Hamas has launched a major attack on Israel

Roller said:
From what I've read, Hamas fired rockets into Israel after the IDF entered Rafah, but who knows? It's so difficult to get accurate information. Regardless, I think Netanyahu would have proceeded with the Rafah operation no matter what Hamas did. He needs the war to continue at some level so he can stay in power.
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Trump and Netanyahu - twin sons from different mothers.
 
Alli said:
Trump and Netanyahu - twin sons from different mothers.
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And the anti-Trumpers who are going to "sit it out" during the next election may as well just be casting their vote for him anyway, they just can't see this for some reason.

I'm also wondering exactly how hijacking all of these college campuses makes any sense for the protesters, I mean logically I'm just trying to understand what the point of it is. It seems really arbitrary.
 
Eric said:
And the anti-Trumpers who are going to "sit it out" during the next election may as well just be casting their vote for him anyway, they just can't see this for some reason.

I'm also wondering exactly how hijacking all of these college campuses makes any sense for the protesters, I mean logically I'm just trying to understand what the point of it is. It seems really arbitrary.
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A small minority of voices may be getting amplified. This is a promising article.


It’s an important issue, but I think many fear a second Trump term and are fretting too much. The protests need to be watched, and Biden is threading the needle. It’s also not his first rodeo, so hopefully there’s no disaster involving the USA, there can be some kind of deals made during ceasefires, and the protests don’t spike.

I think the polls against Biden and Trump, whoever you support, can be explained by the intense partisanship and a large chunk of disinterested Americans buying the “both guys are bad” narrative. Which is beyond stupid, but it is what it is.

I still think Trump is propped up by his former and now disproven reputation as some sort of “businessman”. Apparently, when republicans ask if you were better off four years ago, they’re dealing with more dementia than Joe..

May 9, 2020

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Supposedly, he (Sinwar) was a big reason for the ceasefires not happening, so I would imagine the ball is definitely in Bibi’s hands now. I hope he agrees to ramping this thing down, but I don’t see it.
 
GermanSuplex said:
Supposedly, he was a big reason for the ceasefires not happening, so I would imagine the ball is definitely in Bibi’s hands now. I hope he agrees to ramping this thing down, but I don’t see it.
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he hasn’t even attacked Iran yet. We’ve a ways to go.
 
GermanSuplex said:
Supposedly, he (Sinwar) was a big reason for the ceasefires not happening, so I would imagine the ball is definitely in Bibi’s hands now. I hope he agrees to ramping this thing down, but I don’t see it.
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You called it, based on his statement moments ago.
 
Citysnaps said:
Great news and day! Hat tip to the IDF.
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Small victory. Isreal has created more enemies than it has ever had and will never be safe as a result, and unlike most wars the west has been involved in, there’s no shortage of coverage of the massive death and destruction done by the “good guys.” Maybe it’s time to plant another bio about a hostage that is supposed to somehow offset the 50k+ Palestinians killed directly and countless indirectly.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
Small victory. Isreal has created more enemies than it has ever had and will never be safe as a result, and unlike most wars the west has been involved in, there’s no shortage of coverage of the massive death and destruction done by the “good guys.” Maybe it’s time to plant another bio about a hostage that is supposed to somehow offset the 50k+ Palestinians killed directly and countless indirectly.
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Two separate stories; both of which I've commented on in the past.

Today I'm giving the IDF and Israel props for taking out the killer who architected and led the group who was responsible for the October 7th 2023 attack on Israel that murdered 1,200 men women and children, including 46 Americans and citizens from other countries, and still holding hostages including some Americans.
 
Citysnaps said:
Two separate stories; both of which I've commented on in the past.

Today I'm giving the IDF and Israel props for taking out the killer who architected and led the group who was responsible for the October 7th 2023 attack on Israel that murdered 1,200 men women and children, including 46 Americans and citizens from other countries, and still holding hostages including some Americans.
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My response was probably a little harsh. I know what you were talking about. My point was the killing of one leader isn’t going to stop the coming revenge for Isreal’s actions over the past year (and counting) that will come specifically because of those actions and a lot more people will be sympathetic to it. It won’t be some vague “I don’t know what these animals are so mad about” that usually gets attributed to these events. The west has lost the near complete control of the narrative they were blessed with for most of modern history.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
My response was probably a little harsh. I know what you were talking about. My point was the killing of one leader isn’t going to stop the coming revenge for Isreal’s actions over the past year (and counting) that will come specifically because of those actions and a lot more people will be sympathetic to it. It won’t be some vague “I don’t know what these animals are so mad about” that usually gets attributed to these events. The west has lost the near complete control of the narrative they were blessed with for most of modern history.
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I'm *somewhat* optimistic.

It's a golden opportunity. Netanyahu today has committed to letting Hamas terrorists free passage out of Gaza in exchange for the release of the hostages they're holding. It sounds like Biden is willing to get involved in fostering a long term solution. I suspect other world leaders will as well.

