Charlie Kirk*. During this conversation, Kirk and the crowd cheered when Palin established her anti-vaccine stance and said “it’ll be over my dead body that I’ll have to get a shot. I will not do that. I won’t do it, and they better not touch my kids either.”



We’ve got nearly a million dead bodies from COVID-19 already…


----------



## Runs For Fun

Renzatic said:


> in case my sense of taste goes.



This part really sucks.


----------



## Runs For Fun

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473109205250940930/


----------



## Yoused

Renzatic said:


> … in case my sense of taste goes.



based on some of your posts on here your sense of taste is unlikely to be missed


----------



## JayMysteri0

This f-wit
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473039073535213570/


----------



## fooferdoggie

Unvaccinated, getting the original 2020 edition of Covid-19, purposely remaining unvaccinated, and then getting infected by the Omicron variant and dying is no way to go through life. Also, Texas is now home to the first U.S. Omicron death
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473133185068371972/


----------



## Edd

Quite the read from a doc, assuming it’s true.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1472847303518171136/


----------



## rdrr

Edd said:


> Quite the read from a doc, assuming it’s true.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1472847303518171136/



I cannot verify, but I believe this 100% because my daughter became a nurse August 2019.   She has told me a lot of stories of patients that she has taken care of that is very similar to this story. * Every single one* of her patients who were unvaccinated say the same thing.  "I wish I had gotten the vaccine."


----------



## Roller

rdrr said:


> I cannot verify, but I believe this 100% because my daughter became a nurse August 2019.   She has told me a lot of stories of patients that she has taken care of that is very similar to this story. * Every single one* of her patients who were unvaccinated say the same thing.  "I wish I had gotten the vaccine."



I, too, can't verify this particular account, but it's typical of what I'm hearing from HCWs across the nation, especially in ICUs. Often, it's the relatives that scream for the care team to give their family member a vaccine or some unproven therapy like ivermectin — the patient is usually too far gone to speak for themselves. I'd think Kool Aid would be a better choice, since that's what they've been drinking all along. The damage to our healthcare system is horrendous, and will be with us for decades to come.


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> This f-wit
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473039073535213570/



Threatening a government official, which Dr. Fauci is as head of the NIAID, is a Federal offense. I'm not an attorney, but I would think Mr. Watters should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. And, if that's not possible, he should be sued in a civil action.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> I, too, can't verify this particular account, but it's typical of what I'm hearing from HCWs across the nation, especially in ICUs. Often, it's the relatives that scream for the care team to give their family member a vaccine or some unproven therapy like ivermectin — the patient is usually too far gone to speak for themselves. I'd think Kool Aid would be a better choice, since that's what they've been drinking all along. The damage to our healthcare system is horrendous, and will be with us for decades to come.



This story sounds partially made up, though it could easily happen in a particular hospital I worked at even pre-COVID.
The NDs from Trump University, Dunning-Kruger School of Medicine are pretty hard to reason with.


Roller said:


> Threatening a government official, which Dr. Fauci is as head of the NIAID, is a Federal offense. I'm not an attorney, but I would think Mr. Watters should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. And, if that's not possible, he should be sued in a civil action.



This rhetoric is very concerning. I wonder why these people made it their mission to be on the wrong side of every major issue of my lifetime. So the evidence to support Climate Change is insufficient, but the lacking evidence to support the lab leak hypothesis is more than sufficient to justify advocating for murdering public servants over.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Even I hope this is an actress and this is an act.  If not, it's proof that there maybe no bottom to the rabbit hole these people have thrown themselves down.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473307884314402818/



Roller said:


> Threatening a government official, which Dr. Fauci is as head of the NIAID, is a Federal offense. I'm not an attorney, but I would think Mr. Watters should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. And, if that's not possible, he should be sued in a civil action.




He's a faux news employee, he's going to hide behind magic context.  He'll claim he was just using "colorful" language to help make his point because he's so emotional about the topic, for when one confronts Dr. Fauci with some supposed list of "facts" from reddit.  It's a continuation of the stupid every since we had Palin and her targets all those years ago.  Yes the f-wit full well knows what he is saying is incendiary, but of course doesn't want to deal the consequences if some nut ( that he is fully aware is out there ) does get motivated by his words.


----------



## rdrr

P_X said:


> This story sounds partially made up, though it could easily happen in a particular hospital I worked at even pre-COVID.
> The NDs from Trump University, Dunning-Kruger School of Medicine are pretty hard to reason with.
> 
> This rhetoric is very concerning. I wonder why these people made it their mission to be on the wrong side of every major issue of my lifetime. So the evidence to support Climate Change is insufficient, but the lacking evidence to support the lab leak hypothesis is more than sufficient to justify advocating for murdering public servants over.




Not taking away from your experience, but my daughter has been screamed at and threatened to the point where she reported it to the police, by family members of dying Covid patients.   They accused her of not taking care of their family members, told to "just give them X and it will cure them", and in one instance she was threatened that if she mentioned the Covid hoax one more time they would come down and "beat her ass."

In another incident that I personally witnessed.   During the height of last winter, I was in my car waiting to get tested, but thankfully I only had a cold.   I don't know the back story, but a gentleman was trying to get into the hospital that was closed to the public, and was charging from across the parking lot with balled fists.  The hospital security and police staff were telling him to stand down, but he kept on coming.   Then all hell broke loose, and he was saying something about a loved one and just need to tell the doctor something, as they over powered him and hauled him away.

People have absolutely lost their minds in the last nearly two years of dealing with this.   I don't doubt the story at all, especially after seeing all the "Karen" examples out on social media.   Hell if you told me it was MTG or the other nut job in congress, I wouldn't have questioned the story any less.


----------



## Runs For Fun

This shouldn’t need to be said but here we are








						Fact check: False claim that COVID-19 vaccine contains a species of hydra
					

The COVID-19 vaccine does not contain hydras. Nor can hydras, related to jellyfish, infect human bodies.



					www.usatoday.com


----------



## User.45

rdrr said:


> Not taking away from your experience, but my daughter has been screamed at and threatened to the point where she reported it to the police, by family members of dying Covid patients.   They accused her of not taking care of their family members, told to "just give them X and it will cure them", and in one instance she was threatened that if she mentioned the Covid hoax one more time they would come down and "beat her ass."
> 
> In another incident that I personally witnessed.   During the height of last winter, I was in my car waiting to get tested, but thankfully I only had a cold.   I don't know the back story, but a gentleman was trying to get into the hospital that was closed to the public, and was charging from across the parking lot with balled fists.  The hospital security and police staff were telling him to stand down, but he kept on coming.   Then all hell broke loose, and he was saying something about a loved one and just need to tell the doctor something, as they over powered him and hauled him away.
> 
> People have absolutely lost their minds in the last nearly two years of dealing with this.   I don't doubt the story at all, especially after seeing all the "Karen" examples out on social media.   Hell if you told me it was MTG or the other nut job in congress, I wouldn't have questioned the story any less.



The be clear, my skepticism is about the response to a broken nose, potential concussion and immediate resignation as a physician, not about being punched. The hospital I worked at, half the patients were honestly convinced they knew more about medicine than I do and I've had family members who wanted to beat me up too. My wife is regularly called a "bitch" by patients.


----------



## rdrr

P_X said:


> The be clear, my skepticism is about the response to a broken nose, potential concussion and immediate resignation as a physician, not about being punched. The hospital I worked at, half the patients were honestly convinced they knew more about medicine than I do and I've had family members who wanted to beat me up too. My wife is regularly called a "bitch" by patients.



 Ah gotcha, no worries.  I am usually skeptical myself, but as of late...  the constant crazy coming from the right has made me believe just about anything.


----------



## User.45

Today's HC awardee...



Holy shit this lung.

Normal Chest Xray for comparison:


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> He's a faux news employee, he's going to hide behind magic context.  He'll claim he was just using "colorful" language to help make his point because he's so emotional about the topic, for when one confronts Dr. Fauci with some supposed list of "facts" from reddit.  It's a continuation of the stupid every since we had Palin and her targets all those years ago.  Yes the f-wit full well knows what he is saying is incendiary, but of course doesn't want to deal the consequences if some nut ( that he is fully aware is out there ) does get motivated by his words.



The DOJ should make it clear that anyone who issues threats like this will be prosecuted no matter what their claims. At some point, these Fox "News" people will have to be held accountable.


----------



## Yoused

Off-duty police officer in Missouri approaches a school bus driver and tells the driver that they are breaking the law by wearing a mask. This is premised on an "executive order" prohibiting mask mandates in the show me state.

TYT video rant


----------



## rdrr

TLDR; QAnon conference was a super spreader event, but the attendees think they were poisoned with Anthrax.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473678437978148867/


----------



## User.45

rdrr said:


> TLDR; QAnon conference was a super spreader event, but the attendees think they were poisoned with Anthrax.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473678437978148867/



Is this a parody?


----------



## JayMysteri0

rdrr said:


> TLDR; QAnon conference was a super spreader event, but the attendees think they were poisoned with Anthrax.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473678437978148867/



I love how it's picking up in the news



> People Got Sick at a Conspiracy Conference. They’re Sure It’s Anthrax.
> 
> 
> The fact that the conference was likely a COVID outbreak and superspreader event has been almost entirely ignored.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.vice.com





> A group of unvaccinated people who attended a huge conspiracy conference in Dallas earlier this month all became sick in the days after the event with symptoms like coughing, shortness of breath, and fever. Instead of blaming the global COVID pandemic, however, the conspiracy theorists think they were attacked with anthrax.
> 
> 
> This far-right conspiracy claim began after a dozen people spent time together in a confined space at the ReAwaken America tour event in Dallas over the weekend of Dec. 10. And the fact that this was likely a COVID outbreak and superspreader event has been almost entirely ignored.




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473737107025891334/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473741398025326594/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473678868473167882/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1473684829342420993/

Twitter still collectively writes the best material.


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> Ghost of Gene Rayburn of House Moderna said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And WTF kind of church uses a fog machine?? Is the pastor a pro wrestler or something?
Click to expand...


Well, obviously it is a eucharistical thing: "_This Bread is the Body of Christ, this Wine is His Blood, and this Fog is His Holy After-Last-Supper Farts_"


----------



## JayMysteri0

This is the kind of thing that makes you look at anyone promoting anti vax b.s., and desperately try NOT to backhand slap them as they open their mouths.  It isn't that all of them do this, but when your movement is dependent on this shit you want to b smack the lot of them.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1474170115524550661/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1474120049367695368/


----------



## fooferdoggie

The Good Not News: The wife of a restaurant owner who defied COVID mandates to keep his restaurant open to pay for her cancer treatment is "doing great". Read the article for the Bad News








						Branch County restaurant owner who defied Michigan shutdowns dies of Covid
					






					www.deadlinedetroit.com


----------



## Alli

fooferdoggie said:


> The Good Not News: The wife of a restaurant owner who defied COVID mandates to keep his restaurant open to pay for her cancer treatment is "doing great". Read the article for the Bad News
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Branch County restaurant owner who defied Michigan shutdowns dies of Covid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.deadlinedetroit.com



This speaks to the failure of America’s handling of so many things on so many levels. Just tragic.


----------



## JayMysteri0

If true, FUCK these people!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1474351489929805827/

Season or not, charges need to be pressed.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1474527760991363073/


----------



## fooferdoggie

no real surprise here.
Whopping 62 Percent of Unvaccinated People Say They’ll NEVER Get a Covid Shot of Any Kind​




						Outline - Read & annotate without distractions
					

Outline is a free service for reading and annotating news articles. We remove the clutter so you can analyze and comment on the content.




					outline.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

nothing shuts up a antivaxxer like a ventilator. wonder if he will reawaken after his reawaken event?
Anti-Vax Podcaster Reportedly On Ventilator For COVID After Attending Right-Wing Rally​A podcaster who opposed the COVID-19 vaccine contracted the disease and was on a ventilator Saturday after he attended the right-wing “ReAwaken America” event in Dallas early this month, according to his podcast network and conspiracy theorist attorney Lin Wood.








						Right-Wing Podcaster Reportedly On Ventilator For COVID After Attending Rally
					

Doug Kuzma posed with supplies of ivermectin, which the FDA and CDC have warned against using to treat COVID-19.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Runs For Fun

More


----------



## fooferdoggie

Airline Annie yells at, punches, and spits on an old man during a Delta flight. Why? Because he isn't wearing a mask. Fark: Neither is she
https://twitter.com/ATLUncensored/status/1474552407707242498?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1474552407707242498|twgr^|twcon^s1_c10&ref_url=https://www.cbs46.com/news/passenger-taken-into-fbi-custody-after-altercation-on-flight-to-atlanta/article_bb400288-665c-11ec-8b08-57aab4e81510.html


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1475228993712386049/


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1475228993712386049/



To be fair, SoccerMom189 did her own research.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> Airline Annie yells at, punches, and spits on an old man during a Delta flight. Why? Because he isn't wearing a mask. Fark: Neither is she
> https://twitter.com/ATLUncensored/status/1474552407707242498?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1474552407707242498|twgr^|twcon^s1_c10&ref_url=https://www.cbs46.com/news/passenger-taken-into-fbi-custody-after-altercation-on-flight-to-atlanta/article_bb400288-665c-11ec-8b08-57aab4e81510.html



Last I heard Delta is still requiring masks, but there is no excuse for assault.


----------



## ronntaylor

fooferdoggie said:


> Airline Annie yells at, punches, and spits on an old man during a Delta flight. Why? Because he isn't wearing a mask. Fark: Neither is she
> https://twitter.com/ATLUncensored/status/1474552407707242498?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1474552407707242498|twgr^|twcon^s1_c10&ref_url=https://www.cbs46.com/news/passenger-taken-into-fbi-custody-after-altercation-on-flight-to-atlanta/article_bb400288-665c-11ec-8b08-57aab4e81510.html



Seems like Sky Karen was set off by the beverage cart blocking her getting back to her seat. The absence of a mask on the guy that called out her ridiculous comparison came later. She also assaulted flight crew members. Her ass is mos def on the no-fly list!









						Delta Passenger's Rosa Parks Remark Led To Fight, Arrest
					

A retort about Rosa Parks sparked the incident that saw a Delta passenger arrested.




					www.tmz.com
				






> Cornwall allegedly asked the flight attendant for help finding her seat and was told to find an open seat until beverage service was over, because it was a short flight.
> 
> Well, that seemed to piss off Cornwall ... the docs say she responded to the flight attendant, "What am I Rosa Parks?" ... and that's when her alleged victim told her she "isn't Black ... this isn't Alabama and this isn't a bus."


----------



## fooferdoggie

Huntn said:


> Last I heard Delta is still requiring masks, but there is no excuse for assault.



well now she can wear a mask in the federal lockup. so much Christmas fun.


----------



## fooferdoggie

so sad poor little woo woo
I have a fake COVID-19 vaccine card. My best friend won’t speak to me. Don’t I have the right to make these decisions for myself?​








						I have a fake COVID-19 vaccine card. My best friend won't speak to me. Don't I have the right to make these decisions for myself?
					

‘I’m fed up with the government telling me what to do, and I’m fed up with omicron.’




					www.marketwatch.com


----------



## Herdfan

Here you go.  But still waiting for CNN or ESPN to call him out:


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Here you go.  But still waiting for CNN or ESPN to call him out:
> 
> View attachment 10625



Looks like LeBron’s been hanging out with Kyrie too much or something.

What is the CNN connection?


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> What is the CNN connection?




If Tucker had posted this, Brian Stelter would have foaming at the mouth and dedicating his whole show to it.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> well now she can wear a mask in the federal lockup. so much Christmas fun.



There are actually people who just don’t realize the environment they are in when they cause trouble on an airplane interfering with a flight crew, especially when alcohol is involved.

Many years ago, I was taking (pilot, retired now) a load of passengers to Calgary for Christmas on a DC9 and this one guy heading there to visit family, had been drinking, trying to have conversations with other passengers, and if they did not respond favorably to him, he’d threaten them with things like _I’ll beat your ass when we get off this airplane_. It’s like he thought he was in a bar.

The flight attendants were not afraid of him and told him to be quiet several times and were calling me several,times on the flight deck. _We just can’t get him to shut up_. So I finally called ahead and had the Mounties met the plane. He knew he was in trouble because as passengers were getting off he just sat in his chair and started crying.

As they escorted him off the plane, a flight attendant said, he had told her _I could blow up this airplane! _I was like, _Holy crap, this guy is an idiot. _But based on observing what went on, I told  her, _you can tell the Mounties if you think it is necessary_, realizing that this would land this poor, drunk, crying passenger into more serious trouble, than he was already in. 

As it was I talked to the local police chief, the next day submitted a report for the Canadian authorities, and they told me they were going to let him of jail the day after so he could spend Christmas with his relatives. I wonder how that went?  Anyway I don’t know what the leagal consequences were, but on the commercial airplane it’s not the place where you want to let your inner child loose.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> If Tucker had posted this, Brian Stelter would have foaming at the mouth and dedicating his whole show to it.



Sorry I don’t get it. I don’t have cable, so I’m clearly missing some pieces here.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> Sorry I don’t get it. I don’t have cable, so I’m clearly missing some pieces here.



Something something the libs would be furious if the right posted this.


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> Something something the libs would be furious if the right posted this.



Ok got it. There are plenty of athletes posting ill-informed statements about the virus. Perhaps LeBron is considered different in some way by the right than the other athletes.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Ok got it. There are plenty of athletes posting ill-informed statements about the virus. Perhaps LeBron is considered different in some way by the right than the other athletes.




Not by the right, he is just probably the most famous athlete in North America and Top 5 in the world.  So people listen to what he says even though they probably shouldn't.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Herdfan said:


> Not by the right, he is just probably the most famous athlete in North America and Top 5 in the world.  So people listen to what he says even though they probably shouldn't.



People listening to celebrities/athletes for medical advice is one of the dumbest things ever.


----------



## Renzatic

Runs For Fun said:


> People listening to celebrities/athletes for medical advice is one of the dumbest things ever.




But Dr. J...


----------



## SuperMatt

Renzatic said:


> But Dr. J...



His advice is right up there with Dr. Pepper and Dr. Phil


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> If Tucker had posted this, Brian Stelter would have foaming at the mouth and dedicating his whole show to it.



I wasn't sure what Lebron meant by this meme when I first saw it. Suggesting equivalence between COVID-19, the flu, and colds, maybe? It's certainly odd. But I caught the tail end of Joy Reid's show earlier, and they seemed to be calling Lebron out for posting it.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1475617300317310980/

Burger King is the hill they chose?

I'm not even... MLK?


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1475617300317310980/
> 
> Burger King is the hill they chose?
> 
> I'm not even... MLK?



Dinner and a show!


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> People listening to celebrities/athletes for medical advice is one of the dumbest things ever.



^This. Honestly, listening to celebrities'/athletes' advice outside the stuff they got famous for is one of the reason our society can act so incredibly dumb.


----------



## Herdfan

Roller said:


> I wasn't sure what Lebron meant by this meme when I first saw it. *Suggesting equivalence between COVID-19, the flu, and colds, maybe?* It's certainly odd. But I caught the tail end of Joy Reid's show earlier, and they seemed to be calling Lebron out for posting it.




That's how I interpreted it.  Glad to hear him being called out.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> That's how I interpreted it.  Glad to hear him being called out.



Why? I don’t recall you asking for this guy to be called out:



> “Flu season is coming up! Many people every year, sometimes over 100,000, and despite the Vaccine, die from the Flu,” Trump tweeted on Tuesday morning. “Are we going to close down our Country? No, we have learned to live with it, just like we are learning to live with Covid, in most populations far less lethal!!!”




When the president of the United States, whose job it is to keep America safe, regularly compares COVID to the flu, you don’t bat an eye. When a black basketball player does it, you are “glad to hear him being called out.”

You voted for Trump, shouldn’t you be cheering LeBron for possibly insinuating through a meme what Trump openly said?









						All The Times Trump Compared Covid-19 To The Flu, Even After He Knew Covid-19 Was Far More Deadly
					

"We lose thousands and thousands of people a year to the flu. We don't turn the country off," Trump said in March.




					www.forbes.com


----------



## Huntn

An analysis on National Public Radio concluded that we have all the tools we need to put COVID behind us, yet (at least in the US)…politics and social media are the obstacles.
From here on out, my analysis. Do we have the liberty to be stupid? Sometimes yes, and sometimes no. 

A major political party decided that either science was liberal or more likely, 
this was a golden opportunity to rile up not only the anti-vaxers, but their home grown dummies that this was not only a liberal plot,
that COVID was a made up Democrat plot, at one point an imagined threat, 
and was an attack on their liberty,
and the dummies would be ignorant of past health crises and the recognized ability of States to clamp down on our liberties during health crisises/pandemics/and National emergencies.
Think back during WWII, _I’m not going to lower my blackout shades fir some damn liberal plot to limit my libertay! _


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> Why? I don’t recall you asking for this guy to be called out:
> 
> 
> 
> When the president of the United States, whose job it is to keep America safe, regularly compares COVID to the flu, you don’t bat an eye. When a black basketball player does it, you are “glad to hear him being called out.”
> 
> You voted for Trump, shouldn’t you be cheering LeBron for possibly insinuating through a meme what Trump openly said?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All The Times Trump Compared Covid-19 To The Flu, Even After He Knew Covid-19 Was Far More Deadly
> 
> 
> "We lose thousands and thousands of people a year to the flu. We don't turn the country off," Trump said in March.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.forbes.com



Meanwhile
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476256115742572544/


----------



## Alli

This has to go here. Our mayor is hopeless.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Typhoid Mary gets his just dues.​Self-Proclaimed ‘Plague Spreader’ Dies of COVID After Boasting About Maskless Grocery Store Stunt​









						Self-Proclaimed ‘Plague Spreader’ Dies of COVID After Boasting About Maskless Grocery Store Stunt
					

via YouTubeAn Italian anti-vaxxer and COVID-denier who sparked outrage after declaring himself a “plague spreader” and boasting about how he walked around sick and maskless in a supermarket has died of COVID-19, according to local media reports.Maurizio Buratti, also known as Mauro from Mantua...




					news.yahoo.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Imagine if we had this here?
Australian man charged after allegedly partying at nightclub despite positive COVID test​








						Australian man charged after allegedly partying at nightclub despite positive COVID test
					

A 19 year old South Australian man was arrested when health officials said he went to a nightclub despite testing positive for COVID earlier that day.



					www.usatoday.com


----------



## SuperMatt

English anti-vaxxers storm a testing and tracing site, wrongly thinking it is a vaccination site.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476232714328154127/


----------



## SuperMatt

Just to show there can be multiple levels of stupidity when it comes to COVID and statistics.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476552289469059080/

This is blowing up on Twitter, with tons of people repeating it. The problem is:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476618321911025670/

60% of the unvaccinated are Republicans. That does NOT mean 60% of Republicans are unvaccinated.

It’s still stupid that Republicans are (literally) dying on the hill of vaccine refusal because of Trump, but at least get the facts straight, folks...

  









						Unvaccinated Adults are Now More Than Three Times as Likely to Lean Republican than Democratic
					

A new KFF COVID-19 Vaccine Monitor analysis finds that Republicans and Republican leaning independents, who represent 41% of adults, now make up 60% of the adult unvaccinated population across the …




					www.kff.org
				



(Original source)


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

SuperMatt said:


> English anti-vaxxers storm a testing and tracing site, wrongly thinking it is a vaccination site.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476232714328154127/




It’s scary how many of these thick morons are about. There’s a British doctor who up until 2011 was a scientist at Pfizer (not in vaccines) and has become an activist for anti-vaxx since the pandemic started. I’m seeing quite a few people sharing his theories which have all been debunked, all over my social media. People I had previously thought were intelligent or at least semi intelligent. The result of reading these things is the video you’ve shared and I can only hope they were all exposed and all get covid.


----------



## fooferdoggie

And now, shopping cart shenanigans. Xanax sold separately


----------



## Roller

fooferdoggie said:


> And now, shopping cart shenanigans. Xanax sold separately



The woman blocking the aisle is especially stupid and obnoxious. She's worried about getting infected, but isn't wearing a mask and thinks that a few feet of separation will make a difference to her risk. I also like her use of oft-repeated meaningless lines and threats: "You're fired!" (as if she has any say) and "You don't know who you're dealing with!" Yes, we do know who we're dealing with.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Don’t you dare drag Betty White into this. Sickening


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476935954615185412/


----------



## Huntn

Runs For Fun said:


> Don’t you dare drag Betty White into this. Sickening



Those people… __


----------



## fooferdoggie

Error-riddled Virginia teachers union letter gets roasted on social media don't send covid info out if you cant spell.​









						Error-riddled Virginia teachers union letter gets roasted on social media
					

A sloppily written letter from a Virginia teachers union calling for more protections against the coronavirus has gone viral on Twitter.




					nypost.com


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> Error-riddled Virginia teachers union letter gets roasted on social media don't send covid info out if you cant spell.​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Error-riddled Virginia teachers union letter gets roasted on social media
> 
> 
> A sloppily written letter from a Virginia teachers union calling for more protections against the coronavirus has gone viral on Twitter.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> nypost.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 10708



It was probably their spell checker…   my rule for important communication that has been typed out,  is to read it out loud before finalizing. Reading it silently is better than nothing, but you can miss things that way, that I will catch when said out loud.


----------



## Huntn

New category COVID Sinister, or maybe she‘s just drunk on her own Koolaid? Naw this is hearding the sheep Imo, as she screams _MY LIBERTAY!!!_
It makes you wonder why the Congress does not have an enforceable  dishonesty clause??


Lil Ms Donnie​
Twitter permanently suspends Marjorie Taylor Greene account over COVID-19 misinformation​








						Twitter permanently suspends Greene’s account over COVID-19 misinformation
					

Twitter said on Sunday it permanently suspended the personal account of Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) over the social media platform’s COVID-19 misinformation policy.The social network said i…




					thehill.com
				




_Twitter said on Sunday it permanently suspended the personal account of Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) over the social media platform’s COVID-19 misinformation policy.

The social network said in a statement that it took the action after "repeated violations" of the policy.

“We permanently suspended the account you referenced (@mtgreenee) for repeated violations of our COVID-19 misinformation policy. We’ve been clear that, per our strike system for this policy, we will permanently suspend accounts for repeated violations of the policy,” a Twitter spokesperson told The Hill in a statement_


----------



## Huntn

SuperMatt said:


> English anti-vaxxers storm a testing and tracing site, wrongly thinking it is a vaccination site.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1476232714328154127/



Almost reassuring we in the US maybe don’t have exclusive World wide rights to STUPID.


----------



## Thomas Veil

SuperMatt said:


> It’s still stupid that Republicans are (literally) dying on the hill of vaccine refusal






Huntn said:


> Almost reassuring we in the US maybe don’t have exclusive World wide rights to STUPID.




This guy isn’t American, but he stands a pretty good chance of dying on that hill.

*Man Lights Himself on Fire After New Year's Day Rant Against Vaccine Mandates*









						Man lights himself on fire after New Year's Day rant against vaccine mandates
					

"It was on purpose. He was screaming about mandates. He was screaming 'no vax ID,'" said a witness.




					www.newsweek.com


----------



## Herdfan

Huntn said:


> It was probably their spell checker…   my rule for important communication that has been typed out,  is to read it out loud before finalizing. Reading it silently is better than nothing, but you can miss things that way, that I will catch when said out loud.




They claim the "draft" went out instead of the final version.    Riiiiiight.


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Joe

fooferdoggie said:


> And now, shopping cart shenanigans. Xanax sold separately




This is why I curbside my groceries now.  So I can avoid jail time for running into these types of people and kicking their ass.  

On the second clip I had a similar incident a few years ago. I went to check out and there was a basket full of stuff blocking the checkout line and no one around. I look around and I don’t see anyone there. So I move the basket and put my stuff on the belt. Several minutes later some lady comes. At this point I’m already almost done. That’s how long she was gone. She’s looking at me with this face like she wants to say something because I moved her basket out of the way. I gave her back this look like I dare you to. She didn’t say anything but I could tell she was thinking about it.


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## rdrr

So I think I fell into a Covid Stupidity trap today on Facebook.  Was browsing a Covid info for traveling in and out of Italy group, and someone was expressing how they were positive in Italy but there kids were not and were wondering if there was anything they could do to shorten their quarantine time, (10 - 21 days and up to the Italian Government.)   

Someone posted how they should gargle and nasal flush with Iodine.  WTF?!?

I thought we had gotten over this, but when I researched it I see a lot of info on how it cures Covid instantly, and it looks like it's the latest trend in doing anything but getting the jab and wearing masks.   Then when I replied (my mistake) "This is mis-information please don't do this."   I was told "Don't look up", as if that movie was an allegory for the anti-vax/anti-science folks, and somehow I was the idiot.   It really ruined my day and I wonder, how the F do we turn this ship around or is it too late?


----------



## fooferdoggie

one local news show their Facebook posts get flooded with antivaxxers. I had to stop reading it as they envier did anything unless you called one of them idiots. then you got banned.


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> They claim the "draft" went out instead of the final version.    Riiiiiight.



Somehow that’s even worse. That’s straight out incompetence.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Just found out my uncle had a heart attack the other day.  As if that wasn't bad enough, he couldn't get into the local hospital because all the beds are full with covid patients.  So he had to be air lifted to another hospital an hour & minutes away.  ( I know an ambulance ride minutes away can be up to $400, I can't imagine what air lifting costs ) As if that isn't an imposition enough, family now need to travel all that way to be with him.

Seriously, I don't wish ill ( literally ) on the anti vaxxers or covid deniers that are now suffering from possible legitimate beliefs, but fuck all if your a selfish twat in your feelings wanting to own libs believing that the guy who wanted to ignore the pandemic should still be in charge so you won't take medicine.   Again it's this fucking selfishness and no fucks given for others that will condemn & harm others who shouldn't be.  Some people can't think past their own feelings about the domino effect this has on others, those who are working too damn hard taking care of them, and those that suffer who have loved ones at risk.

It used to be you were afraid of going to the hospital, because going to the hospital understandably sucks.  Waiting seemingly endlessly to be finally seen if it's in the emergency room, the costs, the reasons that warrant you even finally dragging yourself reluctantly... NOW you have to consider that even if you did force yourself, they may not be able to help you because of some knuckle dragging natural immunity didn't work out so well for them nor horse dewormer _______________ now fill all the beds & hallways, so going to the hospital maybe even less of an option.


----------



## rdrr

JayMysteri0 said:


> Just found out my uncle had a heart attack the other day.  As if that wasn't bad enough, he couldn't get into the local hospital because all the beds are full with covid patients.  So he had to be air lifted to another hospital an hour & minutes away.  ( I know an ambulance ride minutes away can be up to $400, I can't imagine what air lifting costs ) As if that isn't an imposition enough, family now need to travel all that way to be with him.
> 
> Seriously, I don't wish ill ( literally ) on the anti vaxxers or covid deniers that are now suffering from possible legitimate beliefs, but fuck all if your a selfish twat in your feelings wanting to own libs believing that the guy who wanted to ignore the pandemic should still be in charge so you won't take medicine.   Again it's this fucking selfishness and no fucks given for others that will condemn & harm others who shouldn't be.  Some people can't think past their own feelings about the domino effect this has on others, those who are working too damn hard taking care of them, and those that suffer who have loved ones at risk.
> 
> It used to be you were afraid of going to the hospital, because going to the hospital understandably sucks.  Waiting seemingly endlessly to be finally seen if it's in the emergency room, the costs, the reasons that warrant you even finally dragging yourself reluctantly... NOW you have to consider that even if you did force yourself, they may not be able to help you because of some knuckle dragging natural immunity didn't work out so well for them nor horse dewormer _______________ now fill all the beds & hallways, so going to the hospital maybe even less of an option.



Sorry about that, I hope he recovers quickly.   April 2020 my father had a stroke, and it was the height of the first wave, plus the uncertainty of the disease.  We weren't allowed to go visit him and had to rely on the meager communications with the hospital.  One afternoon, I got a call as the alternate healthcare proxy.  He was having seizures and I had to give permission for them to look and repair any damaged arteries in his brain.  We didn't hear that he survived for 12 - 15 hours or so. 

I think the hospitals today are just exhausted with the pandemic.  I was in a doctors office at the hospital just last week with my SO who had foot surgery in November.  She was having a follow up and there was a person hacking up a lung in the waiting room.  I assumed that they went through the same check-in process where you are screened to entered.   I do not know how they got past the desk, coughing as much as they were.


----------



## Herdfan

rdrr said:


> She was having a follow up and there was a person hacking up a lung in the waiting room.




Is your area back to the waiting room thing?  Most here are still "wait in your car and we'll text you."  Which both the wife and I prefer.


----------



## Runs For Fun

JayMysteri0 said:


> Just found out my uncle had a heart attack the other day. As if that wasn't bad enough, he couldn't get into the local hospital because all the beds are full with covid patients. So he had to be air lifted to another hospital an hour & minutes away. ( I know an ambulance ride minutes away can be up to $400, I can't imagine what air lifting costs ) As if that isn't an imposition enough, family now need to travel all that way to be with him. Seriously, I don't wish ill ( literally ) on the anti vaxxers or covid deniers that are now suffering from possible legitimate beliefs, but fuck all if your a selfish twat in your feelings wanting to own libs believing that the guy who wanted to ignore the pandemic should still be in charge so you won't take medicine.  Again it's this fucking selfishness and no fucks given for others that will condemn & harm others who shouldn't be. Some people can't think past their own feelings about the domino effect this has on others, those who are working too damn hard taking care of them, and those that suffer who have loved ones at risk. It used to be you were afraid of going to the hospital, because going to the hospital understandably sucks. Waiting seemingly endlessly to be finally seen if it's in the emergency room, the costs, the reasons that warrant you even finally dragging yourself reluctantly... NOW you have to consider that even if you did force yourself, they may not be able to help you because of some knuckle dragging natural immunity didn't work out so well for them nor horse dewormer _______________ now fill all the beds & hallways, so going to the hospital maybe even less of an option.



So sorry he had to go through all that. This is what is infuriating with these antivaxxers. They think their decisions don’t affect anyone else. Fucking bullshit. They’re taking resources away from people that legitimately need care. Their hospital visit would be completely avoidable if they took a few minutes to get a fucking free and very safe vaccine. But nooooo, freedumbs and reasons.


----------



## rdrr

Herdfan said:


> Is your area back to the waiting room thing?  Most here are still "wait in your car and we'll text you."  Which both the wife and I prefer.



Yep, in Boston or at least this hospital which is actually in Cambridge and the teaching hospital for a certain university right next door.


----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> Just found out my uncle had a heart attack the other day.  As if that wasn't bad enough, he couldn't get into the local hospital because all the beds are full with covid patients.  So he had to be air lifted to another hospital an hour & minutes away.  ( I know an ambulance ride minutes away can be up to $400, I can't imagine what air lifting costs ) As if that isn't an imposition enough, family now need to travel all that way to be with him.
> 
> Seriously, I don't wish ill ( literally ) on the anti vaxxers or covid deniers that are now suffering from possible legitimate beliefs, but fuck all if your a selfish twat in your feelings wanting to own libs believing that the guy who wanted to ignore the pandemic should still be in charge so you won't take medicine.   Again it's this fucking selfishness and no fucks given for others that will condemn & harm others who shouldn't be.  Some people can't think past their own feelings about the domino effect this has on others, those who are working too damn hard taking care of them, and those that suffer who have loved ones at risk.
> 
> It used to be you were afraid of going to the hospital, because going to the hospital understandably sucks.  Waiting seemingly endlessly to be finally seen if it's in the emergency room, the costs, the reasons that warrant you even finally dragging yourself reluctantly... NOW you have to consider that even if you did force yourself, they may not be able to help you because of some knuckle dragging natural immunity didn't work out so well for them nor horse dewormer _______________ now fill all the beds & hallways, so going to the hospital maybe even less of an option.




That sucks.  I hope your uncle recovers.

I was just saying yesterday, it's too bad an anti-vaxer isn't booted from their spot for real emergencies.  Let THEM be the ones to get air-lifted elsewhere or sent back home.  It's a public resource.  It's a shame it's being squandered by those who have no desire to do what they can to help relieve the burden.


----------



## shadow puppet

I am so deeply sorry @JayMysteri0 to read your news about your Uncle.  I hope he is recovering.


----------



## SuperMatt

Florida’s governor and Surgeon General are doubling down on the stupid today at an angry press conference.

TLDR: It’s all Biden’s fault, testing is worthless, masks don’t work,  lalalalala I can’t hear you!









						DeSantis Blames Feds, Slams ‘Hysteria’ as Florida Shatters COVID Records
					

Tom Brenner/ReutersFlorida Gov. Ron DeSantis (R) blamed the Biden administration for COVID-19 woes in his state while accusing other state leaders of allowing “hysteria” to reign as they encourage mitigation measures against the virus that he claimed had little basis in sound science.“In terms...




					news.yahoo.com
				




Ladapo, the surgeon general...


> Ladapo on Monday also said he hoped to “unwind the testing mentality the federal government has gotten us into over the last two years,” after Florida reported more than 298,000 new COVID-19 cases last week and a test positivity rate of 26.5 percent.
> 
> “It’s important people are making decisions they want about vaccinations, and *enjoy the fact that many people have natural immunity*,” he said.



Yes, *enjoy* your COVID infection and hospitalization, everybody.

DeSantis, the governor:


> The governor insisted—despite ample evidence to the contrary—that masks were largely ineffective and that kids “do not need to be doing any crazy mitigation.”
> 
> “Just let them be kids,” he said. “I think it’s pretty clear, a lot of this mitigation, it hasn’t worked period.”
> 
> DeSantis drilled down on masks in particular, shredding Dr. Anthony Fauci and other experts, who have continued to defend their use claiming that “it’s not ultimately really sound science.”
> 
> “You even see some of these TV doctors on CNN admitting that cloth masks are not going to stop—protect against Omicron,” DeSantis said. “Simply putting cloth over and thinking that somehow that is going to provide good protection, that’s just not accurate.”


----------



## fooferdoggie

surgeon general my ass.


----------



## fischersd

fooferdoggie said:


> surgeon general my ass.



Likely got his medical degree from Trump University.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> surgeon general my ass.



The surgeon general is neither a surgeon nor a general… discuss!


----------



## SuperMatt

fischersd said:


> Likely got his medical degree from Trump University.



He actually got it from Harvard… but for some reason he has embraced some insane ideas since. But he isn’t a surgeon.

I’m guessing he wants to move further in politics, so he’s willing to abandon the Hippocratic oath, like many other doctors who follow similar paths.





__





						Joseph Ladapo - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org


----------



## fooferdoggie

now this is funny.
Woman strips down to underwear and uses dress as face mask in front of shocked family










						Woman strips to underwear and uses dress as face mask as bemused family watches
					

In a shocking display of dedication to Covid rules, a woman was caught on camera stripping off in an ice cream parlour in front of two children and their dad - who seemed to be sneaking a peek




					www.dailystar.co.uk


----------



## fooferdoggie

well that was a easy change of mind for sure.

A Covid-19 survivor came out of a coma after 65 days. Now she supports vaccinations​








						A Covid-19 survivor came out of a coma after 65 days. Now she supports vaccinations
					

After spending two months in a coma due to Covid-19 earlier this year, a California woman is urging people to get vaccinated.




					www.cnn.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

fooferdoggie said:


> well that was a easy change of mind for sure.
> 
> A Covid-19 survivor came out of a coma after 65 days. Now she supports vaccinations​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A Covid-19 survivor came out of a coma after 65 days. Now she supports vaccinations
> 
> 
> After spending two months in a coma due to Covid-19 earlier this year, a California woman is urging people to get vaccinated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnn.com



Sad that it takes such extremes for some people to get their heads out of their asses.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

California Deputy DA Who Fought Vaccine Mandate Dies Abruptly After Falling Ill With COVID at Age 46
					

Kelly Ernby had reportedly spoken out against vaccine mandates at a Turning Point USA rally shortly before she became ill.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> He actually got it from Harvard…



You know who _else_ has a degree from Harvard? The old Crimson just ain't what it used to be.


----------



## Huntn

JayMysteri0 said:


> Just found out my uncle had a heart attack the other day.  As if that wasn't bad enough, he couldn't get into the local hospital because all the beds are full with covid patients.  So he had to be air lifted to another hospital an hour & minutes away.  ( I know an ambulance ride minutes away can be up to $400, I can't imagine what air lifting costs ) As if that isn't an imposition enough, family now need to travel all that way to be with him.
> 
> Seriously, I don't wish ill ( literally ) on the anti vaxxers or covid deniers that are now suffering from possible legitimate beliefs, but fuck all if your a selfish twat in your feelings wanting to own libs believing that the guy who wanted to ignore the pandemic should still be in charge so you won't take medicine.   Again it's this fucking selfishness and no fucks given for others that will condemn & harm others who shouldn't be.  Some people can't think past their own feelings about the domino effect this has on others, those who are working too damn hard taking care of them, and those that suffer who have loved ones at risk.
> 
> It used to be you were afraid of going to the hospital, because going to the hospital understandably sucks.  Waiting seemingly endlessly to be finally seen if it's in the emergency room, the costs, the reasons that warrant you even finally dragging yourself reluctantly... NOW you have to consider that even if you did force yourself, they may not be able to help you because of some knuckle dragging natural immunity didn't work out so well for them nor horse dewormer _______________ now fill all the beds & hallways, so going to the hospital maybe even less of an option.



