General Health and Exercise

[Clix Pix]

i know what a registered dietitian is, because my mother was one. i also know that there are a lot more current studies that show the benefits of IF and the nutrition experts are often slow to move with current research.

also, there is nothing to say that someone doing IF has to do it in the evening. but for me, i’m eating in the evening anyway with my family so it’s easy to work out.

i appreciate the discussion, but as with most topics, if you “hear” something, it’s better to do actual research, rather than spouting off half truths.

There is nothing I have written that is a "half-truth."

 

[mollyc]

I've heard, too, where eating a lot later in the day is not a healthy practice, too and can affect metabolism.

There is nothing I have written that is a "half-truth."

Where's your source for your first statement? An actual, published source. I linked medical journals and university/hospital sources.

 

[Clix Pix]

Do you have proof that your mother is or was a Registered Dietitian?

 

[mollyc]

I'm sorry, what??? I ask you to post reputable sources backing up your assertions, and you want me to post information about my mother publicly?? LMAO, this is a new low even for you.

It's clear that you know nothing about the topic at hand and don't have anything useful to contribute to the validity or not of intermittent fasting. You have somehow made this an attack on me personally, which is not only unbecoming but frankly childish.

---

To the people who have engaged in good faith discussions on the matter, I am sorry how this has devolved. I would love to get back on track if any of you wish to continue discussing it. I also hope those of you with true medical issues are able to find the right people to help you get well.

 

[Huntn]

I’d call it moderate protein, especially if you’re only supposed to have it 2x a day. 16g/serving also packet according to her branded products. The general govt recommendation is 0.8g per kg of body weight. So for example 200lbs = about 90kg = 72g/day.

I’ve been fortunate to have never struggled with my weight. I often have to remind myself to eat in fact and have a fast metabolism. But by nature I pretty much eat one meal a day in the evening. I suppose that’s kinda like one of the IF methods. I occasionally something in the mid-morning. If I eat within an hour or two of waking up I feel sick.

I did have a pancreatic issue in the past that required me to eat a zero fat diet for months. That was pretty miserable. So I can sympathize with the challenge dieting entails.

I’m by no means thoroughly knowledgeable in nutrition, but I regularly work with diabetic patients and deal with their diabetes meds and counsel them on lifestyle modifications- but I do work with an amazing nutritionist and patients find her very helpful. It’s generally our policy she consult everyone at least once who is diabetic. I would highly suggest working with a nutritionist if you need help figuring out your diet.

The interesting thing is imo how little I eat during a typical day. Usually a bowl of cereal in the morning (I’ve gone back to eating breakfast), eggs and bacon 1 a week, a 200 calorie protein drink for lunch, and 2 or 3 course dinner with not a lot on the plate, and for desert a small bowl of Greek yogurt. I just don’t get it.

 

[Clix Pix]

It's not only the quantity that one consumes, it is the quality......

 

[AG_PhamD]

The interesting thing is imo how little I eat during a typical day. Usually a bowl of cereal in the morning (I’ve gone back to eating breakfast), eggs and bacon 1 a week, a 200 calorie protein drink for lunch, and 2 or 3 course dinner with not a lot on the plate, and for desert a small bowl of Greek yogurt. I just don’t get it.

As I’m you know, as you age your metabolism slows down, making it harder to burn calories. In males, testosterone and growth hormone decline, resulting in a decline of muscle mass, thus less calories are required to fuel one’s body (though many people continue the same amount of calories). And when older people do exercise, they burn less calories due to the reduced muscle mass. TLDR as you age it gets harder to lose weight.

There are drugs to increase testosterone and HGH levels available for those with abnormally low levels, though I think in a lot of cases these are over-prescribed and not worth the longterm risks. But that’s another conversation requiring a lot of nuance.

It may also be worth having your thyroid hormone levels checked, as those age 50-60+ are at higher risk of hypothyroidism.

And as @Clix Pix mentioned, quality of the food is important. Not all, but a lot of cereal has a lot of added sugar and is processed into refined carbs. And I suppose what your dinner entails is another factor.

 

[Huntn]

Is anyone here on a fasting diet? I’ll like to hear about it.

I was at USAToday and this ad popped up about losing weight by fasting (Easy Fast), it asked a whole bunch of question then ordered a discounted plan associated with their app, and it gave me 8min to make up my mind. I have never reacted well to high pressure sales, so instead of signing up, I started researching.

