The Trump Indictment Thread

AG_PhamD

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I watched Todd Blanche give an interview where he - carefully and well-worded - threw Trump under the bus for his failed defense. He framed it as Trump being in control, “very smart” and 100% involved in every decision.

aka “we would have had a better defense but I had to take my orders from 💩-for-brains.”

I have almost no doubt his defense starting opening arguments by denying Trump slept with Daniels was Trump’s decision. The affair itself was irrelevant, and denying it was a joke. From all reports, Blanche is a serious and professional attorney. There’s no way opening that unnecessary can of worms was his idea. Defense lawyer Joe Tacopina had a similar situation in another case where he pretty much had to say to the judge “look, you see who I’m working with here, right?”

Also, word is Fox won’t go live with Trump anymore because he’s a liability, so they tape everything involving him now. Does he do call-ins anymore?

From what I read there were some reportedly highly reputable lawyers who talked about representing Trump but bailed due to “strategic differences” aka denying the affair as the starting point of the defense. Blanche apparently doesn’t have much experience with this sort of case and there’s some strong opinions about how he should have done things differently- particularly in failing to make objections to decisions by the court preventing said issues from being justification for appeal.

Trump certainly has a lot of difficulty getting the caliber of lawyers you’d expect for a POTUS these days. I’m sure his failure to pay has a bit to do with it- but I think the real issue is while normally being associated with a President is a career enhancer- associating with Trump guarantees social rejection, likely harm to one’s professional career, and the risk of getting sucked into Trump’s endless scandals (and/or being put under a microscope to reveal skeletons) that have resulted in seemingly countless numbers of his associated landing in court at a minimum, jail at the worst. He’s clearly the worst type of client a lawyer could imagine. It’s not so crazy to assume a Trump case was almost surely going to be lost in NYC regardless of any merit. Even if a lawyer is a Trump fanatic, I can’t fathom why they’d ever want to get involved.

For a guy who is quite adept at entertaining crowds- performing you might say, he is incredibly inarticulate when it comes to speaking. Elon Musk (one of the worst speakers ever, esp for someone in the public eye) is practically Obama-level in comparison to Trump. If Trump can’t keep keep his mouth shut, he’s often speaks so imprecisely and as if people understand what he’s thinking, that it also gets him in trouble. He seems to have a remarkably very small vocabulary too.
———

I’m deeply concerned about how NYC handled this case. As someone not on team Trump or Biden, it’s very hard for me to say this was a fair trial. The fact the judge donated (against ethics protocol) to “Stop Republicans” in 2020 is problematic- even if it was a mere $10 it’s the sentiment that’s problematic. I won’t get into the controversial legal theory and procedural decisions by the court, that’s all discussed elsewhere. Unfortunately all the signs suggest a desire to hamstring Trump-financially and with his ability to campaign. Why else wait 7-8 years to prosecute this case after the alleged crime.

Don’t get me wrong, this case yet again revealed the type of person Trump is and the type of people he surrounds himself with- Him, Cohen, Daniels, Pecker- what a cast of degenerates. I do not understand how people look up to him. It’s sad this was our President and may be again- the best we can offer as a country.

But it’s also sad to see a court act with such little integrity and for the sake of politics. It’s this type of behavior that exacerbates mistrust in our institutions and delegitimizes the serious cases Trump needs to be held accountable for- Jan 6th, election fraud. Unfortunately, the GA court squandered any chance of the election fraud case being sorted by Election. Willis’ ethics are disgraceful and should be humiliated that Trump’s GA lawyers don’t even seem the most competent. I would also say the Doc case may have started as something not worth prosecuting (due to how common this seems to be), maybe Trump had some sort of argument around privilege early on, but has since clearly participated in indefensible obstruction… putting him in a similar boat as HRC IMO- both should be prosecuted. And we have yet to know if Trump had nefarious intent with these Docs. Knowing Trump, it’s not a stretch.

