# Trump aide Hope Hicks has Covid - Update Trump Tests Positive



## Alli

How can anyone still believe in god or a just world.


----------



## fooferdoggie

I don't like to say it but if anyone deserve covid its trump. he needs to get super sick with a really slow recovery. though I doubt it would beat anything into his head.


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## Eric

It's so risky for both of them but Trump is just careless. He should be in self quarantine right now but we know he won't.


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## Renzatic

fooferdoggie said:


> I don't like to say it but if anyone deserve covid its trump. he needs to get super sick with a really slow recovery. though I doubt it would beat anything into his head.




I hope to god he doesn't have it. If he does, and he dies from it, the Republicans will blame Obama, and there will be even more chaos in the streets.


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## fooferdoggie

wholy crap he says he is going to quarantine I bet it lasts more then a day or so.


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## Eric

I would never wish him harm but if it shut him up for a week or two that would be alright by me.


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## Renzatic

ericgtr12 said:


> I would never wish him harm but if it shut him up for a week or two that would be alright by me.




He's in his 70's, overweight, and likely has a few underlying conditions. If he gets it, it'll more than likely be a death sentence for him.

Better hope he doesn't get it at all.


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## fooferdoggie

ericgtr12 said:


> I would never wish him harm but if it shut him up for a week or two that would be alright by me.



it would truly be an act of god.


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## Renzatic

fooferdoggie said:


> it would truly be an act of god.




At the very least, you could say he was hoisted by his own petard.


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## Eric

Renzatic said:


> He's in his 70's, overweight, and likely has a few underlying conditions. If he gets it, it'll more than likely be a death sentence for him.
> 
> *Better hope he doesn't get it at all.*



I'll go with that, wouldn't wish it on anyone. I want the guy out of office but by getting his ass kicked at the ballot box, not a virus.


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## Renzatic

ericgtr12 said:


> I'll go with that, wouldn't wish it on anyone. I want the guy out of office but by getting his ass kicked at the ballot box, not a virus.




Yeah. Wishing death upon anyone is a shitty thing to do, even for someone as slimy and unscrupulous as Trump. If he's to lose this November, let him lose as cleanly and honestly as possible.

And for a more coldly pragmatic take, it's not something you want to have happen, because imagine how his fanbase, as predisposed to believing in wild conspiracies and fantasies as they are, would take the news of his death. The fallout would be terrible.


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## fooferdoggie

don't want him to die just suffer a lot then get well. death would be too easy.


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## Eric

Trump just tested positive.


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## Eric

Thomas, I just updated your title.

Hope they have a plan in place for this, also who knows how long he's had it now. Biden and everyone at the debates could also be exposed now as well.


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## User.45

Trump has COVID:


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## Eric

As I mentioned in another thread, I'm not going to wish harm on him but can't help think that if they had all practiced CDC guidelines this could've been avoided. That said let's hope for a full recovery here so we can get this election over with.


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## Renzatic

It makes me wonder what would happen if Biden did catch it from Trump, and they both ended up dying. What would we do in that situation, elect the vice presidents?


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## User.45

ericgtr12 said:


> As I mentioned in another thread, I'm not going to wish harm on him but can't help think that if they had all practiced CDC guidelines this could've been avoided. That said let's hope for a full recovery here so we can get this election over with.



Agree, but there's a huge bag of karma in this.


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## Mark

i hope he has a real rough time.
i hope he has to go undergo life support in hospital.
i hope he has lingering complications.
i hope that evangelicals view this as god's punishment.
i hope that he takes hydroxy for it.

i hope the people all around him that he gave it to recover quickly.

i hope he stayed clear of Biden at the debate.


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## Renzatic

niji said:


> i hope he has a real rough time.
> i hope he has to go undergo life support in hospital.
> i hope he has lingering complications.
> i hope that evangelicals view this as god's punishment.
> i hope all around him that he gave it to recover quickly.
> 
> i hope that he takes hydroxy for it.
> 
> i hope he stayed clear of Biden at the debate.




He might.
He could.
He may.
They won't.
They might.

I expect him to claim he did if he recovers.

They probably shook hands at some point that night.

Listen, people. No matter what you think of Trump, his testing positive for Covid is anything but good news. I don't think you all realize just how rife with peril our current situation is, how close to the edge we're teetering. If Trump ends up incapacitated, or, god forbid, dies, it could be the one thing that tips us over completely. 

This is objectively bad news.


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## chagla

If it's true, I wish him (and everyone else on earth who caught it) a speedy recovery. Now, remember, republicans are quite shrewd, they've got their dirty playbooks. I don't see democrats stooping so low but republican motto is win at any cost. So, could this really be a "fake news" to avoid further debates, create a political crisis to delay election, cling on to power one way or another?


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## Thomas Veil

Thank you, @ericgtr12, for updating the thread title.



Renzatic said:


> ...They probably shook hands at some point that night.
> 
> Listen, people. No matter what you think of Trump, his testing positive for Covid is anything but good news. I don't think you all realize just how rife with peril our current situation is, how close to the edge we're teetering. If Trump ends up incapacitated, or, god forbid, dies, it could be the one thing that tips us over completely.
> 
> This is objectively bad news.




According to various news sites, they didn't shake hands...although I now worry for Biden since they were standing on that stage for 90 minutes together. Especially with Trump shouting half the time.

I'm not worried--yet--about his followers having conspiracy theories or an uprising, although I do think based on statistics I've seen there's a 1 in 3 chance Trump dies. Ironically if Trump is seriously incapacitated they will have to finally invoke the 25th amendment, making Pence "temporary president".

There are so many ways this could go, election-wise. On the surface it seems like it would help Biden's chances, but on the other hand if Biden voters get lazy about those chances and start staying home then of course we get the opposite and Pence could potentially be president for the next four years.


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## Edd

This is quite a list of people who’ve recently traveled with Hicks.


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## Thomas Veil

Well, here's what we should be looking for:



> If Trump was first exposed to the virus on Wednesday, it is still very early for him to begin exhibiting symptoms. Most people who are symptomatic begin to feel sick within 11 and a half days, according to the CDC. In rare cases it can take even longer.
> 
> For the 60% of people infected who do develop symptoms, they can experience fever, cough, shortness of breath, fatigue, body aches, headache, loss of taste or smell, sore throat, runny nose, nausea or vomiting and diarrhea.





> Because of his age and obesity, Trump is in two very high-risk groups for developing severe COVID-19 disease, hospitalization and death.
> 
> At 74, the president is five times more likely to be hospitalized and 90 times more likely to die of COVID-19 than someone between the ages of 18 and 29, according to the CDC.


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## JayMysteri0

Edd70 said:


> This is quite a list of people who’ve recently traveled with Hicks.
> 
> View attachment 615



Not to be "THAT guy", but...

That looks awfully like a 'wish list' for America, covid wise.

Also, if 45 has it, does that mean China got the president, once again showing how they keep getting over on him?

Or NOW that he has it, it's covid - 19 a dangerous virus ANYONE can get?


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## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Well, here's what we should be looking for:



THese numbers are largely meaningless, because these stats are a moving target.

Trump is 74, is obese, and I've never seen anybody with his body habitus without hypertension at that age. 
In contrast we now have dexamethasone, remdesivir, he might even get some sexy convalescent plasma, and lot of TLC.
He's not going to be able to do a debate, but he'll be fine otherwise. I just hope this will lead to some kind of a Johnsonian paradigm shift for him.


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## User.45

Edd70 said:


> This is quite a list of people who’ve recently traveled with Hicks.
> 
> View attachment 615



Given the warm and loving relationship between Melania and Trump, if Melania got it there are gonna be a good number of people going down on with COVID on this list. I'd be shocked if McEnany were negative.


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## Eric

PearsonX said:


> Agree, but there's a huge bag of karma in this.



Merging these threads and sticking it.


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## DT

I saw AG posted:



> Inevitably people will get hysteric since he’s overweight and 73 so he might die... that’s very unlikely. His calculated risk based on what I know of his health conditions, BMI (which is just boardering on overweight to obese) [...]




If he's 6'-3" and 240-ish lbs I must be 170 ... seriously, I've seen quite a few pics of people in the 6-2/6-3 at 240-250 area from various workout/health/progress sites (not to mention people I know personally), and he's at least 260, or he's about 6'-0.

I think his weight is a touch more concerning, I mean, it's not like 10-15 lbs is some kind of live / die tipping point.


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## fooferdoggie

Now the question is is he lying about it?


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## Edd

fooferdoggie said:


> Now the question is is he lying about it?



That always seems to be the question with him.


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## User.45

DT said:


> I saw AG posted:
> 
> 
> 
> If he's 6'-3" and 240-ish lbs I must be 170 ... seriously, I've seen quite a few pics of people in the 6-2/6-3 at 240-250 area from various workout/health/progress sites (not to mention people I know personally), and he's at least 260, or he's about 6'-0.
> 
> I think his weight is a touch more concerning, I mean, it's not like 10-15 lbs is some kind of live / die tipping point.



He's obese. Fair and rotund.

I'm 6-3, 215 LBS and he's at least 2x my width.


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## Alli




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## Alli

I was pleased to hear that Hicks is symptomatic. I know that sounds rough, but they don’t take it seriously otherwise. If it’s less than a flu, big deal if everyone gets it.

I don’t believe Trump has it. Of course, if he does it definitely proves that hydroxychloriquine does not work as a prophylactic.


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## DT

fooferdoggie said:


> Now the question is is he lying about it?




I look at these two ways:

Likelihood of him contracting it

- moderately high risk
- rarely wears mask
- attends densely populated rallies, NCs, engages with people also not wearing masks
- has various staffers/aides who have contracted it, moving in/around/through the WH, on AFOne

vs.

His campaign status

- crashing and burning
- debate tactic backfired, likely does not want to attend another
- could provide a way for his frail ego to lose, i.e., due to something out of his control / aka China
- could provide a way to postpone the election

So while I think it's not that unlikely he might've contracted it, I think there's also - at least in trump-logic - reasons he would lie about it

Hell, maybe it's both, i.e., he really does have it, and he's glad is gives him an excuse (even more nutty, maybe he's been reckless lately on purpose ...   )


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## DT

Speaking of my post above, I saw an MR nutter actually said, "I hope he dies so I don't have to vote for him". Wow, you hate him that much, but still won't go Dem, or at the very least, Indie?  That's INSANE.

Oh yeah, also, f*** the right wing pearl clutchers on MR who were bagging on Hilarybeing ill, posting "pedo" memes about Biden, who are now "disgusted" at the comments about trump.


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## JayMysteri0

DT said:


> I saw AG posted:
> 
> 
> 
> If he's 6'-3" and 240-ish lbs I must be 170 ... seriously, I've seen quite a few pics of people in the 6-2/6-3 at 240-250 area from various workout/health/progress sites (not to mention people I know personally), and he's at least 260, or he's about 6'-0.
> 
> I think his weight is a touch more concerning, I mean, it's not like 10-15 lbs is some kind of live / die tipping point.



Aren't we also over looking the suspicions that he had some kind of mini strokes, which account for all the strange recent body tics people keep observing?   Doesn't that make him a greater health risk?


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## User.45

Alli said:


> View attachment 618





Alli said:


> I was pleased to hear that Hicks is symptomatic. I know that sounds rough, but they don’t take it seriously otherwise. If it’s less than a flu, big deal if everyone gets it.
> 
> I don’t believe Trump has it. Of course, if he does it definitely proves that hydroxychloriquine does not work as a prophylactic.



THere's no reason for him to pretend having it. Unless he knows he's going to lose and this is already part of saving face. Unlikely. 



DT said:


> Speaking of my post above, I saw an MR nutter actually said, "I hope he dies so I don't have to vote for him". Wow, you hate him that much, but still won't go Dem, or at the very least, Indie?  That's INSANE.
> 
> Oh yeah, also, f*** the right wing pearl clutchers on MR who were bagging on Hilarybeing ill, posting "pedo" memes about Biden, who are now "disgusted" at the comments about trump.



Tshrimp is now lecturing people on being humane and civil
2020, what a fucked up year you are!


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## JayMysteri0

PearsonX said:


> THere's no reason for him to pretend having it. Unless he knows he's going to lose and this is already part of saving face. Unlikely.
> 
> 
> Tshrimp is now lecturing people on being humane and civil
> 2020, what a fucked up year you are!



The 'compassionate conservative' always comes out of that crowd, if they feel THEY aren't getting that compassion.

Otherwise it's doubling down on 'tough love', and "they knew what they were getting into".

And the favorite for the pseudo tough guys, "win stupid prizes for playing stupid games".


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## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> The 'compassionate conservative' always comes out of that crowd, if they feel THEY aren't getting that compassion.
> 
> Otherwise it's doubling down on 'tough love', and "they knew what they were getting into".
> 
> And the favorite for the pseudo tough guys, "win stupid prizes for playing stupid games".



Personal responsibilitah!!!!!!$!$!!!!