6 ways to do intermittent fasting: The best methods

Intermittent fasting is an increasingly popular diet option for weight loss. There are several programs, but this guide can help you find which one is right for you.

www.medicalnewstoday.com

1. Fasting for 12 hrs.​

2. Fasting for 16 hours​

3. Fasting for 2 days a week​

4. Alternate day fasting​

5. A weekly 24-hour fast​

6. The Warrior Diet​

 

[cbum]

I'm pre-diabetic, and my Hemoglobin A1c was inching above the upper limit of normal, so I started on a very old anti diabetes drug - Metformin.
It decreases the amount of glucose you absorb from your food and the amount of glucose made by your liver. Metformin also increases your body's response to insulin. So it only works for Type II (adult-onset) diabetes.

I'm only bringing this up because I made an unexpected discovery - while my appetite is unchanged, I reach satiety much faster than I used to - i.e., if I pay attention, like asking myself if I really want to finish my plate or have a second helping, my answer is not really - I'm full.
That is in fact surprisingly similar to the effect of all these new GLP-1 drugs that cost a fortune.
Did I mention Metformin is a very old drug? In other words, its dirt cheap.

I don't want to pretend it is as effective, but my experience with Metformin was eye-opening.

 

[Huntn]

I'm pre-diabetic, and my Hemoglobin A1c was inching above the upper limit of normal, so I started on a very old anti diabetes drug - Metformin.
It decreases the amount of glucose you absorb from your food and the amount of glucose made by your liver. Metformin also increases your body's response to insulin. So it only works for Type II (adult-onset) diabetes.

I'm only bringing this up because I made an unexpected discovery - while my appetite is unchanged, I reach satiety much faster than I used to - i.e., if I pay attention, like asking myself if I really want to finish my plate or have a second helping, my answer is not really - I'm full.
That is in fact surprisingly similar to the effect of all these new GLP-1 drugs that cost a fortune.
Did I mention Metformin is a very old drug? In other words, its dirt cheap.

I don't want to pretend it is as effective, but my experience with Metformin was eye-opening.

Would fasting be an option, if weight is an issue?

 

[cbum]

Not really my area, but I believe there are a lot a data on the benefits of intermittent fasting.
I couldn't tell you which specific approach is the best, I would stay away from extremes and find something you can stick with indefinitely, not just for a while. Usually that means slower progress, making it look unattractive, but in the longer term it's more successful.

 

[Huntn]

Not really my area, but I believe there are a lot a data on the benefits of intermittent fasting.
I couldn't tell you which specific approach is the best, I would stay away from extremes and find something you can stick with indefinitely, not just for a while. Usually that means slower progress, making it look unattractive, but in the longer term it's more successful.

I’ve started a 2 day a week 24 hr fast. No problems so far, but it’s too early to tell.

 

[Huntn]

I’ve done my 3rd, 24 fast, and weighed myself this morning: 222 lb a lose of 6lb. I am exercising on the day of the fast, I’m noticing no issues and the fast is not unduly stressful. Basically I’m eating breakfast and skipping lunch and dinner on fast days, drinking lots of liquid. If I’m feeling hungry, I will fix a cup of chicken bouillon. I drank 2 cups yesterday. One cube is 5 cal. Also coffee is supposed to help and that it suppress your appetite.

More on Fasting:

How Often Should You Do Intermittent Fasting​

https://www.medicinenet.com/how_often_should_you_do_intermittent_fasting/article.htm

Intermittent fasting is an eating plan that involves fasting for a set amount of time before eating again. Here are 7 ways to do it
While most diets focus on what to eat, intermittent fasting focuses on when you eat. It’s a popular health and fitness trend that alternates between fasting eating, where you fast for a set amount of time before eating again.
There are different fasting schedules you can try, but the principle is roughly the same: you eat only during a specific period of time, and avoid consuming anything other than water and other noncaloric beverages during the fasting period.

How does intermittent fasting work?​

The food we eat is broken down into macro and micronutrients. Carbohydrates, such as rice and starchy vegetables, get broken down into glucose and used for energy. Unused glucose gets stored in the liver and muscles as glycogen and fat in the fat cells.
When you fast, your body exhausts its sugar stores and starts burning fat for energy, leading to weight loss.

