Eric
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How often would you say they're held accountable?
The Trump Indictment Thread
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Very hard to say, because I don’t know how often people are not caught. I will say that I’ve had many cases where someone has violated an order and been caught. We have a case right now where we’re waiting to see what the court does; the court already sanctioned the bad guys, but we have new evidence and are waiting to see if the judge will make the sanctions more severe.
Typically (but probably a small percentage of the time) it happens with protective orders, where there are restrictions on what can be done with documents that are produced in discovery. It also happens a lot with discovery orders, where people are ordered to produce stuff or to preserve evidence, and don’t. Usually, if you can prove someone violated such orders, the court will do something. They typically do the least severe thing that meets the goals of preventing future violations by the party and other parties in the future, making things fair to the other side, etc. Court’s are loathe to “punish” a party; they just want to make things fair and prevent future violations.
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Even if Trump isn’t held accountable immediately, violations of further court orders will be used as evidence of a pattern to obstruct and ignore the rule of law.
I don’t think Trump has the ability to rally his supporters the way he did for January 6 - he’s been out of office, people have gone to prison for going from protest to sedition and violence, and Trump’s song of being a victim of the “deep state” and a rigged election is three years old. He may be the Republican front runner, but he’s also a desperate man who’s nearing 100 felony charges, bleeding cash and is an self-created web that sets himself up for more legal issues - having a co-defendant as a valet, paying for lawyers of co-defendants and co-conspirators, etc.
But I still think it’s best for the Justice Department to not come out swinging and asking for Trump to be silenced. The judge may do that on her own if he keeps it up, and Trump is always going to attack anyone who issues a ruling he doesn’t like anyways. And attacks on the judge are way more serious than what Trump usually does.
Unfortunately, equal justice under the law has never been tested, and I’m ok with some special treatment now if ultimate justice is served later. Especially when that “special treatment” is really just giving Trump enough rope to hang himself. Think of it like this - if he follows the orders, great, but if not, he’s just making his convictions more likely.
I don’t think Trump has the ability to rally his supporters the way he did for January 6 - he’s been out of office, people have gone to prison for going from protest to sedition and violence, and Trump’s song of being a victim of the “deep state” and a rigged election is three years old. He may be the Republican front runner, but he’s also a desperate man who’s nearing 100 felony charges, bleeding cash and is an self-created web that sets himself up for more legal issues - having a co-defendant as a valet, paying for lawyers of co-defendants and co-conspirators, etc.
But I still think it’s best for the Justice Department to not come out swinging and asking for Trump to be silenced. The judge may do that on her own if he keeps it up, and Trump is always going to attack anyone who issues a ruling he doesn’t like anyways. And attacks on the judge are way more serious than what Trump usually does.
Unfortunately, equal justice under the law has never been tested, and I’m ok with some special treatment now if ultimate justice is served later. Especially when that “special treatment” is really just giving Trump enough rope to hang himself. Think of it like this - if he follows the orders, great, but if not, he’s just making his convictions more likely.
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But wouldn't there be a penalty of some sort in the protective order should trump leak privileged information for the purpose of intimidating witnesses/etc?
In other words, perhaps something like, "Should defendant leak privileged information to any social/news media, he shall be forced to accept the hospitality of the nearest Federal Correctional Institution for the duration of the trial (when court is not in session).
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No, the order Is just an order of the court. The penalty for violating a court’s order varies based on the circumstances, but is seldom found in the order itself (at least for protective orders). Other sorts of orders can be different, but, typically, the way it works is that if a violation is found, someone goes to the court and reports it and asks for particular sanctions (or leaves it up to the court to determine sanctions). Sanctions can vary depending on the circumstance, as justice demands.
Yoused
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His what, now?
I hear the gov'ment has video and other documentation showing Trump is indeed the son of an orangutan, as alleged by Bill Maher in 2013.
shadow puppet
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Hokey, but fun.
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It goes without saying, but I promise you if he actually makes these motions they will fail, and they won’t even delay anything.
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This putz is not going to make it to trial without racking up more charges. And those aren’t including additional charges Jack Smith is still investigating and may bring later.
He is so goddamn predictable it makes the mind hurt.
Eric
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Bill Barr says he’s willing to testify against Trump at Jan. 6 trial
Former Attorney General Bill Barr said he is willing to testify against former President Trump at his Jan. 6 trial. Barr, who was appointed by Trump, responded “of course” when asked on…
thehill.com
Bill Barr says he’s willing to testify against Trump at Jan. 6 trial
Wonderful. Another former Trump enabler who grossly misled the nation about the Mueller report. And now he’s “willing” to testify.Bill Barr says he’s willing to testify against Trump at Jan. 6 trial
Former Attorney General Bill Barr said he is willing to testify against former President Trump at his Jan. 6 trial. Barr, who was appointed by Trump, responded “of course” when asked on…Bill Barr says he’s willing to testify against Trump at Jan. 6 trial
mac_in_tosh
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With his threats and incitement, Trump is a clear and present danger to the nation so it's discouraging that we appear to be unable to stop this behavior. Yes he's been indicted but any trial will be months away and he's apparently free to continue his dangerous behavior in the interim. And if he's found guilty you can be sure he will start a long appeal process and the sociopath would even have no compunction about starting a civil war to protect himself.
He complains that he's being treated unfairly, but it's quite the opposite. Wouldn't anyone else who made a post like he did, saying he will come after anyone that comes after him, face some kind of consequence? It's a threat to the prosecutor, the judge and any potential witnesses against him. How is he allowed to get away with this?
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While I’m glad most of the rank and file did not bend for Trump, why did nobody go to the press or the DoJ? DoJ officials were surely aware these were crimes taking place. Mike Pence didn’t give in to Trump, but if what the president asked him to do was against the law and constitution, he should have demanded testify in the senate impeachment proceedings.
This attempt to placate him without overturning democracy was the absolute bare minimum they could do with the least amount of courage required.
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I remember that. Image rehabilitation.
I think Pence figured his unwillingness to do what Trump asked took place behind the scenes, but testifying at the impeachment trial would have been seen by everyone, including the insurrectionists who wanted him killed.
At this point, though, if he and the others who enabled Trump had any real integrity, they’d speak out much more forcefully and say TFB (Their Former Boss) should never again hold political office.
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I think they hold trump up higher than they do Jesus. thy just cant break away from him no matter what.
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Evangelicals will blame the influence of Satan on everything from masturbation to store displays, but when presented with a mountain of blatant evidence that Trump is an affront to Christianity and therefore their support is clearly the influence of Satan you get “Nope. Don’t see it. The holy spirit wants me to support Trump.”
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exactly the bible talks about this. trump offers what they want so then they can ignore the bad parts.