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## Eric

PearsonX said:


> THere's no reason for him to pretend having it. Unless he knows he's going to lose and this is already part of saving face. Unlikely.
> 
> 
> Tshrimp is now lecturing people on being humane and civil
> 2020, what a fucked up year you are!



It didn't take long for decorum to take a nosedive. No matter how this plays out, it will be divisive on his end while his supporters will expect everyone else to show class.


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## rdrr

"It is what it is."


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## Eric

And now there's this, likely he knew and knowingly put others at risk. What a shame.









						The White House Knew Trump Had Likely Been Exposed to the Virus. He Traveled and Held Events Anyway.
					

The utter carelessness of it all is staggering.




					slate.com


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## DT

PearsonX said:


> Tshrimp is now lecturing people on being humane and civil




At least he chose a name that conveys his intellectual prowess ... and likely other things.


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## DT

JayMysteri0 said:


> Aren't we also over looking the suspicions that he had some kind of mini strokes, which account for all the strange recent body tics people keep observing?   Doesn't that make him a greater health risk?




Yeah, I realize he will have the best medical response on the planet, but I think his current health situation is a little more than, "He's 73 and a few pounds overweight ..."


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## Alli

They are saying he’s reporting mild symptoms, but it’s early.

#ThoughtsAndPrayers


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## JayMysteri0

I realize how tasteless it sounds, but looking at the faux concern reaches for moral superiority...

All I can think of is how much this seems like this same crowd be getting on me if cheered when Hitler shot himself.

"This is a time we as a community need to think about mental health & gun control!"

No!  Remember it's this guy...


> Trump says he's not afraid of contracting coronavirus at his rallies but doesn't mention supporters' risk
> 
> 
> ‘The president appears to have forgotten that this country is still in the middle of a global pandemic,' says governor Steve Sisolak
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.independent.co.uk




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312037306556190721/

Remember kids, when the shit hits the floor, to have compassion for the asshole that produced it.


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## chagla

I'm skeptical. I think it's a ploy. He wants to emerge as a hero and claim that it's nothing, exactly like he's been claiming.


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## JayMysteri0

Twitter is savage.  They've got you covered if you think it's a ploy, just use this...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312061649189306368/


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## Renzatic

Alli said:


> I don’t believe Trump has it. Of course, if he does it definitely proves that hydroxychloriquine does not work as a prophylactic.



I wouldn't put it past him to attempt faking getting sick as a ploy to garner some positive attention his way during the election, but it'd be INCREDIBLY difficult for him to pull off.

I'm about 90% sure he's got it.


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## Eric

chagla said:


> I'm skeptical. I think it's a ploy. He wants to emerge as a hero and claim that it's nothing, exactly like he's been claiming.



A good buddy called me this morning to tell me the same thing, he's been watching a lot of Maddow lately. Personally, I have no reason to doubt it as he's constantly out there with no protection and those who surround him are afraid to wear masks either as they don't want to offend him. This could have reached deep into the WH unfortunately.


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## User.45

ericgtr12 said:


> A good buddy called me this morning to tell me the same thing, he's been watching a lot of Maddow lately. Personally, I have no reason to doubt it as he's constantly out there with no protection and those who surround him are afraid to wear masks either as they don't want to offend him. This could have reached deep into the WH unfortunately.



Faking COVID has no strategic advantage for him in my opinion. There's no objective evidence that he had "mini strokes", and the only tangible data we have about his health is that he's 73 and he is obese. With those usually come with hypertension and my fixation on his asymmetric pupils may give a slight hint that he doesn't have the greatest small vessel health, but to make such statements, we would need a lot more data.

So best is to assume, that he is just an old fat guy with a severe case of DSM-V cluster B personality disorders.

Coronaviruses are cold viruses for a reason. They are much more virulent when its cold. So my suspicion is that he met a lot of people in settings that were working OK during the hot summer, but the same (very lax) precautions immediately failed after he and his team visited some colder states.

What makes me smile is the claim he has mild COVID. Pre-dexamethasone, symptoms tended to peak 7-10d after diagnosis, so current reporting on his symptoms are irrelevant. BUT, this takes us to one important issue: he'll have hell of a difficult time to get out there and regain some ground for this time period. He didn't develop a remote campaigning strategy, and he lives off the energy of his supporters. So this is a truly major hit for Trump. 

+ If 10-20% of his core team gets out of commission for the same time period, that is also a major hit for him.


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## JayMysteri0

A very good point...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1311994002955173898/


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## JayMysteri0

...And your WINNAH!!!!!
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312052668857225216/


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## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312070920010428416/


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## Eric

Glad to hear Biden has avoided it so far but there's still a good chance that Trump infected the entire room because he couldn't keep him from spewing high velocity particulates out of his blowhole through the air the entire time.


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## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> ...And your WINNAH!!!!!
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312052668857225216/








"Both sides are bad."


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## User.45

The more I think about it the more I think what may have happened, is that the Trump bunch were tested daily, but Hicks might have had a false negative test and slipped through the defenses.


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## Eric

PearsonX said:


> The more I think about it the more I think what may have happened, is that the Trump bunch were tested daily, but Hicks might have had a false negative test and slipped through the defenses.



It sounds like their contact tracing is in full swing, will be interesting to hear the results. Everyone in the west wing is freaking out right now, it's almost as if they could've worn masks for some peace of mind.


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## JayMysteri0

How every _offended_ "compassionate conservative" sees any democrat that showed concern for the president.  Then the president has shown for covid victims...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312024079562571776/


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## Chew Toy McCoy

I pretty much have zero sympathy for Trump, but in Trump world there’s always something lower than rock bottom. I have less than zero sympathy for the people who attended his fundraiser last night who then found out today that Trump knew he was exposed before the fundraiser and decided to do it anyway. Why anybody would still give this clown money is beyond me, but this is truly a case where you get what you paid for. Enjoy your secret raffle prize.

I can almost guarantee the only reason they were there was either because of the (R) or because they play both sides. Either way, lol at them.


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## Eric

This is just breaking, they must think it's bad enough to warrant this.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312127070793678850/


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## JayMysteri0

Wait, WTF guy?!!
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312121190597586944/


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## DT

ericgtr12 said:


> This is just breaking, they must think it's bad enough to warrant this.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312127070793678850/




I'm reading some things that do not sound good.  Wow.


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## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> How every _offended_ "compassionate conservative" sees any democrat that showed concern for the president.  Then the president has shown for covid victims...
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312024079562571776/




Projection is tough (like when Trump was told that Alec Baldwin was arrested.
Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I thought conservatives liked bras?


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> Wait, WTF guy?!!
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312121190597586944/



An honor system takes, well....honor.


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## Eric

Must be getting serious, just now breaking...









						President Trump hospitalized at Walter Reed after testing positive for COVID-19
					

White House physician Dr. Sean Conley said President Donald Trump is “fatigued” but in “good spirits” after contracting coronavirus.



					www.usatoday.com


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## User.45

ericgtr12 said:


> Must be getting serious, just now breaking...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> President Trump hospitalized at Walter Reed after testing positive for COVID-19
> 
> 
> White House physician Dr. Sean Conley said President Donald Trump is “fatigued” but in “good spirits” after contracting coronavirus.
> 
> 
> 
> www.usatoday.com



The WH tries to sell this as something routine for monitoring. 
I was thinking about what I'd do if I were the white house physician besides shitting my pants.
Given the volatility of the situation and the closeness of Walter Reed, and the fact that they can give infusions in the WH, 
I'd say he has to have at least 1 poorly controlled symptom for such move. Let it be fever, shortness of breath. Or some worrisome lab values. 
The WH may have an overcautious protocol for this. But I can't think of another justification.


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## Thomas Veil

ericgtr12 said:


> Glad to hear Biden has avoided it so far but there's still a good chance that Trump infected the entire room because he couldn't keep him from spewing high velocity particulates out of his blowhole through the air the entire time.



Yeah, I worry about that because even though they were fairly far apart, Trump's mouth was in full fire hose mode. Who knows how far those particles could have traveled?



JayMysteri0 said:


> Wait, WTF guy?!!
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312121190597586944/



That is rich. They trusted the world's biggest liar with the _honor system??_


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

ericgtr12 said:


> Must be getting serious, just now breaking...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> President Trump hospitalized at Walter Reed after testing positive for COVID-19
> 
> 
> White House physician Dr. Sean Conley said President Donald Trump is “fatigued” but in “good spirits” after contracting coronavirus.
> 
> 
> 
> www.usatoday.com



When did they rename the Kremlin Walter Reed?


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## Eric

He didn't make an appearance, they snuck him on the Marine One.


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## Mark

its becoming apparent that real doctors, not fake doctors, are taking care of him.

the quack in NYC (he will be the fittest president evah)  and ronnie (he's got great genes) were truly corrupt.

but since the recent news that he's at walter reid and that he is on some experimental drugs, its clear that *we* can rely on some believable updates over the coming days - with a little bit of salt knowing that for security reasons any real bad news would be softened.

i do think there will be a pro-covid-trump boost among some (any left?) on the fence voters.


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## lizkat

Alli said:


> View attachment 618




That must be making the rounds, one of my bros who only has facebook emailed me that awhile ago..


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## SuperMatt

It has to be somewhat serious if they’ve taken him to Walter Reed.  I don‘t expect imminent death, but I think we saw the one and only debate.


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## lizkat

niji said:


> i do think there will be a pro-covid-trump boost among some (any left?) on the fence voters.




I dunno, I think it's possible the turnout will end up deflated all around.

People are starting to think wtf you can't even make this shit up so gimme the remote and let's find something better to watch.

If that's true I hope a lotta Dems requested mail-in ballots even if they figured they might take them to the polling station,  At least it's not that much effort to walk them to the mail slot in the lobby or the roadside box for pickup,.


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## lizkat

SuperMatt said:


> It has to be somewhat serious if they’ve taken him to Walter Reed.  I don‘t expect imminent death, but I think we saw the one and only debate.




Maybe something in Trump's memory of all that laying on of hands by his crew of fairly compromised evangelical clergy for the past four years will cause him to get right with the God of his vague recollections.  I'm assuming there's actually something wrong with him.


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## Renzatic

lizkat said:


> Maybe something in Trump's memory of all that laying on of hands by his crew of fairly compromised evangelical clergy for the past four years will cause him to get right with the God of his vague recollections.  I'm assuming there's actually something wrong with him.




I dunno what that guy's problem is. If I woke up with a tail, I'd think it was the greatest day of my life.


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## lizkat

Renzatic said:


> I dunno what that guy's problem is. If I woke up with a tail, I'd think it was the greatest day of my life.




Could probably convert its existence to some cash at the very least with a few banners outside town and a colorful little cage on a platform...

Who knows what the White House staff and campaign crews will be waking up with in the next 10 days or so.   Lotta second guessing of their deep loyalty to the boss who scoffs at masks?   His health costs are covered but some of their coverage might be pretty sketchy.  Anyway this quote from a Politico piece cited below it pretty much says it all.



> “I wish I could tell you they have this good protocol that’s been in play for months, but it seems to ramp up and down with whatever’s going on politically,” said a person familiar with the White House approach to Covid-19 safety measures.












						Confusion, concern infiltrate White House as Trump heads to hospital
					

Trump's public silence after announcing he had coronavirus left some staffers fretting. By Friday afternoon, Trump was moved to the hospital.




					www.politico.com


----------



## Scepticalscribe

I think the the test to apply here is the Twitter Test: If Mr Trump continues to communicate to the world via Twitter, the tone authentically intemperate and laced with ample abuse of capital letters to emphasise his point, we can conclude that his brush with Covid-19 is unlikely to impair his health.

If, however, radio - or Twitter - silence occurs, I think we may conclude that his illness may be actually quite serious.


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## Mark

the medical care he is getting VS the lies he spread to the american public is on parade:

1  early and frequent testing/diagnosis of COVID saves many (most?) lives

2  early usage of Regeneron during the 1st few days after contracting decreases mortality rate across all age groups

the combination of the above early diagnosis and early treatment (with a vaccination that has been available for  3 to 4 months) means that many lives could have been saved.

americans still needing days for test results shall never be forgotten.

he deserves the fate waiting for him in Dante's most inner circle of hell.


----------



## lizkat

One week ago tomorrow there was this big event outside the WH with invited guests for the announcement of Barrett's nomination, remember?

Look ma who's afraid of covid-19?   Jeeeeeez.    I see masks on only a couple of White House or military aides. And that guy getting all hands-on with Senator Lee and his wife and then wiping his nose..   ok then...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312070451535978510/


----------



## Scepticalscribe

I'm reading reports in the Guardian that suggest that this - the condition he - Mr Trump - has contracted - is worse than reported (for all of the reasons that @PearsonX has mentioned) and that the transport to hospital is more than merely "precautionary", but also, worse and characteristically nasty and selfish, that firstly, Mr Biden had to learn that Mr Trump had contracted Covid from the news, (rather than receiving the courtesy of a communication or warning, or suggestion, to get tested as he may have become infected), and secondly, that Mr Trump may already have been infected on Tuesday, may have known that this was the case, prior to the debate, and declined to appraise anyone of this, thereby possibly placing them at risk of infection.