7 ways to do intermittent fasting​

There are several methods of intermittent fasting, varying in the fasting period and the calorie allowances. Since different methods may suit different people, you may want to experiment to see what works best for your lifestyle and preferences.
Before embarking on an intermittent fast or deciding how often to fast, it is important to talk to a medical professional about potential benefits and risks, especially if you have a medical condition.
Below are 7 popular methods of intermittent fasting:

1. 16/8 method: Involves fasting for 16 hours and restricting the eating window to 8 hours. Within the eating window, you can fit in 2-3 or more meals.
2. 12-hour fast: Involves a 12-hour fasting window every day. The easiest way to do the 12-hour fast is to include sleep in the fasting window.
3. The 5:2 diet: Involves eating normally for 5 days of the week and restricting calorie intake to 500-600 calories for 2 days of the week.
4. Alternate-day fasting: Involves fasting every other day either by not eating anything or eating about 500 calories on fasting days.
5. Eat stop eat: Involves 1-2 complete 24-hour fasts per week. Fasting from dinner one day to dinner the next day amounts to a full 24-hour fast. This is an extreme form of fasting and is not recommended.
6. The warrior diet: The warrior diet involves eating small amounts of raw fruits and vegetables during the day (a 20-hour fasting window) and eating 1 huge meal at night within a 4-hour eating window.
7. Meal skipping: Another way to do intermittent fasting is to occasionally skip 1-2 meals according to your hunger levels or time constraints. This flexible approach may be good for beginners, since you don’t need to follow a structured plan to reap benefits.

What are the benefits of intermittent fasting?​

Studies show that intermittent fasting may have health benefits, including:

• Weight loss: Calorie deficit, increased metabolic rate, and enhanced hormone function can contribute to weight loss.
• Reduces risk of diabetes: Reduced insulin resistance can lower blood glucose and insulinlevels if you are at risk of diabetes. It may also help those who suffer from polycystic ovarian disease by reducing insulin levels.
• Lowers cholesterol: Improved lipid profiles, including lower overall cholesterol, low-density lipoprotein (LDL), and triglyceride levels, have been linked to intermittent fasting.
• Improves heart health: Intermittent can help prevent heart disease, as well as recovery after a heart attack, by:
  • Decreasing inflammatory factors, such as C-reactive proteins and cytokines
  • Lowering blood lipid, cholesterol and triglyceride levels
  • Reducing blood pressure
  • Improving resting heart rate
  • Stabilizing blood glucose levels
• Improves brain health: Emerging evidence shows that intermittent fasting may play a role in the suppression of inflammation in the brain, thus reducing the risk of neurological disorders, such as Alzheimer's disease, Parkinson's disease, and stroke.
• Reduces oxidative stress: Studies show that intermittent fasting may reduce oxidative stress, which causes aging and many chronic diseases.
• Reduces inflammation: Intermittent fasting has been shown to reduce concentrations of pro-inflammatory markers, such as homocysteine, interleukin 6, and C-reactive protein, which play a role in the development of these chronic diseases (such as atherosclerosis, osteoporosis, heart disease, and diabetes).
• May help prevent cancer: Research indicates that intermittent fasting may delay the growth of tumors and reduce the risk of cancer, although further research is needed.
• Induces cellular repair: Evidence suggests that intermittent fasting increases the frequency of autophagy, removing unwanted and dysfunctional cells. Increased autophagy prevents several diseases, including cancer, inflammatory diseases, neurodegenerative diseases, and cardiovascular diseases.
• May extend lifespan: Intermittent fasting may increase overall quality of life and reduce the risk of developing chronic diseases. Weight loss, decreased blood pressure, and other benefits may contribute positively to extending lifespan.

​

What are possible drawbacks of intermittent fasting?​

Potential risk factors associated with intermittent fasting include:

• Weight gain: Some people indulge in binge eating behavior during non-fasting periods. Eating more calories than you burn will lead to weight gain.
• Feelings of being sick: Long periods of fasting can lower blood sugar levels and may cause headaches, lethargy, crankiness, constipation, dizziness, or nausea.
• Dehydration: Intermittent fasting is sometimes associated with dehydration because when people don’t eat, they sometimes forget to drink.
• Nutrient deficiencies: Not getting enough calories or not eating healthy food to meet basic needs can lead to nutrient deficiencies, decreased immunity, and lower energy levels.
• Sleep disturbances: Intermittent fasting may cause decreased rapid-eye movement (REM) sleep, leading to sleep disturbances. This can affect memory, cognitive processing, and concentration.
• Fatigue: Fasting can increase stress levels, leading to tiredness, fatigue, or brain fog.
• Mood changes: The biochemical that regulates appetite also regulates mood. Dysregulating appetite may cause mood changes or irritability.
• Hair loss: Sudden weight loss or nutrient deficiency, especially protein and B vitamins, can lead to hair loss.
• Menstrual cycle changes: Insufficient calorie intake, sudden weight loss, or being underweight can disrupt the hormone cycle and cause missed periods.
• Eating disorders: Skipping meals or restrictive eating may lead to eating disorders in some cases.
• Dangerous if taking certain medications: Intermittent fasting can be dangerous for people who take medications for blood pressure or heart disease, as they may be prone to imbalances of sodium, potassium, and other minerals during intermittent fasting.

How to reduce side effects of intermittent fasting:

• Consider a simpler method of intermittent fasting.
• Slowly reduce the time window for eating over a period of several months to help your body adjust.
• Avoid binge eating during non-fasting periods.
• Be active throughout the day so that your body can burn fat.
• Drink plenty of water or calorie-free beverages to stay hydrated.

 

[Huntn]

Decades ago I dropped 20 lb on the Atkins diet, which relies on ketosis to burn your body’s fat as you deprive yourself of carbohydrates. It worked but it was a horrible diet, from a health standpoint, to be on full-time. So the idea was you use the diet to drop your weight and then figure out a way to introduce carbs into your diet without gaining it all back. That’s the hard part.

An aspect of intermittent fasting, is that by virtue of cutting cat calories you will lose weight, but it’s promoted as more benefits than just weight loss.

The first two weeks of fasting I was stating my hunger by sucking on maybe a total of two 15 cal lifesavers, and drinking chicken bouillon made from a single 5 cal cube. It’s debated whether the bouillon breaks your fast in other words, it causes an insulin spike. Now my guess is the lifesavers definitely break your fast even though you’ll still benefit from restricted calories. So in my mind if you’re going to go through the effort of fasting, you might as well get the full benefit, drink water, coffee, tea, without sweetners. There is some debate about herbal tea/coffee such as chickory. This time I start with black coffee, tea/green tea, water/carbonated water.

I started two weeks ago at 228 lbs and woke this morning at 221 lbs.
Disclaimer: I can’t verify any of the following. Spoilers are used to lessen the wall of text factor.
Of possible interest:

The 5 Stages of Fasting (And The Benefits of Each One)

Fasting sounds simple… You simply don’t eat and after a while, you begin to experience all the benefits. Not so fast... Fasting actually comes in 5 different stages, ranging from a 12-hour fast to 72 hours or more. Each stage of fasting comes with unique benefits, including fat loss...

perfectketo.com

The 5 Stages of Fasting (And The Benefits of Each One)​

Intermittent fasting is more than just a weight-loss strategy.

The health benefits extend far beyond simple weight loss. Fasting promotes mental clarity and mood[*], improves immune function[*], increases muscle growth[*], and more.
However, not all fasts provide the same benefits. There are multiple stages of fasting, and the benefits you get from fasting depend on the length of your fast.
Here’s a look at the five main stages of fasting, the specific benefits that come with each one, and a brief look at how to incorporate fasting into your life.

Stage 1 Fasting (8-12 Hours): Stable Blood Sugar​

Fasting begins about eight hours after your last meal. This stage is characterized by changes in your blood sugar levels.

Stable Blood Sugar​

Spoiler

After about eight hours without food, your blood glucose begins to dip. You may experience hunger, fatigue, food cravings, and trouble concentrating.
However, if you can make it over this initial hurdle, these symptoms pass pretty quickly. By 12 hours, your body will begin to tap into your glycogen stores (sugar stores), and your blood glucose levels will stabilize[*].
At 12 hours, you’ll also start switching into the early stages of ketosis — your body stops relying on carbohydrates for fuel and begins burning your body fat stores instead[*].
Short-term fasting may also lower blood pressure and increase insulin sensitivity, making this type of fasting useful for people with type 2 diabetes or other blood sugar control issues[*].

