The Trump Indictment Thread

Roller said:
Then why haven't Trump or the Republicans proposed meaningful immigration reform that recognizes the value of immigrants to this country, including performing work that nobody else will do?
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Why haven't the Democrats? It seems their solution is to just let as many come across the border as possible.


Roller said:
A pause that just happened to apply to Muslim-majority countries.
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It did.


Roller said:
I've read many articles that say the opposite, so it's hardly as settled as you make it seem.
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Federal revenues can be found on a myriad of US Government website. Opinion articles need not be consulted.

Roller said:
Yeah, Trump's nomination of Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, and Coney Barrett to the Supreme Court had nothing to do with their expected votes on abortion.
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Since when did abortion become Birth Control.

Roller said:
Again, show me a bona-fide attempt by Trump or the Republicans to offer a reasonable alternative that wouldn't leave millions of Americans without healthcare coverage.
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There were several bi-partisan attempts to fix a few things after it was passed. Obama refused to consider any of them.
 
The sooner republicans admit Trump is a criminal dipshit, the better. Groveling to his debauchery by using plausible deniability… “Hey, he didn’t say he hates blacks and Mexicans! You’re interpreting it wrong when he says “they’re poisoning the blood of our country”!

Seriously? I’m an adult with a pulse and an IQ of at least a couple digits - I know what it means. People who try to tell me it means something else, I lose respect for you.

All of the defenses of Trump fall into this pattern. It wasn’t a Muslim ban? Yes it was - it was sold as that, that’s the effect it had, and that’s what the whole issue was over. Defend that if you want, fine, but don’t tell me it wasn’t a Muslim ban. Don’t try to pad Trump’s election lies with qualifiers like “Well, we just need to be sure things are ok”. Uh, no, you investigate when there’s evidence, not people making shit up. And for the love of god, STFU about the ethics of Hunter Biden as you pretend Kushner and Ivanka never happened.

It’s this kind of logic that makes it ok to lie about an election for months, whip your base in a frenzy and unleash them on the Capitol. But as long as you use the words “peacefully and patriotically” - once - after telling people to fight like hell or they won’t have a country - well, it’s ok. Nope, that’s madness, not logic.
 
First of all, this is his platform. You can find it everywhere.

Herdfan said:
Immigration - Yes, he wanted to halt immigration - during COVID. He did not want to halt it at any other point. Illegal immigration, yes. Can't understand why anyone would want what we have going on now. At some point it is going to affect everyone. Then what.
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Illegal immigration is at an all time low. The high numbers of people being turned away at the border supports that. Do you think they would have a number of how many people snuck through? You’re wrong. Check his official platform. He wants to halt immigration. That means he won’t even be able to hire staff for his golf courses (if he’s allowed to keep them).
Herdfan said:
Muslim Ban - It wasn't a Muslim ban. It was a 90/120 day pause for people from 7 countries. So even Christians from those countries couldn't enter.
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Of course it was a Muslim ban. Looking at it any other way is lying to yourself. And he has stated multiple times that he wants it reinstated.
Herdfan said:
Taxes - You do realize that Federal Revenues INCREASED after these cuts (2020 not withstanding).
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I’m talking TFG’s platform. He wants more decreases for his buddies. AGAIN. He’s promised them that.
Herdfan said:
Birth control - please supply sources for this. I know of no birth control bans Trump did. Or even suggested.
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www.politico.com

Supreme Court upholds Trump's rollback of birth control coverage mandate

The Supreme Court, in its 7-2 ruling, sought to resolve a long-running legal battle that previously vexed the justices.
www.politico.com www.politico.com
Herdfan said:
The ACA - The GOP has been trying to do away with this since 2010. Trump was just the latest to try.
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Glad you agree that this is one of his goals.
 
I like how everything Trump blasts others for is happening to him. He was running around talking about how Obama wasn’t eligible under the constitution - based on BS birtherism - yet now here he is, having his constitutional eligibility brought into legitimate question. It’s the ultimate karma. 😎

Lock Hillary up for her emails, then he totes boxes of top-secret stuff home and shows them off to his golf buddies and journalists. “Isn’t this cool?” (I believe pretty close to an actual quote when he was waving them around on tape in Bedminster).