If true, while I am sorry that he is ill (I'd rather see him on trial, convicted, and behind bars), this is characteristically disgraceful and disgusting behaviour.


----------



## Eric

Scepticalscribe said:


> I'm reading reports in the Guardian that suggest that this - the condition he - Mr Trump - has contracted - is worse than reported (for all of the reasons that @PearsonX has mentioned) and that the transport to hospital is more than merely "precautionary", but also, worse and characteristically nasty and selfish, that firstly, Mr Biden had to learn that Mr Trump had contracted Covid from the news, (rather than receiving the courtesy of a communication or warning, or suggestion, to get tested as he may have become infected), and secondly, that Mr Trump may already have been infected on Tuesday, may have known that this was the case, prior to the debate, and declined to parade anyone of this, thereby possibly placing them at risk of infection.
> 
> If true, while I am sorry that he is ill (I'd rather see him on trial, convicted, and behind bars), this is characteristically disgraceful and disgusting behaviour.



Anyone who thinks Trump would not knowingly run around without a mask while knowing he has been exposed hasn't been paying attention for the last four years.


----------



## Thomas Veil

ericgtr12 said:


> He didn't make an appearance, they snuck him on the Marine One.




Under a white sheet?


----------



## Eric

Thomas Veil said:


> Under a white sheet?



Red hat, same thing.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

I thought I saw clips of him (fairly pale, rather than his more usual roseate and russet hue) walking to and disembarking from the helicopter, (albeit masked, as were those who accompanied him).

The really interesting contrast is with Mr Putin; earlier this week, I read a fascinating article on the truly extraordinary precautions he has taken since the advent of the corona virus; anyone who wishes to meet him must quarantine for a fortnight first (and that included the WW2 veterans in whose company he reviewed the May parade), and undergo an extraordinary battery of medical tests and be prepared to take a series of stipulated precautions.


----------



## Eric

Scepticalscribe said:


> I thought I saw clips of him (fairly pale, rather than his more usual roseate and russet hue) walking to and disembarking from the helicopter, (albeit masked, as were those who accompanied him).
> 
> The really interesting contrast is with Mr Putin; earlier this week, I read a fascinating article on the truly extraordinary precautions he has taken since the advent of the corona virus; anyone who wishes to meet him must quarantine for a fortnight first (and that included the WW2 veterans in whose company he reviewed the May parade), and undergo an extraordinary battery of medical tests and be prepared to take a series of stipulated precautions.



Yesterday, my wife said "why does he sound so hoarse? I wonder if he caught something", to which I replied, "he's campaigning every day honey, I'm sure it's nothing".

As usual, my wife was right.


----------



## lizkat

Jim Acosta of CNN tweeted that WH officials are quite concerned about Trump now and his symptoms are worse than those of the First Lady.  Per "sources" not further identified at the moment.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312172504148893698/


----------



## Scepticalscribe

lizkat said:


> Jim Acosta of CNN tweeted that WH officials are quite concerned about Trump now and his symptoms are worse than those of the First Lady.  Per "sources" not further identified at the moment.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312172504148893698/




I spotted that tweet. 

Another tweet that I have just read, also quoting "sources" said that this is "serious", that Mr Trump was "exhausted" and "very fatigued", and seems to have experienced some breathing difficulties.


----------



## Mark

Thomas Veil said:


> Under a white sheet?




@Thomas Veil , i think you must be awarded the PoliticalGroove Prize for Acerbic Wit.
Top Score.


----------



## lizkat

Scepticalscribe said:


> I spotted that tweet.
> 
> Another tweet that I have just read, also quoting "sources" said that this is "serious", that Mr Trump was "exhausted" and "very fatigued", and seems to have experienced some breathing difficulties.




Well from what I've read of people who have a substantial reaction to the illness, they're often surprised at how fast it comes on and how badly affected their respiratory capability is.

After all, most of us who are in generally good health (free of apparent major illness etc) might be used to discomforts of a cough with a cold or flu, but not to the point where just getting enough air into the lungs is perceived.  Of course that would be terrifying, and of course they don't want to have to take Trump into hospital later for a severe onset, or even for his reaction to the antibodies injection.   So it's good he's already located for optimum necessary treatment.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

And - again from what I have been reading - he also seems to have what is described as "a fever". that temperature increase that is one of the true symptoms of Covid-19.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

@lizkat: I edited my own post - which you had quoted; my spellcheck (and keyboard) are both causing issues; what I had thought I had written (and had intended to write) was "serious", but it was changed to "series".


----------



## lizkat

Thanks for the fix then...   I sure wasn't going to notice it or the fix, most likely!

[ I don't even see my own typos and repeat-worded goof-ups any more...  some of that is from slow DSL sometimes and a buffering issue from my fast but inaccurate typing,  but some of it's a keyboard cover on my laptop and some of it's multitasking with an iPhone and an iPad in play at the same time.    The alternative is letting Apple guesstimate what I was meaning to say.  sometimes I don't get where they pull their ideas from but my own typos are usually closer to the real mark.]​​----​​On some earlier wonderment about Trump going to Walter Reed:​​


ericgtr12 said:


> He didn't make an appearance, they snuck him on the Marine One.






Thomas Veil said:


> Under a white sheet?






ericgtr12 said:


> Red hat, same thing.




I saw somewhere on Twitter what happened is they released WH video shortly after but didn't want it to go out in real time.  Not sure what that was all about.  Security, whatever.


----------



## lizkat

Well this is gettin' real.. 

Some secret service guys anonymously leaking a few grievances

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312180888524865536/


----------



## JayMysteri0

If only this had been learned earlier
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312157176622768128/


----------



## lizkat

File under GOP / Fox chutzpah.  After nominating Barrett they want Dems to play nice bc Trump is sick.  If he hadn't nominated Barrett then half the people in that Rose Garden wouldn't be testing positive this week.    Senators Lee and Tillis have now both been diagnosed...   meanwhile Fox News wants Biden to fucking suspend his campaign for two weeks? 

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312186133640429573/


----------



## Edd

lizkat said:


> File under GOP / Fox chutzpah.  After nominating Barrett they want Dems to play nice bc Trump is sick.  If he hadn't nominated Barrett then half the people in that Rose Garden wouldn't be testing positive this week.    Senators Lee and Tillis have now both been diagnosed...   meanwhile Fox News wants Biden to fucking suspend his campaign for two weeks?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312186133640429573/



Hoo (fanning my face), the gall takes my breath away! Like it’s a board game and not for real stakes.


----------



## User.45

lizkat said:


> File under GOP / Fox chutzpah.  After nominating Barrett they want Dems to play nice bc Trump is sick.  If he hadn't nominated Barrett then half the people in that Rose Garden wouldn't be testing positive this week.    Senators Lee and Tillis have now both been diagnosed...   meanwhile Fox News wants Biden to fucking suspend his campaign for two weeks?
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312186133640429573/



Aha. If they await the election with the SCOTUS nomination


----------



## lizkat

PearsonX said:


> Aha. If they await the election with the SCOTUS nomination




They may have to let that slide to the lame duck session.   Lee and Tillis are on the judiciary committee and they both were at the nomination party and both have covid-19 now.


----------



## lizkat

Oh here we go.  Already necessary to call out crackpot Trump fans over "Deep State Military" concerns for Trump at Walter Reed?  gimme a damn break.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312201064188313602/​


----------



## Mark

PearsonX said:


> Aha. If they await the election with the SCOTUS nomination




i wonder if in the case a vp formally takes over as president, if he is still President the Senate? 

probably not...hmmm

(edited)


----------



## Alli

Scepticalscribe said:


> If true, while I am sorry that he is ill (I'd rather see him on trial, convicted, and behind bars), this is characteristically disgraceful and disgusting behaviour.



And this is why I want him to live through COVID. That and because he deserves to suffer along with the 7 million other Americans who have gone through it without the benefit of the medical care he’s receiving.


lizkat said:


> meanwhile Fox News wants Biden to fucking suspend his campaign for two weeks?



Biden has been doing it correctly from the beginning. He doesn’t need to suspend. They should be grateful the Biden campaign is suspending the negative ads.


PearsonX said:


> Aha. If they await the election with the SCOTUS nomination



Which they should do because of the next quote:


lizkat said:


> They may have to let that slide to the lame duck session.   Lee and Tillis are on the judiciary committee and they both were at the nomination party and both have covid-19 now.



McConnell has been adamant about votes being taken in person. Think he’ll change his tune now with only R’s home in quarantine?


----------



## fooferdoggie

looks like typhoid trump gave it to his best liar. and of course she has been running around without a mask.


----------



## lizkat

niji said:


> i wonder if in the case a vp formally takes over as president, if he is still President Pro Temp of the Senate.
> probably not...hmmm




The VP is the president of the Senate (although not a Senator).  

He is however NOT the Senate's president pro tempore guy, who actually IS also a Senator, and (since around the time of Truman) has been designated as the senator of the majority party with the most seniority. 

In line of succession to the presidency,  it goes like this
      vice president
      speaker of the house
      senate president pro tempore
      secretary of state
      secretary of treasury
      secretary of defense
      attorney general  (yeah, Barr)
      and on through rest of the cabinet officers  

 In the VP's absence for any reason,  the Senate's president pro tempore takes his place, e.g. to break a tie for instance. 

So there's already a senate president pro tempore, it's currently Senator Grassley, and the only weird thing about that is that he ends up actually double-voting if he must break a tie. 

That's because if there's a tie on the vote and the VP's absent and Grassley has to break it, they can't penalize Iowa his Senatorial vote just because Grassley has to put his pro temp prez hat on...  and if they did do that, then in subtracting his Senate vote to let him put on his other hat, suddenly there'd be no tie to break anyway, duh.    So it can seem a little weird but I guess it doesn't happen often enough to make people mad over Iowa essentially getting an extra vote if Grassley has to break a tie.


----------



## User.45

Alli said:


> And this is why I want him to live through COVID. That and because he deserves to suffer along with the 7 million other Americans who have gone through it without the benefit of the medical care he’s receiving.
> 
> Biden has been doing it correctly from the beginning. He doesn’t need to suspend. They should be grateful the Biden campaign is suspending the negative ads.
> 
> Which they should do because of the next quote:
> 
> McConnell has been adamant about votes being taken in person. Think he’ll change his tune now with only R’s home in quarantine?



That would be interesting. McConnell would fare well with COVID...


----------



## lizkat

PearsonX said:


> That would be interesting. McConnell would fare well with COVID...



 The whole thing with the Barrett vetting is a hot mess.   Dems don't want to meet her because RBG and Obama etc.,  staffers are wary of being exposed to other staffers who may or may not have been masking up before now, or even now;  both Dems and Rs have hired outside counsel and they in turn all have staffers... 

Barrett could end up tagged as justice typhoid mary just for showing up to her own nomination.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Alli said:


> ...Biden has been doing it correctly from the beginning. He doesn’t need to suspend. They should be grateful the Biden campaign is suspending the negative ads.




Yeah, but as Rachel Maddow told us tonight, the Trump campaign has *not* suspended its Biden attack ads. 

Different rules, folks.

Then there's this.



> "QAnon followers, again, unsurprisingly, don't believe the diagnosis is real," said Aoife Gallagher, a disinformation and extremism analyst at the London-based Institute for Strategic Dialogue, in an email interview. "They are excited about the news as they believe Trump is feigning quarantine in order to bring about 'The Storm,' the mass arrest of the 'deep state cabal,' the moment Q followers have been waiting on for years now."




And don't you worry about his health because...



> “You’ve never seen him sick. You’ve never seen him without energy,” Brenden Dilley, a self-described “MAGA life coach,” told his viewers on his radio show Friday. “[He’s] not walking around with weak-ass, p---- f------ genetics. He ain’t got those liberal genes. These are, like, god-tier genetics; top 1-percentile genetics.”




How positively...Aryan.

Then there was another story I saw where someone said this was a plot to "get" Trump. "Don't you think it's funny," one woman asked, "how only Republicans seem to get this disease? You don't see Democrats getting it." Yeah, that _is_ suspicious. There's no other possible explanation.


----------



## lizkat

Project Lincoln is putting up nice Biden ads.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312206032442142720/


----------



## Thomas Veil

Wish I could find this Biden spot that ran during last week's Browns game. Biden talked about he'd be president for all because America is the red states as well as the blue states. He kept saying "We can" work on the climate, "We can" strengthen the ACA,  "We can," "We can," "We can."

I dunno, I think he was channeling somebody...............

Edit: found it, but unfortunately not on YouTube. https://ispot.tv/a/nUTU Excellent ad!


----------



## lizkat

Thomas Veil said:


> Then there's this.



Yeah I could live to be 200 years old and never really get the whole QAnon thing.  To me it all feels like pirated bad reprints or tapes of shadowy spoofs of those 70s essays,  books and documentaries on "_what went wrong w/ America?"   --  _even as back then some of us were having the time of our lives or else knowing damn well what was wrong with America, and either way nothing very mysterious about any of it, even to the power plays of politics and war. But no, QAnon must have it all wrapped up in horror film allusions and conspiracy theories. So tedious.