Sorry to hear this. It really emphasizes how collective STUPID hurts all of us. I’ve talked about COVID related triage, the problem is that STUPID is ever present, filling up all the beds, and none held in reserve for legitimate* illness.

*Today for most cases, with the readily available solution, a vaccine made and provided FREE FOR ALL (US reference), 9 times out of 10 if you are seeking hospital assistance it’s because you were STUPID, you refused the solution, and now STUPID should be given the opportunity to really learn from STUPID’s  mistakes at the back of the line. The problem for hospitals is that they don’t leave empty $$$ beds.


----------



## lizkat

Yoused said:


> You know who _else_ has a degree from Harvard? The old Crimson just ain't what it used to be.




Well in some ways it is (e.g. graduates still coasting on their or its laurels) but the world at large may be less generous these days about hiding the incompetence of incompetents from any venue including elite universities.


----------



## Huntn

Yoused said:


> You know who _else_ has a degree from Harvard? The old Crimson just ain't what it used to be.






lizkat said:


> Well in some ways it is (e.g. graduates still coasting on their or its laurels) but the world at large may be less generous these days about hiding the incompetence of incompetents from any venue including elite universities.



Wealth  distorts everything, not always for the better.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> California Deputy DA Who Fought Vaccine Mandate Dies Abruptly After Falling Ill With COVID at Age 46
> 
> 
> Kelly Ernby had reportedly spoken out against vaccine mandates at a Turning Point USA rally shortly before she became ill.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com



Herman Cain would be proud.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> Herman Cain would be proud.



Cause and effect…


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> Is your area back to the waiting room thing?  Most here are still "wait in your car and we'll text you."  Which both the wife and I prefer.



Our vet did that. Sit in the car with the cats until someone comes to get you. My doctor? Fuggetaboutit. Waiting room has always been packed and I had to recommend they put hand sanitizer next to the self-check-in screens.


----------



## Yoused

Huntn said:


> Wealth  distorts everything, *not always* for the better.



I think the phrase you want there is "very rarely".


----------



## SuperMatt

An extreme right-wing judge appointed by George W Bush has ruled that Navy SEALs don’t have to comply with vaccine requirements. This will almost assuredly be tossed out on appeal, because it's really absurd. The amount of precedent allowing the military to mandate vaccinations is overwhelming. This judge cares nothing for precedent or the law. He just cares about his personal agenda.









						Judge blocks Pentagon from punishing Navy SEALs who refused COVID vaccine
					

A Texas federal judge has barred the Defense Department from penalizing 35 Navy SEALs who refused to get vaccinated against COVID-19 on religious grounds.




					nypost.com
				




His rulings have been shut down on appeal many times, but he keeps issuing garbage rulings regardless. Examples: trying to invalidate the entire Affordable Care Act, allowing companies to fire people for being gay, asserting that white farmers are being discriminated against because of a debt relief program for black farmers... Yep, he is the poster child for the racist right. Great appointment, Dubya.





__





						Reed O'Connor - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				












						After years of injustice, Black farmers had a shot at debt relief. Then Stephen Miller stepped in.
					

Right-wing political operatives have launched a swarm of lawsuits to oppose funding for farmers of color.




					www.motherjones.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

It’s sad this needs to be said 








						Betty White did not die after getting a COVID-19 booster shot, agent confirms
					

White died on Dec. 31, just a few weeks shy of her 100th birthday.




					www.mlive.com


----------



## Clix Pix

What idiots are throwing around that false story about her death being due to a booster shot!?  Anti-vaxxers, of course.....  Sheesh!  That is just disgusting.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

Huntn said:


> Almost reassuring we in the US maybe don’t have exclusive World wide rights to STUPID.




Wasn’t the modern anti-vaxx movement started by a British Doctor who published false information about the MMR vaccine and was struck off in the UK? He relocated to America where the anti-establishment and distrust of the government culture was a perfect platform for his lies. Not saying Americans are more impressionable 

I have found with covid conspiracy theories, a lot of the sources come from American doctors, or websites now. There is a retired virologist called Mike Yeadon who has found fame spreading misinformation about the vaccines here and he is trusted by anti-vaxxers because he’s ‘a doctor’ and once worked for ‘Pfizer’ until 2011, although he didn’t work with vaccines whilst there! lol Still an expert though


----------



## Huntn

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> Wasn’t the modern anti-vaxx movement started by a British Doctor who published false information about the MMR vaccine and was struck off in the UK? He relocated to America where the anti-establishment and distrust of the government culture was a perfect platform for his lies. Not saying Americans are more impressionable
> 
> I have found with covid conspiracy theories, a lot of the sources come from American doctors, or websites now. There is a retired virologist called Mike Yeadon who has found fame spreading misinformation about the vaccines here and he is trusted by anti-vaxxers because he’s ‘a doctor’ and once worked for ‘Pfizer’ until 2011, although he didn’t work with vaccines whilst there! lol Still an expert though



I honestly don’t know. This article covers the history, Britain had a vaccination law in 1853, and it identifies the start of the modern anti-vax movement, for the latter, names are mentioned, but not countries. The first I remember was the doctor in the 1980s (?) who claimed vaccinations gave children autism with zero evidence.









						History of the Anti-Vaccine Movement
					

From those who protested the first vaccines to pandering pediatricians and celebrities, here's when the anti-vaccine movement all began.




					www.verywellhealth.com
				




_1982 _​_Among the leading figures of the movement was Lea Thompson, a reporter who in 1982 created a national debate with her television documentary, DPT: Vaccine Roulette. The program, which linked a vast range of childhood disabilities to the DTaP vaccine, led to numerous lawsuits against the vaccine's manufacturers._

_1984 _​_In 1984, Dr. Robert Mendelsohn, a self-proclaimed "medical heretic" and one of the first anti-vaccine pediatricians, wrote the book The Medical Time Bomb of Immunization Against Disease in which he asserted that the pertussis vaccine could cause brain damage or retardation.9

In addition to deriding vaccines, Mendelsohn spoke actively against the fluoridization of the water supply, coronary bypass surgery, the licensing of nutritionists, and routine breast cancer screening.10_

I can’t but help think of Dr. Strangelove and precious bodily fluids… 

*Update*, I found your Brit, but we had enough stupid over here to run with it. 









						The Vaccine-Autism Myth Started 20 Years Ago. It Still Endures Today
					

It's the 20th anniversary of an infamous article linking vaccines to autism




					time.com
				



The vaccine-autism myth is one chilling example of fraudulent science. February 28, 2018 marks the 20th anniversary of an infamous article published in the prestigious medical journal, _The Lancet_, in which Andrew Wakefield, a former British doctor, falsely linked the MMR (measles, mumps and rubella) vaccine to autism.


----------



## Herdfan

If Flori


Alli said:


> Our vet did that. Sit in the car with the cats until someone comes to get you. My doctor? Fuggetaboutit. Waiting room has always been packed and I had to recommend they put hand sanitizer next to the self-check-in screens.




So far our vet, the wife's chiropractor and our dentist is doing that.  They just text when it is your time.  I'm sure it slows them down a couple of minutes because it takes more time to come in from the car vs. being in the waiting room.

But the wife's chiropractor talked to me about closing off 3/4 of his waiting room to become his office and turning his old office into a treatment room.  It wasn't feasible because we would have had to move the bathrooms but he was prepared to do away with the majority of his waiting room permanently.  He needed to keep a few chairs because some patients walked or got dropped off.


----------



## rdrr

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> Wasn’t the modern anti-vaxx movement started by a British Doctor who published false information about the MMR vaccine and was struck off in the UK? He relocated to America where the anti-establishment and distrust of the government culture was a perfect platform for his lies. Not saying Americans are more impressionable
> 
> I have found with covid conspiracy theories, a lot of the sources come from American doctors, or websites now. There is a retired virologist called Mike Yeadon who has found fame spreading misinformation about the vaccines here and he is trusted by anti-vaxxers because he’s ‘a doctor’ and once worked for ‘Pfizer’ until 2011, although he didn’t work with vaccines whilst there! lol Still an expert though



So the now defunct study wasn't saying vaccines were bad, just the specific combined MMR vaccine was purportedly tied to autism.  He was proposing that instead the child gets three painful shots instead of the one MMR, and oh who's name was on the replacement measles vaccine?  You can guess...


----------



## Yoused

US science teacher arrested for vaccinating 17-year-old student
					

Police say the teacher is not trained to give vaccines and gave the jab to the boy at her home.



					www.bbc.co.uk
				




The lad wanted the shot. His parents were opposed. At 17, I think a person should be able to make that choice for themself.


----------



## ronntaylor

Yoused said:


> US science teacher arrested for vaccinating 17-year-old student
> 
> 
> Police say the teacher is not trained to give vaccines and gave the jab to the boy at her home.
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbc.co.uk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The lad wanted the shot. His parents were opposed. At 17, I think a person should be able to make that choice for themself.



Originally I had mixed emotions: the young man wanted it and as a responsible 17y.o. he did the right thing. Can't say the same for the teacher. She isn't a medical professional. So many things could have gone wrong. And it will just add fuel for anti-vaxxers' stupidity fires. She's out of the classroom, and possibly out of a job.


----------



## fooferdoggie

ronntaylor said:


> Originally I had mixed emotions: the young man wanted it and as a responsible 17y.o. he did the right thing. Can't say the same for the teacher. She isn't a medical professional. So many things could have gone wrong. And it will just add fuel for anti-vaxxers' stupidity fires. She's out of the classroom, and possibly out of a job.



yes I think its Fine he gets it but a teacher doing it?? thats so wonky.


----------



## Yoused

It is not like she taught math or history, she is (was) a _biology_ teacher. I suspect a biology teacher is not an idiot when it comes to things like that (unless her BA is from, say, Liberty).


----------



## ronntaylor

fooferdoggie said:


> yes I think its Fine he gets it but a teacher doing it?? thats so wonky.



And IIRC, the particular dosage used isn't permitted for those under 18. There should be a way for those that are eligible but encumbered by dumb parents to get vaccinated by *medical professionals *in a safe, efficient way.


----------



## ronntaylor

Yoused said:


> It is not like she taught math or history, she is (was) a _biology_ teacher. I suspect a biology teacher is not an idiot when it comes to things like that (unless her BA is from, say, Liberty).



But she isn't a medical professional. She supposedly used the J&J shot, even though (IIRC) only Pfizer is allowed for under 18.



> Video of the incident in Long Island appears to show Ms Russo telling the teenager: "You'll be fine, I hope."




Was the shot stored properly? Was it verified as unexpired? What was in place had he encountered adverse reactions? She's a flipping idiot and should lose her license to teach and if/when convicted, serve jail time. The fact that she could get up to four years if convicted should have been considered by this idiot.


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Eric

This happened with my electrician today. I flat out won't have anyone at my home who isn't vaccinated, even in the garage where I have to speak with them.


----------



## SuperMatt

The #1 male tennis player in the world has refused to get vaccinated. The Australian Open tournament organizers were going to let him play anyway ($$$$) but the Aussie government refused to let him in the country.









						Djokovic denied Australia entry, has visa canceled
					

Novak Djokovic has been denied entry into Australia after initially being granted a medical exemption for the country's COVID-19 vaccination requirements so that the world's No. 1-ranked tennis player could play in the Australian Open.




					www.espn.com


----------



## Joe

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> California Deputy DA Who Fought Vaccine Mandate Dies Abruptly After Falling Ill With COVID at Age 46
> 
> 
> Kelly Ernby had reportedly spoken out against vaccine mandates at a Turning Point USA rally shortly before she became ill.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com




Dying to own the libs


----------



## SuperMatt

The stupidity can turn dangerous. I’d love it if we could hold the people spreading the propaganda accountable.



> One of Parsia Jahanbani’s biggest fears was realized when a man calling healthcare workers “murderers” attacked him and other staff members outside a mobile vaccine clinic in Tustin last week, he said.
> 
> After a security guard asked the man to wear a mask, he became increasingly angry — claiming medical workers were complicit in a COVID-19 hoax and that “he was ‘not a sheep’ ” — said Jahanbani, the mobile operations manager for Families Together of Orange County, where the clinic was operating in the parking lot Dec. 30.
> 
> As Jahanbani, 37, and a medical assistant approached, the man — identified by police as Thomas Apollo, 43 — launched at them, landing a blow on Jahanbani, he said Tuesday. The medical assistant, who declined to be identified, tried to pull Apollo back and took “a few pretty strong punches” to his head, chest and back, Jahanbani said.












						Man attacks workers at Orange County COVID-19 vaccine clinic, calling them 'murderers'
					

It took seven police officers to restrain the man, who punched two healthcare workers before he was arrested, staffers said.




					www.latimes.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> The stupidity can turn dangerous. I’d love it if we could hold the people spreading the propaganda accountable.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Man attacks workers at Orange County COVID-19 vaccine clinic, calling them 'murderers'
> 
> 
> It took seven police officers to restrain the man, who punched two healthcare workers before he was arrested, staffers said.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com



we cant hold the king of covid misinformation responsible how will we hold his minions responsible?


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> we cant hold the king of covid misinformation responsible how will we hold his minions responsible?



We could, but the Republicans in the Senate said at the impeachment trial: “oh yes Trump was very naughty but it would just be wrong to make him go to bed early without his dessert. Here’s your ice cream, Donny.”

I know for a fact that Mitch and company know better, but they decided to let him run for office in the future anyway. That is a complete moral failure. As if Mitch ever had morals in the first place… but still.


----------



## SuperMatt

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> California Deputy DA Who Fought Vaccine Mandate Dies Abruptly After Falling Ill With COVID at Age 46
> 
> 
> Kelly Ernby had reportedly spoken out against vaccine mandates at a Turning Point USA rally shortly before she became ill.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com



I saw an alternate headline for the story:

Freedom-Loving Orange County Deputy DA Dies Of Freedom​


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> We could, but the Republicans in the Senate said at the impeachment trial: “oh yes Trump was very naughty but it would just be wrong to make him go to bed early without his dessert. Here’s your ice cream, Donny.”
> 
> I know for a fact that Mitch and company know better, but they decided to let him run for office in the future anyway. That is a complete moral failure. As if Mitch ever had morals in the first place… but still.



Mitch ran over his morals then backed up over them and ran over them again for good measure.


----------



## Huntn

Yoused said:


> US science teacher arrested for vaccinating 17-year-old student
> 
> 
> Police say the teacher is not trained to give vaccines and gave the jab to the boy at her home.
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbc.co.uk
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The lad wanted the shot. His parents were opposed. At 17, I think a person should be able to make that choice for themself.



How did the teacher get hold of a vaccine? Would that be a controlled substance?


----------



## DT

Huntn said:


> How did the teacher get hold of a vaccine? Would that be a controlled substance?




You can make it with common household supplies ...


----------



## Eric

DT said:


> You can make it with common household supplies ...



Nice to see another fellow Joe Rogan listener on here!


----------



## DT

Eric said:


> Nice to see another fellow Joe Rogan listener on here!




Yeah!  His formula was easy and I totally trust it to work - I'm a little concerned about the delivery method, something about a turkey baster and some lubricant ...


----------



## Eric

Sounds like it worked out for all involved.


At least he died doing what he loved... from
      WhitePeopleTwitter


----------



## Runs For Fun

This


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> This



They don’t demand to do their own research, or ask whether stem cells from the 1970s were used in the testing of the medicines? No religious exemptions requested?


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> This



well there are some that will leave when they dont get ivermectin. was watching Grays anatomy and they had one of the idiots who did not believe in covid and demanded a inhaler and died on the way out.


----------



## Joe

Eric said:


> Sounds like it worked out for all involved.
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/rxmasy




#TotsAndPears


----------



## User.45

I sorta miss pagers, because you always knew if it beeps, it's work. But then you look at it and see stuff like this:
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1479141084345290757/


----------



## Joe

I was a teen during the pager era. Never had one.

Y’all old lol jk


----------



## lizkat

JagRunner said:


> I was a teen during the pager era. Never had one.
> 
> Y’all old lol jk




I remember ensuring that on my crew only the people who worked for me had pagers.


----------



## User.45

JagRunner said:


> I was a teen during the pager era. Never had one.
> 
> Y’all old lol jk



Most healthcare organizations still use them.


----------



## Renzatic

DT said:


> You can make it with common household supplies ...




When you get right down to it, the vaccine is just witch hazel and kerosene. Anyone can make it themselves.


----------



## Joe

P_X said:


> Most healthcare organizations still use them.




Wild!


----------



## fischersd

JagRunner said:


> Wild!



Well, BlackBerry's were a lot more popular due to the guaranteed delivery as well as two-way communication....but we all know what happened to BlackBerry. 

SMS (texting) is a "fire it and forget it" protocol - no guaranteed delivery - though it's more reliable these days due to the nature of the carrier networks.


----------



## Roller

fischersd said:


> Well, BlackBerry's were a lot more popular due to the guaranteed delivery as well as two-way communication....but we all know what happened to BlackBerry.
> 
> SMS (texting) is a "fire it and forget it" protocol - no guaranteed delivery - though it's more reliable these days due to the nature of the carrier networks.



Neither pagers nor texting are suitable for transmitting patient information because they're not secure and for related reasons, though both are used widely.


----------



## Eric

You can't make this stuff up...









						2 lawyers arguing against Biden's vaccine mandate before the Supreme Court will have to do it remotely after testing positive for COVID-19
					

The Supreme Court on Friday is set to review challenges to the Biden administration's federal vaccine mandates announced last year.




					www.businessinsider.com
				



2 lawyers arguing against Biden's vaccine mandate before the Supreme Court will have to do it remotely after testing positive for COVID-19​


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> Neither pagers nor texting are suitable for transmitting patient information because they're not secure and for related reasons, though both are used widely.



The issue with pagers were the need for an intermediary messaging interface to send and a phone call to respond. I hated it so much I paid for getting pages sent as SMS.  That said with a pager i could immediately tell it’s work and i could read it immediately. 

Now having a  sandboxed secure messaging app that takes 3 steps (unlock phone, unlock app, open message), it’s the constant anxiety if my cell battery is dead, that I’ll miss something hyper urgent. I hate it.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Wow…








						QAnon Star Who Said Only ‘Idiots’ Get Vax Dies of COVID
					

Cirsten Weldon told her fans not to get vaccinated and wanted Dr. Anthony Fauci executed. She just died of COVID.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

JagRunner said:


> Wild!



They also still use faxes a lot so this shouldn’t be surprising LOL.


----------



## Yoused

Runs For Fun said:


> Wow…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> QAnon Star Who Said Only ‘Idiots’ Get Vax Dies of COVID
> 
> 
> Cirsten Weldon told her fans not to get vaccinated and wanted Dr. Anthony Fauci executed. She just died of COVID.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com



Not picking on you, but man these stories are getting tiresome. We should just have a wikipost of all the FUITH people who check out like this.


----------



## AG_PhamD

Herdfan said:


> I still don't understand what it hurts to give it ( the real one for humans, not the horse dewormer paste) to them.   They are most likely going to die anyway, so why not.  The side effects are mild so if they recover, there likely won't be any long-term issues from having taken it.






Cmaier said:


> Hippocratic oath. It can’t help them, and it can only hurt them. So you are asking doctors, who swear to do no harm, to prescribe medicines in contradiction to FDA-authorized use, where the use can, at best, do no good, and at worst can make the patient sick.
> 
> All so that a bunch of politicians who have invested in the stock of the companies who make this garbage can make more money.




I would say the reason is #1 there is no substantial evidence that is effective after looking over numerous studies and taking into consideration the qualities of such studies. Given the lack of evidence, you’re giving people a false sense of hope or protection that does not exist, which is unethical. It’s true ivermectin is generally safe, but that brings me to point #2, every medication has risks no matter how “safe” it is perceived to be. Aspirin can easily kill people. To unnecessarily give medication that you know doesn’t work is not in their best interest.  #3 Giving useless meds is a waste of money and healthcare resources.  

For the record, it’s actually not illegal and usually not unethical to prescribe medications that are not indicated for certain conditions. It’s called off label prescribing and it’s pretty routine. 

For example prazosin is a beta-blocker, heart rate/blood pressure med and it’s one of the first line treatments for PTSD nightmares. It’s technically not FDA approved for this but there are plenty of clinical trials to support its use. This tends to happen especially with generic drugs later found to have a new purpose, no one is going to pay for the FDA approval process.


----------



## AG_PhamD

P_X said:


> I sorta miss pagers, because you always knew if it beeps, it's work. But then you look at it and see stuff like this:
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1479141084345290757/




I still have a Motorola pager from my hospital. It was made in 2001, making it older than many patients I see. There are newer pager systems with color screens and such and paging apps, but we’re still using old school pagers. 

The biggest benefit is that it has much better reception than cell phones. Many parts of our campus are underground or in old stone buildings where cell signals get shut put (esp ATT users) and we have tons of Wi-Fi dead zones. They also use a different network than cell phones (UHF I believe) so if cell towers go down in a crisis the pagers will still work. For example, during the Boston Marathon bombings cell service went out (either from being overloaded or from the govt shutting it off to prevent more detonations). You also can’t beat 30+ day battery life on a single AA battery.


----------



## Yoused

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1478896814543630342/

He looks/sounds quite shaky


----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1478896814543630342/
> 
> He looks/sounds quite shaky



We need an hazmat suit emoji here. 



AG_PhamD said:


> For example prazosin is a beta-blocker, heart rate/blood pressure med and it’s one of the first line treatments for PTSD nightmares.



It's an alpha-blocker, but you're right. Old repurposed drugs rarely get through prospective phase 3 testing. You could probably get the trials funded by NIH tho. 



AG_PhamD said:


> I still have a Motorola pager from my hospital. It was made in 2001, making it older than many patients I see. There are newer pager systems with color screens and such and paging apps, but we’re still using old school pagers.
> 
> The biggest benefit is that it has much better reception than cell phones. Many parts of our campus are underground or in old stone buildings where cell signals get shut put (esp ATT users) and we have tons of Wi-Fi dead zones. They also use a different network than cell phones (UHF I believe) so if cell towers go down in a crisis the pagers will still work. For example, during the Boston Marathon bombings cell service went out (either from being overloaded or from the govt shutting it off to prevent more detonations). You also can’t beat 30+ day battery life on a single AA battery.



people working underground get their pagers. after spending 3 years in the hospital basement as a postdoc, I'm proud to have an office with a view..


----------



## AG_PhamD

P_X said:


> We need an hazmat suit emoji here.
> 
> 
> It's an alpha-blocker, but you're right. Old repurposed drugs rarely get through prospective phase 3 testing. You could probably get the trials funded by NIH tho.
> 
> 
> people working underground get their pagers. after spending 3 years in the hospital basement as a postdoc, I'm proud to have an office with a view..




You’re right. It’s an A-1 antagonist. That’s what I get for working a 12hr day 5 days straight and posting online haha. My brain is cooked. I was originally going to go with propranolol and panic attacks originally which is probably how that mistake happened. Prazosin and nightmares seemed more obscure. 

To have get an FDA approval some company would have to spend the money to go through the process. If the patent is up on the drug, there’s no incentive unless they can make a combo product or reformulate to get a new patent. NIH will pay for all sorts of research, but paying the $250,000 (or whatever it is these days) to the FDA to review the application, I doubt it. 

Seroquel for example got in trouble years ago for pushing the antipsychotic as a sleep aid for insomnia. The difference here was their reps were essentially marketing it to prescribers as also being a sleep aid. Obviously most antipsychotics will knock most non-psychotic people out like a light, but marketing without the data becomes a problem for the FDA. 

Years ago I had an internship at a rehab… it was a very bizarre, culty place. Their go to anti-insomnia drug was Seroquel (brand name at the time, $700-800/month). For 90% of people the same effect could have been done with trazadone for $5. Makes me think something sketchy was going on there. The CEO was actually let go years later for basically embezzlement.


----------



## fischersd

Yoused said:


> Not picking on you, but man these stories are getting tiresome. We should just have a wikipost of all the FUITH people who check out like this.



Should put a section on https://darwinawards.com


----------



## Eric

A local restaurant owner just died and when the family was asked about vaccine status they said "we prefer not to talk about it". In other words, NO, she was not vaccinated. At this point nobody has to die with few exceptions, instead of these nutbags offering thoughts and prayers they should be taking them to get the shot.


----------



## SuperMatt

Texas GOP with an idiotic tweet about COVID...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1479529037949292549/

Um, how about governing well and not having long lines for either?


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> A local restaurant owner just died and when the family was asked about vaccine status they said "we prefer not to talk about it". In other words, NO, she was not vaccinated. At this point nobody has to die with few exceptions, instead of these nutbags offering thoughts and prayers they should be taking them to get the shot.



The reality is you don’t die from COVID if you have been vaccinated. It is mind boggling that we are having to reinvent the wheel on this matter. And I’ll acknowledge this is a world wide issue, but what hurts the most is when you watch STUPID flailing for their right to be imbeciles and perpetuate the continuation of this disturbance.

More sinister, in the USA because the Head Shit (you know who) saw an angle to manipulate, it became part of his  multi-pronged plan to dismantle our democracy which relies on manipulation hand in hand with Hard Core, Anti-Vax STUPID, riling them up over their imagined lost libertay at the hands of liberals.  

Have we really dumbed down to the lowest common denominator? 
Is STUPID going to burn down the house?


----------



## fischersd

Huntn said:


> The reality is you don’t die from COVID if you have been vaccinated. It is mind boggling that we are having to reinvent the wheel on this matter. And I’ll acknowledge this is a world wide issue, but what hurts the most is when you watch STUPID flailing for their right to be imbeciles and perpetuate the continuation of this disturbance.
> 
> More sinister, in the USA because the Head Shit (you know who) saw an angle to manipulate, it became part of his  multi-pronged plan to dismantle our democracy which relies on manipulation hand in hand with Hard Core, Anti-Vax STUPID, riling them up over their imagined lost libertay at the hands of liberals.
> 
> Have we really dumbed down to the lowest common denominator?
> Is STUPID going to burn down the house?



...and SO ironic that the bulk of the vaccine production is in the US.

I'm surprised that the Republicans haven't figured it out yet.  The elections over the last few decades have been by thin margins.  They DO realize that fewer Republicans means they may not win again?


----------



## fooferdoggie

Covid victim interviewed by the BBC receives a torrent of online hate from nutters saying he faked the whole thing. Perhaps sarcastically referring to yourself as a 'professional crisis actor' on your Instagram bio wasn't such a good idea after all








						'Crisis actor' conspiracy theory: How anti-vax activists targeted a Covid patient
					

Henry Dyne was ill with Covid, but online his story was twisted by anti-vaccine activists.



					www.bbc.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

what a hill to die on.
 Love is ... sharing your Herman Cain Award together
Unvaxxed couple dies of COVID holding hands: ‘True definition of soulmates’​








						Unvaxxed couple dies of COVID holding hands: ‘True definition of soulmates’
					

William Stewart, 73, and wife Carol, 69, had been hospitalized with COVID-19, unmitigated by the fact that the New Hampshire couple was unvaccinated.




					nypost.com


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Texas GOP with an idiotic tweet about COVID...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1479529037949292549/
> 
> Um, how about governing well and not having long lines for either?



GOP deciding to die on this hill is just pathetic. 
Per the federalist logic we've been hearing in 2020 ad nauseam, it is purely their responsibility to optimize testing.
Which in this case would be a home testing system. So this logic is: if we can do a shitty job with COVID, it's totally fine to do a shitty job with elections too.


----------



## User.45

fischersd said:


> ...and SO ironic that the bulk of the vaccine production is in the US.
> 
> I'm surprised that the Republicans haven't figured it out yet.  The elections over the last few decades have been by thin margins.  They DO realize that fewer Republicans means they may not win again?



This is especially poignant in Florida, where way more people died of COVID than DeSantis' margin of victory for governorship.


----------



## lizkat

P_X said:


> This is especially poignant in Florida, where way more people died of COVID than DeSantis' margin of victory for governorship.




I was thinking about stuff like that yesterday during the high court hearing from plaintiffs arguing that a mandate for masking and testing (or getting vaxxed) would cause "small rural hospitals" to have to close because of staff quitting...  (whereas my understanding was in fact the staffing has got easier at these establishments since implementation of mandates because of caregivers and ancillary staff not being so afraid to WORK there once people either were vaxxed or masking up and testing).

And meanwhile when plaintiff's attorney  kept talking about effect of mandates on "*small *businesses" and "_*small rural hospitals.*_..."  Justice Breyer once or twice noted that "... yes but right now we have _*SEVEN HUNDRED FIFTY THOUSAND *_new cases of covid a day" and that one of the reasons for the mandate was to preclude having to close hospitals (small and rural or f'g otherwise) because of sheer inability to round up enough non-sick staff to keep the damn doors open and try to accommodate needs of the influx of patients whether covid-related or not.


----------



## SuperMatt

lizkat said:


> I was thinking about stuff like that yesterday during the high court hearing from plaintiffs arguing that a mandate for masking and testing (or getting vaxxed) would cause "small rural hospitals" to have to close because of staff quitting...  (whereas my understanding was in fact the staffing has got easier at these establishments since implementation of mandates because of caregivers and ancillary staff not being so afraid to WORK there once people either were vaxxed or masking up and testing).
> 
> And meanwhile when plaintiff's attorney  kept talking about effect of mandates on "*small *businesses" and "_*small rural hospitals.*_..."  Justice Breyer once or twice noted that "... yes but right now we have _*SEVEN HUNDRED FIFTY THOUSAND *_new cases of covid a day" and that one of the reasons for the mandate was to preclude having to close hospitals (small and rural or f'g otherwise) because of sheer inability to round up enough non-sick staff to keep the damn doors open and try to accommodate needs of the influx of patients whether covid-related or not.



Also, Neil Gorsuch refusing to wear a mask during the proceedings. So much for the appearance of impartiality.

There is no sense in these discussions. The precedent for OSHA to do something like this is WELL established. It’s total demagoguery from the court now. The constitution, rule of law, and the public interest are afterthoughts. Ideology is all that matters to the current right-wing justices.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Also, Neil Gorsuch refusing to wear a mask during the proceedings. So much for the appearance of impartiality.
> 
> There is no sense in these discussions. The precedent for OSHA to do something like this is WELL established. It’s total demagoguery from the court now. The constitution, rule of law, and the public interest are afterthoughts. Ideology is all that matters to the current right-wing justices.



Honestly, if people got their shit together, mandates would not be necessary because we'd have >90% vaccination rates. So people who argue against mandates aren't doing it in good faith as, "freedom comes with doing the right thing [vaccination] without coercion".


----------



## Edd

fischersd said:


> ...and SO ironic that the bulk of the vaccine production is in the US.
> 
> I'm surprised that the Republicans haven't figured it out yet.  The elections over the last few decades have been by thin margins.  They DO realize that fewer Republicans means they may not win again?



Voter suppression should help with that.


----------



## lizkat

Edd said:


> Voter suppression should help with that.




Plus changes that alter how audits and investigations are triggered,  and how results are certified at state level.  Ugh.

One assumes some of the recent bills propose or passed are unconstitutional but the problem in some cases will be one of standing, i.e. trying to get the ones enacted into law tossed out by the courts before attempts to use them occur.


----------



## Roller

SuperMatt said:


> Also, Neil Gorsuch refusing to wear a mask during the proceedings. So much for the appearance of impartiality.
> 
> There is no sense in these discussions. The precedent for OSHA to do something like this is WELL established. It’s total demagoguery from the court now. The constitution, rule of law, and the public interest are afterthoughts. Ideology is all that matters to the current right-wing justices.



Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, and Coney Barrett were chosen for one thing only: overturn Roe v Wade. Their other decisions that support right wing policies are icing on the cake.

But putting that aside, it often puzzles me that judges, who are supposed to be experts on legal matters, are required to preside over cases that may be highly technical and far beyond their knowledge or experience. That's why courts rely on expert witness testimony. Although it's an imperfect system — experts are chosen based on their ability to support or refute various contentions — it at least introduces some level of expertise.

Cases are argued before the SCOTUS with no witnesses or jury, so the justices are expected to consider testimony and decisions by lower courts. But reading some of their comments during this proceeding, it seems some of them are mostly going on their personal feelings, politics, and misconceptions. And, as Elena Kagan asked, "Why in the world would courts decide this question?"


----------



## JayMysteri0

You can't make this shit up, just shake your head, and control yourself.



> Lawyers Fighting Vaccine Mandate Argue Remotely Due to Covid-19
> 
> 
> Some might say that's a sign from life that you should reconsider your ideas. That's unlikely to happen here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> gizmodo.com





> Two officials fighting the Biden Administration’s covid-19 vaccine and testing mandates for employers and health care facilities before the Supreme Court ironically tested positive for covid-19 just before their scheduled court date, which forced them to argue their cases remotely on Friday. In other situations, that might be a sign from life that you should reconsider your ideas. However, that’s unlikely to happen here.
> 
> Ohio solicitor general Benjamin Flowers and Louisiana solicitor general Liz Murrill made their arguments to the court by phone on Friday, Reuters reported. Flowers got covid-19 in late December and has since recovered but tested positive on a PCR test on Thursday. Murrill, meanwhile, didn’t explicitly confirm she had covid-19 but said she would be arguing remotely “in accordance with COVID protocols,” according to the outlet.
> 
> Since the Supreme Court resumed in-person arguments in October, it has issued guidance requiring any attorney who tests positive for the virus to make their cases over the phone.


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Roller

One of the stranger stories in a sea of craziness:









						Cy-Fair ISD teacher bonds out of jail after allegedly putting 13-year-old in trunk for fear of COVID-19 exposure, officials say
					

A Cy-Fair ISD teacher who was charged with endangering a child has since bonded out of jail after her 13-year-old son was found in the trunk of her car at a drive-thru COVID testing site on Monday, officials say.




					www.click2houston.com


----------



## Yoused

Roller said:


> Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, and Coney Barrett were chosen for one thing only: overturn Roe v Wade.



My understanding is that Rape Kavanaugh and Amy Covid Barrett were nominated in large part due to their involvement in _Bush v Gore_, on the premise that, if the election was close, they would hand it to Individual-ONE.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Fuck these Qucumbers


----------



## Eric

Runs For Fun said:


> Fuck these Qucumbers



They can avoid the hospital and die a hideous death on their own couch, or they can go into emergency care and get pumped full of enough chemicals of "unknown substances" to make the mRNA vaccine look like child's play. Whatever they decide is fine with me, I just don't want to be anywhere near them as they infect everyone.


----------



## JayMysteri0

And...



> Geraldo Rivera tests positive for COVID
> 
> 
> Rivera, 78, said his symptoms were mild. He got a booster shot recently.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nydailynews.com




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1480205169505841160/


----------



## fischersd

JayMysteri0 said:


> And...
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1480205169505841160/



You need to use an example that doesn't surpass the digits on their hands.


----------



## SuperMatt

I have to wonder if this person spent time in prison... Smuggling contraband using a cute little stuffed animal? Except this time, the contraband is ivermectin and it’s a hospital they’re smuggling it into.



			https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/ivermectin-windsor-regional-hospital-covid-1.6307648
		


Oh, Canada...


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

On the way home from work the other day I approached an intersection with about a dozen handwritten signs planted in the dirt on one of the corners. I couldn’t read them but they were written in red, white, and blue which is usually a sign that I don’t agree with whatever it is they are going on about. The causes I believe in generally don’t drape themselves in patriotism, as if that somehow makes them more valid.

As I got closer I saw there were 2 people pacing in front of the signs, one older gentleman with a flag in hand and another holding a sign that said something about “globalist jab” and they were wearing a sheep mask.

My only real thought was “What are you doing and why here?” There was no medical or governmental building in sight. At the intersection are 2 high end malls, a real epicenter of liberal consumerism. So they probably picked the location because of the amount of likely traffic. To me they just looked like mentally unstable attention whores, not changing any minds. The whole sheep thing has just become comical to me as they are just displaying they are Fox News and conspiracy sheep, another of the many examples of how the right likes to flip definitions or use projection as deflection.


----------



## shadow puppet

Like this approach is going to solve anything.  Temper tantrum much?   

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1480562949806829570/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Uh...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1480572127287861262/


----------



## rdrr

JayMysteri0 said:


> Uh...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1480572127287861262/



I got to admit, I am not surprised that it finally came to drinking your own pee as a Covid cure.  When they started to talk about gargling and nasal cleansing with iodine, I didn't see the bottom then.   Even with this insane treatment plan, I am not sure we are at the bottom yet.


----------



## JayMysteri0

rdrr said:


> I got to admit, I am not surprised that it finally came to drinking your own pee as a Covid cure.  When they started to talk about gargling and nasal cleansing with iodine, I didn't see the bottom then.   Even with this insane treatment plan, I am not sure we are at the bottom yet.



The jokes practically write themselves...


----------



## Roller

rdrr said:


> I got to admit, I am not surprised that it finally came to drinking your own pee as a Covid cure.  When they started to talk about gargling and nasal cleansing with iodine, I didn't see the bottom then.   Even with this insane treatment plan, I am not sure we are at the bottom yet.



The next step, physiologically speaking, is for them to eat their, ahem, solid waste. At that point, they will have literally reached the bottom.


----------



## rdrr

Roller said:


> The next step, physiologically speaking, is for them to eat their, ahem, solid waste. At that point, they will have literally reached the bottom.



Oh I still think that you would be deeply into the money pit and still haven't found the treasure vault in the MAGA world.


----------



## Roller

rdrr said:


> Oh I still think that you would be deeply into the money pit and still haven't found the treasure vault in the MAGA world.



True, but I was speaking anatomically/physiologically.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> The next step, physiologically speaking, is for them to eat their, ahem, solid waste. At that point, they will have literally reached the bottom.



I have the slogan for this:

"Eat shit and...LIVE!!!"


----------



## DT

Oh yeah, that's why I was doing it, yeah, Covid, and no other reason ...


----------



## Hrafn

DT said:


> Oh yeah, that's why I was doing it, yeah, Covid, and no other reason ...



I don't believe you.


----------



## Yoused

Roller said:


> The next step, physiologically speaking, is for them to eat their, ahem, solid waste. At that point, they will have literally reached the bottom.



But is it their own bottom or …


----------



## fischersd

SuperMatt said:


> I have to wonder if this person spent time in prison... Smuggling contraband using a cute little stuffed animal? Except this time, the contraband is ivermectin and it’s a hospital they’re smuggling it into.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/ivermectin-windsor-regional-hospital-covid-1.6307648
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, Canada...



Yep, we have a lot of right-leaning, nut-job Trump supporters up here too.  Most of us like to think that they're isolated to the "red" provinces - Alberta and Saskatchewan - but you find lots in the rural areas.   The mis-information bleeds north.


----------



## rdrr

fischersd said:


> Yep, we have a lot of right-leaning, nut-job Trump supporters up here too.  Most of us like to think that they're isolated to the "red" provinces - Alberta and Saskatchewan - but you find lots in the rural areas.   The mis-information bleeds north.



Sorry about our stupidity spreading north.   Now where can I escape to in 2024?


----------



## JayMysteri0

Because it's stupid, it's covid related, and it's congress

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1481004516237582337/


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Because it's stupid, it's covid related, and it's congress
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1481004516237582337/




These people aren't this stupid. These people think their constituents are. Fauci's salary is public record. 

https://www.federalpay.org/employees/national-institutes-of-health/fauci-anthony-shttps://www.federalpay.org/employees/national-institutes-of-health/fauci-anthony-s

My MR Frenemy called Fauci an "overpaid bureaucrat". This guy would make 3-times this in academia and 10x in industry.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Conservative Activist Dies of COVID Complications After Attending Anti-Vax ‘Symposium’
					

Kelly Canon had celebrated her vaccine exemption a few weeks before she fell ill with the virus and wound up on a ventilator.



					www.thedailybeast.com
				






> No jabby-jabby for me! Praise GOD!




What is with these grown-ass adults speaking baby talk?


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> Conservative Activist Dies of COVID Complications After Attending Anti-Vax ‘Symposium’
> 
> 
> Kelly Canon had celebrated her vaccine exemption a few weeks before she fell ill with the virus and wound up on a ventilator.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> What is with these grown-ass adults speaking baby talk?



well she praised god then got to meet him early.


----------



## AG_PhamD

P_X said:


> These people aren't this stupid. These people think their constituents are. Fauci's salary is public record.
> 
> https://www.federalpay.org/employees/national-institutes-of-health/fauci-anthony-shttps://www.federalpay.org/employees/national-institutes-of-health/fauci-anthony-s
> 
> My MR Frenemy called Fauci an "overpaid bureaucrat". This guy would make 3-times this in academia and 10x in industry.




I think the Senator was asking about his financial disclosures, though indeed he did start the interrogation talking about his salary, giant fake check included.  

While it is kind of shocking to see a government employee making $435k per year, he is indeed an MD and an accomplished one at that. It’s definitely well above what your average immunologist makes, certainly one working at the VA. But he’s prominent in his field and he’s also 81 years old- most doctors, or non-doctors, obviously don’t work till that age. (BTW, he looks and sounds great for being 81). If the government wants one of the most prominent experts working for them, their has to be an incentive. Otherwise people will go elsewhere. 