Next up - severe dementia and mental health issues while Biden continues to age normally. That’s already started, I think, even Megyn Kelly has acknowledged Trump is frequently confusing Biden for Obama. A tweet by Adam Kinzinger on Twitter created a small buzz around Trump’s reported incontinence too, and it was serious enough the campaign responded…

Karma 2024!
 
Alli said:
Illegal immigration is at an all time low. The high numbers of people being turned away at the border supports that. Do you think they would have a number of how many people snuck through? You’re wrong. Check his official platform. He wants to halt immigration. That means he won’t even be able to hire staff for his golf courses (if he’s allowed to keep them).
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Then why did the mayors of NYC, Chicago and Denver? record a video message to Biden to do something about the border.

And of course numbers being turned away are at an all-time low. Because they are not being turned away, they are being let in and released with a promise to appear in court in 8 years.

The immigration issue is going to hurt the D's, they just can't see it.
 
Remember in 2018, when Trump had all three branches of office and was bitching before the midterms about the horrible borders, and caravans coming to cross into the country? What did he do besides blame democrats? So when Trump bitches about immigration before getting into office, during the middle of his term and ever since, while also claiming he fixed the issue, built the wall and democrats have destroyed everything… not true.

The border is a problem, but I don’t believe in the same way republicans do. I’m more of a systems and process that makes sense guy, I look at it from a practical standpoint, not so much of a worry about my blood being poisoned or a future grandchild having a different shade of pigment or praying to a different invincible force than I do.

Having said all that, republicans have and continue to over-exaggerate the migrant issue. Remember, republicans also thought supposed “rising crime” would hurt democrats, but it turns out crime wasn’t as high on the list as others thought (as a whole, crime was down in 2023) and and republicans keep losing.

And to be fair here, republicans have slammed the door on democrats face who want to negotiate the border to get Ukraine funding and other items. Republicans are also lying to Americans when they say they want inidividual votes on items. They lie, because then when it comes to Ukraine funding (or even funding the government), they demand things be packaged together - the same people like Gaetz who whine about wanting individual item votes.

Not serious people.
 
Trying to wrap my head around the latest legal defense. In 2016 Trump claimed there was no foreign interference or propaganda that helped him win, a perfect win, but when it comes to 1/6 he’s claiming it was all foreign interference and propaganda that got his base all fired up to storm the capital and of course the deep state has mountains of evidence supporting this and is refusing to release it to his legal team. I guess it’s at least consistent that he claims Russia had nothing to do with either because he doesn't want to upset his boyfriend.
 
Chew Toy McCoy said:
Trying to wrap my head around the latest legal defense. In 2016 Trump claimed there was no foreign interference or propaganda that helped him win, a perfect win, but when it comes to 1/6 he’s claiming it was all foreign interference and propaganda that got his base all fired up to storm the capital and of course the deep state has mountains of evidence supporting this and is refusing to release it to his legal team. I guess it’s at least consistent that he claims Russia had nothing to do with either because he doesn't want to upset his boyfriend.
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They are trying to intertwine his political campaign and his political campaign.

These are all slightly worse versions of “but I didn’t inhale”. You can say anything in politics - and many are dumb enough to believe you - but it’s not a legal argument. All you need to do is look at the list of Trump victories in any notable court case he’s been party to the last few years. He loses constantly.
 
It looks like the fraud trial has heard closing arguments from both sides (curiously, defense spoke first) and judge Engoron will deliver a decision by the end of the month. The judge allowed Individual-ONE to speak during the defense's summation but told him to STFU (not quite in those words) after about 5 minutes – I think "covfefe" was the triggering moment.
 
He did himself no favors. The arguments were not broadcast and it’s the same garbage everyone has heard over and over, the same accusations he makes against anyone who doesn’t agree with him.

