Why are gas prices so high (and why do they keep climbing)?

[SuperMatt]

You are probably one of the few. Every time I see a comment wondering how all these people with monster trucks like paying $6 for diesel, I just think that they are going to be in for a shock when the prices of goods that move by diesel (pretty much everything) go up and they have no choice but to pay it. I can raise my prices to compensate, but most can't.

I bought my EV in 2016 to have less maintenance and freedom from gas price volatility. But I understand many people had worries about the new technology, the idea of range running out, etc. I think everybody should get an EV, but I get it. We just need more ”evangelism” on how much better an EV is.

 

[Eric]

You are probably one of the few. Every time I see a comment wondering how all these people with monster trucks like paying $6 for diesel, I just think that they are going to be in for a shock when the prices of goods that move by diesel (pretty much everything) go up and they have no choice but to pay it. I can raise my prices to compensate, but most can't.

It's getting passed down in all sorts of ways though, it's one of the main drivers of inflation for all retail price increases. I think it's just sticker shock at the pumps because it's one of the few places that it's so obvious.

 

[Edd]

The one quality I liked the most in him was that he fought back. That is something no Republican has really done since Reagan. He did not let the press dictate what he said or did.

Was he an ass, sure. But so is Biden the minute you challenge him with a question he doesn't like.

Trump was what people on the right had long for, and that was someone who wasn't afraid of the media. Would we have preferred it in a different package, sure. But it was what we got.

You sure are understating the monster Trump is and tossed in a false equivalency between him and Biden. His presidency could mean the end of our country.

 

[SuperMatt]

You sure are understating the monster Trump is and tossed in a false equivalency between him and Biden. His presidency could mean the end of our country.

Par for the course. Anybody trying to compare the two in such a manner probably wishes they were in the Capitol mob on Jan 6.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I bought my EV in 2016 to have less maintenance and freedom from gas price volatility. But I understand many people had worries about the new technology, the idea of range running out, etc. I think everybody should get an EV, but I get it. We just need more ”evangelism” on how much better an EV is.

This! But the trouble is EV’s are a polarising subject. People tend to be really pro or anti.
Of course there is a growing middle ground of people who would like an EV but can’t afford it or can’t get hold of one. But EV’s are the fastest growing sector over here.

 

[Chew Toy McCoy]

The one quality I liked the most in him was that he fought back. That is something no Republican has really done since Reagan. He did not let the press dictate what he said or did.

Was he an ass, sure. But so is Biden the minute you challenge him with a question he doesn't like.

Trump was what people on the right had long for, and that was someone who wasn't afraid of the media. Would we have preferred it in a different package, sure. But it was what we got.

That is something I frequently hear but IMO you can’t appreciate that quality and throw other critical thinking out the window or not see that the reason he fights is 100% about his ego and thinking he is NEVER wrong. But on the latter I can see it as a backlash to us being brainwashed into believing when things don’t work out it’s ALWAYS the individual’s fault.

The poor on the right has the reputation of voting against their own best interests and that notion sometimes gets rejected because the Republicans represent other values. If that were true and there was some real value to continually vote Republican then their voters wouldn’t be so insanely pissed off, embrace an epic conman as their savior, and morph the party into the grotesque monstrosity it is today. And unfortunately the only consistency the party has taught them is to always be scared and pissed off. They’ll never be happy and the party doesn’t offer anything remotely based on reality that would make them happy. It’s not going to stop at forced child birth and stockpiling an arsenal, the so called single issue voters. Win those and that equates to a content life? Does anybody honestly believe that? Seems like bad connecting the dots if your goal is to be content. Guns and babies everywhere wouldn’t be part of my utopia and they somehow missed the memo that babies don’t perpetually exist as babies.

As far as Biden, there is plenty of criticism of him from the left. Maybe not from mainstream news but you don’t have to scratch down too far below that to find it. By comparison Trump on the right is either seen as a savior or misunderstood crass genius. People criticizing him from the right are seen as a fringe group of out of touch relics.

