Big Tech and Russia

Huntn

Whatwerewe talk'n about?
Site Donor
Posts
5,303
Reaction score
5,265
Location
The Misty Mountains
On websites that primarily focus on Apple, we quite often hear the argument from the comments section that "Apple should leave market "X" because country "Y" is unfairly doing action "Z"." Some examples from Apple partisans include:

- "Apple should leave the Netherlands because the Dutch anti-trust authority is charging them €5 million per week over dating apps."
- "Apple should leave South Korea because they are being heavy-handed with their anti-trust investigations while being heavily biased in favor of Samsung."
- "Apple should leave China because their manufacturing partners use slave labor and exploit persecuted minority groups."
- "Apple should leave the EU because anti-trust regulators have unfairly and repeatedly targeted the company."
- "Apple should leave Japan because their Fair Trade Commission is forcing Apple to make changes to its App Store practices with reader apps."
- "Apple should leave Saudi Arabia because they suppress free press and persecute the LGBT community."
- I've even heard "Apple should leave America because the U.S. Congress is working on anti-trust legislation that would break the current iOS security model with the App Store."

I could go on about this, but you get the idea. Regardless of where you personally stand on Apple's guilt or innocence in regards to anti-trust regulations, how they implement their security measures within their software, whether that is an excuse or not to protect a major revenue stream with the App Store, how much this impacts Apple's relationship with developers, or whether or not Apple should allow "side loading" by providing a toggle within iOS system settings likes Google does with Android, this is undeniably a hot topic in recent times.

I personally am quite hesitant for world governments to get involved in the tech sector. The industry moves quickly, and by the time governments enforce changes, the technology itself has moved on. Exhibit "A" would be how much impact that regulations had on Microsoft, a convicted monopolist. Anti-trust rulings had basically no impact on the way Microsoft has done business. You can already see the same old shenanigans are being done with Edge and forcing users to jump through hoops in order to make a different browser the default within Windows 11.

I can see both sides of the argument on Apple's part. A few missteps aside, Apple has done a remarkably good job with privacy and security, compared to their competition, which has been a lasting advantage for them. I occasionally re-read Steve Jobs' "Thoughts on Flash" open letter on occasion, to remind myself of how much privacy and security have been priorities for Apple spanning back decades. At the same time, as a user of both Android and Apple devices, I can see the appeal of being able to load anything on my devices as needed. My Mac remains quite secure, I have never had a security or privacy issue since I switched to OS X back in 2005, and enjoy the balance between security/privacy and the ability to run code as I see fit. Other than an occasional botch with a security issue that wasn't patched quickly enough, or the foolish (and apparently abandoned) attempt to implement CSAM on-device scanning, Apple has had an exemplary record compared to their competition.

In regards to the investigations and political implications, I don't know how Steve Jobs would have handled these multinational anti-trust inquires, but I am sure that he would have handled it differently than Tim Cook. Cook is as much a politician as he is the company's CEO. Apple is much larger and diversified than it was under Jobs, and therefore likely requires a different skill set for a CEO when dealing with regulatory bodies, politicians, and lobbying governments. I'm not sure Jobs would have had the patience to deal with the hurdles that are in front of Apple. I'm not one of those people who is going to blame Tim Cook for not being Steve Jobs, because he was a once in a generation (or multiple generations) talent, but it is worth noting that Cook's temperament is substantially different from Jobs.

Regardless of Tim Cook and his interactions with various politicians around the globe, the situation with Ukraine and Russia is a different matter entirely compared to the above examples I started this post with. Yes, Russia's Federal Anti-monopoly Service (FAS) has its own investigation currently ongoing in regards to price-fixing and monopolistic restrictions in the App Store. Those were announced months ago and have nothing to do with the current conflict.

Tim Cook has always been measured in his approach to anything remotely controversial, including the war in Ukraine, in this case going on Twitter and expressing that he is "deeply concerned", that Apple will support "local humanitarian efforts", and will "join those calling for peace". If I've ever read a statement of political expedience, then that is one. It's all feel good words while offering absolutely nothing of substance.

As I pointed out at the beginning of this long message, Apple has been called upon by their fans to leave any market that they deem to be offensive to their favorite fruit company. If Apple left every market that had a government that was skeptical toward them, then they'd have very few actual markets to compete in. However, I think that Tim Cook and Apple are misreading the room on this one. Other than those who are heavily partisan toward Vladamir Putin's efforts to rebuild a greater Russia, I see few upsides to continuing to stay neutral. Tim Cook never fails to proclaim how virtuous he and Apple are, yet the CEO of the biggest tech company in the world has said almost nothing about the atrocities taking place in Ukraine.

