trump expects to be arrested on Tuesday

Seems Pence is going full-weasel here during today's ABC interview:

“It just feels like a politically charged prosecution here. And I, for my part, I just feel like it's just not what the American people want to see,”

 
I know what I want to see at some point: Donald J. Trump in an orange prison jumpsuit, a resident of the federal prison system. It may take a while and some extra effort to get him there but that is truly where he belongs......
 
And now McCarthy is promising a House investigation into what he is claiming to be politically motivated election interference. So any criminals who want to avoid prosecution should just register with a party other than the one the prosecutor is with and declare themselves a candidate for political office.

The party of law and order has degenerated to the point that they continue to back a guy who incited a violent attack on the Capitol and who stole top secret documents and obstructed efforts to retrieve them. It's party over country for them.

I don't get this "politically motivated" crap defense. Which party somebody is affiliated with has fuck all to do with a crime being committed. This is just another glaring projection from Republicans who seem to think their only job is to attempt to prosecute Democrats or their supposed grand-scale conspiracies which they fail at time and time again.
 
I'm dismayed that its this Tuesday and not last Tuesday.

McCarthy's "threat" to add more to his plate by investigating yet more people who dare call out Trump for his crimes and misdeeds won't amount to anything but more projection and grandstanding. Republicans are getting buried and embarrassed at most of these committee hearings, and they've provided virtually nothing to show for it thus far.

Trump is already laying the groundwork for more violent protests. Nothing he's said YET has has been over inflammatory, but its the same roadmap and playbook he used after he LOST BIGLY in 2020. Deny, lie about your so-called "enemies", paint yourself as the perpetual victim, make stuff up (Trump is name-dropping Soros a lot, which is just a name they use in place of any actual facts of evidence... must be Soros)... whip everyone into a froth, then unleash them when its convenient.

Trump is old, senile and crazy, and I think investigators need to continue doing their jobs and beyond safety reasons, give no concern to the tense political climate.
 
Seems Pence is going full-weasel here during today's ABC interview:

“It just feels like a politically charged prosecution here. And I, for my part, I just feel like it's just not what the American people want to see,”


This behavior undertaken by of many on the right planning on running against Trump is a bit bizarre. Presumably they want to beat him, but when push comes to shove, they often defend him and adopt many of his positions. And they seem too afraid to ever say anything that’s too critical of Trump.

What’s good for the goose is good for the gander I guess? Not sure how anyone could expect to win that way.

I don't get this "politically motivated" crap defense. Which party somebody is affiliated with has fuck all to do with a crime being committed. This is just another glaring projection from Republicans who seem to think their only job is to attempt to prosecute Democrats or their supposed grand-scale conspiracies which they fail at time and time again.

Generally speaking it’s not unreasonable to say investigations can have some level of political motivation, as is how deep they dig. The decision to prosecute and what for I suppose can have political motivations. We have seen the hypocrisy on both sides in how they handle cars depending on who is defendant.

Regarding Trump’s current case in NY specifically- of all the trials that have occurred, this one comes off as petty. Not the apparent fact Trump cheated on his taxes, a misdemeanor. I think everyone agrees that’s an entirely legitimate crime to go after. The effort to contort the law in a novel fashion to make this a felony charge seems to be doing more than is required.

Leticia James literally campaigned with the platform of investigating Trump while also making it very clear she opposed him politically. It’s not surprising some people might conclude she’s not acting in an entirely unbiased manner. There are also people who see Trump as an existential threat who needs to be kept from the Presidency and will support virtually anything to achieve that goal.

That said, just because this case might or could be an example of overcharging due to political bias doesn’t mean his other cases aren’t entirely reasonable. The whole GA election situation and 1/6 are incredibly serious and there appears to be entirely reasonable justification to dig deeper. It’s hard to reasonably call those “witch hunts”.

My concern with the NY case- beyond opening a can of worms Re: what are election contributions and future increased legal warfare between parties- is that that this case could fall flat on its face. And that will only give credibility to Trump’s general “witch hunt” talking point and undermines the public’s view of the more serious and actually consequential cases he is facing. (Losing this case could also fire up Trump support too, just like what happened with the FBI raid).

All that said, the law should be applied fairly, but politicians and others in positions of power should be held to the highest of standards given their influence. Too often the opposite is true when it comes to politicians.
 
This behavior undertaken by of many on the right planning on running against Trump is a bit bizarre. Presumably they want to beat him, but when push comes to shove, they often defend him and adopt many of his positions. And they seem too afraid to ever say anything that’s too critical of Trump.

What’s good for the goose is good for the gander I guess? Not sure how anyone could expect to win that way.



Generally speaking it’s not unreasonable to say investigations can have some level of political motivation, as is how deep they dig. The decision to prosecute and what for I suppose can have political motivations. We have seen the hypocrisy on both sides in how they handle cars depending on who is defendant.