I find the the most annoying comment “when was the last time you treated a patient”. Clearly Fauci has devoted his career and has made a new for himself in research, not working in an outpatient office. 

Anyways, like all other high level government employees, Fauci has to disclose his financials and is bound by rules. His disclosure can be found here: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/7014520-Fauci-Disclosure
Skimming through it very quickly, it mostly looks like mutual funds. Frankly, I am more suspicious of house members and senators financial conflicts of interest. 

The accusation that doctors are profiting from pharma companies is kind of an old trope at this point. That said, I imagine a large percentage of doctors have stocks in medical companies, perhaps because they have some understanding of this specific market. I have plenty of stock in healthcare-related companies, but never once have I ever considered that being a factor in patient treatment. In fact, I own stock in companies I absolutely loath, ie CVS- frankly IMO one of the biggest detriments to healthcare in modern times and usually the last pharmacy I recommend if asked for an opinion. I don’t even get my own prescriptions there. 

That’s not to say there aren’t conflicts of interest between government employees/officials and the for-profit healthcare industry. The FDA is pretty notorious for being a revolving door between high level pharma employees  and FDA officials. But in the case of Fauci, as far as I’m aware he’s basically worked for the NIH his entire career. And I would assume there is far less corrupt corporate pressure for someone issuing grants on behalf of the NIH than there is someone determining whether to approve or deny or recall a drug at the FDA. 

I’ll be honest I have some mixed feelings about Tony Fauci throughout this pandemic. Let’s just say people like to either make him out to be a living saint or an evil tyrant. Like most people in the world he has his flaws and has made mistakes. Some of his responses to questioning about the lab leak hypothesis concern me. But in terms of the pandemic response, of which he is a top health advisor, I think he is doing what he believes is right. And no one can always be right. 

To try to criticize the guy for getting paid a high salary despite being extremely accomplished is insane. Should that senator be ostracized for making $175k per year? To insinuate financial corruption with zero evidence (and apparently without even making the attempt obtain his disclosures) is just a manifestation of rampant toxic tribalism in the name of trying to virtue signal the whole anti-vax, anti-mask ideology.


----------



## Yoused

AG_PhamD said:


> To try to criticize the guy for getting paid a high salary despite being extremely accomplished is insane. Should that senator be ostracized for making $175k per year?




Given what we know about Republican politicians and mouthpieces in general, it is safe to say that the "corruption" that Fauci is being accused of is something of which the Senator himself is guilty.


----------



## Runs For Fun

[deleted by user] from
      HermanCainAward



> I’m so disappointed I could cry. This clinic is her general women’s wellness and sexual health location, and they also offer medical spa treatments.
> 
> Something told me she’d changed when I said I couldn’t bring the kids around until they’d been vaccinated and the vibe in the room got weird. She’d never been the quack doctor type, so this is all so out of left field.


----------



## User.45

AG_PhamD said:


> I think the Senator was asking about his financial disclosures, though indeed he did start the interrogation talking about his salary, giant fake check included.
> 
> While it is kind of shocking to see a government employee making $435k per year, he is indeed an MD and an accomplished one at that. It’s definitely well above what your average immunologist makes, certainly one working at the VA. But he’s prominent in his field and he’s also 81 years old- most doctors, or non-doctors, obviously don’t work till that age. (BTW, he looks and sounds great for being 81). If the government wants one of the most prominent experts working for them, their has to be an incentive. Otherwise people will go elsewhere.



It's a joke. You can't even take a shit at the NIH without an ethics review. It's called National InstituteS of Health and the guy is running one of these Institutes. I know people making comparable salaries to him in private practice, fresh out of training. He'd been taken down decades ago if he had problematic dealings.** The whole questioning is so ridiculous, it just reflects what these politicians think about their constituents' cognitive capabilities.

It's also hilarious to see Trump on the right side of an argument going after DeSantis who sidestepped when asked whether he got a booster. Of course he got a booster, his wife has cancer. But DeSantis feels that pandering to antivaxxers is more important than leading by example. Well, again, these things tell you all about what these folks think about their voters.

**Even better, Fauci's wife works at the NIH too so her dealings are also public record.


----------



## Joe

Who started calling it "the jab"? I understand that jab means to poke, but it's a fucking shot. Call it a shot. 

If you call it "the jab" we can't be friends.


----------



## Yoused

JagRunner said:


> Who started calling it "the jab"? I understand that jab means to poke, but it's a fucking shot. Call it a shot.



Just be thankful it is not known (in most of the country) as "the prick". That could turn out rather poorly.


----------



## Clix Pix

The folks in the UK have for years referred to what Americans usually call "shots" as "jabs," so that's probably the origin of this current usage even in the US, given the International scope of the internet and all of our exposure to each others' use of language....


----------



## AG_PhamD

JagRunner said:


> Who started calling it "the jab"? I understand that jab means to poke, but it's a fucking shot. Call it a shot.
> 
> If you call it "the jab" we can't be friends.




Prior to Coronavirus I had only ever heard “the jab” used by British English speakers. Interestingly, America seems to have adopted the slang term to an extent once the vaccine came into the picture. 

I just googled it and “jab” (as slang for  injection) allegedly started in America in the early 1900’s referring specifically to narcotic injections. Then the British picked it up and now it’s back here. Weird how that works. 

I suppose “jab” makes more sense than “shot”. It’s not like a hypodermic needle is a bullet.


----------



## User.168

.


----------



## AG_PhamD

theSeb said:


> Does the word "shot" not originate from the jet needle gun used mostly by the military? I understand that it is quite painful.




That would make a lot of sense, I didn’t think of that. 

Jet injectors have largely fallen out of favor for mass vaccination due to contamination risks and many documented cases of spreading diseases like hepatitis. I think they generally banned them in the US in the late 90’s. 

To my knowledge there is only one FDA approved jet injector on the market these days with only one FDA approved product it can administer, one brand of flu vaccine, but only in people age 18-64… which is a bit limiting. I’ve never seen it used though. 

There’s also InsulJet, jet injected insulin, different story as it’s for personal use and not on multiple patients. It’s not a popular option and is only approved in a handful of it countries, US excluded. 

Supposedly laser injections could be the next big delivery method. I kinda doubt it as it seems overly expensive. But maybe in the future people will call vaccines “the zap”?


----------



## fooferdoggie

New trend among the anti-vax set, vlog from your hospital bed about how not bad it is to catch the virus. From your hospital bed
The New MAGA Hotness Is Getting COVID and Vlogging From Your Hospital Bed​








						The New MAGA Hotness Is Getting COVID and Vlogging From Your Hospital Bed
					

There’s no better way to own the libs than to put out videos boasting about rejecting the vaccine and how much trouble you’re having breathing, and of course MyPillow promos.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Joe

Clix Pix said:


> The folks in the UK have for years referred to what Americans usually call "shots" as "jabs," so that's probably the origin of this current usage even in the US, given the International scope of the internet and all of our exposure to each others' use of language....




I just wouldn't expect these people using "the jab" to know about anything happening in the UK lolol


----------



## Eric

After spending the last 2 weeks watching local government and school districts push for kids to go back, they're all starting to close now with record infections and lack of staff. They saw it coming a mile away and still pushed for it, it made no sense then and they're paying for it now. Nobody seems to be paying attention here but anyone saw this coming a mile away.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> After spending the last 2 weeks watching local government and school districts push for kids to go back, they're all starting to close now with record infections and lack of staff. They saw it coming a mile away and still pushed for it, it made no sense then and they're paying for it now. Nobody seems to be paying attention here but anyone saw this coming a mile away.



It's sorta like blaming Biden for record COVID deaths, but ignoring the fact that Trump locked down. Lockdowns come with lowered mortality. So when human garbage like Rand Paul is whining about the stuff he's advocated for comes with increased mortality all I can say is well, whodathunk.


----------



## JayMysteri0

A great example of if you don't like a fact, there must be an issue.  Otherwise, they will go with "I think" equals "facts".


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> A great example of if you don't like a fact, there must be an issue.  Otherwise, they will go with "I think" equals "facts".



The Joe Wrongin experience.


----------



## SuperMatt

Arizona is using federal COVID-19 relief funds to prevent schools from requiring masks? The federal government is going to take the money back now. For schools to get the money, Arizona’s state government says the schools must have no mask requirement. This is the exact opposite of what the money was meant for.

Really, these people are immoral and shameless.



> Mr. Ducey announced last year that he was rolling out two education programs intended to undercut school mask requirements that some school districts in the state put in place.
> A $163 million program using the federal relief money provides up to $1,800 in additional funding per pupil in public and charter schools. However, these schools must be “following all state laws” and open for in-person instruction. *Schools that required masks would not be eligible.*
> A separate $10 million program funds vouchers worth up to $7,000 to help poor families leave districts that require face coverings or impose other Covid-related “constraints.”
> In the letter, the Treasury Department said that if Arizona does not cease or change the programs within 60 days, it could start a process to recoup the money that is being misused. It also said that it could hold back the second installment of relief money that Arizona is scheduled to receive this year.






			https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/01/14/world/omicron-covid-vaccine-tests#the-treasury-department-threatens-to-keep-relief-funds-from-arizona-for-using-it-to-fight-school-mask-rules


----------



## Runs For Fun

Good read








						Column: A new study calculates the incredible cost of ivermectin stupidity
					

America wasted an incredible $129 million on a drug that doesn't work against COVID.




					www.latimes.com


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Yoused

Dr. Fauci has been fighting the pandemic since at least two years before Covid-19 took center stage, and somehow that seems to make him an evil man. He called Senator Marshall a moron, and we all heard it because Fauci's mic was on. The Senator is so infuriated by that that he has introduced legislation to get at that guy, the *F*inancial *A*ccountability for *U*niquely *C*ompensated *I*ndividuals Act.

Because, asshole.


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> A great example of if you don't like a fact, there must be an issue.  Otherwise, they will go with "I think" equals "facts".




Now that I watched the video, I understand why this tweet is popular today:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1482018758885617666/


----------



## ronntaylor

Trump Backs Boosters. Clearly, Someone Did the Math for Him.
					

Trump is losing hundreds of voters a day to Covid — far more than the margins in the swing states.




					donaldgmcneiljr1954.medium.com
				






> The math that says: “Uh, sir? Your voters are dying in droves.”




The math is a bit off as not all adults are registered to vote and not all registered voters actually vote. Still...



> As of this week, about 1,800 Americans a day are dying of Covid; the C.D.C. expects that number to rise above 2,600.
> 
> Virtually all are adults. If 95 percent were unvaccinated and we assume that 75 percent of those were Trump supporters, that’s 1,300 to 1,900 of his voters being subtracted from the rolls _every single day_.
> 
> Donald Trump lost Arizona by a mere 10,000 votes. He lost Georgia by 12,000, He lost Wisconsin by 21,000. He lost Nevada by 33,000.
> 
> Right now, about 60 Arizonans, 36 Georgians, 34 Wisconsinites and 14 Nevadans are dying of Covid each day. Seventy five percent of 95 percent of that would be minus 103 Trump voters per day — just in those four swing states. Week after week. That adds up.


----------



## User.45

ronntaylor said:


> Trump Backs Boosters. Clearly, Someone Did the Math for Him.
> 
> 
> Trump is losing hundreds of voters a day to Covid — far more than the margins in the swing states.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> donaldgmcneiljr1954.medium.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The math is a bit off as not all adults are registered to vote and not all registered voters actually vote. Still...



They also did the math on the voter population. The estimate was about 200,000 more GOP voters lost to COVID. These numbers are already much higher than what it takes to flip a presidential election.


----------



## Yoused

P_X said:


> They also did the math on the voter population. The estimate was about 200,000 more GOP voters lost to COVID. These numbers are already much higher than what it takes to flip a presidential election.



But what about the '22 election? AFAICT the losses are largely (though not entirely) in the redder states, where a few dead neighbors are less likely to have a significant impact – unless the Ds can sell theirselves better. If the Rs manage to capture back part of congress, the '24 election will become Teh Suxxor.


----------



## lizkat

Runs For Fun said:


> Good read
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Column: A new study calculates the incredible cost of ivermectin stupidity
> 
> 
> America wasted an incredible $129 million on a drug that doesn't work against COVID.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.latimes.com




A three year old throwing a tantrum in a supermarket aisle has more of a grip on reality than do some of the pro-Trump anti-vaxx voters resorting to near witchcraft to avoid an illness that for strictly political reasons they still don't want to acknowledge is even a thing.   Meanwhile bumping up the risks for the rest of us as well as themselves by their actions.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Will this ever end?








						Fact check: NC lawmaker encourages treating COVID with Benadryl, milk
					

Rep. Jeff McNeely, R-Iredell, said on Facebook that milk “may be the answer to Covid-19,” before linking to the study published in November by an immunologist at the University of Florida.




					www.cbs17.com


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## lizkat

Meanwhile the booksellers are keeping up with the changing times, tongue in cheek or not:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1482721471063597056/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Meanwhile the stupid isn't confined to just here








> Anti-vaccine protesters try to storm Bulgaria's parliament
> 
> 
> Anti-vaccine protesters tried to storm the Bulgarian parliament on Wednesday and briefly scuffled with police officers during a massive rally against coronavirus restrictions in downtown Sofia.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com





> SOFIA, Jan 12 (Reuters) - Anti-vaccine protesters tried to storm the Bulgarian parliament on Wednesday and briefly scuffled with police officers during a massive rally against coronavirus restrictions in downtown Sofia.
> 
> Tensions rose an hour after about 3,000 people gathered in front of the parliament building, demanding the lifting of a mandatory health pass which they said trampled on their rights and was a back-door means of forcing people to get vaccinated.
> 
> Protesters, many of whom arrived on buses for the rally, pushed back a police cordon around parliament and reached the front doors of the building.
> 
> They stopped short of breaking in and called on lawmakers to come out and address their demands. Several people, including police officers, were injured during the brief clashes.
> 
> Waving national flags and flags of the ultra-nationalist Revival party, which organised the rally, they chanted "Freedom" and "Mafia" and decried all measures against the virus.
> 
> "I do not approve of the green certificates. I do not approve that the children are being stopped from attending classes. I do not see the logic of these things," 39-year old engineer Asparuh Mitov told Reuters at the start of the rally.


----------



## Runs For Fun

The next stupid preventative measure for Covid
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1483510022395072520/

Or you could get a vaccine and wear a damn mask.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> The next stupid preventative measure for Covid
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1483510022395072520/
> 
> Or you could get a vaccine and wear a damn mask.



well there you go a pro tells us how to take care of covid. everyone buy this right now. what are you waiting for?


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> The next stupid preventative measure for Covid
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1483510022395072520/
> 
> Or you could get a vaccine and wear a damn mask.



Tell
me
this
is
a
parody.


----------



## Yoused

P_X said:


> Tell
> me
> this
> is
> a
> parody.




Here is a page from last March touting H2O2 nebulizer therapy for Covid. And you know you can trust it because it "_… is from Thomas Levy M.D, J.D., a board certified cardiolosit and prolific medical writer …_". Got to be smarter than Mehmet Oz, who probably cannot spell "cardiolosit".


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Czech singer dies after intentionally catching COVID for a health pass
					

Hana Horka's son said that anti-vax campaigners had 'blood on their hands'.




					www.euronews.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

P_X said:


> Tell
> me
> this
> is
> a
> parody.




These armchair MDs are like internet sleuths trying to solve cold cases but are only focusing on cases that have definitively been solved.  "The Titanic was actually taken down by a family of beavers."


----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> Here is a page from last March touting H2O2 nebulizer therapy for Covid. And you know you can trust it because it "_… is from Thomas Levy M.D, J.D., a board certified cardiolosit and prolific medical writer …_". Got to be smarter than Mehmet Oz, who probably cannot spell "cardiolosit".



True, he is board certed. Prolific? Does 1 peer reviewed paper make someone prolific? Imho that starts somewhere around 100-150 or line 10 a year. His study is on a nonblinded trial of IV ascorbic acid and h2o2 to treat pain in chikunguya fever without a crossover design, or placebo. I mean, it would take me real effort to design a study that answers fewer questions. But yeah. “Expert”, lol.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Neil Gorsuch Reportedly Refuses To Wear Mask In Supreme Court, Forcing Others To Call In​








						Neil Gorsuch Reportedly Refuses To Wear Mask In Court, Forcing Others To Call In
					

A bad look for a justice who claims to champion civility in politics.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## Eric

Prayers anyone?


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/s7phwo


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> Prayers anyone?
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/s7phwo



Is this for real?


----------



## Eric

Huntn said:


> Is this for real?



Here's her Twitter full of RW rants about the vaccine, looks legit to me...





__





						Loading…
					





					twitter.com
				



 Someone strung them together from the looks of it but here's that post as well

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1481273288567496712/


----------



## rdrr

Huntn said:


> Is this for real?



Not sure if this is real, but after daily tweets about still fighting, nothing since Jan 15th. 

On another note, I just found out last night someone in my circle of acquaintance died two days ago from pneumonia, but everyone is making sure to tell people that it wasn't due to the Covid that she had in November.   Even thought that pneumonia showed up right after the November Covid battle in December and it kept putting her into the hospital.   Why is everyone so adamant to make deaths not Covid, when you can clearly draw a line to an infection?


----------



## Eric

rdrr said:


> Not sure if this is real, but after daily tweets about still fighting, nothing since Jan 15th.
> 
> On another note, I just found out last night someone in my circle of acquaintance died two days ago from pneumonia, but everyone is making sure to tell people that it wasn't due to the Covid that she had in November.   Even thought that pneumonia showed up right after the November Covid battle in December and it kept putting her into the hospital.   Why is everyone so adamant to make deaths not Covid, when you can clearly draw a line to an infection?



Like getting shot and then two weeks later getting an infection and dying from the wound. "Tell everyone they died from an infection"


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

rdrr said:


> Why is everyone so adamant to make deaths not Covid, when you can clearly draw a line to an infection?




This might have been posted already, but this county coroner "doesn't do covid deaths"









						Uncounted: Inaccurate death certificates across the country hide the true toll of COVID-19 • Missouri Independent
					

In some counties, half of the spike in deaths during the pandemic is attributed to COVID-19. Researchers say that points to an undercount




					missouriindependent.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> Czech singer dies after intentionally catching COVID for a health pass
> 
> 
> Hana Horka's son said that anti-vax campaigners had 'blood on their hands'.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.euronews.com



Was going to post this. I just can't comprehend this level of stupidity.


Eric said:


> Prayers anyone?
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/s7phwo



The dead cat bounce.


----------



## Huntn

Eric said:


> Here's her Twitter full of RW rants about the vaccine, looks legit to me...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Loading…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> twitter.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Someone strung them together from the looks of it but here's that post as well
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1481273288567496712/



I said that from the standpoint of disbelief.


----------



## Runs For Fun

This fucking idiot


----------



## Yoused

_*Freedom of Speech!*_









						Florida Department of Health confirms Dr. Raul Pino put on leave for encouraging Orange County Department of Health employees to get vaccinated
					

Republican Governor Ron DeSantis has banned vaccine mandates in the workplace, and the state has seen a surge in Omicron cases.




					www.wmfe.org
				




_umm, unless you say what we don't want to hear_

*Orange County Medical Director Dr. Raul Pino wrote an email to staff on Jan. 4th encouraging them to get vaccinated … (then) he was placed on administrative leave. … Florida Department of Health has confirmed Pino was put on leave because, “the decision to get vaccinated is a personal choice that should be free from coercion and mandates from employers.” … (and) it’s even conducting an inquiry into whether any laws were broken …*​
*[redacted]* I mean, *[redacted]* *[redacted]* *[redacted]*. I can only say *[redacted]!*

This is not "Covid Stupid", this is downright _malicious_.


----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> _*Freedom of Speech!*_
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Florida Department of Health confirms Dr. Raul Pino put on leave for encouraging Orange County Department of Health employees to get vaccinated
> 
> 
> Republican Governor Ron DeSantis has banned vaccine mandates in the workplace, and the state has seen a surge in Omicron cases.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wmfe.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _umm, unless you say what we don't want to hear_
> 
> *Orange County Medical Director Dr. Raul Pino wrote an email to staff on Jan. 4th encouraging them to get vaccinated … (then) he was placed on administrative leave. … Florida Department of Health has confirmed Pino was put on leave because, “the decision to get vaccinated is a personal choice that should be free from coercion and mandates from employers.” … (and) it’s even conducting an inquiry into whether any laws were broken …*​
> *[redacted]* I mean, *[redacted]* *[redacted]* *[redacted]*. I can only say *[redacted]!*
> 
> This is not "Covid Stupid", this is downright _malicious_.



DeSantis is on a roll. You guys will probably see what I mean in a few days.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

Runs For Fun said:


> This fucking idiot




Christ almighty. If I was at Alaska Airlines I would ban her for life. What a selfish moron but I’m seeing so many people like that. A guy I know came back from Poland and had a cough. The guy he was travelling with tested positive so he didn’t bother testing and then flew out to Germany two days later. Absolute bellend who probably infected the whole flight.


----------



## Yoused

P_X said:


> DeSantis is on a roll.



With mustard and lettuce?


----------



## MEJHarrison

I assume this has been posted before and I've just missed it.  Regardless, this was an amusing find yesterday.









						sorryantivaxxer.com | stories of anti-vaxxers who died from COVID.
					

They thought COVID was a scam, until they lay dying from it.  sorryantivaxxer.com tells their story using their own facebook and twitter posts.




					sorryantivaxxer.com


----------



## Eric

Tie their ass down and duct tape the mask to their face, make an example of these idiots.









						American Airlines flight to London returns to Miami after passenger refuses to wear mask
					

American Airlines Flight 38 was heading to London with 129 passengers on board when it had to turn back.




					www.cbsnews.com


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Maybe doesn’t deserve to be put among the stupid, but….









						'Called every hospital within 75 miles': Man with COVID dies while waiting for hospital transfer
					

Massachusetts pizza shop owner Antonios “Tony” Tsantinis died after contracting COVID-19 and struggling to find an available hospital bed.



					www.usatoday.com
				




A real snake eating it’s tale on this one.  Doesn’t get vaccinated and then dies because he can’t get a hospital bed due to the unvaccinated case overloads.


----------



## Roller

Eric said:


> Tie their ass down and duct tape the mask to their face, make an example of these idiots.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> American Airlines flight to London returns to Miami after passenger refuses to wear mask
> 
> 
> American Airlines Flight 38 was heading to London with 129 passengers on board when it had to turn back.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com



I think she should have been arrested and required to spend time in jail or doing community service. At the very least, she should be held responsible for the cost incurred by the airline and its passengers.


----------



## Eric

Roller said:


> I think she should have been arrested and required to spend time in jail or doing community service. At the very least, she should be held responsible for the cost incurred by the airline and its passengers.



The problem is these people decide to take it off mid-flight and then refuse to put it back on. I say they treat treat them like the police treat those who spit and muzzle them, no tolerance for these assholes.


----------



## Joe

Eric said:


> Prayers anyone?




She tweeted that she can't believe the stuff people are saying to her and she would never hurt anyone.

Her twitter timeline is literally full of hate and she is surprised people are dishing it back lol


----------



## Joe

Eric said:


> The problem is these people decide to take it off mid-flight and then refuse to put it back on. I say they treat treat them like the police treat those who spit and muzzle them, no tolerance for these assholes.




She wasn't even arrested. They were an hour and a half out and had to turn around. I hope they at least fine her for that crap. I'd be pissed if I were on my way to London and someone did this and we had to turn around.


----------



## User.45

MEJHarrison said:


> I assume this has been posted before and I've just missed it.  Regardless, this was an amusing find yesterday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorryantivaxxer.com | stories of anti-vaxxers who died from COVID.
> 
> 
> They thought COVID was a scam, until they lay dying from it.  sorryantivaxxer.com tells their story using their own facebook and twitter posts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> sorryantivaxxer.com



This website is just an excellent pictorial demonstration why Americans shouldn't expect the Swedish COVID model to work out in the USA.

(Average BMI is >30kg/m2 on this page).


----------



## Yoused

JagRunner said:


> She wasn't even arrested. They were an hour and a half out and had to turn around. I hope they at least fine her for that crap. I'd be pissed if I were on my way to London and someone did this and we had to turn around.



When I took the train from way over yonder to back here in September, the attendants repeated went on PA to advise everyone about masks. What they told us was that if you  refused to abide by the policy, you would find yourself in the next town (very likely north BFE) and your name would be on the list, meaning you would be banned from trains, planes and probably buses, for, like, ever. So, arresting her might be superfluous.


----------



## ronntaylor

Yoused said:


> When I took the train from way over yonder to back here in September, the attendants repeated went on PA to advise everyone about masks. What they told us was that if you  refused to abide by the policy, you would find yourself in the next town (very likely north BFE) and your name would be on the list, meaning you would be banned from trains, planes and probably buses, for, like, ever. So, arresting her might be superfluous.



When I travel on Amtrak the usual conductor does not play. She makes detailed announcements for each stop (grateful for her constant reminder about the Quiet Car rules as well). She will not check your ticket if your mask is on improperly She will wait until you wear it properly. She will not allow nonsense about masks being off while eating if she notices you're not "actively" eating/drinking. Last time I was on her train she informed someone that his 2nd mask warning was his last as she would have him removed the next time it was below his nose or on his chin. I have sympathy for retail workers and front-facing service workers that have to enforce COVID rules. But I also am very grateful for those workers that are strong, consistent enforcers.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

Eric said:


> Tie their ass down and duct tape the mask to their face, make an example of these idiots.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> American Airlines flight to London returns to Miami after passenger refuses to wear mask
> 
> 
> American Airlines Flight 38 was heading to London with 129 passengers on board when it had to turn back.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cbsnews.com




Imagine being on that flight and having all your plans messed up because of a selfish prick like that. I’d have to fight them when it got back to Miami, I’d be furious.


----------



## JayMysteri0

I confess I've kind of stepped away & tried to avoid this shit of late, but...






Carhartt is a popular brand amongst some of the supposed "libertarian" crowd that's all about NOT being told what to do.  So while I missed what precipitated all of this, I can believe the end result.  More of the easily triggered "F your feelings" crowd because a company decided to do what they wanted, and it wasn't what this crowd wanted them to do.

As if Carhartt or Nike give a rat's rear end if you burn stuff you already paid for from either company.

Sheesh!  Let me guess, Carhartt is also probably "woke" now as well.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> I confess I've kind of stepped away & tried to avoid this shit of late, but...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carhartt is a popular brand amongst some of the supposed "libertarian" crowd that's all about NOT being told what to do.  So while I missed what precipitated all of this, I can believe the end result.  More of the easily triggered "F your feelings" crowd because a company decided to do what they wanted, and it wasn't what this crowd wanted them to do.
> 
> As if Carhartt or Nike give a rat's rear end if you burn stuff you already paid for from either company.
> 
> Sheesh!  Let me guess, Carhartt is also probably "woke" now as well.



This is hilarious The RW anger re cancel culture is hilarious in general. Their only real concern about it is they can't weaponize it as well as young (i.e. liberal) people do. They tried though, like I remember when they tried to cancel Metallica when I was a kid, LOL. Panned out quite well...

The thing about "cancel culture" (political value based brand boycott) is that it requires political memory.
Now, when RW politicians try to rewrite things that happened as recently as a few weeks prior and get away with it tells a lot about what they think how long their voters' memory lasts. On one hand, it's really smart to strategically take over a population that requires the least  effort and consistency to keep on the hook. OTOH, good luck getting them involved in activism that requires high-scale consistency.

Carhartt's gonna be just fine, if not even better off, LOL.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## MEJHarrison

JayMysteri0 said:


> I confess I've kind of stepped away & tried to avoid this shit of late, but...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Carhartt is a popular brand amongst some of the supposed "libertarian" crowd that's all about NOT being told what to do.  So while I missed what precipitated all of this, I can believe the end result.  More of the easily triggered "F your feelings" crowd because a company decided to do what they wanted, and it wasn't what this crowd wanted them to do.
> 
> As if Carhartt or Nike give a rat's rear end if you burn stuff you already paid for from either company.
> 
> Sheesh!  Let me guess, Carhartt is also probably "woke" now as well.




I know nothing about Carhartt the company.  I just know last year someone got me a handful of Carhartt t-shirts and I love them.  They seem thicker than a normal t-shirt.  And most of my length is in my torso, not my legs.  So normal t-shirts tend to not be long enough.  My Carhartts fit perfectly, even after a year of use (many "tall" t-shirts just shrink up after a handful of washes).

I was cringing when I saw that video last night.  But after watching it, I was pleased to learn they're getting crap for doing good, not evil.


----------



## fooferdoggie

MEJHarrison said:


> I know nothing about Carhartt the company.  I just know last year someone got me a handful of Carhartt t-shirts and I love them.  They seem thicker than a normal t-shirt.  And most of my length is in my torso, not my legs.  So normal t-shirts tend to not be long enough.  My Carhartts fit perfectly, even after a year of use (many "tall" t-shirts just shrink up after a handful of washes).
> 
> I was cringing when I saw that video last night.  But after watching it, I was pleased to learn they're getting crap for doing good, not evil.



their pants now suck at least the ones I have been buying. I have worn the seat out riding in a  few months,  they used to be some of the most expensive work clothes now dikky are far more.


----------



## Yoused

MEJHarrison said:


> I was cringing when I saw that video last night. But after watching it, I was pleased to learn they're getting crap for doing good, not evil.




We really need to go after the people who foment the attitude of punishing people for behaving responsibly and being decent. Those mouthpieces are fucking stochastic terrorists, who need to be treated with as much respect as Osama bin Laden (who, AFAIK, never actually killed or hurt anyone with his own hands).


----------



## MEJHarrison

I was just talking with my mother.  She informed me that Omicron is just a cold for 3 days and that there haven't been any deaths from it at this point.  I did my best to inform her and suggest that she double check that information with her nurses (she just had surgery and is currently in the hospital).

She said she doesn't watch the news anymore, so I guess she got that from Facebook and word-of-mouth.


----------



## Renzatic

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> "The Titanic was actually taken down by a family of beavers."




Prove it wasn't!


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

JagRunner said:


> Her twitter timeline is literally full of hate and she is surprised people are dishing it back lol




Things seen in writing, text, pictures, video, or in-person are proof of nothing.  You know what is real proof?  No proof.  It's simple.  People just can't seem to see it because they can't see it.


----------



## Yoused

Renzatic said:


> Prove it wasn't!



Theodore Cleaver was involved in the infamous fiftieth attempt to make the Philadelphia Experiment in early 1968. The field generator was augmented with a confoundium mesh, which was a dreadful mistake that ended the experiments for good and resulted in a significant increase in CIA agents, who were sent out to deal with the unwanted side effects.

It appears that Theodore was flung back in time by something on the order of sixty to sixty-five years. The earliest solid evidence we have of his activities are military base records from 1909, which suggests that he must have arrived by at least 1908, because a different time period requires a fair bit of reacclimation.

He is listed on the crew of a naval destroyer, as a third shift helmsman, which was in the general area. It is believed that the destroyer was the closest vessel to the Titanic at the time that it stuck the iceberg, an in steaming hard to its rescue, the helmsman made an error in judgement that caused the destroyer to collide with the Titanic aport, just fore of amidships.

The Titanic would have survived the iceberg had Cleaver not unintentionally rammed it on the other side, severely compromising its structural integrity. Distress calls from the destroyer were intermingled with transmissions from the destroyer, and the big ship carried the navy ship to the bottom, the two hulls so entangled together as to be indistinguishable.

So, the statement is partially correct: the Titanic was sunk by _The_ Beaver. It is assumed that Theodore perished in those cold waters, but that much is uncertain. The destroyer did have lifeboats, and there were odd reports in late April of strangers coming ashore in Gander, Qaqortoq, even as far away as Galway and Sligo (improbable but not entirely inconceivable), so what actually happened to the Beaver is uncertain, but he almost certainly did not sire his father.


----------



## Yoused

Mom charged after threatening to bring loaded guns to Va. school over mask policy
					

Page County Public Schools in Luray, Virginia will increase police presence at schools Monday after a mother made a perceived threat during a school board meeting Thursday night.  Amelia King was upset about the school mask mandate and said her children would not be wearing masks on Monday and...




					wjla.com


----------



## SuperMatt

This lady threatened to bring a lot of guns and shoot up her kids’ school…. all because they mandated masks.









						Mom charged after threatening to bring loaded guns to Va. school over mask policy
					

Page County Public Schools in Luray, Virginia will increase police presence at schools Monday after a mother made a perceived threat during a school board meeting Thursday night.  Amelia King was upset about the school mask mandate and said her children would not be wearing masks on Monday and...




					wset.com
				




But she’s white, so… $5000 bond and go home… no harm no foul I guess? Must be nice to have such privilege.

Also, great job so far Glenn Youngkin… your new anti-mask rules are really bringing Virginia together in peace and love. For those who saw his campaign ads, he railed against the supposed violence and fighting that was supposedly rampant in schools of Virginia… looks like he‘s made it worse in just a few days on the job.



> Several schools are planning a "Mask Off Monday" protest to show their support of Youngkin's new order on Jan. 24.



If you have kids in Virginia, might be a good day to have them play hooky. If they don’t get murdered by a crazy right-wing mom, they could catch COVID and bring it home to parents or grandparents.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

A little on the lighter side






#9 - people not believing in facts


----------



## AG_PhamD

P_X said:


> It's sorta like blaming Biden for record COVID deaths, but ignoring the fact that Trump locked down. Lockdowns come with lowered mortality. So when human garbage like Rand Paul is whining about the stuff he's advocated for comes with increased mortality all I can say is well, whodathunk.




Comparing alpha vs delta and especially omicron are three entirely different beasts all together in terms of death rates and transmissibility. Delta obviously lead to the most deaths, especially in the unvaccinated. Omicron has made the case count skyrocket because it’s so transmissible and the vaccine provides little protection against infection. It’s comparing apples, oranges, and potatoes. 

Biden did vow to “shut the virus down”, which maybe he’ll do eventually relatively speaking, but it’s a stupid promise to make. Zero COVID is an impossibility and such a comment is clearly political-speak. 



ronntaylor said:


> Trump Backs Boosters. Clearly, Someone Did the Math for Him.
> 
> 
> Trump is losing hundreds of voters a day to Covid — far more than the margins in the swing states.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> donaldgmcneiljr1954.medium.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The math is a bit off as not all adults are registered to vote and not all registered voters actually vote. Still...



Kind of amazing Trump’s most fervent supporters also tend to be the most anti-vax, considering Trump essentially claims the vaccines would not have existed without him, which anyone with any sense of reality knows is insane. It’s surprising just now he is slowly, quietly, beginning to support their use. 

200k is far more than enough to flip an election. It might be insignificant if this trend continues of people moving away from the democrat party continues. As a moderate I have been thoroughly been unimpressed with Biden, but a second Trump term would be disastrous. I can only hope 2024 yields candidates worthy of the Presidency.


----------



## ronntaylor

SuperMatt said:


> This lady threatened to bring a lot of guns and shoot up her kids’ school…. all because they mandated masks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mom charged after threatening to bring loaded guns to Va. school over mask policy
> 
> 
> Page County Public Schools in Luray, Virginia will increase police presence at schools Monday after a mother made a perceived threat during a school board meeting Thursday night.  Amelia King was upset about the school mask mandate and said her children would not be wearing masks on Monday and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wset.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But she’s white, so… $5000 bond and go home… no harm no foul I guess? Must be nice to have such privilege.
> 
> Also, great job so far Glenn Youngkin… your new anti-mask rules are really bringing Virginia together in peace and love. For those who saw his campaign ads, he railed against the supposed violence and fighting that was supposedly rampant in schools of Virginia… looks like he‘s made it worse in just a few days on the job.
> 
> 
> If you have kids in Virginia, might be a good day to have them play hooky. If they don’t get murdered by a crazy right-wing mom, they could catch COVID and bring it home to parents or grandparents.



Just heard about this earlier as I prepare to head back down to Virginia. A couple of friends with kids in the local public schools are worried about the so-called protest this coming Monday. I'm afraid to look at the COVID situation of the city and especially county.


----------



## ronntaylor

AG_PhamD said:


> Kind of amazing Trump’s most fervent supporters also tend to be the most anti-vax, considering Trump essentially claims the vaccines would not have existed without him, which anyone with any sense of reality knows is insane. It’s surprising just now he is slowly, quietly, beginning to support their use.
> 
> 200k is far more than enough to flip an election. It might be insignificant if this trend continues of people moving away from the democrat party continues. As a moderate I have been thoroughly been unimpressed with Biden, *but a second Trump term would be disastrous.* I can only hope 2024 yields candidates worthy of the Presidency.



He words and inaction got his supporters to be anti-vax. And that's why we're seeing reports about 25% of the public vowing to never get vaccinated. And his first term was disastrous. If the GOP retakes the Congress, whether one or both chambers, it will be a complete disaster with Biden needing to veto legislation on a regular basis in the worst case scenario.


----------



## Thomas Veil

SuperMatt said:


> This lady threatened to bring a lot of guns and shoot up her kids’ school…. all because they mandated masks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mom charged after threatening to bring loaded guns to Va. school over mask policy
> 
> 
> Page County Public Schools in Luray, Virginia will increase police presence at schools Monday after a mother made a perceived threat during a school board meeting Thursday night.  Amelia King was upset about the school mask mandate and said her children would not be wearing masks on Monday and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wset.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But she’s white, so… $5000 bond and go home… no harm no foul I guess? Must be nice to have such privilege.
> 
> Also, great job so far Glenn Youngkin… your new anti-mask rules are really bringing Virginia together in peace and love. For those who saw his campaign ads, he railed against the supposed violence and fighting that was supposedly rampant in schools of Virginia… looks like he‘s made it worse in just a few days on the job.
> 
> 
> If you have kids in Virginia, might be a good day to have them play hooky. If they don’t get murdered by a crazy right-wing mom, they could catch COVID and bring it home to parents or grandparents.



Amazingly, frighteningly stupid woman there. Bringing guns to school…over *masks?!?*


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Amazingly, frighteningly stupid woman there. Bringing guns to school…over *masks?!?*



#SafetyFirst


----------



## SuperMatt

ronntaylor said:


> He words and inaction got his supporters to be anti-vax. And that's why we're seeing reports about 25% of the public vowing to never get vaccinated. And his first term was disastrous. If the GOP retakes the Congress, whether one or both chambers, it will be a complete disaster with Biden needing to veto legislation on a regular basis in the worst case scenario.



Agreed, there is nothing amazing about it. His idiotic rhetoric about it being less dangerous than the flu took hold among his supporters. They see refusing masks, vaccines, etc. as a badge of courage. He is responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths that wouldn’t have happened if he treated this seriously.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Agreed, there is nothing amazing about it. His idiotic rhetoric about it being less dangerous than the flu took hold among his supporters. They see refusing masks, vaccines, etc. as a badge of courage. He is responsible for hundreds of thousands of deaths that wouldn’t have happened if he treated this seriously.



I'm still amazed how Trump managed to turn COVID stupid into conservative policy.


----------



## User.45

AG_PhamD said:


> Comparing alpha vs delta and especially omicron are three entirely different beasts all together in terms of death rates and transmissibility. Delta obviously lead to the most deaths, especially in the unvaccinated. Omicron has made the case count skyrocket because it’s so transmissible and the vaccine provides little protection against infection. It’s comparing apples, oranges, and potatoes.



Because it's political speak with the assumption that your voters are raging idiots. People saying in retrospect that based on the data we had in March 2020 it wasn't the right thing to lockdown, are like people suggesting we should have done a night time off-trail hike without equipment in Grand Canyon, based on doing the easy trail at daylight the next day.  DeSantis is already on an offensive blaming public health institutions for policy He enacted, LOL.



AG_PhamD said:


> Biden did vow to “shut the virus down”, which maybe he’ll do eventually relatively speaking, but it’s a stupid promise to make. Zero COVID is an impossibility and such a comment is clearly political-speak.



It's political speak too. With the majority of american deers having SARS-CoV2 antibodies, we have a large pool of animal vectors, just like with Influenza. I'll prefer this though, over the above form of PS.


----------



## lizkat

SuperMatt said:


> This lady threatened to bring a lot of guns and shoot up her kids’ school…. all because they mandated masks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mom charged after threatening to bring loaded guns to Va. school over mask policy
> 
> 
> Page County Public Schools in Luray, Virginia will increase police presence at schools Monday after a mother made a perceived threat during a school board meeting Thursday night.  Amelia King was upset about the school mask mandate and said her children would not be wearing masks on Monday and...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wset.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But she’s white, so… $5000 bond and go home… no harm no foul I guess? Must be nice to have such privilege.
> 
> Also, great job so far Glenn Youngkin… your new anti-mask rules are really bringing Virginia together in peace and love. For those who saw his campaign ads, he railed against the supposed violence and fighting that was supposedly rampant in schools of Virginia… looks like he‘s made it worse in just a few days on the job.
> 
> 
> If you have kids in Virginia, might be a good day to have them play hooky. If they don’t get murdered by a crazy right-wing mom, they could catch COVID and bring it home to parents or grandparents.