What’s also concerning is how republicans might seek retribution- with or without Trump being re-elected. The only hope I have is Trump didn’t really go after rivals after 2016– arguable exception Hunter Biden- more specifically the effort to tie Joe in despite the lack of evidence (after scouring every inch of the world). Before legal politics seemed more about defending political allies, the prospect of unfairly prosecuting political rivals is terrifying.

I’m not putting much faith into the alleged polls that 10% of Trump voters might change their mind as a result of Trump’s conviction. I think it’s been baked into the cake all along. Trump voters are either sycophants or are well aware Trump is shyster and unfaithful to his (trophy) wife. Maybe there’s some that will change their mind, but there’s probably also some who will be inspired to vote for him. Whatever dip in the polls Trump may have suffered will probably rebound all things being equal between now and election. Much can happen though.

It’s a sad state of affairs when the only options people are willing to vote for are:
A) A pathologically narcissistic slimy washed up real estate developer/ “celebrity” geriatric playboy who surrounds himself closely with repulsive human beings imaginable. He’s the poor adolescent boy’s conception of what a rich man is.
B) An octogenarian who sadly appears to be perpetually lost in space, time, and his own words. I firmly believe you cannot usually judge a President’s legacy in their time, but his trajectory is not looking good. As unpopular as Trump was, how is Biden’s avg term approval on par with him… (meanwhile an apparent act of God has Kamala’s approval surpassing Biden, somehow).

Oh- the apparent 3rd party- RFK, who is only here because of his family name. Perhaps the most prolific conspiracy theorist in polite society. However bad Trump is with conspiracies, RFK is in another universe of delusion. Autism caused by vaccines, Big Pharma is intentionally poisoning you, natural products > pharmaceuticals, psych drugs create school shooters, atrazine (herbicide) causes autism. His claims around worms “eating a portion” of his brain seem pretty questionable at best. He never found a chemical he didn’t think was worth litigating as a toxin. His worldview is based on pseudoscience and seems to have a fundamental inability to weigh scientific credibility. I can only imagine out country run by a paranoid hypochondriac. Odd VP pick too.

Biden despite loosing his mind is/was actually the most “normal” seeming politicians in DC, especially for a career politician. But everyone know’s his light is fading. Maybe it would be one thing to have an absent POTUS if the administration upheld public confidence- but that’s clearly not the case. It’s like he’s surrounded by incompetence. From his press office to the military brass to some of cabinet appointees- there’s a lot of people and actions that don’t inspire much confidence. It’s not everyone but there are too many and it’s too apparent and it reflects in the polls. It doesn’t help accountability is a rare commodity in DC.

Seriously. There are HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of eligible Americans who could be president. What are we doing here?

Maybe we need to open up elections to to non-citizens and foreigners.
 

Renzatic

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Seriously. There are HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of eligible Americans who could be president. What are we doing here?

Hell, I dunno. We're pretty dumb these days.

For example, we've got MTG grilling Fauci in congress. Again. For something that was already investigated and closed three years ago. Guess the Republicans need a new Benghazi.
 

Chew Toy McCoy

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I probably shouldn’t be surprised that Republicans have managed to get the definition of something exactly backwards once again. Banana Republic is where government officials are never held accountable for anything and they’ve somehow applied that to Trump actually being held accountable.

But I will agree there are situations that do wreak of Banana Republic…

 

GermanSuplex

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From what I read there were some reportedly highly reputable lawyers who talked about representing Trump but bailed due to “strategic differences” aka denying the affair as the starting point of the defense. Blanche apparently doesn’t have much experience with this sort of case and there’s some strong opinions about how he should have done things differently- particularly in failing to make objections to decisions by the court preventing said issues from being justification for appeal.

