The Ai thread

KingOfPain

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At least some AI detection tools think that the US Constitution was produced by an AI:

Since those detection tools also seem to be neural networks that are trained with output generated by the AIs, I'm wondering how decade old forensic linguistic methods for author identification might work in this case.
 

Eric

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I want to hate it but at the same time look at how easily I was able to clean up this image with just a couple of text prompts. It's both amazing and scary, I tried to pull this off in just PS using tools and couldn't come close to getting it this clean, after an hour or so finally gave up. This took less than one minute using AI, it can still use a touch up but otherwise it's pretty flawless doing what I asked without so much as touching any of the tools.


Original image. Look in the generative fill box to see what I typed after drawing a box around the area I wanted modified:

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Citysnaps

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I want to hate it but at the same time look at how easily I was able to clean up this image with just a couple of text prompts. It's both amazing and scary, I tried to pull this off in just PS using tools and couldn't come close to getting it this clean, after an hour or so finally gave up. This took less than one minute using AI, it can still use a touch up but otherwise it's pretty flawless doing what I asked without so much as touching any of the tools.


Original image. Look in the generative fill box to see what I typed after drawing a box around the area I wanted modified:

View attachment 24958

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That's pretty amazing!
 

Eric

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Sadly, in removing the cars, it took out a bit of sunlight and also removed the driveway post. Are there ways that could refine its actions?
Sure you can, this was just a quick and dirty edit. Those lights are actually from street/home lamps (sun was already down), I'm opting go leave it out as part of the scene but they could easily be added back.
 

Huntn

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I want to hate it but at the same time look at how easily I was able to clean up this image with just a couple of text prompts. It's both amazing and scary, I tried to pull this off in just PS using tools and couldn't come close to getting it this clean, after an hour or so finally gave up. This took less than one minute using AI, it can still use a touch up but otherwise it's pretty flawless doing what I asked without so much as touching any of the tools.


Original image. Look in the generative fill box to see what I typed after drawing a box around the area I wanted modified:

View attachment 24958

View attachment 24957

View attachment 24956

View attachment 24955

View attachment 24954

View attachment 24953
AI represents another wholesale loss of technical skills. Not being critical, just observing. This is what technological advancement means, loss of the skills we used to use. Take it to an extreme and you have caretaker machines and the populace is reduced to being uneducated. I saw that in Star Trek. :)
 

Eric

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AI represents another wholesale loss of technical skills. Not being critical, just observing. This is what technological advancement means, loss of the skills we used to use. Take it to an extreme and you have caretaker machines and the populace is reduced to being uneducated. I saw that in Star Trek. :)
I find it hard to disagree with this. I'll just say on the other side is a simpleton like me can make basic adjustments that would either take an expert (something most of us amateurs will never pay for to save a photo) several hours to pull off manually.
 

dada_dave

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AI represents another wholesale loss of technical skills. Not being critical, just observing. This is what technological advancement means, loss of the skills we used to use. Take it to an extreme and you have caretaker machines and the populace is reduced to being uneducated. I saw that in Star Trek. :)
Technological advancement has also historically increased the variety of technical skills as well as their depth - there are a hell of a lot more technical skill jobs today than any other point in history both as an absolute and per-capita. That doesn’t mean it didn’t suck for the workers who were displaced or that I think that we should repeat the sins of the past because after all such little people are simply “the dust of the history” as some assholes have put it.

Also it has to be said that the danger here is that any technical skill that might be created by the coming AI revolution could conceivably also be done by AIs. Whether or not that becomes true remains to be seen but it is more a danger now than in previous technological revolutions as we are attempting to model far more exactly the very human intelligence that enables technical skill to be done. Again, no hard prognostications of the future here, such concerns have been a staple of human hand wringing since the Industrial Revolution, but even I have to admit there appears to be more than a little merit to it this time.
 

dada_dave

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I find it hard to disagree with this. I'll just say on the other side is a simpleton like me can make basic adjustments that would either take an expert (something most of us amateurs will never pay for to save a photo) several hours to pull off manually.
Which in the past has led to an explosion of human activity, productivity, and creativity. But see my post above for the very obvious note of caution that even in my most optimistic outlook I still agree with. This time might be different.
 

Huntn

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Technological advancement has also historically increased the variety of technical skills as well as their depth - there are a hell of a lot more technical skill jobs today than any other point in history both as an absolute and per-capita. That doesn’t mean it didn’t suck for the workers who were displaced or that I think that we should repeat the sins of the past because after all such little people are simply “the dust of the history” as some assholes have put it.