Well they charged her with violation of Code of Virginia 18.2-60 Oral Threat While on School Property which is a misdemeanor akin to what they lay on a kid who triggers a lockdown by making a threat but doesn't have the wherewithal to implement it.

Whatever happened to parents who show up to schools bearing gifts like boxes of lined notebook paper, binders, whiteboard erasers or paper towels, wipes, etc.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Meanwhile at the intersection of politics & stupid

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1485015625764413447/


----------



## Yoused

This story is tangentially related to Covid, but it is all kinds of stupid.

A small group of employees of ThedaCare (a major hospital system) took new jobs at another system, Ascension, which had offered them a better benefits package. ThedaCare got upset about this and convinced a judge to impose an injunction on this move, which now means that these specialists will not be working at either facility until ThedaCare and Ascension can resolve their conflict.

Naturally, these health care specialists had *at will* jobs at ThedaCare, so how they can get a ruling like this is baffling. They complained about a shortage of healthcare workers, so the solution is to make the shortage even worse.

Apparently, ThedaCare was shown the offers that Ascension had made to these people and responded with something like "_Meh, we can't afford to match that._" And clearly there were no contracts involved, so the fact that ThedaCare (which is a major provider in the area) can get away with a stunt like this is troubling.


----------



## AG_PhamD

P_X said:


> Because it's political speak with the assumption that your voters are raging idiots. People saying in retrospect that based on the data we had in March 2020 it wasn't the right thing to lockdown, are like people suggesting we should have done a night time off-trail hike without equipment in Grand Canyon, based on doing the easy trail at daylight the next day.  DeSantis is already on an offensive blaming public health institutions for policy He enacted, LOL.
> 
> 
> It's political speak too. With the majority of american deers having SARS-CoV2 antibodies, we have a large pool of animal vectors, just like with Influenza. I'll prefer this though, over the above form of PS.




Yeah, if there’s one thing that annoys me it’s retrospective judgement when you’re talking about totally novel circumstances. Sure, maybe locking down wasn’t the most effective tactic, but also keep in mind in March 2020 there was very limited preparation- particularly in terms of having needed supplies on hand, like PPE. Artificially delaying the inevitable probably did help buy institutions some time, which likely helped. 

I’m curious what your (and others) opinion is on masking in schools- somehow the most controversial topic since abortion. 

It appears that the Arizona study the CDC has used to claim 3x higher transmission rates in unmasked schools is quite flawed- though it’s worth noting just because a study is flawed doesn’t mean the general conclusion (that masking makes a significant difference) can’t be wrong. 

The WHO doesn’t recommend masks for children under 6 due to safety concerns. The UK has not mandated masks for children under 12. Most of the studies I’ve seen are essentially inclusive in showing any benefit. When you spend 8hrs in a classroom together, I suspect cloth and surgical masks won’t make a huge difference. That said, doing studies like these are not exactly easy to conduct and a number of flawed inconclusive studies isn’t exactly conclusive. 

Obviously COVID affects adults (teachers/staff) and children differently. It’s also worth considering that omicron, delta, and alpha have very different implications. And what masks are being required. I keep hearing about N95’s and kids, do they even make them in a kid size? 

I don’t see an overly compelling evidence for masks in young children, especially if the consequences are as significant as they say they are. But I’d rather have them deal with masking than go to remote learning.

Maybe masking should be dependent on the level of infection in the community is a good compromise? Rigorous in school testing would be ideal- I think most K-12 schools are doing 1x+ per week.


----------



## AG_PhamD

Yoused said:


> This story is tangentially related to Covid, but it is all kinds of stupid.
> 
> A small group of employees of ThedaCare (a major hospital system) took new jobs at another system, Ascension, which had offered them a better benefits package. ThedaCare got upset about this and convinced a judge to impose an injunction on this move, which now means that these specialists will not be working at either facility until ThedaCare and Ascension can resolve their conflict.
> 
> Naturally, these health care specialists had *at will* jobs at ThedaCare, so how they can get a ruling like this is baffling. They complained about a shortage of healthcare workers, so the solution is to make the shortage even worse.
> 
> Apparently, ThedaCare was shown the offers that Ascension had made to these people and responded with something like "_Meh, we can't afford to match that._" And clearly there were no contracts involved, so the fact that ThedaCare (which is a major provider in the area) can get away with a stunt like this is troubling.




Wow. I figured this had to do with a non-compete clause but the basis of the suit actually has to do with the fact doesn’t have replacement staff and won’t let them leave until they do. I’m curious what law (or contract?) is being enforced here.

I get ThedaCare doesn’t feel they can provide the level of care desired without these people, but the employees gave notice and finding replacements isn’t the employees’ responsibility. 

To me, this sounds like ThedaCare is essentially forcing these people to work for them (or not work at all). Finding replacements could theoretically take forever if they offer subpar wages and benefits, presumably locking these employees in forever. 

I don’t get the point of this either. 7 of the 11 staff will not be working at either hospital. It’s a lose lose lose situation. 

I have speciality certification very few in my general field have- I imagine like these employees (though I am thankfully nowhere near having to deal with acute life/death cases as found in interventional cardiology & radiology). I wonder if my hospital could pull something like this? I enjoy my work and don’t have any plans of leaving though. It’s an interesting thought though.


----------



## User.45

AG_PhamD said:


> Wow. I figured this had to do with a non-compete clause but the basis of the suit actually has to do with the fact doesn’t have replacement staff and won’t let them leave until they do. I’m curious what law (or contract?) is being enforced here.
> 
> I get ThedaCare doesn’t feel they can provide the level of care desired without these people, but the employees gave notice and finding replacements isn’t the employees’ responsibility.
> 
> To me, this sounds like ThedaCare is essentially forcing these people to work for them (or not work at all). Finding replacements could theoretically take forever if they offer subpar wages and benefits, presumably locking these employees in forever.
> 
> I don’t get the point of this either. 7 of the 11 staff will not be working at either hospital. It’s a lose lose lose situation.
> 
> I have speciality certification very few in my general field have- I imagine like these employees (though I am thankfully nowhere near having to deal with acute life/death cases as found in interventional cardiology & radiology). I wonder if my hospital could pull something like this? I enjoy my work and don’t have any plans of leaving though. It’s an interesting thought though.



This techs of any sort are a hot commodity, they'll just go elsewhere. The goal of the suit is to prevent the competitor from getting the techs. Companies that start lawsuits like this need to be penalized. 



AG_PhamD said:


> Yeah, if there’s one thing that annoys me it’s retrospective judgement when you’re talking about totally novel circumstances. Sure, maybe locking down wasn’t the most effective tactic, but also keep in mind in March 2020 there was very limited preparation- particularly in terms of having needed supplies on hand, like PPE. Artificially delaying the inevitable probably did help buy institutions some time, which likely helped.



And now people look at Omicron's mortality and somehow forget that mortality crept up to 10-15% in the first waves. And then they forget that young, healthy people may occasionally want/need access to hospital care for non-COVID stuff too.  



AG_PhamD said:


> I’m curious what your (and others) opinion is on masking in schools- somehow the most controversial topic since abortion.
> 
> It appears that the Arizona study the CDC has used to claim 3x higher transmission rates in unmasked schools is quite flawed- though it’s worth noting just because a study is flawed doesn’t mean the general conclusion (that masking makes a significant difference) can’t be wrong.



It's better to actually refer to the articles. It's this one:


> In the crude analysis, the odds of a school-associated COVID-19 outbreak in schools with no mask requirement were 3.7 times higher than those in schools with an early mask requirement (odds ratio [OR] = 3.7; 95% CI = 2.2–6.5).* After adjusting for potential described confounders, the odds of a school-associated COVID-19 outbreak in schools without a mask requirement were 3.5 times higher than those in schools with an early mask requirement (OR = 3.5; 95% CI = 1.8–6.9).*











						Association Between K–12 School Mask Policies and School-Associated COVID-19 Outbreaks — Maricopa and Pima Counties, Arizona, July–August 2021
					






					www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
				




Kids can wear masks just fine:


> *RESULTS*: The primary outcome was percent of the day that the entire class was wearing their masks appropriately. Of the estimated almost 1000 students and 1048 classroom days reported, the mean percentage of the school day with appropriate mask usage was 76.9%.
> *CONCLUSIONS*: For a majority of the day while conducting in-person instruction, children in grades pre-K-2 are able to adhere to mask wearing as a key mitigation strategy for limiting SARS-CoV2 infection spread and possible future use.



https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/josh.13033?casa_token=KubFPw80YZYAAAAA:dWkz0N6B3I0AZZ1ia2mROd4noh6_Hw9IKIZe3rwHZqIt_n6lAYoX959x9ejoej9RDfxNxjjeGv7CC1Vjhttps://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/josh.13033?casa_token=KubFPw80YZYAAAAA:dWkz0N6B3I0AZZ1ia2mROd4noh6_Hw9IKIZe3rwHZqIt_n6lAYoX959x9ejoej9RDfxNxjjeGv7CC1Vj

Masks reduce the social distance required by kids:


> *Results*: Among 251 eligible school districts, 537,336 students and 99,390 staff attended in- person instruction during the 16-week study period, representing 6,400,175 student learning weeks and 1,342,574 staff learning weeks. Student case rates were similar in the 242 districts with ≥3 feet versus ≥6 feet of physical distancing between students (IRR, 0.891, 95% CI, 0.594-1.335); results were similar after adjusting for community incidence (adjusted IRR, 0.904, 95% CI, 0.616-1.325). Cases among school staff in districts with ≥3 feet versus ≥6 feet of physical distancing were also similar (IRR, 1.015, 95% CI, 0.754-1.365).
> *Conclusions*: Lower physical distancing policies can be adopted in school settings with masking mandates without negatively impacting student or staff safety.







AG_PhamD said:


> The WHO doesn’t recommend masks for children under 6 due to safety concerns. The UK has not mandated masks for children under 12. Most of the studies I’ve seen are essentially inclusive in showing any benefit. When you spend 8hrs in a classroom together, I suspect cloth and surgical masks won’t make a huge difference. That said, doing studies like these are not exactly easy to conduct and a number of flawed inconclusive studies isn’t exactly conclusive.



My kids had been wearing masks since age 2 and have 0 issue doing so for 9-10 hours a day. From an anecdotal perspective the rate of colds we used to get pre and post pandemic is remarkably different, so these interventions make a difference. The fact that I only got a cold once since September is telling. 



AG_PhamD said:


> Obviously COVID affects adults (teachers/staff) and children differently. It’s also worth considering that omicron, delta, and alpha have very different implications. And what masks are being required. I keep hearing about N95’s and kids, do they even make them in a kid size?





AG_PhamD said:


> I don’t see an overly compelling evidence for masks in young children, especially if the consequences are as significant as they say they are. But I’d rather have them deal with masking than go to remote learning.



The risks are more with developing language and face reading skills. The language part is, US english is super slurred even without masks, but with that extra barrier it's even harder to learn a language. We speak our native language at home and there are no issues with that (we read an hour a day to them), but the kids go to a trilingual school and those languages are much harder. 

To mitigate the face reading issues, I started allowing the kids to play unmasked outdoors after vaccines became widely available. We restarted outdoors with Omicron, but once it's warm again and Omicron is down, we'll probably take their masks off outside again.



AG_PhamD said:


> Maybe masking should be dependent on the level of infection in the community is a good compromise? Rigorous in school testing would be ideal- I think most K-12 schools are doing 1x+ per week.



People would get whiplash about the policy changes. They already have.


----------



## AG_PhamD

P_X said:


> This techs of any sort are a hot commodity, they'll just go elsewhere. The goal of the suit is to prevent the competitor from getting the techs. Companies that start lawsuits like this need to be penalized.
> 
> 
> And now people look at Omicron's mortality and somehow forget that mortality crept up to 10-15% in the first waves. And then they forget that young, healthy people may occasionally want/need access to hospital care for non-COVID stuff too.
> 
> 
> It's better to actually refer to the articles. It's this one:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Association Between K–12 School Mask Policies and School-Associated COVID-19 Outbreaks — Maricopa and Pima Counties, Arizona, July–August 2021
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Kids can wear masks just fine:
> 
> https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/josh.13033?casa_token=KubFPw80YZYAAAAA:dWkz0N6B3I0AZZ1ia2mROd4noh6_Hw9IKIZe3rwHZqIt_n6lAYoX959x9ejoej9RDfxNxjjeGv7CC1Vjhttps://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/josh.13033?casa_token=KubFPw80YZYAAAAA:dWkz0N6B3I0AZZ1ia2mROd4noh6_Hw9IKIZe3rwHZqIt_n6lAYoX959x9ejoej9RDfxNxjjeGv7CC1Vj
> 
> Masks reduce the social distance required by kids:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My kids had been wearing masks since age 2 and have 0 issue doing so for 9-10 hours a day. From an anecdotal perspective the rate of colds we used to get pre and post pandemic is remarkably different, so these interventions make a difference. The fact that I only got a cold once since September is telling.
> 
> 
> 
> The risks are more with developing language and face reading skills. The language part is, US english is super slurred even without masks, but with that extra barrier it's even harder to learn a language. We speak our native language at home and there are no issues with that (we read an hour a day to them), but the kids go to a trilingual school and those languages are much harder.
> 
> To mitigate the face reading issues, I started allowing the kids to play unmasked outdoors after vaccines became widely available. We restarted outdoors with Omicron, but once it's warm again and Omicron is down, we'll probably take their masks off outside again.
> 
> 
> People would get whiplash about the policy changes. They already have.




I’ll get to the rest of your post and take a look at your article a bit later, but I’m not sure if you’ve seen the discussion of the flawed methodology regarding the AZ study, largely brought to light in this article: https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/12/mask-guidelines-cdc-walensky/621035/

I generally don’t pay much attention to the conventional media’s interpretation of studies as it’s usually garbage, but this is rather interesting and appears thoroughly investigated.


----------



## User.45

AG_PhamD said:


> I’ll get to the rest of your post and take a look at your article a bit later, but I’m not sure if you’ve seen the discussion of the flawed methodology regarding the AZ study, largely brought to light in this article: https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2021/12/mask-guidelines-cdc-walensky/621035/
> 
> I generally don’t pay much attention to the conventional media’s interpretation of studies as it’s usually garbage, but this is rather interesting and appears thoroughly investigated.



That's a lot of fixation on the numbers presented in a very rough  analysis that clearly had a very limited scope and prioritized expedience over accuracy. The Bengali study they refer to in the Atlantic article shows that just handing out masks tripled masking compliance (which still only peaked at 42% and dropped to ~22% after 5 months), and the data was less consistent in the cloth masks group. My interpretation of skimming that very complex study is that the ~10% risk reduction of symptomatic COVID would actually be way higher at higher compliance levels (and compliance was best increased by handing out masks). I think at that level it's generally not a filtration, but an adequate use and comfort question. Single-use surgical masks are really the most comfortable (if you have an occipital strap so it doesn't pull on your ears).

I can tell you that preschoolers are way better at wearing their masks appropriately than a bunch of whiny adults. 

https://www.science.org/doi/epdf/10.1126/science.abi9069


----------



## SuperMatt

Yoused said:


> This story is tangentially related to Covid, but it is all kinds of stupid.
> 
> A small group of employees of ThedaCare (a major hospital system) took new jobs at another system, Ascension, which had offered them a better benefits package. ThedaCare got upset about this and convinced a judge to impose an injunction on this move, which now means that these specialists will not be working at either facility until ThedaCare and Ascension can resolve their conflict.
> 
> Naturally, these health care specialists had *at will* jobs at ThedaCare, so how they can get a ruling like this is baffling. They complained about a shortage of healthcare workers, so the solution is to make the shortage even worse.
> 
> Apparently, ThedaCare was shown the offers that Ascension had made to these people and responded with something like "_Meh, we can't afford to match that._" And clearly there were no contracts involved, so the fact that ThedaCare (which is a major provider in the area) can get away with a stunt like this is troubling.



Yet another example of the American judiciary trampling on workers and giving corporations whatever they want. In my opinion, this is the most worrisome trend of the conservative courts in the past few decades. They may side with liberals on some social issues, but they are almost 100% on siding with companies over people. Add to that their wrongful belief that they know more about public health than the experts at the agency created to protect it… This is a very dangerous court to the health and prosperity of Americans.


----------



## SuperMatt

The anti-vax crowd, led by Robert F Kennedy, is marching in Washington, DC today.









						Organizers of the the anti-vaccine 'Defeat the Mandates' rally in DC are nervous that it will 'get out of hand'
					

Organizers of Sunday's anti-vaccine mandate rally appear nervous that the event could turn violent, social media messages show.




					news.yahoo.com
				






> Thousands of anti-vaccine mandate activists are expected to attend the "Defeat the Mandates: American Homecoming" rally on the National Mall in Washington, DC, on Sunday.
> 
> According to the organizers, more than 24,000 people have said they're going to the demonstration. It starts in the morning at the Washington Monument and ends in the afternoon at the Lincoln Memorial.
> 
> Law enforcement officials have already beefed up security for the large-scale protest, per CNN, due to fears that it could attract extremist groups.
> 
> And it appears that the event organizers themselves are also nervous that the event, which is intended to be peaceful, could escalate into chaos akin to the Capitol riot on January 6, 2021.



When organizers of most right-wing events are worried the attendees will commit violence, shouldn‘t alarm bells be going off for the right?


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> The anti-vax crowd, led by Robert F Kennedy, is marching in Washington, DC today.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Organizers of the the anti-vaccine 'Defeat the Mandates' rally in DC are nervous that it will 'get out of hand'
> 
> 
> Organizers of Sunday's anti-vaccine mandate rally appear nervous that the event could turn violent, social media messages show.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> news.yahoo.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> When organizers of most right-wing events are worried the attendees will commit violence, shouldn‘t alarm bells be going off for the right?



Are they White?


----------



## fooferdoggie

After the incident is when the threats to library staff members over the library's mask policy began.

"Unfortunately, the incident kind of escalated from that day, and that, as I said before, voicemails and emails started, and the library felt that at this time we're going to take a pause," Craig said.
St. Charles library temporarily closes in-person services after threats over mask policy​








						St. Charles library temporarily closes in-person services after threats over mask policy
					

Police were called after a group of about 35 to 40 adults and children stormed inside the building and refused to wear masks.




					abc7chicago.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Washington D.C. Covid-19 mandate protesters march to music from Meat Loaf. Eric Clapton inconsolable
Demonstrators have descended upon Washington D.C. to protest against COVID mandates -- and, ironically, they’re blasting music from someone who just succumbed to the virus.

Thousands of people flooded into the National Mall Sunday and gathered at the base of both the Washington Monument and even more packed in front of the Lincoln Memorial ... and wouldn’t you know it, they were playing a *Meat Loaf* song to get themselves fired up.
The tune blaring over the speakers was ML’s “I’d Do Anything for Love” -- which we suppose is sorta in theme with what the anti-mandate crowd was there for. Song’s all about how one guy would do a lot for a woman he loves, but has a line he won’t cross ... which, presumably, applies to their attitudes toward federal and local policies?








						Meat Loaf Cameos At Anti-Mandate Protest in D.C., Thousands Attend
					

Meat Loaf himself wasn't a big fan of vaccine mandates, which he made known before his death.




					www.tmz.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

JagRunner said:


> Who started calling it "the jab"? I understand that jab means to poke, but it's a fucking shot. Call it a shot.
> 
> If you call it "the jab" we can't be friends.



it is what they call shots in the uk.


----------



## SuperMatt

Incredible posts lately @fooferdoggie …. This world is a strange place


----------



## AG_PhamD

Here’s something incredibly stupid- price gouging,: I received an email today from a sales rep of medical supplier we used in the past to purchase rapid antigen and antibody tests from. 

This company evidently is out of stock of the medical rapid antigen tests (exact same tests sold to consumers except 1/2 the price and you need to have CLIA license or CLIA waiver to order them- this is another instance of stupidity with our regulatory agencies during COVID). This vendor are however selling OTC/consumer rapid tests…

Here is the pricing she gave me;


> FlowFlex OTC Rapid Antigen COVID-19 Test Order Now
> 1-99 $29.90
> 100+ $26.00
> 200+ $25.00
> 640+ $23
> 1280+ $21
> 5000+ $19.99




If you’re not aware, unlike all the other US OTC kits with two tests, FlowFlex only includes ONE test… So this company is trying to charge $30/test. 

CVS selling FlowFlex for $9.99- available for order online today. iHealth is shipping directly to consumers and in bulk for $8.99/test (In fact bought some of these a while back for $6.99/test). Even the most expensive OTC tests at major retailers are max $15/test. 

My response to this sales pitch was pretty scathing. I warned the rep that this situation (charging 3x the normal price, even when buying 100 tests) has the appearance of price gouging. COVID tests are specifically mentioned as an essential commodity in the state they operate in, making price gouging illegal. 

I can’t imagine anyone would pay for this but someone must be if they’re trying.


----------



## DT

Our child, 13 has worn a mask for 2 years, has had zero issues, wears (and carries an extra) every day at school, zero complaints, she's awesome.


----------



## rdrr

AG_PhamD said:


> Here’s something incredibly stupid- price gouging,: I received an email today from a sales rep of medical supplier we used in the past to purchase rapid antigen and antibody tests from.
> 
> This company evidently is out of stock of the medical rapid antigen tests (exact same tests sold to consumers except 1/2 the price and you need to have CLIA license or CLIA waiver to order them- this is another instance of stupidity with our regulatory agencies during COVID). This vendor are however selling OTC/consumer rapid tests…
> 
> Here is the pricing she gave me;
> 
> 
> If you’re not aware, unlike all the other US OTC kits with two tests, FlowFlex only includes ONE test… So this company is trying to charge $30/test.
> 
> CVS selling FlowFlex for $9.99- available for order online today. iHealth is shipping directly to consumers and in bulk for $8.99/test (In fact bought some of these a while back for $6.99/test). Even the most expensive OTC tests at major retailers are max $15/test.
> 
> My response to this sales pitch was pretty scathing. I warned the rep that this situation (charging 3x the normal price, even when buying 100 tests) has the appearance of price gouging. COVID tests are specifically mentioned as an essential commodity in the state they operate in, making price gouging illegal.
> 
> I can’t imagine anyone would pay for this but someone must be if they’re trying.



FYI, Looks like iHealth is a scam site.   









						iHealth Labs, Inc |  Better Business Bureau® Profile
					

This organization is not BBB accredited. Health and Medical Products in Sunnyvale, CA. See BBB rating, reviews, complaints, & more.




					www.bbb.org


----------



## Thomas Veil

rdrr said:


> FYI, Looks like iHealth is a scam site.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> iHealth Labs, Inc |  Better Business Bureau® Profile
> 
> 
> This organization is not BBB accredited. Health and Medical Products in Sunnyvale, CA. See BBB rating, reviews, complaints, & more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbb.org



LOL at that company's location. Looks like the crows have come home to roost.


----------



## fooferdoggie

could not happen to a smarter person.
Sarah Palin Catches Covid For Second Time After Saying She'd Get Vaccine 'Over Her Dead Body'​








						Sarah Palin Catches Covid For Second Time After Saying She'd Get Vaccine 'Over Her Dead Body'
					

Sarah Palin Catches Covid For Second Time After Saying She'd Get Vaccine 'Over Her Dead Body'




					www.unilad.co.uk


----------



## AG_PhamD

rdrr said:


> FYI, Looks like iHealth is a scam site.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> iHealth Labs, Inc |  Better Business Bureau® Profile
> 
> 
> This organization is not BBB accredited. Health and Medical Products in Sunnyvale, CA. See BBB rating, reviews, complaints, & more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bbb.org




No, they are very much a real company and their tests are sold at major retailers. iHealthLabs is the manufacturer of one of the relatively few FDA approved COVID tests.




__





						Loading…
					





					www.fda.gov
				







__





						Loading…
					





					www.fda.gov
				




I will say I ordered 20 kits from them on 12/27 and they said the order shipped 12/28 “via FedEx” yet the tracking never updated… come to find out because it was actually a UPS tracking number. It was supposed to take 4-10 days to deliver. Delivery did not occur until Jan 16th.

They did have a statement on their site that orders made after some date (very early Jan IIRC) would be delayed.

If you read the reviews, I suspect a lot of the people had similar experiences to mine. Complaining about a 6 month expiration on COVID tests is a bit much… all the On/Go tests I’ve seen have 4 months expirations. Not being able to communicate due to staffing is also isn’t unheard of, especially in late 2021/early 2022.

As for the complaints of ordering masks and not getting them in the designated time frame, maybe their logistics were just overloaded, which is apparently what happened with their COVID tests- company specifically cited here:








						Worker shortages, flight delays contributing to slow delivery of rapid tests
					

With millions of COVID-19 rapid tests ready for distribution in the U.S., delays in delivery are being caused by warehouse bottlenecks and worker shortages.




					abcnews.go.com
				




That said at the beginning of the pandemic, there were tons of greedy companies who claimed to have PPE, hand sanitizer, etc in stock only to have it on order- so people wouldn’t get their orders for months. So there could be some of that going on, perhaps with the masks, less likely with the COVID tests considering the government oversight.

It looks like iHealth Labs was founded in 2010 and basically just sold cheap glucometers, pulse oximeters, and BP cuffs. Then somehow they got into selling masks and eventually marketing a COVID test. They probably went from have very stable business to having an overwhelming amount with no idea how to handle it. I know they do a lot of big contracts with schools, governments, retail stores, etc, so dealing with small orders is probably not the top priority.

I’m not saying it’s a well run business and if you buy from them I would anticipate having to wait longer than indicated, but I wouldn’t call it a scam website.

Keep in mind people typically don’t report favorable experiences to the BBB. Abbott has a rating of 1.08 and 38 complaints in the past year. But they’re worth 220B and have been in business for well over 100 years.


----------



## User.45

COVID Data Tracker
					

CDC’s home for COVID-19 data. Visualizations, graphs, and data in one easy-to-use website.



					covid.cdc.gov
				








Vaccination makes you 20 years younger...at least when it comes to risk of dying from COVID


----------



## Yoused

fooferdoggie said:


> 'Over Her Dead Body'



oh man oh man oh man

(not gonna say it)


----------



## fooferdoggie

man what a hill to die on literally. I wonder if he thinks if he waits long enough they will let him go without? Herman Cain would be proud.
Man Can’t Get Heart Transplant Because He’s Not Vaccinated Against COVID​“It’s kind of against his basic principles, he doesn’t believe in it. It’s a policy they are enforcing and so because he won’t get the shot, they took him off the list of a heart transplant,” Ferguson said.

Brigham and Women’s released a statement saying, “And like many other transplant programs in the United States – the COVID-19 vaccine is one of several vaccines and lifestyle behaviors required for transplant candidates in the Mass General Brigham system in order to create both the best chance for a successful operation and also the patient’s survival after transplantation.”










						Man Can't Get Heart Transplant Because He's Not Vaccinated Against COVID
					

DJ Ferguson was set to receive a heart transplant, but because he is not vaccinated against COVID-19 he is no longer eligible, according to hospital policy.




					boston.cbslocal.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

Sigh... You can lead a Covid denier to the ICU, but you can't make him breathe
Unvaccinated 28-Year-Old in Denial of COVID Diagnosis Dies After Ripping Off Oxygen Mask​




__





						Unvaccinated 28-Year-Old in Denial of COVID Diagnosis Dies After Ripping Off Oxygen Mask
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

fooferdoggie said:


> could not happen to a smarter person.
> Sarah Palin Catches Covid For Second Time After Saying She'd Get Vaccine 'Over Her Dead Body'​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sarah Palin Catches Covid For Second Time After Saying She'd Get Vaccine 'Over Her Dead Body'
> 
> 
> Sarah Palin Catches Covid For Second Time After Saying She'd Get Vaccine 'Over Her Dead Body'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.unilad.co.uk



Part of me thinks she got secretly vaccinated like all the other wingnut grifters, however, she's not exactly the smartest so it also wouldn't surprise me if she really is unvaccinated.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yes, this nonsense is still going on as well...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1485801992157114372/


----------



## Roller

JayMysteri0 said:


> Yes, this nonsense is still going on as well...
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1485801992157114372/



Minor kudos to the guy for not being as obnoxious as many others of his ilk, though maybe he did that because he was with his daughter. But he loses points for invoking the "You are only following orders" line, which, intentional or not, ties to the mask mandates are the same as the Holocaust trope.


----------



## Clix Pix

I am SO glad that I am retired!  These days librarians have to deal with an awful lot of issues that really are not anything for which they have been prepared or trained, stuff which has nothing to do with books and resources.    Good for this little lady in standing up to that jerk and insisting that he wear a mask while in the facility!


----------



## User.45

Clix Pix said:


> I am SO glad that I am retired!  These days librarians have to deal with an awful lot of issues that really are not anything for which they have been prepared or trained, stuff which has nothing to do with books and resources.    Good for this little lady in standing up to that jerk and insisting that he wear a mask while in the facility!



The most absurd thing is that I don't know what this guy wants in a library when he's clearly not the type who reads.


----------



## SuperMatt

P_X said:


> The most absurd thing is that I don't know what this guy wants in a library when he's clearly not the type who reads.



Probably needed to get something for his kid even though he didn’t want to.


----------



## Clix Pix

In a lot of public libraries the big drawing-card these days is the public computers which access the internet.  People who don't have a computer at home or don't have internet access use what is available at the library.....

In this case, though, since the guy had a kid with him he probably was there because she needed a book for a school assignment.


----------



## User.45

Clix Pix said:


> In a lot of public libraries the big drawing-card these days is the public computers which access the internet.  People who don't have a computer at home or don't have internet access use what is available at the library.....
> 
> In this case, though, since the guy had a kid with him he probably was there because she needed a book for a school assignment.



He also had a cell phone, so all he needed is WiFi. One of the weird millennial things is having the illusion that you can do everything off your cell phone, when reality most things take 1.5-2x longer on a cell phone.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

The irony of that shirt is breathtaking.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> View attachment 11313
> 
> The irony of that shirt is breathtaking.



Or just wear the shirt and have that face…


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> View attachment 11313
> 
> The irony of that shirt is breathtaking.




And the context 









						‘Bunch of Idiots’: Grown Man Accused of Spitting on and Shoving Kids for Wearing Masks
					

Parents say the middle-age man has been behind a string of incidents targeting children in recent weeks.



					www.thedailybeast.com
				




Another concerning part of the story is that the police seem to have been aware of this guy but haven’t done anything about it yet.  If that’s true, regardless of your Covid views, in what other situation is it acceptable for adults to terrorize kids?


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> And the context
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ‘Bunch of Idiots’: Grown Man Accused of Spitting on and Shoving Kids for Wearing Masks
> 
> 
> Parents say the middle-age man has been behind a string of incidents targeting children in recent weeks.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Another concerning part of the story is that the police seem to have been aware of this guy but haven’t done anything about it yet.  If that’s true, regardless of your Covid views, in what other situation is it acceptable for adults to terrorize kids?



COVID STUPID EVIL


----------



## Eric

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalHumor/comments/scrcgs


----------



## fooferdoggie

does this even need to be said? I guess so


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> does this even need to be said? I guess so View attachment 11319




I rode TriMet for years.  Never spit on _*anyone*_.  Never witnessed anyone else spitting on anyone else. Or anything else.  Where the hell did people's sense go?  It's not as if the company is just now addressing an ongoing issue.  This is a new thing.  Strange the behavior a public health crisis can bring out in people.

I swear the past few years have caused some people to de-evolve from stupid to almost the animal level again.


----------



## fooferdoggie

MEJHarrison said:


> I rode TriMet for years.  Never spit on _*anyone*_.  Never witnessed anyone else spitting on anyone else. Or anything else.  Where the hell did people's sense go?  It's not as if the company is just now addressing an ongoing issue.  This is a new thing.  Strange the behavior a public health crisis can bring out in people.
> 
> I swear the past few years have caused some people to de-evolve from stupid to almost the animal level again.



more covid crazy. Now that I commute on my bike I almost never ride on the bus. I did see some idiot smoking weed once he lit up as I was getting off.


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> more covid crazy. Now that I commute on my bike I almost never ride on the bus. I did see some idiot smoking weed once he lit up as I was getting off.




I've seen crazy things on the bus and train, but not spitting on employees to the point that an announcement needs made.  And I suspect that it's not coming from the usual group of crazies who do all the other whacky stuff.  This is an entirely new and different group of crazy people.  Who would have guessed a few years back that they were hiding among us the whole time?  They were just waiting for the right trigger to let loose their insanity on the world.

I saw a blind guy get on downtown once, put away his cane and glasses and then played on a phone or something. Guess he was just done working for the day like the rest of us.


----------



## Yoused

Neil Young tells Spotify that they can carry his music or Joe Rogan's Covid bullshit, but not both. Spotify makes the wrong choice.

I never used Spotify before and certainly will not now.


----------



## Joe

JayMysteri0 said:


> Yes, this nonsense is still going on as well...
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1485801992157114372/




I can't imagine being a grown ass man harassing an older lady like that. 

Then when she says she's just following the orders of the library he goes "That's the problem" but when it's other people dealing with the police they should just comply.


----------



## fooferdoggie

MEJHarrison said:


> I
> 
> I saw a blind guy get on downtown once, put away his cane and glasses and then played on a phone or something. Guess he was just done working for the day like the rest of us.



my wife plays with her phone all the time she is blind. there are different levels of blindness.


----------



## MEJHarrison

fooferdoggie said:


> my wife plays with her phone all the time she is blind. there are different levels of blindness.




This wasn't a partially blind person.  They were clearly a fake.  Their entire demeanor changed.  If I'm remember correctly, I might have even seen them get off the train.  It was 100% fake.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wha?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1486519854484049920/


----------



## fooferdoggie

Kansas bill forces pharmacists to fill ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine as off-label COVID treatment​








						Kansas bill forces pharmacists to fill ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine as off-label COVID treatment
					

Kansas senators who oversee public health policy debate a bill that would promote off-label drugs ivermectin and hydroxychloroquine to treat COVID.




					www.aol.com


----------



## Alli

Yoused said:


> Neil Young tells Spotify that they can carry his music or Joe Rogan's Covid bullshit, but not both. Spotify makes the wrong choice.
> 
> I never used Spotify before and certainly will not now.



I don’t use Spotify. Good thing since Neil Young is my favorite male vocalist.


----------



## Runs For Fun

I would love to switch to Apple Music but I've found it to be just so bad.


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> I would love to switch to Apple Music but I've found it to be just so bad.



Apple recently purchased a company that specializes in streaming classical music. They claim that new team will revamp their classical offerings. I am looking forward to that. I hope the result is positive.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> Apple recently purchased a company that specializes in streaming classical music. They claim that new team will revamp their classical offerings. I am looking forward to that. I hope the result is positive.



Yeah I remember that. My main problems are 

The app has a horrible UI
Little annoyances like not being able to sort a playlist by date added
Buggy behavior like searching for a song and be able to play it from the search results but when you add it to your library it tells you it's not available in your region
Public playlists suck compared to Spotify's. I've found a lot of good music from other people's playlists
Spotify's algorithm for discovering new music is light years ahead of Apple Music
Apple Music's weird obsession with Hip-Hop.


----------



## lizkat

Yoused said:


> Neil Young tells Spotify that they can carry his music or Joe Rogan's Covid bullshit, but not both. Spotify makes the wrong choice.
> 
> I never used Spotify before and certainly will not now.




I killed my Spotify account this morning.   Currently streaming Neil Young on Apple music platform...


----------



## Eric

They dig their own graves from
      facepalm


----------



## Runs For Fun

Da fuq?

Got this gem on my windshield after work (WI) from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## Yoused

Runs For Fun said:


> Da fuq?
> 
> Got this gem on my windshield after work (WI) from
> HermanCainAward



Da fuq is that SARS nCov19 tends to have less than salutary effects on blood flow in the brain: the unvaccinated are almost certainly catching δ or ξ or λ or μ or omicron variants and suffering ischemic sub-strokes that are compromising their already dubious mental functionality.

We might not care, we might say let them light their own curtains on fire, but, then we have to have the charred sticks cleaned up and to figure out how to deal with these now homeless ones. And, smoke in the air is not good for anyone.


----------



## User.45

Runs For Fun said:


> Yeah I remember that. My main problems are
> 
> The app has a horrible UI
> Little annoyances like not being able to sort a playlist by date added
> Buggy behavior like searching for a song and be able to play it from the search results but when you add it to your library it tells you it's not available in your region
> Public playlists suck compared to Spotify's. I've found a lot of good music from other people's playlists
> Spotify's algorithm for discovering new music is light years ahead of Apple Music
> Apple Music's weird obsession with Hip-Hop.



Dunno. The UI isn't buggier than TIDAL's, but sure it needs some improvement. Public playlists generally suck. Agree, spotify's custom AI generated playlists are ridiculously good, but the sound quality is whack. Apple Music's auto playlists aren't bad, I'd even call them good for Jazz and Opera. I think TIDAL's obsession with Hip-hop is irritating. I have a bunch old Wu-Tang and GZA tracks on my lists, but it doesn't want to sell me hip-hop at all.


----------



## Joe

Runs For Fun said:


> I would love to switch to Apple Music but I've found it to be just so bad.




Yeah, Apple Music is horrible.


----------



## lizkat

Runs For Fun said:


> Yeah I remember that. My main problems are
> 
> The app has a horrible UI
> Little annoyances like not being able to sort a playlist by date added
> Buggy behavior like searching for a song and be able to play it from the search results but when you add it to your library it tells you it's not available in your region
> Public playlists suck compared to Spotify's. I've found a lot of good music from other people's playlists
> Spotify's algorithm for discovering new music is light years ahead of Apple Music
> Apple Music's weird obsession with Hip-Hop.




My problem is UI-related too...  remembering how much more flexible the old iTunes app used to be in terms of playlist editing and stuff like visual reload of a reshuffle of contents of a playlist, etc.  All that even before there was the option to stream music on the Apple platform.    What we have now whether using Apple Music or not is a pale shadow of previous functionality.


----------



## Yoused

Washingtion State Patrol Rocket Surgeon holds the line,

*“Wish I could say more but this is it … this is the last time you’ll hear me in a State Patrol car, and (Governor) Inslee can kiss my ass,” LaMay said in a recording of his final radio call …

The video was viewed millions of times and LaMay appeared on multiple TV shows, including on Fox News, where he said he and his family “don’t do vaccines.” His Facebook page was deleted earlier this month when he reportedly fell ill with COVID-19 and was put on a ventilator … and he died on Friday, journalist Naveed Jamali said.*​
such courage and wisdom


----------



## JayMysteri0

Two unnecessary reminders.

1.  Covid stupidity is not just a U.S. thing

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1487181897373528071/

2.  When someone tries to peddle to you that their fetishism of the confederate flag is somehow about some heritage or history, they think you're the stupid one.


----------



## fooferdoggie

"My fourth child was born this past Saturday; I've decided I need to do this for my family" says trucker who abandoned his wife in mid-labor to drive to Ottawa to protest vaccines

My fourth child was born this past Saturday; I’ve decided I need to do this for my family': National Post talks to the truckers in the convoy 

_The National Post spoke to truck drivers and supporters as they were driving to Ottawa for this weekend’s “Freedom Convoy 2022” to protest vaccine mandates. Here is what they told us about their jobs, their frustrations with government measures during the pandemic, and the rule that could kill their livelihoods.








						Meet the truckers: The men and women of the Freedom Convoy 2022
					

'My fourth child was born this past Saturday; I’ve decided I need to do this for my family': National Post talks to the truckers in the convoy




					nationalpost.com
				



_


----------



## fooferdoggie

Very brave police officer makes a video of himself resigning due to COVID-19 vaccine mandate. Since you're reading this on FARK, you can probably guess what happened next
Washington trooper who defied state vaccine mandate and told gov to 'kiss my a--' dies from COVID-19​








						Washington trooper who defied state vaccine mandate and told gov to 'kiss my a--' dies from COVID-19
					

A Washington State Patrol officer who defied a statewide vaccine mandate and signed off for the last time by issuing a strongly worded message to Gov. Jay Inslee has passed away from COVID-19 complications.




					www.foxnews.com


----------



## Eric

Top comment FTW "Cut me open and insert somebody else’s kidney? No problem! Vaccinate me? What are you crazy that stuff is dangerous!"


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/sfk3s4


----------



## Roller

At this point, I doubt if anything will convince the die-hard antivaxxers. Certainly not guidance from public health officials, physicians, and other people with domain expertise, not the death of other unvaccinated people around them, and not even a close brush with death from COVID-19. They are a lost cause who will continue to overwhelm the healthcare system during surges, complicating life and potentially causing death or lack of access to care for others.

