More than 270 medical experts call out Spotify, Joe Rogan for spreading COVID-19 misinformation

P_X said:
Sorry, but this is some stupid shit circulated by dumb fucks. If we don't have PPE and you are tasked to orient demand where it is the most justified, i.e. preventing gen pop from syphoning away PPE from hospitals then maybe you need to say something about it. Just because a fucking lie is repeated 1202349348938 times it's still a dumb fucking lie and I'm really losing my patience about this shit.


People were literally buying up the veterinary formulations of a drug flaunted as the alternative of vaccinations but even the very low quality supportive evidence put it in the range of like 20x lower efficacy than prevention by vaccination.

Can we stop regurgitating stupid shit?
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Sounds like some of these “completely useless” or “unproven” “alternatives” are successfully being used as supplements in treatment. Is that incorrect? Sincere question. I’m not disputing that they shouldn’t be used as an alternative to vaccinations. I’m disputing that they are completely useless in any capacity. But again, I’m asking. I’m not saying this with any authority.

And honestly, I’m trying to have a discussion here. I’m not trying to piss you off. But if that’s all its accomplishing then I’ll bow out.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
Thanks for sharing that information and your experience. I don’t question any of it. I just take issue with a belief in or need for absolutes, one side is 100% right and the other is 100% wrong, not willing to even entertain the possibility that even 1% of the opposing view is a valid point. I’m sure me even just saying that now probably pisses some people off based on this specific topic and like I said in a previous post, there may not be room for that type of discussion in this thread. Which is fine.
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You mean to say spreading misinformation and questioning science while touting talking points from a washed up comedian is unacceptable at this site. And you would be right. If it's based in science we'll be happy to discuss but otherwise it will not be tolerated, there are plenty of other sites out there that question our experts, we are not one of them.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
Thanks for sharing that information and your experience. I don’t question any of it. I just take issue with a belief in or need for absolutes, one side is 100% right and the other is 100% wrong, not willing to even entertain the possibility that even 1% of the opposing view is a valid point. I’m sure me even just saying that now probably pisses some people off based on this specific topic and like I said in a previous post, there may not be room for that type of discussion in this thread. Which is fine.
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I'm all on board for criticism, but these are topics that were discussed and eviscerated a gazillion times and the only thing that keeps them alive is people profiting financially or politically from perpetuating them.

So when Joe Rogan is told he's a dumb fuck and knows nothing about myocarditis but goes on about it, it's no longer about open discourse it's about propaganda.

Chew Toy McCoy said:
Sounds like some of these “completely useless” or “unproven” “alternatives” are successfully being used as supplements in treatment. Is that incorrect? Sincere question. I’m not disputing that they shouldn’t be used as an alternative to vaccinations. I’m disputing that they are completely useless in any capacity. But again, I’m asking. I’m not saying this with any authority.

And honestly, I’m trying to have a discussion here. I’m not trying to piss you off. But if that’s all its accomplishing then I’ll bow out.
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You need to know the effect size and then design a prospective randomized controlled double blinded study that includes adequate number of patients to answer questions definitively. This shit takes a lot of expertise beyond basic medical training and clinical skills and a lot of money. This is why the stuff with the best evidence have pharma money in it. THe ivermectin studies were done at enthusiastic, but extremely inexperienced investigators at places like Egypt.

Zinc had some anecdotal evidence in shortening colds, but that's it. I'm not aware of an RCT that evaluated it further. So no, when it comes to evidence-based medicine, evidence takes time and money, but at the end of the day it helps us get rid of voodoo shit.
 
Here’s a discussion to pursue: why do people believe a middling stand-up comic who got fame on a stupid gross-out show instead of Dr. Fauci, who was instrumental in helping get the AIDS epidemic under control?

People wouldn’t take their car to a comedian to get the transmission repaired. But they take medical advice from one? I just don’t get it. I guess I should have pursued a career as a snake oil salesman. It’s quite lucrative and requires no actual education or knowledge.
 
I'll just leave here, how it mystifies me people in droves turn up for gems like this...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1486380134873534464/

www.mediamatters.org

Spotify's Joe Rogan and guest Jordan Peterson suggest Michael Eric Dyson isn't really Black

www.mediamatters.org www.mediamatters.org
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JOE ROGAN (HOST): What did Michael Eric Dyson call you? A mean, angry white man?