 

[AG_PhamD]

Gas yesterday in my town directly next to Boston at Shell- $5.39/reg, $5.89/mid, $6.19/prem, $6.69/diesel. Absolutely ridiculous.

Thankfully I only drive about 12mi round trip to work. And I get to work around 7:00-7:30am which allows me to avoid the traffic. My 535i AWD gets pretty mediocre gas mileage by todays standards- like 22mpg average on my commute, but I occasionally bike to work. My wife drives about 18mi round trip but gets probably 26-27avg in her S60 T6 AWD. We do have extremely convenient access to two of the green line branches but at this point are no longer regularly working at locations that are remotely accessible by the trains or public transit in general.

We’re prefect candidates for EV’s but unfortunately living in an urban area with 100-120+ year old brownstones the cost of installing charging would be astronomical due to how things are arranged. It would be nice for all the owners/condo associations to make the investment jointly, which would significantly simplify things.

I have to say I am a little disgusted by this attitude celebrating high gas prices. While many of us may not be severely affected by high gas prices- especially the EV owners here, this is certainly causing financial difficulties for many people. I work with a lot of lower-income people and single mothers with kids- or even people who make comfortable salaries but have 2 kids in college- who have extremely high anxiety over these gas prices and in many cases can’t afford an EV or afford to even live anywhere close to where they work.

Plus, when the cost of gas goes up, obviously so does the price of everything that requires fuel for shipment aka basically everything- on top of all the inflation that’s occurring and market nonsense, and supply chain issues driving up costs. And most financial experts think we’re heading for a recession. If gas prices continue to rise I think the situation will become dire for many people.

I’m all for moving towards cleaner energy sources and vehicles and I’m happy to see the govt invest in that (not happy to see that a lot of that funding ends up in China)- but that’s going to be a transition over many years. I think the government should be doing more to bring down the costs or at least stop them from rising. I don’t buy the line that nothing can be done.

It’s great that Biden enacted the defense production act for green energy, perhaps using it for oil production. It’s true it’s a time consuming and expensive process for oil companies to increase oil production, but gas is a commodity and prices are based on future speculation.

Additionally, between all the oil rich countries capable of rapidly increasing production Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, and Russia, as much as I don’t love SA they are the lesser of those three evils. It astounds me Biden has allowed himself to be snubbed by SA/MBS- even prior to this whole fuel debacle. SA is almost entirely dependent on the US for military hardware. Maybe we should reconsider providing new deliveries, parts, maintenance, intelligence, etc. Now would be a rather inconvenient time for them to loose such support. They can always try to buy from Russia- that might be a bit tricky at the moment.

 

[Roller]

The one quality I liked the most in him was that he fought back. That is something no Republican has really done since Reagan. He did not let the press dictate what he said or did.

Was he an ass, sure. But so is Biden the minute you challenge him with a question he doesn't like.

Trump was what people on the right had long for, and that was someone who wasn't afraid of the media. Would we have preferred it in a different package, sure. But it was what we got.

You damn well knew what you were getting: a lying, grifting, misogynistic narcissist for whom "fighting back" means advocating violence against people who question him, especially the media. And now it's clear that he's a seditionist, too. All politicians, including Joe Biden, have faults, as do all humans. But implying any level of equivalency between him and Trump demonstrates that you don't get it or are just trolling.

 

[JayMysteri0]

I have to say I am a little disgusted by this attitude celebrating high gas prices. While many of us may not be severely affected by high gas prices- especially the EV owners here, this is certainly causing financial difficulties for many people. I work with a lot of lower-income people and single mothers with kids- or even people who make comfortable salaries but have 2 kids in college- who have extremely high anxiety over these gas prices and in many cases can’t afford an EV or afford to even live anywhere close to where they work.

Plus, when the cost of gas goes up, obviously so does the price of everything that requires fuel for shipment aka basically everything- on top of all the inflation that’s occurring and market nonsense, and supply chain issues driving up costs. And most financial experts think we’re heading for a recession. If gas prices continue to rise I think the situation will become dire for many people.

