Electric Vehicles: General topics

We're not really campers, but this is absolutely slick. Tent is powered, lit, and shares the HVAC system:

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And that whole tent assembly folds down into this decently compact roof carrier:

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Love the aero treatment on the rear edge of the roof, much more visible in this studio photo:

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Yeah, yeah, I get it, no Car Play, but the Rivian R2 is coming together nicely. Even with the lack of ACP, it's not off the table for us (we have a same day, early reservation too).
 
DT said:
There's been a lot of announcements, just not sure who's actively in process.

EA is changing to new (apparently much better) hardware:



And apparently that will involve NACS availability as well for some existing CCS locations.

IONNA doing some neat stuff, I like how they're offering different charging experiences:

View attachment 34370


And this was interesting, a new EV9 picked up and it was NACS (the owner wasn't even aware):

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With how slow others are dragging their feet, I wonder if the whole thing will fall apart. I mean with how much Tesla seems to be hated, I dunno why these companies are going to bother using a plug that is clearly associated with Tesla. Or even want their vehicles to be seen using Tesla Superchargers.
 
diamond.g said:
With how slow others are dragging their feet, I wonder if the whole thing will fall apart. I mean with how much Tesla seems to be hated, I dunno why these companies are going to bother using a plug that is clearly associated with Tesla. Or even want their vehicles to be seen using Tesla Superchargers.
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Plus it seems like you would be a sitting duck at any of them right now.
 
diamond.g said:
With how slow others are dragging their feet, I wonder if the whole thing will fall apart. I mean with how much Tesla seems to be hated, I dunno why these companies are going to bother using a plug that is clearly associated with Tesla. Or even want their vehicles to be seen using Tesla Superchargers.
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The plug standard itself is in the hands of SAE now, so it will be harder for Tesla to try to gain leverage. There’s still more benefit IMO in unifying under a single plug standard, than spiting Musk in this instance. Keep in mind that the switch was predicated on a couple of things: Tesla dropping the unusual patent sharing requirement to use the plug, and agreements for Supercharger network access. Even if the second part goes sideways, getting the plug out from under Tesla’s control is effectively a win for the EV industry as a whole, IMO.

The interesting thing about the new Alpitronic hardware that EA is starting to install: it looks like it has CCS and NACS connectors on it. So I guess we are starting to see the transition on the charging side.

 
So this morning, when I went to unplug my vehicle I noticed a strong ozone smell at my charger. As soon as I stopped charing my vehicle the smell started to dissipate. Is this a normal condition or do I have starting worry that there is something wrong with the charger or circuit?
 
rdrr said:
So this morning, when I went to unplug my vehicle I noticed a strong ozone smell at my charger. As soon as I stopped charing my vehicle the smell started to dissipate. Is this a normal condition or do I have starting worry that there is something wrong with the charger or circuit?
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Have you been using the (assuming home) charger for a while without the smell? Was this a particularly long charge vs. other times? I don't recall of you're hardwired or using an outlet, if it's the latter, was the plug hot to the touch? Same for the vehicle side plug?
 
rdrr said:
So this morning, when I went to unplug my vehicle I noticed a strong ozone smell at my charger. As soon as I stopped charing my vehicle the smell started to dissipate. Is this a normal condition or do I have starting worry that there is something wrong with the charger or circuit?
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I think this is something to take pretty seriously, you should definitely not be smelling that and it could indicate arcing or overheating somewhere. If it were me I would be getting an electrician out to look everything over just to be on the safe side.
 
If the smell was near the charger, that is a bad thing; if the smell was near the car, that is a very bad thing.
 
DT said:
Have you been using the (assuming home) charger for a while without the smell? Was this a particularly long charge vs. other times? I don't recall of you're hardwired or using an outlet, if it's the latter, was the plug hot to the touch? Same for the vehicle side plug?
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Its a hardwired. It wasn't hot to the touch on either the plug or the cord when I wound it back up. I didn't check the charger.

I have a Emporia ‎EMEVSE1 on a 60 amp circuit. I will check again more closely for the smell and any hot to the touch issues, tonight to make sure I wasn't imagining it and if it is the charger, then will get an electrician out there ASAP, and not the one that installed it. Just to get a non-biased opinion.
 
rdrr said:
Its a hardwired. It wasn't hot to the touch on either the plug or the cord when I wound it back up. I didn't check the charger.