Trump certainly has a lot of difficulty getting the caliber of lawyers you’d expect for a POTUS these days. I’m sure his failure to pay has a bit to do with it- but I think the real issue is while normally being associated with a President is a career enhancer- associating with Trump guarantees social rejection, likely harm to one’s professional career, and the risk of getting sucked into Trump’s endless scandals (and/or being put under a microscope to reveal skeletons) that have resulted in seemingly countless numbers of his associated landing in court at a minimum, jail at the worst. He’s clearly the worst type of client a lawyer could imagine. It’s not so crazy to assume a Trump case was almost surely going to be lost in NYC regardless of any merit. Even if a lawyer is a Trump fanatic, I can’t fathom why they’d ever want to get involved.

For a guy who is quite adept at entertaining crowds- performing you might say, he is incredibly inarticulate when it comes to speaking. Elon Musk (one of the worst speakers ever, esp for someone in the public eye) is practically Obama-level in comparison to Trump. If Trump can’t keep keep his mouth shut, he’s often speaks so imprecisely and as if people understand what he’s thinking, that it also gets him in trouble. He seems to have a remarkably very small vocabulary too.
———

I’m deeply concerned about how NYC handled this case. As someone not on team Trump or Biden, it’s very hard for me to say this was a fair trial. The fact the judge donated (against ethics protocol) to “Stop Republicans” in 2020 is problematic- even if it was a mere $10 it’s the sentiment that’s problematic. I won’t get into the controversial legal theory and procedural decisions by the court, that’s all discussed elsewhere. Unfortunately all the signs suggest a desire to hamstring Trump-financially and with his ability to campaign. Why else wait 7-8 years to prosecute this case after the alleged crime.

Don’t get me wrong, this case yet again revealed the type of person Trump is and the type of people he surrounds himself with- Him, Cohen, Daniels, Pecker- what a cast of degenerates. I do not understand how people look up to him. It’s sad this was our President and may be again- the best we can offer as a country.

But it’s also sad to see a court act with such little integrity and for the sake of politics. It’s this type of behavior that exacerbates mistrust in our institutions and delegitimizes the serious cases Trump needs to be held accountable for- Jan 6th, election fraud. Unfortunately, the GA court squandered any chance of the election fraud case being sorted by Election. Willis’ ethics are disgraceful and should be humiliated that Trump’s GA lawyers don’t even seem the most competent. I would also say the Doc case may have started as something not worth prosecuting (due to how common this seems to be), maybe Trump had some sort of argument around privilege early on, but has since clearly participated in indefensible obstruction… putting him in a similar boat as HRC IMO- both should be prosecuted. And we have yet to know if Trump had nefarious intent with these Docs. Knowing Trump, it’s not a stretch.

What’s also concerning is how republicans might seek retribution- with or without Trump being re-elected. The only hope I have is Trump didn’t really go after rivals after 2016– arguable exception Hunter Biden- more specifically the effort to tie Joe in despite the lack of evidence (after scouring every inch of the world). Before legal politics seemed more about defending political allies, the prospect of unfairly prosecuting political rivals is terrifying.

I’m not putting much faith into the alleged polls that 10% of Trump voters might change their mind as a result of Trump’s conviction. I think it’s been baked into the cake all along. Trump voters are either sycophants or are well aware Trump is shyster and unfaithful to his (trophy) wife. Maybe there’s some that will change their mind, but there’s probably also some who will be inspired to vote for him. Whatever dip in the polls Trump may have suffered will probably rebound all things being equal between now and election. Much can happen though.

It’s a sad state of affairs when the only options people are willing to vote for are:
A) A pathologically narcissistic slimy washed up real estate developer/ “celebrity” geriatric playboy who surrounds himself closely with repulsive human beings imaginable. He’s the poor adolescent boy’s conception of what a rich man is.
B) An octogenarian who sadly appears to be perpetually lost in space, time, and his own words. I firmly believe you cannot usually judge a President’s legacy in their time, but his trajectory is not looking good. As unpopular as Trump was, how is Biden’s avg term approval on par with him… (meanwhile an apparent act of God has Kamala’s approval surpassing Biden, somehow).