I’m all for moving towards cleaner energy sources and vehicles and I’m happy to see the govt invest in that (not happy to see that a lot of that funding ends up in China)- but that’s going to be a transition over many years. I think the government should be doing more to bring down the costs or at least stop them from rising. I don’t buy the line that nothing can be done.

It’s great that Biden enacted the defense production act for green energy, perhaps using it for oil production. It’s true it’s a time consuming and expensive process for oil companies to increase oil production, but gas is a commodity and prices are based on future speculation.

Additionally, between all the oil rich countries capable of rapidly increasing production Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, and Russia, as much as I don’t love SA they are the lesser of those three evils. It astounds me Biden has allowed himself to be snubbed by SA/MBS- even prior to this whole fuel debacle. SA is almost entirely dependent on the US for military hardware. Maybe we should reconsider providing new deliveries, parts, maintenance, intelligence, etc. Now would be a rather inconvenient time for them to loose such support. They can always try to buy from Russia- that might be a bit tricky at the moment.

I believe you're taking that the wrong way. It isn't so much as "celebrating high gas prices", as it's more like finally the painful necessary steps we all need to take to get away from fossil fuels. It maybe the catalyst that pushes more away from gas. I can't tell you not to be "disgusted", but I can tell you to not ignore all the context that has been provided all along WITH the discussions of high gas prices here.


Just the first 4 minutes

We've had posters from across the pond scoffing at our gas prices, while the talk here has been about reducing the dependency that's fossil fuel. We know it's destructive, we know it empowers the wrong sources, but yet we keep blindly & merrily on that course. EVERYONE knows someone that finds gas prices painful. No one is celebrating that. We also all know someone who after the last gas fiasco still went out & brought an SUV, big pick up truck, or muscle car. That was their choice, and they had to know if gas prices rose, they'd feel it more than others. We know this, because those are the models of vehicles that are the top selling, and we found sedans & coupes shrinking ind demand. Because the appetite for automobiles shifted despite being fully aware of our situations with fossil fuels.

Name the Ford coupe or sedan heavily promoted for sales in the U.S.

The context with mentioning the rise of gas prices is the hopeful transition away from fossil fuels that we should have done years ago, but we didn't out of concern for profits of oil companies, car companies, and convenience. If we had, perhaps electric vehicles wouldn't be the aspirational items they are now, and be more commonplace. That way when a guy decides to invade a country NOT his own & oil companies see a great reason for rising prices & keeping them there, it would not have affected so many at the pump / wallet.

So if you're going to be "disgusted", at least be disgusted for the proper reasons.

https://www.twitter.com/i/web/status/1535408002861150208/

Gas hits $5 a gallon for the first time. Here's how it got here and what's ahead

Gasoline has become more expensive given that oil prices have surged as the world recovers from the pandemic. Russia's invasion of Ukraine has also made things worse. Here are four things to know.

www.npr.org

So what can be done?​

Not much.

President Biden has said fighting inflation is his top economic priority, but when it comes to curbing oil prices, there's little he may be able to do.

Biden announced a plan in March to release up to 180 million barrels from the country's emergency oil reserves, spread over six months.

The unprecedented drawdown is helping, according to analysts, but it hasn't been enough to curb the price gains at the gas pump.

Biden has also called on U.S. oil producers to ramp up drilling, but oil producers have faced constraints, including in securing materials and enough workers.

Oil companies are also under pressure from shareholders not to chase high oil prices too much given the industry's history of boom-and-bust cycles.

Biden has also called on oil cartel OPEC+ to significantly increase prodution.

The group this month announced it would lift production modestly, but data shows that a handful of OPEC+ countries are producing well below their current allotments because of different challenges faced by members.

 

[Herdfan]

We also all know someone who after the last gas fiasco still went out & brought an SUV, big pick up truck, or muscle car. That was their choice, and they had to know if gas prices rose, they'd feel it more than others. We know this, because those are the models of vehicles that are the top selling, and we found sedans & coupes shrinking ind demand. Because the appetite for automobiles shifted despite being fully aware of our situations with fossil fuels.

I don't feel too bad for someone who bought an $80,000 Suburban. If you can afford that, then if you drive a normal amount, you probably aren't really affected.