I have a Emporia ‎EMEVSE1 on a 60 amp circuit. I will check again more closely for the smell and any hot to the touch issues, tonight to make sure I wasn't imagining it and if it is the charger, then will get an electrician out there ASAP, and not the one that installed it. Just to get a non-biased opinion.
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Being warm to the touch is pretty normal for the cable but the smell of ozone comes from electrical arcing and that should be your main concern, really not something to mess around with.
 
diamond.g said:
Shouldn't arcing trip the breaker?
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Not necessarily, without knowing the source I would not rely on that as an indicator. I just happen to be extra cautious about these things, especially when it comes to EVs as we know what can happen with battery issues and fires. It's also what prompted me to install a smoke detector in the garage.
 
diamond.g said:
Shouldn't arcing trip the breaker?
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It depends. If you have AFCI (arc fault circuit interrupter) circuit breakers, they should trip. IIRC, they were required for new construction by the NEC in the early 2000s. Older homes will likely not have them. I don't know if charger installers would replace an older breaker in your panel with an AFCI.
 
Citysnaps said:
It depends. If you have AFCI (arc fault circuit interrupter) circuit breakers, they should trip. IIRC, they were required for new construction by the NEC in the early 2000s. Older homes will likely not have them. I don't know if charger installers would replace an older breaker in your panel with an AFCI.
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It was a brand new circuit installed. I renovated my kitchen summer of 2024 and had the box and service replaced, knowing at sometime I would probably be looking for an EV. I also had the electrician install an electrical monitoring device from Sense in the panel. It has a couple of troubleshooting monitors to check for electrical motor stalls and floating neutrals which all have come back negative. I did see a post on reddit about the exact same unit that caused the breaker to melt in their box... definitely calling an electrician.
 
diamond.g said:
Shouldn't arcing trip the breaker?
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No and that's why ARC Fault Breakers were developed.

Citysnaps said:
It depends. If you have AFCI (arc fault circuit interrupter) circuit breakers, they should trip. IIRC, they were required for new construction by the NEC in the early 2000s. Older homes will likely not have them. I don't know if charger installers would replace an older breaker in your panel with an AFCI.
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And code enforcement has been sporadic to the point of some AHJ's removed ARC Fault requirements in the early years because of nuisance tripping. Plus when they started being integrated into the code, at first they were just for sleeping rooms and that slowly expanded to all rooms.

And unless the code has changed in the last cycle, they are only required on 120V, 15A or 20A circuits. So an EV charger would not be required, at least by the NEC, to have them, but some AHJ's may require them.
 
So, here in australia I ran the numbers and for me, here it just doesn't make sense even with the government recently un-exempting plug in or hybrid vehicles from a tax break.

Just put a deposit on a hybrid RAV4 (intending to do 3 yr novated lease) and it won vs. EVs due to

  • battery
    • toyota has 7-10 year hybrid battery warranty
    • battery replacement is about $4k
    • EV option(s) I was looking at (e.g., Polestar 2) - battery replacement 50k!
  • lower initial purchase cost for similar level of quality/refinement.
    • rav4 hybrid in the trim I wanted was 62k Australian here
    • polestar 2 was about 83k without even getting leather which was an extra 9k on top due to being tied to option packs I didn't necessarily want
    • even with the EV tax breaks on the novated lease, the initial purchase cost just doesn't make it worth it
  • reliability
    • recent consumer reports indicate that despite what you might expect, its actually hybrids with the least reliability problems (due to most being made by toyota), followed by ICE, followed by EV
  • resale
    • 3 year old version of this car is retaining like 80% of its value here - Tesla/other EV retained value is a bloodbath
    • battery replacement costs on the full EVs are excessive - who's going to want to buy a 3 year old EV halfway into its battery warranty for anywhere near reasonable resale price when the potential battery replacement cost is more than the residual on the car post-lease!
  • Charging costs/range
    • here there's limited charging available and fast charge is 70-90c per kwh
    • 500km range on an EV, 900-1100 on the RAV4 and I can just put fuel in it anywhere without thinking
    • over 3 years the cost difference assuming I rely on fast charge is like 3k, and installing a home charger would be 3-5k.
    • Gasoline can be claimed pre-tax/salary sacrifice on the novated lease. Charging currently can’t!
So, for now, going RAV4 hybrid and will re-evaluate in 3 years.

I'd love to go full EV but right now it makes no sense for me.
 
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diamond.g said:
Holy moly, why is installing a home charger so expensive?
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Running from building entry and blah blah something something Australian electrician rates probably. Plus Australian new technology bs pricing

Also. Above explains why until recently there was a 12-18 month wait on rav4 hybrids here. Demand massively outstripping supply.

It’s still 4 months for a brand new order. I managed to find one I wanted in stock, brand new. Thanks ChatGPT search!! Only one within 200km of Perth that wasn’t a demo!
 

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