End result of it all seems to be turning the questions away from

"what is true, what are the facts and how do we feel about them?"​​ to something else, something more malicious, like

"whaddya gonna do when ya can't keep us from swearing to God that it's all a hoax and an apocalyptic set of conspiracies all the way down?"​​and I'm like _yeah but why would you want to do that really?_

Must be why I like those Biden ads, they still make some sense in context of and comparison to the real world I see every day.    The stuff I see about QAnon feels like b-roll off b-movies that went right to dvd.


----------



## Thomas Veil

When I'd see something like large groups of people acting moronically in the movies I'd think, yeah it's a nice story, but people would never _really_ be that stupid.

You know that commercial where all the teenage kids are running from the killer, and instead of wisely escaping in the running car, they choose to hide out in the garage with all the chain saws? It's such an absurd commercial. I never thought I'd see that level of stupidity actually come to life. But that's QAnon.


----------



## lizkat

Here's a flat piece of truth...  that we could really use it now but nobody's home to tell it.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312205940653920256/


----------



## Mark

lizkat said:


> The VP is the president of the Senate (although not a Senator).
> 
> He is however NOT the Senate's president pro tempore guy, who actually IS also a Senator, and (since around the time of Truman) has been designated as the senator of the majority party with the most seniority.
> 
> In line of succession to the presidency,  it goes like this
> vice president
> speaker of the house
> senate president pro tempore
> secretary of state
> secretary of treasury
> secretary of defense
> attorney general  (yeah, Barr)
> and on through rest of the cabinet officers
> 
> In the VP's absence for any reason,  the Senate's president pro tempore takes his place, e.g. to break a tie for instance.
> 
> So there's already a senate president pro tempore, it's currently Senator Grassley, and the only weird thing about that is that he ends up actually double-voting if he must break a tie.
> 
> That's because if there's a tie on the vote and the VP's absent and Grassley has to break it, they can't penalize Iowa his Senatorial vote just because Grassley has to put his pro temp prez hat on...  and if they did do that, then in subtracting his Senate vote to let him put on his other hat, suddenly there'd be no tie to break anyway, duh.    So it can seem a little weird but I guess it doesn't happen often enough to make people mad over Iowa essentially getting an extra vote if Grassley has to break a tie.




thanks for the terminology correction i got wrong.

so, if the VP takes over for P, then the VP is not able to break ties in the Senate.
but you indicate that in that case, the  President Pro Tempore gets to cast his vote as Senator AND vote as a tie breaker.

thanks.


----------



## Mark

i don't see any reason to think that Hicks was the most likely to have infected trump.
of course its totally possible that that is what happened, but everything really is pointing to the Barrett Rose Garden Party as _Prime Vector._

of course it couldn't be the debutant barrett.
it has come to light just today that Barrett herself had COVID-19 earlier in the spring.
so presumably she has some limited time immunity from the same strain of virus she had.

i can't find any info about a recovered covid person infecting others while s/he is non-symptomatic.

_meanwhile, trump himself and his garden party coterie were infecting people in Minnesota and Columbus even though they knew at least that Hicks was infected._


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312245655650349056/
That was funny, This  brought me back to Earth
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312173114868953089/
.
.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312105773703458816/


----------



## Mark

Here is how it went for 74 year old Herbert Caine.
Admitted to hospital about 1 week after contracting it, dying a little bit more than 3 weeks later after going into hospital.

Herman Cain Passes After 3-Week Coronavirus Battle​JUL 30, 2020
Herman Cain, business executive and former presidential candidate, has died of COVID-19. Cain previously survived cancer and was 74 years of age.
...
Cain was admitted to an Atlanta, Georgia area hospital on July 1, after testing positive for SARS-CoV-2 several days prior.

On Tuesday, Cain was said to be recovering, possibly reflecting the complex immune system stages of COVID-19 disease course:

"We didn’t release detailed updates on his condition to the public or to the media because neither his family nor we thought there was any reason for that. *There were hopeful indicators, including a mere five days ago when doctors told us they thought he would eventually recover, *although it wouldn’t be quick. We were relieved to be told that, and passed on the news via Herman’s social media. And yet we also felt real concern about the fact that he never quite seemed to get to the point where the doctors could advance him to the recovery phase," Calabrese said.
...


then, there is this:
photo of how crowded the rose garden pack-the-court-event was


----------



## Scepticalscribe

A nice quote from Andrew Gawthrope in today's edition of the Guardian: "For that reason, we should wish the president a speedy recovery, a devastating election defeat and a long and ignominious retirement."

To that, I would add, that - as part of that retirement - being put on trial, convicted and finding himself behind bars as a consequence - which would be a triumph for evidence based convictions and the concept of the rule of law - would be a satisfactory outcome.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Pretty well sums it up
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312189188750540800/


----------



## Thomas Veil

niji said:


> ...photo of how crowded the rose garden pack-the-court-event was
> View attachment 641



That's about as close to a suicide cult as you can get without actually being one.


----------



## User.45

Guys, I'm seriously looking for an analysis on what's gonna happen to the SCOTUS in this situation? ANybody?


----------



## JayMysteri0

The doors of conversation that have opened up with 45 getting the best medical treatment in the world for a virus he downplayed, while actively working to kill the medical aid others would get is becoming interesting.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312359795660382208/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312360656645939200/


----------



## DT

Wow, the Dr.s just came out of WR, 50 minutes late, and had a roll call, a 5 minute circle jerk, and didn't answer any questions and walked off ...


----------



## Eric

DT said:


> Wow, the Dr.s just came out of WR, 50 minutes late, and had a roll call, a 5 minute circle jerk, and didn't answer any questions and walked off ...



Seriously man, WTF was that? I had to hit the FF button to get through all the introductions. What a joke.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

PearsonX said:


> Guys, I'm seriously looking for an analysis on what's gonna happen to the SCOTUS in this situation? ANybody?




I have assumed - or thought - that the attempt to rush to fit the vacancy in the SC left by the death of RBG (did that really happen only two weeks ago? I am experiencing a feeling, a mad sense of the 'acceleration' of history - that I remember from the events of late 1989, a sense that if you don't watch - or listen to - the news for a few hours, you will actually run the risk of missing something important) was prompted by two political needs, one short term, and the other, more long term.

The short term is an attempt to stack the court so that it has a conservative majority in the (almost inevitable) event of a (GOP) legal challenge to the validity of the election. 

Here, despite strong political and ideological preferences (without which their nominations to the SC would not, and could not, have occurred), the SC would do well to tread with caution; the separation of powers is a doctrine worth respecting, and politicising the court will undermine its credibility and legitimacy in the long run.

This is troubling, or  cause for considerable concern, because if the electoral system returns yet another president who wins the electoral college but loses the popular vote - for the third time in twenty years (and leaving aside all of the flagrant attempts at voter suppression), I see confidence in the electoral system being able to return a result that reflects the political preferences of the electorate becoming further undermined.  

Secondly, obviously, there is a marked desire to stack the SC with conservative nominees in order to rule on issues of interest to conservatives, conservative Catholics, Evangelicals, and so on; over-turning Roe v Wade is the obvious example, but - I would argue - that would imply be the beginning of the implementation of such an agenda driven by conservative ideology.

However, with Senators dropping like ninepins with Covid required quarantining, which will eat into the remaining time available, the window of opportunity whereby they - the GOP - will be able to rush through a nominee to this position is rapidly narrowing.


----------



## Eric

Chris Christie just tested positive.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> Chris Christie just tested positive.



Yep.   He tweeted it and the Times ran a piece already as an add-on to updates about Trump.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312416381758050305/









						Trump Says He Is Better After His Chief of Staff Expresses Concern
					

The president is “improving,” his doctor said in an optimistic assessment that raised questions about when the virus was diagnosed. But Mr. Trump’s chief of staff, Mark Meadows, said his symptoms were “very concerning,” and the president, in a video, acknowledged that the next few days would...




					www.nytimes.com


----------



## JayMysteri0

If the announcement ceremony was indeed the super spreader event that caused all of this, in the hopes the president could stack the court hoping the decide the election for him, ...this will become the biggest example of Karma existing in modern history.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

I confess to some curiosity as to when exactly Mr Trump was diagnosed with Covid-19.

The briefings thus far appear to be somewhat opaque on this point.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Scepticalscribe said:


> I confess to some curiosity as to when exactly Mr Trump was diagnosed with Covid-19.
> 
> The briefings thus far appear to be somewhat opaque on this point.



The word going around now is that he'd been infected for 72 hours, meaning he was sick when he did the fund raiser, but they waited until 36 hours to share the news.

If any of those fund raisers get sick now that it's confirmed he was sick & the WH were aware that morning...   

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312422234254905356/

And...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312013783607328769/
jerks!


----------



## Eric

Scepticalscribe said:


> I confess to some curiosity as to when exactly Mr Trump was diagnosed with Covid-19.
> 
> The briefings thus far appear to be somewhat opaque on this point.



It's looking more and more like he knew and still went out into those events. Only someone as selfish and thoughtless as Trump would do something so horrific.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312437747164962816/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312437749341851651/
 That I think is the important thing to note, that he started a therapy, and still knowingly went to the fund raiser.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312437751304708104/


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312437747164962816/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312437749341851651/
> That I think is the important thing to note, that he started a therapy, and still knowingly went to the fund raiser.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312437751304708104/



This is huge news, I'm wondering if we'll see a correction issued by the doctor here.


----------



## JayMysteri0

ericgtr12 said:


> This is huge news, I'm wondering if we'll see a correction issued by the doctor here.



I am sure the administration will work up one to give the doctor to pass on.


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> I am sure the administration will work up one to give the doctor to pass on.




They're working their way down to absurd levels of denial, like one of my bros at age 3 hiding in mom's closet and  pigging through a box of chocolates stashed in there for an upcoming holiday. She found him with empty chocolate papers scattered around the box on his lap and chocolate on hands and face,  but he kept saying "what chocolate?"  and insisting "I didn't do that!"


----------



## Eric

ericgtr12 said:


> This is huge news, I'm wondering if we'll see a correction issued by the doctor here.



We got the correction as expected on the timeline.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> We got the correction as expected on the timeline.



Man oh man.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312451434609143809/


----------



## Eric

As everyone is left to speculate the one true measure is going to be his tweets, as long as his fingers are off his phone, he's likely too sick to use it IMO.


----------



## User.45

ericgtr12 said:


> As everyone is left to speculate the one true measure is going to be his tweets, as long as his fingers are off his phone, he's likely too sick to use it IMO.



agree. tweeting is the 5th vital sign for him


----------



## Edd

He could be aiming for a Jesus rising from the dead angle.

“I died, saw a light, and God spoke! It’s not your time yet, he said. Go back, put a gun in every Republican’s hand, take all the money, grab all the pussies! God sent me to win the election and get great ratings, like MASH finale ratings, so very big, believe me!”


----------



## Alli

PearsonX said:


> Guys, I'm seriously looking for an analysis on what's gonna happen to the SCOTUS in this situation? ANybody?



If there aren’t enough Republicans healthy enough to vote in person, then a vote should be taken anyway, allowing the Democrats to vote down the nomination. Maybe they could quickly vote in Merrick Garland while they’re at it?


----------



## lizkat

Edd70 said:


> He could be aiming for a Jesus rising from the dead angle.
> 
> “I died, saw a light, and God spoke! It’s not your time yet, he said. Go back, put a gun in every Republican’s hand, take all the money, grab all the pussies! God sent me to win the election and get great ratings, like MASH finale ratings, so very big, believe me!”




Hmm... does Trump ever crack open that Bible he likes to hold up as a prop now and then?

“But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors” (James 2:9).​ 
That may not fly in moments here on earth for candidates and their advocates, but when they get up to the pearly gates to meet the authors of the rulebooks,  well... ol' James happened to be talking there about the sin of favoring the rich over the poor, but applied that message as well to other forms of turning away from the commandment to love one another.

The early church was radical on this point:  its followers ranged from slaves to the extremely wealthy, so the message was hammered on, and in particular by James, the brother of Jesus Christ.  The Old Testament had the commandment as one to love the neighbor.  The New Testament put it simply as to love one another, managing to elide rather than emphasize the potentially extreme differences among followers of the commandments.

None of this stuff seems to go all that well with Trump's ways of life when I think on it.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

Several separate sources reported in the Guardian stating that oxygen was administered to Mr Trump before he left the WH in order to be admitted to hospital.


----------



## Eric

Scepticalscribe said:


> Several separate sources reported in the Guardian stating that oxygen was administered to Mr Trump before left the WH in order to be admitted to hospital.



CNN is reporting the same thing.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> CNN is reporting the same thing.