I feel bad for the small independent contractor who has to have a large truck to make a living. It is not a lifestyle choice, it is a requirement. And you know what? There current isn't an EV substitute. Ford Lightning? Please. First, you can't get one, second they will build the $90K Platinum ahead of the $40K Pro. These guys are driving 10-year old SuperDuty's because it is all they can afford. And they are suffering.

These guys don't care about EV vs fossil fuels. They just want to be able to work and provide for their families. And right now they are being pinched.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Gas yesterday in my town directly next to Boston at Shell- $5.39/reg, $5.89/mid, $6.19/prem, $6.69/diesel. Absolutely ridiculous.

Thankfully I only drive about 12mi round trip to work. And I get to work around 7:00-7:30am which allows me to avoid the traffic. My 535i AWD gets pretty mediocre gas mileage by todays standards- like 22mpg average on my commute, but I occasionally bike to work. My wife drives about 18mi round trip but gets probably 26-27avg in her S60 T6 AWD. We do have extremely convenient access to two of the green line branches but at this point are no longer regularly working at locations that are remotely accessible by the trains or public transit in general.

We’re prefect candidates for EV’s but unfortunately living in an urban area with 100-120+ year old brownstones the cost of installing charging would be astronomical due to how things are arranged. It would be nice for all the owners/condo associations to make the investment jointly, which would significantly simplify things.

I have to say I am a little disgusted by this attitude celebrating high gas prices. While many of us may not be severely affected by high gas prices- especially the EV owners here, this is certainly causing financial difficulties for many people. I work with a lot of lower-income people and single mothers with kids- or even people who make comfortable salaries but have 2 kids in college- who have extremely high anxiety over these gas prices and in many cases can’t afford an EV or afford to even live anywhere close to where they work.

Plus, when the cost of gas goes up, obviously so does the price of everything that requires fuel for shipment aka basically everything- on top of all the inflation that’s occurring and market nonsense, and supply chain issues driving up costs. And most financial experts think we’re heading for a recession. If gas prices continue to rise I think the situation will become dire for many people.

I’m all for moving towards cleaner energy sources and vehicles and I’m happy to see the govt invest in that (not happy to see that a lot of that funding ends up in China)- but that’s going to be a transition over many years. I think the government should be doing more to bring down the costs or at least stop them from rising. I don’t buy the line that nothing can be done.

It’s great that Biden enacted the defense production act for green energy, perhaps using it for oil production. It’s true it’s a time consuming and expensive process for oil companies to increase oil production, but gas is a commodity and prices are based on future speculation.

Additionally, between all the oil rich countries capable of rapidly increasing production Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, and Russia, as much as I don’t love SA they are the lesser of those three evils. It astounds me Biden has allowed himself to be snubbed by SA/MBS- even prior to this whole fuel debacle. SA is almost entirely dependent on the US for military hardware. Maybe we should reconsider providing new deliveries, parts, maintenance, intelligence, etc. Now would be a rather inconvenient time for them to loose such support. They can always try to buy from Russia- that might be a bit tricky at the moment.

I appreciate not everyone can afford an EV and those on lower incomes are the most affected. I earn good money, but Mrs AFB doesn’t work at all, so when you look at our household income it isn’t great. The investment I made in an EV will take many years to make me better off than buying petrol. But I’m glad I made the leap when I did.
But at £100 for a tankful my 50 mile round trip to work is not getting any easier if I was filling up my Golf every 10 days.

 

[SuperMatt]

I appreciate not everyone can afford an EV and those on lower incomes are the most affected. I earn good money, but Mrs AFB doesn’t work at all, so when you look at our household income it isn’t great. The investment I made in an EV will take many years to make me better off than buying petrol. But I’m glad I made the leap when I did.
But at £100 for a tankful my 50 mile round trip to work is not getting any easier if I was filling up my Golf every 10 days.

It is definitely a multi-faceted issue. My VW e-Golf, bought in 2016, cost about $25K and with the $7500 tax credit, was a sub-$18K vehicle. My old car was dead so I needed a new one. I chose it to save me money, and it has. Unfortunately, inexpensive EVs are very hard to find today.