JORDAN PETERSON (CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST): Yeah. A mean, angry white man.

ROGAN: Hilarious. You're not mean at all. That's what's dumb about that statement. You're not mean at all.

PETERSON: I am white -- actually that's a lie too. I am kind of tan. And he was actually not Black, he was sort of brown.

ROGAN: If you're tan then what the fuck am I. Because I'm darker than you. That's ridiculous.

PETERSON: Neither of us are white.

ROGAN: Well, I'm Italian.

PETERSON: And he was brown, not Black.

ROGAN: Well, isn't that weird. The Black and white thing is so strange because the shades are such a spectrum of shades of people. Unless you are talking to someone who is like 100% African from the darkest place where they are not wearing any clothes all day and they have developed all of that melanin to protect themselves from the sun, even the term Black is weird. When you use it for people who are literally my color, it becomes very strange.

PETERSON: Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is true.
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Just two White guys chilling, deciding who's Black & what that means.

Because the guy maybe nice to Rogan or what Rogan has seen, it MUST mean that Peterson can't be mean. Especially not to someone else, or even worse a critic of his.

:rolleyes:
 
Eric said:
Some of these people can't be reasoned with, as is the case here.
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I've admitted ignorance and that I've possibly been misguided, corrected myself, and welcomed new information I was unaware of several times in this thread. So what's your issue here, that I can continue to post and ask more questions? What would satisfy you?
 
SuperMatt said:
Here’s a discussion to pursue: why do people believe a middling stand-up comic who got fame on a stupid gross-out show instead of Dr. Fauci, who was instrumental in helping get the AIDS epidemic under control?

People wouldn’t take their car to a comedian to get the transmission repaired. But they take medical advice from one? I just don’t get it. I guess I should have pursued a career as a snake oil salesman. It’s quite lucrative and requires no actual education or knowledge.
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Honestly I think it’s because he does manly stuff and the right feels they converted him from liberalism, you know, like Donald Trump, and therefor an expert on everything else too. Although I’d argue Joe is way more manly than Trump and entertains multiple viewpoints. But this Covid thing seems to be a one side low for him, and it’s just perpetuating itself through pressure. It’s probably an ego thing that he feels he needs to double down on “experts” and not be lumped in with the willfully and politically motivated ignorant.

There might also be some kind of Manchin/Sinema new national ridicule attention spite thing going on here "Oh, you don't like what I'm doing? I'm just going to do it more now."
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
Honestly I think it’s because he does manly stuff and the right feels they converted him from liberalism, you know, like Donald Trump, and therefor an expert on everything else too. Although I’d argue Joe is way more manly than Trump and entertains multiple viewpoints. But this Covid thing seems to be a one side low for him, and it’s just perpetuating itself through pressure. It’s probably an ego thing that he feels he needs to double down on “experts” and not be lumped in with the willfully and politically motivated ignorant.

There might also be some kind of Manchin/Sinema new national ridicule attention spite thing going on here "Oh, you don't like what I'm doing? I'm just going to do it more now."
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Another way to say this is that people feel he is part of their tribe.

Are we devolving as a species? It seems a majority of people toss out millennia of human progress in science and technology and rush to quacks offering superstition instead of science.

I cannot stand folks like Rogan. They act like they know it all, and discredit people with decades of experience in their fields. They are detrimental to humanity.
 
Like they did with HRC, right wing media has successfully vilified Fauci. That toothpaste will never go back in the tube. Half the country will never believe a word he says, no matter how reasonable and provable it is. He represents science, which is bad.
 
JayMysteri0 said:
I'll just leave here, how it mystifies me people in droves turn up for gems like this...

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1486380134873534464/




Just two White guys chilling, deciding who's Black & what that means.

Because the guy maybe nice to Rogan or what Rogan has seen, it MUST mean that Peterson can't be mean. Especially not to someone else, or even worse a critic of his.

:rolleyes:
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🎉🎉🎉"2022 AD: Joe Rogan and Jordan Peterson discover that race is a societal construct and skin color is a continuous, non-binary variable."🎉🎉🎉

Jokes aside, this conversation excerpt is incredibly disturbing (and racist). Especially when Rogan says "from the darkest place (sic!) where people are not wearing any clothes", so living in huts is a criterion to be considered black that I apparently missed out on when the last time some college kids told me they'll kill this N tonight. Maybe I missed out on some smart retort explaining them that my being hypomelanistic and dressed disqualifies me from the racial abuse?! (Not that I took it to heart, but come on...).