Also it has to be said that the danger here is that any technical skill that might be created by the coming AI revolution could conceivably also be done by AIs. Whether or not that becomes true remains to be seen but it is more a danger now than in previous technological revolutions as we are attempting to model far more exactly the very human intelligence that enables technical skill to be done. Again, no hard prognostications of the future here, such concerns have been a staple of human hand wringing since the Industrial Revolution, but even I have to admit there appears to be more than a little merit to it this time.
Not a large enough outcry when unskilled jobs were replaced, but now it is skilled jobs threatened. What I’m saying is that the number of humans who possess whatever skills you want to talk about, is reduced in substantial numbers and under the automation standard there is no way I see to produce enough skillEd jobs to keep the masses comfortably employed in a Capitalist system. Besides all wealth generation and inherent inequalities it relies on, Capitalism is due for a reckoning.

Just like @Eric outlined his Photoshop experience, The writers strike in Hollywood, it about an AI that will allow anyone to write an outline of a movie, just throw in some plot elements and turn it over to AI to write the script for them. This is a profession that has a legitimate reason to worry about their employment.

In aviation flying a plane will be reduced to push the taxi button, push the takeoff button, up button, down, left, right button, then get a machine to push the buttons, who needs a pilot? :oops:
 
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dada_dave

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Not a large enough outcry when unskilled jobs were replaced, but now it is skilled jobs threatened. What I’m saying is that the number of humans who possess whatever skills you want to talk about, is reduced in substantial numbers and under the automation standard there is no way I see to produce enough skill to keep the masses comfortably employed in a Capitalist system. Besides all wealth generation and inherent inequalities it relies on, Capitalism is due for a reckoning.

Just like @Eric outlined his Photoshop experience, The writers strike in Hollywood, it about an AI that will allow anyone to write an outline of a movie, just throw in some plot elements and turn it over to AI to write the script for them. This is a profession that has a legitimate reason to worry about their employment.

In aviation flying a plane will be reduced to push the taxi button, push the takeoff button, up button, down, left, right button, then get a machine to push the buttons, who needs a pilot? :oops:
It’s often been skilled labor that gets replaced first by automation in the workplace - skilled labor is far more expensive and, ironically, much more amenable to automation. It’s just that eventually that further avenues of skilled labor are opened up. Unfortunately that often means little to the people who lost their jobs, few of whom get to have the new ones due to lack of retraining opportunities (or the new jobs take too long to replace the old ones in terms of quantity). It should be pointed out that naturally unskilled labor does not mean “easy” but rather the type of labor that is required. And of course a huge percentage of agricultural production has been automated which is typically considered “unskilled” work. Same for home making, though arguably the advances there led to a massive boom in economic participation.

Autopilots can already land planes (can’t take off) and handle most if not nearly all aspects of in flight maneuvers. But pilots are still deemed necessary (quite rightly) for when things go wrong and for managing the automation correctly. There’s going to be long time for that being the case even for the new AI systems.
 

Colstan

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This thread has diverged from its original topic of discussing artificial intelligence into one of political ideology, economic systems, and labor principles. As moderator of the technology forums, it's not my place to take a position on that.

However, politics are still restricted in the four "All Things Technology" areas of the forum, which I am charged with overseeing. As long as @Eric continues to keep me on as moderator, I'll enforce that. We've become far more permissive about political posts here on TechBoards ever since @Eric did a shadow unban of the politics section. I try not to be a hard ass about it, I allow for some leeway. I'd never want to make anyone feel unwelcome here, but I would humbly ask everyone to take the political aspects of this discussion to a more appropriate area of the forum.

Thank you all for your understanding.
 

dada_dave

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This thread has diverged from its original topic of discussing artificial intelligence into one of political ideology, economic systems, and labor principles. As moderator of the technology forums, it's not my place to take a position on that.

However, politics are still restricted in the four "All Things Technology" areas of the forum, which I am charged with overseeing. As long as @Eric continues to keep me on as moderator, I'll enforce that. We've become far more permissive about political posts here on TechBoards ever since @Eric did a shadow unban of the politics section. I try not to be a hard ass about it, I allow for some leeway. I'd never want to make anyone feel unwelcome here, but I would humbly ask everyone to take the political aspects of this discussion to a more appropriate area of the forum.

Thank you all for your understanding.

I don’t think it has diverged? The below is the opening post?
This is a topic snowballing all over the internet so I wanted to start a thread dedicated to it.