There is an argument to be made that pulling out of the Russian market would only be a detriment toward the average Russian consumer and Russian developers. I myself purchase Mac software made by Russian programmers and they have some very talented engineers. I don't want to see them punished because of their government. For instance, I very much enjoy the Pathfinder series of games made by Owlcat Studios on my Mac, which are a Russian gaming house. On the flip side, I also enjoy the the Metro franchise, developed by 4A Studios, whom are primarily based in Ukraine. 4A recently put out a tweet apologizing for not being able to provide tech support; I think that is understandable considering that there are bombs dropping around them, and there are more important things than computer games. I have no idea if 4A will be able to continue to make games that I enjoy on my Mac. I have no idea if the announced sanctions will prevent Owlcat from collecting payment from those purchasing their Pathfinder games, potentially putting them out of business. Neither company is at fault for the current geopolitical situation and just want to make computer games, which I enjoy on my Mac.

Of course, there are more important things right now than Mac gaming, but it's the analogy I decided to use, because it involves developers that just want to make software, not get into a war that is heavily impacting their countries. However, what I am certain of is that Vladimir Putin's actions cannot go unpunished. There will be economic hardships regardless of what happens, so the heaviest sanctions possible are appropriate, in my opinion. Tim Cook should take off his political moderation hat, stop trying to please everyone, and pull Apple products and support from the Russian market, at least until a peaceful solution is reached (that doesn't involve installing a puppet regime). Apple Pay is no longer being processed within the Russian Federation, and the limited SWIFT sanctions may make it so that Apple cannot collect payment on product purchases anyway. As a result of Russian demands on big tech companies, Apple just opened their first corporate office in Moscow this past month, but it's not like they have a heavy presence within the country, like they do with the Chinese.

Even sleazy Facebook is no longer accepting advertising revenue from Russian media outlets and is labeling any content from them as being propaganda. If Facebook is taking the moral lead (albeit self-serving for Facebook), something Apple tends to pride itself on, then something is wrong. I don't want to see the average Russian consumer or software developer punished for the misdeeds of their corrupt leadership, but beyond escalating the conflict outside of Ukraine, which nobody wants, strong unified sanctions from a coalition of other nations are the only thing that might have an impact. Tim Cook seems to instinctively try to keep the heat off of Apple, no matter what, but this should be an easy decision on his part. Yet, we haven't seen anything other than his typical platitudes.
The sad fact is you can either have government involved in tech, or you can have a neutered government. Some might say that the latter is good, but usually the premise and goal is that your government is a positive mechanism for society, that you want it functional and able to address the issues we expect it to be able to.
 

Colstan

Site Champ
Posts
822
Reaction score
1,124
According to an article over at the mothership, Apple has halted sales inside of Russia, following international sanctions, and a direct appeal from Ukraine's vice prime minister. Attempting to place an order on Apple's Russian website lists all Apple devices as "unavailable". Apple has also ceased all shipments into the sales channel, Apple Pay is unusable, and state-run propaganda media outlets have been blocked outside of Russia. Apple will also be matching employee charitable donations to relevant humanitarian organizations by a 2:1 ratio, and is working to support their teams inside Ukraine. Notably, live updates for Apple Maps have been disabled within Ukraine in an attempt to make it more difficult for the Russian military to navigate within the country and target Ukrainian citizens.

Tim Cook also sent out a letter to Apple employees, featuring his usual flowery boilerplate language, but in this case, actions are more important than words. A cynical view is that international sanctions, particularly those imposed on the Russian banking system, make it somewhere between difficult to impossible for Russians to actually pay for Apple products, not to mention the precipitous decline of the Ruble, making trade within the Russian Federation significantly more volatile. Apple's revenue from the Russian market going forward would likely be substantially reduced, due to sanctions and market forces. Hence, it made little sense to continue doing business within the country, due to growing pressure to suspend commerce within Russia. In their defense, Apple is a risk-adverse company, with a CEO that isn't known for knee-jerk reactions, and the company has clearly defined a comprehensive response to the situation.

Regardless of Apple's intent, they are doing the right thing, which is what ultimately matters. I have to wonder what Apple's reaction would be if China were to invade Taiwan, due to Apple's depedance on Chinese manufacturing, but that's another discussion entirely. For now, I believe we should commend them for doing the right thing. Whether the average Russian citizen is willing to put heat on the Putin regime because they can't purchase iPhones and Macs is questionable, but the cumulative impact from multiple countries and industries has to be taking a toll on the Russian economy, at least in the short term.
 