Yeah the disease can move quickly.  They didn't want to end up having to haul him out on a gurney to a helicopter or ambulance if his blood oxygen levels suddenly crashed.   There are all these horrifying stories of people having mild symptoms and then quite suddenly realizing they couldn't satisfy a conscious need for "more air" no matter how hard they tried to breathe it in.

What a horrible illness, behaving so differently person to person regardless of this or that "typical" frameworks for either vulnerability or response after having been infected.   Just the fact that the quantitative viral load has effect on course of the impact is a complication, i.e. degree of proximity of the face to the face of an infected person can worsen not only likelihood of infection but outcome.  And of course at the time of a crisis the physicians may not know a whole lot about the person's history with the virus prior to the patient presenting fresh off an ambulance into the ICU.


----------



## Edd

Trump’s Twitter account is tweeting today but no way to know who’s typing. Not stopping dolts online from 100% believing it’s him.


----------



## User.45

Edd70 said:


> Trump’s Twitter account is tweeting today but no way to know who’s typing. Not stopping dolts online from 100% believing it’s him.



At this point they'll have to show a video of him in 48H otherwise i call it BS


----------



## Yoused

I will say the crass thing: for 45 months, Individual-ONE's polling has been in negative territory, but he could now be poised to significantly reverse his ratings deficit.


----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> I will say the crass thing: for 45 months, Individual-ONE's polling has been in negative territory, but he could now be poised to significantly reverse his ratings deficit.



If this self-inflicted wound reverses course for him, America deserves its fate. I doubt it. I usually have a very easy time forgiving people and have treated a number of criminals before. Yet, I still have a very hard time resetting my mind about him, and this inertia (I think) applies to others too.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

Yoused said:


> I will say the crass thing: for 45 months, Individual-ONE's polling has been in negative territory, but he could now be poised to significantly reverse his ratings deficit.




Not unless he dies.   

However, I am somewhat concerned that this illness - which I don't doubt now is probably genuine, (which says everything about the credibility of any statement emanating fro the current administration in the WH) but which struck at an extraordinarily convenient time - may serve, if it has not already done so, to move attention and focus away from the questionable financial practices and appalling irregularities of his taxes.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

Take a look at Mr Trump's - just released - four minute video clip; good grief.


----------



## Thomas Veil

I don't see him getting a sympathy vote from this, if that's what you guys are suggesting. 

I do think that to forestall anything like that from happening, the moment it looks like he's improved and will leave the hospital, the Democrats ought to go on an "I told you so" tour, telling America that they and the scientists were right and Trump was wrong, and that's why he's too dangerously incompetent to be re-elected.


----------



## Eric

Thomas Veil said:


> I don't see him getting a sympathy vote from this, if that's what you guys are suggesting.
> 
> I do think that to forestall anything like that from happening, the moment it looks like he's improved and will leave the hospital, the Democrats ought to go on an "I told you so" tour, telling America that they and the scientists were right and Trump was wrong, and that's why he's too dangerously incompetent to be re-elected.



I agree here, I think people will wish him well and all but won't give him a pity vote, especially when it's all his own doing. He also deliberately infected others even when he knew he was exposed.


----------



## Yoused

And, of course, we know this is all Barack's fault


----------



## Yoused

Thomas Veil said:


> the Democrats ought to go on an "I told you so" tour



About 45 years ago, kind of out of the blue, I promised myself that I would never use that sentence. I have kept that promise (though, I have cast a look that may have been too close once or twice).

Really, though, the Democrats need do nothing. Their work is being done for them.
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312046688840953858/


----------



## User.45

One comment I'm gonna make. If I had money I'd pour  it into regeneron....
Nothing will give you more of the insider info than what he's getting and what he's NOT getting, which actually proves a point about the misinformation he has done:
1. He didn't get the breakthrough treatment of convalescent plasma, because it's WEAK AF
2. He didn't get hydroxychloroquine, and I doubt he got azithromycin...That combo may be well tolerated with a good heart, but with some COVID carditis it's risk for no gain.


----------



## Eric

PearsonX said:


> One comment I'm gonna make. If I had money I'd pour  it into regeneron....
> Nothing will give you more of the insider info than what he's getting and what he's NOT getting, which actually proves a point about the misinformation he has done:
> 1. He didn't get the breakthrough treatment of convalescent plasma, because it's WEAK AF
> 2. He didn't get hydroxychloroquine, and I doubt he got azithromycin...That combo may be well tolerated with a good heart, but with some COVID carditis it's risk for no gain.



I can't speak for COVID but I can for azithromycin and copd, when I get a chest infection that medication is like a miracle drug. At my early stages I tend to get a couple infections a year and it knocks it out pretty well, I get a 5 day course to have on hand after each episode to be prepared for the next one.


----------



## User.45

ericgtr12 said:


> I can't speak for COVID but I can for azithromycin and copd, when I get a chest infection that medication is like a miracle drug. At my early stages I tend to get a couple infections a year and it knocks it out pretty well, I get a 5 day course to have on hand after each episode to be prepared for the next one.



It's probably not great practice as it promotes azithromycin resistance esp that many of these infections are viral (ie. an antibacterial agent won't touch it), but with COPD in the right setting may be a reasonable. Some people argued that it may also have an antiinflammatory effect. The issue is that
1. COVID causes heart inflammation, which can cause arrhythmias
2. Hydroxychloroquine can prolong QT (a form of pre arrhythmia state)
3. Azithromycin can prolong QT
4. Combine it with some electrolyte derangements like hypomagnesemia...
And you have a combo of 4 arythmogenic factors, so the cocktail better does magic in exchange before your EKG starts looking like this:


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> I agree here, I think people will wish him well and all but won't give him a pity vote, especially when it's all his own doing. He also deliberately infected others even when he knew he was exposed.




Yeah and he's not the only one.  Three Minnesota GOP congresscritters flew on Air Force One w/ Trump to Minnesota on Wednesday but then flew back to DC on Delta Friday night, already knowing from Friday morning's Trump tweet that they had been exposed.









						Minnesota Congressmen Flew Delta After Flying With Trump
					

Minneapolis (AP) -- Three Minnesota congressmen are facing backlash over taking a commercial flight home from Washington, D.C., on Friday night just two days after they shared Air Force One with President Donald Trump.




					www.bloomberg.com
				




(I'm tired of so many people thinking they are so f^cking special that the rules laid down by anyone over anything just don't apply to them.)



> U.S. Reps. Pete Stauber, Tom Emmer and Jim Hagedorn all were on the same Delta Airlines flight despite the airline’s restrictions on passengers recently exposed to COVID-19. Trump announced early Friday morning he had tested positive for the virus. *Delta’s policy says customers who know they were exposed to the virus in the past 14 days cannot travel on the company's aircraft*. The airline defines exposure as face-to-face contact with someone carrying the virus, or sustained contact for more than 15 minutes less than 6 feet apart.




The guys told the airline about their situation but said they'd tested negative (so what, you're supposed to quarantine for 14 days after exposure, not take a test after 2 and pronounce yourself airplane worthy)  and Delta (ludicrously) did let them fly.

Plane was "only" 40% full.

Yeah...   news flash,  the air you breathe in a plane is as fungible as cash money in a homebrew kitchen table budget.

No one seems to know what passengers were told, if anything, although the flight was delayed for quite awhile;  the airline dithered over what to do....   (and how much flak they'd get for not flying 3 members of congress back to DC on demand?)


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312515816655470592/


----------



## SuperMatt

Scepticalscribe said:


> Take a look at Mr Trump's - just released - four minute video clip; good grief.




He finally is showing some concern for somebody with the virus!


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312413225061961728/


----------



## Eric

Biden is playing it smart, while making a point.



> Joe Biden’s campaign said Saturday it will now disclose the result of every coronavirus test the candidate takes, following increased pressure for more transparency after President Trump recently tested positive for the virus and Vice President Pence has released results for two consecutive days.
> 
> “We have adhered to strict and extensive safety practices recommended by public health experts and doctors in all of our campaigning — including social distancing, mask wearing, and additional safeguards,” campaign spokesman Andrew Bates said in a statement. “Vice President Biden is being tested regularly, and we will be releasing the results of each test.”






			https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/biden-campaign-says-it-will-now-disclose-the-result-of-every-coronavirus-test/2020/10/03/c4fdc30c-058f-11eb-b7ed-141dd88560ea_story.html


----------



## Thomas Veil

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312413225061961728/



You have *got* to be kidding. 

And they say we don’t have royalty in America.


----------



## fooferdoggie

what does trump need a kitchen for he does not even know what one is used for.


----------



## DT

@PearsonX 

Hahahaha, I think AG over at The Other Place is using this graph for reference ...


----------



## Chew Toy McCoy

No, I will not wish Donald Trump well
					

I only wish for his convincing defeat on November 3 – nothing more, or less.




					www.aljazeera.com
				




well said


----------



## Thomas Veil

I’ll just leave this here.

*Merriam-Webster sees 30,500% spike in 'schadenfreude' searches following Trump diagnosis*


----------



## lizkat

Thomas Veil said:


> You have *got* to be kidding.
> 
> And they say we don’t have royalty in America.




Man.  I knew there was something I forgot to do when renovating my copy of "this old house".  Two mirrors on the dining room wall.    I can usually get by with the answer from just one mirror though, when as the Evil Queen before breakfast, I ask that old question from the Snow White fairy tale.

_Mirror, mirror on the wall, who's the fairest of them all?_​​Oh, wait.  I get it.  That's the backup mirror, for when the first mirror gets uppity and goes against me.

Imma shop at Amazon right now to fix.that.right.up.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

Chew Toy McCoy said:


> No, I will not wish Donald Trump well
> 
> 
> I only wish for his convincing defeat on November 3 – nothing more, or less.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.aljazeera.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> well said




Brilliant piece, and thanks for sharing. 

As commentators on Twitter (and in the Guardian/Observer) have remarked, the decency is so asymmetrical; Barack Obama, Joe Biden and the Clintons have all courteously wished Mr Trump well, former VP Biden has pulled his attack ads, yet Donal Trump lies and gaslights, neglects to notify his challenger that some in his circle (and possible himself) had tested positive for Covid-19 at the time of the presidential debate last Tuesday, while his loathsome son - the day after the debate - attacked Joe Biden's son, Hunter, (on the Glenn Beck programme) referring to him as "crackhead Hunter"; these people have neither pity nor morals, let alone empathy or ethics.


----------



## Yoused

lizkat said:


> Oh, wait. I get it. That's the backup mirror, for when the first mirror gets uppity and goes against me.



The mirror over my sink has a sticker on it, "things seen in this mirror may be closer to reality than they appear".


----------



## DT

So I'm hearing trump had a couple of lower O2s like lower 90s, brought back up by way of a short round oxygen - but I also read he had dropped even lower than that, and there was a steroid treatment, which sounds way more concerning than a little 4-5 point drop.


----------



## Eric

DT said:


> So I'm hearing trump had a couple of lower O2s like lower 90s, brought back up by way of a short round oxygen - but I also read he had dropped even lower than that, and there was a steroid treatment, which sounds way more concerning than a little 4-5 point drop.



While I have mild COPD (I quit smoking a long time ago and hope to have a normal lifespan as a result) I also watched my dad (who refused to quit and died in his late 70s) go through all the stages of oxygen depravation, so I can speak to this.

As long as it's above 94% you're usually okay, a respiratory therapist prefers to see it above 96% but if it drops below that for any amount of time it will raise alarms. Also, when monitoring they'll often try to get you to move around (just walking for example) to get it while you're active, as opposed to just sitting at rest. Even with my condition I average between 97% and 99% on average.

The main concern is not that it causes breathing issues (although shortness of breath is always a concern) it's that it deprives all of your organs the necessary oxygen to sustain themselves. So you could end up with liver, kidney or heart issues as a result and I'm guessing the doctors are watching all of these things very closely, it's hard to imagine they would let him leave under these circumstances.


----------



## DT

ericgtr12 said:


> So you could end up with liver, kidney or heart issues as a result and I'm guessing the doctors are watching all of these things very closely, it's hard to imagine they would let him leave under these circumstances.




Holy hell, the suggestion he might "Be leaving by Monday ...", sounds __insane__.


----------



## DT

WHAT IN THE SERIOUS FUCK

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312866037675814913/


----------



## lizkat

DT said:


> WHAT IN THE SERIOUS FUCK
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312866037675814913/




Proof of life?   See nobody believes anything any more.

He's who said don't believe all you see or hear.  

He did this to himself.


----------



## Thomas Veil

DT said:


> WHAT IN THE SERIOUS FUCK
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312866037675814913/



That really is bizarre. It's either a pathetic need for adoration or a North Korea-type attempt to say, "See? Our leader is okay."


----------



## lizkat

It's a rally, here's more video.    How you like driving that with windows rolled up and covid-19 in the back seat.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312865078602072065/


----------



## Eric

Jesus H Christ. This president has lost his mind, exposing everyone in his circle like this is unbelievable.

Meanwhile, Democrats...


----------



## Yoused

lizkat said:


> Proof of life? See nobody believes anything any more.




_Dave_, anyone?