Of course a lasting peace will be far more complicated and likely tenuous along the way. I say let's give it a chance and see what happens.
 
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Seems like the death of Sinwar was just the beginning, unfortunately. I believe I saw Hamas has now said the war will continue as well, and Israel has announced strikes in Lebanon are “imminent”.
 
Citysnaps said:
I'm *somewhat* optimistic.

It sounds like Biden is willing to get involved in fostering a long term solution.
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What exactly would a "long term solution" look like? Hamas didn't launch this war, and Hezbollah/Iran aren't attacking Israel, to bring about the much talked about two-state solution. As with all previous wars going back to 1948, as well as attacks on Jewish villages even in the late 1800's, the conflict is a religious one, with one side wanting to establish a global caliphate.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
Small victory. Isreal has created more enemies than it has ever had and will never be safe as a result, and unlike most wars the west has been involved in, there’s no shortage of coverage of the massive death and destruction done by the “good guys.” Maybe it’s time to plant another bio about a hostage that is supposed to somehow offset the 50k+ Palestinians killed directly and countless indirectly.
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First of all, while the situation is tragic on both sides, such figures come from Hamas and are no doubt exaggerated. Early on they were showing photos of destruction which were actually from the Syrian civil war. Also, in an interview a Hamas spokesman denied that the Oct. 7 intruders attacked Israeli civilians. So any "information" from them is suspect.

Second, and I know I've asked this multiple times, what alternative path would Israel have when Hamas launches rockets from rooftops and alleyways in populated areas, when they vow to repeat the atrocities of Oct. 7 whenever possible and when they continue to hold hostages? Is Israel supposed to do nothing so as to avoid Palestinian civilian casualties while its enemy is trying to kill as many Israeli civilians as possible? Should Israel invite Hamas leaders over for tea and ask them nicely to stop attacking?

Hamas started this war. Hamas committed unspeakable atrocities and bragged about them on social media. Hamas continues to hold hostages and endanger its own civilians by hiding among them and using schools and hospitals as command centers and weapons depots. There were even reports that they forcibly prevented civilians from fleeing conflict areas to induce more of the kind of reaction you have. They could end this war any time by surrendering, disarming and releasing the hostages.
 
mac_in_tosh said:
First of all, while the situation is tragic on both sides, such figures come from Hamas and are no doubt exaggerated. Early on they were showing photos of destruction which were actually from the Syrian civil war. Also, in an interview a Hamas spokesman denied that the Oct. 7 intruders attacked Israeli civilians. So any "information" from them is suspect.

Second, and I know I've asked this multiple times, what alternative path would Israel have when Hamas launches rockets from rooftops and alleyways in populated areas, when they vow to repeat the atrocities of Oct. 7 whenever possible and when they continue to hold hostages? Is Israel supposed to do nothing so as to avoid Palestinian civilian casualties while its enemy is trying to kill as many Israeli civilians as possible? Should Israel invite Hamas leaders over for tea and ask them nicely to stop attacking?

Hamas started this war. Hamas committed unspeakable atrocities and bragged about them on social media. Hamas continues to hold hostages and endanger its own civilians by hiding among them and using schools and hospitals as command centers and weapons depots. There were even reports that they forcibly prevented civilians from fleeing conflict areas to induce more of the kind of reaction you have. They could end this war any time by surrendering, disarming and releasing the hostages.
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Hamas's numbers should be suspect, but they aren't literally the only ones providing the numbers. There are figures reported by others on the ground and a lot of well informed estimates that exceeds even what Hamas is reporting.

Hamas. "Well, they voted them into office." I'll pretend it was a competely fair election with absolutely no intimidation (and didn't they stop having elections a long time ago?), and I don't know if you are a US citizen, but if a foreign power killed your family and a good percentage of your friends based on being a MAGA Trump supporter because you live in the US would your response be "That's a fair assessment."? Like I said before, this action is creating far more enemies than they've ever had and for that reason alone their response has been the wrong one for their future security and world standing. I'd go as far as saying the US is single-handedly keeping them from being considered a rouge pariah state by the rest of the world.

But this is just one situation in many currently in the world where we have leaders or leaders in waiting that give zero fucks about the majority of humanity including their own people beyond using them for propaganda to gain or stay in power. They'll gladly throw their people into the war grinder far removed from their own reality.
 
mac_in_tosh said:
What exactly would a "long term solution" look like? Hamas didn't launch this war, and Hezbollah/Iran aren't attacking Israel, to bring about the much talked about two-state solution. As with all previous wars going back to 1948, as well as attacks on Jewish villages even in the late 1800's, the conflict is a religious one, with one side wanting to establish a global caliphate.
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I don't have any specific arrangement or structure in mind of what a long-term solution would look like. I still feel optimistic there is a solution. I do understand you (and others) feel there is no solution.
 
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