FBI executed search warrant at Mar-a-Lago

Alli

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Citysnaps

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We know where the missing documents are:


"Another source familiar with the matter said multiple raids happened simultaneously in New York City, Southampton, and Florida, targeting multiple designees from the US Department of Treasury’s Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC)."

Garland making his move - hope it's fruitful!
 

mac_in_tosh

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Just to show how gullible Trump's base is, and how enabling are his supporters in the media, there was a clip of him talking to some right wing extremist show where he actually said that if the DOJ had only asked him for the documents he would have turned them over but instead they raided his home. Now the host must have known what an absolute lie that was, that the DOJ spent months asking for the documents before having to issue a subpoena for them and that even then he withheld many documents, necessitating the search warrant.
 

GermanSuplex

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Just to show how gullible Trump's base is, and how enabling are his supporters in the media, there was a clip of him talking to some right wing extremist show where he actually said that if the DOJ had only asked him for the documents he would have turned them over but instead they raided his home. Now the host must have known what an absolute lie that was, that the DOJ spent months asking for the documents before having to issue a subpoena for them and that even then he withheld many documents, necessitating the search warrant.

I’m sure the DoJ is thrilled with each interview he or his lawyers give to the media. Especially when he incriminates himself on a near-daily basis.
 

Huntn

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Empty folders huh? Wonder where those classified documents went....
You are not the only one. There has been speculation about the compromise of US foreign agents and their deaths. I‘d say speculation at this point but if that has any basis in fact, the man needs to tried for serious treason.
 

fischersd

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You are not the only one. There has been speculation about the compromise of US foreign agents and their deaths. I‘d say speculation at this point but if that has any basis in fact, the man needs to tried for serious treason.
If he actually leaked information which resulted in the deaths of intelligence agents, then we could actually see the first time that a former President was put to death for treason (should happen....but will it?) *sigh*

Me, I think there should be a civil war with Trump's supporters - it'll clean up the US gene pool considerably.
 

GermanSuplex

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I expect the rhetoric to ramp up considerably in the coming months as Trump is hit with legal issues, a conservative pool that probably doesn’t want him to run, people will start announcing runs shortly and Trump won’t handle any primary opponent well.

If republicans somehow lose the house, they’ll double-down on their stolen election BS. And if they win, they’ll get the circus going quickly.

Trump’s cult rally in Wilkes-Barre was a reminder that the guy is fucking OUT THERE. He does not care about anything but power. It’s so bizarre watching him standing there, lying and talking like an idiot, that people cheer him. It’s only going to get worse as he feels the squeeze.
 

lizkat

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If he actually leaked information which resulted in the deaths of intelligence agents, then we could actually see the first time that a former President was put to death for treason (should happen....but will it?) *sigh*

Me, I think there should be a civil war with Trump's supporters - it'll clean up the US gene pool considerably.

Trump has certainly proven himself (so far) more of a Teflon Don than anyone might reasonably have expected. But he's playing in a civilian ballpark now; not the venue of a sitting president with political protocols and rulebooks amended by the likes of Mitch McConnell.

On the matter of resisting the return of sensitive documents, that's not at all like some dude ignoring a bunch of parking tickets. Trump seems to have tried seriously to obstruct the government's effort to retrieve for secure storage some highly restricted materials, and he may already have dragged a few hapless attorneys into legal trouble themselves.

What more does it take to bring a rogue ex president to heel? He appears to have incited electoral fraud and overturn of the government. He appears to have stolen documents that endanger our national security. He has definitely mocked every guardrail that protocol, norms, rules and actual law together ever framed and constrained powers of a president, or an ex-president either.

And still out on the hustings this afternoon there are politicians campaigning on the assumed appeal of an outlaw-caricature of Trump (an image elevated by Trump himself!) to their own potential voters.

It's not just Trump who is dangerous. It's also the people who think he's cool, and think he's persecuted, and think he should run again for public office. But there's really no there there for a lot of his rally-base sort of followers, it's all props and smoke and mirrors and often enjoyed as entertainment.

When one breaks out the stats, it doesn't seem like there are enough of that hard core to be a threat to America. But they're not all faceless people in crowds; a significant number of politically aware fans of Trump's autocratic take on leadership are already in positions of supposed public trust, in Congress, state legislatures, school boards, county election offices.

Who knows how hard or easy it will be to un-sell the false images of Donald Trump to those followers. And behind Trump are a bench of wannabe successors.

Best we can hope for right now is that he keeps pulling walls down around himself to reveal his unfitness. So far the DoJ seems to have been patiently allowing an apparent criminal to further incriminate himself. It's alarming though to reallize at each turn in the road, we still hadn't seen the extent of his unworthiness to have been where he once sat atop our government.

If there was ever a book of object lessons for pols and voters alike to quit dismissing character and morality as key in electing leaders, Trump certainly warrants a chapter of his own.
 