Oh- the apparent 3rd party- RFK, who is only here because of his family name. Perhaps the most prolific conspiracy theorist in polite society. However bad Trump is with conspiracies, RFK is in another universe of delusion. Autism caused by vaccines, Big Pharma is intentionally poisoning you, natural products > pharmaceuticals, psych drugs create school shooters, atrazine (herbicide) causes autism. His claims around worms “eating a portion” of his brain seem pretty questionable at best. He never found a chemical he didn’t think was worth litigating as a toxin. His worldview is based on pseudoscience and seems to have a fundamental inability to weigh scientific credibility. I can only imagine out country run by a paranoid hypochondriac. Odd VP pick too.

Biden despite loosing his mind is/was actually the most “normal” seeming politicians in DC, especially for a career politician. But everyone know’s his light is fading. Maybe it would be one thing to have an absent POTUS if the administration upheld public confidence- but that’s clearly not the case. It’s like he’s surrounded by incompetence. From his press office to the military brass to some of cabinet appointees- there’s a lot of people and actions that don’t inspire much confidence. It’s not everyone but there are too many and it’s too apparent and it reflects in the polls. It doesn’t help accountability is a rare commodity in DC.

Seriously. There are HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS of eligible Americans who could be president. What are we doing here?

Maybe we need to open up elections to to non-citizens and foreigners.

You’re deeply concerned about the NY trial and you think Biden has lost his mind.

Yeah, ok. I appreciate the effort you put into your posts, but it’s very, very difficult to take seriously.
 

Cmaier

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You’re deeply concerned about the NY trial and you think Biden has lost his mind.

Yeah, ok. I appreciate the effort you put into your posts, but it’s very, very difficult to take seriously.
I heard Biden interviewed a couple of weeks ago on Howard Stern. Interview lasted a long time - maybe an hour? He told delightful stories about his life, his family, and how he met his wives. He was clearly in complete control of his faculties. The guy stutters, and struggles to talk sometimes. But that doesn’t mean he isn’t sharp as a tack.
 

Citysnaps

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Jones and trump.jpg
 

Herdfan

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I heard Biden interviewed a couple of weeks ago on Howard Stern. Interview lasted a long time - maybe an hour? He told delightful stories about his life, his family, and how he met his wives. He was clearly in complete control of his faculties. The guy stutters, and struggles to talk sometimes. But that doesn’t mean he isn’t sharp as a tack.

And how many of these tales have been proven to be complete falsehoods? Here are a couple to get you started:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-arrest-as-kid-black-family/ (When you lose Snopes.....)

(Yes, I know its the NYP, but every single one of you can watch his interview when he says this and then determine on your own if Senators have Secret Service Protection)
 

GermanSuplex

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And how many of these tales have been proven to be complete falsehoods? Here are a couple to get you started:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-arrest-as-kid-black-family/ (When you lose Snopes.....)

(Yes, I know its the NYP, but every single one of you can watch his interview when he says this and then determine on your own if Senators have Secret Service Protection)

Ah yea, more bringing out the lies to defend Trump. I guarantee you every politician has a laundry list. Am I ok with it? No. But I fail to see how you have an issue with it either, if your alternative is a beyond narcissistic pathalogical liar.

I just can't understand why you don't realize every fault you point to of literally anyone else, Trump has them ten-fold.
 

MEJHarrison

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And how many of these tales have been proven to be complete falsehoods? Here are a couple to get you started:

I did not know this! Now I'm going to have to seriously consider whether to give my vote to your run-of-the-mill politician or a convicted felon. That now joins other conundrums like "get the liver or the cheesecake?", "stop for the red light or roll the dice?", "smile at the stranger in the grocery store or punch them in the gut?". Why can't things ever be easy?
 

Herdfan

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Ah yea, more bringing out the lies to defend Trump. I guarantee you every politician has a laundry list. Am I ok with it? No. But I fail to see how you have an issue with it either, if your alternative is a beyond narcissistic pathalogical liar.