Regarding Trump’s current case in NY specifically- of all the trials that have occurred, this one comes off as petty. Not the apparent fact Trump cheated on his taxes, a misdemeanor. I think everyone agrees that’s an entirely legitimate crime to go after. The effort to contort the law in a novel fashion to make this a felony charge seems to be doing more than is required.

Leticia James literally campaigned with the platform of investigating Trump while also making it very clear she opposed him politically. It’s not surprising some people might conclude she’s not acting in an entirely unbiased manner. There are also people who see Trump as an existential threat who needs to be kept from the Presidency and will support virtually anything to achieve that goal.

That said, just because this case might or could be an example of overcharging due to political bias doesn’t mean his other cases aren’t entirely reasonable. The whole GA election situation and 1/6 are incredibly serious and there appears to be entirely reasonable justification to dig deeper. It’s hard to reasonably call those “witch hunts”.

My concern with the NY case- beyond opening a can of worms Re: what are election contributions and future increased legal warfare between parties- is that that this case could fall flat on its face. And that will only give credibility to Trump’s general “witch hunt” talking point and undermines the public’s view of the more serious and actually consequential cases he is facing. (Losing this case could also fire up Trump support too, just like what happened with the FBI raid).

All that said, the law should be applied fairly, but politicians and others in positions of power should be held to the highest of standards given their influence. Too often the opposite is true when it comes to politicians.

I honestly don’t know all the details of this case but I agree it’s pretty low on the totem pole of possible prosecutions. For me the only real thing that stands out is that (some) evangelical Christians have decided a man who had an affair with a porn star and then paid her to STFU about it should continue to be their leader. All the other cases may not fall under Christian values, but this particular case shows them as the top shelf hypocrites that they are.

Trump supporters know he has committed crimes over his lifetime but they just don’t care because they either think those crimes are just part of being a successful business man or if the crime serves their agenda they think it shouldn’t be a crime. The fact that so many believe these indictments will increase the chances of Trump winning the Republican nomination and the Presidency is sickening.
 
Kevin McCarthy needs a half-hour grilling by a respected journalist. This covering for Trump at every turn has got to stop. If you disagree with Trump, say so. Don't try to retroactively and magically change what he said to fit your narrative.

But the California lawmaker also said, “I don’t think people should protest this, no. And I think President Trump, if you talk to him, he doesn’t believe that, either.” - Kevin McCarthy

Oh really, Kevin? Trump literally said the EXACT OPPOSITE in his social postings. What a joke.
 
I don't get this "politically motivated" crap defense. Which party somebody is affiliated with has fuck all to do with a crime being committed.

Couple of reasons.

First, Hillary and the DNC did the exact same thing. They misclassified the Steele Dossier as "legal expenses" when they weren't. But instead of being indicted, they paid a $113K fine.

Second, the DOJ decided not to prosecute this. So if the DOJ doesn't think there is much there, why is a DA in NY doing it?

And it is just a misdemeanor which will carry no jail time. Now there is a way that it can be elevated to a felony, but the DA will have to prove that the misclassification was deliberate and was done to cover up a crime. Most legal pundits don't think he will see a day in jail from this.
 
Couple of reasons.

First, Hillary and the DNC did the exact same thing. They misclassified the Steele Dossier as "legal expenses" when they weren't. But instead of being indicted, they paid a $113K fine.

Second, the DOJ decided not to prosecute this. So if the DOJ doesn't think there is much there, why is a DA in NY doing it?
Apples and oranges, Hillary never paid off a porn star to keep quiet about their sexual affair and then tried to cover it up. Bottom line is if he did something illegal and the grand jury recommends it, then go with it, like you would any other person in the country.

And it is just a misdemeanor which will carry no jail time. Now there is a way that it can be elevated to a felony, but the DA will have to prove that the misclassification was deliberate and was done to cover up a crime. Most legal pundits don't think he will see a day in jail from this.
I'll agree that it does seem like low hanging fruit, Trump will have much bigger issues with the other investigations going on. However, look at all the press he is getting as it gives red meat to his supporters and has the entire party coalescing behind him... then there's the other guy, Ron who?

Only Trump can take something this small and make it the number one story for an entire week.
 
I honestly don’t know all the details of this case but I agree it’s pretty low on the totem pole of possible prosecutions. For me the only real thing that stands out is that (some) evangelical Christians have decided a man who had an affair with a porn star and then paid her to STFU about it should continue to be their leader. All the other cases may not fall under Christian values, but this particular case shows them as the top shelf hypocrites that they are.

Sometimes it is the devil you know and how it affects you individually.

Does Trump having sex with a porn star and then paying her off affect them directly. Nope. Not one bit. Smarmy for sure, but it still has no effect on their lives.

But if Trump is in office, then Biden or some other Progressive who supports policies that they don't like that might affect them, isn't. So they will take the serial cheater over policies they truly believe are hurtful or they disagree with.
 
Apples and oranges, Hillary never paid off a porn star to keep quiet about their sexual affair and then tried to cover it up. Bottom line is if he did something illegal and the grand jury recommends it, then go with it, like you would any other person in the country.