Sounds like writers are getting pretty worried, understandable considering the strike.

pk9z8d46e70b1.jpg

It’s almost impossible to discuss this issue without invoking society, labor, or economics. Perhaps it should be in the political section? Or not I dunno I’ll leave that to those with the power to make said decisions.
 

Huntn

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It’s often been skilled labor that gets replaced first by automation in the workplace - skilled labor is far more expensive and, ironically, much more amenable to automation. It’s just that eventually that further avenues of skilled labor are opened up. Unfortunately that often means little to the people who lost their jobs, few of whom get to have the new ones due to lack of retraining opportunities (or the new jobs take too long to replace the old ones in terms of quantity). It should be pointed out that naturally unskilled labor does not mean “easy” but rather the type of labor that is required. And of course a huge percentage of agricultural production has been automated which is typically considered “unskilled” work. Same for home making, though arguably the advances there led to a massive boom in economic participation.

Autopilots can already land planes (can’t take off) and handle most if not nearly all aspects of in flight maneuvers. But pilots are still deemed necessary (quite rightly) for when things go wrong and for managing the automation correctly. There’s going to be long time for that being the case even for the new AI systems.
But for the jobs that don’t involve human safety, there will be a lot less people doing the job. Decades ago I read an article in Atlantic Magazine about a factory of some kind (forgot :oops:) where they were replacing workers where what used to be done by 10 people could be done by one person with a college degree and expensive equipment. The article profiled one of the female workers who wanted to move up to operating the machine, but she needed the training, the company demanded a degree and would not train her. They only kept on workers where the calculation was they collectively were the same cost as the machine.

Then look at robots in automotive manufacturing. Factories that once held several thousand people, went to a couple hundred. And the workers displaced, there were no skilled jobs at the same goI’d pay waiting for them. There are no government programs to retrain these workers in the magical new jobs that are supposed to appear. And the Capitolist overlords don’t want to spend their profits on training.

Bottom line, under Capitalism, the workers get screwed, have been screwed, will continue to be screwed. And AI, will just make this worse. Don’t believe the BS that new jobs will pop up making it a win win for those displaced workers. That is a lie, a diversion, as Capitolism is about the bottom line and max profits, and ME>WE. :mad:
 

dada_dave

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But for the jobs that don’t involve human safety, there will be a lot less people doing the job. Decades ago I read an article in Atlantic Magazine about a factory of some kind (forgot :oops:) where they were replacing workers where what used to be done by 10 people could be done by one person with a college degree and expensive equipment. The article profiled one of the female workers who wanted to move up to operating the machine, but she needed the training, the company demanded a degree and would not train her. They only kept on workers where the calculation was they collectively were the same cost as the machine.

Then look at robots in automotive manufacturing. Factories that once held several thousand people, went to a couple hundred. And the workers displaced, there were no skilled jobs at the same goI’d pay waiting for them. There are no government programs to retrain these workers in the magical new jobs that are supposed to appear. And the Capitolist overlords don’t want to spend their profits on training.

Bottom line, under Capitalism, the workers get screwed, have been screwed, will continue to be screwed. And AI, will just make this worse. Don’t believe the BS that new jobs will pop up making it a win win for those displaced workers. That is a lie, a diversion, as Capitolism is about the bottom line and max profits, and ME>WE. :mad:
I don’t? I said explicitly that unfortunately for workers who get displaced that we’ve never done a good job retraining them for jobs or the jobs that could’ve replaced them came too late even if we had wanted to retrain them which we have hardly ever done. The only mass retraining program where large (admittedly huge) sections of the population were laid off (admittedly from a job we had hoped would be temporary rather than automation) we ever did was the post WW2 GI Bill and it’s (partially) credited with one of the biggest gains in productivity basically ever.

I also mentioned that this “AI” Industrial Revolution could be different and even the jobs that are created are likewise consumed by it. We won’t know unfortunately until it’s too late or long afterwards (which again even if for the positive, jobs are created, wont help most of the displaced if we aren’t proactive).
 

Yoused

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I said explicitly that unfortunately for workers who get displaced that we’ve never done a good job retraining them

The biggest problem for business jumping on tech to reduce the wetware expense is that eventually they are going to be struggling to make up the revenue lost from the masses of people who can no longer afford to buy their stuff.
 

Eric

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These sans fonts are messing me up. Now I am starting to worry about AI Capone.
If you're not careful I might start adding AI auto responses, all pro Musk so we can start spreading an anti-vaccine and gay hating agenda.
 
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