The Republican Agenda 2021 and Forward

JayMysteri0 said:
The hypocrisy & irony



Burn bags?

If you can't be held responsible for violating a law for presidents SPECIFICALLY, what law can this guy be held responsible for?
Click to expand...

Hence my pessimism. We have a Congress stocked with law breaking condoners for political advantage. Is there any reason I shouldn’t say we‘re fucked? :oops:
 
Huntn said:
Hence my pessimism. We have a Congress stocked with law breaking condoners for political advantage. Is there any reason I shouldn’t say we‘re fucked? :oops:
Click to expand...
This isn't a congressional thing though.

This is a cut & dry violation of the law.

This is the Dept of Justice NOT wanting to do their job thing.

Each record carries supposedly a 3 year jail term. Out of deference though, because all presidents have violated this rule in some small way nothing is ever noted.

UNTIL you take 15 boxes of records & have a noted history of destroying records because you DON'T want any records.

This has to be followed up with, even if it's just insultingly fines. Otherwise we further the slide of the office being used in the future in more authoritarian ways.
 
JayMysteri0 said:
This isn't a congressional thing though.

This is a cut & dry violation of the law.

This is the Dept of Justice NOT wanting to do their job thing.

Each record carries supposedly a 3 year jail term. Out of deference though, because all presidents have violated this rule in some small way nothing is ever noted.

UNTIL you take 15 boxes of records & have a noted history of destroying records because you DON'T want any records.

This has to be followed up with, even if it's just insultingly fines. Otherwise we further the slide of the office being used in the future in more authoritarian ways.
Click to expand...

I think there’s a lot of people in government agencies who aren’t doing their job because they are scared of getting assaulted by a Trump supporter or they actually agree with them. At best the government decided that there are enough violence threatening fascists in the country that they should be respected and represented. Even if you agree with that conclusion, would they do the same if it was determined there is a big voter base of Islamic extremists or Black Panthers? Somehow I think they would manage to roll in the red carpet in those scenarios and clamp down hard on those groups.

It seems you can get away with all kinds of lawbreaking if you're white and the government determines your minions are a big enough threat. That's the point where we start negotiating with terrorists.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
I think there’s a lot of people in government agencies who aren’t doing their job because they are scared of getting assaulted by a Trump supporter or they actually agree with them. At best the government decided that there are enough violence threatening fascists in the country that they should be respected and represented. Even if you agree with that conclusion, would they do the same if it was determined there is a big voter base of Islamic extremists or Black Panthers? Somehow I think they would manage to roll in the red carpet in those scenarios and clamp down hard on those groups.

It seems you can get away with all kinds of lawbreaking if you're white and the government determines your minions are a big enough threat. That's the point where we start negotiating with terrorists.
Click to expand...
I get that, but we are talking Merrick Garland & co. Some of the most protected people in the world with the ultimate gang behind them if you consider messing with them. Threats of violence I don't believe are a concern. I think it's a belief in upsetting old norms that the 45th president can't be bothered with.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491073671934656513/

This administration had been a grift since the escalator ride down, and the idea that there's no responsibility for it is sickening.
 
Legitimate Political Discourse, the TV Show:

1573cbCOMIC-legitimate-political-discourse.jpg
 
JayMysteri0 said:
I get that, but we are talking Merrick Garland & co. Some of the most protected people in the world with the ultimate gang behind them if you consider messing with them. Threats of violence I don't believe are a concern. I think it's a belief in upsetting old norms that the 45th president can't be bothered with.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491073671934656513/

This administration had been a grift since the escalator ride down, and the idea that there's no responsibility for it is sickening.
Click to expand...

I’ll include whispering of a civil war with threats of violence. You can’t tell me Trump’s popularity with some groups of people doesn’t weigh in on what legal actions are being considered and at what rate. On some level that’s the essence of politics and stability, real or perceived. At every possible turn Trump and his supporters are constantly pushing what is legal and a right to their absolute limits which includes blatant lies being perfectly legal.

I fear the only lessons that are going to come from Trump are going to be bad ones on what you can get away with.
 
There was a good interview with NY Times reporter Jeremy Peters about how we got from Pat Buchanan in 1992 to Sarah Palin in 2008 to the Tea Party in 2010 to Trump in 2016.

www.npr.org

How did the Republican Party become the party of Trump?

New York Times reporter Jeremy Peters says the religious right and social conservatives "got basically everything that they wanted" from Trump's presidency. Peters' new book is Insurgency.
www.npr.org www.npr.org

Short version: The GOP platform of lower taxes and regulations for big corporations was extremely unpopular. The “Bush” wing of the party was reaching out to see what policies they could adopt to attract minority voters. The right wing of the party went straight to racial animus and “if the Democrats won it’s only because they cheated.” Interesting note: Roger Ailes of Fox News reportedly told Romney after losing in 2012 that it was because of Democrats cheating... so this narrative has been years in the making.
 