----------



## lizkat

Yoused said:


> _Dave_, anyone?




Silently and discreetly engineered by Pence, no doubt.   Trumper supporter rallies,  "Trump" appearances...  re-election and then the denouement:  Mikey pops out of a birthday cake on the western plaza of the US Capitol Building facing the National Mall and says "Swear me in, lads, the prez he's not feelin' too well [finally]."


----------



## Eric

You can't make this stuff up, folks.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312885335634788352/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312885350541467651/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312886030329147392/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312885502899494913/


----------



## JayMysteri0

This is literally a trend on Twitter now


> People are concerned for the health of the Secret Service staff who drove with President Trump so he could wave to his supporters outside Walter Reed hospital where he’s being treated for COVID-19



That's what is trending in the politics section now.  When was the last time the Secret Service were trending for concern of THEIR safety?

That's how asswards back this president is.


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> This is literally a trend on Twitter now
> 
> That's what is trending in the politics section now.  When was the last time the Secret Service were trending for concern of THEIR safety?
> 
> That's how asswards back this president is.



Exactly what I was tweeting about above.

Trump is a selfish asshole, willing to infect everyone around him for a photo op. Sorry but he deserves whatever he gets from this thing.


----------



## Eric

Bill Barr now self-quarantining, will be interesting to see how the dominoes fall over this coming week.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> Bill Barr now self-quarantining, will be interesting to see how the dominoes fall over this coming week.




He's not anxious or anything.... has only taken 4 tests since Friday morning.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312872950392029184/


----------



## Eric

lizkat said:


> He's not anxious or anything.... has only taken 4 tests since Friday morning.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312872950392029184/



Interesting, it appears that his biggest risk was last Saturday at that event so if he hasn't tested positive yet he's nearly out of the woods by now.


----------



## lizkat

Wall Street Journal reporting now that Trump had a positive test result on Thursday evening and didn't mention it during a phone interview with Hannity on Fox.









						Trump Didn’t Disclose First Positive Covid-19 Test While Awaiting a Second Test on Thursday
					

President Trump didn’t disclose a positive result from a rapid test for Covid-19 on Thursday while awaiting the findings from a more thorough coronavirus screening, according to people familiar with the matter.




					www.wsj.com
				




https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312866445366366209/


----------



## fooferdoggie

DT said:


> WHAT IN THE SERIOUS FUCK
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312866037675814913/



it only needs a plane flying over dropping bleach to be perfect.


----------



## Alli

Thomas Veil said:


> That really is bizarre. It's either a pathetic need for adoration or a North Korea-type attempt to say, "See? Our leader is okay."



It’s either Kim Jong Un or Weekend at Bernie’s. The line is starting to blur.


----------



## lizkat

Thomas Veil said:


> That really is bizarre. It's either a pathetic need for adoration or a North Korea-type attempt to say, "See? Our leader is okay."





ericgtr12 said:


> Jesus H Christ. This president has lost his mind, exposing everyone in his circle like this is unbelievable.




Meanwhile if you were a lucky Secret Service guy, you're detailed to FLOTUS.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312911255557025793/


----------



## lizkat

A former director of the CDC notes that the class of steroids that Trump took may cause hyperactivity...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312936904061579264/


----------



## lizkat

Meanwhile the Missouri GOP mocks Biden for hidin' while the President was out and about despite his covid infection inspecting his fans along a road in Bethesda...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312938188768501761/


----------



## lizkat

An attending physician (chief of Disaster Medicine no less) at Walter Reed says those who were in Trump's limo this afternoon s/b quarantined for 14 days, having risked their lives...  and calls the outing "insane".

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312877318742790146/


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312897120853262337/


----------



## Eric

One thing is for certain, unless it's leaked we will not be getting a real status update on the president's condition. ALL news coming from the WH will be rosy and glowing no matter what.


----------



## Alli

lizkat said:


> Meanwhile if you were a lucky Secret Service guy, you're detailed to FLOTUS.



The really lucky ones are detailed to the former presidents and Vice Presidents.


----------



## Thomas Veil

So I’m driving home, and because my favorite sports station was in one of their interminable commercial breaks, I tuned in Rush Limbaugh for a few minutes.

He was talking to some Trump fan who was apoplectic, absolutely _beside_ himself, as to why Trump would do such a stupid thing as take that joy ride around Walter Reed. He wanted Rush to explain to him why Trump would do something so utterly stupid, knowing it would open him to criticism.

I have to admit to being amused by Trump’s fans being driven crazy by his idiotic antics. I’m glad it’s giving them hives. At the same time, it’s amazing to see how stick stone stupid they are by not recognizing that the man does idiotic things _because he’s an idiot_. They are so resistant to the idea that their adulation of him is undeserved. The answer is right there staring them in the face, but they don’t see it.

Rush, for his part, noted that what the guy was really worried about was all the negative media coverage at this engendered, and that Trump wasn’t wrong, it’s just that the media are a bunch of evil fear mongers.

Both of them were concerned about how this _looked_, not about how inappropriate this was or how this would affect the Secret Service agents.

They truly are in their own little world.


----------



## Eric

Thomas Veil said:


> So I’m driving home, and because my favorite sports station was in one of their interminable commercial breaks, I tuned in Rush Limbaugh for a few minutes.
> 
> He was talking to some Trump fan who was apoplectic, absolutely _beside_ himself, as to why Trump would do such a stupid thing as take that joy ride around Walter Reed. He wanted Rush to explain to him why Trump would do something so utterly stupid, knowing it would open him to criticism.
> 
> I have to admit to being amused by Trump’s fans being driven crazy by his idiotic antics. I’m glad it’s giving them hives. At the same time, it’s amazing to see how stick stone stupid they are by not recognizing that the man does idiotic things _because he’s an idiot_. They are so resistant to the idea that their adulation of him is undeserved. The answer is right there staring them in the face, but they don’t see it.
> 
> Rush, for his part, noted that what the guy was really worried about was all the negative media coverage at this engendered, and that Trump wasn’t wrong, it’s just that the media are a bunch of evil fear mongers.
> 
> Both of them were concerned about how this _looked_, not about how inappropriate this was or how this would affect the Secret Service agents.
> 
> They truly are in their own little world.



If that's the reaction of a "fan" imagine what it looks like to everyone else. It's just hard to imagine him politically surviving this but after 2016 it's still anyone's guess.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> One thing is for certain, unless it's leaked we will not be getting a real status update on the president's condition. ALL news coming from the WH will be rosy and glowing no matter what.




Speaking of rosy and glowing, remember the early days of Ms. McEnany?  In fairness I will note here that she was not yet on board as WH Press Secretary but was working for the Trump campaign at the time of this news clip.   Later, and on day one of her appointment at the WH,  she promised never to lie to us.  Right, so she ran this collection up the flagpole while she could.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313147374156410884/


----------



## DT

@lizkat 

I saw someone post in response to that, "This whole, _that didn't age well_ thing is getting tiresome".


----------



## lizkat

HIstorians are preparing to write that the whole Trump era didn't age well, and it's not even over.


----------



## Edd

DT said:


> Holy hell, the suggestion he might "Be leaving by Monday ...", sounds __insane__.





lizkat said:


> Speaking of rosy and glowing, remember the early days of Ms. McEnany?  In fairness I will note here that she was not yet on board as WH Press Secretary but was working for the Trump campaign at the time of this news clip.   Later, and on day one of her appointment at the WH,  she promised never to lie to us.  Right, so she ran this collection up the flagpole while she could.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313147374156410884/



Ms McEnay has tested positive.


----------



## Renzatic

Looks like Trump is being released from Walter Reed this evening. 

Amazing how quickly he beat this thing! What amazing genetics! Greatest president ever!


----------



## Edd

One of his hospital tweets while on steroids:
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313071950781181953/


----------



## Eric

Edd70 said:


> One of his hospital tweets while on steroids:
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313071950781181953/



Dude is loaded.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

lizkat said:


> He's not anxious or anything.... has only taken 4 tests since Friday morning.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312872950392029184/




I read a report in the Guardian about how - at that now notorious Garden Event - his nose dripped, whereupon he wiped it with his hand, and then, unbelievably, proceeded to still shake hands with others (that actually seems to have been caught on video).

Long before the advent of Covid-19, this would have been considered disgusting behaviour.  If I had done this at any age after say, about three, my mother would have *killed* me.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> Dude is loaded.




Yeah or wants to be able to self medicate with his whatever he indulges in,  without having a bunch of WR medicos popping in to make sure he's ok.

I don't think the Secret Service is happy with the idea of the President returning to "circulation" while he is still deemed contagious.

Also... National Security chief O'Brien seemed to be signaling it would be cool if Trump stayed on at Walter Reed for awhile...  he noted that in his own experience of the disease he had a downturn in days 7 and 8.  He said this yesterday during an interview on Face the Nation:

"And the good news is, is the president feels very well. And he actually wants to get back home to the White House and get back to work. But I think he's going to stay at Walter Reed for at least another period of time. Look, I went through this virus myself, as you know, Margaret, over the summer. And *even if you have no symptoms, and I would -- I had very, very minor symptoms, day seven and eight are the critical days."*​
So why can't Trump just hang out for the rest of the normal course of a covid experience in the pretty nice looking quarters of Walter Reed where they have put him?  He gets waited on hand and foot, there's places to rest, eat, work,  watch TV etc.,   and he's where he needs to be for medical care in event of a turn for the worse in his own experience of covid-19.


----------



## Eric

My dad was on steroids and just weeks before he passed said "I haven't felt this good in years, I feel like superman". It's a false sense of security, unfortunately, as it suppresses your immune system so it no longer fights whatever infect you have. The problem is the infection is then left unchecked and can do far more damage, it's a trade off to treat the symptoms.

BTW when people come off of them they can be downright evil, we do not want to see a monster like Trump have to deal with this.


----------



## lizkat

ericgtr12 said:


> My dad was on steroids and just weeks before he passed said "I haven't felt this good in years, I feel like superman". It's a false sense of security, unfortunately, as it suppresses your immune system so it no longer fights whatever infect you have. The problem is the infection is then left unchecked and can do far more damage, it's a trade off to treat the symptoms.
> 
> BTW when people come off of them they can be downright evil, we do not want to see a monster like Trump have to deal with this.




Yes.   Despite Trump's having said he understands covid now, he doesn't.

Covfefe.  Covfefe all the way down.


----------



## Mark

lizkat said:


> Yes.   Despite Trump's having said he understands covid now, he doesn't.
> 
> Covfefe.  Covfefe all the way down.





yes, and, of course, the very prophetic

*person, woman, man, camera, TV*


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313187148540137474/


----------



## Thomas Veil

Why are the networks covering this live? All this is is an ego trip for him.


----------



## Thomas Veil

He’s at the White House door and...the mask comes off.


----------



## Yoused

Thomas Veil said:


> He’s at the White House door and...the mask comes off.



Because an ancient _Wagon Train_ rerun, almost older'n me, came on, so they know there is better stuff to watch instead.


----------



## Eric

Thomas Veil said:


> He’s at the White House door and...the mask comes off.



Did you see him gasping for air?


----------



## Thomas Veil

No. He may have been but the camera angles were very distant.


----------



## Yoused

Well,
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313192280971452418/


----------



## GermanSuplex

This is beyond embarrassing. He always has these authoritarian-like photo-ops that he does, which remind me of the victory laps dictators take after winning a rigged election.

Watching him stand on the White House balcony, giving a salute, removing his mask and standing there as if he's a god is just laughable. Knowing he had his hairs sprayed to his style and his orange makeup applied for that moment... It's not a presidency, its a reality show.

Still in constant amazement people legitimately like this guy.


----------



## Thomas Veil

Meanwhile...
White House Is Not Contact Tracing ‘Super-Spreader’ Rose Garden Event​


> The White House has decided not to trace the contacts of guests and staff members at the Rose Garden celebration 10 days ago for Judge Amy Coney Barrett, where at least eight people, including the president, may have become infected, according to a White House official familiar with the plans...





> “This is a total abdication of responsibility by the Trump administration,” said Dr. Joshua Barocas, a public health expert at Boston University, who has advised the City of Boston on contact tracing. “The idea that we’re not involving the C.D.C. to do contact tracing at this point seems like a massive public health threat.”



Always finding new ways to be irresponsible.


----------



## Thomas Veil

GermanSuplex said:


> This is beyond embarrassing. He always has these authoritarian-like photo-ops that he does, which remind me of the victory laps dictators take after winning a rigged election.
> 
> Watching him stand on the White House balcony, giving a salute, removing his mask and standing there as if he's a god is just laughable. Knowing he had his hairs sprayed to his style and his orange makeup applied for that moment... It's not a presidency, its a reality show.




Exactly. This whole thing is embarrassingly crass and self-serving.

When did he time his self-discharge from Walter Reed? 6:30, just when the east coast network news comes on. I watched NBC, and sure enough the *whole fucking half hour* and more was just him walking out, getting on the chopper, flying, landing (yes, cameras followed the entire flight), and then Captain Covid getting out, taking off his mask, basking in the media coverage, and then going inside to spread the disease to someone new.