Huntn

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I expect the rhetoric to ramp up considerably in the coming months as Trump is hit with legal issues, a conservative pool that probably doesn’t want him to run, people will start announcing runs shortly and Trump won’t handle any primary opponent well.

If republicans somehow lose the house, they’ll double-down on their stolen election BS. And if they win, they’ll get the circus going quickly.

Trump’s cult rally in Wilkes-Barre was a reminder that the guy is fucking OUT THERE. He does not care about anything but power. It’s so bizarre watching him standing there, lying and talking like an idiot, that people cheer him. It’s only going to get worse as he feels the squeeze.
And the dimwits cheer…
 

GermanSuplex

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Trump has been granted a special master, but I don’t think it will help him. It’s an odd thing to grant when he had no argument, but it is what it is. DoJ has the right to appeal, we’ll see what they do. I don’t think it matters much at this point, it’s just a delay tactic.
 

mac_in_tosh

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I wouldn't be surprised if corruption was involved given that the judge was appointed by Trump and appears to have asserted jurisdiction where she may not have it. But here he goes again getting his lawyers (I use the term loosely) to prevent him from paying the price for his illegality. I'm sure that's why so many contractors gave up trying to get paid for work they did. And what's the status of the cases of all those women who claimed he assaulted them?

If the documents weren't actually declassified, as appears to be the case since procedure was not followed, then Trump should be charged with stealing top secret documents and storing them in an insecure location. If the documents were declassified by a snap of his finger (not likely), then he exercised gross negligence because he didn't carefully examine each of the hundreds of document to assess the impact of declassification on national security. I don't know what crimes that might involve, but whether the documents were classified or not, he was in illegal possession of them, didn't comply with a subpoena to produce them and lied to the FBI about having them.

What is the DOJ waiting for? The more this creep is allowed to spew his lies and incitement, the greater the danger to the nation. Even Bill Barr has condemned what Trump did and said his actions were unprecedented.
 

Renzatic

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Trump has been granted a special master, but I don’t think it will help him. It’s an odd thing to grant when he had no argument, but it is what it is. DoJ has the right to appeal, we’ll see what they do. I don’t think it matters much at this point, it’s just a delay tactic.

Yeah, but how long can he use this as an excuse to delay?

If the documents weren't actually declassified, as appears to be the case since procedure was not followed, then Trump should be charged with stealing top secret documents and storing them in an insecure location.

The issue of classification is entirely moot by this point. Whether it was or not doesn't change the fact that Trump allegedly had information critical to our national defense stored in unsecured locations where anyone could have seen it, and outright refused to do anything about it.
 

GermanSuplex

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WTF?

He has no claim of executive privilege. Really, I think this lies in the hands of the DoJ. It may be quicker if they can agree to a timetable to have the master appointed and to go through the documents in a timeframe.

Trump will just attack the judge and special master the moment things don’t play to his liking. The delays are never ending and annoying, but I don’t think they’ll ultimately help him. It’ll also weaken any of his arguments moving forward.
 

thekev

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He has no claim of executive privilege. Really, I think this lies in the hands of the DoJ. It may be quicker if they can agree to a timetable to have the master appointed and to go through the documents in a timeframe.

He might have leverage against the judge or something. It was one of his appointees (again). I would like to see judges that try to treat former presidents as having such privilege beyond their last day in office as ex-judges. I don't believe that her suggestion is an argument made in good faith.
 

Eric

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Sounds like this is a huge win for Trump and lawyers are saying it could possibly derail the entire investigation. It's really hard to believe that they can find a single judge that can undo everything like this with no recourse for the DOJ.
 

GermanSuplex

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Sounds like this is a huge win for Trump and lawyers are saying it could possibly derail the entire investigation. It's really hard to believe that they can find a single judge that can undo everything like this with no recourse for the DOJ.

DoJ can appeal. I don’t think there’s much precedence for appointing a special master in a case such as this. From what most attorneys are saying, it’s more common in raids of lawyer offices where target info may be stored alongside that of tons of other metrical that is privileged, like those of clients.

I don’t think this will derail the investigation for long. I don’t think this is going to extend any possible indictment beyond an original timeframe more than a month of two, if at all.

Then again, I said I didn’t think Trump would get a special master, so I’m not putting any money on my own words. 😁
 

Renzatic

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Sounds like this is a huge win for Trump and lawyers are saying it could possibly derail the entire investigation. It's really hard to believe that they can find a single judge that can undo everything like this with no recourse for the DOJ.

It all depends on whether this judge is there to insure a fair case for both the prosecution and defendant, or is a hardcore MAGA idiot out to give special favors for Trump.

If she's the former, then this is nothing more than a detour to the inevitable conclusion, and could even end up strengthening the DOJ's case against him, given that all evidence will have been double checked to make sure it was all above board.
 
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