I just can't understand why you don't realize every fault you point to of literally anyone else, Trump has them ten-fold.

Because you and one other are the only ones who are willing to even admit this.

The reason for me it is an issue, and should concern everyone, is the media will put Trump's lies on the front page while ignoring Biden's for the most part. This causes the level of distrust in the media that we have today and that is not good for anyone.
 

Roller

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Because you and one other are the only ones who are willing to even admit this.

The reason for me it is an issue, and should concern everyone, is the media will put Trump's lies on the front page while ignoring Biden's for the most part. This causes the level of distrust in the media that we have today and that is not good for anyone.
I admit that Biden and pretty much every politician I've ever known about has lied or "stretched the truth" at times. JFK did it. Obama did it. Heck, who among us here wouldn't be lying if we claimed we never lie? I have seen front page stories when Biden lies, including recently.

In Biden's case, I suspect some of it can be chalked up to faulty memory, as opposed to intentionally saying something he knows to be untrue. But degree — what the person is lying about and how often they do it — matters. A lot.

With Trump, it's at least an order of magnitude greater on the political and ethical scale. He even lies about things that can be readily fact-checked, such as his pronouncement that he never said "lock her up!" about Hillary Clinton. There are literally thousands of examples. Now, if you counter that Trump truly believes his lies, it's just as bad. He was and again wants to be President of the United States. How can any foreign leader, ally or adversary, ever trust him about anything?

And how can we, the American people, trust him? Remember all the times he said COVID-19 wasn't a problem, that it would go away, when he knew otherwise? There's a huge difference between softening bad news with hope and outright lying. What's Trump going to say or do when the next deadly pandemic strikes?
 

shadow puppet

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I follow an email newsletter run by Dr. Jen Golbeck, often seen on MSNBC & other news outlets for her input & expertise. She has managed to anonymously infiltrate a few of the MAGGOT forums.

This update came yesterday:

"Over the weekend, the pro-Trump forums experienced a few Stages of Grief. We saw denial, anger, bargaining, and even a little depression, but definitely no acceptance. The followers are searching for ways this can be undone (e.g. Supreme Court interventions or appeals), convincing one another that this would make Trump more electable (despite even Fox News reporting that significantly fewer Republicans are likely to support him at the polls), and generally bemoaning that the US has become a “banana republic”.


There are no plans for action and, in fact, the forums are returning to their pre-conviction states of gripes about the usual conservative rage points: LGBTQ+ visibility, immigration, and Hunter Biden.

I don’t expect a lot of new fuel on the MAGA fire until sentencing or unless there is some other big development in the case. For now, we’re easing back into comfortable raging at the progressive world."
 

Renzatic

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The reason for me it is an issue, and should concern everyone, is the media will put Trump's lies on the front page while ignoring Biden's for the most part. This causes the level of distrust in the media that we have today and that is not good for anyone.

That's probably because Trump's lies tend to be a bit bigger. Like Biden talks about getting racy photos from some chick while in the senate, while Trump talks about Biden and the FBI colluding in an attempted assassination attempt against him.

It's like saying that crabs and untreated syphilis are equally as bad because they're both STDs.
 

GermanSuplex

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Biden’s lies from yester-year (or decade) aren’t going to outshine a much more serious and consequential lie Trump told five minutes ago.

This is another issue I’ve mentioned before - there is no way to cover Trump and his acolytes that won’t seem “left leaning”. If these clowns start co-signing murder - which they’re not far off from doing - it isn’t biased or slanted to report “these people are saying and doing vile things”. It’s like arguing the news is biased against murderers and lowlife criminals when they report on their crimes.
 

Citysnaps

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I was thinking about the sentencing. The offense was basically against all Americans. He should be ordered to pay every person in America one dollar for each count.

Better yet, every non-republican. Everyone else then gets two dollars.
 
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