Invasion of Venezuela

T

tomO2013

Power User
Joined
Nov 8, 2021
Posts
176
Just woke up today to this news. I'm just in shock.


www.bbc.com

Venezuela latest: Captured Venezuelan leader Maduro arrives in New York after US strikes

Trump said the US will "run" Venezuela "until a safe and proper and judicious transition", while Caracas denounces the “military aggression".
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

www.theatlantic.com

Venezuela

The Atlantic's coverage of Venezuela
www.theatlantic.com www.theatlantic.com

apnews.com

US plans to 'run' Venezuela and tap its oil reserves, Trump says, after operation to oust Maduro

President Donald Trump says the United States will run Venezuela at least temporarily after an audacious military operation plucked leader Nicolás Maduro from power and removed him from the country.
apnews.com apnews.com
 
This is the type of post that used to go in the news forum before it was closed. Eric, please correct me if I’m wrong, but I assume you don’t want stuff like this here, either.
 
Roller said:
This is the type of post that used to go in the news forum before it was closed. Eric, please correct me if I’m wrong, but I assume you don’t want stuff like this here, either.
Click to expand...
It's a pretty big topic, maybe we can keep it neutral.
 
Roller said:
This is the type of post that used to go in the news forum before it was closed. Eric, please correct me if I’m wrong, but I assume you don’t want stuff like this here, either.
Click to expand...

Hi Folks,

Would somebody please get me up to speed - I took a break for a while from social media and the forums in general so probably missed the news thread going away here.

This was not intended to be a shit-stir post , but more intended to share a major news world event that is being reported right across the globe on all of the major news outlets.

@Adminstrators : If this is going to open a can of worms for you guys, or make moderation life hard, feel free to nuke the thread.

Thanks,
T.
 
Citysnaps said:
Just so I (and others) know, what are the boundaries?
Click to expand...
I think as long as it's civil it's fine. IMO this is a pretty important topic, also agree that it's meant to deflect for better or worse but we're in a bad place right now either way. It's my hope that the midterms can at least change course or slow things down.
 
Eric said:
I think as long as it's civil it's fine. IMO this is a pretty important topic, also agree that it's meant to deflect for better or worse but we're in a bad place right now either way. It's my hope that the midterms can at least change course or slow things down.
Click to expand...

Thanks.

My sense is over the last few months more Repub legislators have had enough of his shenanigans. And today's incursion and kidnapping, using the US military no less, is so over the top that he'll lose more of them. Which, along with midterms, is good for impeachment eventually being on the table. Why the truck are we futzing around in another country's business when things here are such a mess? I suspect it's really about two things: distracting the news coverage and public awareness regarding the E files, and, eventually bringing back US control/ownership of their oil production (that was lost back in the mid 1970s).
 
David McWilliams (Economics Professor at Trinity College Dublin and author) had a fascinating take on the Venezuela situation in a podcast interview episode with Jean Gabriel Tokatlian of America's quarterly https://americasquarterly.org/article/donald-trump-and-the-return-of-the-monroe-doctrine/. This podcast aired two weeks before yesterday's events.


McWilliams and Tokatlian argued that the removal of Maduro and the embargo aren't really about narcotics. Considering President Trump recently pardoned Honduran President Juan Orlando Hernandez - who was convicted of drug crimes - it is a hard sell to claim Maduro was targeted solely for that reason.

Instead, they posit that this is the reestablishment of a modern Monroe Doctrine. The core argument is that if Venezuela falls, Cuba is next.

Venezuela has long been a critical economic lifeline for Cuba, providing subsidized oil and financial support. By collapsing the Venezuelan petrostate, the US effectively cuts off Cuba's energy resources. This leaves the Cuban government vulnerable to collapse without the US needing to intervene there militarily.

Trump’s recent comment about the US running Venezuela until "a proper transition can take place" does support this theory. It looks like a move to reassert control over "Washington's backyard", dismantling the primary hub of anti-American sentiment and removing proxies for external powers like Russia or China. It’s essentially a tactical victory in a larger proxy war, with the fall of Cuba being the ultimate strategic prize.