Here’s a sign that Trump is losing support within his party.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491135618910670851/

McConnell is siding with Cheney and Kinzinger. History has shown that Mitch only cares about holding onto power, so this is a strong sign that the GOP feels that Trump is hurting more than helping so far in 2022.

If Trump becomes a boat anchor that drags on the party, I do not shed a single tear for any of them, especially Mitch. He had the chance to convict the former President in 2 impeachment trials, preventing him from ever running again... and chose to defend him instead.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
www.salon.com

Elderly Florida voters registered as Republicans without consent

Elderly Florida residents say canvassers in GOP hats changed registrations without their knowledge in voting "scam."
www.salon.com www.salon.com
Click to expand...

I posted about this in another thread. Pretty brazen, and unlike this mystery voter fraud of 2020 where millions of fishy ballots supposedly cost Trump the election, a couple reporters with a microphone uncovered more suspicious behavior in just a location or two.

We are entering a realm where skirting the laws, lying and simply using semantics that defies logic works on conservatives (BLM riots = burning down cities, Jan. 6 = “legitimate political discourse).

The only way this trend of disinformation, lies and lawlessness ends is if we have republicans who put principles above winning at all costs and start winning. I do think a GOP cleansing can gain steam, but it’s going to take them to start joining voices to denounce and discard Trump, and start propping up whatever principled conservatives they have left (there aren’t many).
 
Because with Trump you know it can always get worse…

The National Archives and Records Administration discovered what it believed was classified information in documents Donald J. Trump had taken with him from the White House as he left office, according to a person briefed on the matter.
Click to expand...

Sure, just leave cardboard boxes full of classified information laying around Mar-a-Lago. Why not?

As for a unique ”memento” of Trump’s time as President, they also found this infamous map:

1644459498631.jpeg

Trump might want to listen to this lecture about how it’s criminal to be negligent with government documents, especially classified ones:

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491236780200558594/
 
SuperMatt said:
Here’s a sign that Trump is losing support within his party.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1491135618910670851/

McConnell is siding with Cheney and Kinzinger. History has shown that Mitch only cares about holding onto power, so this is a strong sign that the GOP feels that Trump is hurting more than helping so far in 2022.

If Trump becomes a boat anchor that drags on the party, I do not shed a single tear for any of them, especially Mitch. He had the chance to convict the former President in 2 impeachment trials, preventing him from ever running again... and chose to defend him instead.
Click to expand...

McConnell is extremely cynical and self-serving when it comes to his own career, but on party matters and as a party leader his style has been that of a pulse taker and not an impulsive heart-attack maker. So, I'd say this is one of those milestones along the way for Republicans still confused about whether you can get lost on a straight road. The answer is yeah but only if you're still trying to follow the wrong gods home.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
I fear the only lessons that are going to come from Trump are going to be bad ones on what you can get away with.
Click to expand...

I still buy that "it ain't over 'til the fat lady sings." She's not even warmed up yet when it comes to how that insurrection plays out versus points of law --letter and spirit-- in the USA. What happened there was a set of crimes unlike any others this country has experienced in its history.

We don't know what the lessons are yet, because the consequences have not yet stopped playing out. There are members of the previous administration as well as some in the current and previous Congress who should be nervous about their own outcomes in this debacle.

And ok, maybe right now, no one really believes that neo-Teflon Donnie will finally find out that all nonstick pans eventually lose their surface appeal. I mean he has endured two impeachments and yet a party complicit in his blatantly pre-arranged acquittals in the Senate still hesitates to call him out on the part he played in the plotting to overturn a free and fair Presidential election. Trump has long made Nixon's attempts to go around the Constitution look like a daycare cookie break. Nixon's reputation has probably been jacked up a few points thanks to The Don...

So yeah, Trump will have left an indelible stain on the fabric of our democracy and in particular on the shreds of the current version of the Republican Party. It remains to be seen if the party can redeem itself or has to cede its tarnished banner to the Trump cult and regroup entirely.

You do have a point in that if there's no serious effort to reform the GOP, no clear renunciation of the power-at-any-cost path that has so lowered that party's standards and even their ability to formulate coherent policy, and if voters don't just blow them out of the water at the polls over that, then we haven't learned jack and our democracy is in serious trouble. Probably not civil war though. More like apathy, and so more opportunity for more grifters and self-serving strongmen to rise to power, and from either side of the aisle.

I still don't think we'll have learned only those bad ways to operate in the wake of Trump's anomalous presidency. Even now the Congress is addressing with seriousness some vulnerabilities of the electoral college system and looking to close them up. And it's not just Democrats looking to fix those issues. Republicans too realize we can't have another near miss on peaceful transfer of power, in part simply because language related to our election law is a little vague here and there.
 
I think republicans are gearing up for a huge intra-party fight. I don’t think Trump will be able to win a primary against a Republican who is not afraid of him. Trump and his sycophants wonder how Biden defeated Trump with little enthusiasm. Well, there are plenty of people who are passionate about beating Trump. I think McConnell knows this. A referendum on Trump is a winning strategy for democrats. Should
be interesting to see how this plays out.
 