Unfortunately, the United States nearly leads the pack in the percentage of people who fall into this category. It's honestly hard for me to muster a lot of empathy for them. Like drunk drivers who get back on the road and kill others, their actions have consequences for more than just themselves. In many instances, their approach to the pandemic is molded by massive misinformation from Fox News and other grifters, but it's not as if reliable information isn't also available to them if they care to listen.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Roller said:


> At this point, I doubt if anything will convince the die-hard antivaxxers. Certainly not guidance from public health officials, physicians, and other people with domain expertise, not the death of other unvaccinated people around them, and not even a close brush with death from COVID-19. They are a lost cause who will continue to overwhelm the healthcare system during surges, complicating life and potentially causing death or lack of access to care for others.
> 
> Unfortunately, the United States nearly leads the pack in the percentage of people who fall into this category. It's honestly hard for me to muster a lot of empathy for them. Like drunk drivers who get back on the road and kill others, their actions have consequences for more than just themselves. In many instances, their approach to the pandemic is molded by massive misinformation from Fox News and other grifters, but it's not as if reliable information isn't also available to them if they care to listen.




Yeah, some people seem too set in their ways to listen to reason.  Since I'm not a doctor and have never taken any oaths, I say the sooner that crowd kills themselves off, the better off we'll all be.  That population isn't savable.  I don't want to see people die, but I also don't want this crowd keeping things going longer than is necessary.  The longer it has a nice place to circulate, the longer it has to turn into the next letter of the Greek alphabet.


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> Covid stupidity is not just a U.S. thing



Except, I suspect that is a pickup from the US: it does not look like a Canadian plate.


----------



## DT

Karma:  "Well, this seems too easy ..."

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1487418902896209921/


----------



## fooferdoggie

seems not was an employee that did it when I  read more.
LYNNWOOD, Wash. — In the past week, a pirate-themed bar in the Seattle suburb of Lynnwood has lost staff, bands and other customers — over a show with advertised discounted prices for people sick with COVID-19.


The Vessel Taphouse posted on Facebook on Friday, Jan. 21, that people should, “Come see the show, maybe catch the virus or just stay home and whine,” The Daily Herald reported.


The post also said people could enter the bar for a discounted rate with proof of omicron positive test. Owner Steve Hartley said four employees quit and three bands refused to play another show that weekend. Hartley told the newspaper the post was “an ill-advised attempt at humor,” and the responsible employee has been fired.









						Washington bar loses staff, bands, customers after advertising ‘catch the virus’ show
					

The Vessel Taphouse posted on Facebook on Friday, Jan. 21, that people should, “Come see the show, maybe catch the virus or just stay home and whine,” The Daily Herald reported.




					www.oregonlive.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

Yoused said:


> Except, I suspect that is a pickup from the US: it does not look like a Canadian plate.



It was a convoy that Americans joined in on.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1485881178196353024/

What people are saying that took photos is that it was part of this convoy in Canada.

I should point out also there's a whole discussion in that thread how white supremacists in Canada adopted the confederate flag as their symbol.


----------



## Runs For Fun

A couple WTFs






__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/sfrnlh


----------



## SuperMatt

Runs For Fun said:


> A couple WTFs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/sfrnlh



Is Trump running for President of Canada in 2024?


----------



## thekev

Eric said:


> Top comment FTW "Cut me open and insert somebody else’s kidney? No problem! Vaccinate me? What are you crazy that stuff is dangerous!"
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/sfk3s4




Seems to be happening quite a lot. Given that they'll have to take immuno-suppressants to reduce the chance that organ is rejected, they're not going to be considered eligible without getting vaccinated against anything they're like to encounter. 


DT said:


> Karma:  "Well, this seems too easy ..."
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1487418902896209921/




He mentions having worked sick. If he got COVID, I wonder if he would still show up to work.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> Is Trump running for President of Canada in 2024?



I don’t know but there also seems to be some confederates there too!


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> A couple WTFs
> 
> 
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/vaxxhappened/comments/sfrnlh



trump has infected Canada. he is worse then covid.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> Is Trump running for President of Canada in 2024?



why not he wants to be supreme leader.


----------



## Yoused

Canadians seem to be learning US behavior patterns,

*Roughly a dozen protesters had parked their vehicles on the site of the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier at Ottawa's National War Memorial earlier Saturday. The cars and trucks were removed by midday after orders from local police. "Parking on this sacred ground was a sign of complete disrespect," Ottawa Mayor Jim Watson said.

Later, protesters were seen dancing on the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier …
*​
Seriously, WTF is wrong with people?


----------



## SuperMatt

A nice pic from the Canadian anti-vaccine rally:


----------



## DT

SuperMatt said:


> A nice pic from the Canadian anti-vaccine rally:
> 
> View attachment 11408





Seems more like a finishing move, but hey, you do you ...


----------



## fooferdoggie

Plague rats gave these two nurses $1.5 million for something they could have gotten for free
only in the us will people pay 250.00 for something you can get for free.

Long Island Nurses Make $1.5 Million in Fake Vaccine Card Scam: DA​








						Long Island Nurses Make $1.5 Million in Fake Vaccine Card Scam: DA
					

Two nurses working on Long Island are accused of forging official COVID-19 vaccination cards and entering the information into New York’s statewide database — a scheme that allegedly brought in over $1.5 million. The district attorney in Suffolk County announced Friday the arrests of Julie...




					www.nbcnewyork.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

when you're told off by someone even more crazy then you your doing really bad. 
Michele Bachmann Says Sarah Palin Should Be 'Commended' For Dining Out With COVID​








						Michele Bachmann Says Sarah Palin Should Be 'Commended' For Dining Out With COVID
					

Palin was just "trying to act  like a normal human being," claimed the former GOP presidential candidate.




					www.huffpost.com


----------



## thekev

fooferdoggie said:


> when you're told off by someone even more crazy then you your doing really bad.
> Michele Bachmann Says Sarah Palin Should Be 'Commended' For Dining Out With COVID​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Michele Bachmann Says Sarah Palin Should Be 'Commended' For Dining Out With COVID
> 
> 
> Palin was just "trying to act  like a normal human being," claimed the former GOP presidential candidate.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.huffpost.com




Palin isn't so much crazy. She's just a shithead.


----------



## fooferdoggie

thekev said:


> Palin isn't so much crazy. She's just a shithead.



I guessed you missed her family drama?


----------



## thekev

fooferdoggie said:


> I guessed you missed her family drama?




I care very little about her family drama. I guess it could be crazy + shithead.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Daaaaamn

This...ALL of this from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## Runs For Fun

Two New York nurses charged with forging Covid vaccine cards to earn more than $1.5 million
					

Julie DeVuono and Marissa Urraro, of Wild Child Pediatric Healthcare in Amityville, are each being charged with one count of forgery in the second degree.




					www.cnbc.com


----------



## thekev

Runs For Fun said:


> Two New York nurses charged with forging Covid vaccine cards to earn more than $1.5 million
> 
> 
> Julie DeVuono and Marissa Urraro, of Wild Child Pediatric Healthcare in Amityville, are each being charged with one count of forgery in the second degree.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnbc.com




Those two were morons, which was probably a contributing factor in their being caught. Assuming almost all adult patients, this would have required over 6800 patients between November of last year and roughly now.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> Two New York nurses charged with forging Covid vaccine cards to earn more than $1.5 million
> 
> 
> Julie DeVuono and Marissa Urraro, of Wild Child Pediatric Healthcare in Amityville, are each being charged with one count of forgery in the second degree.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnbc.com



sorry I beat you to this story.


----------



## ronntaylor

thekev said:


> Those two were morons, which was probably a contributing factor in their being caught. Assuming almost all adult patients, this would have required over 6800 patients between November of last year and roughly now.



"Smart" enough to rake in millions. Dumb enough to have records and most of the cash just laying around ready to be scooped up by authorities. What about a couple maroons!!


----------



## Runs For Fun

fooferdoggie said:


> sorry I beat you to this story.



Whoops. Missed it!


----------



## Yoused

Going back to Ottawa,

*The Shepherds of Good Hope homeless shelter, located just a few blocks from Parliament Hill, reported that a service user and a security guard were assaulted and its staff were harassed by protesters pressuring them to provide meals over the last 24 hours.*​
but, no grift going on here,

B.J. Dichter, one of the organizers behind _*a GoFundMe page that has amassed more than $8 million to support the convoy*_, said the goal is to create a "logistics nightmare" for the government​


----------



## fooferdoggie

Runs For Fun said:


> Whoops. Missed it!



your forgiven


----------



## thekev

ronntaylor said:


> "Smart" enough to rake in millions. Dumb enough to have records and most of the cash just laying around ready to be scooped up by authorities. What about a couple maroons!!




I'm not convinced they have to be particularly smart to make money in that manner. It doesn't require significant inventory, just the cards and access to a public health database. The sheer volume required in fake vaccinations alone to put out those numbers would have easily been enough to flag them if anyone was monitoring.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Does he think it will become a martyr or a hero? 

LOCAL NEWS
'I'm willing to die': NC man denied life-saving kidney transplant over vaccine requirement​ 
"They said the last thing we need talk about is your vaccination status," Carswell said. "And that's when I politely told him there was nothing really to talk about. It wasn't up for debate that I wasn't getting it. And then he told me, you know you'll die if you don't get it. And I said I'm willing to die."

The hospital says their policy follows the current standard in the U.S. saying the vaccine is required to protect the patient, who is at high risk for severe illness if they don't have immunity prior to the transplant.

Carswell said he's already had COVID twice and is not willing to get the vaccine, even if it means giving up on finding a kidney.








						'I'm willing to die': NC man denied life-saving kidney transplant over vaccine requirement
					

A North Carolina man is turning down an opportunity at a lifesaving kidney transplant, because the hospital is requiring he be vaccinated against COVID before the procedure.




					www.wral.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

Please stop.



> Many react to Rep. Thomas Massie Tweeting a quote falsely attributed to French philosopher Voltaire meant to criticize Dr. Anthony Fauci, which has been traced back to a 1993 radio broadcast by American neo-Nazi and white nationalist Kevin Alfred Strom, according to fact-checkers



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488092515584651270/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488121595373789186/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488123005876289538/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488123215293595658/

The idea behind intelligent debate, is not looking stupid by quoting a racist into child porn.

FFS

The real danger of this pandemic besides the obvious deaths, is the level of stupid that's been elevated that is in part responsible for some of those deaths.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

I saw an article where an American man is refusing a life saving kidney transplant because the hospital require him to be vaccinated prior to the op. He’s morbidly obese too by the looks of him. 

His response to the media:

‘I was born free so i’ll die free’ 

Yep, you’ll die about 40 years earlier too mate but at least he can’t die of covid if he’s already died of kidney disease. That kidney will go to someone less stupid though one hopes lol. You can’t make this stuff up.


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Please stop.
> 
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488092515584651270/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488121595373789186/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488123005876289538/
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488123215293595658/
> 
> The idea behind intelligent debate, is not looking stupid by quoting a racist into child porn.
> 
> FFS
> 
> The real danger of this pandemic besides the obvious deaths, is the level of stupid that's been elevated that is in part responsible for some of those deaths.



He's an MIT grad engineer who integrated a tesla battery into his home's power grid. 
This is a feature, not a bug.


----------



## thekev

P_X said:


> He's an MIT grad engineer who integrated a tesla battery into his home's power grid.
> This is a feature, not a bug.



Maybe he'll try to quote Descarte next?


----------



## Huntn

A report says that 98% of USNavy personnel have been vaccinated, bravo! Think about functioning on a ship.
…accept for the  35 SEAL team members who are asserting a religious objection?? Huh?  Can someone explain what Christianity or any religion says about not being vaccinated?


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> Does he think it will become a martyr or a hero?
> 
> LOCAL NEWS
> 'I'm willing to die': NC man denied life-saving kidney transplant over vaccine requirement​
> "They said the last thing we need talk about is your vaccination status," Carswell said. "And that's when I politely told him there was nothing really to talk about. It wasn't up for debate that I wasn't getting it. And then he told me, you know you'll die if you don't get it. And I said I'm willing to die."
> 
> The hospital says their policy follows the current standard in the U.S. saying the vaccine is required to protect the patient, who is at high risk for severe illness if they don't have immunity prior to the transplant.
> 
> Carswell said he's already had COVID twice and is not willing to get the vaccine, even if it means giving up on finding a kidney.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 'I'm willing to die': NC man denied life-saving kidney transplant over vaccine requirement
> 
> 
> A North Carolina man is turning down an opportunity at a lifesaving kidney transplant, because the hospital is requiring he be vaccinated against COVID before the procedure.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wral.com



It’s called cutting off your nose to spite your face. A lot of this shit we have Trump and the manipulative GOP to blame for and in combination with the abundance of… STUPID.


----------



## JayMysteri0

A little extra on the "freedom convoy"

For a group that hates mainstream media so much, because it's fake news...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488143239865847810/

They sure make up a lot of shit.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Also, 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1488310900264030211/


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Huntn said:


> …accept for the  35 SEAL team members who are asserting a religious objection?? Huh?  Can someone explain what Christianity or any religion says about not being vaccinated?




I don’t know about that, but I’m pretty positive that Jesus considered elite killing squads defending capitalism the most beloved of his flock. Also, Jesus was supposed to be born in America but a Jew gave Joseph and Mary bad directions.


----------



## Huntn

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> I don’t know about that, but I’m pretty positive that Jesus considered elite killing squads defending capitalism the most beloved of his flock. Also, Jesus was supposed to be born in America but a Jew gave Joseph and Mary bad directions.



So many Christians badmouth Jewdism as if they forgot about their savior’s origin… Probably mostly ignorance.


----------



## Yoused

thekev said:


> Maybe he'll try to quote Descarte next?



_Aristotle, Aristotle, was a bugger for the bottle,
Awfulest fond of his dram
And Rene Des Cartes was a drunken fart
"I drink, therefore I am"_​


----------



## Eric

Guy wearing the mask is the only one offending people. Ironic.


Only one person in this photo felt like wearing a mask. from
      funny


----------



## SuperMatt

U.S. Has Far Higher Covid Death Rate Than Other Wealthy Countries
					

Despite having one of the world’s most powerful arsenals of vaccines, the United States has failed to inoculate as much of its population as other wealthy nations.



					www.nytimes.com
				




The death rate from COVID in America is way beyond other countries. It’s really absurd how stupid the nation has become.

PS - Most Times articles about COVID aren’t paywalled, but if this one is let me know and I can post a different link.


----------



## The-Real-Deal82

I stumbled across this and it made me spit my tea out this morning lol. Not so much of an issue in the UK as religion is less of a public influence these days but I’m sure many of my American friends will laugh and relate to this:


----------



## Pumbaa

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I stumbled across this and it made me spit my tea out this morning lol. Not so much of an issue in the UK as religion is less of a public influence these days but I’m sure many of my American friends will laugh and relate to this:



Not to mention clothes…


----------



## Huntn

The-Real-Deal82 said:


> I stumbled across this and it made me spit my tea out this morning lol. Not so much of an issue in the UK as religion is less of a public influence these days but I’m sure many of my American friends will laugh and relate to this:





_Take your clothes off too._​


----------



## fooferdoggie

northing like working in the cancer ward and spreading covid and not giving a fuck. 
Faces of the Unvaccinated: Nurse contracts COVID for a second time after refusing vaccine​








						Faces of the Unvaccinated: Nurse contracts COVID for a second time after refusing vaccine
					

(WTNH) – Camile is in her second year of being a registered nurse at a major Connecticut hospital. News 8 spoke to her last fall and she said she was worried about the long-term effects of the COVI…




					www.wtnh.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

man this guy had no clue and now he is really clueless 

 Let's check in on Father Romeo whose belief that 'aborted embryos' are the main ingredients of SpikeVax may have turned out to be a misconception
An Italian priest who shunned COVID-19 vaccines over the false belief that they contain “aborted embryos” has died at the age of 51 after battling coronavirus for several weeks.

Don Paolo Romeo had resisted pleas to get vaccinated from friends and colleagues who tried to talk sense into him, according to the _L’Unione Sarda_ newspaper.








						Anti-Vax Priest Who Claimed Vaccines Contain ‘Aborted Embryos’ Dies of COVID
					

Don Paolo Romeo had reportedly ignored the pleas of friends and colleagues to get inoculated before he wound up ill, spending a month in the hospital before dying at age 51.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Yoused

fooferdoggie said:


> Don Paolo Romeo had resisted pleas to get vaccinated from friends and colleagues who tried to talk sense into him, according to the _L’Unione Sarda_ newspaper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Anti-Vax Priest Who Claimed Vaccines Contain ‘Aborted Embryos’ Dies of COVID
> 
> 
> Don Paolo Romeo had reportedly ignored the pleas of friends and colleagues to get inoculated before he wound up ill, spending a month in the hospital before dying at age 51.
> 
> 
> 
> www.thedailybeast.com



Hopefully Og in the cloudtops will hand him a nice golden lyre and say “_Nice job!_”


----------



## Yoused




----------



## User.45

fooferdoggie said:


> northing like working in the cancer ward and spreading covid and not giving a fuck.
> Faces of the Unvaccinated: Nurse contracts COVID for a second time after refusing vaccine​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Faces of the Unvaccinated: Nurse contracts COVID for a second time after refusing vaccine
> 
> 
> (WTNH) – Camile is in her second year of being a registered nurse at a major Connecticut hospital. News 8 spoke to her last fall and she said she was worried about the long-term effects of the COVI…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.wtnh.com



belongs here, indeed


----------



## Clix Pix

She was working on an ONCOLOGY unit!!!!!   Sheesh!!!!!   I would've thought that the powers-that-be at that hospital would have had sense enough not to schedule and permit  an unvaccinated staff member (who in my opinion should not have been allowed to be working in the place at all)  to be doing hands-on patient treatment  on an oncology unit, where patients are going to be far more vulnerable than in many other departments in the facility.   If any of those oncology patients does or has come down with COVID they or their families should sue the hospital for allowing an unvaccinated employee anywhere near them.


----------



## Hrafn

Clix Pix said:


> She was working on an ONCOLOGY unit!!!!!   Sheesh!!!!!   I would've thought that the powers-that-be at that hospital would have had sense enough not to schedule and permit  an unvaccinated staff member (who in my opinion should not have been allowed to be working in the place at all)  to be doing hands-on patient treatment  on an oncology unit, where patients are going to be far more vulnerable than in many other departments in the facility.   If any of those oncology patients does or has come down with COVID they or their families should sue the hospital for allowing an unvaccinated employee anywhere near them.



I'm on Nextdoor, and there is a local woman asking which local hospitals with oncology units don't require masks or vaccines for her nurse sister looking for work.  I wish her thoughts and prayers.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Clix Pix said:


> She was working on an ONCOLOGY unit!!!!!   Sheesh!!!!!   I would've thought that the powers-that-be at that hospital would have had sense enough not to schedule and permit  an unvaccinated staff member (who in my opinion should not have been allowed to be working in the place at all)  to be doing hands-on patient treatment  on an oncology unit, where patients are going to be far more vulnerable than in many other departments in the facility.   If any of those oncology patients does or has come down with COVID they or their families should sue the hospital for allowing an unvaccinated employee anywhere near them.



exactly what I was thinking. wonder if she had a fake vaccination card?


----------



## User.45

Hrafn said:


> I'm on Nextdoor, and there is a local woman asking which local hospitals with oncology units don't require masks or vaccines for her nurse sister looking for work.  I wish her thoughts and prayers.



the morgue. it also requires very little work from a nurse (likely not RN...)


----------



## Joe

My sister is an anti-vax RN. We haven't spoken in 5 years, but my niece told me that she gives them (her kids) shit for being vaccinated. Just one of the many reasons I don't speak to my crazy sister.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Hrafn said:


> I'm on Nextdoor, and there is a local woman asking which local hospitals with oncology units don't require masks or vaccines for her nurse sister looking for work.  I wish her thoughts and prayers.



Tots and pears.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1490107505216823301/


----------



## fooferdoggie

Lets move him to a hospital that does not care as much about his health.​GoFundMe Removes Fundraiser for Dying Texas Sheriff Deputy After Wife Posts About Ivermectin​Erin and Jason Jones cannot access $36,000 in funds for medical and legal bills​








						GoFundMe Removes Fundraiser for Dying Texas Sheriff Deputy After Wife Posts About Ivermectin Court Battle (Part 5)
					

Erin and Jason Jones cannot access $36,000 in funds for medical and legal bills




					www.emilypostnews.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

​so was this the start?​‘You will not believe what I’ve just found.’ Inside the ivermectin saga: a hacked password, mysterious websites and faulty data.​Lawrence would go on to contact Research Square, the website that published the paper, which had not been peer-reviewed. Within 24 hours, Lawrence got a response from the editor, and the website withdrew the paper in mid-July. 

It’s just one of several retractions and withdrawals of studies pointing to ivermectin as a viable COVID-19 treatment, and the impact of this kind of fraudulent research is still reverberating. During the pandemic, there has been a surge of demand for ivermectin, a drug commonly used to treat parasites in people who live in regions of South America and Africa, as well as in livestock. 

The number of monthly ivermectin prescriptions in the U.S. jumped to a high of 454,000 in August 2021, from about 57,000 in January 2020, according to healthcare data firm IQVIA. This figure doesn’t take into account veterinary prescriptions, which also increased when people began to seek out novel means of gaining access to the drug. Research published in January estimates that health insurers spent about $2.5 million on ivermectin prescriptions for COVID-19 in one week of August 2021. 








						‘You will not believe what I've just found.’ Inside the ivermectin saga: a hacked password, mysterious websites and faulty data.
					

How a drug used to treat parasites for decades became the hot and controversial drug of the pandemic




					www.marketwatch.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

Marjorie Taylor Greene released this video from
      CovIdiots


----------



## Huntn

Runs For Fun said:


> Marjorie Taylor Greene released this video from
> CovIdiots



La Stupida (or Mz Sinista) Went To Washington … Some of these people sound stupid, but then I’m wondering if it‘s really just part of the master manipulation program designed to brainwash STUPID.


----------



## Joe

fooferdoggie said:


> Lets move him to a hospital that does not care as much about his health.​GoFundMe Removes Fundraiser for Dying Texas Sheriff Deputy After Wife Posts About Ivermectin​Erin and Jason Jones cannot access $36,000 in funds for medical and legal bills​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GoFundMe Removes Fundraiser for Dying Texas Sheriff Deputy After Wife Posts About Ivermectin Court Battle (Part 5)
> 
> 
> Erin and Jason Jones cannot access $36,000 in funds for medical and legal bills
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.emilypostnews.com




Why are these people begging for money, after they tell everyone else they don't deserve healthcare lol

#thoughtsandprayers


----------



## fooferdoggie

letting your kids get covid not abuse at all.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Wow. What a 180

Back in the day when Rogan LOVED vaccines from
      HermanCainAward


----------



## Runs For Fun

Imagine using your kid to regurgitate your propaganda 

Little girl fights tyranny from
      CovIdiots


----------



## Yoused

​
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491441851748204546/


----------



## Huntn

Yoused said:


> ​
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491441851748204546/



Kool-Aid for STUPID, the quote. 

Here is the problem with off of this, why we are having serious, country- breaking problems, it’s STUPID, selfish STUPID, aand SINISTER preying on STUPID.

Here’s an image:

​
…but all the  little elephants have their own flutes and behind them are 40M or so STUPID marching the country into Deep Shit Territory.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Yoused said:


> ​
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491441851748204546/




The most annoying part is I don't believe for a minute that he doesn't see the problem with what he said.  I'm sure he knows it doesn't work that way.  But it won't stop him from still saying something dumb knowing a lot of his listeners won't take the effort to put 2 + 2 together on their own.


----------



## Yoused

Huntn said:


> … all the little elephants have their own flutes …



It goes back 40 years, with the whole "_government bad, make America great_" BS. R stupidity hardly began with CFEFWSG, or W, or even Newt, et al – they have been trying to bring back Tailgunner Joe.


----------



## Eric

The sister of another friend just passed from COVID in Oregon. Both were/are vocal antivaxxers, they're getting lots of thoughts and prayers while still bashing Fauci and the vaccine. Nothing will convince these people short of dying, sadly.


----------



## Joe

Eric said:


> The sister of another friend just passed from COVID in Oregon. Both were/are vocal antivaxxers, they're getting lots of thoughts and prayers while still bashing Fauci and the vaccine. Nothing will convince these people sort of dying, sadly.




#ThoughtsAndPrayers


----------



## fooferdoggie

Eric said:


> The sister of another friend just passed from COVID in Oregon. Both were/are vocal antivaxxers, they're getting lots of thoughts and prayers while still bashing Fauci and the vaccine. Nothing will convince these people sort of dying, sadly.



well death has not worked either so its pretty much hopeless.


----------



## User.45

MEJHarrison said:


> The most annoying part is I don't believe for a minute that he doesn't see the problem with what he said.  I'm sure he knows it doesn't work that way.  But it won't stop him from still saying something dumb knowing a lot of his listeners won't take the effort to put 2 + 2 together on their own.







Feature, not bug. I'm curious how trollservativism will change with Twitter implementing dislikes. It will be very hard for them to hide  how hard they push the trollshit.


----------



## Huntn

Joe said:


> #ThoughtsAndPrayers



…plus $1 buys you a coffee.


----------



## Huntn

fooferdoggie said:


> well death has not worked either so its pretty much hopeless.



The good news we are not the only ones suffering from STUPID. Canada and now France, as convoys of stupid inspired by Mr Sinister make their presence felt.

_STUPID, It’s Contagious_​








						Canadian Judge Orders End to Bridge Blockade
					

Ontario's premier issues state of emergency as truckers' mask, vaccine protests enter third week




					www.voanews.com
				












						Paris and Brussels ban protests linked to French 'Freedom Convoy' - KRDO
					

By Joseph Ataman, Lianne Kolirin, Mick Krever and Aliza Kassim Khalidi, CNN Authorities in both Paris and Brussels have announced a ban on protests linked to the so-called “Freedom Convoy” that is scheduled to arrive in the French capital from Friday. Following the “Freedom Convoy” in Canada —...




					krdo.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1492536838023700481/


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1492536838023700481/



I want to like Elon for his cars but it's almost impossible when you read his tweets.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Eric said:


> I want to like Elon for his cars but it's almost impossible when you read his tweets.



I can't even say that, because of stories like these.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1492921555088719879/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> I can't even say that, because of stories like these.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1492921555088719879/



In one case, Tesla’s comeback/excuse was “he was a contractor” - so that makes calling him the N-word every day ok???!?!?!? WTF?









						Regarding Today’s Jury Verdict | Tesla
					






					www.tesla.com
				




Then you have the rampant sexual harassment.









						Tesla Hit By 6 More Sexual Harassment Claims
					

The women filed individual suits against the company led by Elon Musk claiming they were sexually harassed by fellow employees and that Tesla failed to act.




					www.forbes.com
				




This company is rotten, and it all starts with Musk.


----------



## User.45

Eric said:


> I want to like Elon for his cars but it's almost impossible when you read his tweets.



I considered him on the more likable side until his COVID stupid performance "identifying" HCQ as a drug candidate.
Those tweets transformed my view of him from a _visionary_ to another _shortcuts guy. _And my view of him has been on a free fall since.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Eric said:


> I want to like Elon for his cars but it's almost impossible when you read his tweets.



I feel this. Honestly I can't stand the guy. The technology in Teslas is pretty sweet but I can't support this douchebag.


----------



## Joe

Anyone gonna boycott their tesla like they did Spotify? lol


----------



## Deleted member 215

P_X said:


> I considered him on the more likable side until his COVID stupid performance "identifying" HCQ as a drug candidate.
> Those tweets transformed my view of him from a _visionary_ to another _shortcuts guy. _And my view of him has been on a free fall since.




For me it was when he called that person who criticized his plan to rescue those children trapped in a Thai cave "Pedo Guy". I knew he was a douche canoe from then on.


----------



## User.45

TBL said:


> For me it was when he called that person who criticized his plan to rescue those children trapped in a Thai cave "Pedo Guy". I knew he was a douche canoe from then on.



True. He even hired a PI to prove he is a "pedo". It was really pathetic.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Man tried to open emergency door on Portland-bound plane in attention-grab to address COVID-19 vaccines, feds say​A 31-year-old man appeared Monday in federal court on allegations that he tried to open an emergency door on a Delta Air Lines flight bound for Portland from Salt Lake City because he wanted to make a statement about COVID-19 vaccines.


Michael Brandon Demarre of Portland was seen removing the plastic covering on an emergency exit handle and pulled on the handle with his full body weight Friday before a flight attendant intervened and demanded he let go of the handle, FBI agent Adam T. Hoover wrote in an affidavit in support of a criminal complaint.








						Man tried to open emergency door on Portland-bound plane in attention-grab to address COVID-19 vaccines, feds say
					

Michael Brandon Demarre, 31, told police he tried to push the emergency exit handle during a Delta Air Lines flight Friday so passengers would videotape him and he'd get “the opportunity to share his thoughts on COVID-19 vaccines,” an FBI agent wrote in an affidavit filed in court.




					www.oregonlive.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

Hackers Just Leaked the Names of 92,000 ‘Freedom Convoy’ Donors
					

GiveSendGo, the Christian crowdfunding site that helped raise $8.7 million for the anti-vax “freedom convoy” in Canada, was hacked on Sunday night.




					www.vice.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1493719443515531269/


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> I was just talking with my mother.  She informed me that Omicron is just a cold for 3 days and that there haven't been any deaths from it at this point.  I did my best to inform her and suggest that she double check that information with her nurses (she just had surgery and is currently in the hospital).
> 
> She said she doesn't watch the news anymore, so I guess she got that from Facebook and word-of-mouth.




When I had it, that is exactly what it was like.  The wife was closer to 5 days.  But it does affect everyone differently.


----------



## Runs For Fun

Herdfan said:


> When I had it, that is exactly what it was like.  The wife was closer to 5 days.  But it does affect everyone differently.



I think the main point was that this 


> there haven't been any deaths from it at this point.



is totally false.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> When I had it, that is exactly what it was like.  The wife was closer to 5 days.  But it does affect everyone differently.




Two people in this house had what amounted to a very mild cold.  They also both had all 3 shots.

The third person who got it here only had the first two shots.  He returned to work yesterday after being out nearly 2 months.

With that said, I'm in no way drawing any conclusions from a sample size of 3.  But it's interesting regardless.


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> Two people in this house had what amounted to a very mild cold.  They also both had all 3 shots.
> 
> The third person who got it here only had the first two shots.  He returned to work yesterday after being out nearly 2 months.
> 
> With that said, I'm in no way drawing any conclusions from a sample size of 3.  But it's interesting regardless.




At the time we got it, we had 2 shots.    And given the CDC California & NY Health departments are now implying that at least with Delta, natural immunity is better, we probably won't get the 3rd unless required.  But those requirements seem to be going away as well.

Edit:  It wasn't the CDC, it was both the California & NY Heath Departments.  The CDC was mentioned in the story which led to the error.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> And given the CDC is now implying that at least with Delta, natural immunity is better



Please provide a source for this.


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> Please provide a source for this.



@Herdfan this is a fair request, we'll continue to label your posts that contain false information. I'll give you the rest of the day to back up this statement from a credible source.


----------



## Runs For Fun

SuperMatt said:


> Please provide a source for this.



Just came across this today that proves the opposite lol








						mRNA vaccine-induced antibodies more effective than natural immunity in neutralizing SARS-CoV-2 and its high affinity variants - Scientific Reports
					

Several variants of SARS-CoV-2 have emerged. Those with mutations in the angiotensin-converting enzyme (ACE2) receptor binding domain (RBD) are associated with increased transmission and severity. In this study, we developed both antibody quantification and functional neutralization assays...




					www.nature.com


----------



## fooferdoggie

All teenagers think their parents are idiots, but sometimes it's actually true
High school junior Nicolas Montero stays busy. He runs track, works night and weekend shifts at Burger King and keeps on top of his schoolwork at Neshaminy High School in Bucks County, Pennsylvania.

But Montero's packed schedule is also strategic — he says it's a way to stay out of the house.

Montero and his parents are separated by a political and cultural rift common throughout the U.S.: He says his parents are part of a small but vocal minority who oppose COVID-19 vaccination and have refused to let him get the shots.

"The thing about these beliefs is that they alternate by the day," said Montero, who is 16. "It's not one solid thing that they're going with, so it's just really baseless. It's like one thing they see on Facebook, and then they completely believe it."









						This 16-year-old wanted to get the COVID vaccine. He had to hide it from his parents
					

At 16, Nicolas Montero is old enough to get vaccinated on his own in some parts of the country. But he had to try to get the jabs without his parents knowing, since they're opposed to the vaccine.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Joe

SuperMatt said:


> Please provide a source for this.




Trust me bro is the source lol


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1495123869908316166/

When the mask mandates are gone, I am worried what the next trigger will be for such epic stupidity?

I hope it won't be back to just good ol' standby racism.

I want some good shit.  I want them to flip the script on everyone, to own mohr libs.

  "What?!  What do you mean I can't wear masks now?  What am I sheep?  If I want to wear a mask, I'll wear a mask!  Have you seen the people here?!"


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1495123869908316166/
> 
> When the mask mandates are gone, I am worried what the next trigger will be for such epic stupidity?
> 
> I hope it won't be back to just good ol' standby racism.
> 
> I won't some good shit.  I want them to flip the script on everyone, to own mohr libs.
> 
> "What?!  What do you mean I can't wear masks now?  What am I sheep?  If I want to wear a mask, I'll wear a mask!  Have you seen the people here?!"





Man, so many probably sane people have just plain lost it during Covid.   All common sense gone, all normal acknowledgment of an enterprise's right to set its rules so long as they don't violate state or federal laws etc.    Insanity!

Gotta love him yelling "Don't touch me!"  Like they're really interested in touching a guy who won't mask up in the first place.


----------



## User.45

Herdfan said:


> At the time we got it, we had 2 shots.    And given the CDC is now implying that at least with Delta, natural immunity is better, we probably won't get the 3rd unless required.  But those requirements seem to be going away as well.



Yes, source or GTFO. How come you can't live up to the most minimal standards of discourse a on serious topic?!

in the meantime, the paper above you didn't read concludes this:


> In this study, we showed that mRNA vaccinated blood donors have a median of 17 times higher RBD antibody levels when compared with those who became seropositive due to prior COVID-19. Our results indicated an exceptional strong association between high RBD antibody levels in and the ability to biochemically neutralize RBD binding to the cellular ACE2 receptor. The N501Y mutation, while did not alter the neutralizing antibody binding, presented with a fivefold greater affinity to ACE2, which resulted in a drastically reduced ability of COVID-19 convalescent antisera to neutralize its ACE2 binding. Fortunately, the vaccinated blood samples, due to their much-elevated RBD antibody levels, were far more effective in neutralizing both the WT and N501Y RBD from binding to ACE. With an average of 16-fold greater potency than convalescent blood, the vaccinated blood samples were more than sufficient to compensate for the fivefold increased affinity of N501Y RBD, resulting in the highly effective inhibition of both the WT and N501Y RBD from binding to ACE2.
> 
> We observed very strong correlation between RBD antibody levels and ability to biochemically neutralize RBD and ACE2 binding. Previous studies have shown the correlation between neutralizing antibody and protection34,35. With over 150 million people infected with SARS-CoV-2 by May 2021, one of the critical questions going forward is whether the natural immunity would be sufficient to prevent future reinfections, particularly by more infectious variants. N501Y RBD is central to the investigation as it is the key driver to increased affinity to cell ACE2 receptors. While the reinfections were seen with the original SARS-CoV-2, our results indicated that the antisera from natural immunity would be less effective against variants such as B.1.1.7 due to its increased affinity to ACE2. Thus, many individuals acquired immunity through prior SARS-CoV-2 infections would not be sufficient to prevent reinfections by new variants with higher affinity to their cell receptors, especially in those with low RBD antibody levels.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1495061843622121481/


----------



## Hrafn

P_X said:


> Yes, source or GTFO. How come you can't live up to the most minimal standards of discourse a on serious topic?!
> 
> in the meantime, the paper above you didn't read concludes this:



"Beauty is only skin deep, but stupid runs clear to the bone"


----------



## Edd

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1495123869908316166/
> 
> When the mask mandates are gone, I am worried what the next trigger will be for such epic stupidity?
> 
> I hope it won't be back to just good ol' standby racism.
> 
> I want some good shit.  I want them to flip the script on everyone, to own mohr libs.
> 
> "What?!  What do you mean I can't wear masks now?  What am I sheep?  If I want to wear a mask, I'll wear a mask!  Have you seen the people here?!"



This was posted on my ski forum. It was from some conservative dipshit website that called the cheering crowd ”pro-tyranny”. This fuckhead was screwing up everyone’s day behind him. He sucks and is the worst. He chose to ride that mountain that day so why be a pointless dick?


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Please provide a source for this.





Eric said:


> @Herdfan this is a fair request, we'll continue to label your posts that contain false information. I'll give you the rest of the day to back up this statement from a credible source.




Sorry, went out of town and didn't have time to visit here until Saturday.  Forgot I posted this and hadn't visited the thread.  It wasn't the CDC, but both the California & NY Health departments.  The CDC was mentioned in the article, which was the basis for the error.  Previous post has been corrected.









						Prior COVID infection more protective than vaccination during Delta surge -U.S. study
					

People who had previously been infected with COVID-19 were better protected against the Delta variant than those who were vaccinated alone, suggesting that natural immunity was a more potent shield than vaccines against that variant, California and New York health officials reported on Wednesday.




					www.reuters.com
				






> People who had previously been infected with COVID-19 were better protected against the Delta variant than those who were vaccinated alone, suggesting that natural immunity was a more potent shield than vaccines against that variant, California and New York health officials reported on Wednesday.


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> Sorry, went out of town and didn't have time to visit here until Saturday.  Forgot I posted this and hadn't visited the thread.  It wasn't the CDC, but both the California & NY Health departments.  The CDC was mentioned in the article, which was the basis for the error.  Previous post has been corrected.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prior COVID infection more protective than vaccination during Delta surge -U.S. study
> 
> 
> People who had previously been infected with COVID-19 were better protected against the Delta variant than those who were vaccinated alone, suggesting that natural immunity was a more potent shield than vaccines against that variant, California and New York health officials reported on Wednesday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.reuters.com



Thank you, warning removed.


----------



## SuperMatt

Eric said:


> Thank you, warning removed.



Please note, the quote says natural immunity PLUS vaccination seemed to provide better protection than vaccination *alone*.

Here is more info on the study.









						COVID-19 Cases and Hospitalizations by COVID-19 ...
					

This report describes COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations by vaccination status and previous COVID-19 diagnosis before and after the Delta variant became predominant.




					www.cdc.gov
				




Notice how, in the linked article, it says multiple times that vaccination is the safest method. And nobody “implied” that natural immunity was “better” in any way.

Somebody doesn’t want to get the vaccine or wear a mask, they could find some article with a headline that confirms their decision, and not bother carefully reading the full article or the associated study.



Herdfan said:


> And given the CDC California & NY Health departments are now implying that *at least with Delta, natural immunity is better*



Here is a quote, straight from the linked article, from the California health department:



> Dr. Erica Pan, state epidemiologist for the California Department of Public Health, said in an email that the study *"clearly shows" that vaccines provide the safest protection* against COVID-19 and they offer added protection for those with prior infections.
> 
> "Outside of this study, recent data on the highly contagious Omicron variant shows that getting a booster provides significant additional protection against infection, hospitalization and death,” Pan said.




Sorry, but the statement from the forum member is NOT what is reflected by the statement from the state of California epidemiologist.

Finally, over 95% of cases are omicron now, and the above study points out that none of the subjects got the booster. I realize it can all be confusing, but I think the statement from the CA epidemiologist was very clearly NOT implying that natural immunity is better.


----------



## Herdfan

SuperMatt said:


> Please note, the quote says natural immunity PLUS vaccination seemed to provide better protection than vaccination *alone*.




It does say that, but the very first paragraph says:



> *People who had previously been infected with COVID-19 were better protected against the Delta variant than those who were vaccinated alone, suggesting that natural immunity was a more potent shield than vaccines against that variant, *




That is pretty clear. 

Now as to safer, of course getting vaxxed is safer than catching it, but that wasn't my point.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> It does say that, but the very first paragraph says:
> 
> 
> 
> That is pretty clear.
> 
> Now as to safer, of course getting vaxxed is safer than catching it, but that wasn't my point.



What was the point then? You said the report “implied” natural immunity was “better” than vaccination. In what way?

And sorry, but that first paragraph isn’t that clear, and it doesn’t really back itself up with details. I looked through the article for evidence that natural immunity was more potent a shield than vaccination against Delta… I didn’t see it. Perhaps @P_X can read the paper I linked and I missed something about it that shows that.

So, you have two apparently contradictory statements in the first paragraph. Seems like a bit of a fault by Reuters. But if you cared to read the second paragraph…



> Protection against Delta was *highest, however, among people who were both vaccinated and had survived a previous COVID infection*, and lowest among those who had never been infected or vaccinated, the study found.



So again, I think the Reuters headline and first paragraph are a bit misleading. The second paragraph is more clear.


----------



## Herdfan

Ok, let's break it down like this.

As it relates to Delta, and only Delta:

Natural Immunity > Vaxxed alone

Natural Immunity + Vaxxed,  > Natural Immunity.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Ok, let's break it down like this.
> 
> As it relates to Delta, and only Delta:
> 
> Natural Immunity > Vaxxed alone
> 
> Natural Immunity + Vaxxed,  > Natural Immunity.



Thank you for that. I read through it again. I see what you’re saying about Delta during October-November.

