Russia-Ukraine

rdrr

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I also like that Ukraine is repurposing the 155mm cluster munition artillery shells we recently gave them. They use an angle grinder to cut open the shell, exposing the 88 small submunitions contained within, and are used as individual drone bomblets. Each submunition is a shaped charge that's capable of penetrating 2 3/4" armor plating. Military aircraft on the ground don't stand a chance.

You really have to admire Ukraine's resourcefulness.




I guess I don't understand how the shells really work, but I would probably need a change of underwear if they gave me the job to angle grind a shell containing 88 bomblets.
 

Citysnaps

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I guess I don't understand how the shells really work, but I would probably need a change of underwear if they gave me the job to angle grind a shell containing 88 bomblets.

Yeah, I liked the beginning where they were deciding (as if they weren’t really sure) where to make the cut.
 

dada_dave

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I also like that Ukraine is repurposing the 155mm cluster munition artillery shells we recently gave them. They use an angle grinder to cut open the shell, exposing the 88 small submunitions contained within, and are used as individual drone bomblets. Each submunition is a shaped charge that's capable of penetrating 2 3/4" armor plating. Military aircraft on the ground don't stand a chance.

You really have to admire Ukraine's resourcefulness.




They’d actually asked us to deliver them the rocket cluster munitions (M26) specifically for that purpose, cutting them open and dropping the submunitions by drone as a way around our discomfort with supplying cluster munitions directly. But we said no (this was before we finally sent them 155 cluster munitions). Of course a lot of M26s, beyond being destroyed, are going to be repurposed for GLSDB but unclear what we’re doing with the submunitions from the converted M26 … hopefully we will send them to Ukraine for drones but 🤷‍♂️
 

dada_dave

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Unfortunately it’s on Twitter but this is amusing:


The Ukrainians called the Russian emergency hotline to get them to describe the after action damage from the drone strikes, ending it with “only one aircraft on fire? thanks for helping to correct our fire, we’ll get the others next time, Slava Ukraina!” Russians on the other end “uhhhh”. Reminds me of when Christo Grozev cold called one of the GRU agents with the thinnest of pretexts and got him to admit to the poisoning of Nalvany with Nalvany sitting next to him guffawing and Grozev head in hands “I can’t believe that worked” expression - actually more like “I’m professionally insulted by these idiots”.
 
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dada_dave

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1693931268736.png
 

dada_dave

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I doubt the US (or Ukraine via shared US intelligence) would be fooled.

Still... it could make sense expending a drone-dropped cluster submunition to take out the aircraft.
Yeah the only other thing I could think of is a double bluff, most are dressed up but occasionally one is the real thing, but then getting that one flying and then putting the tires back on hardly seems worth it. Or maybe there’s not enough hard cover for the non-airworthy frames, these care huge planes, so this is the best they can do? I dunno hard to figure out the logic here.

I mean someone pointed out that cope cages make a lot more sense now than when the Russians first brought them out - the increased prevalence of drone dropped munitions vs trying to do anything against top attack munitions. But I’m not sure this helps against anything that can reach them since they tend to be suicide drones that have the range to reach these strategic bombers.
 

Citysnaps

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As ridiculous as it sounds... I'm noodling the *possibility* that perhaps tires *might/could* be a reasonable defense against the type of shaped charge submunition (repurposed from US 155mm cluster munition artillery rounds) dropped from drones.
 

dada_dave

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As ridiculous as it sounds... I'm noodling the *possibility* that perhaps tires *might/could* be a reasonable defense against the type of shaped charge submunition (repurposed from US 155mm cluster munition artillery rounds) dropped from drones.
Sure I could buy that but aren’t the type of drones that hit them suicide drones? From what I’ve seen, munition dropping drones tend to be shorter range. The only thing that could hit the strategic bombers, airworthy frames or not, in their bases are long range missiles and/or (suicide) drones. There was some discussion about it confusing the targeting system of Ukraine’s repurposed Neptune missiles but that was dismissed as well.
 

Citysnaps

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Sure I could buy that but aren’t the type of drones that hit them suicide drones? From what I’ve seen, munition dropping drones tend to be shorter range. The only thing that could hit the strategic bombers, airworthy frames or not, in their bases are long range missiles and/or (suicide) drones. There was some discussion about it confusing the targeting system of Ukraine’s repurposed Neptune missiles but that was dismissed as well.

I think you're right. I apparently was confusing/commingling multiple stories - drones with submunitions, suicide drones, and missile attacks.
 

cbum

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Re: the Musk story:

I believe that is not an accurate characterization. (see today’s NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/08/world/europe/elon-musk-starlink-ukraine.html )

The Krim area had never been activated by Starlink, so Musk did not shut anything down.

What did happen, is that he refused an urgent Ukrainian request to activate Starlink over the Krim peninsula just before the planned attack, arguing that would have made him an “active participant” in the war.

Needless to say, that is obviously exactly what he should have done.
 
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