GermanSuplex said:
I think republicans are gearing up for a huge intra-party fight. I don’t think Trump will be able to win a primary against a Republican who is not afraid of him. Trump and his sycophants wonder how Biden defeated Trump with little enthusiasm. Well, there are plenty of people who are passionate about beating Trump. I think McConnell knows this. A referendum on Trump is a winning strategy for democrats. Should
be interesting to see how this plays out.
Click to expand...
…with Trump in jail as we welcome MTG to the White House, where she issues an immediate pardon. :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
www.salon.com

Joe Walsh on what the left doesn't get: TrumpWorld "would happily burn this country down"

"I'm responsible for Trump," says former GOP congressman. Now he's here to warn us: The danger isn't going away
www.salon.com www.salon.com

"I hear from thousands of Republican voters every single day. If there's one message that I try to convey to the MSNBC viewers of the world, it is the following: These people, the Trump folks, the Republican voters of today, they would happily burn this country down to get the country they want. They would happily do it. And they tell me that. I don't think the folks who watch CNN and MSNBC every night really understand that fact.

There is an echo-chamber effect among Democrats, liberals and progressives, the NPR and MSNBC types. They refuse to accept that the people living in TrumpWorld and the MAGAverse really believe what they are being told. Those Trumpists don't think they are sick. They don't think they're confused. They don't think they're lost. They think that you folks, the Democrats, the "liberals," are the sick and confused ones. The MAGAverse is the real world to them, and all your interventions will not help them."
 
GermanSuplex said:
I don’t think Trump will be able to win a primary against a Republican who is not afraid of him.
Click to expand...
What scares me about that is, his only potential competitors in the Republican Party are as crazy as he is.

Any R in the White House will be a disaster. Trump could at least be occasionally talked out of taking some disasterous course of action, largely because there were some still establishment types on his staff who feared the consequences. If DeSantis gets in I’ve no doubt he’ll bring a bunch of his Florida friends who have no idea how Washington and the Constitution work and who frankly don’t care. The kinds of edicts DeSantis is issuing now will become presidential orders, with the full force of a Justice Department run by somebody like Madison Cawthorne.
 
Thomas Veil said:
What scares me about that is, his only potential competitors in the Republican Party are as crazy as he is.

Any R in the White House will be a disaster. Trump could at least be occasionally talked out of taking some disasterous course of action, largely because there were some still establishment types on his staff who feared the consequences. If DeSantis gets in I’ve no doubt he’ll bring a bunch of his Florida friends who have no idea how Washington and the Constitution work and who frankly don’t care. The kinds of edicts DeSantis is issuing now will become presidential orders, with the full force of a Justice Department run by somebody like Madison Cawthorne.
Click to expand...

The only real opposing solution to this as I see it is passing popular legislation, and well, we know how that is going. People are exhausted (which is a fascist playbook staple) and they need to be given a legitimate positive proven results alternative.

As the article I posted above says, Democrats, from voters to politicians aren't taking the threat seriously. They either don't want to believe it or they think it's something the establishment status quo can successfully counter. It sure as fuck can not.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
www.salon.com

Joe Walsh on what the left doesn't get: TrumpWorld "would happily burn this country down"

"I'm responsible for Trump," says former GOP congressman. Now he's here to warn us: The danger isn't going away
www.salon.com www.salon.com

"I hear from thousands of Republican voters every single day. If there's one message that I try to convey to the MSNBC viewers of the world, it is the following: These people, the Trump folks, the Republican voters of today, they would happily burn this country down to get the country they want. They would happily do it. And they tell me that. I don't think the folks who watch CNN and MSNBC every night really understand that fact.

There is an echo-chamber effect among Democrats, liberals and progressives, the NPR and MSNBC types. They refuse to accept that the people living in TrumpWorld and the MAGAverse really believe what they are being told. Those Trumpists don't think they are sick. They don't think they're confused. They don't think they're lost. They think that you folks, the Democrats, the "liberals," are the sick and confused ones. The MAGAverse is the real world to them, and all your interventions will not help them."
Click to expand...

I absolutely believe this. And this sector of republicans make up roughly 30 percent of the country or so.

But that’s still a minority. The question is, how do we galvanize democrats and what moderate republicans and independents are left? The loudest people in the room aren’t the majority of the room. It’s easy to see Trump rallies and things like January 6 as an insurmountable obstacle, but I don’t believe it is. There needs to be a domino effect of shaming Trump and his sycophants. Once that happens, the group will break off, some of them waking up to the fact they were in a cult, some of them may just go back to being moderate or traditional conservatives, and the remain blowhards won’t really matter.

I think the Justice Department indicting and convicting some of these goons like Giuliani, Bannon and any members of congress who actively participated in the events leading up to January 6 could be a good start.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Back
Top