Stage 2 Fasting (12-18 Hours): Ketosis, Fat Burning, and Mental Clarity​

After 16 to 18 hours of fasting, you should be in full ketosis[*]. Your liver begins converting your fat stores into ketone bodies — bundles of fuel that power your muscles, heart, and brain.
This stage of fasting has a few benefits:

Appetite suppression​

Fat Loss​

Mental clarity​

Spoiler

Appetite Suppression​

Ketones suppress appetite, which means your hunger should actually start to subside during this fasting stage[*].

Paradoxically, fasting begins to get easier as you fast for a longer time. After the first stage of fasting, appetite generally declines.

Fat Loss​

Stage 2 fasting is ideal if you want to lose weight. Your body switches fully into fat-burning mode, and because you don’t have any food in your system, you begin to burn through body fat quickly.
In addition, this stage of fasting decreases ghrelin, the hormone that makes you want to eat a lot of food, and also stabilizes your insulin levels, which prevents food cravings[*].
These factors work together to prevent overeating. If you can do intermittent fasting for 16-18 hours a day, you’ll burn through body fat and fill up quickly when you break your fast, which makes it easy to stay in a calorie deficit and lose weight.

Mental Clarity​

At this stage of fasting, you may also enjoy a boost in brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF).
BDNF is a protein that your brain makes to protect existing brain cells. BDNF also encourages the growth of new brain pathways. It also enhances learning[*] and boosts mood[*].
Fasting[*][*] and ketosis[*] both increase BDNF in animal studies, and researchers theorize that they do the same in humans[*] (although there haven’t been reliable human studies yet).

Stage 3 Fasting (24 hours): Autophagy and Anti-Aging​

After a full-day fast, your body goes into repair mode. It begins recycling old or damaged cells and reducing inflammation. If you’re looking for anti-aging or anti-inflammatory benefits, a 24-hour fast may help.

Autophagy​

Spoiler

When your body is under mild stress (such as exercise or an extended fast), your cells respond by becoming more efficient.
One thing they do is turn on autophagy. The term is Greek for “self-eating,” and that’s exactly what happens. During autophagy, your cells check all their internal parts, find anything that’s old, damaged, or functioning poorly, and replace them with shiny new versions. The old parts are either recycled into new materials or destroyed.
Studies show that fasting-induced autophagy comes with a variety of benefits.

• Fasting triggered autophagy in the brain, clearing out misfolded proteins linked to Alzheimer’s disease[*].
• Autophagy declines naturally as you age, which is connected to a variety of diseases. Fasting may be able to combat the age-related decline, keeping you biologically younger and protecting your cells from oxidative stress[*].
• Early research suggests that fasting-related autophagy may help kill cancer cells[*].
• Fasting reduces bodywide inflammation via autophagy[*].

Stage 4 Fasting (36-48 hours): Growth Hormone and Recovery​

At stage 4, you’re leaving intermittent fasting territory and entering a longer fast.
As you undertake multiple days of fasting, your growth hormone levels begin to shift, which provides you with a new set of benefits.

Muscle Growth and Repair​

Spoiler

A study of healthy adults found that 48-hour fasting increased human growth hormone (HGH) secretion by up to 400%. It also increased the frequency of growth hormone bursts throughout the day[*].
HGH increases muscle mass[*] and stimulates faster muscle repair[*]. It may also speed up the healing process for wounds and more serious injuries[*]. HGH is so effective that taking it externally is banned in professional sports and is considered doping.
It seems counterintuitive, but occasionally going without food for two days may actually help you build muscle, not lose it.

Stage 5 Fasting (72+ hours): Stem Cells and Immune Function​

The final stage of fasting begins after a full three days without food.
Before you read about the benefits, note that a 72-hour fast is a serious undertaking. If you’re going to try it, make sure you drink plenty of water, get plenty of electrolyteslike sodium, magnesium, and potassium, and stop fasting if you feel lightheaded or otherwise unwell.

Immune System Regeneration​

Spoiler

A 2014 study found that 72-hour fasting led to a near-complete rejuvenation of the immune system. Fasting triggered stem cell production, creating brand new immune cells to replace old ones[*].
The same study also had cancer patients fast throughout chemotherapy treatment. Normally, chemotherapy devastates the immune system, increasing the risk of infection and illness for cancer patients.
But when patients fasted during chemo, their immune system stayed strong throughout the process.