If you are to believe Trump, he’s the most inept and put upon man on earth and democrats are a nationwide, coordinated, unstoppable force so powerful they don’t even need their leader in the presidency, we all pull the strings behind the scenes with Obama and the Clintons and George Soros, constantly outsmarting and defeating strongman genius Trump.

I don’t think America has the stomach for much more of this. He’s going to lose to Biden, republicans are not capable of unity and getting behind a cohesive message. They can’t legislate or govern and any moderate voices in the caucus are either drowned out and irrelevant, or willing to sell their values to keep their seats safe (or themselves safe, from their own voters).

His lawyers seem content to take his baseless campaign arguments in a court of law. That seems like a recipe for disaster.

Something else to keep in mind - Trump doesn’t get off if one juror finds him not guilty. The verdict has to be unanimous. So if there’s a deadlocked jury, he’s not off. And there is no jury that will acquit him unanimously. It’s not going to happen. Will he be able to keep his sanity during a trial, after a guilty verdict or - god help us all - re-trials?
 
Yoused said:
It looks like the fraud trial has heard closing arguments from both sides (curiously, defense spoke first) and judge Engoron will deliver a decision by the end of the month. The judge allowed Individual-ONE to speak during the defense's summation but told him to STFU (not quite in those words) after about 5 minutes – I think "covfefe" was the triggering moment.
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Plaintiff always gets the last word, because plaintiff has the burden of proof. Though usually they go first, too (then go again after defendant). Since this is a bench trial, they may have modified things.
 
GermanSuplex said:
I don’t think America has the stomach for much more of this. He’s going to lose to Biden, republicans are not capable of unity and getting behind a cohesive message. They can’t legislate or govern and any moderate voices in the caucus are either drowned out and irrelevant, or willing to sell their values to keep their seats safe (or themselves safe, from their own voters).
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I wished I had your optimism. Right now it doesn't look particularly in favor of Biden (if polls are to be believed). One can only hope you are right
 
Agent47 said:
I wished I had your optimism. Right now it doesn't look particularly in favor of Biden (if polls are to be believed). One can only hope you are right
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It doesn’t look in favor of Trump either. I wonder how many republicans down ballot from him are begging for donors and the party to get behind someone else, or hoping Haley gains momentum.

Some of this is bravado, I’m well aware Trump is a threat. I just refuse to treat him like that. I’m not dismissive, but he’s a dolt and I do get tired of having to take a dolt as a serious threat. Up to this point though, he’s truly only won once. That was in 2016. His downfall hasn’t been as swift and publicly humiliating as one could hope, but it is happening and I still have faith in the electorate.

Personally, if Trump wins, I’m blaming it on a lack of positive energy from TechBoards posters. 😁
 
GermanSuplex said:
It doesn’t look in favor of Trump either. I wonder how many republicans down ballot from him are begging for donors and the party to get behind someone else, or hoping Haley gains momentum.

Some of this is bravado, I’m well aware Trump is a threat. I just refuse to treat him like that. I’m not dismissive, but he’s a dolt and I do get tired of having to take a dolt as a serious threat. Up to this point though, he’s truly only won once. That was in 2016. His downfall hasn’t been as swift and publicly humiliating as one could hope, but it is happening and I still have faith in the electorate.

Personally, if Trump wins, I’m blaming it on a lack of positive energy from TechBoards posters. 😁
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Trump is a sociopath. He will never concede defeat, whether it's in the 2024 election or any of the legal proceedings he's involved in. And that's what his brainwashed base loves about him. They'll remain under his spell until he dies and probably beyond that, since they'll concoct conspiracy theories that blame his passing on his opponents. Trump has also been adept at intimidation, which is why he wasn't convicted in the Senate in his second impeachment trial, and it's only gotten worse. It's why so few Republicans are willing to denounce him while they're in office, and it's why judge Engoron let Trump speak the other day. And Trump is boosted by Fox News and billionaires who care only about themselves. The so-called mainstream media add oxygen to the fire by treating Trump as a conventional candidate and giving him a voice.

The only hope is that there are enough people who recognize the danger Trump poses to the country and the world and are willing to vote accordingly, even if they prefer his "policies" to Biden's.
 

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