1. The auto manufacturers definitely deserve a lot of blame.
2. The government moved too slow to raise MPG standards to the point where EVs would be needed by manufacturers to meet the standards.
3. People are skeptical of new technology.
4. Neither the government nor private industry has invested in a robust charging infrastructure.
5. I see regular anti-EV pieces in the Wall Street Journal and elsewhere, clearly put there by the fossil fuel lobby.
6. Consumers are short-sighted. The last time gas prices were high, almost everybody bought a Prius. When they went down again, they bought SUVs. They do have to blame themselves individually for that choice though.

I am happy to see Ford getting aggressive with their marketing of an electric truck. Most other manufacturers act embarrassed that they have EVs, even going as far as to create a different brand name for their EVs so you don’t immediately associate them with the brand you “know and love.”

We’ve known two undeniable truths for a long time.

1. Fossil fuel emissions are having a devastating impact on the habitability of the planet.
2. A world economy dependent on a single commodity (oil) is inherently volatile and fragile.

Instead of accepting these facts and doing something about them, those who get rich from oil have denied them, used propaganda to convince others to deny them, and actively worked to make things worse for everybody except themselves.

If we as a society had the will, we could almost all be driving affordable electric vehicles (or live in cities where we don’t even need cars) already.

 

[JayMysteri0]

I don't feel too bad for someone who bought an $80,000 Suburban. If you can afford that, then if you drive a normal amount, you probably aren't really affected.

I feel bad for the small independent contractor who has to have a large truck to make a living. It is not a lifestyle choice, it is a requirement. And you know what? There current isn't an EV substitute. Ford Lightning? Please. First, you can't get one, second they will build the $90K Platinum ahead of the $40K Pro. These guys are driving 10-year old SuperDuty's because it is all they can afford. And they are suffering.

These guys don't care about EV vs fossil fuels. They just want to be able to work and provide for their families. And right now they are being pinched.

And no one is dismissing them. It's not about feeling bad for this person Vs that person. It's about STILL being in a situation where we are so beholden to fossil fuels. The reason there may not be a substitute for larger vehicles is because there was no REAL desire to look into alternatives for such much earlier. Perhaps if a real move to alternatives had been sooner, there would be large vehicle substitutes. As it is now there's a feeling of no need, because of technology / infrastructure / lack of desire or need. There maybe a better network of chargers to increase adoption. There may even be lower costs by now for an electric vehicle.

Let's also be honest because there is no way to sugar coat it. If adoption of alternative vehicles had happened earlier, there would still be subset who would NOT adopt. Whether if it's for necessity, practical reasons, or a romantic view of gas powered vehicles. The price of gas would still be high. Whether it's taxes or fees, or in a new world a lack of demand. Let's not pretend the sting of gas prices was NEVER not going to happen. It's a matter now of how many of us feel it, over how many of us might have avoided if an alternative was readily available.

Someone is going to hurt whether don't go electric, or already went electric. "Feeling bad" for contractors, drivers, lower income individuals, etc, for some is a concern that's suddenly adopted when it's convenient. This is happening now, it happened in the past, and it's going to happen in the future. Fossil fuel reliance is NOT practical. It won't matter if who is in office, we will feel that pinch again, and it still will not be their fault. What is the fault of whoever is in charge is leaving us all vulnerable to an ever dwindling resource that is at the whims dictators & greedy markets.

 

[Herdfan]

Perhaps if a real move to alternatives had been sooner, there would be large vehicle substitutes. As it is now there's a feeling of no need, because of technology / infrastructure / lack of desire or need. There maybe a better network of chargers to increase adoption. There may even be lower costs by now for an electric vehicle.

The one thing I don't understand with regard to larger vehicles is why they haven't adopted the locomotive engine design. Small diesel turning a generator to provide power to electric motors.

People buy diesels because of the torque, not the HP. And electric motors provide torque out the wazoo. Put a Tesla size motor on each wheel and you are back to your 1000 ft/lbs of torque.

I hated my EE class, so calculating the power needed to turn a generator big enough to power these motors is above my pay grade.