It will be very interesting to see how this plays out over the coming weeks and months.

I'd be very interested to hear your respective thoughts :)
 
Eric said:
I think as long as it's civil it's fine. IMO this is a pretty important topic, also agree that it's meant to deflect for better or worse but we're in a bad place right now either way. It's my hope that the midterms can at least change course or slow things down.
Click to expand...
Thanks, Eric. So many horrible things have happened in just the brief interval since the news forum was shut down. I welcome the opportunity to comment about events civilly while avoiding the rancor that plagued some previous discussions. But please do what makes you comfortable.
 
I don’t think Cuba is next. I say Greenland.

Reason: it’s not about exporting democracy, etc., it’s about natural resources.
 
Cmaier said:
I don’t think Cuba is next. I say Greenland.

Reason: it’s not about exporting democracy, etc., it’s about natural resources.
Click to expand...

I'm really hoping that you are wrong. That would be incredibly damaging if not catastrophic to NATO and the relationship between Europe and the US. It would represent the end of NATO in my humble opinion.
The current administration has said it - numerous times - and we in Canada are not immune from the threat of annexation either.
 
tomO2013 said:
I'm really hoping that you are wrong. That would be incredibly damaging if not catastrophic to NATO and the relationship between Europe and the US. It would represent the end of NATO in my humble opinion.
The current administration has said it - numerous times - and we in Canada are not immune from the threat of annexation either.
Click to expand...
I am personally campaigning for annexation of Quebec, simply because it’s really hard to get poutine here. I’m opposed to annexation of all of Canada, however, because while we’d get Rush, we’d also have to receive the Tragically Hip, and America is too great a country for that.
 
Citysnaps said:
My sense is over the last few months more Repub legislators have had enough of his shenanigans. And today's incursion and kidnapping, using the US military no less, is so over the top that he'll lose more of them.
Click to expand...
I'm afraid there is a good chance that any such losses will be made up by encouraging more Rah Rah MAGAts. Not to mention the effect of this "win" on the orange menace himself.
The only thing that might change that is if this adventure turns into a disastrous quagmire à la "Special military operation" ... but who wants to root for such an outcome? :cautious:

What I'd like to know is who screwed up the messaging about the Venezuelan VP, saying she was on board, with her response just hours later condemning the operation in strongest terms ???
 
Last edited:
cbum said:
I'm afraid there is a good chance that any such losses will be made up by encouraging more Rah Rah MAGAts. Not to mention the effect of this "win" on the orange menace himself.
The only thing that might change that is if this adventure turns into a disastrous quagmire à la "Special military operation" ... but who wants to root for such an outcome? :cautious:

What I'd like to know is who screwed up the messaging about the Venezuelan VP, saying she was on board, with her response just hours later condemning the operation in strongest terms ???
Click to expand...
While it’s impossible to know right now for sure what is happening, one interpretation is that this was almost inside coup conducted by members of the Maduro regime using the US military as the means and the Trump administration as chumps - ie that in helping get rid of Maduro they made promises to the Trump administration that they have no intention of keeping. It is also possible that their rhetoric is for the home audience “rubes”. I don’t think this is true mind you. But there’s a lot of strange shit.

The simpler and more likely answer is simply incompetence on the Trump administration. There were reportedly talks with the VP taking over earlier this year that supposedly fell through but those talks were made with Maduro’s approval and Maduro stepping down into a life of leisure. But that may have been why they thought they’d have a willing accomplice in the government now. So who knows?
 
Last edited:
cbum said:
What I'd like to know is who screwed up the messaging about the Venezuelan VP, saying she was on board, with her response just hours later condemning the operation in strongest terms ???
Click to expand...
If the messaging originated from the administration, the probability of misinformation is quite high. Mohammed Saeed al Sahaf ("Baghdad Bob") is still alive and has a direct line to the West Wing.
 
Back
Top