For your own health and safety, I believe you are drawing the wrong conclusions. You indicated that this study means you don’t need a booster.

First, in that study, the vaccinated people hadn’t gotten the booster yet.

Second, Delta is now very rare.









						Omicron makes up 95% of sequenced Covid cases in U.S. as infections hit pandemic record
					

The omicron variant now represents nearly every Covid case sequenced by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.




					www.cnbc.com
				




As of January 1:
95% - Omicron
4% - Delta

Finally, there is mounting evidence that the booster helps with longer-term immunity in B and T cells.









						Got a Covid Booster? You Probably Won’t Need Another for a Long Time
					

A flurry of new studies suggests that several parts of the immune system can mount a sustained, potent response to any coronavirus variant.




					www.nytimes.com
				



(paywall removed)



> Specialized immune cells called T cells produced after immunization by four brands of Covid vaccine — Pfizer-BioNTech, Moderna, Johnson & Johnson and Novavax — are about 80 percent as powerful against Omicron as other variants, the research found. Given how different Omicron’s mutations are from previous variants, it’s very likely that T cells would mount a similarly robust attack on any future variant as well, researchers said.
> 
> 
> This matches what scientists have found for the SARS coronavirus, which killed nearly 800 people in a 2003 epidemic in Asia. In people exposed to that virus, T cells have lasted more than 17 years. Evidence so far indicates that the immune cells for the new coronavirus — sometimes called memory cells — may also decline very slowly, experts said.
> 
> “Memory responses can last for ages,” said Wendy Burgers, an immunologist at the University of Cape Town who led one of the studies, published in the journal Nature. “Potentially, the T-cell response is extremely long lived.”






> In the newest study, another team showed that a third shot creates an even richer pool of B cells than the second shot did, and the antibodies they produce recognize a broader range of variants. In laboratory experiments, these antibodies were able to fend off the Beta, Delta and Omicron variants. In fact, more than half of the antibodies seen one month after a third dose were able to neutralize Omicron, even though the vaccine was not designed for that variant, the study found.
> 
> “If you’ve had a third dose, you’re going to have a rapid response that’s going to have quite a bit of specificity for Omicron, which explains why people that have had a third dose do so much better,” said Michel Nussenzweig, an immunologist at Rockefeller University who led the study.
> 
> Memory cells produced after infection with the coronavirus, rather than by the vaccines, seem less potent against the Omicron variant, according to a study published last month in Nature Medicine. Immunity generated by infection “varies quite a lot, while the vaccine response is much more consistently good,” said Marcus Buggert, an immunologist at the Karolinska Institute in Sweden who led the study.





I’d love to hear from @P_X on this, but from what I’m reading, the evidence is showing that the vaccine should basically be considered a 3-shot sequence and there is the possibility that immunity could last a long time if you get all 3 shots. Also, the immediate immunity of antibodies (from infection or vaccination) wanes fairly quickly, but longer-term immunity from T and B cells could last decades. For this study, it would have been interesting to know when those with natural immunity original caught COVID vs. when the vaccinated people got their vaccine. Perhaps that study was seeing some of the longer-term immunity from people who caught COVID early in 2020.


----------



## User.45

SuperMatt said:


> Thank you for that. I read through it again. I see what you’re saying about Delta during October-November.
> 
> For your own health and safety, I believe you are drawing the wrong conclusions. You indicated that this study means you don’t need a booster.
> 
> First, in that study, the vaccinated people hadn’t gotten the booster yet.
> 
> Second, Delta is now very rare.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Omicron makes up 95% of sequenced Covid cases in U.S. as infections hit pandemic record
> 
> 
> The omicron variant now represents nearly every Covid case sequenced by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.cnbc.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As of January 1:
> 95% - Omicron
> 4% - Delta
> 
> Finally, there is mounting evidence that the booster helps with longer-term immunity in B and T cells.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Got a Covid Booster? You Probably Won’t Need Another for a Long Time
> 
> 
> A flurry of new studies suggests that several parts of the immune system can mount a sustained, potent response to any coronavirus variant.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.nytimes.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (paywall removed)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I’d love to hear from @P_X on this, but from what I’m reading, the evidence is showing that the vaccine should basically be considered a 3-shot sequence and there is the possibility that immunity could last a long time if you get all 3 shots. Also, the immediate immunity of antibodies (from infection or vaccination) wanes fairly quickly, but longer-term immunity from T and B cells could last decades. For this study, it would have been interesting to know when those with natural immunity original caught COVID vs. when the vaccinated people got their vaccine. Perhaps that study was seeing some of the longer-term immunity from people who caught COVID early in 2020.



Wow what a horrible paper this CDC one is. The tables are so bad, if I were a reviewer, I would tell the editor not to accept the paper without that shit being fixed. Neither Reuters nor @Herdfan should draw generalized conclusions about this paper. In fact the naturally vs artificially acquired immunity studies always have to be interpreted with a major caveat: you aren't comparing the same populations if you removed the 130,781 worst players from the naturally-acquired team. So in one group you have a bunch of people who would have died if weren't vaccinated and in the other you just excluded the people who died of their first infection.

The only fair conclusion I can make is that the Vaccines that were developed for the Wildtype virus have variable efficacy against the subsequent variants, but naturally-acquired immunity has the same issue. 

THe 3 most striking things to me from the data are 

1)  Moderna coming up again and again as the best. Americans should be proud about this, this vaccine is the love-child of an NIH-Industry collaboration and as such, couldn't be more American (literally healthy national pride, folks?)




2) It would have taken 52,000,000 vaccinated people to achieve the the number of hospitalizations of the ~5M unvaccinated. Insane!!!

3) If I fix the supplementary figure, it actually shows lower risk in the vaccinated among those who got COVID in 2021


----------



## Nycturne

P_X said:


> 1) Moderna coming up again and again as the best. Americans should be proud about this, this vaccine is the love-child of an NIH-Industry collaboration and as such, couldn't be more American (literally healthy national pride, folks?)



This is exactly the sort of national pride I can get behind.



P_X said:


> True. He even hired a PI to prove he is a "pedo". It was really pathetic.



It's one of the reasons I'm glad that Shotwell is running the day-to-day over at SpaceX. They are doing some great work, but Musk is as much a liability to any corporate endeavor as he is a help. And I'd be looking to push him towards the door if I had the opportunity to do so. To protect what Tesla and SpaceX have managed to build so far and not have the baby thrown out with the bath water. Especially since the sort of accomplishments SpaceX has pulled off with reuse and adding much needed competition for human rated craft (although I'm mixed on Starlink) is another form of healthy national pride, in my opinion.



lizkat said:


> Man, so many probably sane people have just plain lost it during Covid.   All common sense gone, all normal acknowledgment of an enterprise's right to set its rules so long as they don't violate state or federal laws etc.    Insanity!



You know, this is an interesting comment, but I think we were already heading this way. Covid may have accelerated it though, adding gasoline on top of fuel already primed to turn into a blaze. If it wasn't mask mandates, it would have been something else that would have been politicized to this level, but the health policies required to tame a pandemic just _made it so easy_.


----------



## lizkat

Nycturne said:


> If it wasn't mask mandates, it would have been something else that would have been politicized to this level, but the health policies required to tame a pandemic just _made it so easy_.




Maybe.  It just seems all the more outlandish that it's in reaction to public health measures.    One might sooner expect big hissy fits over stuff like changing speed limits on highways or some such, not that people seem to observe those anyway, so I do take your point...


----------



## Edd

Nycturne said:


> You know, this is an interesting comment, but I think we were already heading this way. Covid may have accelerated it though, adding gasoline on top of fuel already primed to turn into a blaze. If it wasn't mask mandates, it would have been something else that would have been politicized to this level, but the health policies required to tame a pandemic just _made it so easy_.



Agreed. Tucker Carlson’s entire job is identifying or conjuring the friction points between left/right. The pandemic was bad for Trump but a two year blowjob for TC. Any request/mandate to take Covid precautions is an affront to your way of life. These rules from a private business are juicy but, from any government body, that’s filet mignon.


----------



## Nycturne

lizkat said:


> Maybe.  It just seems all the more outlandish that it's in reaction to public health measures.    One might sooner expect big hissy fits over stuff like changing speed limits on highways or some such, not that people seem to observe those anyway, so I do take your point...



Similar to what Edd points out, Fox News has been planting the seed that the left in the US is out to create an authoritarian state, etc, etc. And it’s been going on well before the pandemic, with Obama being a popular target, followed up with the pivot to “The deep state is hindering Trump”. Having a Democrat (even if they are a centrist) in charge + pandemic restrictions just lines up with that message, no matter the real basis. But this is what propaganda looks like. It’s not about cultivating an informed public, but cultivating a particular form of political thought.

What we see in this thread is _partly _the long result of beating that drum for well over a decade. 



Edd said:


> Agreed. Tucker Carlson’s entire job is identifying or conjuring the friction points between left/right. The pandemic was bad for Trump but a two year blowjob for TC. Any request/mandate to take Covid precautions is an affront to your way of life. These rules from a private business are juicy but, from any government body, that’s filet mignon.



Yup, Carlson and O’Reilly have been at the heart of this sort of nonsense for a long, long time.


----------



## lizkat

So let me get this straight.  The Rs are all over law'n'order with valentines and candy boxes...   _*except *_if the "authoritarian" mayor of your town or the "authoritarian" owner of a private enterprise like a ski resort or the "authoritarian" agency the CDC tells us to mask up in order to tone down the spread of covid...  ?

I'm sick of all the propaganda coming from the right about who's an authoritarian.

We spent four years under the bizarrely egomaniacal authoritarianism of Donald J. Trump, and the party whose banner he carried has been about trying to expand the powers of the US presidency for decades.​​The Republicans cannot reasonably pitch anti-authoritarianism as a virtue while having supported the most autocratic president ever to occupy the White House.​​I mean Trump is a guy who tried to work around the Constitution any time it got in his way, a guy who completely ignored the norms of his high office and who realized that the _spirit_ of our rule of law was something he could definitely ignore with impunity.​
 Time for the Democrats to point all that out more often, especially considering all the pushback on state and federal efforts to manage covid without trying to run a Chinese model with zero tolerance of outbreaks.


----------



## Eric

Nobody's more oppressed than butthurt Republicans.


----------



## Yoused

The stench of the shitgibbon lingers over the country, and we just cannot open enough windows and doors to get the place adequately aired out









						An Anti-Vax Judge Is Preventing the Navy From Deploying a Warship
					

Admirals want to remove an insubordinate anti-vaxxer from command of a destroyer. A judge won’t let them.




					slate.com
				




so now you know, personal "religious" stupid overrides the security of hundreds of millions of _reasonable_ people.


----------



## SuperMatt

Yoused said:


> The stench of the shitgibbon lingers over the country, and we just cannot open enough windows and doors to get the place adequately aired out
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> An Anti-Vax Judge Is Preventing the Navy From Deploying a Warship
> 
> 
> Admirals want to remove an insubordinate anti-vaxxer from command of a destroyer. A judge won’t let them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> slate.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so now you know, personal "religious" stupid overrides the security of hundreds of millions of _reasonable_ people.



Weird, I didn’t think the military answered to the judiciary. I don’t think this would pass constitutional muster if it made it to the Supreme Court. We can’t have judges telling military commanders who they can or cannot deploy or promote to command or remove from command.


----------



## Yoused

SuperMatt said:


> I don’t think this would pass constitutional muster if it made it to the Supreme Court.



_This_ supreme court, though, I would have my doubts. This boat is to be sent on a mission, which brass says is pretty important (which they admittedly probably say about all the jaunts), and delaying it until the ruling can be appealed might well negate the value of what is meant to be done.


----------



## Roller

P_X said:


> Wow what a horrible paper this CDC one is. The tables are so bad, if I were a reviewer, I would tell the editor not to accept the paper without that shit being fixed. Neither Reuters nor @Herdfan should draw generalized conclusions about this paper. In fact the naturally vs artificially acquired immunity studies always have to be interpreted with a major caveat: you aren't comparing the same populations if you removed the 130,781 worst players from the naturally-acquired team. So in one group you have a bunch of people who would have died if weren't vaccinated and in the other you just excluded the people who died of their first infection.
> 
> The only fair conclusion I can make is that the Vaccines that were developed for the Wildtype virus have variable efficacy against the subsequent variants, but naturally-acquired immunity has the same issue.
> 
> THe 3 most striking things to me from the data are
> 
> 1)  Moderna coming up again and again as the best. Americans should be proud about this, this vaccine is the love-child of an NIH-Industry collaboration and as such, couldn't be more American (literally healthy national pride, folks?)
> View attachment 11843
> 
> 2) It would have taken 52,000,000 vaccinated people to achieve the the number of hospitalizations of the ~5M unvaccinated. Insane!!!
> 
> 3) If I fix the supplementary figure, it actually shows lower risk in the vaccinated among those who got COVID in 2021
> View attachment 11844



I've spoken to several fully-vaccinated people who had mildly-symptomatic COVID-19 and are happy because they feel better protected against re-infection and/or future variants. The same is true for as-yet-uninfected individuals who've abandoned all preventive measures because they're not concerned about, or even look forward to, mild COVID-19 for the same reason. Unfortunately, this ignores cardiovascular and other long-term risks that are increasingly coming to light. I'm very concerned that the healthcare system will be dealing with acute and chronic post-COVID conditions for decades. I also suspect that research will show many additional connections between viral illnesses and chronic disease.


----------



## User.45

Roller said:


> I've spoken to several fully-vaccinated people who had mildly-symptomatic COVID-19 and are happy because they feel better protected against re-infection and/or future variants. The same is true for as-yet-uninfected individuals who've abandoned all preventive measures because they're not concerned about, or even look forward to, mild COVID-19 for the same reason. Unfortunately, this ignores cardiovascular and other long-term risks that are increasingly coming to light. I'm very concerned that the healthcare system will be dealing with acute and chronic post-COVID conditions for decades. I also suspect that research will show many additional connections between viral illnesses and chronic disease.



Agree. I'll be speculative here, but  I think the virus' patterns are becoming predictable. We're probably going to be golden until June (the spring peak has been modulated by vaccination last year, and there's a slight delay this year with the waves). I'm quite certain, the new variant will come in June, hit Florida again by August, peak by October and die down by November. Whereas the rest of the nation will have this slowly emerging wave that will build up between Thxgiving and Xmas.


----------



## SuperMatt

Why are these idiots driving in circles on the DC Beltway? To protest mask mandates, they say. But DC ended its mask mandate on March 1.









						Trucker Convoy Plans To Return To Beltway This Morning After Non-Disruptive Weekend Protest
					

The impact on traffic is unclear.




					dcist.com
				




The mask mandates were about stopping the spread of a disease. Now that the infection rate is low and the vaccination rate is high, infectious disease experts are saying we can go without the masks for now. This is what it ALWAYS was about. If things change, we can always put the masks back on. It’s a small action that can save a lot of lives. And let’s get real, the folks driving in circles probably never followed mask mandates to begin with. So it didn’t even affect them.

So, drive your heavy-polluting trucks in circles for no reason, idiots. Thanks for snarling traffic and destroying the environment to protest something that is no longer happening.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500808905689030658/

We started this stupidity LARPing as faux military, and now they've moved to being crusaders.

Are we forgetting what crusaders are also infamous for?

But hey, you want to cruise around in your costume while gas rises to $5 a gallon, over mask mandates that are being dropped across the country...


----------



## Yoused

JayMysteri0 said:


> We started this stupidity LARPing as faux military, and now they've moved to being crusaders.



_We want … *a shrubbery!*_


----------



## ronntaylor

Went into a fast food joint to pick up my online order. They closed off the seating area during the Pandemic but first day without mask mandates for restaurants and the place was jam packed. *sigh* Hoping against reality that this change wasn't premature.

Still wearing masks wherever there are crowds (and hand sanitizer, and keeping my distance). I don't trust people to follow simple precautions. Many could not do the bare minimum at the height of the Pandemic. I have no confidence with too many of my fellow citizens.


----------



## DT

Yeah, the wife and I are kind of in "mask as needed" mode, if we go inside somewhere and people are pretty spaced out, sure, but we have them on deck.  Like the other day we both hit the grocery, it was pretty quiet, had mask in the ready position (strapped to wrist), things got a little crowded in the produce, said she masked up, got her stuff came over to where I was, took it off.

Still moving away from people, yeah, lots of hand washing/sanitizer,  we hit up one of our favorite joints the other day, we walked in, back out to the patio, nobody around, didn't mask up, but would've to move through people at other tables (it was pretty much empty).


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500923740628029441/


----------



## SuperMatt

ronntaylor said:


> Went into a fast food joint to pick up my online order. They closed off the seating area during the Pandemic but first day without mask mandates for restaurants and the place was jam packed. *sigh* Hoping against reality that this change wasn't premature.
> 
> Still wearing masks wherever there are crowds (and hand sanitizer, and keeping my distance). I don't trust people to follow simple precautions. Many could not do the bare minimum at the height of the Pandemic. I have no confidence with too many of my fellow citizens.



Went to the grocery store today. About 80% of people were masked. Nobody said anything about it one way or the other.


----------



## JayMysteri0

It's been weird for me.

I took a seasonal job to pay for Christmas gifts, and the place ( not sure if I will stay ) decided to keep me on.  Last week the place said the CDC says masks aren't necessary in the building.  But, any place I go to that has customers still have all of their employees wearing masks / chinstraps.  I just carry my mask with me and wear it still.


----------



## ronntaylor

JayMysteri0 said:


> It's been weird for me.
> 
> I took a seasonal job to pay for Christmas gifts, and the place ( not sure if I will stay ) decided to keep me on.  Last week the place said the CDC says masks aren't necessary in the building.  But, any place I go to that has customers still have all of their employees wearing masks / chinstraps.  I just carry my mask with me and wear it still.



I'm wearing my mask for the foreseeable future. The local pizza joint had its gates up. Not sure if they're cleaning out the place or reopening after abruptly closing a couple months ago. I refused to eat inside after most customers were maskless before the vaccinated could sit down to eat. (They had a few tables on the sidewalk, but half the time the space was mostly occupied by non-customers.) I really miss their Italian cuisine, but I value my safety more.


----------



## Clix Pix

I definitely am continuing to wear a mask when going to the library, the bank, the grocery store and any other stores.....


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> It's been weird for me.
> 
> I took a seasonal job to pay for Christmas gifts, and the place ( not sure if I will stay ) decided to keep me on.  Last week the place said the CDC says masks aren't necessary in the building.  But, any place I go to that has customers still have all of their employees wearing masks / chinstraps.  I just carry my mask with me and wear it still.




Yeah, I kind of adapt to the situation, if I'm not wearing a mask, but other people are, or someone I'm interacting with is wearing one, I'll put mine on too.  Like if they're concerned, I'll be concerned with and for them.


----------



## Eric

ronntaylor said:


> Went into a fast food joint to pick up my online order. They closed off the seating area during the Pandemic but first day without mask mandates for restaurants and the place was jam packed. *sigh* Hoping against reality that this change wasn't premature.
> 
> Still wearing masks wherever there are crowds (and hand sanitizer, and keeping my distance). I don't trust people to follow simple precautions. Many could not do the bare minimum at the height of the Pandemic. I have no confidence with too many of my fellow citizens.



This is me and I don't care what anyone thinks, it'll be a long time before I'm indoors in a crowd without a mask. We went to a home and garden show over the weekend and out of thousands of people only a couple were wearing them. Fine now that cases are low but I still won't risk it personally.


----------



## ronntaylor

Eric said:


> This is me and I don't care what anyone thinks, it'll be a long time before I'm indoors in a crowd without a mask. We went to a home and garden show over the weekend and out of thousands of people only a couple were wearing them. Fine now that cases are low but I still won't risk it personally.



I'm seriously thinking that I will severely limit my jaunts to places where crowds are guaranteed. The fast food joint has a ton of Queens College students. Skipping them for a while. My fav restaurant said they'll probably drop their mask requirement for pickup. I will limit myself to maybe once a week, probably during the weekend when it's less crowded in the early evening.

Almost all the other restaurants in the area immediately did away with the mask requirement. They're all sketchy and I avoided them like they ... ahem, plague. They're not serious about the Pandemic so I'll continue to not patronize them.

I'll have to fight my mother in-law, but I'll be cooking many (most?) of my meals with the warmer weather.


----------



## Eric

ronntaylor said:


> I'm seriously thinking that I will severely limit my jaunts to places where crowds are guaranteed. The fast food joint has a ton of Queens College students. Skipping them for a while. My fav restaurant said they'll probably drop their mask requirement for pickup. I will limit myself to maybe once a week, probably during the weekend when it's less crowded in the early evening.
> 
> Almost all the other restaurants in the area immediately did away with the mask requirement. They're all sketchy and I avoided them like they ... ahem, plague. They're not serious about the Pandemic so I'll continue to not patronize them.
> 
> I'll have to fight my mother in-law, but I'll be cooking many (most?) of my meals with the warmer weather.



I don't think you are alone, you see this same sentiment everywhere for those who aren't ready to drop the mask. Over the weekend in the Bay Area everyone was still wearing them, even outside and alone.


----------



## Hrafn

My parents are now both at extreme health risk, and I'm visiting much more often than when COVID first hit.  My work has about 20 people, but we got word on Friday that the mandate has lifted.  Three of us are still wearing masks around each other.  We had an outbreak just three weeks ago in the office, so 4 people had to quarantine for two weeks each, while the mandate was in effect.


----------



## JayMysteri0

In case you hear the word "#digitile" tomorrow, I'd like you to be "informed".  
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500902909478903818/


----------



## SuperMatt

JayMysteri0 said:


> In case you hear the word "#digitile" tomorrow, I'd like you to be "informed".
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500902909478903818/



So that is the real technology Mark Zuckerberg is working on with “Meta”… it all makes sense now.


----------



## JayMysteri0

SuperMatt said:


> So that is the real technology Mark Zuckerberg is working on with “Meta”… it all makes sense now.







They're coming for us.


----------



## fooferdoggie

JayMysteri0 said:


> In case you hear the word "#digitile" tomorrow, I'd like you to be "informed".
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500902909478903818/



the brilliance of all the trump protestors combined could not not light a Charlie Brown Christmas tree


----------



## rdrr

JayMysteri0 said:


> In case you hear the word "#digitile" tomorrow, I'd like you to be "informed".
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500902909478903818/



Why only female robots?  I mean, why give a gender to a robot?


----------



## Arkitect

fooferdoggie said:


> the brilliance of all the trump protestors combined could not not light a Charlie Brown Christmas tree



One of those posts I have to decide between the _Laugh out Loud_ vs _Horrified_ Emoji reaction.

And my word for the day… Digitiled.


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> In case you hear the word "#digitile" tomorrow, I'd like you to be "informed".
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1500902909478903818/



Since when did they give Mama June a truck?


----------



## JayMysteri0

A different spin on Covid Stupid, or Covid grift



> Man sentenced to 3 years in federal prison over Pokémon card
> 
> 
> The $57,000 Charizard is now government property
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.polygon.com





> A Georgia man has been sentenced to 36 months in prison — three years — after using COVID-19 relief money to purchase a rare Charizard Pokémon card. The Department of Justice (DOJ) announced the sentencing in a news release issued Monday.
> 
> The man, 31-year-old Vinath Oudomsine, was awarded an Economic Injury Disaster Loan (EIDL) for $85,000 after claiming to own a small business that supported 10 employees. These loans were created as part of Congress’ pandemic relief plan, and intended to be used for businesses to pay workers and rent.
> 
> Once Oudomsine got the money, however, the DOJ said he used $57,789 of it to buy a Charizard card. A card matching this description — a first-edition, shadowless, and holographic Charizard card with a 9.5 gem mint rating — was sold at the PWCC marketplace for that price in late December.
> 
> 
> U.S. district court judge Dudley H. Bowen also ordered Oudomsine to pay $10,000 on top of the $85,000 in restitution and three years in prison. He will have three years of “supervised release” after the three years in prison. Oudomsine has also agreed to turn the Charizard card over to prosecutors.


----------



## Alli

Arkitect said:


> One of those posts I have to decide between the _Laugh out Loud_ vs _Horrified_ Emoji reaction.
> 
> And my word for the day… Digitalised.



Digitiled. I know your spell check balked at this.

I feel so sorry for this woman. I had no idea so many people lived to adulthood with anencephaly.


----------



## Arkitect

Alli said:


> Digitiled. I know your spell check balked at this.
> 
> I feel so sorry for this woman. I had no idea so many people lived to adulthood with anencephaly.



Thanks! I'll fix that. Not so much my spell checker as my brain refused to see that horror of a word.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1501028708907458561/


----------



## fooferdoggie

Michigan man pleads guilty to threatening to shoot up a police station, then attempting to steal a Coast Guard helicopter with plans to break into a hospital and rescue Covid patients. Ta da








						Michigan man pleads to trying to steal helicopter to free COVID patients from hospitals
					

A helicopter pilot in the military, the man is now legally blind.




					www.mlive.com


----------



## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> In case you hear the word "#digitile" tomorrow, I'd like you to be "informed".




This is why I'm saying there's no reasonable debate, there's no open to the "other side's" perspective.

My answer to what she said?

Fuck you.



rdrr said:


> Why only female robots?  I mean, why give a gender to a robot?




Plus, it seems like a good opportunity to, ummm, experiment, so yeah, maybe some dude-bots.


----------



## rdrr

fooferdoggie said:


> Michigan man pleads guilty to threatening to shoot up a police station, then attempting to steal a Coast Guard helicopter with plans to break into a hospital and rescue Covid patients. Ta da
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Michigan man pleads to trying to steal helicopter to free COVID patients from hospitals
> 
> 
> A helicopter pilot in the military, the man is now legally blind.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mlive.com



Get to da CHOPPA!


----------



## Eric

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/PoliticalHumor/comments/taj512

I've seen them interviewed and I would have to say it's dental insurance.


----------



## Yoused

Eric said:


> I've seen them interviewed and I would have to say it's dental insurance.



They want to insure their collective tooth?


----------



## Huntn

rdrr said:


> Why only female robots?  I mean, why give a gender to a robot?



Watch Stepford Wives and A.I. to know why robots might be given sexuality.  Now this has no bearing on what this brilliant female trucker thinks…


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1502281879399149578/


----------



## SuperMatt

I saw the anti-mask convoy today. Lots of semis (no trailers) with Trump flags and various homemade signs, blowing their horns and clouds of pollution.  I was headed the opposite direction, which was lucky because traffic was at a standstill on their side of I-395.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> I saw the anti-mask convoy today. Lots of semis (no trailers) with Trump flags and various homemade signs, blowing their horns and clouds of pollution.  I was headed the opposite direction, which was lucky because traffic was at a standstill on their side of I-395.



I remember the trumper trucks too it was so dumb might as well tattoo I am dumb on your forehead and be done with it.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> I remember the trumper trucks too it was so dumb might as well tattoo I am dumb on your forehead and be done with it.



I think I saw one of them with that tattoo.


----------



## Eric

SuperMatt said:


> I saw the anti-mask convoy today. Lots of semis (no trailers) with Trump flags and various homemade signs, blowing their horns and clouds of pollution.  I was headed the opposite direction, which was lucky because traffic was at a standstill on their side of I-395.



Hope it's worth the hit to their pocketbook.


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> I remember the trumper trucks too it was so dumb might as well tattoo I am dumb on your forehead and be done with it.



They closed some bridges into the city to block them from entering.


----------



## shadow puppet

What is in the water these whack jobs are drinking?

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1503470345436684289/


----------



## Eric

shadow puppet said:


> What is in the water these whack jobs are drinking?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1503470345436684289/



The fact that these loonbags have to pay hundreds in gas to attend these things makes me smile.


----------



## fischersd

You get out into the rural areas and there's still idiots with their Canadian flags mounted on their pickup trucks here in BC.  Makes your blood boil just seeing them on the road.  On the plus side, those flags are certainly not going to help their gas milage (though they certainly don't care, driving these big, lifted pick-ups everywhere that they go).


----------



## DT

shadow puppet said:


> What is in the water these whack jobs are drinking?




And like I've said, my response to her idiotic babbling is just a simple, fuck you.

The underlying conspiracy theory is incredibly stupid, but the real icing-on-the-cake is that the conspirators, built some kind of clues into the naming convention, like the evil world cabal was like, "_You know what would be funny?  If we encoded the name of the virus with the mark of Satan!_"  *room erupts with evil laughter*


----------



## Eric

DT said:


> And like I've said, my response to her idiotic babbling is just a simple, fuck you.
> 
> The underlying conspiracy theory is incredibly stupid, but the real icing-on-the-cake is that the conspirators, built some kind of clues into the naming convention, like the evil world cabal was like, "_You know what would be funny?  If we encoded the name of the virus with the mark of Satan!_"  *room erupts with evil laughter*



Elections are lost by losing those in the middle and in this case these people will definitely turn them off. If Democrats were smart they would give these people the mic and the stage and just let them bury themselves, midterms are going to be ugly for them anyway so there's no harm in trying.


----------



## Renzatic

DT said:


> And like I've said, my response to her idiotic babbling is just a simple, fuck you.
> 
> The underlying conspiracy theory is incredibly stupid, but the real icing-on-the-cake is that the conspirators, built some kind of clues into the naming convention, like the evil world cabal was like, "_You know what would be funny?  If we encoded the name of the virus with the mark of Satan!_"  *room erupts with evil laughter*




I JUST CAN'T HELP MYSELF! IN LATIN, THE WORD "VACCINE" MEANS 666 WORSHIP THE GOD THAT FELL! HILLARY CLINTON! GLOBALISM!


----------



## DT

Hahaha, right?  It's just so goddam stupid, and you can so easily reverse engineer any meaning into __anything__.

Just right now, with about 30 seconds of thought, I took the date of the assassination of JFK, added the single digits:  

1 + 1 + 2 + 2 + 1 + 9 + 6 + 3 = 25

Covid is 6 letters, 6 + 19 = 25

OMG!!


----------



## Renzatic

DT said:


> Hahaha, right?  It's just so goddam stupid, and you can so easily reverse engineer any meaning into __anything__.
> 
> Just right now, with about 30 seconds of thought, I took the date of the assassination of JFK, added the single digits:
> 
> 1 + 1 + 2 + 2 + 1 + 9 + 6 + 3 = 25
> 
> Covid is 6 letters, 6 + 19 = 25
> 
> OMG!!




13 is the number of Fallen apostles that follow the Dark Lord. 13 + 13, or Evil Squared, is 26. 26 minus Baby Jesus is 25.

25 IS A BEAST NUMBER!


----------



## Arkitect

DT said:


> Hahaha, right?  It's just so goddam stupid, and you can so easily reverse engineer any meaning into __anything__.
> 
> Just right now, with about 30 seconds of thought, I took the date of the assassination of JFK, added the single digits:
> 
> 1 + 1 + 2 + 2 + 1 + 9 + 6 + 3 = 25
> 
> Covid is 6 letters, 6 + 19 = 25
> 
> OMG!!







Renzatic said:


> 13 is the number of Fallen apostles that follow the Dark Lord. 13 + 13, or Evil Squared, is 26. 26 minus Baby Jesus is 25.
> 
> 25 IS A BEAST NUMBER!




Haha! You two should get yourselves on Fox (or whatever). 
The pair of you could stand for president and vice president at the next election.

So many bat shit crazy — or is it just uneducated — or confused — voters out there… It'd be a landslide victory…


----------



## Renzatic

Arkitect said:


> Haha! You two should get yourselves on Fox (or whatever).
> The pair of you could stand for president and vice president at the next election.
> 
> So many bat shit crazy — or is it just uneducated — or confused — voters out there… It'd be a landslide victory…




THE ONLY THING STANDING BETWEEN YOU AND THE DEEP STATE VACCINATORS WITH THEIR LIBERAL AGENDAS IS ME!


----------



## DT

Arkitect said:


> Haha! You two should get yourselves on Fox (or whatever).
> The pair of you could stand for president and vice president at the next election.
> 
> So many bat shit crazy — or is it just uneducated — or confused — voters out there… It'd be a landslide victory…




I feel flattered ... or wait, maybe insulted ... f*** me, I don't even know anymore ...


----------



## Renzatic

DT said:


> I feel flattered ... or wait, maybe insulted ... f*** me, I don't even know anymore ...




I BET YOU LIKE THE COMMON CORE'S COMMIE MATH!


----------



## DT

I LIKES THE CRT, CRACKER REPUBLICAN TRUTHS !!!!


----------



## Renzatic

DT said:


> I LIKES THE CRT, CRACKER REPUBLICAN TRUTHS !!!!




I'm stealing that.


----------



## Clix Pix

SuperMatt said:


> They closed some bridges into the city to block them from entering.




These clowns don't seem to give a damn that they are uselessly tying up traffic in the already heavily-congested DC area with their stupid truck convoy that means nothing to anyone else [except being a nuisance] and probably really not all that much even to them since they don't seem to be able to articulate clearly just what the meaning of this convoy is in the first place.   They are wasting gas, wasting time, wasting money.....and for what?  Vaccinations and masks are already becoming a moot point, so that's not it, not really their "cause" any more.....

Bleating about "My RIGHTS!" doesn't really go very far.  Not in this area!   We ALL have "rights."  Those of us who live in this area are affronted by this pointless stomping on ours.   With that convoy adding to the significant traffic on the Beltway and other roads going into the city, they're violating the rights of many other people,  DC-area residents --  but clearly don't care about that -- the rights of the commuters who need to get into their office in town in the morning and back home at night after a long day at work, the rights of those who don't work in the city but who still need to get into it or around it for various purposes such as reporting to work at an office in the suburbs,  going to classes at one of the many area colleges and universities in and around the city, going to a doctor's appointment at a physician's office or at a hospital, or for a surgical procedure at a hospital, etc. etc.

Our weather is looking good for the next week or so, which means that it is likely that our famous cherry blossom trees (a wonderful gift many,  many years ago from the people of Japan)  will be out in full peak bloom in another week or ten days....and that always brings in the tourists, and yes, MORE traffic!   Everybody here is fervently hoping that the convoy folks will already be on their way back to the flyover states or wherever they call "home" so that we can have our city back and celebrate the cherry blossoms with those who appreciate their beauty.


----------



## MEJHarrison

shadow puppet said:


> What is in the water these whack jobs are drinking?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1503470345436684289/




I did a little research.  Couldn't find any reference to "Ovid" = "Sheep".  Nor could I validate that code 19 means surrender.

That said, I must admit she could be on to something with "C" = "See".  My mind is now blown!


----------



## DT

Hahaha, the Genus for sheep is Ovis ... O V I S ...


----------



## Arkitect

MEJHarrison said:


> I did a little research.  Couldn't find any reference to "Ovid" = "Sheep".  Nor could I validate that code 19 means surrender.
> 
> That said, I must admit she could be on to something with "C" = "See".  My mind is now blown!



Apparently this bizarre assertion has been doing the rounds for quite a while now…

This is the problem with sheep like this woman.
Facts, genuine irrefutable evidence, do not matter to them.

Link
Fact check: COVID-19 does not mean “see a sheep surrender”​


> Posts circulating on social media claim that the acronym COVID-19 is made up of a series of ancient symbols that when compiled together mean “see a sheep surrender”, implying the pandemic is a conspiracy. The logic behind this assertion is false. The posts make the claim that “Ovid” means sheep in Latin, the “C” means “to see” in an unspecified “ancient language” and that 19 was the so-called “number of surrender” in “ancient times”.


----------



## Pumbaa

MEJHarrison said:


> I did a little research.  Couldn't find any reference to "Ovid" = "Sheep".  Nor could I validate that code 19 means surrender.
> 
> That said, I must admit she could be on to something with "C" = "See".  My mind is now blown!




Deduction skills worthy the world’s greatest detective.








> It happened at sea. See? C for Catwoman!


----------



## Roller

Arkitect said:


> Apparently this bizarre assertion has been doing the rounds for quite a while now…
> 
> This is the problem with sheep like this woman.
> Facts, genuine irrefutable evidence, do not matter to them.
> 
> Link
> Fact check: COVID-19 does not mean “see a sheep surrender”​



One wonders how people like this ever function in society, especially when they seek medical care. For example, if this woman were to be diagnosed with cancer or some other serious condition, would she apply the same illogic to recommendations from her physicians? When she tries to purchase real estate or anything else that requires a formal contract, does she rail against all the steps needed to execute it?


----------



## Pumbaa

Roller said:


> One wonders how people like this ever function in society, especially when they seek medical care.



I know I certainly do wonder that.



Roller said:


> For example, if this woman were to be diagnosed with cancer or some other serious condition, would she apply the same illogic to recommendations from her physicians? When she tries to purchase real estate or anything else that requires a formal contract, does she rail against all the steps needed to execute it?



Yes.

I think most of them are just consumers (and regurgitators) of the contrarian lunacy and not capable of making it up themselves. Thanks, social media…


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Clix Pix said:


> These clowns don't seem to give a damn that they are uselessly tying up traffic in the already heavily-congested DC area with their stupid truck convoy that means nothing to anyone else [except being a nuisance] and probably really not all that much even to them since they don't seem to be able to articulate clearly just what the meaning of this convoy is in the first place.   They are wasting gas, wasting time, wasting money.....and for what?  Vaccinations and masks are already becoming a moot point, so that's not it, not really their "cause" any more.....




It dawned on me that a lot of right-wingers have problems living in the present. Without ever getting a direct answer, we had to connect a lot of dots to determine their comfort zone is the 1950’s. Given that, it really shouldn’t be shocking that they are actively protesting something that is no longer an issue. At least we didn’t have to go back 7+ decades to figure out what they’re going on about, a marked improvement on still being behind the times.


----------



## SuperMatt

I got held up by the trucker convoy today coming back from work. The police handled the situation the best they could. They closed all the off-ramps, then set a lane aside for the caravan so they would roll through and stop gumming it all up. As the caravan passed by, they opened each off-ramp again.  They had cops on bikes, cars, trucks, and had helicopters overhead too.

I saw “Let’s Go Brandon” flags and a “Fuck Joe Biden and fuck you for voting for him” flag... among many others. They were blasting their horns. Many local drivers stuck their middle fingers out the window at the truckers as they drove by. One trucker hit somebody else’s car so the cops were taking a report on that too, which made things worse.

It was a circus, except the circus was nothing but clowns, and none of the clowns were funny.

Sitting there motionless for half an hour, I saw 2 different vehicles with paper tags from Texas. I did a quick search and found that Texas STILL hasn’t done anything to stop bad actors from selling unlimited temporary Texas tags online. Gotta love how well the Republican Party governs. They can make abortion illegal and lock up the parents of transgender kids, but they can’t even fix the temp tag problem, which has been going on for years.


----------



## Clix Pix

This afternoon here in Northern Virginia I was out on the boardwalk and walking trail that goes around our small lake and I kept hearing sirens on-and-off.  Right about the time I got close to my building again (a little after 3:30 PM), I heard more sirens and also loud honking.  Looking over at the cars lined up at the traffic light to turn one direction or another on to the main highway from our residential area, I saw that everybody was sitting there and no one was moving.  The high school near me had just let out and so some, if not most of the cars,  were probably from there.  We are only about a half-mile from entrance and exit  ramps from/to the Beltway in either direction, and it didn't take long for me to figure out that probably the sirens and the honking were due to the darned truck convoy probably plodding through on the Beltway, clogging the normal flow of traffic at our section of the Beltway, and the sirens were police trying to respond to the situation possibly by closing off both our entrance/exit ramps and that the honking was coming from maybe some of the truckers, but also from frustrated motorists who couldn't even just get on to the main drag, an important one in our suburban piece of this area, much less the entrance ramps to the Beltway.

These convoy people just need to GO AWAY.  NOW.


----------



## SuperMatt

Clix Pix said:


> This afternoon here in Northern Virginia I was out on the boardwalk and walking trail that goes around our small lake and I kept hearing sirens on-and-off.  Right about the time I got close to my building again (a little after 3:00 PM), I heard more sirens and also loud honking.  Looking over at the cars lined up at the traffic light to turn one direction or another on to the main highway from our residential area, I saw that everybody was sitting there and no one was moving.  The high school near me had just let out and so some, if not most of the cars,  were probably from there.  We are only about a half-mile from entrance and exit  ramps from/to the Beltway in either direction, and it didn't take long for me to figure out that probably the sirens and the honking were due to the darned truck convoy probably plodding through on the Beltway, clogging the normal flow of traffic at our section of the Beltway, and the sirens were police trying to respond to the situation possibly by closing off both our entrance/exit ramps and that the honking was coming from maybe some of the truckers, but also from frustrated motorists who couldn't even just get on to the main drag, an important one in our suburban piece of this area, much less the entrance ramps to the Beltway.
> 
> These convoy people just need to GO AWAY.  NOW.



They aren’t even demanding anything. The mask mandates are already canceled. They just want to PWN the libs. They are pathetic. How would they like it if we blocked their streets wherever they came from for hours, blasting our horns and putting out nasty clouds of smoke?


----------



## Clix Pix

Exactly, Matt!  This is just SO annoying and so unnecessary!