Cmaier

Site Master
Staff Member
Site Donor
Top Poster Of Month
Posts
5,509
Reaction score
8,953
According to an article over at the mothership, Apple has halted sales inside of Russia, following international sanctions, and a direct appeal from Ukraine's vice prime minister. Attempting to place an order on Apple's Russian website lists all Apple devices as "unavailable". Apple has also ceased all shipments into the sales channel, Apple Pay is unusable, and state-run propaganda media outlets have been blocked outside of Russia. Apple will also be matching employee charitable donations to relevant humanitarian organizations by a 2:1 ratio, and is working to support their teams inside Ukraine. Notably, live updates for Apple Maps have been disabled within Ukraine in an attempt to make it more difficult for the Russian military to navigate within the country and target Ukrainian citizens.

Tim Cook also sent out a letter to Apple employees, featuring his usual flowery boilerplate language, but in this case, actions are more important than words. A cynical view is that international sanctions, particularly those imposed on the Russian banking system, make it somewhere between difficult to impossible for Russians to actually pay for Apple products, not to mention the precipitous decline of the Ruble, making trade within the Russian Federation significantly more volatile. Apple's revenue from the Russian market going forward would likely be substantially reduced, due to sanctions and market forces. Hence, it made little sense to continue doing business within the country, due to growing pressure to suspend commerce within Russia. In their defense, Apple is a risk-adverse company, with a CEO that isn't known for knee-jerk reactions, and the company has clearly defined a comprehensive response to the situation.

Regardless of Apple's intent, they are doing the right thing, which is what ultimately matters. I have to wonder what Apple's reaction would be if China were to invade Taiwan, due to Apple's depedance on Chinese manufacturing, but that's another discussion entirely. For now, I believe we should commend them for doing the right thing. Whether the average Russian citizen is willing to put heat on the Putin regime because they can't purchase iPhones and Macs is questionable, but the cumulative impact from multiple countries and industries has to be taking a toll on the Russian economy, at least in the short term.

Were china to invade Taiwan, Apple would have little say in the matter of what to do. Doubtless they’d be blocked from importing anything from china by sanctions, not to mention practical realities.

The question I have and I haven’t seen an answer for is whether the App Store is available still. And presumably icloud still works. If Apple wanted to make an actual difference they could turn that stuff off.
 

Runs For Fun

Masochist
Site Donor
Posts
2,057
Reaction score
3,034
Location
Ohio
Were china to invade Taiwan, Apple would have little say in the matter of what to do. Doubtless they’d be blocked from importing anything from china by sanctions, not to mention practical realities.

The question I have and I haven’t seen an answer for is whether the App Store is available still. And presumably icloud still works. If Apple wanted to make an actual difference they could turn that stuff off.
I haven’t seen any kind of official answer but it sounds like that stuff is still accessible.
 

Huntn

Whatwerewe talk'n about?
Site Donor
Posts
5,303
Reaction score
5,265
Location
The Misty Mountains
Were china to invade Taiwan, Apple would have little say in the matter of what to do. Doubtless they’d be blocked from importing anything from china by sanctions, not to mention practical realities.

The question I have and I haven’t seen an answer for is whether the App Store is available still. And presumably icloud still works. If Apple wanted to make an actual difference they could turn that stuff off.
This has always been the huge danger of placing the bulk of your manufacturing overseas And it’s not a new worry. My grandfather once warned my father, WWII era about sending technology out of the country.

And just look at China, the western corportacracy has turned China into a manufacturing powerhouse, they have a country full of people who know how to make things, while in very many cases we know who do do it on paper but don’t have a similarly skilled workforce. At some point this is big trouble and why you need a government who manages this technology transfer.
 

Nycturne

Elite Member
Posts
1,148
Reaction score
1,502
This has always been the huge danger of placing the bulk of your manufacturing overseas And it’s not a new worry. My grandfather once warned my father, WWII era about sending technology out of the country.

And just look at China, the western corportacracy has turned China into a manufacturing powerhouse, they have a country full of people who know how to make things, while in very many cases we know who do do it on paper but don’t have a similarly skilled workforce. At some point this is big trouble and why you need a government who manages this technology transfer.

The idea was that by intertwining national economies this tightly with other nations, a nation can't wage wars of aggression without being cut off from things they need day-to-day.

The problem with the idea is that a country that can bring enough of that global economy under their sphere of influence, or simply stops caring about global trade (i.e. isolationist), can start telling the rest of the world to take a flying leap. One thing that concerns me about China is that they have clearly been interested in bringing R&D within their borders to have the full stack "in house". They are already emboldened enough to push the line on IP to do so, with ARM just being the most recent example I can think of. It already feels like they just want to say "What can you do about it? Really?"
 

Cmaier

Site Master
Staff Member
Site Donor
Top Poster Of Month
Posts
5,509
Reaction score
8,953
Looks like Apple Maps has reassigned crimea to Ukraine
 

Cmaier

Site Master
Staff Member
Site Donor
Top Poster Of Month
Posts
5,509
Reaction score
8,953
…and looks like Russia cut off access to “app stores.”
 
Top Bottom
1 2