So yeah. This whole thing was timed to be a television show.

It's as appalling as those flag-waving fools camped outside of Walter Reed like apostles waiting for Jesus to walk out of the tomb.

Had I remembered, I know I would have better enjoyed the Chiefs-Patriots pregame show on CBS. But then I wouldn't have seen this to complain about it.

The only good thing I can say about it is that I think the last week or so has made some people _finally_ see Trump for what he is. When he's just being a dick, they're like, "Oh, that's Trump being Trump." But I think for more than a few, this is a bridge too far. His bullying "debate", his cavalier attitude about coronavirus even after catching it, his spreading it to others, his special treatment that nobody else gets, his joy ride around the hospital, and now his big show of leaving Walter Reed...it's no wonder his poll numbers are dropping. They may yet drop further still.


----------



## User.45

lizkat said:


> He's not anxious or anything.... has only taken 4 tests since Friday morning.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312872950392029184/



Are they mentally challenged?! Poor epithelial cells in the mucosa don't work on a Trumpian timeline. They take a few days to start producing enough viral RNA we are testing for. You can kindly request them to work faster and test 16 times, at the end of the day those lazy cells will still take a few days to turn your tests positive.


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Meanwhile...
> White House Is Not Contact Tracing ‘Super-Spreader’ Rose Garden Event​
> 
> Always finding new ways to be irresponsible.



It would be ironic if they ended up infecting the republican part of the senate pushing the SCOTUS vote to lame duck season.


----------



## iLunar

GermanSuplex said:


> This is beyond embarrassing. He always has these authoritarian-like photo-ops that he does, which remind me of the victory laps dictators take after winning a rigged election.
> 
> Watching him stand on the White House balcony, giving a salute, removing his mask and standing there as if he's a god is just laughable. Knowing he had his hairs sprayed to his style and his orange makeup applied for that moment... It's not a presidency, its a reality show.
> 
> Still in constant amazement people legitimately like this guy.




It makes me really sad for our country. The US Constitution is such a beautiful document full of really noble ideals. To see it tarnished with this casino clown shitting all over it really breaks my heart in ways I didn't think it could. 

I long for the days of integrity in our politics. The cynicism and distrust aren't sustainable for anyone. If Biden/Harris win, I truly hope they are capable of pulling us out of this whiplash of a disaster. It will take real leadership.

If Trump wins, by hook or crook, all we will have left is a mustard seed. We'll have to fight a million times harder to even come close to the American dream.


----------



## DT

GermanSuplex said:


> Watching him stand on the White House balcony, giving a salute, removing his mask and standing there as if he's a god is just laughable. Knowing he had his hairs sprayed to his style and his orange makeup applied for that moment... It's not a presidency, its a reality show.




Holy hell, he was seriously having trouble breathing in that video, probably why he pulled off his mask.  I know he's all jacked up on several drugs, but I think they just sort of "animated" him to put on this show, and he's still going to drop dead.


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> The only good thing I can say about it is that I think the last week or so has made some people _finally_ see Trump for what he is. When he's just being a dick, they're like, "Oh, that's Trump being Trump." But I think for more than a few, this is a bridge too far. His bullying "debate", his cavalier attitude about coronavirus even after catching it, his spreading it to others, his special treatment that nobody else gets, his joy ride around the hospital, and now his big show of leaving Walter Reed...it's no wonder his poll numbers are dropping. They may yet drop further still.



I suspect that the only people who had a bigger celebration than the Trumpsters outside were the medical staff inside Walter Reed.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313258660479602694/


----------



## Eric

Yoused said:


> Well,
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313192280971452418/



That is flat out freaky.


----------



## JayMysteri0

__
		http://instagr.am/p/CF97psgAj3v/


----------



## DT

ericgtr12 said:


> That is flat out freaky.




Yeah, that extended timeline is spooky ...


----------



## Yoused

ericgtr12 said:


> That is flat out freaky.



It appears that my father may have some sort of vascular dementia related to coronary artery occlusion. One day, his Wednesday bible club found he had not shown up because he was unable to get out of the bathtub, so they got him to the hospital where his coronary artery was roto-rootered. In recovery, he was stable and improving, then he was gone, just like that.

In his case, I believe that he was feeling less and less needed. Some of the things that he was doing got wrapped up, and his cat had died, so he probably felt it would be ok to just let go. Someone like the ShitGibbon will never reach that headspace – his body will simply fail because he should not have had that one hamberder.


----------



## Eric

Republicans gone wild!

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313268264223432710/


----------



## Alli

Thomas Veil said:


> Why are the networks covering this live? All this is is an ego trip for him.



His entire presidency is nothing but an ego trip.


ericgtr12 said:


> Did you see him gasping for air?



Like a fish. 

I’m watching for him to do the speed version of Herman Caine’s timeline.


----------



## Eric

Alli said:


> His entire presidency is nothing but an ego trip.
> 
> Like a fish.
> 
> I’m watching for him to do the speed version of Herman Caine’s timeline.



I was thinking I was the only one who noticed but just checked Twitter and "Gasping" is one of the top trends so I guess not lol.


----------



## JayMysteri0

ericgtr12 said:


> I was thinking I was the only one who noticed but just checked Twitter and "Gasping" is one of the top trends so I guess not lol.



Here you go
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313295629116940290/


----------



## Thomas Veil

PearsonX said:


> It would be ironic if they ended up infecting the republican part of the senate pushing the SCOTUS vote to lame duck season.



“Fortuitous” would be a better word.


----------



## iLunar

ericgtr12 said:


> Republicans gone wild!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313268264223432710/




So conspiracy theory time: Is Rudy really sick, or is he just coughing to eat up headlines to distract us from the county-by-county election fraud that they are attempting? 

I'm so sick of this shit.


----------



## User.45

ericgtr12 said:


> Republicans gone wild!
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313268264223432710/



This is very confusing to me as a physician scientist. Maybe I have an opposing opinion to myself.

But seriously. Science is about a reproducible measurable truth, not opinions. He's talking about law.


----------



## Thomas Veil

I’m worried about this quote from Trump this weekend:


> I learned it by really going to school. This is the real school. This isn’t the let’s-read-the-book school. And I get it, and I understand it, and it’s a very interesting thing, and I’m going to be letting you know about it.




When I read that, I hear, “Fauci hasn’t had Covid. I’ve had Covid. I now have more experience with it than he has. I know more than he does.”


----------



## Thomas Veil

Because of course he did.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313230232799842307/

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313265470343176192/


----------



## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> I’m worried about this quote from Trump this weekend:
> 
> 
> When I read that, I hear, “Fauci hasn’t had Covid. I’ve had Covid. I now have more experience with it than he has. I know more than he does.”



"Fauci didn't have gonorrhea, I had gonorrhea. I know more than he does!"


----------



## Eric

Thomas Veil said:


> Because of course he did.
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313230232799842307/
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313265470343176192/



His blatant disregard for the lives of everyone around him is mind blowing.


----------



## Yoused

Watch this here video and tell me if it looks like some sophisticated doctoring was done to it to obscure edits.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313267615083761665/


----------



## Thomas Veil

This is *not* The Onion:

*You can preorder a $100 'Trump defeats COVID' commemorative coin at White House Gift Shop*



> The $100 “Trump defeats COVID” coins are for sale on the website of the White House Gift Shop, which is not affiliated with the White House.





> The coin is part of a series designed by Anthony Giannini, chairman of the White House Gift Shop. He described the COVID-19 coin as the last in a series illustrating "President Trump's ascendance over and defeat of the deadly COVID pandemic virus."




Love the use of the word “ascendance”. Maybe Trump could do his next speech from the Mount of Olives.


----------



## DT

Yoused said:


> Watch this here video and tell me if it looks like some sophisticated doctoring was done to it to obscure edits.




Yes.  He looked like Max Headroom or a PS3 cutscene ...


----------



## Alli

Thomas Veil said:


> I’m worried about this quote from Trump this weekend:
> 
> 
> When I read that, I hear, “Fauci hasn’t had Covid. I’ve had Covid. I now have more experience with it than he has. I know more than he does.”



IOW, he thinks more of the school of hard knocks than a school with books.

He is so dangerous.


----------



## Yoused

Hmm, i turns out that Sean Conley, personal physician to the president, is an Osteopath. Which means he is a whisker more qualified for that post than, say, Gwyneth Paltrow.


----------



## Eric

Yoused said:


> Hmm, i turns out that Sean Conley, personal physician to the president, is an Osteopath. Which means he is a whisker more qualified for that post than, say, Gwyneth Paltrow.



He specializes in the study of YesMan.


----------



## lizkat

Thomas Veil said:


> This is *not* The Onion:
> 
> *You can preorder a $100 'Trump defeats COVID' commemorative coin at White House Gift Shop*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Love the use of the word “ascendance”. Maybe Trump could do his next speech from the Mount of Olives.




Wonderful.  Meanwhile  top US military leaders are quarantining, including chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.









						Pentagon leaders are quarantining after being exposed to the virus. (Published 2020)
					






					www.nytimes.com
				






> Gen. Mark A. Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, along with several of the Pentagon’s most senior uniformed leaders, are quarantining after being exposed to the coronavirus, a Defense Department official said on Tuesday.






> ...almost the entirety of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, including Gen. James C. McConville, the Army chief of staff, are quarantining after Adm. Charles Ray, the vice commandant of the Coast Guard, tested positive for coronavirus.
> 
> “We are aware that Vice Commandant Ray has tested positive for Covid-19 and that he was at the Pentagon last week for meetings with other senior military leaders,” Jonathan Hoffman, the Pentagon spokesman, said in a statement released by his office.


----------



## Scepticalscribe

DT said:


> Holy hell, he was seriously having trouble breathing in that video, probably why he pulled off his mask.  I know he's all jacked up on several drugs, but I think they just sort of "animated" him to put on this show, and he's still going to drop dead.




While Mr Trump cares little (actually, cares nothing) for the lives of others, those in his pay, in his staff, in his life, what this pathological liar and malevoevnt narcissist fails (completely) to understand is that those business elites (and indeed, the evangelicals) who support him, enable him, and prop him up, care nothing whatsoever for him personally.

Once his usefulness and utility to them - in facilitating their agenda - ends, they will not mourn his passing, irrespective of whether this takes a literal, or merely political, form.


----------



## lizkat

Scepticalscribe said:


> While Mr Trump cares little (actually, cares nothing) for the lives of others, those in his pay, in his staff, in his life, what this pathological liar and malevoevnt narcissist fails (completely) to understand is that those business elites (and indeed, the evangelicals) who support him, enable him, and prop him up, care nothing whatsoever for him personally.
> 
> Once his usefulness and utility to them - in facilitating their agenda - ends, they will not mourn his passing, irrespective of whether this takes a literal, or merely political, form.




That is exactly one of the risks McConnell takes in pushing the nomination of Barrett to occur before the elections.  Many Republicans will vote in person on election day,  not by mail. So if Barrett is confidently pitched by Mitch as a shoo-in by then, never mind if the floor vote has actually been taken,   some of those evangelical farmers will sigh in relief and then throw an angry bird at Trump in the balloting.... over stuff like monumental covid-19 mismanagement and the godblasted trade wars that have put many American farmers into near unsustainable financial positions with erratic, inefficient or reduced market for their crops,  and insufficient government response to their losses.


----------



## JayMysteri0




----------



## User.45

Yoused said:


> Hmm, i turns out that Sean Conley, personal physician to the president, is an Osteopath. Which means he is a whisker more qualified for that post than, say, Gwyneth Paltrow.



Nah. DOs and MDs have the same postgraduate training (at least most), so the differences are very minimal to none. Usually it is easier to get into a DO school, but this doesn't tell you much about the abilities of a DO. I'd say there are more differences between the training of a foreign MD and a US MD than a DO and a US MD.


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313615997727768579/
Justice
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313616612075986944/


----------



## User.45

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313615997727768579/
> Justice
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313616612075986944/



I wanna see Barr's results.


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313615997727768579/
> Justice
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313616612075986944/




Stephen Miller's wife already had covid-19 over the summer, she works for Pence.  Guess we'll find out whether immunity lasts awhile...  but I sure hope Kamala Harris won the debate commitee wrangle over putting up plexiglass dividers around Pence too, not just her.  Pence didn't want them.


----------



## JayMysteri0

Truth
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313617970908868610/


----------



## JayMysteri0

lizkat said:


> Stephen Miller's wife already had covid-19 over the summer, she works for Pence.  Guess we'll find out whether immunity lasts awhile...  but I sure hope Kamala Harris won the debate commitee wrangle over putting up plexiglass dividers around Pence too, not just her.  Pence didn't want them.



Just so I grasp this, the head of the covid task force is against the plexiglass dividers?  The HEAD of the covid task force?    

Scorched Earth sounds more & more like a necessity, with this administration.

Just saw that 'head' has given up his objections...  How big of him.

What an asshole!