----------



## SuperMatt

Further proof that ivermectin doesn’t cure COVID-19…









						Ivermectin Not Effective At Fighting COVID, According To New Study
					

After all the hoopla about the horse de-wormer maybe treating COVID, it turns out it almost certainly does nothing.




					uproxx.com
				




Time for Rogan to take the walk of shame.


----------



## Roller

SuperMatt said:


> Further proof that ivermectin doesn’t cure COVID-19…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ivermectin Not Effective At Fighting COVID, According To New Study
> 
> 
> After all the hoopla about the horse de-wormer maybe treating COVID, it turns out it almost certainly does nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> uproxx.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Time for Rogan to take the walk of shame.



As if he or any of these people will admit they were wrong.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Why the Covid cult of ivermectin won't die​There has never been good clinical evidence to support the use of this drug. But the debate over its use is really about ideology and in-group signaling — not science.
The rise of the ivermectin cult is one of the most nonsensical storylines — in a sea of nonsensical storylines — to emerge during the pandemic. Even now, as Covid begins to become a less dominant force in our lives, the ivermectin bunkum continues.

There have been several recent large, well-done, clinical trials, including one published in the New England Journal of Medicine on Wednesday, that definitively show, according to one of the study’s authors, “there’s really no sign of any benefit.”  








						Opinion | Why the Covid cult of ivermectin won't die
					

There has never been good clinical evidence to support the use of this drug. But the debate over its use is really about ideology and in-group signaling — not science.




					www.nbcnews.com


----------



## Eric

__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/rareinsults/comments/tyc3qs


----------



## Clix Pix

Of course we have friends!  Over the past two years I've kept in touch with mine via the computer and my various Apple devices, and of course phone calls and texts, too. In-person situations were definitely not in the scheme of things for quite a while.

....And throughout this whole pandemic situation I have never gotten COVID.  I must be doing something right!


----------



## Cmaier

Eric said:


> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/rareinsults/comments/tyc3qs



He’s right. I never got it.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Cmaier said:


> He’s right. I never got it.




Agreed.  I was going to say basically the same thing.  Seems spot on to me.


----------



## Eric

Yeah I have many friends who didn't care, they got it and they spread it, I simply refused to see them at all during the entire thing. To each their own I guess but I always saw it as selfish.


----------



## Roller

I wonder (and we may never know), how many people had COVID-19 and were asymptomatic or so minimally symptomatic that they never made the connection and weren't tested. I suspect there are quite a few. The question is how many of them will have manifestations later in life.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Roller said:


> I wonder (and we may never know), how many people had COVID-19 and were asymptomatic or so minimally symptomatic that they never made the connection and weren't tested. I suspect there are quite a few. The question is how many of them will have manifestations later in life.



I think I saw it was over 70% when they did blood tests and such they checked everyones blood.


----------



## Alli

We went to our first indoor concert last night. Bob Dylan. Both my husband and I went in with our masks on and kept them on throughout the concert. It was a sold-out show…I saw one other person wearing a mask.


----------



## Eric

Alli said:


> We went to our first indoor concert last night. Bob Dylan. Both my husband and I went in with our masks on and kept them on throughout the concert. It was a sold-out show…I saw one other person wearing a mask.



Awesome, you got to see a show and feel safe about it. It's pretty much the same where ever I go now as well, typically I'm the only one masked up but I always feel protected.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Eric said:


> ...typically I'm the only one masked up but I always feel protected.




Same here.  I'm happy to keep wearing mine for now.


----------



## SuperMatt

Did a few early and baroque music concerts recently. Masks and proof of vaccination were required for attendees and performers. Exceptions to the mask rules were for wind players and singers only (for obvious reasons…).

Nobody broke the rules. Interesting to see the culture differences between audiences of different musical styles.


----------



## Edd

I live an hour north of Boston. Hadn’t gone down there since before Covid until two days ago for a concert. Virtually no masks there, which I’m fine with, nobody is wearing them where I live. It was so weird to be around that many people.


----------



## Clix Pix

Went to the Apple store at my local mall today and was surprised to see that staff and most of the customers were not wearing masks.  I think there were maybe three of us in the place who actually were masked.  Whatever....   Bought a new mouse, nothing exciting, but I did have fun looking at all the new goodies that are available now that weren't the last time I was in there quite a while ago.  I played with a few but didn't bring any of them home with me (_this_ time).....


----------



## Nycturne

Clix Pix said:


> Went to the Apple store at my local mall today and was surprised to see that staff and most of the customers were not wearing masks.  I think there were maybe three of us in the place who actually were masked.  Whatever....   Bought a new mouse, nothing exciting, but I did have fun looking at all the new goodies that are available now that weren't the last time I was in there quite a while ago.  I played with a few but didn't bring any of them home with me (_this_ time).....




I actually did something similar. I was there to get an iPhone so I could repurpose my well used one as a dedicated engineering device. Got a chance to play with the Studio and Studio Display. 

Similar here in a region north of Seattle. Only a handful masked. Especially folks from cultures where masking is generally more common.


----------



## ronntaylor

Clix Pix said:


> Went to the Apple store at my local mall today and was surprised to see that staff and most of the customers were not wearing masks.  I think there were maybe three of us in the place who actually were masked.  Whatever....   Bought a new mouse, nothing exciting, but I did have fun looking at all the new goodies that are available now that weren't the last time I was in there quite a while ago.  I played with a few but didn't bring any of them home with me (_this_ time).....



We visited the Apple store on the Upper West Side after picking up new eyeglasses. Such a stark difference. The eyeglass place prefers appointments. Limits the amount of customers inside. And insists on masks. We went from what felt like a very safe, responsible space to the Apple store where there were relatively few masks. We quickly picked up a couple accessories and spent 2/3 minutes looking at the Mac Studio and Studio Display before hightailing it out of there.


----------



## Clix Pix

I will be very happy that I wore the mask if it turns out (which of course I hope) that I once again evaded COVID...... Well worth it!


----------



## lizkat

Edd said:


> I live an hour north of Boston. Hadn’t gone down there since before Covid until two days ago for a concert. Virtually no masks there, which I’m fine with, nobody is wearing them where I live. It was so weird to be around that many people.




I still have most stuff delivered but when I'm out and about on particular errands then I don't mind being the weird one wearing a mask.  There's still a high rate of unvaccinated in this area,  and the risk of a breakthrough is not nil for people my age,  even with boosters.


----------



## Herdfan

The elite D.C. social scene sees a rash of covid cases, but parties on
					

WASHINGTON - To party or not to party? That is the question.




					www.stamfordadvocate.com


----------



## Eric

Herdfan said:


> The elite D.C. social scene sees a rash of covid cases, but parties on
> 
> 
> WASHINGTON - To party or not to party? That is the question.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.stamfordadvocate.com



We've all but given in, not just DC but everywhere. We'll have to see where the case rates and hospitalizations land.


----------



## Herdfan

Eric said:


> We've all but given in, not just DC but everywhere. We'll have to see where the case rates and hospitalizations land.




It's not that.  I simply don't think there is enough outrage on this board, or at PRSI,  when those who make the rules, break the rules.  During the peak if someone walked into a store without a mask it was the worst thing that could have happened.  But politicians who made the mask rules could do whatever they wanted and no one cared.   Might get a "Well they shouldn't have done that" but that was about it.  It didn't come close to the level of vitriol aimed at some "Karen" who was videoed in a store not wearing a mask.

I'm sorry, but it simply made/makes no sense.  And any comment about "this is why the little people aren't following the rules" was ignored or ridiculed.  As much as my hatred of masks was known and documented, not once did I ever not wear one where required either by law or even by a sign on the door.  So when the people that make the rules ignore them, yes it pissed me off.

Note: Please excuse multiple subject/verb disagreements in this post.


----------



## Eric

Those mandates have all been lifted though, do you want Democrats to continue adhering to rules that no longer exist because you're upset that they implemented them to begin with?

At the time (and if it happens again) we damn well will be busting on every Karen out there so willing to spread it, we've learned how selfish people are during this thing and politicizing it cost a lot of lives, if you want to show some outrage maybe do it for all those who senselessly died when they didn't have to.


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> It's not that.  I simply don't think there is enough outrage on this board, or at PRSI,  when those who make the rules, break the rules.  During the peak if someone walked into a store without a mask it was the worst thing that could have happened.  But politicians who made the mask rules could do whatever they wanted and no one cared.   Might get a "Well they shouldn't have done that" but that was about it.  It didn't come close to the level of vitriol aimed at some "Karen" who was videoed in a store not wearing a mask.
> 
> I'm sorry, but it simply made/makes no sense.  And any comment about "this is why the little people aren't following the rules" was ignored or ridiculed.  As much as my hatred of masks was known and documented, not once did I ever not wear one where required either by law or even by a sign on the door.  So when the people that make the rules ignore them, yes it pissed me off.
> 
> Note: Please excuse multiple subject/verb disagreements in this post.



I don't disagree with you that politicians set a bad example by not following mandates or public health guidance, not counting putting themselves and people around them at risk. However, it's harder for them to model good behavior, such as mask-wearing, when they're constantly mocked as being "weak," or worse. 

What's really sad is that we have the tools to get us much closer to what life was like in 2019, but too many politicians who think it's more important to adhere to conspiracy theories or enact legislation that harms their own constituents to remain in power. 

I don't think the U.S. will experience what China and some other countries are going through, though we will see some rise in cases and possibly hospitalization in selected areas. Our leading mRNA vaccines are more effective than others, and more people have some immunity from prior infection. But that doesn't mean the pandemic is over, as the majority seem to believe by the way they're conducting themselves. The world is fortunate that Omicron hasn't been more virulent, but we may not be so lucky with the next one, which is probably incubating in a host somewhere.

And the problem of long-COVID looms, though it is largely being ignored except by those who are affected and the people close to them, The federal government should be earmarking at least a billion dollars for research, but I'm not hopeful when they can't even provide funding for basic things like vaccination.


----------



## SuperMatt

Roller said:


> I don't disagree with you that politicians set a bad example by not following mandates or public health guidance, not counting putting themselves and people around them at risk. However, it's harder for them to model good behavior, such as mask-wearing, when they're constantly mocked as being "weak," or worse.
> 
> What's really sad is that we have the tools to get us much closer to what life was like in 2019, but too many politicians who think it's more important to adhere to conspiracy theories or enact legislation that harms their own constituents to remain in power.
> 
> I don't think the U.S. will experience what China and some other countries are going through, though we will see some rise in cases and possibly hospitalization in selected areas. Our leading mRNA vaccines are more effective than others, and more people have some immunity from prior infection. But that doesn't mean the pandemic is over, as the majority seem to believe by the way they're conducting themselves. The world is fortunate that Omicron hasn't been more virulent, but we may not be so lucky with the next one, which is probably incubating in a host somewhere.
> 
> And the problem of long-COVID looms, though it is largely being ignored except by those who are affected and the people close to them, The federal government should be earmarking at least a billion dollars for research, but I'm not hopeful when they can't even provide funding for basic things like vaccination.



Congress had a $15 billion COVID package setup to pass. $5 billion of that was to help with global vaccination efforts. They took that out. Do members of Congress only have the memory capabilities of goldfish?

When historians look back 1000 years from now, the shortsighted tendencies and inability to learn from past mistakes will be listed as reasons for the late 21st century near-extinction of humanity… be it through the next pandemic or irreversible climate change.


----------



## Roller

SuperMatt said:


> Congress had a $15 billion COVID package setup to pass. $5 billion of that was to help with global vaccination efforts. They took that out. Do members of Congress only have the memory capabilities of goldfish?
> 
> When historians look back 1000 years from now, the shortsighted tendencies and inability to learn from past mistakes will be listed as reasons for the late 21st century near-extinction of humanity… be it through the next pandemic or irreversible climate change.



If we continue along the current path, there may not be any historians in 1,000 years. And please don't insult goldfish by comparing them to members of Congress.


----------



## Herdfan

Roller said:


> I don't disagree with you that politicians set a bad example by not following mandates or public health guidance, not counting putting themselves and people around them at risk. However, it's harder for them to model good behavior, such as mask-wearing, when they're constantly mocked as being "weak," or worse.




They are supposed to be leaders.  And true leaders do what is right no matter what.  

I think @Eric hit the nail on the head in this post:



Eric said:


> We've all but given in, not just DC but everywhere. We'll have to see where the case rates and hospitalizations land.




The people are done.  I do not think they will accept any more lockdowns on mask mandates.  And I think in part is because the leaders that issued the mandates, ignored them.  Fresh in their minds will be the NFC Championship and Superbowl where the Governor and multiple mayors were maskless throughout the game.  And then tried to lie about it when confronted.  



SuperMatt said:


> Do members of Congress only have the memory capabilities of goldfish?




No, they think we do.


----------



## Yoused

Herdfan said:


> SuperMatt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do members of Congress only have the memory capabilities of goldfish?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, they think we do.
Click to expand...


from what I have seen, they would not be too far off the mark


----------



## lizkat

Edd said:


> I live an hour north of Boston. Hadn’t gone down there since before Covid until two days ago for a concert. Virtually no masks there, which I’m fine with, nobody is wearing them where I live. It was so weird to be around that many people.




But covid has surged in Boston proper.    BSO has cancelled its European tour due to breakout of covid in 31 of the orchestra's musicians despite vaxx and testing, It must be such a disappointment.  Was going to be first such tour since 2018.









						BSO cancels European tour, citing COVID-19 surge - The Boston Globe
					

The Boston Symphony Orchestra has canceled its upcoming four-city European tour citing “an increase in [COVID] cases among the members of the orchestra and Tanglewood Festival Chorus following recent Symphony Hall performances.”




					www.bostonglobe.com
				






> The Boston Symphony Orchestra has canceled its upcoming four-city European tour citing “an increase in cases among the members of the orchestra and Tanglewood Festival Chorus following recent Symphony Hall performances.” According to the BSO, a recent surge of COVID-19 cases has affected 31 onstage musicians.
> 
> The orchestra’s COVID-19 policy requires vaccinations and boosters for all performers. According to the orchestra, singers as well as wind and brass players are tested daily, while string players are tested twice per week. The chorus sang unmasked at performances of Britten’s “War Requiem” that took place between March 31 and April 2 under the direction of Antonio Pappano.


----------



## Edd

lizkat said:


> But covid has surged in Boston proper.    BSO has cancelled its European tour due to breakout of covid in 31 of the orchestra's musicians despite vaxx and testing, It must be such a disappointment.  Was going to be first such tour since 2018.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> BSO cancels European tour, citing COVID-19 surge - The Boston Globe
> 
> 
> The Boston Symphony Orchestra has canceled its upcoming four-city European tour citing “an increase in [COVID] cases among the members of the orchestra and Tanglewood Festival Chorus following recent Symphony Hall performances.”
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.bostonglobe.com



With the return to relative normalcy around here, I speculate that I and nearly everyone I know has had some form of COVID. Most of us don’t get tested regularly like the BSO.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Tennessee to make ivermectin available without a prescription because "It's a lot safer to go to your pharmacist and let him tell you how much ivermectin to take than it is to go to the co-op and guess what size horse you are"








						Tennessee to make ivermectin available without a prescription, despite research showing no benefit for COVID treatment
					

Ivermectin will soon be available without a prescription in Tennessee. Both the state House and Senate have given final approval to the bill intended to make the anti-parasitic more easily available to treat COVID, despite a growing body of research that finds no benefit.




					wpln.org


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Tennessee to make ivermectin available without a prescription because "It's a lot safer to go to your pharmacist and let him tell you how much ivermectin to take than it is to go to the co-op and guess what size horse you are"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tennessee to make ivermectin available without a prescription, despite research showing no benefit for COVID treatment
> 
> 
> Ivermectin will soon be available without a prescription in Tennessee. Both the state House and Senate have given final approval to the bill intended to make the anti-parasitic more easily available to treat COVID, despite a growing body of research that finds no benefit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wpln.org



They’re in the running for worst state legislature in America, but there are a lot of other strong competitors for that title.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> They’re in the running for worst state legislature in America, but there are a lot of other strong competitors for that title.



sad it seems like its a goal thats desirable.


----------



## Herdfan

Not sure why anyone cares if someone wants to take Ivermectin as it doesn't affect you or your family.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Herdfan said:


> Not sure why anyone cares if someone wants to take Ivermectin as it doesn't affect you or your family.



then again why do you need top have free access to a prescription drug?


----------



## Renzatic

Herdfan said:


> Not sure why anyone cares if someone wants to take Ivermectin as it doesn't affect you or your family.




When you have a bunch of people buying up supplies, accusing doctors of killing family members because they didn't give them the latest anti-covid craze of the day, and just being general all around pains in the asses...

...yeah, it effects others.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Renzatic said:


> When you have a bunch of people buying up supplies, accusing doctors of killing family members because they didn't give them the latest anti-covid craze of the day, and just being general all around pains in the asses...
> 
> ...yeah, it effects others.



plus dying and getting sick from eating hose paste.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> Not sure why anyone cares if someone wants to take Ivermectin as it doesn't affect you or your family.



Think for a second about the story that was actually posted.

It was the legislature making ivermectin available without a prescription. This is meant to pander to those who think it actually helps against COVID, which it doesn’t. I don’t personally care if somebody wants to take it, but for the legislature of a state to effectively promote a false cure for a disease means they are encouraging people to take an ineffective medicine.The end result could be the death of those who choose this over an actually effective treatment. If Tennessee’s Republican legislators are ok with killing a few people in order to score some political points, then they are inhuman reprobates.


----------



## Herdfan

Renzatic said:


> When you have a bunch of people buying up supplies, accusing doctors of killing family members because they didn't give them the latest anti-covid craze of the day, and just being general all around pains in the asses...
> 
> ...yeah, it effects others.




This law kind of makes that point moot.  No Doctor required, so no Doctor to blame.  Plus I don't think enough people will buy it to affect supplies.  



SuperMatt said:


> Think for a second about the story that was actually posted.
> 
> It was the legislature making ivermectin available without a prescription. This is meant to pander to those who think it actually helps against COVID, which it doesn’t. I don’t personally care if somebody wants to take it, but for the legislature of a state to effectively promote a false cure for a disease means they are encouraging people to take an ineffective medicine.The end result could be the death of those who choose this over an actually effective treatment. If Tennessee’s Republican legislators are ok with killing a few people in order to score some political points, then they are inhuman reprobates.




At least they won't die from taking the horse version. 

I think if someone is hell bent on taking Ivermectin,  they are going to do it one way or another.  This is the COVID equivalent of a needle exchange.  At least give them a safe way to do it.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> This law kind of makes that point moot.  No Doctor required, so no Doctor to blame.  Plus I don't think enough people will buy it to affect supplies.




A question for you.  Do you think society should rely on politicians or medical professionals to decide which medications are safe to make available to the general public?


----------



## Herdfan

MEJHarrison said:


> A question for you.  Do you think society should rely on politicians or medical professionals to decide which medications are safe to make available to the general public?




Medical professionals for sure.

But at the same time, if a licensed Dr. prescribes it, where is the problem?

And medical professionals will tell you not to inject heroin or fentenyl into your veins, but politicians provide free needles so that people can do just that.  They justify it by saying it causes lesser harm.  Same as the TN bill.  People are going to either buy the legit stuff at a pharmacy or buy the horse version.  Which is better?

And the bill does not force any pharmacy to stock it or dispense it.  And I figure the major chains won't, so this is probably not the big deal it is being made out to be.


----------



## SuperMatt

Herdfan said:


> But at the same time, if a licensed Dr. prescribes it, where is the problem?



The Tennessee legislature removed doctors from the picture by allowing it to be sold over the counter. That is literally the entire discussion here.



Also, free needles don’t come with free heroin. You know that, right? It’s one thing to hand out clean needles to protect addicts from passing deadly diseases around. It’s a different story entirely to provide them with the drug that is killing them.

The argument isn’t apples-to-apples. If politicians made heroin an over-the-counter drug, then you’d have an equivalent argument. Instead you’ve got zilch.


----------



## Herdfan

I will admit that I didn't realize state politicians made those (OTC vs scrip) decisions.  I really thought it was the FDA.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Herdfan said:


> I will admit that I didn't realize state politicians made those (OTC vs scrip) decisions.  I really thought it was the FDA.



welcome to Tennessee.


----------



## MEJHarrison

Herdfan said:


> Medical professionals for sure.




Good!



Herdfan said:


> But at the same time, if a licensed Dr. prescribes it, where is the problem?




A doctor prescribing it vs it being freely available?  I'd say at least you have someone with more knowledge of medicine than the average citizen prescribing it.  They're more likely to be aware of potential harmful side-effects that might apply to each individual patient differently.  They're more likely to know if there are drug interactions a patient should be aware of.  And a decent pharmacist will likely double check those things as well.  If you're able to walk into Walgreen's, grab a bag of Cheetos, a Coke and a tube of Ivermectin, a lot of those guardrails are completely gone. 

To be fair, I'm not a medical professional.  And I've seen some dumb things.  Like I can't get a new sleep apnea mask because my prescription is expired.  A prescription for a mask?  What the hell?  Have people overpaid for too many masks in the past and it caused some other ailment?  It makes no sense and now I need to go get a new prescription so I can pay way too much for a mask.  I honestly don't know how safe Ivermectin is and never cared enough to investigate.  Still, for the most part, I'd support more rather than less restrictions.  If medical professionals think it should require a prescription, that's good enough for me.  Even when that includes stupid things like a mask.



Herdfan said:


> And medical professionals will tell you not to inject heroin or fentenyl into your veins, but politicians provide free needles so that people can do just that.  They justify it by saying it causes lesser harm.  Same as the TN bill.  People are going to either buy the legit stuff at a pharmacy or buy the horse version.  Which is better?




I suspect, but don't know off the top of my head, that the average medical professional probably supports those programs.  That's different than lawmakers going _*against*_ doctors advice with Ivermectin.



Herdfan said:


> And the bill does not force any pharmacy to stock it or dispense it.  And I figure the major chains won't, so this is probably not the big deal it is being made out to be.




I agree with you.  I also think it's probably a little late to the game.  People don't even wear masks now.  By the time you can legally go buy Ivermectin, I suspect the demand will be quite low.  Unless there's a new variant that sweeps the nation.


----------



## Yoused

Are people numbnutzes taking a "course" of this and stopping, or do they just keep downing more and more?


----------



## Roller

Herdfan said:


> Medical professionals for sure.
> 
> But at the same time, if a licensed Dr. prescribes it, where is the problem?
> 
> And medical professionals will tell you not to inject heroin or fentenyl into your veins, but politicians provide free needles so that people can do just that.  They justify it by saying it causes lesser harm.  Same as the TN bill.  People are going to either buy the legit stuff at a pharmacy or buy the horse version.  Which is better?
> 
> And the bill does not force any pharmacy to stock it or dispense it.  And I figure the major chains won't, so this is probably not the big deal it is being made out to be.



Any healthcare provider who prescribes Ivermectin for COVID should be penalized. Its lack of efficacy is no longer a subject of debate, so anyone who prescribes Ivermectin is committing malpractice. The only saving grace is that the grifter physicians who sell it will be less likely to profit if it's available OTC.


----------



## DT

Alli said:


> We went to our first indoor concert last night. Bob Dylan. Both my husband and I went in with our masks on and kept them on throughout the concert. It was a sold-out show…I saw one other person wearing a mask.




We're headed back up to NYC, masks required for shows.  No problem for me, or Wife, or 14 year Daughter, since, you know, we're not snowflakes.


----------



## Clix Pix

I saw recently where some shows have had to temporarily close again due to cast and crew infections.....  Don't recall which ones, though.


----------



## DT

Clix Pix said:


> I saw recently where some shows have had to temporarily close again due to cast and crew infections.....  Don't recall which ones, though.




Yeah, quite a few, some substitutions here and there, we're good, so far, heck, tomorrow this time we'll be done with our first show


----------



## Alli

DT said:


> Yeah, quite a few, some substitutions here and there, we're good, so far, heck, tomorrow this time we'll be done with our first show



Which reminds me, my son wants a full report on the trip between SA and NY. He’s unwilling to fly on an unknown airline without a really good recommendation.


----------



## Eric

When even the meth heads are skeptical.


you'll survive from
      facepalm


----------



## Eric

Thoughts and prayers I guess.


Turns out she was the idiot all along from
      LeopardsAteMyFace


----------



## Renzatic

Eric said:


> When even the meth heads are skeptical.
> 
> 
> you'll survive from
> facepalm




Yeah, but I got that meth from that guy in the orange van down by the strip mall. I trust him! He's good people!


----------



## Eric

Renzatic said:


> Yeah, but I got that meth from that guy in the orange van down by the strip mall. I trust him! He's good people!



Plus you can trust meth cooked by tweakers, unlike that untested "vaccine" they only gave to 11 billion people.


----------



## Renzatic

Eric said:


> Plus you can trust meth cooked by tweakers, unlike that untested "vaccine" they only gave to 11 billion people.




I've seen the lab, man. It's pretty clean. I can't say the same thing about Pfizer and all those other pharma companies.

...haven't seen their labs.


----------



## SuperMatt

This man is a U.S. Senator. He thinks the COVID vaccine could give you AIDS. Wonderful!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1521549634170195968/


----------



## Edd

SuperMatt said:


> This man is a U.S. Senator. He thinks the COVID vaccine could give you AIDS. Wonderful!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1521549634170195968/



Seems like he’s walking that line, admitting that the public thinks it’s safe, but avoiding going further to avoid pissing off the stupid fuckin’ Trumpers.


----------



## SuperMatt

Edd said:


> Seems like he’s walking that line, admitting that the public thinks it’s safe, but avoiding going further to avoid pissing off the stupid fuckin’ Trumpers.



Walking the line between Dumb and Dumber....


----------



## Yoused

Roller said:


> Any healthcare provider who prescribes Ivermectin for COVID should be penalized. Its lack of efficacy is no longer a subject of debate, so anyone who prescribes Ivermectin is committing malpractice.




For malpractice to be brought down on a quack, there has to be a negative effect. If the crap can be prescribed in a way that does not injure the patient, there is little call for an action. Malpractice is not a crime, so it either results in a suit or, possibly, loss of license. But you really have to piss off the board to get you license yanked – and even that is not enough to stop some people.


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> Walking the line between Dumb and Dumber....



I think that was like a drunk with a .3ba trying to walk a line.


----------



## rdrr

Herdfan said:


> Not sure why anyone cares if someone wants to take Ivermectin as it doesn't affect you or your family.




Haven't been on for a while, because I had to shut down for sanity sake.   It is so easy for your side to say, who does this hurt other than the fool taking it, and why does it matter to me?

I'll tell you why...  My daughter became a new nurse August 2019 and got her first job in Early September.   Nursing for her was a joy in taking care of people and her ultimate goal was to go into hospice care, because that is the type of person she is.  Then the pandemic happened and it has totally crushed her spirit.  People like you have made this pandemic go a lot longer than it needed to.   The healthcare industry has been totally eviscerated of good doctors, nurses, EMTs, and other healthcare staff.   The ones that remain are hanging on by a thread, and suffer from depression, anxiety, and PTSD.   When regular people on the internet think that they are smarter than people who have spent in some cases a decade learning to hone their skills, they end up in the hospital too late and beg people like my daughter to help them live.   Too often she has seen family members come in when the O2 is so low that their body is crashing from their inability to rapid breath to stay alive.   In one instance, my daughter had to convince a wife who was threatening bodily harm if they didn't release her husband, that if they let him leave he would be dead in a matter of hours.   The wife wanted to take him home and off of the oxygen that was keeping him alive, to treat him with Ivermectin.  He had 2 small children.

She is now fighting, and I mean fighting a severe depression, and I am worried.  So don't you give me this BS about why do I care.   It effects a lot more people and families than your narrow view can imagine.


----------



## Cmaier

rdrr said:


> Haven't been on for a while, because I had to shut down for sanity sake.




I’d love you to stick around. You could always try the forum’s “ignore” function, or avoid certain topics.


----------



## rdrr

Cmaier said:


> I’d love you to stick around. You could always try the forum’s “ignore” function, or avoid certain topics.



Oh I am back baby.  I just had to take a break from the interwebs.   It's been a rough March/April, a lot of weirdness in my life.   Let's just say I thanks to Ancestry DNA, my foundation of who I thought I was, has been shaken.


----------



## Cmaier

rdrr said:


> Oh I am back baby.  I just had to take a break from the interwebs.   It's been a rough March/April, a lot of weirdness in my life.   Let's just say I thanks to Ancestry DNA, my foundation of who I thought I was, has been shaken.



Yikes.


----------



## Roller

Yoused said:


> For malpractice to be brought down on a quack, there has to be a negative effect. If the crap can be prescribed in a way that does not injure the patient, there is little call for an action. Malpractice is not a crime, so it either results in a suit or, possibly, loss of license. But you really have to piss off the board to get you license yanked – and even that is not enough to stop some people.



Yes, the plaintiff has to show they were harmed as a result of a practitioner's action or inaction. So if a physician prescribes ivermectin instead of initiating accepted therapy, and the patient suffers adverse consequences, they can be found guilty of malpractice. The key is whether they breached the medical standard of care, which varies. For example, a trained specialist may be held to a higher standard. (I've been an expert witness several times in my career, and it was never fun.)

Loss of licensure, which is done by state medical boards, ideally follows accepted principles of practice. However, it's been my experience that board members, who are often appointed by the governor, don't always take the appropriate disciplinary action. It's gotten particularly bad in recent years.


----------



## Roller

rdrr said:


> Haven't been on for a while, because I had to shut down for sanity sake.   It is so easy for your side to say, who does this hurt other than the fool taking it, and why does it matter to me?
> 
> I'll tell you why...  My daughter became a new nurse August 2019 and got her first job in Early September.   Nursing for her was a joy in taking care of people and her ultimate goal was to go into hospice care, because that is the type of person she is.  Then the pandemic happened and it has totally crushed her spirit.  People like you have made this pandemic go a lot longer than it needed to.   The healthcare industry has been totally eviscerated of good doctors, nurses, EMTs, and other healthcare staff.   The ones that remain are hanging on by a thread, and suffer from depression, anxiety, and PTSD.   When regular people on the internet think that they are smarter than people who have spent in some cases a decade learning to hone their skills, they end up in the hospital too late and beg people like my daughter to help them live.   Too often she has seen family members come in when the O2 is so low that their body is crashing from their inability to rapid breath to stay alive.   In one instance, my daughter had to convince a wife who was threatening bodily harm if they didn't release her husband, that if they let him leave he would be dead in a matter of hours.   The wife wanted to take him home and off of the oxygen that was keeping him alive, to treat him with Ivermectin.  He had 2 small children.
> 
> She is now fighting, and I mean fighting a severe depression, and I am worried.  So don't you give me this BS about why do I care.   It effects a lot more people and families than your narrow view can imagine.



So sorry to hear that, especially about someone who is just beginning her career, but it mirrors what I'm seeing in physicians, advanced practice providers, and nurses. When your daughter is feeling better, which I hope she will soon, she may want to consider working in other settings, such as research, where she may be less likely to encounter the situations that caused her anxiety and depression.


----------



## Alli

rdrr said:


> Oh I am back baby.  I just had to take a break from the interwebs.   It's been a rough March/April, a lot of weirdness in my life.   Let's just say I thanks to Ancestry DNA, my foundation of who I thought I was, has been shaken.



You know this begs for a thread of its own. Tell us more.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Wha?
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1519823501535825920/



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1522780617657634817/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1522965423561621504/


----------



## BigMcGuire

The last few years has really opened my eyes to what I thought was a given. People whom I thought were defined by a love and care for others were the same ones who laughed at the idea of Americans dying and fought to be inconvenienced a tiny bit to prevent fellow Americans from dying. Kinda turned my world up side down. I still have relatives who think that the shot will kill them... despite my 80+ year old mother in law getting her second booster now without any problems. Ignorance is bliss - the Matrix was right.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1526601715365068801/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1526638273711448070/


----------



## JayMysteri0

Update on previous Covid Stupid story, that included air lines, feelings, and attack those doing their jobs.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1530683408032071680/


----------



## SuperMatt

It would be nice to let this thread die. Sadly, there’s a man in Florida who insisted that we revisit it…









						Gov. Ron DeSantis clashes with Biden White House over decision that Florida won't order vaccines for children under 5
					

Florida is the only state that hasn't preordered COVID-19 vaccines for children under 5, and they could start to go out as soon as next week.




					www.businessinsider.com
				






> Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis confirmed on Thursday that the state would not be ordering COVID-19 vaccines for young children after a Food and Drug Administration panel unanimously endorsed the Pfizer and Moderna shots for babies and kids under 5.
> 
> "There is not going to be any state programs that are going to be trying to get COVID jabs to infants, toddlers, and newborns," the Republican governor said in response to a question asked at a Miami press conference on Everglades conservation. "That's not something that we think is appropriate, and so that's not where we are going to be utilizing our resources."



Are we still playing these games, now with the health of kids under 5?

Gotta say, he’s working hard to earn the “DeathSantis” nickname.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Making fun of anti-vaxxers isn't just entertaining, it's your civic duty. New study shows vaccine-hesitant people were more likely to get vaccinated after viewing humorous anti-vaxxer memes








						Exposure to humorous memes about anti-vaxxers boosts intention to get a COVID-19 vaccine, study finds
					

A series of studies revealed that exposure to sarcastic memes about anti-vaxxers increased UK residents’ intention to receive a COVID-19 vaccine. The researchers suggest that the humorous memes were able to bypass the typical defense processes of people who are vaccine-hesitant. ...




					www.psypost.org


----------



## fooferdoggie

SuperMatt said:


> Are we still playing these games, now with the health of kids under 5?
> 
> Gotta say, he’s working hard to earn the “DeathSantis” nickname.



he is just another trump could give a fuck about others.


----------



## Cmaier

Whittier Nurse's Suit Ties Job Loss to COVID Testing Refusal — NBC LA
					

Former nurse at a Whittier hospital is suing her ex-employer alleging she was discriminated against because she objected COVID testing, due to religious reasons.




					apple.news
				




She is suing because she got fired for refusing even to getting tested.


----------



## SuperMatt

Cmaier said:


> Whittier Nurse's Suit Ties Job Loss to COVID Testing Refusal — NBC LA
> 
> 
> Former nurse at a Whittier hospital is suing her ex-employer alleging she was discriminated against because she objected COVID testing, due to religious reasons.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> apple.news
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> She is suing because she got fired for refusing even to getting tested.



She’s probably got a shot with the current makeup of the Supreme Court. Probably 5 COVID deniers on there.


----------



## Yoused

well, that one was known at the time as Amy Covid Barrett


----------



## fooferdoggie

Florida Pediatrician Booted From State Board for Being Pro-Vax​








						Florida Pediatrician Booted From State Board for Being Pro-Vax
					

A DeSantis cabinet official said Lisa Gwynn made “very political statements that do not reflect the CFO’s point of view.”



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Runs For Fun

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1543075419699625984/


----------



## Runs For Fun




----------



## Yoused

Vladimir Zelenko, orthodox Hasidic doctor who first promoted Hydroxychloroquine/zinc/Azithromycin treatment for Covid and steadfastly opposed vaccines,









						Vladimir Zelenko, Orthodox doctor who promoted unproven COVID-19 treatment, dies at 48 - Jewish Telegraphic Agency
					

Zelenko, who left his Hasidic community in May 2020 amid controversy, remained a hero to the anti-vaxx movement.




					www.jta.org
				




has been taken by cancer at age 48.


----------



## mollyc

i gotta say....as a 48 year old myself....he looked way older than 48.


----------



## Alli

mollyc said:


> i gotta say....as a 48 year old myself....he looked way older than 48.



That’s what happens when you live on a diet of hydroxychloriquine.


----------



## DT

Runs For Fun said:


>





Hahaha, who is "we" exactly?  A bunch of f***ing idiots?  Oh, it is?  Well, carry on.


----------



## SuperMatt

Because of all the attacks and threats on doctors working for the government during the pandemic, many are resigning.









						D.C.'s Health Director LaQuandra Nesbitt Is Stepping Down
					

Nesbitt joins a number of local public health officials moving away from their roles after two years of working through a pandemic.




					dcist.com
				




Trump is one of the worst offenders, but really every single person who attacked doctors is at fault. They were simply trying to save lives, and so many people attacked them for it. You’d really threaten the life of a doctor rather than wear a mask? Sad.


----------



## Cmaier

Yoused said:


> Vladimir Zelenko, orthodox Hasidic doctor who first promoted Hydroxychloroquine/zinc/Azithromycin treatment for Covid and steadfastly opposed vaccines,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Vladimir Zelenko, Orthodox doctor who promoted unproven COVID-19 treatment, dies at 48 - Jewish Telegraphic Agency
> 
> 
> Zelenko, who left his Hasidic community in May 2020 amid controversy, remained a hero to the anti-vaxx movement.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.jta.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> has been taken by cancer at age 48.



I grew up in that town. Well, a year or so ago Kiryas Joel became its own town, but before that it was part of the town I grew up in. 

Doesn’t surprise me.


----------



## Runs For Fun

EXCLUSIVE: Anti-vax dating site that let people advertise 'mRNA FREE' semen left all its user data exposed
					

An anti-vaccine dating website that allows users to procure 'mRNA FREE' semen left its users' personal data exposed online.




					www.dailydot.com


----------



## fischersd

Someone should reboot the "Lemmings" game - rename it Anti-vaxxers and turn all of the Lemmings into Trump bobble-heads.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Head of Florida ‘church’ that sold bleach as COVID-19 ‘miracle cure’ faces fraud charges​




__





						Head of Florida ‘church’ that sold bleach as COVID-19 ‘miracle cure’ faces fraud charges
					





					www.msn.com


----------



## SuperMatt

fooferdoggie said:


> Head of Florida ‘church’ that sold bleach as COVID-19 ‘miracle cure’ faces fraud charges​
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Head of Florida ‘church’ that sold bleach as COVID-19 ‘miracle cure’ faces fraud charges
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.msn.com



Good to know the Snake Oil business is still alive and well.


----------



## AG_PhamD

https://www.statnews.com/2022/08/17/cdc-ambitious-overhaul-covid-missteps/ 

Looks like the CDC is finally admitting their COVID response was not up to par. Not to say I told you so, but remember when I was criticized for saying such blasphemous things? When it comes to public health my number one concern is public health. Politics should play no role in the response of a public health disaster. 

I’m glad to see this evaluation and restructuring occurring so that the next epidemic will hopefully be handled better. The Monkeypox response has already been a bit of a disaster, but hopefully moving forward future the response outbreaks won’t be such a mess. 

I can only hope other departments, such as the FDA, HHS, etc also reflect on how they can better streamline their response. I also think it’s important they study how to better communicate with the public to help mitigate false information, conspiracies, politicization, and confusion.


----------



## Eric

AG_PhamD said:


> https://www.statnews.com/2022/08/17/cdc-ambitious-overhaul-covid-missteps/
> 
> Looks like the CDC is finally admitting their COVID response was not up to par. Not to say I told you so, but remember when I was criticized for saying such blasphemous things? When it comes to public health my number one concern is public health. Politics should play no role in the response of a public health disaster.
> 
> I’m glad to see this evaluation and restructuring occurring so that the next epidemic will hopefully be handled better. The Monkeypox response has already been a bit of a disaster, but hopefully moving forward future the response outbreaks won’t be such a mess.
> 
> I can only hope other departments, such as the FDA, HHS, etc also reflect on how they can better streamline their response. I also think it’s important they study how to better communicate with the public to help mitigate false information, conspiracies, politicization, and confusion.



You have to admit that their responses to it were all over the place. At the same time it came on so sudden and evolved every couple of months so I thought they did the best they could all considering, they may not have been sure what was right but they had our best interests at heart. Going forward I agree that they can learn from this and be more prepared next time around. Thinking about it i don't think we've seen anything this drastic since the Spanish Flu.


----------



## AG_PhamD

Eric said:


> You have to admit that their responses to it were all over the place. At the same time it came on so sudden and evolved every couple of months so I thought they did the best they could all considering, they may not have been sure what was right but they had our best interests at heart. Going forward I agree that they can learn from this and be more prepared next time around. Thinking about it i don't think we've seen anything this drastic since the Spanish Flu.




I’m sure they did the best they could considering what they were dealing with organizationally and I would never accuse the CDC as intentionally not working in the public’s best interest, but it’s many remarkable mistakes and lack of planning and contingency plans.They appear to have been caught totally flatfooted and unprepared to deal with anything of this scale- which to be fair is always going to be extremely difficult. 

You’d think they would have learned there lesson but even looking at the Monkeypox outbreak response has been a total mess- look tot my post in the Monkeypox thread if you want to read about that. There was also a great article in the WaPo recently outlining just how painfully ridiculous the government response has been. Keep in mind Monkeypox is a decently well known quantity, an infinitesimally smaller outbreak, far less resource intensive, AND we already have a vaccine.  And yet here are are. The Swine Flu response was also quite poor, by CDC officials own admission. So I would say this is very much a trend over the past 20-30+ years when it comes to anything beyond a tiny outbreak of a rare disease. 

We have been lucky that COVID has a fatality rate of less than 1%- not to gloss over the millions of people who have died or have had their lives severely affected. But imagine if the next pandemic has a fatality rate of 5% or 15% or 50%… 

We need a better organized whole of government response to future public health crises. There’s too much bureaucratic nonsense in the way of responding quickly which is needed when you have an epidemic. What has happened in the past is what it is and there is nothing that can be done to change that, other than learn the many lessons to be learned.