For the US right, I can just switch black to jewish and ask them whether they'd question whether someone qualified as being jewish in the same conversation? (The far right where I grew up would just laugh and say, sure).
 
One more return to Rogan & Petersen's exchange so we can appreciate the brain power that could barely power a 1 watt bulb.

gizmodo.com

Jordan Peterson and Joe Rogan Talking About Climate Change Will Make Your Brain Dissolve

The big boys had a big thinky about climate change.
gizmodo.com gizmodo.com
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Rogan starts the exchange by mentioning he’s reading a book about climate change, which he describes as “intense” and “requiring a lot of thinking” and that he’s looking into criticisms of climate science from “both sides” (uh, that’s not… a thing). “The climate change one is a weird one,” he concludes.

Peterson responds with some of the most pure, unadulterated nonsense I’ve heard in some time:
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PETERSON: Well, that’s ‘cause there’s no such thing as climate. Right? “Climate” and “everything” are the same word, and that’s what bothers me about the climate change types. It’s like, this is something that bothers me about it, technically. It’s like, climate is about everything. Okay. But your models aren’t based on everything. Your models are based on a set number of variables. So that means you’ve reduced the variables, which are everything, to that set. Well how did you decide which set of variables to include in the equation, if it’s about everything? That’s not just a criticism, that’s like, if it’s about everything, your models aren’t right. Because your models do not and cannot model everything.

ROGAN: What do you mean by everything?

PETERSON: That’s what people who talk about the climate apocalypse claim, in some sense. We have to change everything! It’s like, everything, eh? The same with the word environment. That word means so much that it doesn’t mean anything. … What’s the difference between the environment and everything? There’s no difference.
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For the next several minutes, as they continue this frankly bonkers conversation with all the seriousness of libertarian college students at debate club, Peterson also claimed that climate models are untrustworthy because of errors he said “compound over time,” which means, apparently, the models are “all errors.” Trying to predict what’s going to happen with the climate, he said, is analogous to trying to “predict how your life goes.” He also said that poor people are the real reason for climate change (??); that solar power is more deadly than nuclear because people fall off roofs during installation (???); and that fracking hasn’t polluted any water supplies (????).
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Unfortunately, people like Peterson are some of Rogan’s favorites to platform, and this interview underlines the true issues with his “I-like-to-hear-both-sides” approach. Despite Peterson having absolutely no official expertise in climate change or science whatsoever, Rogan makes basically zero effort to question any of these wild assertions or correct course when Peterson begins pulling in the parable of the ant and the grasshopper as well as 1930s Weimar Germany to talk about why climate models suck (??????).

Maybe we shouldn’t be surprised, because Rogan’s last “climate” guest was a guy who thinks the world goes through cyclical stages of changing climate. His bio reads that he is “a master builder and architectural designer, teacher, geometrician, geomythologist, geological explorer and renegade scholar.” Weirdly, Rogan hasn’t had any actual scientists on his show recently to talk about climate change. But yes, both sides. Sure.
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JayMysteri0 said:
One more return to Rogan & Petersen's exchange so we can appreciate the brain power that could barely power a 1 watt bulb.





a34b110ef910d47cd38ea955454de035.gif
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Again. JR talks like someone who has marginal cognitive functioning.
JP is much smarter, but he is pandering to his alt right younglings. JP is a psychologist so he actually understands the issues and limitations of using models, so on his end the reasoning is dishonest (and lazy).

I'll peace out of this thread, JR and his guests definitely don't deserve my time or attention.
The more shit he produces, the more attention he gets the more he is to stay. Just ignore him.
 
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So Young was asking them to deal with the misinformation, not pull Rogan altogether. And Spotify wouldn’t do that? Like an audio warning may suffice perhaps.

“Joe Rogan lies sometimes”.
 
SuperMatt said:
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Too many people choose #2 for some reason.
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I don't remember when this started or by who, but remember when politics got distilled down to "Who would you rather sit down and have a beer with?"? Apply that here while also realizing who you are asking that question to.
 
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