----------



## Eric

JayMysteri0 said:


> Just so I grasp this, the head of the covid task force is against the plexiglass dividers?  The HEAD of the covid task force?
> 
> Scorched Earth sounds more & more like a necessity, with this administration.
> 
> Just saw that 'head' has given up his objections...  How big of him.
> 
> What an asshole!



It's time Biden and Harris both set some ground rules, if they can't adhere to them then nobody will blame them for refusing.


----------



## User.45

Add about Donald Trump from
      Unexpected


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313614056175984641/

Oh, and because I just want to say "Fuck you" to some others...
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313110663200464899/


----------



## Alli

lizkat said:


> Stephen Miller's wife already had covid-19 over the summer, she works for Pence.  Guess we'll find out whether immunity lasts awhile...  but I sure hope Kamala Harris won the debate commitee wrangle over putting up plexiglass dividers around Pence too, not just her.  Pence didn't want them.



Pence gave in. He didn’t have much choice.


----------



## Eric

Alli said:


> Pence gave in. He didn’t have much choice.



Oh, so there will be a plexiglass barrier? Glad to hear that, and Pence should be disclosing daily test results right now as well.


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313614056175984641/





I was thinking Miller might be fatal for onward march of the pandemic.  The virus has to move from one live host to another,  but it needs to hang out with the first host for awhile to get its strength up for the leap.


----------



## JayMysteri0

lizkat said:


> I was thinking Miller might be fatal for onward march of the pandemic.  The virus has to move from one live host to another,  but it needs to hang out with the first host for awhile to get its strength up for the leap.



If I was writing a movie, he would be in that scene mid credits, hanging out in China directing how the virus should be made based on his recommendations.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313621593793257475/
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313629899681411072/
I added this, because there aren't enough Fozzie the Bear gifs


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> If I was writing a movie, he would be in that scene mid credits, hanging out in China directing how the virus should be made based on his recommendations.




It's true there are a lot of truly wicked tweets out there right now about Stephen Miller.  He's gonna get more attention than Trump will tonight.    Uh-oh.  So much for Trump's admonition to not let covid-19 dominate our lives.  He forgot to add "... or your social media feeds."  Oops.


----------



## JayMysteri0

lizkat said:


> It's true there are a lot of truly wicked tweets out there right now about Stephen Miller.  He's gonna get more attention than Trump will tonight.    Uh-oh.  So much for Trump's admonition to not let covid-19 dominate our lives.  He forgot to add "... or your social media feeds."  Oops.



If anyone deserves...


----------



## lizkat

This is why Pence couldn't say no to a plexiglass around him at the debate tomorrow.  The news was getting around all day while the commission and the Pence and Harris reps were arguing over the matter.    Absurd.   F§ck Pence anyway, he had to know he may have been exposed and could be contagious right now.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313616485395251202/

And really looking at all these guys who spent days in a room prepping Trump for the 1st prez debate, and so many including Miller now positive, and Miller's wife's workplace proximity to Pence...   seems to me like Harris should say hell no and cancel, how is it worth it.  We know now that aerosolized covid can circulate in the air indoors too.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1312241059427221505/


----------



## JayMysteri0

It's actually getting to the point that I can't tell whether to post here or in "This Fucking Guy"
https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313509849393758208/


----------



## lizkat

And now this...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313668130221285376/

and what i think of that


----------



## JayMysteri0

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313894075347722240/

There's like a million variations of this one...


----------



## JayMysteri0

lizkat said:


> And now this...
> 
> https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313668130221285376/
> 
> and what i think of that
> 
> View attachment 675



Footage of the WH doing their contact tracing...


----------



## lizkat

JayMysteri0 said:


> Footage of the WH doing their contact tracing...




Well exactly.  The families of WH staffers must be livid by now;  it's clear the casual attitudes by Trump and some of his aides towards safety protocols have made the place a dangerous work site.

I don't get why the aides and inner circle of top level advisors, cabinet heads etc. still let Trump boss them around when it comes to covid_19 issues.  It's not just public health now, and I get it that their politics gives them a blind eye on some of his messaging. But a bunch of them have been sickened themselves now,  yet they're still reluctant to call in GOP leaders and medics and sit him down (maybe w/ some family like Ivanka) and say "NO MORE, you're ill, Pence will step in until you're able to resume working," 

What the hell is the 25A for anyway.  Is this guy actually running the government on steroids and a not-for-public-use cocktail of antivirals?     Meanwhile the schmuck walks around the WH creating potential hot spots of infection for more innocent WH workers to encounter.  It's not like he has ever seemed to give a damn about them, but to show he doesn't care even now is quite a tell as to his core values:  he has none.


----------



## JayMysteri0

lizkat said:


> Well exactly.  The families of WH staffers must be livid by now;  it's clear the casual attitudes by Trump and some of his aides towards safety protocols have made the place a dangerous work site.
> 
> I don't get why the aides and inner circle of top level advisors, cabinet heads etc. still let Trump boss them around when it comes to covid_19 issues.  It's not just public health now, and I get it that their politics gives them a blind eye on some of his messaging. But a bunch of them have been sickened themselves now,  yet they're still reluctant to call in GOP leaders and medics and sit him down (maybe w/ some family like Ivanka) and say "NO MORE, you're ill, Pence will step in until you're able to resume working,"
> 
> What the hell is the 25A for anyway.  Is this guy actually running the government on steroids and a not-for-public-use cocktail of antivirals?     Meanwhile the schmuck walks around the WH creating potential hot spots of infection for more innocent WH workers to encounter.  It's not like he has ever seemed to give a damn about them, but to show he doesn't care even now is quite a tell as to his core values:  he has none.



https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1313952940260876288/


----------



## User.45

lizkat said:


> Well exactly.  The families of WH staffers must be livid by now;  it's clear the casual attitudes by Trump and some of his aides towards safety protocols have made the place a dangerous work site.
> 
> I don't get why the aides and inner circle of top level advisors, cabinet heads etc. still let Trump boss them around when it comes to covid_19 issues.  It's not just public health now, and I get it that their politics gives them a blind eye on some of his messaging. But a bunch of them have been sickened themselves now,  yet they're still reluctant to call in GOP leaders and medics and sit him down (maybe w/ some family like Ivanka) and say "NO MORE, you're ill, Pence will step in until you're able to resume working,"
> 
> What the hell is the 25A for anyway.  Is this guy actually running the government on steroids and a not-for-public-use cocktail of antivirals?     Meanwhile the schmuck walks around the WH creating potential hot spots of infection for more innocent WH workers to encounter.  It's not like he has ever seemed to give a damn about them, but to show he doesn't care even now is quite a tell as to his core values:  he has none.



Because that would adversely affect the cash out they took the job for:
Analyst jobs at Fox or lobbyist positions in DC.


----------



## JayMysteri0

lizkat said:


> Well exactly.  The families of WH staffers must be livid by now;  it's clear the casual attitudes by Trump and some of his aides towards safety protocols have made the place a dangerous work site.
> 
> I don't get why the aides and inner circle of top level advisors, cabinet heads etc. still let Trump boss them around when it comes to covid_19 issues.  It's not just public health now, and I get it that their politics gives them a blind eye on some of his messaging. But a bunch of them have been sickened themselves now,  yet they're still reluctant to call in GOP leaders and medics and sit him down (maybe w/ some family like Ivanka) and say "NO MORE, you're ill, Pence will step in until you're able to resume working,"
> 
> What the hell is the 25A for anyway.  Is this guy actually running the government on steroids and a not-for-public-use cocktail of antivirals?     Meanwhile the schmuck walks around the WH creating potential hot spots of infection for more innocent WH workers to encounter.  It's not like he has ever seemed to give a damn about them, but to show he doesn't care even now is quite a tell as to his core values:  he has none.



One more for you...

__
		http://instagr.am/p/CGDLfJzDamU/


----------



## User.45

I'll paste it here. I've never seen such a piece in NEJM:

_Why has the United States handled this pandemic so badly? We have failed at almost every step. We had ample warning, but when the disease first arrived, we were incapable of testing effectively and couldn’t provide even the most basic personal protective equipment to health care workers and the general public. And we continue to be way behind the curve in testing. While the absolute numbers of tests have increased substantially, the more useful metric is the number of tests performed per infected person, a rate that puts us far down the international list, below such places as Kazakhstan, Zimbabwe, and Ethiopia, countries that cannot boast the biomedical infrastructure or the manufacturing capacity that we have.2 Moreover, a lack of emphasis on developing capacity has meant that U.S. test results are often long delayed, rendering the results useless for disease control.

Although we tend to focus on technology, most of the interventions that have large effects are not complicated. The United States instituted quarantine and isolation measures late and inconsistently, often without any effort to enforce them, after the disease had spread substantially in many communities. Our rules on social distancing have in many places been lackadaisical at best, with loosening of restrictions long before adequate disease control had been achieved. And in much of the country, people simply don’t wear masks, largely because our leaders have stated outright that masks are political tools rather than effective infection control measures. The government has appropriately invested heavily in vaccine development, but its rhetoric has politicized the development process and led to growing public distrust.

The United States came into this crisis with enormous advantages. Along with tremendous manufacturing capacity, we have a biomedical research system that is the envy of the world. We have enormous expertise in public health, health policy, and basic biology and have consistently been able to turn that expertise into new therapies and preventive measures. And much of that national expertise resides in government institutions. Yet our leaders have largely chosen to ignore and even denigrate experts.

The response of our nation’s leaders has been consistently inadequate. The federal government has largely abandoned disease control to the states. Governors have varied in their responses, not so much by party as by competence. But whatever their competence, governors do not have the tools that Washington controls. Instead of using those tools, the federal government has undermined them. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which was the world’s leading disease response organization, has been eviscerated and has suffered dramatic testing and policy failures. The National Institutes of Health have played a key role in vaccine development but have been excluded from much crucial government decision making. And the Food and Drug Administration has been shamefully politicized,3 appearing to respond to pressure from the administration rather than scientific evidence. Our current leaders have undercut trust in science and in government,4 causing damage that will certainly outlast them. Instead of relying on expertise, the administration has turned to uninformed “opinion leaders” and charlatans who obscure the truth and facilitate the promulgation of outright lies.

Let’s be clear about the cost of not taking even simple measures. An outbreak that has disproportionately affected communities of color has exacerbated the tensions associated with inequality. Many of our children are missing school at critical times in their social and intellectual development. The hard work of health care professionals, who have put their lives on the line, has not been used wisely. Our current leadership takes pride in the economy, but while most of the world has opened up to some extent, the United States still suffers from disease rates that have prevented many businesses from reopening, with a resultant loss of hundreds of billions of dollars and millions of jobs. And more than 200,000 Americans have died. Some deaths from Covid-19 were unavoidable. But, although it is impossible to project the precise number of additional American lives lost because of weak and inappropriate government policies, it is at least in the tens of thousands in a pandemic that has already killed more Americans than any conflict since World War II.

Anyone else who recklessly squandered lives and money in this way would be suffering legal consequences. Our leaders have largely claimed immunity for their actions. But this election gives us the power to render judgment. Reasonable people will certainly disagree about the many political positions taken by candidates. But truth is neither liberal nor conservative. When it comes to the response to the largest public health crisis of our time, our current political leaders have demonstrated that they are dangerously incompetent. We should not abet them and enable the deaths of thousands more Americans by allowing them to keep their jobs._

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2029812


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## User.45




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## Eric




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## Thomas Veil

Trump asked Walter Reed doctors to sign non-disclosure agreements in 2019​*At least two Walter Reed doctors who refused to sign non-disclosure agreements last year were not permitted to be involved in Trump’s care.*



> President Donald Trump required personnel at Walter Reed National Military Medical Center to sign non-disclosure agreements last year before they could be involved with treating him, according to four people familiar with the process.





> During a surprise trip to Walter Reed on Nov. 16, 2019, Trump mandated signed NDAs from both physicians and nonmedical staff, most of whom are active-duty military service members, these people said. At least two doctors at Walter Reed who refused to sign NDAs were subsequently not permitted to have any involvement in the president's care, two of the people said.





> The reason for his trip last year remains shrouded in mystery.




Yeah, nothing suspicious here. Trump is Mr. Transparency.


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## Edd

Thomas Veil said:


> Trump asked Walter Reed doctors to sign non-disclosure agreements in 2019​*At least two Walter Reed doctors who refused to sign non-disclosure agreements last year were not permitted to be involved in Trump’s care.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, nothing suspicious here. Trump is Mr. Transparency.



Doctor: You mean I get to not take part in keeping Trump alive? I’ll not sign whatever you want.


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## User.45

Thomas Veil said:


> Trump asked Walter Reed doctors to sign non-disclosure agreements in 2019​*At least two Walter Reed doctors who refused to sign non-disclosure agreements last year were not permitted to be involved in Trump’s care.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, nothing suspicious here. Trump is Mr. Transparency.



Those 2 doctors are the smart ones, who spared themselves from getting involved in this shit show, and I promise they did it for this exact reason.


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## Yoused




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