Is that illegal?

It may be a lot of things, but since having sex with her isn't a crime, paying her hush money isn't illegal.

And FYI, John Edwards paid Rielle Hunter $114K for some "campaign videos" she made. After he had knocked her up and was running for President. Pretty sure he wasn't indicted either.


However, look at all the press he is getting as it gives red meat to his supporters and has the entire party coalescing behind him... then there's the other guy, Ron who?

I think the Dems should worry less about how his committed supporters feel and more about how independents might feel. Will they see this as an overzealous prosecution or a witch hunt? If so, those people who thought he was icky and Tweeted mean things might come back into the fold for him thinking he was right all along. They might hold their nose while doing it though. ;)
 
Couple of reasons.

First, Hillary and the DNC did the exact same thing. They misclassified the Steele Dossier as "legal expenses" when they weren't. But instead of being indicted, they paid a $113K fine.

Second, the DOJ decided not to prosecute this. So if the DOJ doesn't think there is much there, why is a DA in NY doing it?

And it is just a misdemeanor which will carry no jail time. Now there is a way that it can be elevated to a felony, but the DA will have to prove that the misclassification was deliberate and was done to cover up a crime. Most legal pundits don't think he will see a day in jail from this.

I say go after everybody, but at some point whoever you are for or against people are going to have to admit defeat if a case isn't brought and move on. Whataboutism isn't a legal defense.

I heard an interview with a former DOJ attorney who confirmed there is a completely separate justice system for those at the top. If a group of average citizens threw a rally at the capitol on 1/6 that ended in the same result all those people would already be in prison just from what would probably be a low level investigation. But when you are dealing with the ruling class a case needs to be run up many levels of approval and somewhere in there is where it dies.

Sometimes it is the devil you know and how it affects you individually.

Does Trump having sex with a porn star and then paying her off affect them directly. Nope. Not one bit. Smarmy for sure, but it still has no effect on their lives.

But if Trump is in office, then Biden or some other Progressive who supports policies that they don't like that might affect them, isn't. So they will take the serial cheater over policies they truly believe are hurtful or they disagree with.

The key difference is they are stuck with Biden in office for now. Nobody is stuck supporting Trump. Anoint somebody else. They are making that choice despite the fact that he represents just about everything Christian values are against. In fact I can't think of any Christian value he embodies.
 
Is that illegal?

It may be a lot of things, but since having sex with her isn't a crime, paying her hush money isn't illegal.
It is if he violated campaign finance or tax laws while doing it. I agree that on the scale of wrongdoing Trump has been credibly accused of, this is at the low end. The question is what will be enough to make reasonable people (not counting the zealots who take everything as a "witch hunt") accept that Trump deserves to be charged with a crime?
 
Is that illegal?

It may be a lot of things, but since having sex with her isn't a crime, paying her hush money isn't illegal.

And FYI, John Edwards paid Rielle Hunter $114K for some "campaign videos" she made. After he had knocked her up and was running for President. Pretty sure he wasn't indicted either.
According to the NY DA it IS illegal, apparently.

I think the Dems should worry less about how his committed supporters feel and more about how independents might feel. Will they see this as an overzealous prosecution or a witch hunt? If so, those people who thought he was icky and Tweeted mean things might come back into the fold for him thinking he was right all along. They might hold their nose while doing it though. ;)
Exactly, we agree here. In 2020 those in the middle clearly felt Trump was too much, no you're hedging your bets that those same people in the middle will now accept Trump again because of MORE calls for protests along with felonies on his record? Trust me, Dems are welcoming all of this as Republicans once again choose to fall in line behind that mad man. Good luck with that.
 
It is if he violated campaign finance or tax laws while doing it. I agree that on the scale of wrongdoing Trump has been credibly accused of, this is at the low end. The question is what will be enough to make reasonable people (not counting the zealots who take everything as a "witch hunt") accept that Trump deserves to be charged with a crime?
I'll just point out that @Herdfan is on record here not supporting Trump, yet here he is defending him. Not knocking that as it's his point of view, it just makes the point that as a party they'll never be able to move beyond this guy and it only hurts them.
 
I'll just point out that @Herdfan is on record here not supporting Trump, yet here he is defending him. Not knocking that as it's his point of view, it just makes the point that as a party they'll never be able to move beyond this guy and it only hurts them.

I do not want him to run again. It just brings the circus to town and we don't need that.

But if Trump is the nominee and the Dems nominate Biden or some other Progressive, I will hold my nose and vote for him. Won't be happy about it, but won't be happy about another 4 years of Biden or Harris or some other Progressive. So kind of in no man's land here.
 
I do not want him to run again. It just brings the circus to town and we don't need that.

But if Trump is the nominee and the Dems nominate Biden or some other Progressive, I will hold my nose and vote for him. Won't be happy about it, but won't be happy about another 4 years of Biden or Harris or some other Progressive. So kind of in no man's land here.
Democrats welcome that rematch, trust me.
 
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