Eric
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I think it's a fair concern against any other candidate who isn't looking at being in prison during his first term.
2024 Democrat Presidential Candidates
- Thread starter Herdfan
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Lets fast forward to, say, September 2024, a couple of months before the election... And the republican and Democratic primaries are over.
Joe Biden is the Democratic candidate. And he's dealing with a major health issue and is looking even more frail.
donald trump is the republican candidate. He's running under two Federal indictments, a NY state indictment, and an indictment from Georgia. I don't know how many felonies that represents. Probably 20+ ? Likely more. I haven't a clue if any of those trials will be finished.
All I can say is.... Jeeeeez.
Joe Biden is the Democratic candidate. And he's dealing with a major health issue and is looking even more frail.
donald trump is the republican candidate. He's running under two Federal indictments, a NY state indictment, and an indictment from Georgia. I don't know how many felonies that represents. Probably 20+ ? Likely more. I haven't a clue if any of those trials will be finished.
All I can say is.... Jeeeeez.
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George Takai pointed out the obvious. He is 6 years older than Biden and has just finished doing 7 stage performances a week, in a very demanding role. (And don’t tell me that memorizing lines and putting on a brilliant performance AFTER WRITING THE SHOW, is easier than being president.)
Those of you seeing Biden as frail are looking for it. I’ve seen 50 year olds in worse shape both mentally and physically. Stop wishing ill on a guy who has brought the country back from the brink of ruin.
Yes, it would be nice to have someone younger, but youth guarantees nothing but a number.
Those of you seeing Biden as frail are looking for it. I’ve seen 50 year olds in worse shape both mentally and physically. Stop wishing ill on a guy who has brought the country back from the brink of ruin.
Yes, it would be nice to have someone younger, but youth guarantees nothing but a number.
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What? Looking for it? No, not at all. Merely expressing an opinion developed through observation over the last 10+ years. As a person I like Biden a lot - his views dovetail perfectly with mine.
But... casting selfishness aside, not wanting another four years of trump, or especially desantis, I'm really concerned that either one being elected President will result in the country becoming even more consumed in division, hate, bigotry, loss of rights and freedoms, etc. And that's a very real possibility.
Herdfan
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“We have plans to build a railroad from the Pacific all the way across the Indian Ocean,” the president said this month during an address before the League of Conservation Voters.
Really????? Other world leaders must hear this and laugh. At us.
It's true that age is but one factor that determines an individual's physical and mental capacity. Anthony Fauci, George Takei, Ringo Starr, Paul McCartney, and, yes, Joe Biden, are just some examples of octogenarians who function at a higher level than many of their generation. And I'm sure many of us are personally acquainted with people who aren't well known but are similarly capable. As well, being around for more time affords experience and perspective that can be particularly beneficial in politics and governance.
Biden has done an incredible job in his first term — I doubt if any of his opponents in the last Democratic primary could have accomplished what he did, and I'll certainly vote for him if he's the candidate in 2024. But I'm concerned about the apparent increase in his verbal slip-ups and falls. He's extremely fortunate not to have fractured a hip by now.
I also feel the 2020 and 2024 elections were/will be the most consequential in at least the last century or so. (The same was true of 2016 in retrospect, but I don't think we quite knew it.) The choice is stark, even if someone like DeSantis runs instead of Trump — it's between democracy and fascism. The country is divided (though I believe many Americans don't fully comprehend what's at stake), so there's no room for error. Republicans will take every opportunity to point out Biden's shortcomings, and that may be sufficient to swing the election. Perception is important.
I'd feel better if Biden had a running mate who could convince the electorate that they can step into a strong, effective presidency in a heartbeat, but I don't think Harris fits the bill. She's intelligent, but not adept at getting a message across, and some of the assignments thrown her way haven't helped. Like it or not, Biden's age will cause his VP candidate to be scrutinized more than ever. Unfortunately, as @Herdfan pointed out, Biden would never drop Harris because it would look bad and because he's loyal. For someone else to run, she'd have to step aside, and I doubt if she'll do that.
shadow puppet
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I abhor this statement.
