exoticspice1
Site Champ
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2022
- Posts
- 381
Can Apple add it to later SoCs or ARM can't use Hyperthreading or SMT like x86 chips?
Is hyperthreading even useful?
Is hyperthreading even useful?
Can Apple add it to later SoCs or ARM can't use Hyperthreading or SMT like x86 chips?
Is hyperthreading even useful?
Intel has turned a design issue into a marketing item. Amazing how this comes up now and then.
Don't tell MR members. They believe there is a distinction between turbo boost and throttling. One is good, the other is very, very bad.Same with “turbo boost.”
Don't tell MR members. They believe there is a distinction between turbo boost and throttling. One is good, the other is very, very bad.
Sadly, even Ars Technica bought into the nonsense and quoted MaxTech. Not a good look.One of the most clever things Intel did was that marketing. Turn a negative into a positive.
In Intel's world there actually is a distinction, and one is in fact good and the other very, very bad. The problem is that the forums experts are trying to map their vague understanding of a context-dependent truth to a different system, and failing at understanding the limits of their knowledge.Don't tell MR members. They believe there is a distinction between turbo boost and throttling. One is good, the other is very, very bad.
I regularly experienced what you called 'Intel throttling' on both my 2011 and 2014 15" MBP's whenever the room temp got into the low 80's. My laptops were on a raised aluminum stand (Rain Design mStand, https://www.raindesigninc.com/mstand.html), so they were well-ventiated.Intel "throttling", on the other hand, is emergency measures. Throttling is what an Intel chip does to prevent severe overtemps, or avoid damaging motherboard VRMs if they're complaining about running in excess of their rated current. There's two kinds of throttling response. One is simply pulling clocks (and voltages) all the way down to minimums otherwise seen only in idle states (usually about 800 MHz iirc). However, since that takes nonzero time (voltages can't slew immediately), another common Intel emergency measure is gating dispatch rate, making the processor immediately downgrade itself way below 1 instruction per clock.
So, Intel throttling actually is super bad, and in a well engineered system, you should essentially never experience it. The only worse thing which can happen is a forced shutdown (which will happen if even throttling fails to get things under control).
What else other than opteron would we have worked on? I mean, the *original* K8 was a whole other thing, but we had no choice but to do what became Opteron because almost the entire design team resigned and what you had left were around 15-20 folks between circuit design, logic design, and architecture. And even Opteron (which we called sledgehammer) almost didn’t happen - there was a dinner at La Papillon that ended in a vote. The alternative was we go work elsewhere.I wonder about what would have happened if AMD had abandoned the Opteron project in the late '90s to focus more on other products. Intel was intent on going all in with Itanic and had no back-up plan to deal with its duddiness. PPC was the only other mainstream 64-bit processor at the time. How long would it have taken Intel to get something practical going? Could mips or sparc have become viable?
The dude goes crazy and essentially throws me out of his office. The next day I get a long voice mail from the manager, explaining why they can’t hire me because I wouldn’t be able to “keep up.” He runs out of time on my answering machine, and calls back and leaves a second message explaining in more detail why I suck because I touched the workstation.
Those guys are lucky I hadn’t gone to law school by that point![]()
I suspect the actual boring answer would've been something like:Anyway, what would have happened if Opteron wasn’t a thing? Well, either Merced/Itanium would have succeeded, for lack of alternative, OR PowerPC/Power would have succeeded, or maybe AMD would have done something else that would have pulled the industry along (there is some possibility it could have been ARM - it would have HAD to have been some form of RISC since we didn’t have manpower to do something huge. But whatever it would have been would have required Microsoft’s buy-in. That is often overlooked - we would never have done Opteron if Microsoft didn’t agree to put Windows on it.)
The pc I bought for college had one of those. Was made by a company called AST. Can’t remember how fast, but probably something like 16 MHz or less.The real Turbo Boost was that button on the front of the PC...?
The pc I bought for college had one of those. Was made by a company called AST. Can’t remember how fast, but probably something like 16 MHz or less.
Pretty sure mine was a 386. Built a little breadboard thing so me and my roommate could “network” our machines using the rs232 port. I remember coding in turbo pascal for a lumped parameters class on that thing, and using it to access the campus mainframe. Don’t recall what happened to it or when I replaced it. Don’t even remember what I replaced it with. I think I may have bought it on CDW? I recall I definitely bought RAM for it on CDW and it was crazy expensive.Oh yeah, probably the AST Premium/286We sold those as our "premium brand" at the computer store where I worked. Really nicely put together machines, beefy case, easily accessed components, a good factory backed warranty (only sold through authorized dealers). I even remember the first one I installed was at Georgia-Pacific for one of their mechanical engineers (they actually manufacture paper related products).
Before that we sold the holy heck out of their Six Pack Plus expansion card.
They did really well, until the no-name clones took over the PC space and they didn't predict or flow with the low end market, and they got creamed.
Don't tell MR members. They believe there is a distinction between turbo boost and throttling. One is good, the other is very, very bad.
Well that tale didn't end quite the way I expected! Boo on the guy for going nuts just because you attempted to do what you needed to bullshit gotcha question, and on his manager for not seeing through it. And, y'know, if you like other things about a candidate and they demonstrate in front of your eyes that they won't need much training on your weird CAD software almost nobody else uses... hire them???
I usually work under contract so it is pretty rare that if someone is willing to pay my rate that I don't want the job. Mercenary.People seem to forget sometimes that the interview process is as much about determining whether YOU even want the job, as it is about the employer deciding whether to hire you.
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