Any reason this wouldn't work?

there would still be subset who would NOT adopt.

Of course. There is always a subset. There are idiots who will spend $1000 to change the tune on their brand new $60-80K diesel trucks so they don't have to buy $15 worth of DEF each month. And it also invalidates the warranty on said $60-80K truck. Pure lunacy, but they exist.

Now I will say, I prefer how diesel trucks drive. Acceleration is very smooth. I am sure this could be set via software in an electric motor, but will they?

 

[JayMysteri0]

The one thing I don't understand with regard to larger vehicles is why they haven't adopted the locomotive engine design. Small diesel turning a generator to provide power to electric motors.

People buy diesels because of the torque, not the HP. And electric motors provide torque out the wazoo. Put a Tesla size motor on each wheel and you are back to your 1000 ft/lbs of torque.

I hated my EE class, so calculating the power needed to turn a generator big enough to power these motors is above my pay grade.

Any reason this wouldn't work?

Mine is NOT the place to figure out what will & won't work with EVs. I'd just like to get one not named Tesla, and enjoy it.

Of course. There is always a subset. There are idiots who will spend $1000 to change the tune on their brand new $60-80K diesel trucks so they don't have to buy $15 worth of DEF each month. And it also invalidates the warranty on said $60-80K truck. Pure lunacy, but they exist.

Now I will say, I prefer how diesel trucks drive. Acceleration is very smooth. I am sure this could be set via software in an electric motor, but will they?

It's because of "Of course. There is always a subset." That we don't stop progressing. For years that was the excuse car manufacturers used to NOT seriously pursue the EV market. Now that is 'in', manufacturers are rushing to get in, and discovering they can't make enough cars. Especially due to other shortages. That subset will always be present whether by choice or need, but it can't be the only concern.

The point is, the sooner EVs become a more viable alternative, we will probably see greater options. Ford does tote that their electric pickup will do some loads. Freightliner already has their own EVs, including one that is a school bus that can carry 81. The potential is there, it just needs the adoption rate to support it. One can only hope if a big enough adoption rate ( along with better infrastructure to support bikes and better mass transit ) does happen. Reducing the cost & demand for fossil fuel, so that those who want to remain with fossil fuel can afford it. But they will inevitably be hit with other fees or penalties for the continued destructive presence of fossil fuel vehicles.

 

[Herdfan]

Well this didn't age well.

 

[Edd]

Well this didn't age well.

View attachment 14849

Did Biden start the war?

 

[Herdfan]

Did Biden start the war?

I don't think I blamed Biden or even mentioned him.

Just that this was predicted and brushed off as some conservative fear mongering.

Some doomsay-ish people latched onto the fact that a gas station had adjusted its dispensers to accomodate an additional price digit. Arrrgh! Ten dollar gas coming soon! The station happens to be near the local drag track, and top fuel is slightly more expensive than suv juice.

Well, that didn't age well either:

 

[SuperMatt]

Did Biden start the war?

Yeah, how did that writer fail to predict that Russia would invade Ukraine leading to an embargo on one of the world’s biggest oil and gas producers?

There’s a reason one of the biggest subreddits is dedicated to the right being unable to understand memes.

 

[Herdfan]

Yeah, how did that writer fail to predict that Russia would invade Ukraine leading to an embargo on one of the world’s biggest oil and gas producers?

Hmmmm.........

Here is the EIA.gov chart of gas prices. When Biden was inaugurated, January 2021, the average cost of all grades of gasoline was $2.420. Russia invaded Ukraine in February of 2022 when the price was already $3.611. So maybe the last few months the price increase is related to Ukraine amounting to a $0.934 increase. But I would like you to explain how the previous $1.191 increase from January 2021 through February 2022 has anything to do with Ukraine. I'm not blaming Biden, but it all certainly is not related to Ukraine no matter how much MSNBC tells you it is.

2021	2.420	2.587	2.898	2.948	3.076	3.157	3.231	3.255	3.272	3.384	3.491	3.406
2022	3.413	3.611	4.322	4.213	4.545