Thank you. Although on the very outskirts, being one of the younger ones of this age group, I also fall into the boomer category. The dreaded "okay boomer" derogatory statement...like nothing we did, nor our hard work and effort, matters. It makes me ill. It's like saying nothing @Alli (as erudite as she is), matters. That's flat out wrong.
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Herdfan
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There needs to be a new generation. My wife is a boomer, I am Gen X, yet neither one of fits in either category well.
So we call ourselves Boomer X's.
Eric
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Right, because they're so proud of Donald Trump.“We have plans to build a railroad from the Pacific all the way across the Indian Ocean,” the president said this month during an address before the League of Conservation Voters.
Really????? Other world leaders must hear this and laugh. At us.
‘Where’s Rudy?’: Trump Doesn’t Appear to Realize That Giuliani’s Sitting Right Across From Him
"Maybe I'll ask Rudy to say a few words," POTUS said, turning his head all around the room. "Where's Rudy?"
www.mediaite.com
‘Where’s Rudy?’: Trump Doesn’t Appear to Realize That Giuliani’s Sitting Right Across From Him
One thing I'll point out is you have genuine concerns from Democrats in this thread, and of course you're welcome to your views as well. But the main difference is we challenge our candidates, as has happened in here from the most Liberal of Democrats. This is something Conservatives absolutely refuse to do in their own party, why is that? Genuinely curious as to this mindset.
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That is something I'll never understand. I just don't get it.
If, just as an example, Biden, who I like a lot, was a criminal defendant in both Federal and State trials (and possibly/likely soon facing two more trials) looking at least a couple dozen felonies altogether, I would not be supporting him. Especially were he to foment an insurrection and attempted coup on the United States. The notion of presumption of innocence can only go so far before it begins to stretch credulity.
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I have long felt that the majority are often wrong, partly because of the way our consumeristic culture makes it easy for those with enough money to manipulate the people simply by burying them in bullshit. For the RW, the opposition to their causes is just not thinking properly (or thinking too much), so they close ranks in the campaign to try to make those bad folks heel to the "right" side.
From this position, their R party has to stand strong against the headwinds of progress. It was their grand hero, Saint Ronnie, who said, "Never speak ill of a fellow Republican," because the pursuit of their cause is fundamentally martial in nature (but with slightly less shooting). Attacking their co-conspirators for any reason is friendly fire that they cannot afford in their resolute defense of "conservative" values as they strive to restore America to the halcyon days of the (fifteen)fifties.
From this position, their R party has to stand strong against the headwinds of progress. It was their grand hero, Saint Ronnie, who said, "Never speak ill of a fellow Republican," because the pursuit of their cause is fundamentally martial in nature (but with slightly less shooting). Attacking their co-conspirators for any reason is friendly fire that they cannot afford in their resolute defense of "conservative" values as they strive to restore America to the halcyon days of the (fifteen)fifties.
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“We have plans to build a railroad from the Pacific all the way across the Indian Ocean,” the president said this month during an address before the League of Conservation Voters.
Really????? Other world leaders must hear this and laugh. At us.
How do you know other world leaders don’t make the mistakes just as often? It happens, a lot, even with folks like Obama.
Trump didn’t need to stumble over his words - which he has, probably as often as Biden or more - but he did say a lot of stupid shit.
I mean, world leaders literally laughed at Trump, in person. So that was different than your view world leaders are laughing at Biden how?
Eric
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This. Republicans are smoking crack if they don't think the world looks at Trump as the most unstable candidate/former president of our lifetimes. I've never even heard this about Biden and can only figure Fox News took the ball and ran with with such a trivial thing on a slow news day.
That comment was the least substantive post in this thread, I don't mind fair criticism but that was a just childish low blow for no apparent reason.
Herdfan
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It was.