----------



## Yoused

AG_PhamD said:


> We need a better organized whole of government response to future public health crises.



Well, we _did_ – until '18, when _Obama_ disbanded the CDC's pandemic response team and then our hero Captain HCQ was unable to fight through the jungle of red tape to where he could tear off the head of the fiendish Dr. Fauci.

I mean, in the face of a major public disaster, insanity and chaos are not exactly the best way to deal with it.


----------



## AG_PhamD

Yoused said:


> Well, we _did_ – until '18, when _Obama_ disbanded the CDC's pandemic response team and then our hero Captain HCQ was unable to fight through the jungle of red tape to where he could tear off the head of the fiendish Dr. Fauci.
> 
> I mean, in the face of a major public disaster, insanity and chaos are not exactly the best way to deal with it.




This frankly is a media talking point that doesn’t really hold up when you dig into what this department was, how big it was, how many people were in this department, the fact it had only existed for 2 years, and that the units responsibilities were reassigned. And it was actually John Bolton that reorganized the department and it was actually part of the National Security Council, not the CDC. And the focus of this department was more geared towards  bioweapons defenses. 



			https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/03/20/was-white-house-office-global-pandemics-eliminated/
		


One of the primary responsibilities of the CDC is epidemic/pandemic monitoring and response. Besides, the NSC probably would not be the one taking the lead in organizing a response in terms of things like testing development and public health programs. Even if you go back to the CDC’s AIDS response in the 80’s compared to Europe their response is pretty embarrassing. And the recent Monkeypox failures are this point given all that happened with COVID and the fact we have a reasonably effective vaccine is really just inexcusable. 

If you want to talk about Trump’s failures on COVID there is plenty to talk about there- particularly around his messaging and creating a system where states were bidding against each other. But the whole narrative around the “pandemic response unit” (which is not its name) does not really hold up to scrutiny. 

I’ve read the article by the former director or whatever of the program and there is no compelling argument that had she been in power there would have been anything different or how she would have avoided the problems that occured. I can’t imagine a 12 person team buried somewhere in the NSC with zero authority and no technical resources would have been the people organizing the whole of government response that occurred or been the ones creating tests when none existed. 

The reality is the government made grievous mistakes (or completely idiotic decisions) from top to bottom on this one. Government meaning the organizations from the White House (under Trump… and Biden… not to mention many previous admins dating back decades in the sense of failing to promote adequate preparedness) to CDC, FDA, HHS, State/Local authorities, etc. 

Obviously given the nature of the virus, much of the illness and death was unavoidable. But missteps on things like public communications, PCR testing roll out, rapid test availability, medical supply resource allocation, nursing home safety, etc should have never happened the way that they did. 

And surely COVID will be rearing it’s head once again in a matter of months- likely around Thanksgiving-Christmas-New Years, but perhaps even sooner. We should have a new vaccine by then to better target the major variants that have arisen since 2019 (omicron). We just need to make sure it’s produced and distributed efficiently and focus on an effective public health campaign to encourage uptake.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Panel: Trump staffers pushed unproven COVID treatment at FDA








						Panel: Trump staffers pushed unproven COVID treatment at FDA
					

WASHINGTON (AP) — Officials in the Trump White House tried to pressure U.S. health experts into reauthorizing a discredited COVID-19 treatment , according to a congressional investigation  that provides new evidence of that administration’s efforts to override Food and Drug Administration...




					apnews.com


----------



## Deleted member 215

Biden says the pandemic is over. Is he correct?









						Joe Biden says the COVID-19 pandemic is over. This is what the data tells us
					

While cases have decreased dramatically, there are still thousands of cases being reported across the world, and hundreds of people are still dying from it every day in the United States.




					www.npr.org


----------



## Eric

TBL said:


> Biden says the pandemic is over. Is he correct?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Joe Biden says the COVID-19 pandemic is over. This is what the data tells us
> 
> 
> While cases have decreased dramatically, there are still thousands of cases being reported across the world, and hundreds of people are still dying from it every day in the United States.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org



I'll always take the word of the actual CDC before that of any politician. We need to see an official statement here, not just hyperbole during election season.


----------



## lizkat

Eric said:


> I'll always take the word of the actual CDC before that of any politician. We need to see an official statement here, not just hyperbole during election season.




Well it can't be totally over yet since one of my brothers (vaxxed and boosted) just got some variant...  damn!


----------



## Eric

lizkat said:


> Well it can't be totally over yet since one of my brothers (vaxxed and boosted) just got some variant...  damn!



It's super transmissible, now that the new booster is out (though only a week old) let's hope that people take advantage of it. Hoping the best for your brother.


----------



## mollyc

i don’t think someone (preferably a health official) saying the pandemic is over means no one will get it anymore. it just means it isn’t killing people at high rates. the goal has always been to make this endemic, livable with, like the flu or regular colds.


----------



## Eric

mollyc said:


> i don’t think someone (preferably a health official) saying the pandemic is over means no one will get it anymore. it just means it isn’t killing people at high rates. the goal has always been to make this endemic, livable with, like the flu or regular colds.



They have specific criteria around what technically dictates it as a pandemic, the CDC has not been perfect but they're still the gold standard and have done the best they could considering how dynamic and evasive this virus has been. When they come out and say it's over they'll have data to back it up, until then I won't personally take anyone's word for it.


----------



## Cmaier

Eric said:


> They have specific criteria around what technically dictates it as a pandemic, the CDC has not been perfect but they're still the gold standard and have done the best they could considering how dynamic and evasive this virus has been. When they come out and say it's over they'll have data to back it up, until then I won't personally take anyone's word for it.



My main beef with the CDC has been the awkward social engineering. “If we tell people to get a booster, they‘ll think the original shot is no good and won’t get it.” “If we authorize a delta vaccine, then people will lose confidence in the effectiveness of vaccines” “if we tell people to wear n95 masks they’ll stop wearing masks entirely.”

Stop playing 3D chess.


----------



## Roller

The pandemic is not over, despite Biden’s proclamation. 400-500 Americans are dying daily, and variants that are more immune-evasive than ever are already circulating.

This doesn’t mean we’re in the same situation as we were in 2020. But I’m afraid even more people will believe they can safely abandon all mitigation strategies. Simple measures like masking on public transportation & indoor settings would make a difference., but that won’t happen. 

What Biden should have said is that we’re in a different phase that is better than before, but we have to fund a major effort to develop nasal vaccines, novel therapies, and long COVID, as well as push for improved ventilation in buildings. 

It’s also worth noting that the brunt has been borne by low income folks and POC. Unfortunately, that makes it easier for people who have ready access to vaccines and other healthcare to buy into the “pandemic? what pandemic?” narrative.


----------



## ronntaylor

lizkat said:


> Well it can't be totally over yet since one of my brothers (vaxxed and boosted) just got some variant...  damn!



I feel for your brother. Sending positive vibes.

I tested positive this weekend and have started on meds. >2 years being super vigilant -- always masked, and vaxxed & boosted -- meant nothing. I don't know if I caught it from recent travel to Virginia (first with absolutely no mask mandates in effect) or if my in-laws' foolishness is to "blame" for the infection. It is what it is.

I had already scheduled the bivalent booster, now it's delayed for at least three months. My PCP will be monitoring and advising after the special meds.

I think Biden just gave up as so many have COVID fatigue. I'm afraid that there will be a huge spike this Fall/Winter. Don't know what can be done with vaccines being widely available and people just giving up. There is not much to be done if people don't want to get boosted, let alone simply vaccinated.

450-500 dying daily doesn't signal an end to The Pandemic to me.


----------



## Eric

ronntaylor said:


> I feel for your brother. Sending positive vibes.
> 
> I tested positive this weekend and have started on meds. >2 years being super vigilant -- always masked, and vaxxed & boosted -- meant nothing. I don't know if I caught it from recent travel to Virginia (first with absolutely no mask mandates in effect) or if my in-laws' foolishness is to "blame" for the infection. It is what it is.
> 
> I had already scheduled the bivalent booster, now it's delayed for at least three months. My PCP will be monitoring and advising after the special meds.
> 
> I think Biden just gave up as so many have COVID fatigue. I'm afraid that there will be a huge spike this Fall/Winter. Don't know what can be done with vaccines being widely available and people just giving up. There is not much to be done if people don't want to get boosted, let alone simply vaccinated.
> 
> 450-500 dying daily doesn't signal an end to The Pandemic to me.



Wow, sorry to hear that, especially after you've gone through all that effort to avoid it and I'm sure it's deflating. It just shows that we're all still vulnerable, hoping your booster is helping to keep this from becoming a bad case, sending thoughts your way and wishing you a speedy recovery.

I still wear my mask at all indoor settings and usually I'm one of the very few doing it, I agree that people have all but given up. Biden running around bragging about not wearing a mask doesn't help things either. Just want to hear what the professionals have to say.


----------



## Herdfan

TBL said:


> Biden says the pandemic is over. Is he correct?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Joe Biden says the COVID-19 pandemic is over. This is what the data tells us
> 
> 
> While cases have decreased dramatically, there are still thousands of cases being reported across the world, and hundreds of people are still dying from it every day in the United States.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.npr.org




Not according to his own White House:



> (CNN) — The Biden administration is largely downplaying President Joe Biden’s comments declaring the coronavirus pandemic “over,” suggesting his remarks signal a continuation of the White House’s evolving stance toward the pandemic over the past few months.












						White House says Covid-19 policy unchanged despite Biden’s comments that the ‘pandemic is over’
					

(CNN) — The Biden administration is largely downplaying President Joe Biden’s comments declaring the coronavirus pandemic “over,” suggesting his remarks signal a continuation of the White House’s...




					whdh.com


----------



## Edd

I’m in Mexico this week and mask use here is 10x greater than back home. A convenience store across the street requires them. I attempted to enter maskless the first day. Took a half step and a woman stared daggers into me and made a gesture across her face that said “come in without a mask and I’ll fucking kill you”. She unnerved me, I confess.


----------



## lizkat

ronntaylor said:


> I feel for your brother. Sending positive vibes.
> 
> I tested positive this weekend and have started on meds. >2 years being super vigilant -- always masked, and vaxxed & boosted -- meant nothing. I don't know if I caught it from recent travel to Virginia (first with absolutely no mask mandates in effect) or if my in-laws' foolishness is to "blame" for the infection. It is what it is.
> 
> I had already scheduled the bivalent booster, now it's delayed for at least three months. My PCP will be monitoring and advising after the special meds.
> 
> I think Biden just gave up as so many have COVID fatigue. I'm afraid that there will be a huge spike this Fall/Winter. Don't know what can be done with vaccines being widely available and people just giving up. There is not much to be done if people don't want to get boosted, let alone simply vaccinated.
> 
> 450-500 dying daily doesn't signal an end to The Pandemic to me.




Yeah the meds are apparently working for the bro.  He was feeling well enough to pitch a cartoon into the email, always a good sign.   He has no clue where he got the variant.  Always goes into stores masked and had a third booster scheduled.  Sigh, now that's on the back burner for awhile I guess.

Feel better soon!!


----------



## ronntaylor

lizkat said:


> Yeah the meds are apparently working for the bro.  He was feeling well enough to pitch a cartoon into the email, always a good sign.   He has no clue where he got the variant.  Always goes into stores masked and had a third booster scheduled.  Sigh, now that's on the back burner for awhile I guess.
> 
> Feel better soon!!



Thanks! That includes others that sent positive vibes as well. At this point I don't how/where I got it. I always wear a mask and avoid places where there won't be heavy masking (especially when in Virginia). I suspect either Amtrak or my in-laws not being vigilant. Again, at this point it doesn't matter.

Just glad that I'm boosted and halfway through the meds. Caused GI issues the first couple days, and I've been super fatigued. But I hopeful that I'll be back to full strength by this weekend.

My PCP will check on my early next week to see where I'm at and assist me in scheduling a third booster.


----------



## Eric

ronntaylor said:


> Thanks! That includes others that sent positive vibes as well. At this point I don't how/where I got it. I always wear a mask and avoid places where there won't be heavy masking (especially when in Virginia). I suspect either Amtrak or my in-laws not being vigilant. Again, at this point it doesn't matter.
> 
> Just glad that I'm boosted and halfway through the meds. Caused GI issues the first couple days, and I've been super fatigued. But I hopeful that I'll be back to full strength by this weekend.
> 
> My PCP will check on my early next week to see where I'm at and assist me in scheduling a third booster.



Interesting about the GI issues, they're saying that Omicron causes that and one of the people I worked with got hit hard that way, too. It's also worth mentioning that with the new bivalent booster I definitely had side effects in my GI area that I never had with any of the other boosters.

In any case it sounds like you're recovering well, glad to hear that.


----------



## Cmaier

Just woke up from my booster-induced coma.  Got the shot this morning. Was a bit of a pain, since Stanford has people administering them this time who apparently don’t know what they are doing. They delayed opening for 15 minutes, didn’t know how to enter the information in the computer, and the jab hurt, unlike the flu shot I got 2 days ago or any of my prior covid shots.  Also not sure they coded it into the system right, as it’s showing up weird in my digital file.

Side-effects this time around include crankiness, fur on my knuckles, and now I’m even more handsome.


----------



## Roller

ronntaylor said:


> I feel for your brother. Sending positive vibes.
> 
> I tested positive this weekend and have started on meds. >2 years being super vigilant -- always masked, and vaxxed & boosted -- meant nothing. I don't know if I caught it from recent travel to Virginia (first with absolutely no mask mandates in effect) or if my in-laws' foolishness is to "blame" for the infection. It is what it is.
> 
> I had already scheduled the bivalent booster, now it's delayed for at least three months. My PCP will be monitoring and advising after the special meds.
> 
> I think Biden just gave up as so many have COVID fatigue. I'm afraid that there will be a huge spike this Fall/Winter. Don't know what can be done with vaccines being widely available and people just giving up. There is not much to be done if people don't want to get boosted, let alone simply vaccinated.
> 
> 450-500 dying daily doesn't signal an end to The Pandemic to me.



Sorry to hear about your infection — I hope you recover quickly. I understand the frustration of getting COVID despite your vaccination and precautions, but I wouldn't say your efforts meant nothing. Among other things, you were likely spared more serious symptoms. As well, reducing the number of infections lowers the chance of long-term healthcare concerns.

I agree about people being "over it." Not that they would do this, but if the CDC or anyone in the administration tried to reinstate masking on public transport or any similar mitigation measure, it would cause an uproar and be ignored by many. We, collectively, have been our own worst enemies.


----------



## Roller

Cmaier said:


> Just woke up from my booster-induced coma.  Got the shot this morning. Was a bit of a pain, since Stanford has people administering them this time who apparently don’t know what they are doing. They delayed opening for 15 minutes, didn’t know how to enter the information in the computer, and the jab hurt, unlike the flu shot I got 2 days ago or any of my prior covid shots.  Also not sure they coded it into the system right, as it’s showing up weird in my digital file.
> 
> Side-effects this time around include crankiness, fur on my knuckles, and now I’m even more handsome.



Responses are so idiosyncratic. I haven't had much if any pain from any of my five vaccinations so far. I did have a day of fatigue and fever, but less than with prior shots. As for the other side effects, especially the fur, please report them to VAERS. Seriously, I bet that would show up on a conspiracy site quickly.


----------



## Cmaier

Roller said:


> Responses are so idiosyncratic. I haven't had much if any pain from any of my five vaccinations so far. I did have a day of fatigue and fever, but less than with prior shots. As for the other side effects, especially the fur, please report them to VAERS. Seriously, I bet that would show up on a conspiracy site quickly.



TBH, I may have already had fur on my knuckles. Not sure, but I think what happened is that the booster vaccine cured my hereditary knuckle blindness.


----------



## lizkat

Roller said:


> Responses are so idiosyncratic




So are the remarks ahead of a jab by the person about to apply it, versus what actually happens.  I don't mind needles really,  but I suppose my brain has some kind of response ready to roll when the tech says "this might sting a little"  -- and then I barely feel it?!   When they say "this won't hurt, just relax" though, I have a tendency to override whatever my brain has in mind and I probably tense up and then I do feel it.  Got lucky w/ my covid sticks, hope that applies to flu shot in October and another covid booster.  But they will be what they will be.  Better the stick than the illness they're meant to prevent.


----------



## shadow puppet

lizkat said:


> So are the remarks ahead of a jab by the person about to apply it, versus what actually happens.  I don't mind needles really,  but I suppose my brain has some kind of response ready to roll when the tech says "this might sting a little"  -- and then I barely feel it?!   When they say "this won't hurt, just relax" though, I have a tendency to override whatever my brain has in mind and I probably tense up and then I do feel it.  Got lucky w/ my covid sticks, hope that applies to flu shot in October and another covid booster.  But they will be what they will be.  Better the stick than the illness they're meant to prevent.



I'm getting both flu and the latest Covid booster (my 5th Covid jab) this Friday.  I very much abhor needles.  I have a tendency to pull away so really have to focus on not moving.  I know it will be over faster that way, lol.


----------



## Eric

lizkat said:


> So are the remarks ahead of a jab by the person about to apply it, versus what actually happens.  I don't mind needles really,  but I suppose my brain has some kind of response ready to roll when the tech says "this might sting a little"  -- and then I barely feel it?!   When they say "this won't hurt, just relax" though, I have a tendency to override whatever my brain has in mind and I probably tense up and then I do feel it.  Got lucky w/ my covid sticks, hope that applies to flu shot in October and another covid booster.  But they will be what they will be.  Better the stick than the illness they're meant to prevent.



I felt the stick pretty good with the latest bivalent booster, then it abated after about 10 minutes and after about 3 or 4 hours it was sore for the next couple of days but this is typical for me. Also, the side effects usually don't hit for about 24 hours or so.

I got my flu jab yesterday (a week after my COVID) and it stung goin in as well but did not get sore again so I lucked out, I always get side effects from this one the same day so most of the time I was warm and having a lot of hot flashes, I also always get a metallic taste with it for some reason. Symptoms were very mild though and they're saying the efficacy this year is around 90% so it's totally worth it.


----------



## ronntaylor

Eric said:


> I got my flu jab yesterday (a week after my COVID) and it stung goin in as well but did not get sore again so I lucked out, I always get side effects from this one the same day so most of the time I was warm and having a lot of hot flashes, I also always get a metallic taste with it for some reason. Symptoms were very mild though and they're saying the efficacy this year is around 90% so it's totally worth it.



When I got my flu shot a week ago, it was the first time I felt the sting. I absolutely hate needles and usually zone out. I usually have to be told it's over. This time it was as if I could feel the shot entering my arm. And I was achy and fatigued on my walk home (about a 4-mile roundtrip to CVS). When I started feeling the effects of COVID, I thought it was the reemergence of the Flu shot. Super glad to be vexed and boosted because I can't imagine what would have happened had I not been.


----------



## Eric

ronntaylor said:


> When I got my flu shot a week ago, it was the first time I felt the sting. I absolutely hate needles and usually zone out. I usually have to be told it's over. This time it was as if I could feel the shot entering my arm. And I was achy and fatigued on my walk home (about a 4-mile roundtrip to CVS). When I started feeling the effects of COVID, I thought it was the reemergence of the Flu shot. Super glad to be vexed and boosted because I can't imagine what would have happened had I not been.



I have to tell you this is my biggest fear, getting the shot and not knowing whether or not the symptoms are from the jab (even though I get yours was for flu) or the actual virus. I tried to time it when I was around people the least the week before but I still could've been exposed because I was out. Sorry this happened, I don't know how we can avoid it entirely even when you took every precaution.


----------



## ronntaylor

Eric said:


> I have to tell you this is my biggest fear, getting the shot and not knowing whether or not the symptoms are from the jab (even though I get yours was for flu) or the actual virus. I tried to time it when I was around people the least the week before but I still could've been exposed because I was out. Sorry this happened, I don't know how we can avoid it entirely even when you took every precaution.



I had at least a couple family members that got COVID early on during The Pandemic. What I'm suffering is nothing compared to what they suffered. One member was about to be put on a ventilator. They thought their life was over and made arrangements to have their will and trusts verified as soon as they entered the hospital's pandemic wing. So I do consider myself fortunate (almost wrote lucky, but that most definitely doesn't jibe with what's happening) that I'm coherent, not in any pain, and not isolated with beeping machines and no loved ones around.


----------



## lizkat

Eric said:


> I have to tell you this is my biggest fear, getting the shot and not knowing whether or not the symptoms are from the jab (even though I get yours was for flu) or the actual virus. I tried to time it when I was around people the least the week before but I still could've been exposed because I was out. Sorry this happened, I don't know how we can avoid it entirely even when you took every precaution.




Yeah ever since the variant that's prevalent now has seemed so transmissible, I've joked that I'm likely to get it just showing up to get my booster and flu shot.   Not all that amusing really.  But it will be how it is. I'm wearing a mask when I go there!


----------



## Eric

lizkat said:


> Yeah ever since the variant that's prevalent now has seemed so transmissible, I've joked that I'm likely to get it just showing up to get my booster and flu shot.   Not all that amusing really.  But it will be how it is. I'm wearing a mask when I go there!



One day I had to stand in line in the Kaiser pharmacy for like 45 minutes and everyone in there was sick, I was surprised I didn't catch it then but they made everyone mask up.


----------



## Cmaier

Fun fact: apparently the Apple Wallet vaccination card can only show the most recent four doses.


----------



## fooferdoggie

Family of man who died of Covid-19 lives with corpse for over a year, believing he was only in a coma. Fark: They were given a death certificate that he was officially dead when he died








						Family Lives With Corpse for Over a Year, Thinking It’s Only in a Coma
					

The family of a 35-year-old man who died in April of last year due to Covid-19 have been living with his body ever since, thinking he was only in a coma




					www.odditycentral.com


----------



## Herdfan

You still need food and water when you are in a coma..........


----------



## Alli

Herdfan said:


> You still need food and water when you are in a coma..........



Good point. But you can’t fix stupid - not even with duct tape.


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

Herdfan said:


> You still need food and water when you are in a coma..........




But maybe he self-identified as an air plant and those require very little upkeep.  I have one I haven't watered for well over a year and it's still doing fine.


----------



## Roller

fooferdoggie said:


> Family of man who died of Covid-19 lives with corpse for over a year, believing he was only in a coma. Fark: They were given a death certificate that he was officially dead when he died
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Family Lives With Corpse for Over a Year, Thinking It’s Only in a Coma
> 
> 
> The family of a 35-year-old man who died in April of last year due to Covid-19 have been living with his body ever since, thinking he was only in a coma
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.odditycentral.com



Is this any more delusional than believing the lies that the 2020 election was stolen, despite there being no evidence to back up the claim? Or that all Democrats are satan-worshipping pedophiles, perhaps?


----------



## Edd

The wife an I got our first cases of COVID. Almost certainly, it was this maskless jackass on a plane last Monday who passed it to us. He had every evident symptom, coughed and sneezed non-stop.

We’ve just felt like shit for two days but doesn’t seem to be getting worse. I’m at the tail end of a long vacation from work which looks like it’ll get a bit longer.


----------



## DT

Booster scheduled for all of us this afternoon.  We're going to be out and about next week, around a lot of people, so this is good timing.


----------



## Nycturne

Our luck ran out. I was getting ready to schedule my booster (and the flu shot) when my partner mentions her brother got a positive test Friday. Their father has been causing trouble in his old age and so they’ve had to do a lot with folks trying to get power of attorney setup, deal with finances and the state of his house. She tested positive Sunday, and me today. 

100F fever today.

Honestly, I’d much rather take the booster than go through this. Blah.


----------



## Eric

Nycturne said:


> Our luck ran out. I was getting ready to schedule my booster (and the flu shot) when my partner mentions her brother got a positive test Friday. Their father has been causing trouble in his old age and so they’ve had to do a lot with folks trying to get power of attorney setup, deal with finances and the state of his house. She tested positive Sunday, and me today.
> 
> 100F fever today.
> 
> Honestly, I’d much rather take the booster than go through this. Blah.



Sorry to hear that, hopefully you'll get away with milder symptoms.


----------



## Nycturne

Eric said:


> Sorry to hear that, hopefully you'll get away with milder symptoms.



Peaked at 101.8F or so yesterday, down under 100F this morning, and I think the fever properly broke a little bit ago. 

Still feel like trash. Sore throat to the point I can’t really talk from the coughing, congestion as bad as I’ve ever experienced. But at least the head feels a lot better and not so dizzy/lightheaded as I was. Mostly just need to protect the throat from more injury and continue rest.


----------



## Edd

Nycturne said:


> Peaked at 101.8F or so yesterday, down under 100F this morning, and I think the fever properly broke a little bit ago.
> 
> Still feel like trash. Sore throat to the point I can’t really talk from the coughing, congestion as bad as I’ve ever experienced. But at least the head feels a lot better and not so dizzy/lightheaded as I was. Mostly just need to protect the throat from more injury and continue rest.



I’m a person who rarely gets sick, so when I going through the worst of COVID last weekend I was surprised to see how effective Advil was at breaking the fever. It did come back daily but I kept taking Advil and was glad to have it.


----------



## Nycturne

Edd said:


> I’m a person who rarely gets sick, so when I going through the worst of COVID last weekend I was surprised to see how effective Advil was at breaking the fever. It did come back daily but I kept taking Advil and was glad to have it.



For sure, and I was using something similar which has worked well for me the last time I had a fever years ago. The sobering thought here is that my fever went that high despite the meds.


----------



## lizkat

Nycturne said:


> For sure, and I was using something similar which has worked well for me the last time I had a fever years ago. The sobering thought here is that my fever went that high despite the meds.




Hope progression of your recovery is smooth.   My bro is feeling much better now from his bout with covid, contracted despite his vaxxes and booster, but he does say that fatigue still comes back like gangbusters sometimes,  so he has to remember to take it a bit easier than he's used to doing.


----------



## Nycturne

lizkat said:


> Hope progression of your recovery is smooth.   My bro is feeling much better now from his bout with covid, contracted despite his vaxxes and booster, but he does say that fatigue still comes back like gangbusters sometimes,  so he has to remember to take it a bit easier than he's used to doing.




Fingers crossed on that front. I haven’t had any shortness of breath or anything along those lines, and blood oxygen barely budged as an average compared to the week before. My VO2 max hasn’t been great for a long time though, so who knows. I guess we will find out when I feel good enough to start riding the bike again.


----------



## ronntaylor

lizkat said:


> Hope progression of your recovery is smooth.   My bro is feeling much better now from his bout with covid, contracted despite his vaxxes and booster, but he does say that fatigue still comes back like gangbusters sometimes,  so he has to remember to take it a bit easier than he's used to doing.



The fatigue sneaks up on you like crazy. Still haven't been able to go for a regular speed walking session since testing positive. Between the fatigue and insomnia, I can't imagine how those who aren't vaccinated and boosted can handle getting COVID.


----------



## DT

DT said:


> Booster scheduled for all of us this afternoon.  We're going to be out and about next week, around a lot of people, so this is good timing.




We were all pretty unaffected, well, possibly, maybe a little more tired than usual - but our usual is pretty tired 

I had some severe reactions to my other vaccinations, so this was a pleasant surprise, arm isn't even sore tonight.


----------



## Herdfan

ronntaylor said:


> The fatigue sneaks up on you like crazy. Still haven't been able to go for a regular speed walking session since testing positive. Between the fatigue and insomnia, I can't imagine how those who aren't vaccinated and boosted can handle getting COVID.




Just like the shots.  Some people barely noticed, others had issues.  Individual body chemistry can make a huge difference.


----------



## lizkat

Herdfan said:


> Just like the shots.  Some people barely noticed, others had issues.  Individual body chemistry can make a huge difference.




It's all down to mountain air, broccoli, red bell pepper, a Simply Asia sesame teriyaki noodle bowl and Honduran coffee.  Well on Thursdays anyway, take my word for it.   Worked last week, went for it again tonight.


----------



## fooferdoggie

'Plenty of protections in place' as 800 COVID-19 infected passengers disembark cruise ship in Sydney​








						'Plenty of protections in place' as 800 COVID-19 infected passengers disembark cruise ship
					






					www.9news.com.au


----------



## fooferdoggie

can't even imagine how such a honest group did this.​
COVID-Denying Medical Group Implodes Over Founder’s Extravagant Spending​When employees at leading COVID pseudoscience group America’s Frontline Doctors tried to log in to work last week, they found themselves locked out of their email accounts. The nonprofit quickly fell into factions, with employees holding rival Zoom meetings to plot who would take over the group.

The organization’s exiled founder, Dr. Simone Gold, tried unsuccessfully to gain access to a private Zoom call, only to find herself stuck in a waiting room. In internal emails, the group’s accountant worried about who could still access the $7 million locked in its bank accounts.








						COVID-Denying Medical Group Implodes Over Founder’s Extravagant Spending
					

Dr. Simone Gold is one of America’s foremost purveyors of bogus COVID cures. She’s used the money on a mansion, private jet trips, and her underwear-model boyfriend.



					www.thedailybeast.com


----------



## Edd

For $9M, you can give me a COVID vaccination weekly if you wish. My guy Cube doesn’t roll like that, and he’s whiny about it.









						Ice Cube still very mad about that movie he lost because he wouldn't get the COVID vaccine
					

Cube is still upset about missing a $9 million paycheck for Jack Black's Oh Hell No because he refused to be vaccinated




					www.avclub.com


----------



## Eric

Edd said:


> For $9M, you can give me a COVID vaccination weekly if you wish. My guy Cube doesn’t roll like that, and he’s whiny about it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ice Cube still very mad about that movie he lost because he wouldn't get the COVID vaccine
> 
> 
> Cube is still upset about missing a $9 million paycheck for Jack Black's Oh Hell No because he refused to be vaccinated
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.avclub.com



His right not to get it, their right not to hire him as a result. Everyone exercised their rights and he's out $9 million, cry me a river.


----------



## fischersd

I just don't understand the companies shuffling to now allow back the people that refused to be vaccinated.  These are the people we want working there?!?!  *sigh*


----------



## Edd

fischersd said:


> I just don't understand the companies shuffling to now allow back the people that refused to be vaccinated.  These are the people we want working there?!?!  *sigh*






Eric said:


> His right not to get it, their right not to hire him as a result. Everyone exercised their rights and he's out $9 million, cry me a river.




When you read what he says, he’s just speaking about how it affects *him*. *He *“didn’t need it”. He’s not taking that additional step to be concerned for other people. I love that they yanked the offer. Fuck him, truly.


----------



## lizkat

fischersd said:


> I just don't understand the companies shuffling to now allow back the people that refused to be vaccinated.  These are the people we want working there?!?!  *sigh*




It's quite problematic.  Studies are still being done (and reviewed)  to determine whether serial re-infections by Covid variants do heighten the risk of ending up with "long Covid."

And we don't even have a great handle yet on scope and remediation of long Covid.   We have to hope that ongoing work on vaccines can further reduce potential breakthrough by new variants.

One pretty robust study of reinfection effects that is under review does have some caveats attached, e.g. it involved military vets, and that population trends older and so possibly with some health issues atypical of general population.   Still it should give pause to companies deciding to hire unvaccinated individuals who could serve as vectors of re-infection, even to vaccinated co-workers or customers.









						Each COVID-19 Reinfection Increases Health Risks
					

Researchers report a cumulative effect in a pre-print study looking at health effects of coronavirus reinfections.




					www.webmd.com


----------



## Eric

Edd said:


> When you read what he says, he’s just speaking about how it affects *him*. *He *“didn’t need it”. He’s not taking that additional step to be concerned for other people. I love that they yanked the offer. Fuck him, truly.



There are two really different groups, those who think of others and those who simply couldn't care less about anyone other than themselves. If nothing else we've learned who those people are.


----------



## Pumbaa

> In the interview the parents say their baby has severe pulmonary valve stenosis, and that he needs surgery “almost immediately”, but that they are “extremely concerned with the blood [the doctors] are going to use”.
> 
> “We don’t want blood that is tainted by vaccination,” the father said. “That’s the end of the deal – we are fine with anything else these doctors want to do.”




Covid-19 vaccine bigly bad.









						Parents refuse use of vaccinated blood in life-saving surgery on baby
					

New Zealand’s health services go to court over guardianship of four-month-old boy whose parents have not let heart operation go ahead




					www.theguardian.com


----------



## SuperMatt

Pumbaa said:


> Covid-19 vaccine bigly bad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Parents refuse use of vaccinated blood in life-saving surgery on baby
> 
> 
> New Zealand’s health services go to court over guardianship of four-month-old boy whose parents have not let heart operation go ahead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com



Were they also outraged at the surgeons for wearing masks?


----------



## Yoused

some people do get their just desserts









						Homeopath who made thousands on bogus COVID pellets gets nearly 3 years in prison
					

Before sentencing, Juli Mazi claimed she had "sovereign immunity."




					arstechnica.com
				




too bad it took so long


----------



## fooferdoggie

Pumbaa said:


> Covid-19 vaccine bigly bad.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Parents refuse use of vaccinated blood in life-saving surgery on baby
> 
> 
> New Zealand’s health services go to court over guardianship of four-month-old boy whose parents have not let heart operation go ahead
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theguardian.com



too stupid to be parents.


----------



## Eric

Not going to disrespect her but it's almost infuriating that people are choosing death over prevention.


Only 46 years old from
      LeopardsAteMyFace


----------



## Yoused

She was apparently an outspoken member of a group that is actively trying to make everyone worse off than they were. I shall treat her consummation with peak indifference.


----------



## Yoused

Eric said:


> Not going to disrespect her but it's almost infuriating that people are choosing death over prevention.
> 
> 
> Only 46 years old from
> LeopardsAteMyFace




Curiously, a search turns up her name on a story about her demise dated January 5.


----------



## fooferdoggie

of course they are on fox begging someone to help them save their daughter. I mean they can save her but choose not to. they claim they did not know she would need to be vaccinated. come on now way too many cases were in the news over the last three years. They still chose to believe the crap about the vaccination and think its actually worse they dying I guess. 
Teen denied kidney transplant because she's not vaccinated for COVID, say parents​


			Teen denied kidney transplant because she's not vaccinated for COVID, say parents


----------



## AG_PhamD

Well, after 3 years of both my wife and I working in the healthcare environment, vaccination dose 1,  dose 2, booster, bivalent vaccine, etc our luck has finally run out. This past weekend we both tested positive for COVID. It was bound to happen sooner or later.

My symptoms are fairly mild. I didn’t feel great Friday night, took a test, tested negative. Saturday I pretty much slept all day- awful headache, body aches, and sore throat. Sunday morning similar symptoms so I took another test which came back positive knowing the rapid tests don’t sways register immediately. Generally I’ve just had a mild sore throat and a splitting headache which is well managed with ibuprofen. I had some congestion this morning but feel fine now.

My wife developed symptoms Saturday morning. Her symptoms have been worse than mine- days in bed, fever, cough, sinus congestion, etc but things seem to be improving for the two of us. It was nice that many of our friends and family members have sent us care packages.

The most frustrating part of this is that this week is Hanukkah, so most of our plans have been cancelled. We had a bunch of Hanukkah and Christmas parties scheduled. We obviously don’t want to risk infecting our family and friends... there’s always next year. We also had scheduled much of this week off which sucks. Hopefully we’ll be able to catch the tail end of the holidays next week. We’ll have our own party together at home alone I suppose.

I have always said if I catch COVID, it will be at the most in opportune time. That’s just how my life works. I suppose my prediction was right.

Hope everyone (and your families) have a safe, happy, and healthy holiday season!


----------



## Roller

AG_PhamD said:


> Well, after 3 years of both my wife and I working in the healthcare environment, vaccination dose 1,  dose 2, booster, bivalent vaccine, etc our luck has finally run out. This past weekend we both tested positive for COVID. It was bound to happen sooner or later.
> 
> My symptoms are fairly mild. I didn’t feel great Friday night, took a test, tested negative. Saturday I pretty much slept all day- awful headache, body aches, and sore throat. Sunday morning similar symptoms so I took another test which came back positive knowing the rapid tests don’t sways register immediately. Generally I’ve just had a mild sore throat and a splitting headache which is well managed with ibuprofen. I had some congestion this morning but feel fine now.
> 
> My wife developed symptoms Saturday morning. Her symptoms have been worse than mine- days in bed, fever, cough, sinus congestion, etc but things seem to be improving for the two of us. It was nice that many of our friends and family members have sent us care packages.
> 
> The most frustrating part of this is that this week is Hanukkah, so most of our plans have been cancelled. We had a bunch of Hanukkah and Christmas parties scheduled. We obviously don’t want to risk infecting our family and friends... there’s always next year. We also had scheduled much of this week off which sucks. Hopefully we’ll be able to catch the tail end of the holidays next week. We’ll have our own party together at home alone I suppose.
> 
> I have always said if I catch COVID, it will be at the most in opportune time. That’s just how my life works. I suppose my prediction was right.
> 
> Hope everyone (and your families) have a safe, happy, and healthy holiday season!



Wishing both of you a speedy recovery and no lingering issues. I know some people say everyone will be infected anyway, so it’s not worth taking precautions, but the fewer the number of episodes, the better. It’s infuriating that this country isn’t spending billions on nasal or pan-coronavirus vaccines. Take care.


----------



## Eric

AG_PhamD said:


> Well, after 3 years of both my wife and I working in the healthcare environment, vaccination dose 1,  dose 2, booster, bivalent vaccine, etc our luck has finally run out. This past weekend we both tested positive for COVID. It was bound to happen sooner or later.
> 
> My symptoms are fairly mild. I didn’t feel great Friday night, took a test, tested negative. Saturday I pretty much slept all day- awful headache, body aches, and sore throat. Sunday morning similar symptoms so I took another test which came back positive knowing the rapid tests don’t sways register immediately. Generally I’ve just had a mild sore throat and a splitting headache which is well managed with ibuprofen. I had some congestion this morning but feel fine now.
> 
> My wife developed symptoms Saturday morning. Her symptoms have been worse than mine- days in bed, fever, cough, sinus congestion, etc but things seem to be improving for the two of us. It was nice that many of our friends and family members have sent us care packages.
> 
> The most frustrating part of this is that this week is Hanukkah, so most of our plans have been cancelled. We had a bunch of Hanukkah and Christmas parties scheduled. We obviously don’t want to risk infecting our family and friends... there’s always next year. We also had scheduled much of this week off which sucks. Hopefully we’ll be able to catch the tail end of the holidays next week. We’ll have our own party together at home alone I suppose.
> 
> I have always said if I catch COVID, it will be at the most in opportune time. That’s just how my life works. I suppose my prediction was right.
> 
> Hope everyone (and your families) have a safe, happy, and healthy holiday season!



Wow, sorry to hear that. Sounds like it's just a matter of time for most of us as much as we try to avoid it. At least you're vaccinated and boosted, hopefully your symptoms will be mild and won't last. Thought are with you and your wife.


----------



## AG_PhamD

Roller said:


> Wishing both of you a speedy recovery and no lingering issues. I know some people say everyone will be infected anyway, so it’s not worth taking precautions, but the fewer the number of episodes, the better. It’s infuriating that this country isn’t spending billions on nasal or pan-coronavirus vaccines. Take care.





Eric said:


> Wow, sorry to hear that. Sounds like it's just a matter of time for most of us as much as we try to avoid it. At least you're vaccinated and boosted, hopefully your symptoms will be mild and won't last. Thought are with you and your wife.




Thanks! I appreciate the well wishes.

I’m just surprised it’s taken so long to catch this given we both work in healthcare with direct patient contact. Literally I know of like 1 co-worker now who has not been infected. My side-business is a residential program with ~25 patients (they are free to come and go during the day to jobs, school, etc) went over 2 years without a COVID outbreak which is miraculous as far as I’m concerned. Outbreak meaning having spread between the patients and/or staff. 

It’s definitely worth taking precautions, especially if you’re at risk for complications, especially now that numbers seem to be increasing. Unfortunately, I don’t think many of the current stats reflect the actual situation. Massachusetts went from reporting daily to weekly some time ago, which is fine when there’s hardly any cases. It’s been clear numbers over the past month (Thanksgiving time, not surprisingly), but since most people have milder cases now and are using home kits, the cases are not being reported like there were before.

I’m also concerned because China went from a state of home-arrest to far fewer restrictions, plus their insistence to use vaccines with poor effectiveness, will create an explosion of cases that may lead new variants. I think a lot of the science now suggests that lockdowns tend to only delay the inevitable and create a lot of externalities. But if you can have a comprehensive testing program, get people to quarantine who are infected, you can at least slow the rate of spread to something reasonably controllable for the healthcare system. And vaccinations of course at the very least minimize severity of cases. 

People are working on pan-coronavirus vaccines, it’s just a lot easier said than done and may not really be possible with the technology we have. We’ve had vaccines/inoculations for centuries but still haven’t managed vaccines to work against all strains of the common cold viruses or the flu. And while mRNA vaccines have revolutionized the development time of vaccines, we can only speed up clinical trials so much. Maybe someday we’ll get to a point where mRNA COVID vaccines can be updated without the requirement for full scale trials.


----------