But IIRC, back during the election any comment I would make about Biden's mental fitness was met immediately with pushback. But now, many of those same posters are concerned with his mental fitness. What changed? I saw it then. Did people here see it too but since he was on the same team, it was ignored.
Eric
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Well, you will never level criticism over your own party the way we all do it here regularly and that's the crux of what we've been asking. Forgive me if I call you out on not answering that questions, we know why but it would've been nice to see a real response. Otherwise, it's just another "I'll only criticize the guy in your party" in a thread where we're all calling out Biden and the Democratic choices.
And it's definitely NOT substantive, it's just a partisan hit. How can you expect us to be "concerned" with a memory lapse when you've stood buy and let Trump say the most insane shit this world has ever seen.
Herdfan
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Because Trump is not President (and in a perfect world, he won't be again). Biden is. So whatever Trump is doing is not affecting the country.
And yes, Trump said some crazy stuff. But his policies were mostly good from where I sit. (many of which were supported by a number of Dems until they became Trump's policies). Biden's not so much. So like you and many on here, if you agree with the policies then you might let the other stuff slide.
And as crazy as this might sound, I would take Hillary over Joe every day and twice on Tuesday at this point. And I f-ing hate her as much as many of you probably hate Trump.
Eric
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He is your frontrunner and likely nominee with a slew felonies who may very well end up in jail. You can conveniently gloss over that while making a dig at Biden's cognition, just expect to be called on it as long as the glaring hypocrisy continues.
Yoused
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That is one hell of a bubble. Try not to push too hard on the walls, lest you fall right on out.
I am in the opposite camp. I never much cared for Joe the President's corporatist positions, although he seems to lbe a bit better than I expected on that front. However, his mental fitness has not concerned me at alli not then, not now.
The first method for estimating the intelligence of a ruler is to look at the men he has around him. – Niccolo Macchiavelli
This is the most important metric, and Joe the President has it down.
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This is the difference between today’s GOP and the party of 50ish years ago. When Republicans saw what Nixon had done, they turned against him, rather than embracing him further like they’re doing with Trump.
Are you blind? The jerk is still at the top of the news every day. He won’t go away. He’s holding rallies and fomenting his base. TODAY.
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The GOP has not gotten this memo, or they wouldn’t be going on non-stop about Hunter Biden.
You’re deluding yourself if you think Trump - the uncontested leader of the GOP - doesn’t have an impact on the country.
Again, this is an example of the GOP walking backwards on the priority chain. I don’t agree with the outrage over Hunter Biden, but let’s grant you that what he did was unethical and possibly illegal. Where is this outrage against Ivanka and Jared? While the left brings their name up to remind the right about their misplaced priorities on Hunter Biden, I don’t see the mainstream media demanding their heads and directly tying them to Trump, even though they were his kids as well, AND White House officials (and wholly unqualified for the roles at that).
Heck, you have Trump on tape committing crimes, and in the very tape where he’s breaking the law, again brings up Hillary Clinton! That’s like hearing him on tape criticizing Bill Clinton’s affairs while he’s banging Stormy Daniels.
As for the 2024 candidates, it’s going to be Biden. It’s not even a question, and his only challenge if he faces Trump will be enthusiasm. Trump, as much as I dread another few years of lies, conspiracies and bullshit, he is the best bet to ensuring a second Biden term. If Biden was running against someone like DeSantis, I’m not sure flaky democrat voters would be enthused enough to vote for Biden, or even show up to the polls at all. With Trump, however, Biden is going to pick up a lot of anti-Trump votes, way more than he would from a DeSantis or other milquetoast GOP candidate like Pence, Haley or Scott.
But the GOP candidates are doing so poorly that, if I were as conspiratorial as the right, I would wonder if it wasn’t some coordinated effort to help him win again. DeSantis was hot shit a mere six months ago, now he looks like a groveler running for a cabinet spot if Trump is elected. Pence too, really.